Giving and Keep Trying

Been trying to break into animation since 2018. Created several different projects and worked at pitching them to a variety studios and production companies. All have been rejected for one reason or another.
Some with negative reception, others with positive reception over all.
I attend regular networking events and know at least one person at every major studio, but that doesn’t always equate to a pitch opportunity.
Last year I was almost picked up to work on a show at Netflix, but they ultimately hired someone else.
This year I had two opportunists. One meeting to pitch to a certain company that will go unnamed, but is globally known. Then with a newer company with well established people behind it.
The big one has not gotten back to me with a definitive answer, this is normal for them and I’ve had various producers and talent throughout the industry tell me “they’re dinosaurs who leave you hanging.” But after 5 months the smaller people got back to me with a kind rejection, but ultimately still a rejection.

I’m at a point to where I don’t know what I’m supposed to do. Yes, I’ve had opportunities and I’m grateful for them, but I’ve also had zero actual wins and haven’t made a dime in my endeavors. I haven’t even been able to score a job as a mailroom grunt.
Do I give up and go back to college to try and do a career change, or stick through it?
I acknowledge that this route is more or less giving up on my goals forever and I don’t think I’ll ever be happy if I do that, but I’m not really happy now.

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  1. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Are you a white guy?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Mixed race

      Your art is probably shit. Work on it more. Know more people as well.

      Compared to the pitches I’ve seen get picked up, my art is more than enough.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Show some of your art. Posting on Cinemaphile does not get you blacklisted. I guarantee you most people in the industry peek at it from time to time.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          What does get you blacklisted from the industry?

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            It's a combination of working at enough studios and being a toxic, disruptive, gossipy butthole enough to piss a lot of people off. That or sexually harassing people. Basically don't be a bad person.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            Associating with right-wing people. Working at Ben Shapiro's company, Daily Wire.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            Calling out bullshit

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          I know for a fact they do, I know enough industry people to know that. The only reason I’m not going to is because I’m still under consideration at the big one and don’t want a lazy excuse for them to say no. Hence why I’m not naming the big one despite it being obvious.

          Why would college get you a job?

          It wouldn’t, but a degree in a proper field would at least help the gap in my resume if I give up and do an office job.

          Don’t listen to the trolls about your skin color, that’s a bullshit cop out.

          The animation business is all about who you know. You need to continue pushing your projects out there and network with as many people in the business as you can.

          Do you have a Twitter or Instagram where you can post your work? What about a Patreon or Subscribestar to make side-money doing commissions?

          I know race is bullshit because my foot is currently jammed in the door, I just need to open it.
          I’ve even been to several WiA events and let me tell you, the majority of it is white men.
          I network regularly(currently 80 connections in linkedin and growing, I attend Hollywood parties, networking events, workshops, post to Instagram and Twitter, I do all I can. I do know people, but none that can give me a proper push.

          I don’t have patreon or subscribe Star because I don’t have an audience that would pay for such a thing. I’m not someone interesting enough to rake in “influencer money”

          What does get you blacklisted from the industry?

          Shitty work ethic and being annoying to work with. People have to like you. I know many openly right wing people in animation even, they just don’t start fights for no reason

          Who is this cute girl in the OP picture.

          Andrea Davenport from Molly McGee, the only reason to watch that show

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            Why not go back to school and continue to apply places while you work on a degree?

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            Either show some stuff or I don't care. Sorry anon, but anyone can come in here and say wild shit, doesn't mean it's true. Every month we get the same "leak" of Steven Universe returning with some special called "Diamonds are Unbreakable" and they're not true. If you can't even show you art I'm just going to assume you're roleplaying.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        WHAT RACES

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          NASCAR, the Great Race, ooo the Wacky Races

  2. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Your art is probably shit. Work on it more. Know more people as well.

    • 2 years ago
      guy

      Lmao this is the worst thing for a shill to say. You should be particularly ashamed. People in today's industry draw worse than 10-year-olds with rare exception

      Show some of your art. Posting on Cinemaphile does not get you blacklisted. I guarantee you most people in the industry peek at it from time to time.

      If you express any sort of disagreement with animation industry norms and associate it with your artwork that is wrong. Only if you're already a mind slave to an industry you haven't entered is that right, and that's really unlikely.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        I'm not normally one who thinks you should have to know how to do something to criticize others for doing said thing poorly, but you, someone notorious for constantly b***hing about their exclusion from the industry, have literally included an example of your legendarily terrible art right there in your post claiming people in the industry draw worse than 10 year olds. You have a complete inability to spot contradictions between your actions.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Ok toon.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Who screencaps their own (You)s?

  3. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Why would college get you a job?

  4. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    If you’re looking for advice here I have bad news for you

  5. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Don’t listen to the trolls about your skin color, that’s a bullshit cop out.

    The animation business is all about who you know. You need to continue pushing your projects out there and network with as many people in the business as you can.

    Do you have a Twitter or Instagram where you can post your work? What about a Patreon or Subscribestar to make side-money doing commissions?

  6. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Who is this cute girl in the OP picture.

  7. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    >ghost and molly mcgee
    Your little project is generic as frick ins't it? Teenager girl protagonist? goofy sidekick? generic lore, low stakes and shitty jokes?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Nope.
      I intentionally used a show that in no way like my project for this thread.

      Why not go back to school and continue to apply places while you work on a degree?

      Mainly because I’ll have less time to network and attend events

      Why don't you try to get a job at an ad agency or something while you try to get a job in the narrative industry? Something where you can get paid for doing art?

      Tried, no success.ni continue to try daily of course. I practically live on job boards.

      Are you only interested in pitching your original projects or have you been making an active effort to try and get a crew job? You mention you “ haven’t even been able to score a job as a mailroom grunt” but it doesn’t sound like you’ve been applying for every low-level art department job you can find like you should be. Everyone has to start somewhere and get a couple credits

      I’ve applied to every low level job imaginable. The two closest times were last year when Netflix almost hired me to write for an upcoming show, and I BBC may Nickelodeon almost hired me to work in their outreach department, I interviewed twice for both but was ultimately passed up, which is normal for any job

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Welcome to the world of animation in our modern era. If you’re honest about everything you’re saying and you really can’t find even the most menial of industry jobs, you might just need to think about reinventing your style/direction entirely. If it hasnt worked after this many attempts, then you arent showing producers/executives what they want.
        It sucks, but animation isnt what it was like in the 90s. In some ways its more liberating, but in others it constricts anything that wont rake in millions of fandom-whoring revenue. If youre not interesting to the masses, youre interesting to none. Just look at what happened to Final Space

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Final Space got cancelled but Olan raised $400k in a Kickstarter.

          Which isn't nothing but it's not really enough.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        If you've managed to get interviews, then you're already way up in their list. They don't interview people that aren't serious candidates

  8. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Nice blog gay.

  9. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Why don't you try to get a job at an ad agency or something while you try to get a job in the narrative industry? Something where you can get paid for doing art?

  10. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Are you only interested in pitching your original projects or have you been making an active effort to try and get a crew job? You mention you “ haven’t even been able to score a job as a mailroom grunt” but it doesn’t sound like you’ve been applying for every low-level art department job you can find like you should be. Everyone has to start somewhere and get a couple credits

  11. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Hey man, I'd like to be the artists who make the characters. Idc about a job from it, I'd just do it for fun, but I want to be a GOOD fanart creator.

