Still it as bad as current DC. Especially since gay new 52 Alan Scott was an alternate universe version. It is modern DC that has decided that all versions of Alan Scott are gay. Just like they decided all DC characters are gay.
DC'S HARLEY QUINN ROMANCES #1
Written by GREG LOCKARD, ALEXIS QUASARANO, FRANK ALLEN, ZIPPORAH SMITH, AMANDA DEIBERT, IVAN COHEN, RAPHAEL DRACCON, CAROLINA MUNHÓZ, and others
Art by MAX SARIN, FICO OSSIO, ADRIANA MELO, GIULIO MACAIONE, and others
Cover by AMANDA CONNER
Variant cover by DAVID TALASKI
1:25 variant cover by ELIZABETH TORQUE
$9.99 US | 80 pages | One-shot | Prestige
(all covers are card stock)
ON SALE 1/31/23
DC is proud to present a selection of eight stories of rapscallion romance, prodigious passion, and undulating, unbridled affection. Tension builds as Apollo and Midnighter are captured by an unknown alien species who are determined to learn the secrets of their supersoldier success. Harley Quinn gets caught in a scintillating fantasy: What would life have been like if she and Ivy had met in high school? Also featuring Fire and Ice heating things up, fan-favorite heroine Power Girl's romantic tale, John Constantine's mysterious tryst, an amorous Aquaman adventure, and many more! These are lovelorn fantasies as only DC can tell them…but it's not a Harlequin romance…prepare yourself for the Harley Quinn Romances!
I’d take New 52 over current DC any day. At least it had Aquaman, Green Lantern, Animal Man, and Swamp-Thing. Even Wonder Woman was more popular. Now DC is 90% Batman, 10% other.
Hot Take Time: The New 52 was great and you're all fricking moronic. A ton of new, different books that were absolute killer but capeshitters can't look past the fact that they moved over Hellblazer (I'll admit I'm still pissed there) and Scott Lobdell vigorously shat the bed and made Teen Titans and the Superman Family of books unreadably fricking shit (and they were fricking agonising).
Green Lantern? Still great.
Flash? Fricking great.
Batman? Great, even if the contrarians are coming are starting to b***h about Snyder.
Wonder Woman? Great, even if they dragged their nuts over the Amazons. Enjoy a story and understand your fricking lore will come back later.
So a lot of your capeshit stuff was fricking good, I'd dare say more consistent than it is now. Then we look at the fricking different, interesting shit you should have read and didn't because you're all fricking boring shitters who let the best books die.
- Demon Knights: Fantasy and legit to the final issue.
- All-Star Western: More of the good shit from the creatord of the previous run.
- I, Vampire: A cool, dark, horror themed book that was mismarketed by the covers. Go back and read that shit. Awesome story and art.
- Justice League Dark: So cool they keep bringing it back.
Animal Man: Dark, twisted, and fun. Bit edgy but a fricking good read.
- Swamp Thing: Solid read alongside Animal Man, but once Soule comes in its the best Swampy has been since Moore (but not better. It does fun stuff with the ideas and the art is incrddible).
- Dial H: 15 issues of unhinged fun as the fat frick plays Ben 10 with Granny. If you want that comic weirdness it was waiting for you and you ignored it.
There's more, but I'm at cap. Look into those titles.
"Hurr Durr, they could have done it without the big reboot."
That's not how marketing works. It was either an insane push or nothing at all. DC tried putting out the new and interesting stuff people claim they want and you demanded more slop. ONLY slop.
You're right about the average quality of the books (Dial H is one of my all-time favorite comics, and it might've been my all-time favorite if it didn't get the rushed ending), but the way the transition to the New 52 was executed was totally botched.
And I don't have a problem with it being a reboot either, at least not in theory.
The initial plan was for Final Crisis to lead into the New 52, which would've made 10x more sense, but they decided not to do that and instead to turn a solo Flash story into the inciting event for a reboot...okay.
But surely they actually rebooted the universe, right?
Well, Superman got pretty much a full reboot. While his titles weren't great (sans Moz's Action Comics), he was actually rebooted.
Same thing for Wondy, and really most characters.
But several of their big name characters - most egregiously, the Green Lanterns - weren't rebooted!
So we had an awkward situation where pre-Flashpoint comics were no longer canon except for the series which were doing particularly well before the New 52, which they continued with minimal changes or with no changes at all like Green Lantern.
If the New 52 had been a proper, fresh slate reboot, it would've been good. But they half-assed it, just like they did 26 years ago with Crisis on Infinite Earths.
DC isn't very good at learning from its mistakes.
Real shame about the ending. I fricking adored that book. They tried to tie it up with that villain issue for Justice League but it wasn't enough (and they didn't put it in the recent deluxe edition for some reason).
The behind the scenes stuff is the most unhinged shitshow I've ever heard in comics. As much as they claimed otherwise it clearly wasn't thought through in the slightest. Things worked out because they got insane talent on a ton of books and let them do their thing. If management wasn't busy micromanaging Batman/Superman and was shitting everything up equally it could have been a real shit show.
Superman, Titans, and Suicide Squad were repeatedly ruined and unreadable despite the constant relaunches of the titles. Batfamily stuff, which was otherwise mediocre for the most part (Nightwing and Batgirl were fine, not classics, but you'd be happy reading them, and Batwoman was the definition of a 5/10 story with 11/10 art) was constantly being fricked up with tie-ins (they actually took fricking Batwing out of his main plot, in fricking Africa, in the middle of an arc to Gotham for a one issue tie-in).
