Batman in Injustice 2 is especially nuts on this one, not that Injustice 1 Batman wasn't already, but in the context of Brainiac's forces conducting a global total war on Earth he still insists to everyone "We. Do. Not. Kill."
>alright guys, we can't let batman or any other cape kill anyone because the buttholes in congress are having a moral crusade, alright? >you mean that if batman ever killed anyone he'd start killing everyone in the entire world and there'd be no way to stop him and we'd have to write that story!?!?!?!?!?
Silver Age already had it solved by making Batman a honorary deputy of the Gotham Police department which meant everyone looked the other way in regard to his vigilantism but as a civilian, he wasn't legally allowed to kill. The whole question was done with.
What’s amusing is that him being deputized by the GCPD lasted into bronze age stuff. I forget the exact comic, but there was a whole anti-vigilante plot where a corrupt official got muscled into it, ruining an arrest made by Batman of a serial killer. I think the guy was shoving Woman into dumpsters and everything, amusingly enough considering the OP was that Jason was Robin in the story.
Of course they didn't, the no kill rule came about because of censorship laws, but over the years it's morphed into something that actually informs the character and makes him more interesting.
Different writers interpret his motivation differently, and sometimes you get some really bad duds like the Red Hood storyline, but I don't think those outweigh the benefits of it remaining a consistent layer to his character.
The original code: >Batman never kills >Batman never uses a firearm >Batman works with local law enforcement
And that has to turned to Batman doesn't allow killing (but you don't have to save everyone,) he has a deep hatred of guns to traumatized degrees, and a might make right vigilante who violates civil laws with expressed impunity. All because the OG Batman was too scary and kids didn't want to see a man dressed as a bat shoot sleeping vampires.
It wouldn't be in a better state, but it's incredibly obvious that Jason was suppose to die here. Literally no writer knew what to do with him after this; especially when they nixed the plan of him becoming the new Nightwing after Infinite Crisis.
He can't actually be "the Batman who kills" because Bruce wouldn't allow it, but he also could be "weird vigilante who keeps taking over Gotham's crime" because the biggest element of that was that Batman had no idea WHY he was so good at countering him.
> Jason is DC number one problem
Kek. Jason haters are so fricking moronic. I'd like to say Jason would be in a better state if he had stayed dead but that sure as hell didn't stop the heroic batfam from spitting on a kid's grave.
He just needs to be used better and less frequently. He can't be a member of the Batfamily again, but he could be an occasional ally/enemy that pops up every now and then for a story that actually wants to do something meaningful with him.
Only if the Joker was involved. He could have personally seen him throwing israelites in the ovens and still fought of the Allies coming to capture him.
Nope, he does that to Ra's all the time. Hell, the climax of Batman 400 was him purposely dunking a revived Ra's back into a Lazarus Pit to watch him fricking melt.
>everyone loses
And like everything in Batman it's style over substance because Joker doesn't lose. He get to see Batman breaks his no-kill rule on an ex-Robin to save his clown pasty white ass.
When I see shit like this, I think it just makes it outright cathartic to see Batman kill, because when you see the lengths he goes to not kill no matter what, you just feel letdown that he can't allow even one piece of shit maniac die.
he wasn't even the one that was gonna pull the trigger. It was his long dead sidekick who was killed by the man he was about to kill.
>It was his long dead sidekick who was killed by the man he was about to kill.
This is even more stupid than that. Jason can't seize or get Justice for his murder any other way, since Bruce fricking lied about how his 14 yo ward died to cover his secret identity. The contrast between Bruce becoming Batman to find his parent's murderer, Bruce putting Zucko being barrs asap so Dick doesn't become like him, and what he does with Jason is just jarring.
He doesn’t want Joker to win
If he lets Joker tempt him to murder, he’ll tip over the deep end like all his rogues have
His father was a doctor and his mother a philanthropist (she even saved Joker once when he was a boy) and taught Bruce the value in helping others instead of condemning
Deep down he recognises the scary similarity between Joker and himself, and recognises Joker wasn’t born this way but driven this way by the world they both live in. So he wants to help Joker get better again instead of giving up on him (as impossible as that seems). Most of his robins were former criminals themselves, in fact. If Joker did die as he is, it’d be like seeing himself, or one of his robins, go down a worse path without a light at the end of that tunnel.