    Tldr is, what programs do you use for drawing? Do animations like Molly McGee use vector art?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      I enjoy creating and do it for free, but it’s still what I’d like to do for a living instead of having it be a hobby.

      toon boom is the industry standard, but various softwares are used depending on the studio.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Thanks man. I've heard of Toon Boom when researching before. I think it does both bitmap and vector, I assume the industry uses vector?

        How did you learn?

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Lots of trial and error and a brief stint working at an ad agency. I made very boring commercials you see at gas station screens(they had to be boring because the brands demanded it) but through that I got to learn a lot about his room boom works. I’m admittedly not the greatest animator in the world, but I can get a competent pitch produced

  12. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Have you tried making a different cartoon project? Something more marketable?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      The current project is the 7th one I’ve shopped around and the one that has gotten the most positive reception.

      That said I am submitting a very different one to Nickelodeon for consideration in their shorts program. And I did develop a Junior show concept as well.

      Welcome to the world of animation in our modern era. If you’re honest about everything you’re saying and you really can’t find even the most menial of industry jobs, you might just need to think about reinventing your style/direction entirely. If it hasnt worked after this many attempts, then you arent showing producers/executives what they want.
      It sucks, but animation isnt what it was like in the 90s. In some ways its more liberating, but in others it constricts anything that wont rake in millions of fandom-whoring revenue. If youre not interesting to the masses, youre interesting to none. Just look at what happened to Final Space

      Final Space got cancelled but Olan raised $400k in a Kickstarter.

      Which isn't nothing but it's not really enough.

      I think choice of network was Final Space’s biggest issue. It was good, but it wasn’t the type of humor American Dad is, and American Dad is the only other animated show TBS puts out. They also heavily advertised Conan’s involvement with the show but it didn’t have a Conan comedic style to it, which was likely jarring and potentially boring to the TBS audience.
      I also personally think the pilot on YouTube was funnier and more compelling than the show itself, but I still ultimately enjoyed it and wished it got a proper ending

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        maybe you should try actually producing a cartoon about a stupid girl and her goofy talking pet sidekick fighting some villain with some isekai, who knows, it's by far the the most safe bet nowadays, you can try something else after getting inside the industry, Stan Lee constantly tried to write other kinds of story but only his superhero comics were ever approved.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          The closest I ever came to that was one where the stupid girl was also the goofy sidekick and the boy character has to keep her in line. It was an alright idea but one that was just thrown together hastily when I was asked to submit something involving magic.
          It wasn’t an idea I was ever passionate about and didn’t shop it around further

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            the goofy talking sidekick is important
            girl protagonist + non human little sidekick + unique magic object + villain + villain sidekick + isekai world

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              No one would watch that this soon after Amphibia ended

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Are you sure? Star vs, Infinity Train, Owl House, Amphibia, Hilda, The Ghost and Molly Mcgee

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              I’ll try for fun…

              >girl protagonist
              Half Japanese and half French. Lives in the USA. Girl is quirky, likes anime and art, and is not afraid to try new things and makes friends quickly despite being a weirdo sometimes.

              >non human little sidekick
              Small lion the size of a teddy bear whose powers have been sealed due to the awakening of the antagonist, but is there to guide the protagonist in her quest. Reminiscing of the guardian statues in his true form

              >unique magic object
              A magic metallic fan that can change size and conjure strong winds. She can use it to fly around, knock back opponents around non lethally, and cut monsters made of darkness

              >villain
              Shogun of darkness, who needs the pieces of his dark katana in order to reforge it, and bring himself fully back to the physical realm

              >villain sidekick
              Kunoichi/Wizard woman that can channel the powers of the dark realm to bring a fraction of the shogun’s army. Each shard she obtains expand her powers (or those of a shadow samurai/ninja) greatly.

              >isekai world
              Each shard of the katana creates a small pocket of the dark world, world where the minions are stronger. It also transforms everything to look like a distorted equivalent of any object in feudal Japan

              What do you guys think?

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >Half Japanese and half French.
                Good luck finding a japanese-french voice actor

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Miraculous Ladybug got half French half Chinese protag, doesn’t seem that hard

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                are you foolish? you can just get an asian woman. or a french woman. or neither.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                I'm interested.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >try for fun
                >clearly and idea youve had for years

                homie please

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                I literally just wrote it before going to bed, though the first half of what I wrote was me joking about it, then I got a bit serious

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                I'm interested.

                >try for fun
                >clearly and idea youve had for years

                homie please

                I literally just wrote it before going to bed, though the first half of what I wrote was me joking about it, then I got a bit serious

                Now you guys know why the industry release so many shows like that, with this formula anyone can easily create something solid, interesting and marketable, it's just that easy

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Do you think this idea can be pulled out of Cinemaphile? Started as a joke but I see that I can have fun with it.

                If not, that sounds like the thing that we could writegay here.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Rule of thumb is “If you have an idea, three people babe the same idea, two people are writing it, and one person is already pitching it.”

                What this essentially means is that you can’t and shouldn’t be upset or angry if w similar idea is made because there’s a lot of people coming up with a lot of ideas every day.
                So take the idea off of Cinemaphile. There’s a 0% chance someone can say you started it in Cinemaphile with 100% certainty even if they have archived

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                If you are not japanese, some people would call it cultural appropriation.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Some would surely. You can’t stop that. But I think it just shows how cool I think their culture is.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >Some would surely. You can’t stop that.
                and the industry will avoid the drama by not hiring you

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                (X) -Doubt

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >girl protagonist + non human little sidekick + unique magic object + villain + villain sidekick + isekai world
                Don't forget the 1 to 3 human friends and the human bully or rival

                The protagonist must to overcame some kind of real life personal problem as well like being lonely, foolish a pushover or a jerk

                With this combination I don't anyone can frick up, now just think about some simple and still not recently used worldbuilding like a desert or industrial world

                Okay let's exand more...

                >1 to 3 human friends
                Multicultural and among those who at first were reluctant to join in the protagonist's shenanigans, but after 1 or two adventures they became close friends. Either it's all girls, or there's one boy that would surely become the love interest by default. Each shard of the katana could manifest (or used to its fullest) when in contact with a person, and the first victims would be the protagonist's friends... kinda like the unown in the pokemon movie. The Kunoichi would send minions to recover the shard/assist the "Dark Host" at defeating the protagonist

                >human bully or rival
                Mean girl that piss off everyone, and unintentionally led them to find shards of the katana. Ex: school trip in the woods, she's paired with 'X', annoys 'X', 'X' goes in a cave to vent and finds a shard, give into the shadows in their heart, creates a dark realm around the cave and forest, wants to have revenge on the bully, protagonist intervene and saves the day. Sometimes the Kunoichi retrieves the fragment because the protagonist is too busy saving the dark host

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              >girl protagonist + non human little sidekick + unique magic object + villain + villain sidekick + isekai world
              Don't forget the 1 to 3 human friends and the human bully or rival

              The protagonist must to overcame some kind of real life personal problem as well like being lonely, foolish a pushover or a jerk

              With this combination I don't anyone can frick up, now just think about some simple and still not recently used worldbuilding like a desert or industrial world

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Can confirm, I am a consoomer and I want more pretty brightly colored tween girl protags like Star or deutoroprotags like Mabel (srs).

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            Pedo confirmed

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Keep trying bro, I believe in you.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        >The current project is the 7th one I’ve shopped around and the one that has gotten the most positive reception.
        I don't know the industry, I just comsume, but you are getting closer, keep the grind anon.

  13. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Frick off Pan.