That said, DC has NEVER successfully pulled off a reboot. They're always moronic. It was more complete than anything else they've done before. I'm glad Green Lantern got to finish though (and just do what we did with every other reboot, handwave the changes away until it matters later), but there was no reason for Batman not to get rebooted. Seems like they were just bending over backwards for Morrison and his terrible Batman Inc shit (and they let him frick over Perez on Superman, so it's hardly surprising). I'm sure someone out there is glad it finished, but I fail to see anything that was necessary to keep around for that series. Damien felt pointless and wasted in that.
Frick it, I'm back with more titles because you're just that much of a b***h.
- Green Arrow by Lemire.
- Action Comics by Morrison (bit overrated, but better than most shit).
- Aquaman was fricking sick, best shit since PAD.
- Grayson by Tim Seeley.
- Earth 2 (accept that alternate versions of shit can be different and not hurt your precious old books homosexual).
- Sword of Sorcery: More fantasy that was doing interesting shit.
- Batwing (until they brought in the Fox homosexualry, the original half set in South Africa). It was actually doing interesting shit with the Batman Inc set up. Something that wasn't just Morrison jerking off to completion over the fricking Silver Age.
I'm sorry limp-wristed homosexuals like you read nothing but Superman, Batman, and Teen Titans. Hopefully one day you'll actually develop some taste you fricking troglodytes.
Hot Take Time: The New 52 was great and you're all fricking moronic. A ton of new, different books that were absolute killer but capeshitters can't look past the fact that they moved over Hellblazer (I'll admit I'm still pissed there) and Scott Lobdell vigorously shat the bed and made Teen Titans and the Superman Family of books unreadably fricking shit (and they were fricking agonising).
Green Lantern? Still great.
Flash? Fricking great.
Batman? Great, even if the contrarians are coming are starting to b***h about Snyder.
Wonder Woman? Great, even if they dragged their nuts over the Amazons. Enjoy a story and understand your fricking lore will come back later.
So a lot of your capeshit stuff was fricking good, I'd dare say more consistent than it is now. Then we look at the fricking different, interesting shit you should have read and didn't because you're all fricking boring shitters who let the best books die.
- Demon Knights: Fantasy and legit to the final issue.
- All-Star Western: More of the good shit from the creatord of the previous run.
- I, Vampire: A cool, dark, horror themed book that was mismarketed by the covers. Go back and read that shit. Awesome story and art.
- Justice League Dark: So cool they keep bringing it back.
Animal Man: Dark, twisted, and fun. Bit edgy but a fricking good read.
- Swamp Thing: Solid read alongside Animal Man, but once Soule comes in its the best Swampy has been since Moore (but not better. It does fun stuff with the ideas and the art is incrddible).
- Dial H: 15 issues of unhinged fun as the fat frick plays Ben 10 with Granny. If you want that comic weirdness it was waiting for you and you ignored it.
There's more, but I'm at cap. Look into those titles.
"Hurr Durr, they could have done it without the big reboot."
That's not how marketing works. It was either an insane push or nothing at all. DC tried putting out the new and interesting stuff people claim they want and you demanded more slop. ONLY slop.
Snyder’s Batman was awful and you should stream your suicide. Flash was bottom of the barrel garbage too. Wonder Woman may have had her worst run ever in during the New 52.
>l-le sales
Okay shill. There were many more comic shops ten years ago and you have no clue how any DC comic is selling for the past two years so what a moronic thing to claim.
>Shill
You’re the one one shilling for Modern DC, Shill.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Considering current Wonder Woman can’t even make it to the top 100, I think we can safely say she ain’t doing too well.
No, I’m merely pointing out that the new 52 was the worst era in the company’s history by far. Nice time stamp.
1 year ago
Anonymous
> No, I’m merely pointing out that the new 52 was the worst era in the company’s history by far
It wasn’t though. It actually sold and brought readers back. Unlike Rebirth and current DC.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>s-sales!
Lol jfc you really come off like a creator from that period begging to get more opportunities.
Batman: Yeah, Court of Owls is so infamously shit, I know. Heaven forbid we do something different with the main title and do something with Gordon for a couple years. I'm sure you're happy furiously jacking yourself off rereading the O'Neil stuff for the umpteenth fricking time but I'm happy to take a detour and pretend shit can change for 5 minutes.
Flash: Look, we're both going to have to accept that Wally isn't coming back because Johns hates us, but at least I see why he hates you and your b***h-tier taste. It's some of the better stuff Barry has had in a long time, and that may suck to hear, but it doesn't suck as hard as Barry has for a long time.
Wonder Woman: Oh yeah, totally. Let's go back to the glory days of being a powerless spy, wearing the jacket, or work8ng at taco bell. Great new designs, awesome art, a run interrupted by any external events (frick knows Azzarello ignored the Superman/Wonder Woman trash going on) and was loyal to her character, even if it did shit on the Amazons. I'll take a good story over shitty lore want every time. The fact that this is the only time c**ts bothered to buy WW says plenty.
