How come Alan Moore doesn't get the same amount of shit everyone gives Frank Miller? Sure Frank has his problems as well such as being a fricking edgelord boomer, but Moore literally puts his rape fetish in almost every product he does. Seriously I don't get it.
Moore actually has a standard of quality with his comics and managed to maintain it. As opposed to Frank Miller who after 9/11 induced lung disease and his drinking problem destroyed his brain has been on a constant slide into worse writing, worse art, and worse personal opinions.
There's also the fact he's openly Anti-Islam and Anti-Muslim, which is still a big nono that still gets him in trouble and kicked out of conventions even today.
If a gang of israelite hating goat f****** killed 3,000 people in my hometown, I probably have a little bit of a chip on my shoulder as well.
I'm more upset with the people those goat frickers hated destroying our national economy and goading us into fighting for a country we get no major resources from.
>israelite hating goatfrickers
Is that who was dancing around celebrating immediately after the event?
Miller legitimately ran out of steam in both writing and art. Drinking, and possibly getting into the movie business, did a great deal of damage.
Moore didn't exactly run out of steam, though he lost love for the superhero genre, the comics industry, and eventually the medium overall. Rape comes up in his work because sex is a topic he likes to discuss. A lot more brutal murder occurs in his comics and no one bats an eye.
Miller had like five great books in him, while Moore had at least several more, most of which never saw print.
>still a big nono
Shame. I wish there was more tolerance in this respect.
The last volume is literally called "The Tempest".
Great sequence.
>worse personal opinions.
This is the not reason you hate him
>openly Anti-Islam
Yet of he was anti-christian i bet you'd be sucking his wiener you worthless hypocrite
How come when you put murder in your every story it's not a murder-fetish but when you write about rape (a more common thing) in a serious manner it's a rape fetish
When your literal answer to killing a rapist is by raping them, that's when you start to question whether or not it is a fetish or not.
Which fricking comic did he do that in?
League of Gentlemen
Probably League of extraordinary Gentlemen, where the invisible Man(who's a rapist) gets raped to Death by Mr. Hyde.
I take it sort of tongue in cheek. Moore writes from the perspective of these characters as victorian era ones. Similar to how he write Bulldog Drummond and Alan Quartermain being disgusted by James Bond; Bond is old now but to an even older generation it was a huge change from what they're used to a heroic character being like.
A similar thing happens in From Hell where a character has a vision of the future and is appalled by how everyone acts, with women wearing more revealing outfits and men not reacting to it.
this is what made me understand how much I love this hyde. After don rosa scrooge, its my favourite character from comics
I found that after the alien part, when they begin to advance in time, so boring that I always stop reading it. Boring and uninteresting
Yeah, this bit was horrific but also underscored what monsters are: what they do, not what they look like. And Hyde is not the Hulk. Hyde is the id that Jekyll kept at bay. Hyde does things not as a snarling junkyard dog, but a very brutish man who does what he wants. In this case, meting out a very perverse form of justice.
He also has a rapist get raped in his novel Jerusalem. Except he dies first and he's a ghost, being raped by other ghosts, in his personal hell indefinitely.
Separately, his short film series Show Pieces features a character who is judged for his sins (womanising among them) in the afterlife, and is offered slavery as an alternative to having his soul devoured; it's briefly implied this will include being raped.
I wouldn't describe it as a rape fetish, but Moore is undeniably fond of it as a narrative device symbolising absolute cruelty.
IIRC it's not used in any of the new short stories from Illuminations or in his feature film The Show. But there's no way he's getting through five whole novels of his upcoming series set in London without including rape somehow
Moore's actually a decent writer. Miller just impressed people with good art composition and cribbing Hammet and Spillane style writing.
Me and some friends just finished the league of the extraordinary Gentlemen. The first two volumes are fine but the others are just awful, i dont get it why people praise those fricking comics, the last volume is literally him b***hin' about ¨oh muh superheroes ruined my life¨ and metanarrative bullshit.
Dont get me wrong Alan Moore has more bangers than Miller, but stop giving him all the praise in the world
Is it worth continuing on with LoEG? I've read the first two volumes and the Black Dossier but most people online seem to say that the series rapidly goes downhill in the later stuff
I'm going to read the rest pretty soon.
The first two volumes are some of my favorite comics.
I haven't read The Black Dossier either, though I know it's a source book and not a regular narrative.
I've heard the biggest problem is that it gets bogged down with far too many references. There's also the Harry Potter thing, which one thing I've been told is that you shouldn't parody something you don't like.
Same here. That and the final conversation with Mina.
ah yes, on the bridge. Peak character. Go teach aliens whats the meaning of fear
YOU SHOULD SEE ME DANCE THE POLKA
YOU SHOULD SEE ME COVER THE GROUND
YOU SHOULD SEE MY COAT TAILS FLYING AS I JUMP MY PARTNER ROUND
WHEN THE BAND COMMENCES PLAYING
MY FEET BEGIN TO GO
FOR A ROLLICKING ROMPING POLKA IS THE ONLY JOY I KNOW
The Black Dossier is half source book, half narrative. I found both to be pretty enjoyable, though there are some bits of the source stuff that I found kinda dull
The Black Dossier sort of sets the tone for the rest of the series where its a lot of world building and characters reflecting on how things have changed and running meta commentaries on the changing nature of fiction. The basic appeal of mashing all these recognizable characters in a team isn't there in favor of a more world tour thing. So your mileage may vary.
People like the Nemo trilogy despite not being fans of Black Dossier and Century
if you're hooked on the "all fiction ever is canon" concept, yes
I found century incredibly mean spirited.
The first two are the best.
