Reaction would've been the same regardless. First, it was always an impossible fantasy that you would never have been satisfied by. >It's *different* >It's... bad!
This is the prequels/special editions hate all over again, and just as impotent and meaningless. The purpose of this is exercise is endless desire *itself*, that the complaints are baseless and without merit is what sustains this exercise.
Second, like the prequels, the desires of the fans did come true in a monkey-paw fashion: >I want Luke as a jedi master! >"Okay so we watched the movies and it's clear that the Jedi are huge frickups, just completely terrible as an organization. Directly responsible for Anakin murdering so many people and instigating interstellar wars of aggression."
Obviously, Luke as a jedi would be a frick-up, since the jedi themselves are frickups. But fans react to an actual understanding of the narrative of SW by rejecting it outright.
>>"Okay so we watched the movies and it's clear that the Jedi are huge frickups, just completely terrible as an organization.
They aren't >Directly responsible for Anakin murdering so many people and instigating interstellar wars of aggression."
They didn't >Obviously, Luke as a jedi would be a frick-up
Based on what? He was a natural hero.
Return of the Jedi was a 23 year old Luke desperately trying to stop the Sith from killing everybody just to remember there is another way
Sequels is a 53 year old Luke simply giving up in the middle of the fight and hiding while several of his friends and followers are destroyed by the sith even though they had the upper hand, Luke was never a reluctant hero
2 years ago
Anonymous
No no no anon, he also tries murdering his infant nephew in his sleep. You know, like Luke always did! Hahaha
2 years ago
Anonymous
No no no anon, he also tries murdering his infant nephew in his sleep. You know, like Luke always did! Hahaha
It is simply wrong to say that Luke's moment with sleeping Ben Solo is out of character. It is absolutely within character. Yoda tells Obi-Wan to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan tells Luke to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan agrees to do it. Luke refuses. It sounds harsh, but Yoda is right in both cases. If you have magic abilities to foresee a threat and you sense millions of deaths issuing from one man's turn to the dark, you end the threat. You should think about killing Young Hitler if someone foresees his future. That responsibility comes before your personal feelings. Or, at least, it's good leadership to think that way.
When Luke sees Ben's future, he reacts instinctively to this wisdom. He is a leader. He should end the threat before it becomes real.
Then the better part of him--the Luke we know--stops himself. That is Luke. It's not out of character to be tempted. It is out of character if he tried to go through with it. He did not. The logic of those who criticize this scene suggests that Luke really tried to kill Ben. Rather, he did exactly what he has done in the past: saw great evil and refused to allow it to lead him on a path to murder, despite what others might counsel.
He did exactly what he did in ROTJ: gave into instinct and then overcame instinct. That makes it IN character. What happened afterwards was a result of a kind of Shakespearean tragic miscommunication/misunderstanding.
(1/2)
2 years ago
Anonymous
(2/2)
Luke does NOT do what Yoda and Obi-Wan did after his pupil turns to the dark. They went into hiding, biding their time until they could train a super weapon that they could use against Palpatine and Vader. They intended to train a new Skywalker to kill an old Skywalker that they failed at training. When you think about it, their plan doesn’t make that much sense. I know we aren’t allowed to speak ill of the OT, but if they had one job (to train the “Last Hope” of the Galaxy), why did they wait so long? In fact, why did they wait until events forced their hand? What would they have done if Leia didn’t happen upon Tatooine? If not for luck/The Force, Leia (1/2 of their last hope) would have died (were there plans to train her?).
Luke’s exile makes more sense than theirs. He doesn’t want to wait to train the person who will eventually kill Ben Solo/Snoke. He realizes that he is part of a cycle: the Jedi find special people, train them to use magic powers as great weapons, and place them in positions where if they ever get tempted to use their amazing powers for ill (and succumb to that temptation), as many people die from this evil as end up being saved by Jedi goodness. He comes to believe that it is time to end this cycle. He believes that it's improper for an organized group to seek out people to train in the Force, as if the Force is theirs to wield. The Force, he believes, will find a way to work its way without the Jedi.
You can disagree with his logic, but to say that he is giving up and leaving his friends/family behind out of cowardice isn’t accurate. He doesn’t quit because he failed once and gave up; he quits because he sees that he’s part of a cycle of failure that is inevitable.