I'll tell you what; I'll kill myself, and all I ask is that when I've got the brick on the accelerator and a rag in the exhaust pipe you hold my hand like the code chomping homosexual you are.
CoO is the sort of "game changing" shit that ends up amounting to very little. Lets make an ultra-important secret society that changes everything you know about Gotham! But not really. Its a lame example of a writer trying to make a mark and not caring about the implications long term or how it even fits in the universe. >do something different with the main title and do something with Gordon for a couple years.
See, what they did wit Gordon is an example of something I hate; basically turning an interesting supporting character into yet another superhero. The at the movies issue Alan Grant wrote has more pathos in 22 pages for Goron than anything written with Gordon and his mech suit did in however many years that asinine story ran.
>It's some of the better stuff Barry has had in a long time, and that may suck to hear, but it doesn't suck as hard as Barry has for a long time.
Really not saying much, most of Barry's stuff is unreadable.
Saying it amounts to very little is an understatement. Sadly, that's to be expected in Capeshit. Flatly, it's kind of standard. Everything is a one-off until it isn't. Ra's al Ghul and the League of Shadows would have been another on the pile of endless secret organisations if other writers didn't pick it up. I look at the shit in a vacuum. Only way to look at these sorts of attempts. Even when I was reading CoO and City of Owls I didn't think I'd see it again. I was fine with that. Still am. It is what it is.
>Other writers are better.
Shit is relative. Has there been better shit Gordon done in the past? Yeah, there has. The existence of 9/10's and 10/10's don't dispute the existence of the high 7's. I'll agree with the statements regarding everyone being turned into heroes as it undermines characters. If he'd been set up to be a permanent change, or even a long-term one then I'd have been furious, but seeing it as a digression and character piece (even if not the greatest ever made) is a good time. We can talk about fricking up the lore, but we're talking about Batman and capeshit in general. I'm not disparaging the artistic merits of the medium or characters, but saying that they're actively created to disregard themselves in exactly this sort of circumstance. This wasn't something created to be seen as a permanent addition to the lore. It's basically a stand-alone. You may hate that, and if I had a the choice I'd change it, but I'm meeting the books (New 52 and otherwise) on their terms. Your problem here is with Marvel and DC.
>Barry is gay and lame and gay
Yeah, so we agree that the bar couldn't have gotten lower and a book with solid art could clear that.
I would be a bigger fan of Snyder's run if Zero Year never happened. MAYBE I would accept it if DC had an actual continuity reboot and this was a truly new origin and starting point for the Batman timeline. In actuality it was basically just a pitch for a movie and retconned out Year One, since all the current day stories were just implying it was canon anyway, Snyder even did a flashback to it in Court.
Riddler blowing up the whole city in Batman's first week sucks.
Temporarily taking shit out of continuity doesn't affect me; as I've said I'm fine looking at shit in a vacuum since functionally it doesn't affect other stories outside of Snyder's run. The problem is that even in a vacuum Zero Year eats shit with a fork and a smile. Even putting aside that it's such a fricking escalation for an early Batman story, it somehow also manages to be fricking boring.
>Grayson by Tim Seeley.
This was after the New 52 imprint ended. >Batwing (until they brought in the Fox homosexualry, the original half set in South Africa). It was actually doing interesting shit with the Batman Inc set up.
Frick Winick's Batwing. It completely ignored everything established for Batwing in Batman Incorporated and still makes no sense when read alongside the rest of the books from that era. David was a rich Zorro type character from the ruling family of Mtamba, Jezebel Jet's cousin, then suddenly he's a former child soldier from the Congo.
Frick it, I'm back with more titles because you're just that much of a b***h.
- Green Arrow by Lemire.
- Action Comics by Morrison (bit overrated, but better than most shit).
- Aquaman was fricking sick, best shit since PAD.
- Grayson by Tim Seeley.
- Earth 2 (accept that alternate versions of shit can be different and not hurt your precious old books homosexual).
- Sword of Sorcery: More fantasy that was doing interesting shit.
- Batwing (until they brought in the Fox homosexualry, the original half set in South Africa). It was actually doing interesting shit with the Batman Inc set up. Something that wasn't just Morrison jerking off to completion over the fricking Silver Age.
I'm sorry limp-wristed homosexuals like you read nothing but Superman, Batman, and Teen Titans. Hopefully one day you'll actually develop some taste you fricking troglodytes.
>liking New52 Flash
It devoted more time to Barry's dull supporting cast than it did to any of the villains, and yet managed to leave all of them feeling boring and underdeveloped. Not to mention both Reverse-Flashes, Daniel and Eobard, were absolute shit and unmemorable.
I don't even think that Barry or the New 52 is inherently bad or anything, but Jesus. New 52 Flash sucked a fat wiener.
Look, I won't lie, I don't remember shit about the supporting cast from the run and i had to force myself through the sections where they were trapped in the Speed Force. It had great art, played with some fun ideas about speeding up his thoughts, and there were interesting retreads of the Reverse Flash and playing with issue numbering and forced flashback/event months that are literally the only time I've ever found those sorts of gimmicks clever. You might say it's a bit meta (and I'll normally stop reading shit trying to get meta), but it felt clever reading it at the time.
>can't look past the fact that they moved over Hellblazer >- Justice League Dark: So cool they keep bringing it back.