Why is it on Batman do kill the Joker? He dumps him into police custody. What about the hundreds of cops who’ve had a chance at killing him and refused to do so? What about the dozens of judges who could’ve condemned him to death instead of giving him life sentences? What about all of his rival supervillains sharing prison cells with him? Seems like everyone is complicit with this “we gotta help the Joker” mantra
because Batman is a fictional character with his own decisions, not a story about a perfectly average person always doing perfect things that everybody in the world agrees with. Why did Don Quixote fight the windmills?
This, Jesus Christ. If Batman wants to save Joker, then he saves Joker. If you think that’s morally wrong then fine, think that. The protag doesn’t always have to fit your morals like a puzzlepiece.
>brainlet
The narrative in Don Quixote says he's just a noble fool and excentric carried by his servant. Meanwhile, Bruce and his world take Batman very seriously, calling him a hero when he's just a nepo baby and authoritarian figure who never face consequences or critcicism for his actions. The only reason Bruce is fighting windmills right now it's because there's no end to Batman.
This, Jesus Christ. If Batman wants to save Joker, then he saves Joker. If you think that’s morally wrong then fine, think that. The protag doesn’t always have to fit your morals like a puzzlepiece.
Nta, but I'm completely okay with Batman being a toxic piece of shit and making fun of him.
>the Robins start looking forward to the villain of the week being Joker, because it means Bruce will be pounding clown bussy instead of theirs >Joker killed Jason in a jealous fit because he didn't want to share the Batwiener
It all makes a horrible kind of sense.
Batman is actually playing a long con here. It makes it all the more believable that a billionaire Brucie Wayne would be caught in a scandal that he'd touch his kids
Batman is actually playing a long con here. It makes it all the more believable that a billionaire Brucie Wayne would be caught in a scandal that he'd touch his kids
3 months ago
Anonymous
Didn't all three of them volunteer? Obviously, Bruce should have resisted, but Tim was really fricking insistent.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Tim definitely did. But it came along with the perks of getting adopted for Dick and Jason. They probably wouldn't turn down the chance to be a crime fighting hero sidekick when they learned pops was the Bat
I think this has taken a reasonable “I have a code where I don’t kill people” into an idiotic insane thing because of META.
Joker and other supervillains kill thousands and nearly destroy the Universe and shit on a regular basis. The GOVERNMENT of some country would kill them at this point, or at least not put them in a fricking revolving door prison.
But this is a business, so they have to escape every week to make money for Marvel and DC and they can’t die. For money and plot reasons.
This leads to Batman bending over backwards to SAVE the Joker and acting moronic when really, he wouldn’t bother to save him here.
if none of the writers ever acknowledged that Batman doesn't kill people, it wouldn't be an issue. most readers can suspend their disbelief and understand how the medium of comics works. Batman doesn't kill the joker because they want to keep using him for new stories. criminals keep breaking out of blackgate and arkham because they need to for the plot to happen.
it's very obvious DC doesn't actually have an in-universe answer to why Batman doesn't kill, and I wish they'd stop trying to invent one because all it does is force people who would've normally suspended their disbelief to confront the nonsensicality of the world, and now the problem is made even worse.
>Batman doesn't kill the joker because they want to keep using him for new stories.
This is such a bullshit reason when you can easily pull stunts like this
I prefer it when Joker just somehow manages to survive impossible situations rather than being deliberately saved
The movie version at least made sense. Jason didn't just want the Joker dead, he wanted the catharsis of Batman being forced to choose between them and picking Jason. Batman understood the situation well enough to know that he wouldn't execute the Joker until he got that. So walking away was a much more sensible response than bataranging Jason Todd.
Batman "no kill rule" worked before they turned Joker and many of his rogue gallery into unrepentant mass murderers. It was within reason. Why gone out of his way to save a guy who gas whole packed theaters or a woman who feeds people to her literal man eating plants?
I always preferred the Joker as a perfect innocent who didn’t understand how fricked up what he’s doing is. He thinks reality operates like The Three stooges, the Simpsons, or Looney Tunes. He just wants to make the public laugh. If brainwashing Superman into publicly sodomozing Jimmy Olsen is what it takes than so be it , but he should usually do things like calling in a school shooting threat, and then, once the students have all left the building, have his minions disguised as police officers arrest all the teachers for the crime of “being boring”, and give every kid an espresso and a puppy. Think a version of Harlequin from “Repent, Harlequin,” said the tick-tock man”. Likewise with the rest of his rogue’s character. If the excuse for why none of these people are ever sent to prison is because “they’re insane” than have them actually act like crazy people. Zsaz should be a normal sane moral individual until he gets another scar, and then he has to find a perfect victim to murder or else he’s convinced his skin will start peeling off or the world will end. He’ll start ripping his skin off if he’s contained and not allowed to kill. Professor Pyg and Humpty Dumpty s already perfect as is. The Riddler should be obsessed with getting Batman to pay attention to him as he’s adopted Bruce as a surrogate replacement father figure after figuring out his identity. He only commits crimes when Bruce puts on the costume because he thinks that means it’s time to play. He knows father doesn’t want to pay attention to him because he’s busy but he’ll make him pay attention to him. He shouldn’t be forcing people into saw trap unless there’s a giant red “i admit Edward Nygma is smarter than me “ button that releases them.