2 years ago
Anonymous
(2/2)
Luke does NOT do what Yoda and Obi-Wan did after his pupil turns to the dark. They went into hiding, biding their time until they could train a super weapon that they could use against Palpatine and Vader. They intended to train a new Skywalker to kill an old Skywalker that they failed at training. When you think about it, their plan doesn’t make that much sense. I know we aren’t allowed to speak ill of the OT, but if they had one job (to train the “Last Hope” of the Galaxy), why did they wait so long? In fact, why did they wait until events forced their hand? What would they have done if Leia didn’t happen upon Tatooine? If not for luck/The Force, Leia (1/2 of their last hope) would have died (were there plans to train her?).
Luke’s exile makes more sense than theirs. He doesn’t want to wait to train the person who will eventually kill Ben Solo/Snoke. He realizes that he is part of a cycle: the Jedi find special people, train them to use magic powers as great weapons, and place them in positions where if they ever get tempted to use their amazing powers for ill (and succumb to that temptation), as many people die from this evil as end up being saved by Jedi goodness. He comes to believe that it is time to end this cycle. He believes that it's improper for an organized group to seek out people to train in the Force, as if the Force is theirs to wield. The Force, he believes, will find a way to work its way without the Jedi.
You can disagree with his logic, but to say that he is giving up and leaving his friends/family behind out of cowardice isn’t accurate. He doesn’t quit because he failed once and gave up; he quits because he sees that he’s part of a cycle of failure that is inevitable.
The main problem is not Luke being a stupid drunk blue milk addicted hobo who almost killed his nephew while acting crazy
The problem is Luke giving up and taking the force and jedi knowledge with him, abandoning all his friends and followers who are holding the line to be destroyed, it's okay for some heroes to give up or turn evil but Luke is not this archetype.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Filoni himself said it perfectly, "Sometimes, you have to be the one that carries that burden and becomes that vessel. These aren’t characters that go and get married. They don’t get over the scar. Frodo [from The Lord of the Rings] carries the ring to Mount Doom and for the rest of his life is plagued with fear. On certain days, he remembers those pains. Because he has to carry that burden. And Frodo has no peace until he leaves that world. Luke is that character."
Fans try to claim that things being different from their expectations isn’t the problem they have with the sequels and it’s actually “objectively bad writing” but comparisons like this really make it so clear. Everyone knows Yoda became disillusioned on Dagobah now, and no one knew Yoda before 1980 and therefore couldn’t be disappointed. But these fans turned Luke from an actual character into a symbol of some warrior-god-hero that could do no wrong and held onto that idea of him for over 30 years. Give him an actual arc, say that he actually changed, and the difference between their expectations and reality became too vast for them to understand a totally consistent development that is clearly explained by the character himself. He even saves the day despite all that, but the movie briefly “besmirched” their favorite fictional uncle, and they took that personally.
It sounds like these "fans" wanted Luke to be a STAGNANT character in the sequels. You can argue all you want that his story was over and done with in the OT, but if you give LUKE SKYWALKER nothing to do in the sequels, make him another innocent, wise Ben Kenobi, I doubt it would be very interesting. A better, and simpler, explanation for why Luke's character was "ruined" is that they failed to reconcile their creative desire with the value the fans gave to the purity of his character. Saying that they hate the fans is a cheap way to get clicks on low-effort YouTube videos
2 years ago
Anonymous
>your feelings are wrong and you suck for these reasons I am projecting onto you
Frick you. No one had a problem with him failing with Ben. It's that he gave up. The reason he gave up was not in character and had no deeper meaning beyond Luke needing to move aside to make way for Rey to save the day, a new character no one cares about beyond self-inserting shippers. Even Mark Hamill said (in a nice way) that it was complete bullshit. This was the last opportunity to have my favorite childhood hero be a hero on the big screen and Disney fricked it up. End of story. No amount of apologism is going to change that.
2 years ago
Anonymous
(2/2)
Luke does NOT do what Yoda and Obi-Wan did after his pupil turns to the dark. They went into hiding, biding their time until they could train a super weapon that they could use against Palpatine and Vader. They intended to train a new Skywalker to kill an old Skywalker that they failed at training. When you think about it, their plan doesn’t make that much sense. I know we aren’t allowed to speak ill of the OT, but if they had one job (to train the “Last Hope” of the Galaxy), why did they wait so long? In fact, why did they wait until events forced their hand? What would they have done if Leia didn’t happen upon Tatooine? If not for luck/The Force, Leia (1/2 of their last hope) would have died (were there plans to train her?).