This, to me, is a contrary statement, and illustrates just why I dislike a lot of what new 52 did. Yes, having a variety of genres is a good idea, my problem is that a good deal of it was basically just written like cape comics. Trying to stick all the magic/supernatural characters in a justice league style team is an idea I'll always find tacky and stupid. Killing vertigo was a terrible idea.
You're right that stuff like I-Vampire.AS Western, Animal Man, and Dial H were good. But a lot of those would've been better suited under Vertigo than trying to be mashed in to the clearly teen-oriented New 52. I guess what bugs me is that a lot of the books felt like old image books from the 90's in terms of writing.
I don't see them as contrary, but I see what you're getting at. I can appreciate JLD as being good, but not worth breaking the egg that was Hellblazer, but that's partially because it was basically an institution at this point. Unlike other characters it's not something that can be "restored" to what it was in any capacity.
A Supernatural team isn't a bad idea, but some writers treating it like discount Justice League is pretty shit. Apparently it takes talent to think that magic isn't just a different coloured laser. People wanting to read a darker, supernatural story that's got a collection of characters that otherwise wouldn't get a title shouldn't be a surprise. I'd love a solo Etrigan book, but I don't like my chances. I'll take watching the many characters bounce off each other.
The death of Vertigo is the biggest tragedy honestly, but I don't attribute that to the New 52, though it definitely helped to speed things along. The growing prominence of Image and creators rights did that. Things being mismarketed to teens really didn't help; I, Vampire's marketing being a chief example of that. I feel like that book would have survived better as a Vertigo title that didn't try to present itself as some vampire porn shit with its covers, especially with more understated sales expectations.
I still remember a lot of the b***h-tier titles you're referring to; The Ravagers, The Movement, Mister Terrific, Katana, Scott Lobdell, Hawk & Dove, etc. I won't argue, but I'll take a greater number of good titles with some stinkers over nothing but Batman, or no push for anything new. People love Reborth bit that was just giving people the exact capeshit they wanted. Fun, but it's just eating ice cream for dinner every night if you catch my drift.
im gonna go ahead and say it
it was a dissapointment
episode 1 and 3 are its saving grace and no can deny the quality drop that ensued
Cinemaphile was on pure copium episode 4 onwards
N52 never disappointed me since I, used it as a jumping off point and never gave it a chance. Rebirth was one though since I tentatively gave it a chance, it got my hopes up as it got under way and then they got dashed the moment Didiot announced Bendis was coming.
>huge potential for a great series >potential for games, comics, toys, action figures, movies and everything you could ever hope for >great first season >second season comes >Disney decides to kill it for a bunch of boring shorts nobody even cares outside stupid manufactured controversy
Personally, this one was a big one. I was watching on my own without and thinking with myself I was seeing the beginning of something actually great. And they really did deliver in part, I just wish it could had time to fully mature instead of being killed so early on, you can tell how much they had planned to explore.
This makes no sense. They can do that shit in OGNs and minis. Why do mainline comics need to be tanked just to appeal to weirdos who only want to read the characters if theyre completely different? Those types never buy floppies anyway.
Look, I grew up on Post Crisis DC and never wanted the New 52 anyway but since they were do adamant with a reboot just go all in not some half-assed one. Fricking Batman & Green Lantern went through that shit twice.
>I don’t want a reboot but if you’re going to do what I don’t want just make it even worse
Again, this doesn’t address the fact that they used to have the elseworld line, that they can do whatever they like in OGNs and minis and non-canon books. There is NO reason to have ever rebooted ongoings when people who want reboots DO NOT BUY ONGOINGS
The problem is comics are a very slow medium, starting for day 1 for all these heroes means you wouldn't see a bunch of them for literal decades. And they already reprint a lot of the classic stories anyway, so what do you do, have a reprint of old Knightfall, and a new Knightfall down the line?
I don't know why people have this idea that superhero stories NEED to start at day 1--the idea seems to be its because thats how manga is..but not every manga is like that either. Like its ok to be introduced to a character having already had their set up-- a cast of friends/supporting characters, etc. Like James Bond in Casino Royal has his first mission as 007 sure, but he's still introduced as a seasoned agent already. You watch a cop show and the cast tends to already know each other, too.
you don't need a knightfall at all. What's the point of doing a reboot if you're just going to retread all the old shit, usually worse, anyway? Make new stories for the new setting/era
Voodoo went for 12 issues. Changed creative teams and direction unannounced after #3 because the main character literally raped and killed a dude as part of the main story. New writer then said "Nah, that one was a clone of the real Voodoo who I will now introduce to you this deep into the story," and the clone is now the main antagonist of the series for the rest of the run. It's a fun, but forgettable series aside from that crazy change.
Don't forget that the supporting cast was killed off and replaced. Also it was lesbian rape by deception since she took the form of the female agent's male partner.
Calling Nu52 disappointing is wrong because it implies anybody smart expected anything good from it.
Now DC Rebirth? THAT's a disappointment. It was the only good chance DC had of unfricking itself and then Didio just canceled it because he's an butthole and should have been fired 15 years ago.
Here's an easier one: Legend of Korra.
It is amazing how disappointing this show was. Especially the ending of season one.
Wrong board
>here's your lore and avatar bro
I can’t believe they did that.
Better than current Woke DC Comics.
At least everyone wasn’t being turned gay or black.