  14. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Sorry Ground Kieth and Miss Citrus didn’t get approved.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Never heard of either

  15. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Just post ye shit.

  16. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Try teaming up with other people to create a short or something on your own time. Can't hurt other than opportunity cost.

  17. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Anon my best advice is to wait two years. No one is gonna be picking up shows. We are about to hit a recession.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Ironically, that’s how long it would take me to get a degree.

      Try teaming up with other people to create a short or something on your own time. Can't hurt other than opportunity cost.

      I’ve produced comics with others and while I have the ability to get high quality voice over talent through connects to a prominent voice director, the actual cost of putting it all together wouldn’t be cheap. Unless I did some puppet show thing like epithet, but I don’t think that worked out too well for the jello guy

  18. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Damn, this sounds like rough work overall. I'm not going to pretend I know jackshit about the industry, but what is it like? I'm curious, but not curious enough to venture into the unknown and have to move to Cali probably.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Moving to Cali is not necessary, but it makes it easier since you can attend in person events. Like just last month I was at a party where I met David Hayter and he introduced me to producers who worked for PlayStation. That in no way helps me get work, but it gives me reason to be able to talk to them should I meet them again.

      Generally people are inviting and welcoming. They’re regular people who love to chat. I’ve seen Oscar nominated short film directors discuss Chris Chan with a list writers, and I personally listened to a prominent voice director rant about how annoying it was to cast people now because of race requirements.
      I’ve had the same conversations I would have with people on Cinemaphile with animation people. The only real difference is that it’s in a more “professional” setting. You don’t swear as often, and you generally don’t say “homosexual.”
      I’d even say the few trannies I have met were not the kind who get hostile when misgendered.
      People like to say it’s an incestuous industry, but really it’s just small, so if you know one person, you’re usually no more than 4 degrees of separation from another. It’s mostly welcoming, just don’t be an butthole.
      Like, during 2020 when animal crossing was big, I ended up playing it with almost the entire crew of Ducktales on my island because I had made a joke shrine to Scrooge and one of them wanted to see it and invited others. Just be normal and chat about whatever interests them.

      Either show some stuff or I don't care. Sorry anon, but anyone can come in here and say wild shit, doesn't mean it's true. Every month we get the same "leak" of Steven Universe returning with some special called "Diamonds are Unbreakable" and they're not true. If you can't even show you art I'm just going to assume you're roleplaying.

      I have no leaks. I’m just a mostly defeated man not sure if I should give up or keep going. You have no reason to believe me because I’m a nobody

      • 2 years ago
        guy

        The things you say about people in the industry are exactly what I would expect. You have to work hard to please them, making sure not to offend ever, even making fun of them as a friendly gesture is off limits. Basically a dynamic of an abusive family.

        >Generally people are inviting and welcoming. They’re regular people who love to chat.
        Not if you uphold artistic standards for example, they hate any sort of measurement of quality to live up to. I'm not seeing much sign that you hold to any particular standard.

        Attacking some dude playing a video game makes them look psychotic and untrustworthy to be around kids, doesn't mean they want to work with you or vouch for you or would help you if you got canceled. The comment I'm replying to below is a sign of how the industry treats dissenters

        I'm not normally one who thinks you should have to know how to do something to criticize others for doing said thing poorly, but you, someone notorious for constantly b***hing about their exclusion from the industry, have literally included an example of your legendarily terrible art right there in your post claiming people in the industry draw worse than 10 year olds. You have a complete inability to spot contradictions between your actions.

        Yet another insane attempt to insult me which I quit reading. Imagine spending your time thinking about the next frothing mad insult you're going to send to persecuted artist anonymously instead of drawing, Animation student.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          You’re insane. I have seen first hand that literally all of that is false.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        They sound like a bunch of immature normalgays who have no business being in the industry to begin with. I also hold most people who worked on CN in low esteem and most people who worked on FoxKids and Warner Brothers to be the real mature talent. For me a show like TheLastAirbender is the norm, not the exception. A show needs to be like Pirates of Dark Water, Spiderman TAS, Batman TAS. Shows you see on PBS again have far more talent than the crappy in-house shows you saw on CN. The only shows worth a shit to me on CN is Kids Next Door, Swat Kats and Megas XLR.
        >voice director rant about how annoying it was to cast people now because of race requirements.
        So they're fricking themselves over rather than somebody actually pushing for it.
        Same way they fricked themselves over with the DuckTales reboot with those ugly designs and overfocus on the trio rather than Scrooge and Donald.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        >I’m just a mostly defeated man not sure if I should give up or keep going. You have no reason to believe me because I’m a nobody
        I'm with that other anon, sounds to me like you're just bullshitting and enjoying the attention. You don't even need to show the stuff you pitched to studios, just show us what you can do.
        But I doubt you would do that as well with a bullshit excuse like "They can tell based on the style who I am"(Oh please, as if they have enough time to remember the thousands of styles newcomers send them and then recognize them on a Cinemaphile thread of all places)

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Not him but as someone who goes through self doubt at times i can say that this isn't looking for attention, it's looking for someone who can help.
          I know it might seem weird for someone to look for such help on Cinemaphile of all places but when people are in that state of mind people tend to get desperate and seek out help in any place they can.

          >Doesn't understand "generally speaking" as a concept
          >Feeling personally attacked right now and am definitely not OP
          Anyone who is just an ideas guy won't get far in any industry. Or just an animator (sans any professional animation experience in OPs case)

          Additional labor shortens production of a creative process, it doesn't replace it. Some core individual or collaboration has to actually be able to make the decisions. Those people are the showrunners/producers. Someone who COULD do it all themselves, but to shorten production time from years to months everyone else is along to execute the vision.

          If OP or you or anyone else "in the industry" who... y'know, hasn't actually had a single job in the industry, spent a few hours drawing or writing after every networking party and failed product pitch and bombed interview you might actually have the body of work behind you to actually get into the industry. Yes you too could become SIR and work on half a season of Rick and Morty!

          >Doesn't understand "generally speaking" as a concept
          >Feeling personally attacked right now and am definitely not OP
          It's not that i feel attacked, it's just that you should have worded your post better.
          All in all though, i just fined your short sighted views of making a cartoon to be disrespectful to the profession and process of making a cartoon.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            > i can say that this isn't looking for attention, it's looking for someone who can help.
            then he would show his stuff to us
            You don't get it, I'm not saying he is scared of showing his stuff, I'm saying he is lying he ever had anything. He probably never even spoken to someone in the animation industry. He is just saying things you would "expect" someone to say, but then shows no proof whatsoever.

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              >dox yourself or you’re a lying imposter.

              Classic moron argument. You’re on the same mental level as Chris Chan

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                How are we supposed to help if we have nothing to go off of?

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >dox
                show us stuff that he hasn't pitched you fricking moron. If he has been doing it as long as he claims, he would have countless drawings that one couldn't track back to him.
                You're OP aren't ya?