Luke’s exile makes more sense than theirs. He doesn’t want to wait to train the person who will eventually kill Ben Solo/Snoke. He realizes that he is part of a cycle: the Jedi find special people, train them to use magic powers as great weapons, and place them in positions where if they ever get tempted to use their amazing powers for ill (and succumb to that temptation), as many people die from this evil as end up being saved by Jedi goodness. He comes to believe that it is time to end this cycle. He believes that it's improper for an organized group to seek out people to train in the Force, as if the Force is theirs to wield. The Force, he believes, will find a way to work its way without the Jedi.
You can disagree with his logic, but to say that he is giving up and leaving his friends/family behind out of cowardice isn’t accurate. He doesn’t quit because he failed once and gave up; he quits because he sees that he’s part of a cycle of failure that is inevitable.
Didn’t read, didn’t even start reading than drop it. Enjoy your crappy movies, I’m never watching Star Wars again lol. I don’t wanna watch the saga of the child murderers and their wacky incest shenanigans
>a natural hero
He was human and fallible, like his father before him.
Why is this so hard to understand?
[...]
It is simply wrong to say that Luke's moment with sleeping Ben Solo is out of character. It is absolutely within character. Yoda tells Obi-Wan to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan tells Luke to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan agrees to do it. Luke refuses. It sounds harsh, but Yoda is right in both cases. If you have magic abilities to foresee a threat and you sense millions of deaths issuing from one man's turn to the dark, you end the threat. You should think about killing Young Hitler if someone foresees his future. That responsibility comes before your personal feelings. Or, at least, it's good leadership to think that way.
When Luke sees Ben's future, he reacts instinctively to this wisdom. He is a leader. He should end the threat before it becomes real.
Then the better part of him--the Luke we know--stops himself. That is Luke. It's not out of character to be tempted. It is out of character if he tried to go through with it. He did not. The logic of those who criticize this scene suggests that Luke really tried to kill Ben. Rather, he did exactly what he has done in the past: saw great evil and refused to allow it to lead him on a path to murder, despite what others might counsel.
He did exactly what he did in ROTJ: gave into instinct and then overcame instinct. That makes it IN character. What happened afterwards was a result of a kind of Shakespearean tragic miscommunication/misunderstanding.
(1/2)
(2/2)
Luke does NOT do what Yoda and Obi-Wan did after his pupil turns to the dark. They went into hiding, biding their time until they could train a super weapon that they could use against Palpatine and Vader. They intended to train a new Skywalker to kill an old Skywalker that they failed at training. When you think about it, their plan doesn’t make that much sense. I know we aren’t allowed to speak ill of the OT, but if they had one job (to train the “Last Hope” of the Galaxy), why did they wait so long? In fact, why did they wait until events forced their hand? What would they have done if Leia didn’t happen upon Tatooine? If not for luck/The Force, Leia (1/2 of their last hope) would have died (were there plans to train her?).
Luke’s exile makes more sense than theirs. He doesn’t want to wait to train the person who will eventually kill Ben Solo/Snoke. He realizes that he is part of a cycle: the Jedi find special people, train them to use magic powers as great weapons, and place them in positions where if they ever get tempted to use their amazing powers for ill (and succumb to that temptation), as many people die from this evil as end up being saved by Jedi goodness. He comes to believe that it is time to end this cycle. He believes that it's improper for an organized group to seek out people to train in the Force, as if the Force is theirs to wield. The Force, he believes, will find a way to work its way without the Jedi.
You can disagree with his logic, but to say that he is giving up and leaving his friends/family behind out of cowardice isn’t accurate. He doesn’t quit because he failed once and gave up; he quits because he sees that he’s part of a cycle of failure that is inevitable.
Filoni himself said it perfectly, "Sometimes, you have to be the one that carries that burden and becomes that vessel. These aren’t characters that go and get married. They don’t get over the scar. Frodo [from The Lord of the Rings] carries the ring to Mount Doom and for the rest of his life is plagued with fear. On certain days, he remembers those pains. Because he has to carry that burden. And Frodo has no peace until he leaves that world. Luke is that character."