*drops the mic*
/thread
>At least everyone wasn’t being turned gay or black
Alan Scott
Wally West
Harper Row
Still it as bad as current DC. Especially since gay new 52 Alan Scott was an alternate universe version. It is modern DC that has decided that all versions of Alan Scott are gay. Just like they decided all DC characters are gay.
>having to use an OC like Harper Row
Meanwhile DC just turned Fire and Ice into Lesbians because they didn’t want Guy to be happy.
Can't believe dubs got wasted on goalpost moving
>Source: My Ass
DC'S HARLEY QUINN ROMANCES #1
Written by GREG LOCKARD, ALEXIS QUASARANO, FRANK ALLEN, ZIPPORAH SMITH, AMANDA DEIBERT, IVAN COHEN, RAPHAEL DRACCON, CAROLINA MUNHÓZ, and others
Art by MAX SARIN, FICO OSSIO, ADRIANA MELO, GIULIO MACAIONE, and others
Cover by AMANDA CONNER
Variant cover by DAVID TALASKI
1:25 variant cover by ELIZABETH TORQUE
$9.99 US | 80 pages | One-shot | Prestige
(all covers are card stock)
ON SALE 1/31/23
DC is proud to present a selection of eight stories of rapscallion romance, prodigious passion, and undulating, unbridled affection. Tension builds as Apollo and Midnighter are captured by an unknown alien species who are determined to learn the secrets of their supersoldier success. Harley Quinn gets caught in a scintillating fantasy: What would life have been like if she and Ivy had met in high school? Also featuring Fire and Ice heating things up, fan-favorite heroine Power Girl's romantic tale, John Constantine's mysterious tryst, an amorous Aquaman adventure, and many more! These are lovelorn fantasies as only DC can tell them…but it's not a Harlequin romance…prepare yourself for the Harley Quinn Romances!
>Also featuring Fire and Ice heating things up
Look, let's be real. If Ice ain't getting with Guy, I rather have her with Fire.
I’d take New 52 over current DC any day. At least it had Aquaman, Green Lantern, Animal Man, and Swamp-Thing. Even Wonder Woman was more popular. Now DC is 90% Batman, 10% other.
I agree. There wasn’t enough queers and blacks. It was like the 1930s all over again. Glad DC Comics finally fixed their universe.
Hot Take Time: The New 52 was great and you're all fricking moronic. A ton of new, different books that were absolute killer but capeshitters can't look past the fact that they moved over Hellblazer (I'll admit I'm still pissed there) and Scott Lobdell vigorously shat the bed and made Teen Titans and the Superman Family of books unreadably fricking shit (and they were fricking agonising).
Green Lantern? Still great.
Flash? Fricking great.
Batman? Great, even if the contrarians are coming are starting to b***h about Snyder.
Wonder Woman? Great, even if they dragged their nuts over the Amazons. Enjoy a story and understand your fricking lore will come back later.
So a lot of your capeshit stuff was fricking good, I'd dare say more consistent than it is now. Then we look at the fricking different, interesting shit you should have read and didn't because you're all fricking boring shitters who let the best books die.
- Demon Knights: Fantasy and legit to the final issue.
- All-Star Western: More of the good shit from the creatord of the previous run.
- I, Vampire: A cool, dark, horror themed book that was mismarketed by the covers. Go back and read that shit. Awesome story and art.
- Justice League Dark: So cool they keep bringing it back.
Animal Man: Dark, twisted, and fun. Bit edgy but a fricking good read.
- Swamp Thing: Solid read alongside Animal Man, but once Soule comes in its the best Swampy has been since Moore (but not better. It does fun stuff with the ideas and the art is incrddible).
- Dial H: 15 issues of unhinged fun as the fat frick plays Ben 10 with Granny. If you want that comic weirdness it was waiting for you and you ignored it.
There's more, but I'm at cap. Look into those titles.
"Hurr Durr, they could have done it without the big reboot."
That's not how marketing works. It was either an insane push or nothing at all. DC tried putting out the new and interesting stuff people claim they want and you demanded more slop. ONLY slop.
You're right about the average quality of the books (Dial H is one of my all-time favorite comics, and it might've been my all-time favorite if it didn't get the rushed ending), but the way the transition to the New 52 was executed was totally botched.
And I don't have a problem with it being a reboot either, at least not in theory.
The initial plan was for Final Crisis to lead into the New 52, which would've made 10x more sense, but they decided not to do that and instead to turn a solo Flash story into the inciting event for a reboot...okay.
But surely they actually rebooted the universe, right?
Well, Superman got pretty much a full reboot. While his titles weren't great (sans Moz's Action Comics), he was actually rebooted.
Same thing for Wondy, and really most characters.
But several of their big name characters - most egregiously, the Green Lanterns - weren't rebooted!
So we had an awkward situation where pre-Flashpoint comics were no longer canon except for the series which were doing particularly well before the New 52, which they continued with minimal changes or with no changes at all like Green Lantern.
If the New 52 had been a proper, fresh slate reboot, it would've been good. But they half-assed it, just like they did 26 years ago with Crisis on Infinite Earths.
DC isn't very good at learning from its mistakes.
Real shame about the ending. I fricking adored that book. They tried to tie it up with that villain issue for Justice League but it wasn't enough (and they didn't put it in the recent deluxe edition for some reason).