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              Not OP but showing you when you got no real steak is a massive loss.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                you see this? This shitty sketch is something I drew when I was like 14, 23 years ago.
                Now get this: This shitty sketch is more than anything we have seen from OP.
                But let me also ask you this: Can you track me down because of this? I have a deviantart, go ahead, try. You have my age, you have a drawing, even my nationality if you try hard enough. Go ahead, dox me.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Sure. But not this one. OP didnt ask for advices, and industry is more than some nice anatomy or pleasing colors. You cant make 6 digits with one canvas. Certainly not this too either.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                At this point, if OP does show you something, regardless of quality, you will call it shit. That’s how this always works, there is literally nothing to prove to you

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Alright so since you clearly are OP, why are you so afraid of your idea being called shit? You asked for OUR help, so clearly you don’t actually want it and think your ideas are untouchable works of God that can’t be critiqued, like you really think we came in this thread to shit on you? We want you to succeed as much as you tell us you want to

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >You asked for OUR help

                No he didn’t.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                he did
                >Do I give up and go back to college to try and do a career change, or stick through it?
                How can we tell him he should change his career, if we don't know if he has the skills to even succeed in his career?

  19. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Are you the guy from the cartoon fallout rip off threads?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      I have no idea what that is, I’ve actually taken a break from Cinemaphile since April to work on stuff IRL. So I’m behind in the happenings here.

  20. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Hey, I work in the industry and I want to clarify something for you. The thing is, trying to pitch a show and trying to get hired on a crew are two different things that don't necessarily have much overlap. And getting a show picked up, or even going into development, as a total outsider is extremely unlikely. Why would a studio/network believe you could be a good showrunner without any experience (or name recognition to make up for it)? What evidence do you have that your show would be good other than "believe me I think it's gonna be cool"? Also, what else do you think all the hundreds of artists who actually work at these studios want to do? At least half of them probably want to pitch shows, and are closer to doing it by having solid connections and experience. Not saying this is you but I see anassumption by people online that the only reason people working in the industry aren't selling shows left and right is because it hasn't occured to them, or that they're not interested. A first step is getting hired as part of a crew, but you can't just say "I want to get hired on a crew so then I can sell a show." It's a long game and most people never win, that's part of why so many animators on twitter are always complaining.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Not entirely accurate. There’s plenty of examples of people selling a show without having prior industry credits.

      And at the same time, if OP has really had pitch meetings and is networking, he seems at least further up the ladder than many of the standard employees

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      What job do you have?

  21. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Then maybe anon, the problem is (You).
    Fix your fricking personality first, then go make a cartoon.

  22. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    This is actually an interesting thread that i honestly needed but didn't know i needed.
    I myself am working on a cartoon, i haven't pitched it yet, it's still early in development, but this really does give me more insight to what i can expect.
    Thank you. I hope for the best for both of us.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Feel free to ask questions, I’ve pitched enough and spoken with enough people who pitch to know the process fairly well.

      I plan to take college again if i m not making the big shot this week/month online ala hironobu sakaguchi/Final fantasy

      Maybe it s the switch to my universal luck or karma lol

      Sadly that was a fake story, but I’m in the same boat. As my OP said, I’m heavily debating going back to college, moving someplace cheaper and doing standard office work as opposed to continuing trying to be in animation. I’ve had chances but no break. But at the same time I don’t want to give up on my dreams. There’s still a lot of passion left and I know I won’t be happy if I give up.

      They sound like a bunch of immature normalgays who have no business being in the industry to begin with. I also hold most people who worked on CN in low esteem and most people who worked on FoxKids and Warner Brothers to be the real mature talent. For me a show like TheLastAirbender is the norm, not the exception. A show needs to be like Pirates of Dark Water, Spiderman TAS, Batman TAS. Shows you see on PBS again have far more talent than the crappy in-house shows you saw on CN. The only shows worth a shit to me on CN is Kids Next Door, Swat Kats and Megas XLR.
      >voice director rant about how annoying it was to cast people now because of race requirements.
      So they're fricking themselves over rather than somebody actually pushing for it.
      Same way they fricked themselves over with the DuckTales reboot with those ugly designs and overfocus on the trio rather than Scrooge and Donald.

      You really need to look at the cultures that lead to the shows you’re talking about.
      Action shows like Batman, Spider-Man, X-Men, Silver Surfer etc we’re all part of the Saturday morning line ups. They aired at a time when cable was not the norm and essentially every child in America was essentially captive on the main networks for a set amount of time. I’m this era, ad space, especially for toys, candy, and cereal were at their peaks and shows could afford high budgets and intense action to keep kids coming in.
      You actually saw this well into the 2000’s as Foxbox/4Kids tv kept with the action packed Saturday morning trend and was more or less a child-friendly version of toonami.
      Cartoon Network was the first channel dedicated exclusively to cartoons and relied heavily on the Hannah Barbera/Warner Bros back catalogue to stay afloat. They needed shows that wouldn’t clash with what the kids were going to be watching, which is why the average 90’s cartoon cartoon was a comedy in the vein of a Hannah barbera show. They wouldn’t formally adopt action until the mid-2000’s.
      Nickelodeon had a similar approach. It was mainly acquired programming and sitcoms from as early as the 70’s with pinwheel before getting a Chuck jones style show with Ren and Stimpy, setting the tone for the channel to this day. It was the mid-2000’s desire dir action that lead to the Avatar, Danny Phantom, Teenage Robots.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Fake story??? What u mean?

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Final fantasy was not a last hurrah by sakaguchi. That’s just how the legend goes because it’s a nice story.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            But... this is on wikipedia and many more.. can you disprove this? Also it s a horrible story coupled with his more recently un-bill-able projects and studio after his departure from square given his ALSO unbillable triple A cg movie... it s just a horrible disastrous lineup of a career.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        If you really think it's you (like you personally) and not your animation, have someone else pitch your show for you.

        >but that will be difficult because
        Uh huh, but it's literally your only option

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          I don’t think it’s me. Selling a show is extremely difficult and a lot of it is luck mixed with right place at the right time. I’ve been told I was impressive in my delivery and ability to pitch by several people, communication has never been a problem for me.

          But... this is on wikipedia and many more.. can you disprove this? Also it s a horrible story coupled with his more recently un-bill-able projects and studio after his departure from square given his ALSO unbillable triple A cg movie... it s just a horrible disastrous lineup of a career.

          https://www.destructoid.com/final-fantasy-was-almost-called-fighting-fantasy-creator-explains-actual-reason-behind-the-name/

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        >Feel free to ask questions, I’ve pitched enough and spoken with enough people who pitch to know the process fairly well.
        What are the industry's views on foreign animation?
        Should i try my luck with a well known USA studio or should i stick with my home country?

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Depends on who you go with. Netflix loves to grab foreign shows, especially the ones with no dialog. And I know people who we to Australia and New Zealand to get stuff made: Malaysia is also growing as an animation hub. And of course French shows are usually popular exports. Generally speaking, if your show idea has broad appeal and doesn’t rely heavily on cultural context, it can usually find distribution here.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            >Generally speaking, if your show idea has broad appeal and doesn’t rely heavily on cultural context, it can usually find distribution here.
            Well frick me i guess. Part of my show's identity is that it's very Canadian.
            And yes, Canada is my home country. Sorry that i forgot to specify that.

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              Most Canadian cartoons never leave Canada.
              But I’m the bright side, at least you get the Canada arts grant, so it’s generally cheaper to make a cartoon in Canada.

              Of course, plenty still do. Grizzly and the Lemmings is doing insanely well all over the world right now and that’s such a Canadian show that you see the flag in every episode

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                I never heard of that show before.
                I just watched some footage and it's a fun looking show.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                It’s basically a Tom and Jerry-like thing. I think the most unique aspect, for me at least, is that every episode ends very badly for both sides. Which I enjoy because I always wanted Jerry to be punished as a kid and he never did. I’m this show, everyone is an butthole.