Batman sucks because writers and editors keep trying to defend this stupid no-kill rule when the real solution is just stop using the Joker too much and make more new villains with interesting stories.
It is more Gotham sucks. Why does batman have to kill the joker? Why can't joker go to trial and be convicted of being a remorseless murderer and sentenced to death?
they courts are somehow bent to always try him as insane, the state got rid of the death penalty, and somehow a city full of corruption, rouge cops, and thugs has never tried to "suicide" him. Basically plot convenience
Joker actions and body count put him at federal sphere by a large margin >government funds black op groups like the suicide squad/task force X >never used to get rid of a menace like the Joker
From a logical standpoint, nobody wants to deal with the Joker gang. If you were to kill the clown, those lunatics would undoubtedly retaliate, putting you and your family at risk.
Alright, anons. The gloves are off, DC and Warner are growing desperate, and they've come to (you), yes (you), to finally kill the Clown Prince of Crime, for real, with no take-backs! Well, until they run out of money again and need a twist. Be that as it may, there are rules! Batman can't do it. A member of the Bat family can't do it. Gordon can't do it. And finally, another super hero can't do it. How do you finally put the clown in the ground?
>some rando
Nah do a timeline where it was Harvey Dent as two face but every low level scumbag is trying to take credit. Like a whodunnit where all the villains are suspects even the robins and shit.
Yeah but then that random guy would go crazy and start killing people, or he was already some kind of psycho serial killer and the Joker was just his latest victim and the publicity from it allows Batman to catch him for all of his other killings. Whatever it takes to make sure Batman always has the moral high ground, no matter what.
I'd like to think he's an butthole that did a good thing and becomes an annoying little thorn in Batman's side. He also likes to imply that Batman molests his Robins.
One thing I was surprised about reading some Bronze Age Comics was Batman's' generally neutral stance to the death of his villains, and even random thugs, especially if they were the cause of their own death. I think the hard no kill rule being an in story thing and not an incidental result of Batman simply not being out to hunt criminals like deer makes his character worse.
Arkham City's handling of the Joker's death was about as perfect as you could do it.
>Joker is apprehended by Batman after blowing up medical factory and sent to Arkham as usual >the same old song and dance >Joker manipulates the other prisoners into creating an opportunity for him to escape, as always >except he finds out the dudes he was manipulating were randomly sent to solitary >the trial begins, the Joker pleads insanity, and the prosecution tries to argue otherwise, as always
>the judge actually accepts the argument this time and he's sentenced to death >Batman apparently tried to get into Arkham to see Joker, but the guards managed to catch and expel him >Joker finds out his execution is a massive media event where a bunch of death-related supers are being called into to oversee the execution and make sure he's 100% dead and his soul isn't coming back >Joker's really sweating and can't figure out why this is happening >on the night before his execution, Batman manages to finally break in >he explains that this is all happening because he cost Big Phrama trillions and now a whole lot of people are calling in favors to get rid of him and all of Joker's contingency plans he had prepared have been dismantled >final Joker story is a huge chaotic mess where a whole lot of different parties show up to either try to stop the execution, make sure it happens, or just stop everyone from killing each other. Joker thinks it's hilarious. >After three days of shit happening, Joker has maintained tons of injuries, is on his last legs, and has one last conversation with Batman where he tries one last time to get him to do the deed. Batman refuses and Joker laughs and disappears into the night, saying if he doesn't do it, there are a million other people in Gotham who will >Joker is found shot dead in the alley a few days later >final scene is the pharma guy sitting down and a whoopie cushion goes off. Horror spreads over his face as he realizes Joker had been here and probably set up lots of other "surprises" for him before he died.
I kind of like it. >Joker is found shot dead in the alley a few days later
This part does not sit well with me but you almost got it.