The behind the scenes stuff is the most unhinged shitshow I've ever heard in comics. As much as they claimed otherwise it clearly wasn't thought through in the slightest. Things worked out because they got insane talent on a ton of books and let them do their thing. If management wasn't busy micromanaging Batman/Superman and was shitting everything up equally it could have been a real shit show.
Superman, Titans, and Suicide Squad were repeatedly ruined and unreadable despite the constant relaunches of the titles. Batfamily stuff, which was otherwise mediocre for the most part (Nightwing and Batgirl were fine, not classics, but you'd be happy reading them, and Batwoman was the definition of a 5/10 story with 11/10 art) was constantly being fricked up with tie-ins (they actually took fricking Batwing out of his main plot, in fricking Africa, in the middle of an arc to Gotham for a one issue tie-in).
That said, DC has NEVER successfully pulled off a reboot. They're always moronic. It was more complete than anything else they've done before. I'm glad Green Lantern got to finish though (and just do what we did with every other reboot, handwave the changes away until it matters later), but there was no reason for Batman not to get rebooted. Seems like they were just bending over backwards for Morrison and his terrible Batman Inc shit (and they let him frick over Perez on Superman, so it's hardly surprising). I'm sure someone out there is glad it finished, but I fail to see anything that was necessary to keep around for that series. Damien felt pointless and wasted in that.
Frick it, I'm back with more titles because you're just that much of a b***h.
- Green Arrow by Lemire.
- Action Comics by Morrison (bit overrated, but better than most shit).
- Aquaman was fricking sick, best shit since PAD.
- Grayson by Tim Seeley.
- Earth 2 (accept that alternate versions of shit can be different and not hurt your precious old books homosexual).
- Sword of Sorcery: More fantasy that was doing interesting shit.
- Batwing (until they brought in the Fox homosexualry, the original half set in South Africa). It was actually doing interesting shit with the Batman Inc set up. Something that wasn't just Morrison jerking off to completion over the fricking Silver Age.
I'm sorry limp-wristed homosexuals like you read nothing but Superman, Batman, and Teen Titans. Hopefully one day you'll actually develop some taste you fricking troglodytes.
Snyder’s Batman was awful and you should stream your suicide. Flash was bottom of the barrel garbage too. Wonder Woman may have had her worst run ever in during the New 52.
have a nice day.
> Wonder Woman may have had her worst run ever in during the New 52.
Yet it sold better than it is now.
>l-le sales
Okay shill. There were many more comic shops ten years ago and you have no clue how any DC comic is selling for the past two years so what a moronic thing to claim.
>Shill
You’re the one one shilling for Modern DC, Shill.
No, I’m merely pointing out that the new 52 was the worst era in the company’s history by far. Nice time stamp.
> No, I’m merely pointing out that the new 52 was the worst era in the company’s history by far
It wasn’t though. It actually sold and brought readers back. Unlike Rebirth and current DC.
>s-sales!
Lol jfc you really come off like a creator from that period begging to get more opportunities.
Considering current Wonder Woman can’t even make it to the top 100, I think we can safely say she ain’t doing too well.
Batman: Yeah, Court of Owls is so infamously shit, I know. Heaven forbid we do something different with the main title and do something with Gordon for a couple years. I'm sure you're happy furiously jacking yourself off rereading the O'Neil stuff for the umpteenth fricking time but I'm happy to take a detour and pretend shit can change for 5 minutes.
Flash: Look, we're both going to have to accept that Wally isn't coming back because Johns hates us, but at least I see why he hates you and your b***h-tier taste. It's some of the better stuff Barry has had in a long time, and that may suck to hear, but it doesn't suck as hard as Barry has for a long time.
Wonder Woman: Oh yeah, totally. Let's go back to the glory days of being a powerless spy, wearing the jacket, or work8ng at taco bell. Great new designs, awesome art, a run interrupted by any external events (frick knows Azzarello ignored the Superman/Wonder Woman trash going on) and was loyal to her character, even if it did shit on the Amazons. I'll take a good story over shitty lore want every time. The fact that this is the only time c**ts bothered to buy WW says plenty.
I'll tell you what; I'll kill myself, and all I ask is that when I've got the brick on the accelerator and a rag in the exhaust pipe you hold my hand like the code chomping homosexual you are.
I wouldn’t need you to stream your suicide if I were right there newbie. Just go ahead and start the stream and link me while you have a nice day.
>Court of Owls is so infamously shit, I know.
CoO is the sort of "game changing" shit that ends up amounting to very little. Lets make an ultra-important secret society that changes everything you know about Gotham! But not really. Its a lame example of a writer trying to make a mark and not caring about the implications long term or how it even fits in the universe.
>do something different with the main title and do something with Gordon for a couple years.
See, what they did wit Gordon is an example of something I hate; basically turning an interesting supporting character into yet another superhero. The at the movies issue Alan Grant wrote has more pathos in 22 pages for Goron than anything written with Gordon and his mech suit did in however many years that asinine story ran.
>It's some of the better stuff Barry has had in a long time, and that may suck to hear, but it doesn't suck as hard as Barry has for a long time.
Really not saying much, most of Barry's stuff is unreadable.