Fans try to claim that things being different from their expectations isn’t the problem they have with the sequels and it’s actually “objectively bad writing” but comparisons like this really make it so clear. Everyone knows Yoda became disillusioned on Dagobah now, and no one knew Yoda before 1980 and therefore couldn’t be disappointed. But these fans turned Luke from an actual character into a symbol of some warrior-god-hero that could do no wrong and held onto that idea of him for over 30 years. Give him an actual arc, say that he actually changed, and the difference between their expectations and reality became too vast for them to understand a totally consistent development that is clearly explained by the character himself. He even saves the day despite all that, but the movie briefly “besmirched” their favorite fictional uncle, and they took that personally.
It sounds like these "fans" wanted Luke to be a STAGNANT character in the sequels. You can argue all you want that his story was over and done with in the OT, but if you give LUKE SKYWALKER nothing to do in the sequels, make him another innocent, wise Ben Kenobi, I doubt it would be very interesting. A better, and simpler, explanation for why Luke's character was "ruined" is that they failed to reconcile their creative desire with the value the fans gave to the purity of his character. Saying that they hate the fans is a cheap way to get clicks on low-effort YouTube videos
I get what you are saying, but honestly this kind of just changes my issue with Luke in Episode 8 to a) he never learned from his regret and the outcome of his encounter with Vader in 6 and tried to do the same exact thing later, and b) it implies that self-imposed exile was the best thing he could come up with while the Galaxy he knew and cared about was getting assfricked by a problem he indirectly made.
I agree with your point on the OT though. People treat it like it’s high art sometimes when it is host to the same kind of popcorn flick writing you’ll see in the other trilogies, though arguably to a lesser extent.
This video is an hour long, you don’t need to to watch the whole thing if you’re not interested, but the basic idea is the Star Wars sequel creators have all made incredibly inconsistent statements, regarding George Lucas’s sequel treatments and what was kept vs what was dropped
Both sides suck. So the moral here is that you shouldn't hire people who profess to be fans either way, know how to shut the hell up and actually have writing talent.
So fanfiction.net is the largest bastion of quality writing apparently. If you really care about creative integrity, you'd hire neither and end the story when you, as the creator, are done with it.
stuff made by "fans" sucks. they venerate the material too much, look to the wiki as a religious document not to be sullied. or they pander to their own waifus or ships or fetishes and pandering always sucks.
it's also bad when a team is working on something that they don't like in the first place. but not as bad as when fans do it.
the best is when the original creators make things to spite the fans. fandom in general is a destructive force on society so it's a universal good when fans get trolled. they deserve it. when lucas first changed the han shooting greedo scene it was stupid, but now that he knows he's pissing people off, he keeps changing it on purpose and it's great
Zack Snyder hates fans too though
the only one of the left that's actually not just fan wank is mickey mouse. hiring fans is equally as bad as getting someone who hates them.
How is The Batman fan wank?
The idea wasn't bad. Everything around it and the actual execution were.
Reaction would've been the same regardless. First, it was always an impossible fantasy that you would never have been satisfied by.
>It's *different*
>It's... bad!
This is the prequels/special editions hate all over again, and just as impotent and meaningless. The purpose of this is exercise is endless desire *itself*, that the complaints are baseless and without merit is what sustains this exercise.
Second, like the prequels, the desires of the fans did come true in a monkey-paw fashion:
>I want Luke as a jedi master!
>"Okay so we watched the movies and it's clear that the Jedi are huge frickups, just completely terrible as an organization. Directly responsible for Anakin murdering so many people and instigating interstellar wars of aggression."
Obviously, Luke as a jedi would be a frick-up, since the jedi themselves are frickups. But fans react to an actual understanding of the narrative of SW by rejecting it outright.
>>"Okay so we watched the movies and it's clear that the Jedi are huge frickups, just completely terrible as an organization.
They aren't
>Directly responsible for Anakin murdering so many people and instigating interstellar wars of aggression."
They didn't
>Obviously, Luke as a jedi would be a frick-up
Based on what? He was a natural hero.
>a natural hero
He was human and fallible, like his father before him.
Why is this so hard to understand?