                Of course it mainly gets circulation because it has no dialog and nearly no text, so it can just be plopped on TV or an app in any country and it’s CG so it’s cheap to produce

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Also literally every episode has a chase scene down the road, allowing them to reuse the same tree backgrounds flinstones style without issue

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Also literally every episode has a chase scene down the road, allowing them to reuse the same tree backgrounds flinstones style without issue

                Well the show i'm working on is more complex than that so i don't think the same would apply.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                I mean, if Total Drama. 6Teen, Stoked, Johnny Test, Ed Edd n Eddy, and Lloyd in Space can escape Canada, no reason your show can’t

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                I feel like i should bring up the fact that Johnny Test started as an USA cartoon by yeah, i see your point.
                I just panicked a bit after what you said about Canadian shows.

  23. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    How does the cartoon industry differ from the video game industry?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      In the cartoon industry, you can pitch with just a well written idea. Big Mouth famously had no art whatsoever when it was pitched and picked up. It also needs to decide how it’s going to monetize differently.
      In games it’s either game sales or micro transactions.
      In animation it’s either advertising, merchandise, or streaming subs. If X amount of people in said platform watch it, they equate to how much money it made based on a ratio of hours watched vs the overall sub cost.

      In gaming, you have to either have a prototype or be very high up in the company to pitch a game. That said however, a prototype or demo is often easier to make and sell on the crowd funding market since you can use unity/epic assets as place holders.

      The cost is also just different. A single episode of a cartoon can range anywhere from $750,000 to over a million depending on the budget and talent involved, and usually there’s a 13-20 episode order. Though shows considered high risk may only get a pilot or a short 6 episode test. For Instance, a lot of early SpongeBob episodes got monthly releases because at first Nick only ordered a small amount and then didn’t have enough to meet demand, so they shot episodes out as soon as they are done rather than finishing the season at once.

      There’s also demographics. There’s not as many adults interested in kids animation as opposed to kids games, and the market for non-sitcom adult animation is sadly not considered viable despite anime’s success.

  24. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    I plan to take college again if i m not making the big shot this week/month online ala hironobu sakaguchi/Final fantasy

    Maybe it s the switch to my universal luck or karma lol

  25. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Have you ever considered doing short animations as commisions?
    You could get a wagie job and do commisions in your off time, it's what I do, except I don't animate them I just make 3d models and rig them according to what they ask for.

  26. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    >had 4 years of time
    >Have no product to show for it

    Literally nothing is stopping you from writing, storyboarding, and ultimately animating a series let alone an episode. What else are you going to do with your time, wagecuck?
    >Oh I just have the idea written on a napkin and my totally unique wacky style that's impossible to translate to animation or literally just calarts, everyone else has to do the hard parts
    And you wonder why you're getting nowhere.

    Let's do some napkin math
    Take your average drawgay and their ~20min turnaround time for a passable quality lineart of 1-2 characters.
    Let's say you draw a pane for every 15 seconds of an 11 minute episode1. That's 44 sketches. 14 hours of work. 16 episodes, 702 and 234 hours of work.

    My point is you could do a detailed storyboard for an ENTIRE MINISERIES with a month concerted of effort. Probably knocking out the vast majority of keyframes for the sweatshop Koreans (or yourself) to make the real thing around.

    >Or just learn rigged animation

    But that requires writing, storyboarding, and actually executing a concept into a form you could do something with. If you can't do that and won't do that simply because it's what you n e e d to do, you aren't the kind of person that can go from nothing to showrunner. You're likely in it for clout and are demonstrably lazy. Your time value is probably near worthless, so the cheapest person you can find to work on YOUR IDEA if you actually have one is yourself. And if you won't, why think anyone else would throw money and effort into something you haven't even gone to bat for.

    If you were any good and had any real drive you'd have done that because you had a compulsion to. instead you've wasted years of your life trying to schmooze into the gay little clique of California animation when you could have spent that time just fricking making something.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Not OP but all of that is really, really, easier said than done, especially when you bring up multiple skills and talents that one person on their own can't do by themselves even if they can do all of them individually, but even that alone would take years.
      This is why teams are made to get a group of people together to help do what others can't do by themselves or can't do at all.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        If your entire contribution is
        >Ok guys like get this... A female protagonist! And she's light brown! Oh and there's going to be a sidekick character and an effeminate black guy who's super smart and a white guy I guess but he has to have black hair and be moderately dysgenic and...
        You're not contributing anything.

        If you can't write you can't world build and you can't make a cartoon. You'd implicitly only be a character designer at best and really just be a ghost artist for the teams actual head creative. The cope and seethe over not actually controlling "your" project as other people make all the major decisions is one of the very prescient reasons for why an ideas guy with no core skill isn't going to get an idea picked up to be made on someone else's dime. You and your "unique" idea are the most replaceable component of the production process.

        A storyboard for an 11 minute cartoon is something that could be done in a day or two. Core keyframes a week. Transition frames a month. Backgrounds and colorization a higher bar, but YouTube is full of people hitting it that are implicitly better than OP because they didn't stop actually animating after some 3 minute student project half a decade ago.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          I really do think you have a lack of understanding of the situation and are just ignorant to OP's side of the story.
          I also find your lack of reasoning to be closed minded at best.
          Also, like i said, i'm not OP so i don't know why you're responding to me as if i was the guy you replied to.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            >Doesn't understand "generally speaking" as a concept
            >Feeling personally attacked right now and am definitely not OP
            Anyone who is just an ideas guy won't get far in any industry. Or just an animator (sans any professional animation experience in OPs case)

            Additional labor shortens production of a creative process, it doesn't replace it. Some core individual or collaboration has to actually be able to make the decisions. Those people are the showrunners/producers. Someone who COULD do it all themselves, but to shorten production time from years to months everyone else is along to execute the vision.

            If OP or you or anyone else "in the industry" who... y'know, hasn't actually had a single job in the industry, spent a few hours drawing or writing after every networking party and failed product pitch and bombed interview you might actually have the body of work behind you to actually get into the industry. Yes you too could become SIR and work on half a season of Rick and Morty!

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      I’m OP but why are you greentexting arguments I didn’t make? Not would I have never made any of those arguments, you’re assuming a hell of a lot without reading or asking if I’ve put out anything.
      I have webcomics out there to be read, I’ve done work in advertising, I write and create daily, but there is still a major difference between what I can accomplish solo and what I can accomplish with a budget to hire a full staff. But also as I stated, I don’t need to be the head of something. I just want to be able to create and do what I love for a living, I would be more than happy working as a staff writer or staff artist.

      I’m not sure why you’re so hostile, but I hope whatever it is goes away and you can mellow out

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Because you need a kick in the pants or a wakeup call you aren't getting from hollow affirmations from industry "friends" keeping a rival out of the secret club.

        How many minutes of animation do you have to your name that you can actually show someone. How many full scripts. Storyboards.

        You're hanging on the fact these people keep telling you you're "soooo good omg" at the pitch while pitching vaporware. "Cartoons" with design docs on a wienertail napkin that can carry a 10 minute face to face but everyone knows can be thought up by anyone.

        And hell, ever think those interviews for entry level jobs you're not getting
        >You're getting interviewed through cronyism from knowing people
        >You're not getting hired for because you have no portfolio to back up the nod from the right people
        You're framing things like you're doing everything right and seeking a pity party yet at the same time offering authoritative advice to others about an industry you've never actually gotten a job in. You're doing something wrong. You're avoiding all the hard, actual legwork of the industry you claim you're infatuated with. Yet you won't make a 3minute short for your own enjoyment about a concept you think can carry a series.