Saying it amounts to very little is an understatement. Sadly, that's to be expected in Capeshit. Flatly, it's kind of standard. Everything is a one-off until it isn't. Ra's al Ghul and the League of Shadows would have been another on the pile of endless secret organisations if other writers didn't pick it up. I look at the shit in a vacuum. Only way to look at these sorts of attempts. Even when I was reading CoO and City of Owls I didn't think I'd see it again. I was fine with that. Still am. It is what it is.
>Other writers are better.
Shit is relative. Has there been better shit Gordon done in the past? Yeah, there has. The existence of 9/10's and 10/10's don't dispute the existence of the high 7's. I'll agree with the statements regarding everyone being turned into heroes as it undermines characters. If he'd been set up to be a permanent change, or even a long-term one then I'd have been furious, but seeing it as a digression and character piece (even if not the greatest ever made) is a good time. We can talk about fricking up the lore, but we're talking about Batman and capeshit in general. I'm not disparaging the artistic merits of the medium or characters, but saying that they're actively created to disregard themselves in exactly this sort of circumstance. This wasn't something created to be seen as a permanent addition to the lore. It's basically a stand-alone. You may hate that, and if I had a the choice I'd change it, but I'm meeting the books (New 52 and otherwise) on their terms. Your problem here is with Marvel and DC.
>Barry is gay and lame and gay
Yeah, so we agree that the bar couldn't have gotten lower and a book with solid art could clear that.
I would be a bigger fan of Snyder's run if Zero Year never happened. MAYBE I would accept it if DC had an actual continuity reboot and this was a truly new origin and starting point for the Batman timeline. In actuality it was basically just a pitch for a movie and retconned out Year One, since all the current day stories were just implying it was canon anyway, Snyder even did a flashback to it in Court.
Riddler blowing up the whole city in Batman's first week sucks.
Temporarily taking shit out of continuity doesn't affect me; as I've said I'm fine looking at shit in a vacuum since functionally it doesn't affect other stories outside of Snyder's run. The problem is that even in a vacuum Zero Year eats shit with a fork and a smile. Even putting aside that it's such a fricking escalation for an early Batman story, it somehow also manages to be fricking boring.
>Grayson by Tim Seeley.
This was after the New 52 imprint ended.
>Batwing (until they brought in the Fox homosexualry, the original half set in South Africa). It was actually doing interesting shit with the Batman Inc set up.
Frick Winick's Batwing. It completely ignored everything established for Batwing in Batman Incorporated and still makes no sense when read alongside the rest of the books from that era. David was a rich Zorro type character from the ruling family of Mtamba, Jezebel Jet's cousin, then suddenly he's a former child soldier from the Congo.
>liking New52 Flash
It devoted more time to Barry's dull supporting cast than it did to any of the villains, and yet managed to leave all of them feeling boring and underdeveloped. Not to mention both Reverse-Flashes, Daniel and Eobard, were absolute shit and unmemorable.
I don't even think that Barry or the New 52 is inherently bad or anything, but Jesus. New 52 Flash sucked a fat wiener.
Look, I won't lie, I don't remember shit about the supporting cast from the run and i had to force myself through the sections where they were trapped in the Speed Force. It had great art, played with some fun ideas about speeding up his thoughts, and there were interesting retreads of the Reverse Flash and playing with issue numbering and forced flashback/event months that are literally the only time I've ever found those sorts of gimmicks clever. You might say it's a bit meta (and I'll normally stop reading shit trying to get meta), but it felt clever reading it at the time.
>can't look past the fact that they moved over Hellblazer
>- Justice League Dark: So cool they keep bringing it back.
This, to me, is a contrary statement, and illustrates just why I dislike a lot of what new 52 did. Yes, having a variety of genres is a good idea, my problem is that a good deal of it was basically just written like cape comics. Trying to stick all the magic/supernatural characters in a justice league style team is an idea I'll always find tacky and stupid. Killing vertigo was a terrible idea.
You're right that stuff like I-Vampire.AS Western, Animal Man, and Dial H were good. But a lot of those would've been better suited under Vertigo than trying to be mashed in to the clearly teen-oriented New 52. I guess what bugs me is that a lot of the books felt like old image books from the 90's in terms of writing.
I don't see them as contrary, but I see what you're getting at. I can appreciate JLD as being good, but not worth breaking the egg that was Hellblazer, but that's partially because it was basically an institution at this point. Unlike other characters it's not something that can be "restored" to what it was in any capacity.
A Supernatural team isn't a bad idea, but some writers treating it like discount Justice League is pretty shit. Apparently it takes talent to think that magic isn't just a different coloured laser. People wanting to read a darker, supernatural story that's got a collection of characters that otherwise wouldn't get a title shouldn't be a surprise. I'd love a solo Etrigan book, but I don't like my chances. I'll take watching the many characters bounce off each other.
The death of Vertigo is the biggest tragedy honestly, but I don't attribute that to the New 52, though it definitely helped to speed things along. The growing prominence of Image and creators rights did that. Things being mismarketed to teens really didn't help; I, Vampire's marketing being a chief example of that. I feel like that book would have survived better as a Vertigo title that didn't try to present itself as some vampire porn shit with its covers, especially with more understated sales expectations.