After that you need a serious interest in all fiction to pick the references. I stuck to the bitter end and realize no matter how much i wanted a female indian science pirate comic when i was a kid it turns out that i still wasnt satisfied.
And James Bond has a big role at the end. I dont hes important enough to deserve the role.
Moore doesn’t put his “rape fetish” into “almost every product he does.” Read some of his actual work
The only reason why some of his work doesn't have rape fetish in it is because the editors at DC said no.
Nope. A couple of his comics over the years mentioning the fact that rape exists do not a fetish make
I'd say it's pretty much all of the big ones. Killing Joke, Watchmen, V for Vendetta (at least attempted? Its been awhile since I've read it), a whole lot in league, including a bit in century where a character gets so raped she goes catatonic for decades. Neonomicon is pretty much entirely about rape. I don't remember if anyone gets raped in Marvelman. I think there is the implication of rape In swamp thing, but, again, it's been awhile. Child rape is big part of Top Ten...
I mean, it might be hyperbolic to say "every Moore work has rape in it!" but if you look at the stories he is most known for, it is usually in there.
>I don't remember if anyone gets raped in Marvelman.
Johnny Bates nearly gets raped by one of the other kids in the orphanage, and to get out of it he changes into Kid Marvelman which leads directly into that big gory fight
The Killing Joke doesn't have rape, but a lot of people infer it from the naked pictures of a wounded Barbara.
Watchmen has an attempted rape.
V for Vendetta has an attempted rape.
Miracleman has rape: Miraclewoman is raped while in stasis, Johnny Bates might have gotten raped, which makes him snap.
Swamp Thing gets raped by an alien.
LoEG has a lot of rape/attempted rape.
From Hell has no rape.
The thing is that sex is a subject of great interest for Moore. Count the number of times people have sex or some kind sexual topic is mentioned in his comics.
Providence also has that body-swap-rape shit. Plus the blowjob of doom.
Alan Moore hasn't been cancelled. Frank has been cancelled multiple times and it's commonly agreed his work declines in quality during the 2000's
But we on Cinemaphile try to put him in perspecitve.
>but Moore literally puts his rape fetish in almost every product he does.
And it routinely comes up as an issue whenever people talk about his work on a general level.
fedora lel
Moore's a stronger writer, but Miller writes stronger women, which is funny to me.
Miller gets an awful rep for writing nothing but prostitutes, and its ridiculous because that accusation was lobbied at him by a man who didn't jerk off until he was 21 and cried when he did so, and has a fetish for college aged women jerking off with machine dryers.
>that accusation was lobbied at him by a man who didn't jerk off until he was 21 and cried when he did so, and has a fetish for college aged women jerking off with machine dryers.
Give us a name anon
David Willis of shortpacked. Its insane to say it, but as an oldgay the "prostitutesprostitutesprostitutes" meme came from this
I'm willing to bet Willis doesn't know about Martha Washington, or anything Miller that isn't Big Two or Sin City.
frick me wrong comic. Its this one from 2006.
I guess Linkara parroted this same sentiment and it became common since watching videos about comics is what half of comic fans do these days.
It is a funny comic, but yeah, too many took it seriously.
Like, you don’t even need to dig deep to find non-prostitute women in Frank Miller comics. Carrie Kelly? The Dark Knight Returns isn’t some obscure comic of his, it’s his flagship
Willis doesn't know a thing his fans don't pat him on the ass for knowing. He knows more about social trends on an Indiana school campus than he does about comics, despite b***hing endlessly about the latter.
Ignore him. If possible, strike him.
>How come Alan Moore doesn't get the same amount of shit everyone gives Frank Miller?
Miller actually likes the idea of capeshit and hasn't given up on it. Also he has a streak of patriotism.
Moore hates it all so the Gary Groth crowd will suck his dick forever.
>Miller actually likes the idea of capeshit and hasn't given up on it.
I wish he did, his TDKR sequels have been utter dogshit.
>the Gary Groth crowd will suck his dick forever
Hilariously enough Fantagraphics is publishing Don Simpson's 1963 annual
Don Simpson seems to be a c**t.
A lot of Miller's persona is a character he puts on. Moore can still probably gush about comics he read as a kid, so long as he knows its not on record.
>Moore hates it all so the Gary Groth crowd will suck his dick forever.
Moore cut off ties with Groth and Fantagraphics in the 90s.
>why are bad Frank Miller memes popular and not bad Alan Moore memes
Because libshits think he's on their side, unable to realize he hates their guts as much as he hates everything else
He's left wing.
/thread
Inb4 "frank is too". Not enough for the powers that be.
>Inb4 "frank is too". Not enough for the powers that be.
I don't remember Moore doing anything half as cringe as TDKR: The Golden Child
If you went by Frank's old work you'd assume he was a neocon. The original TDKR, The 300, Holy Terror, etc. His work came across as anti-PC, pro-war, tough on crime, anti-Muslim, etc. There was his anti-Occupy Wall Street rant.
Then he sobered up, realized he had alienated the mostly leftist comics media, and blamed it all on his alcoholism and started putting out stuff like The Golden Child and emphasizing that he voted for Hillary (who really on foreign policy and other things is not that different from a neocon).
I don't think the people writing articles about him are familiar with the minutia of his work. They just perceive him as being "on our team". He did endorse voting for a UK politician recently, despite previously making a big show of being an anarchist.
Btw I know there's some nuance there, like Superman the patriot boy scout. Some anti-religion stuff. Miller does like to satirize extremes on both sides. But generally his work comes off as largely right wing.
I bet the powers that be absolutely loved when Moore wrote that comic detailing the cost in blood of every murderous American foreign policy initiative since the CIA's inception.
https://archive.org/details/BroughtToLightShadowplayTheSecretTeam/page/n13/mode/2up?view=theater