        You'll get your shit together however that shit needs to be gotten together or as is currently happening you'll get drummed out of the interview pool regardless of how many elbows you can rub.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Yeah, you have proven you have no idea how the industry works at all.
          I’m sorry you never made it.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            Consider your state of employment m8
            You know even less apparently

            Not him but as someone who goes through self doubt at times i can say that this isn't looking for attention, it's looking for someone who can help.
            I know it might seem weird for someone to look for such help on Cinemaphile of all places but when people are in that state of mind people tend to get desperate and seek out help in any place they can.
            [...]
            >Doesn't understand "generally speaking" as a concept
            >Feeling personally attacked right now and am definitely not OP
            It's not that i feel attacked, it's just that you should have worded your post better.
            All in all though, i just fined your short sighted views of making a cartoon to be disrespectful to the profession and process of making a cartoon.

            I'm fully aware it takes a single person months to get a piece of traditional keyframed animation past the few minute mark and more people can get that same piece of animation out in the same number of hours. Hundreds of people are doing it right now and uploading it for the sake of doing. Then some of them become vizziepop(or one of her barista animators) or meatcanyon or Tom and Don or the myriad of others making unique things small and large through a non legacy distribution network.

            There is an art school mafia route to studio employment and a indie animator route to studio employment and OP is blind to both.

            Look how he copes about simple questions like how many minutes of animation are in his portfolio. He not only has no projects he's worked on, he has no example of his skill to even become a lowtier keyframe monkey on a project. And he thinks knowing people will replace having a concrete skill and reputation to bulwark a project pitch. That someone will just give him several million, writers, animators, distribution for a full show he can't even show an OC animation test for.

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              Well you don't really need either of those two options you brought up, those options aren't for everybody. And the examples of people you brought up really is just a small amount compared to the hundreds of others who're less fortunate. Not everyone is a Vizzie.

              > i can say that this isn't looking for attention, it's looking for someone who can help.
              then he would show his stuff to us
              You don't get it, I'm not saying he is scared of showing his stuff, I'm saying he is lying he ever had anything. He probably never even spoken to someone in the animation industry. He is just saying things you would "expect" someone to say, but then shows no proof whatsoever.

              Yeah i know. But you have to understand that he doesn't have to show his work. We don't need to know someone's work to help them with self doubt or possibly even depression. (Not saying OP is depressed, just bringing up the possibility)
              Also, posting your work on the internet isn't a good idea to begin with as there's tons of issues that can come from showing to the public what's supposed to be private.
              For example the work posted can get stolen or if it does turn into a show then it could give spoilers or people can connect you and your work to your social media life. All things not everyone would want that's for sure. There's just problems with posting posting information that should stay private. I have been told this by lots of people, including writers over on Cinemaphile.

              >You do know that a lot of cartoons where made just based on a few ideas, right?
              Those are made because of who people's relatives are anon. Or who they know, building off an existing reputation. You and OP aren't Seth Rogan, able to blow a bong rip into an execs face and rant for 20 minutes about how much he fricking hates Christmas.

              Butch Hartman could walk in and pitch a show in his existing style with his core elements and 5 minutes and get a greenlight without having the rest of the work in hand. He'd also be calling his own people to flush out the project.

              OP has been too busy starfricking to actually collaborate with anyone apparently. Because if he can't write someone in his position should know a few who can. Know more animation guys who defer to his personality. Composer, voice actors, the networking that actually matters. A team of 3 can do a lot, things like actually get a self produced short cobbled together to sell an idea.

              >The big picture being that it doesn't matter how much scripts, animations or storyboards you make
              Nature of the beast. Every single person pretending to be in the animation industry thinks they have breakthrough ideas. Most don't. There are a thousand nevers for each of the ~50 mainstream series made every year. But your chances of getting a series as a nobody with nothing are much lower than the already low figure of being an established working grunt in a US side studio or an indie creator with an ever growing body of work.

              Honestly your posts read like a pessimist who's bitter for getting his dreams crushed and now your using your own personal experiences to fuel a biased view of the industry and discouraging people just because you got burned despite the fact that it's not always that way.

              you see this? This shitty sketch is something I drew when I was like 14, 23 years ago.
              Now get this: This shitty sketch is more than anything we have seen from OP.
              But let me also ask you this: Can you track me down because of this? I have a deviantart, go ahead, try. You have my age, you have a drawing, even my nationality if you try hard enough. Go ahead, dox me.

              Not him but there's a difference between posting a drawing you made decades ago and posting story and artwork from a project you hope to be made into a full show.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Hi OP

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                How many times do i have to tell you, i'm not OP. I'm not even mixed race like OP says that he is, i'm a white man.
                If you really wanna know who i am i'm this guy

                This is actually an interesting thread that i honestly needed but didn't know i needed.
                I myself am working on a cartoon, i haven't pitched it yet, it's still early in development, but this really does give me more insight to what i can expect.
                Thank you. I hope for the best for both of us.

                His whole "concern" is that posting this thread will impact his chances in the industry so can't post a single doodle but can't help himself but name-drop someone who if he's not bullshitting would be a backtrace to everyone knowing he's a weird Cinemaphile incel since his network is so tight and interconnected.

                He's having a larp somewhere in this. All possibilities are pretty pathetic. In the time OP has spent saying he can't show art he could have drawn some actual OC.

                >and posting story and artwork from a project you hope to be made into a full show.
                why do you guys keep ignoring my advice of showing something that he does NOT pitch to a studio? That's why I showed that example of my teenage sketch. Just start somewhere you know its safe. Or create something new. 8 years ago I talked with some other anons in a similar thread, that time about my own drawings. They requested to show them an animation, but I didn't had anything current. You know what I did? I created something on the spot! Because I was serious about getting help.

                While i don't doubt he made some mistakes with the thread i will say that as a guy who wrote a script myself i wouldn't want to post it online and in public because i prefer to keep my online life, my irl life and my possible business life to be separate so i understand not wanting to post anything.
                And for the "Why doesn't he create OC" thing is that it's not that easy to just come up with something on the spot, or maybe he just didn't think of doing so and assumed all people wanted was his other projects that he's more serious about.
                Maybe try giving him a request to draw something and he can deliver it.

                [...]
                [...]
                [...]
                Now you guys know why the industry release so many shows like that, with this formula anyone can easily create something solid, interesting and marketable, it's just that easy

                I prefer to do something original, well, original compared to the stuff we're getting now.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >Maybe try giving him a request to draw something and he can deliver it.
                Okay, sure

                https://i.imgur.com/ltTJ6Hr.jpg

                Been trying to break into animation since 2018. Created several different projects and worked at pitching them to a variety studios and production companies. All have been rejected for one reason or another.
                Some with negative reception, others with positive reception over all.
                I attend regular networking events and know at least one person at every major studio, but that doesn’t always equate to a pitch opportunity.
                Last year I was almost picked up to work on a show at Netflix, but they ultimately hired someone else.
                This year I had two opportunists. One meeting to pitch to a certain company that will go unnamed, but is globally known. Then with a newer company with well established people behind it.
                The big one has not gotten back to me with a definitive answer, this is normal for them and I’ve had various producers and talent throughout the industry tell me “they’re dinosaurs who leave you hanging.” But after 5 months the smaller people got back to me with a kind rejection, but ultimately still a rejection.