Return of the Jedi was a 23 year old Luke desperately trying to stop the Sith from killing everybody just to remember there is another way
Sequels is a 53 year old Luke simply giving up in the middle of the fight and hiding while several of his friends and followers are destroyed by the sith even though they had the upper hand, Luke was never a reluctant hero
No no no anon, he also tries murdering his infant nephew in his sleep. You know, like Luke always did! Hahaha
It is simply wrong to say that Luke's moment with sleeping Ben Solo is out of character. It is absolutely within character. Yoda tells Obi-Wan to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan tells Luke to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan agrees to do it. Luke refuses. It sounds harsh, but Yoda is right in both cases. If you have magic abilities to foresee a threat and you sense millions of deaths issuing from one man's turn to the dark, you end the threat. You should think about killing Young Hitler if someone foresees his future. That responsibility comes before your personal feelings. Or, at least, it's good leadership to think that way.
When Luke sees Ben's future, he reacts instinctively to this wisdom. He is a leader. He should end the threat before it becomes real.
Then the better part of him--the Luke we know--stops himself. That is Luke. It's not out of character to be tempted. It is out of character if he tried to go through with it. He did not. The logic of those who criticize this scene suggests that Luke really tried to kill Ben. Rather, he did exactly what he has done in the past: saw great evil and refused to allow it to lead him on a path to murder, despite what others might counsel.
He did exactly what he did in ROTJ: gave into instinct and then overcame instinct. That makes it IN character. What happened afterwards was a result of a kind of Shakespearean tragic miscommunication/misunderstanding.
(1/2)
(2/2)
Luke does NOT do what Yoda and Obi-Wan did after his pupil turns to the dark. They went into hiding, biding their time until they could train a super weapon that they could use against Palpatine and Vader. They intended to train a new Skywalker to kill an old Skywalker that they failed at training. When you think about it, their plan doesn’t make that much sense. I know we aren’t allowed to speak ill of the OT, but if they had one job (to train the “Last Hope” of the Galaxy), why did they wait so long? In fact, why did they wait until events forced their hand? What would they have done if Leia didn’t happen upon Tatooine? If not for luck/The Force, Leia (1/2 of their last hope) would have died (were there plans to train her?).
Luke’s exile makes more sense than theirs. He doesn’t want to wait to train the person who will eventually kill Ben Solo/Snoke. He realizes that he is part of a cycle: the Jedi find special people, train them to use magic powers as great weapons, and place them in positions where if they ever get tempted to use their amazing powers for ill (and succumb to that temptation), as many people die from this evil as end up being saved by Jedi goodness. He comes to believe that it is time to end this cycle. He believes that it's improper for an organized group to seek out people to train in the Force, as if the Force is theirs to wield. The Force, he believes, will find a way to work its way without the Jedi.
You can disagree with his logic, but to say that he is giving up and leaving his friends/family behind out of cowardice isn’t accurate. He doesn’t quit because he failed once and gave up; he quits because he sees that he’s part of a cycle of failure that is inevitable.
The main problem is not Luke being a stupid drunk blue milk addicted hobo who almost killed his nephew while acting crazy
The problem is Luke giving up and taking the force and jedi knowledge with him, abandoning all his friends and followers who are holding the line to be destroyed, it's okay for some heroes to give up or turn evil but Luke is not this archetype.
Filoni himself said it perfectly, "Sometimes, you have to be the one that carries that burden and becomes that vessel. These aren’t characters that go and get married. They don’t get over the scar. Frodo [from The Lord of the Rings] carries the ring to Mount Doom and for the rest of his life is plagued with fear. On certain days, he remembers those pains. Because he has to carry that burden. And Frodo has no peace until he leaves that world. Luke is that character."
Fans try to claim that things being different from their expectations isn’t the problem they have with the sequels and it’s actually “objectively bad writing” but comparisons like this really make it so clear. Everyone knows Yoda became disillusioned on Dagobah now, and no one knew Yoda before 1980 and therefore couldn’t be disappointed. But these fans turned Luke from an actual character into a symbol of some warrior-god-hero that could do no wrong and held onto that idea of him for over 30 years. Give him an actual arc, say that he actually changed, and the difference between their expectations and reality became too vast for them to understand a totally consistent development that is clearly explained by the character himself. He even saves the day despite all that, but the movie briefly “besmirched” their favorite fictional uncle, and they took that personally.