I still remember a lot of the b***h-tier titles you're referring to; The Ravagers, The Movement, Mister Terrific, Katana, Scott Lobdell, Hawk & Dove, etc. I won't argue, but I'll take a greater number of good titles with some stinkers over nothing but Batman, or no push for anything new. People love Reborth bit that was just giving people the exact capeshit they wanted. Fun, but it's just eating ice cream for dinner every night if you catch my drift.
>Soule comes in its the best Swampy has been since Moore
Ohhh wait these whole posts were bait. Touché anon that was good.
>ratio
New 52 was the last good era of DC Comics.
Nah that was Rebirth.
>thread gets two posts in before completely falling apart
Make better threads
im gonna go ahead and say it
it was a dissapointment
episode 1 and 3 are its saving grace and no can deny the quality drop that ensued
Cinemaphile was on pure copium episode 4 onwards
N52 never disappointed me since I, used it as a jumping off point and never gave it a chance. Rebirth was one though since I tentatively gave it a chance, it got my hopes up as it got under way and then they got dashed the moment Didiot announced Bendis was coming.
The Batman 89 comic
Steven Universe
The way it resolved plot so many times was so disappointing. The Cluster, Yellow Diamond, White Diamond. It was all lame.
Watching image at the start and being excited then realizing they had no clue how to write or keep deadlines
Ah, I remember those days. Thankfully I collected WildCATS only for the Lee/Williams art and not for the story.
The Cuphead show. It isn’t the worst, but I expected better. I watched three or four episodes and gave up on it.
>Aw shit, here comes NIGHTMASK
We never saw how this bizarre adventure would end
Probably with a fight against Ronnie James and his Stand, The Planet.
To be fair this was double damned for being spawned from One More Day and how a mugger stole a web shooter.
That Scooby Doo/Courage the Cowardly Dog crossover.
Was not as good as the old bumpers.
Rise of the TMNT
All the characters were loud and annoying. It made me miss the 2012 show.
Amazing Spider-Man post Nick Spencer.
>huge potential for a great series
>potential for games, comics, toys, action figures, movies and everything you could ever hope for
>great first season
>second season comes
>Disney decides to kill it for a bunch of boring shorts nobody even cares outside stupid manufactured controversy
Personally, this one was a big one. I was watching on my own without and thinking with myself I was seeing the beginning of something actually great. And they really did deliver in part, I just wish it could had time to fully mature instead of being killed so early on, you can tell how much they had planned to explore.
New 52 should've have been a total clean slate but leave it to DC to do the same mistakes from Crisis and Zero Hour.
>______ should've have been a total clean slate but leave it to DC to do the same mistakes
A tale as old as time.
This makes no sense. They can do that shit in OGNs and minis. Why do mainline comics need to be tanked just to appeal to weirdos who only want to read the characters if theyre completely different? Those types never buy floppies anyway.
Look, I grew up on Post Crisis DC and never wanted the New 52 anyway but since they were do adamant with a reboot just go all in not some half-assed one. Fricking Batman & Green Lantern went through that shit twice.
>I don’t want a reboot but if you’re going to do what I don’t want just make it even worse
Again, this doesn’t address the fact that they used to have the elseworld line, that they can do whatever they like in OGNs and minis and non-canon books. There is NO reason to have ever rebooted ongoings when people who want reboots DO NOT BUY ONGOINGS
Hey take it up with DC who's managed to frick up continuity like 5 times since 1985. You do have a good point.
The problem is comics are a very slow medium, starting for day 1 for all these heroes means you wouldn't see a bunch of them for literal decades. And they already reprint a lot of the classic stories anyway, so what do you do, have a reprint of old Knightfall, and a new Knightfall down the line?
I don't know why people have this idea that superhero stories NEED to start at day 1--the idea seems to be its because thats how manga is..but not every manga is like that either. Like its ok to be introduced to a character having already had their set up-- a cast of friends/supporting characters, etc. Like James Bond in Casino Royal has his first mission as 007 sure, but he's still introduced as a seasoned agent already. You watch a cop show and the cast tends to already know each other, too.
you don't need a knightfall at all. What's the point of doing a reboot if you're just going to retread all the old shit, usually worse, anyway? Make new stories for the new setting/era
what was that new52 book with a sexy alien chick? maybe lasted 6 issues?
found it,
voodoo
sexo
Voodoo went for 12 issues. Changed creative teams and direction unannounced after #3 because the main character literally raped and killed a dude as part of the main story. New writer then said "Nah, that one was a clone of the real Voodoo who I will now introduce to you this deep into the story," and the clone is now the main antagonist of the series for the rest of the run. It's a fun, but forgettable series aside from that crazy change.
yeah it kinda fell off my radar
I think of that book whenever new52 is posted
Don't forget that the supporting cast was killed off and replaced. Also it was lesbian rape by deception since she took the form of the female agent's male partner.
Weird opinion you've got there, New 52 was great.
What do ya mean of Great Disappointments of Comics and Cartoons?
Hobgoblin
When DC kept ruining masterpieces in the final 10 yards Morrison spent years on with reboots that got reversed within months
Not everything from New 52 was bad
Tom King's career, according to how people praised the frick out of his first few comics.
I maintain that he and his comics were NEVER good.
Calling Nu52 disappointing is wrong because it implies anybody smart expected anything good from it.
Now DC Rebirth? THAT's a disappointment. It was the only good chance DC had of unfricking itself and then Didio just canceled it because he's an butthole and should have been fired 15 years ago.