                I’m at a point to where I don’t know what I’m supposed to do. Yes, I’ve had opportunities and I’m grateful for them, but I’ve also had zero actual wins and haven’t made a dime in my endeavors. I haven’t even been able to score a job as a mailroom grunt.
                Do I give up and go back to college to try and do a career change, or stick through it?
                I acknowledge that this route is more or less giving up on my goals forever and I don’t think I’ll ever be happy if I do that, but I’m not really happy now.

                Hey OP, think fast: we need a cartoon for ages 6-14, fantasy/isekai genre, one of the main characters needs to be a lesbian, another black. It has to be episodic with status quo. No lore shit, we're done with that. Give us a summary and concept sketches for 5 main characters. GO

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                You can be original AFTER you join the industry and turn rich and influential, know the rules and win the game.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Ah frick. I have dozens of scrips, dozens of stories, yet not a single one of them fits those descriptions.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                OP.

                This thread isn’t about my work and never has been. Me creating something new for you would honestly have no purpose whatsoever.
                You cannot gauge someone’s talent or “worthiness” in a thread like this. I’m doing some genuine life contemplating and was looking for perspectives on the situation. None of that requires more than I said in my OP. Nothing I have said was fake or a larp. You don’t have to believe any of it, this is Cinemaphile after all, but it’s the truth. I’m not going to perform for you.
                I’m not sure if the goal here is to prove you’re more talented than I am, or size yourself up compared to the few opportunities I have had, or even just blatant curiosity, but I personally don’t see it as relevant

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Hey, i'm the guy who's trying to give you the benefit of the doubt here. I'm the guy who's been defending you. Why are you treating me like i'm trying to put hate on you when i'm the one who's trying to help you?

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >and posting story and artwork from a project you hope to be made into a full show.
                why do you guys keep ignoring my advice of showing something that he does NOT pitch to a studio? That's why I showed that example of my teenage sketch. Just start somewhere you know its safe. Or create something new. 8 years ago I talked with some other anons in a similar thread, that time about my own drawings. They requested to show them an animation, but I didn't had anything current. You know what I did? I created something on the spot! Because I was serious about getting help.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          You do know that a lot of cartoons where made just based on a few ideas, right?
          Hell there are even tons of cartoons and creators that do exactly what you said yet still don't see the light of day.
          TL;DR What you're saying ultimately doesn't matter in the big picture. The big picture being that it doesn't matter how much scripts, animations or storyboards you make, a show can get picked up with none of that while a show can get shunned despite having all of that.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            >You do know that a lot of cartoons where made just based on a few ideas, right?
            Those are made because of who people's relatives are anon. Or who they know, building off an existing reputation. You and OP aren't Seth Rogan, able to blow a bong rip into an execs face and rant for 20 minutes about how much he fricking hates Christmas.

            Butch Hartman could walk in and pitch a show in his existing style with his core elements and 5 minutes and get a greenlight without having the rest of the work in hand. He'd also be calling his own people to flush out the project.

            OP has been too busy starfricking to actually collaborate with anyone apparently. Because if he can't write someone in his position should know a few who can. Know more animation guys who defer to his personality. Composer, voice actors, the networking that actually matters. A team of 3 can do a lot, things like actually get a self produced short cobbled together to sell an idea.

            >The big picture being that it doesn't matter how much scripts, animations or storyboards you make
            Nature of the beast. Every single person pretending to be in the animation industry thinks they have breakthrough ideas. Most don't. There are a thousand nevers for each of the ~50 mainstream series made every year. But your chances of getting a series as a nobody with nothing are much lower than the already low figure of being an established working grunt in a US side studio or an indie creator with an ever growing body of work.

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              I didnt decide, i just said IF he can’t write he should put his ego aside and find someone who can

              Am OP.
              I do not have an ego. But it’s funny that bring up Butch, I was literally talking to him last night. We met in 2020 through my voice coach. and he gave me his cell number,we talk a few times a month about random stuff. Obviously im not going to prove that, but I have a large enough network that I am not in need of help. If you read my OP, you’d have seen the entire point was deciding if I should stay motivated or give up and move on.

              Alright so since you clearly are OP, why are you so afraid of your idea being called shit? You asked for OUR help, so clearly you don’t actually want it and think your ideas are untouchable works of God that can’t be critiqued, like you really think we came in this thread to shit on you? We want you to succeed as much as you tell us you want to

              No, actually, that wasn’t me.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >I do not have an ego
                The first response of someone with an immense ego, everyone has an ego homie, you NEED an ego to break into the industry you keep telling us you want to get into, you just have to know when to use it and when to put it aside

                And you then you get braggadocious about your “network” that, from what you have told us since you are being weirdly scarce with the info provided, hasn’t done JACK SHIT for you, you havent gotten any crew members, voice actors or anything tangible to help with your shows or career from ANY of these guys, but according to you thats enough and you don’t need help…

                If you have to ask us to stay motivated OP you should just quit, you know every big creator and still havent gotten anything through the door and clearly too prideful for constructive criticism, you won’t go anywhere till you get over yourself

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                >Won't post art because he's so high profile and known surely it'll doxx him and they'll know he's the hacker known as Cinemaphile
                >Says he's a close personal contact who talks all the time with a public figure everyone can message on Twitter with screengrabs of your posts

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                It's possible. There are people in the industry who use Cinemaphile.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                His whole "concern" is that posting this thread will impact his chances in the industry so can't post a single doodle but can't help himself but name-drop someone who if he's not bullshitting would be a backtrace to everyone knowing he's a weird Cinemaphile incel since his network is so tight and interconnected.

                He's having a larp somewhere in this. All possibilities are pretty pathetic. In the time OP has spent saying he can't show art he could have drawn some actual OC.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Go at it for just a bit longer. Who knows, you might eventually strike gold.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Have you ever made a cartoon yourself? Serious question. I wanna know if you yourself have made anything or if you're just talking from your ass. No offence.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          This homie is right unfortunately, anyone can be an ideas guy, and theres nothing wrong with that, but you are expendable if you cant do anything else (write, storyboard, animate) its why you tend to see a lot of duos in the industry where one guy comes up with the ideas and another guy does everything else (Trey Parker and Matt Stone, Craig Thomas and Carter Bays, Ben Affleck and Matt Damon)

          My suggestion OP is if you arent a great writer artist storyboarder etc but good at coming up with concepts and pitching, find a co creator or assemble a crew who can do those other things and pitch your show together, stop being an egomaniac and trying to have complete control of your project because that will never happen, you need to bring something to the table other than you and your wet farts

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            >You do know that a lot of cartoons where made just based on a few ideas, right?
            Those are made because of who people's relatives are anon. Or who they know, building off an existing reputation. You and OP aren't Seth Rogan, able to blow a bong rip into an execs face and rant for 20 minutes about how much he fricking hates Christmas.

            Butch Hartman could walk in and pitch a show in his existing style with his core elements and 5 minutes and get a greenlight without having the rest of the work in hand. He'd also be calling his own people to flush out the project.

            OP has been too busy starfricking to actually collaborate with anyone apparently. Because if he can't write someone in his position should know a few who can. Know more animation guys who defer to his personality. Composer, voice actors, the networking that actually matters. A team of 3 can do a lot, things like actually get a self produced short cobbled together to sell an idea.

            >The big picture being that it doesn't matter how much scripts, animations or storyboards you make
            Nature of the beast. Every single person pretending to be in the animation industry thinks they have breakthrough ideas. Most don't. There are a thousand nevers for each of the ~50 mainstream series made every year. But your chances of getting a series as a nobody with nothing are much lower than the already low figure of being an established working grunt in a US side studio or an indie creator with an ever growing body of work.