I think Arkham Asylum series already covered this rather well and if I recall correctly Batman & Robin series already had a villain dying after tripping on a banana peel.
I feel his end should be more like an analogy for a stand up routine where he is ultimately defeated by hecklers and his joke bombing but the audience loves it and receives a stand ovation at the end with the punchline being that the joker finally managed to make people laugh but he never got to hear it.
Joker threatens Baby Doll for no raisin so Killer Croc just fricking eats him. A couple of days later he shits him out on the steps of Gotham Police HQ, and the final little fart he poops out onto the pile of crap is his plastic flower. The fricking End.
Joker holds a dive bar hostage to try his new standup routine. He chokes on a peanut while laughing at a joke and the audience laughs out of fear as he dies on stage, last thing he hears is their faked laughter at his unfnny jokes.
A large sized one-shot where Joker gets hit by a car while in an abandoned part of Gotham and gets fricked up pretty bad by it. He desperately tries to make it to the warehouse where he was setting up his latest scheme is, having to deal with aggressive vagrants and reflecting on shit all the while. He finally collapses and bleeds out laughing because of some ironic twist, like it's the wrong warehouse, or the delivery of his shit got delayed, or his henchmen inside can't hear him/turn him away because he's out of his colors, or gets beaten to death by the other vagrants who come back towards the end.
He slips on a banana peel that he set up for batman to trip on during a fight with him, which causes him to fall into the same ace chemical plant tub thing. Obviously the irony is that he was literally trying to turn batman into himself and also that he died in the same place he was "born"
Other villians of goth ham collectively decide they've had enough of his shit, Harley included. They each create a plan involving pretending to help Joker out with his latest scheme except they can't decide whose to go with. They end up going through with all of them except they keep failing because Batman is protecting Joker through them all. Eventually Harley's the only one left, runs up to "Mistah J" acting all worried and fires a fake gun in his face, laughing about how of course she wouldn't hurt him. She then pulls a second gun and ventilates his skull without warning.
Bring back Tommy and Natt with the a Lazarus pit in a separate issue if the revived Hitman series. Later on down the series (after issue 15 or 20) have Hacken accidentally run over the Joker.
I always kinda thought it might be funny if Joker got killed by someone who didn't know they were killing the Joker, so that his last thoughts would be fury when he realizes he's going to go out with a whimper and that he's not going to be able to see Batman's reaction.
>Batman doesn't kill the joker because they want to keep using him for new stories.
This is such a bullshit reason when you can easily pull stunts like this [...]
I like the idea that like half of gothams hospitals are just full of horribly maimed/lame criminals and its a massive drain on taxpayers and little pop up shops to keep up with the demand of wheelchairs are everywhere. just miles and miles of people lined up at unemployment offices all wearing neck braces and shit. Doctors and surgeons from around the world moving to gotham because the sheer amount of work available
Toss in an opiod crisis because of how many fricking victims of batman are now in constant pain. City officials panicking when they hear batmans expanded his "jurisdiction" to their location >oh frick we gonna need to find some funding for some fricking methadone clinics and wheel chair access cobstruction fricking ASAP
>literally slits his son's throat to save the Joker
What is the defense for this? Jason has already killed people so it's not like Bruce is stopping him from being a murderer.
Doomsday has never died. Even after Superman “killed” him he woke up minutes later but they had him chained up by then and hank henshaw threw him into space
3 months ago
Anonymous
Superman tried though. What is the ethical argument for not killing Doomsday
3 months ago
Anonymous
That Doomsday’s a living sentient person. Interestingly the 2nd time Superman fought Doomsday he had developed speech and Superman purposefully spared him after he won the fight. Then Doomsday helped him fight Imperiex
Because if Bruce let Jason kill the Joker he'd have to bring him on on a murder charge. Admittedly it'd probably be ruled a justifiable homicide, but I can't exactly blame him for not taking a cold, legalistic viewpoint of doing that to his surrogate son who he previously failed to save.
>What is the defense for this?
There isn't. It's why DC never reference UTRH in details and change it here or there. For them it just boil down to "Jason come back as a villain and Batman won." The end.
No it’s not, Killing is wrong. Batman tried to stop Joker when he killed Jason, so he should stop Jason now.
>killing is le wrong but slitting throat is le good
>saving a man’s life from a murderer is “throwing a tantrum”
Edgytards…
>saving a murderer’s life from his former victim is “throwing a tantrum”
No it’s not. Noone is allowed to commitirder just because they feel butthurt, Jason
>t.manchild wo dress as a bat because he is vengeance and the night
Batgays are on another level when it come to coping and mental gymnastics.