It sounds like these "fans" wanted Luke to be a STAGNANT character in the sequels. You can argue all you want that his story was over and done with in the OT, but if you give LUKE SKYWALKER nothing to do in the sequels, make him another innocent, wise Ben Kenobi, I doubt it would be very interesting. A better, and simpler, explanation for why Luke's character was "ruined" is that they failed to reconcile their creative desire with the value the fans gave to the purity of his character. Saying that they hate the fans is a cheap way to get clicks on low-effort YouTube videos
>your feelings are wrong and you suck for these reasons I am projecting onto you
Frick you. No one had a problem with him failing with Ben. It's that he gave up. The reason he gave up was not in character and had no deeper meaning beyond Luke needing to move aside to make way for Rey to save the day, a new character no one cares about beyond self-inserting shippers. Even Mark Hamill said (in a nice way) that it was complete bullshit. This was the last opportunity to have my favorite childhood hero be a hero on the big screen and Disney fricked it up. End of story. No amount of apologism is going to change that.
Didn’t read, didn’t even start reading than drop it. Enjoy your crappy movies, I’m never watching Star Wars again lol. I don’t wanna watch the saga of the child murderers and their wacky incest shenanigans
>I will not kill you, nephew
The absolute state
I get what you are saying, but honestly this kind of just changes my issue with Luke in Episode 8 to a) he never learned from his regret and the outcome of his encounter with Vader in 6 and tried to do the same exact thing later, and b) it implies that self-imposed exile was the best thing he could come up with while the Galaxy he knew and cared about was getting assfricked by a problem he indirectly made.
I agree with your point on the OT though. People treat it like it’s high art sometimes when it is host to the same kind of popcorn flick writing you’ll see in the other trilogies, though arguably to a lesser extent.
That’s not true.
This video is an hour long, you don’t need to to watch the whole thing if you’re not interested, but the basic idea is the Star Wars sequel creators have all made incredibly inconsistent statements, regarding George Lucas’s sequel treatments and what was kept vs what was dropped
luke was suppossed to have a dark ending iot was just handled poorly
Luke and Clark need to be switched.
Thing is that the Thundercats Roar showrunner is actually a fan.
If you were a fan, would you really let execs cut corners in terms of quality?
Not sure who's at fault, him/the executives/the budget
Not relevant whatsoever. You work with what you have.
Both sides suck. So the moral here is that you shouldn't hire people who profess to be fans either way, know how to shut the hell up and actually have writing talent.
So fanfiction.net is the largest bastion of quality writing apparently. If you really care about creative integrity, you'd hire neither and end the story when you, as the creator, are done with it.
Dragon Ball is the worst example of this, Toriyama ripped off the mexican fans for Gohan Blanco and made profit off it.
>Snyder
>Superman fan
The guy already said several times he's not a Superman fan.
Not wrong, but since this is the bait thread
Josh thinks the wolves are white people doesn't he?
sheep with wool as white as snow
wolves that obviously aren't white
The caption is Sheep in Wolves clothing.
The sheep are pretending to be wolves not the other way around.
okay so a wolf in sheeps clothing means 'a bad person pretending to be good'
so if we were to do the opposite, sheep in wolves clothing would mean that 'a good person is really being bad'
He's not half bad as a furry artist, he'd make some bank if he dedicated himself to furry commissions.
>Snyder
>Superman fan
absolutely hilarious.
DBS is a mess, frick fans
don't forget when Toriyama did hire a fan you get good stuff like this
stuff made by "fans" sucks. they venerate the material too much, look to the wiki as a religious document not to be sullied. or they pander to their own waifus or ships or fetishes and pandering always sucks.
it's also bad when a team is working on something that they don't like in the first place. but not as bad as when fans do it.
the best is when the original creators make things to spite the fans. fandom in general is a destructive force on society so it's a universal good when fans get trolled. they deserve it.
when lucas first changed the han shooting greedo scene it was stupid, but now that he knows he's pissing people off, he keeps changing it on purpose and it's great
The only fans still involved in media production nowadays are all Asian.
Western adaptations aren't made by fans nowadays.
The left side tells me that you get a 50% chance of getting dogshit from hiring a fan.
>Snyder
Didn't this guy call superheroes fricking moronic in general? He's no fan by any definition.
>hack snyder
Well, that's an argument that you shouldn't ALWAYS hire fans.
>Zack Snyder
>fan
Opinion discarded