            Why have you magically decided OP can’t write?

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              I didnt decide, i just said IF he can’t write he should put his ego aside and find someone who can

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              His posting style and mentality when he's talking about what's important that's failing to gain him literally any employment. If he could animate and write he could storyboard and get a full product proposal or just start making something, even for his own enjoyment and to do the ever important thing of actually honing his craft.

              His flex is also not working in marketing and he talks with the flash of a bullshit artist. Lots of aires. Might even be right about being a master of the pitch and the fine art of throwing out buzzwords about profitability and merchandizing while having no actual show to show. Or he's too fragile and deluded to realize smoke is being blown up his ass for the xth time of walking in on the grace of pitching the pitch to a industry contact and then secretly embarrassing everyone involved. Those opportunities stop coming and it'd be the height of irony if OP actually did sqaunder a dozen chances because he couldn't get real evidence he and the team he doesn't have could turn a 6 minute short into a profitable 2 season show by simply adding money to the equation.

  27. 2 years ago
    Seth Amphetamine

    Keep going, and if all else fails just do your own stuff on youtube.

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Like said, if you end up not being able to get the attention of any companies by pitching directly to them, you can try to make a career on youtube; you can both make youtube animations the career itself, OR it can be used to get the attention of companies and studios.

      I do wish you the best mah boi, animation is one of the career choices i wish i had pursued when i was younger. It's a lot of hard work, but when it's done, it is like magic, and always fascinates people of all ages. Godspeed, OP.

  28. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    What do you do for a living, between pitches and waiting for a response?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Script consulting, freelance marketing, and the odd acting job here and there.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Maybe try get into contract animation job, like some middle position like storyboarding or layout or design, and work you way up from here. The higher-ups usually trust people they already know are capable of managing a show and have some portfolio of work. ANiamtion does cost loads of money, and producers woudn't want to trust some rando with these budgets.
        Also maybe try to cut off from Cinemaphile for a year or so

  29. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Start your own youtube channel and post your shit, it worked for Hazbin Hotel, Cliffside, Puppycat, Murder Drones,Bravest Warriors etc

  30. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    if you need the money and you can't get a position at any level then it's probably best to go into another profession and work on your dream show in your spare time and post what you make on youtube/dailymotion/newgrounds/twitter/or here lol

  31. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Mixed race isn’t enough if you are a male that looks and acts like a normal male.

    Also some mixed races are as bad as whites to these libshits in the animation industry.

  32. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    >In this thread, OP tries to garner sympathy but shuts down when anon calls him out

    You should at the very least make a webcomic of your work
    That Supr Dee guy made a comic and now he's got work with SEGA, Eddsworld, a whole other newspaper comic, and Adult Swim contacted him at one point during his time working on Life with Kurami
    Three Bare Bears started out as a webcomic and got a show and spin off
    Megg Mogg and Owl was in the works for a show before the creator took their shit back after realizing how pozzed hollywood is

    You don't NEED to go directly to the studio these days. If you gain a big enough following there's a chance your webcomic will get picked up from there, you would have already shown a level of competence and material by that point. Webtoons is already making strides with that in mind

  33. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    never give up trust your instincts

  34. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Major studio writer here. Took me ten years to get my first writing job. If you're persistent and good, you will meet the right person who will give you your break. Don't give up!

  35. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    >Mollytroon is a loser
    Like poetry

  36. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Daily reminder "passion project" is a trap to filter the naive ones, the most sucessful artists consistently say they write whatever they think a lot of people would want to watch rather than what they would want to write for fun.

  37. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    this whole thread is incredibly funny to me. I know the OP and have seen his stuff. I've been talking with him since he started in 2018, I've seen all the pitches, one of them came from a dream and he woke up and instantly sent a message to me about it

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      >one of them came from a dream and he woke up and instantly sent a message to me about it
      Wtf is OP HP Lovecraft?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      Is there any way we can check on his work? i'm legit curious

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      >I know the OP and have seen his stuff
      Oh my are you guys dating or married?

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        >He doesn't check, evaluates, elongates and validates his homies and their stuff

  38. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    Have you tried not being such a whiny homosexual?

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      You see it's posts like this that make OP the victim.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        OP isn’t a victim. He’s just a whiner that came here hoping to vent and garner some sympathy.

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          Like i said, you're making him a victim. You're making him a victim by being so sour, to say the least. OP just looks better compared to you.

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            I’m not being sour. Just honest.

            • 2 years ago
              Anonymous

              OP proves he isn't a writer because he never changes diction while samegayging.
              >Should I give up guise I'm just so talented and go to so many parties and have so many connections in the hekkin studios and yet it's been 4 years of never getting a single job in the industry I claim to be a part of. Please tell me my days of being an unpaid background extra and barista will be over soon once the big studio finally gives me the show I deserve!
              Ok show us your art
              >Wow ok, like I'm not OP but you can't just ask someone about their art style like how is that even relevant. He's clearly so talented and unique any sketch getting posted to Cinemaphile will mean all his powerful friends will know can you please be better and give m... OP the praise he rightly deserves.
              >Yeah other guy! I'm also not OP and Animation is hard! You don't need a portfolio or past work to become a showrunner anyway!

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Pretty much. The amount of autistic samegayging here is tragic. Like I said OP should just quit being such a weenie.

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Pretty much. The amount of autistic samegayging here is tragic. Like I said OP should just quit being such a weenie.

                I’d say we should work on the idea

                I’ll try for fun…

                >girl protagonist
                Half Japanese and half French. Lives in the USA. Girl is quirky, likes anime and art, and is not afraid to try new things and makes friends quickly despite being a weirdo sometimes.

                >non human little sidekick
                Small lion the size of a teddy bear whose powers have been sealed due to the awakening of the antagonist, but is there to guide the protagonist in her quest. Reminiscing of the guardian statues in his true form

                >unique magic object
                A magic metallic fan that can change size and conjure strong winds. She can use it to fly around, knock back opponents around non lethally, and cut monsters made of darkness

                >villain
                Shogun of darkness, who needs the pieces of his dark katana in order to reforge it, and bring himself fully back to the physical realm

                >villain sidekick
                Kunoichi/Wizard woman that can channel the powers of the dark realm to bring a fraction of the shogun’s army. Each shard she obtains expand her powers (or those of a shadow samurai/ninja) greatly.

                >isekai world
                Each shard of the katana creates a small pocket of the dark world, world where the minions are stronger. It also transforms everything to look like a distorted equivalent of any object in feudal Japan

                What do you guys think?

                I had, or others, send it to multiple studios and laugh at OP’s face when we do in a few months what he couldn’t do in years

              • 2 years ago
                Anonymous

                Pretty much. The amount of autistic samegayging here is tragic. Like I said OP should just quit being such a weenie.

                How many times must i tell you people, i'm not OP. And like i said i'm not even mixed race.

  39. 2 years ago
    Anonymous

    sure lonely out here once OP was found out

    • 2 years ago
      Anonymous

      I wasn’t “found out” it’s a Thursday afternoon, I’m busy

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        Busy with what?

        • 2 years ago
          Anonymous

          With what? Waiting for that big break?

          My regular job? I said it earlier I do script consulting, and marketing

          • 2 years ago
            Anonymous

            You should focus on that.

      • 2 years ago
        Anonymous

        With what? Waiting for that big break?

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