He's the world's greatest detective, he knows about his existence as a marketable character. He can't tell anyone else about it though as they might zero-sum.
Frank is literally threatening top cut Batman's sales in HALF!
That's hitting a guy where it hurts.
False
When writers originally made the no kill code, they didn't fricking mean "Batman would kill a man who trying to shoot a pedo molesting his kid"
DC somehow turned what was originally a way to justify Batman not killing his villains into a religion
Batman in Injustice 2 is especially nuts on this one, not that Injustice 1 Batman wasn't already, but in the context of Brainiac's forces conducting a global total war on Earth he still insists to everyone "We. Do. Not. Kill."
>alright guys, we can't let batman or any other cape kill anyone because the buttholes in congress are having a moral crusade, alright?
>you mean that if batman ever killed anyone he'd start killing everyone in the entire world and there'd be no way to stop him and we'd have to write that story!?!?!?!?!?
Silver Age already had it solved by making Batman a honorary deputy of the Gotham Police department which meant everyone looked the other way in regard to his vigilantism but as a civilian, he wasn't legally allowed to kill. The whole question was done with.
>honorary
I thought he actually was "duly deputized", or was that just the show?
>as a civilian, he wasn't legally allowed to kill
Anyone is allowed to kill if it's in self defence, and self defence includes defending others.
What’s amusing is that him being deputized by the GCPD lasted into bronze age stuff. I forget the exact comic, but there was a whole anti-vigilante plot where a corrupt official got muscled into it, ruining an arrest made by Batman of a serial killer. I think the guy was shoving Woman into dumpsters and everything, amusingly enough considering the OP was that Jason was Robin in the story.
Lmao forgot the point of the post where the corrupt official stripped Batman of his deputized position.
Of course they didn't, the no kill rule came about because of censorship laws, but over the years it's morphed into something that actually informs the character and makes him more interesting.
Different writers interpret his motivation differently, and sometimes you get some really bad duds like the Red Hood storyline, but I don't think those outweigh the benefits of it remaining a consistent layer to his character.
The original code:
>Batman never kills
>Batman never uses a firearm
>Batman works with local law enforcement
And that has to turned to Batman doesn't allow killing (but you don't have to save everyone,) he has a deep hatred of guns to traumatized degrees, and a might make right vigilante who violates civil laws with expressed impunity. All because the OG Batman was too scary and kids didn't want to see a man dressed as a bat shoot sleeping vampires.
DC would be in such a better state if Jason just stayed dead.
DC would be in a better state if they'd stop piling "legacies" onto characters that aren't retiring, or even aging.
How so?
>How so?
Less pointless angst that goes nowhere.
Well then they should kill Batman first.
It wouldn't be in a better state, but it's incredibly obvious that Jason was suppose to die here. Literally no writer knew what to do with him after this; especially when they nixed the plan of him becoming the new Nightwing after Infinite Crisis.
He can't actually be "the Batman who kills" because Bruce wouldn't allow it, but he also could be "weird vigilante who keeps taking over Gotham's crime" because the biggest element of that was that Batman had no idea WHY he was so good at countering him.
> Jason is DC number one problem
Kek. Jason haters are so fricking moronic. I'd like to say Jason would be in a better state if he had stayed dead but that sure as hell didn't stop the heroic batfam from spitting on a kid's grave.
>DC would be in such a better state if Jason just stayed dead.
Jason is the reason why DC is in the shits?
Counterpoint, Red Hood is cool. It's important for comic books to have stupid shit that's just really cool.
He just needs to be used better and less frequently. He can't be a member of the Batfamily again, but he could be an occasional ally/enemy that pops up every now and then for a story that actually wants to do something meaningful with him.
Would Batman interfere in the Nuremberg Trials to stop the hangings?
Only if the Joker was involved. He could have personally seen him throwing israelites in the ovens and still fought of the Allies coming to capture him.
Top 5 worst moments in fiction.
My spiritual son or my clown bussy? DON'T MAKE ME CHOOSE!
Is it out of character for Bats to decide not to kill Joker, but say he wasn't going to save him either
Nope, he does that to Ra's all the time. Hell, the climax of Batman 400 was him purposely dunking a revived Ra's back into a Lazarus Pit to watch him fricking melt.
With ras he can probably just justify it with "he cheated death so he doesn't count" like a zombie
Bruce would give up all of his kids if it meant he had to sacrifice the clown bussy
If it was Dick holding the gun, would Bruce still do it?
Probably not?
But Dick would never be in that situation in the first place.
>Batman: "I'LL LET A BILLION INNOCENTS DIE BEFORE I LET ONE MASS-MURDERING MONSTER BE BROUGHT TO JUSTICE!"
Clown bussy wins
Only Nightwing's death in Injustice is more embarrassingly stupid
Where is this from?
The original Under the Hood story.
Batgays only hate this story because it exposed the flaws of their beloved character.
Say what you want about this moment, but Joker's reaction and line about how he found a way to win where everyone loses was fantastic.
Like most parts of this scene it's better in the movie. DiMaggio's performance is excellent
>DiMaggio's performance is excellent
This, he's honestly my favorite portrayal of joker in anything
>everyone loses
And like everything in Batman it's style over substance because Joker doesn't lose. He get to see Batman breaks his no-kill rule on an ex-Robin to save his clown pasty white ass.
All Jason needed was a good dicking from Papa Bruce
Gross. He just needed Bruce to be a decent person and adult.
I miss when Batman would be fine with indirectly killing thugs.
When I see shit like this, I think it just makes it outright cathartic to see Batman kill, because when you see the lengths he goes to not kill no matter what, you just feel letdown that he can't allow even one piece of shit maniac die.
he wasn't even the one that was gonna pull the trigger. It was his long dead sidekick who was killed by the man he was about to kill.
>It was his long dead sidekick who was killed by the man he was about to kill.
This is even more stupid than that. Jason can't seize or get Justice for his murder any other way, since Bruce fricking lied about how his 14 yo ward died to cover his secret identity. The contrast between Bruce becoming Batman to find his parent's murderer, Bruce putting Zucko being barrs asap so Dick doesn't become like him, and what he does with Jason is just jarring.
I think it's pretty obvious Bruce has favorites when it comes to his Robins
why does Batman always save the joker? is he stupid?
>necrobump
i absolutely hate the fact that asiaticmoot removed ip count because now anons will think every post is made by the same person.
He doesn’t want Joker to win
If he lets Joker tempt him to murder, he’ll tip over the deep end like all his rogues have
His father was a doctor and his mother a philanthropist (she even saved Joker once when he was a boy) and taught Bruce the value in helping others instead of condemning
Deep down he recognises the scary similarity between Joker and himself, and recognises Joker wasn’t born this way but driven this way by the world they both live in. So he wants to help Joker get better again instead of giving up on him (as impossible as that seems). Most of his robins were former criminals themselves, in fact. If Joker did die as he is, it’d be like seeing himself, or one of his robins, go down a worse path without a light at the end of that tunnel.
why should Batman's personal desire to help Joker get better trump the fact that Joker continually slaughters thousands of people?
Why is it on Batman do kill the Joker? He dumps him into police custody. What about the hundreds of cops who’ve had a chance at killing him and refused to do so? What about the dozens of judges who could’ve condemned him to death instead of giving him life sentences? What about all of his rival supervillains sharing prison cells with him? Seems like everyone is complicit with this “we gotta help the Joker” mantra
because Batman is a fictional character with his own decisions, not a story about a perfectly average person always doing perfect things that everybody in the world agrees with. Why did Don Quixote fight the windmills?
This, Jesus Christ. If Batman wants to save Joker, then he saves Joker. If you think that’s morally wrong then fine, think that. The protag doesn’t always have to fit your morals like a puzzlepiece.
>brainlet
The narrative in Don Quixote says he's just a noble fool and excentric carried by his servant. Meanwhile, Bruce and his world take Batman very seriously, calling him a hero when he's just a nepo baby and authoritarian figure who never face consequences or critcicism for his actions. The only reason Bruce is fighting windmills right now it's because there's no end to Batman.
Nta, but I'm completely okay with Batman being a toxic piece of shit and making fun of him.
The movie did this so much better.
That's because he didn't throw his very sharp batarang into Jason's neck/shoulder depending on how you view the angle.
>depending on how you view the angle.
pesn't matter when in the same comics you have Jason explaining to Onyx how lethal a shoulder wound is.
so what you're saying is he brought this on himself
why does buttom man use children to help him fight crime anyway?
Usually it's the
>they would've went on a dark path if I didn't step in
excuse
So he can molest them after patrol
>the Robins start looking forward to the villain of the week being Joker, because it means Bruce will be pounding clown bussy instead of theirs
>Joker killed Jason in a jealous fit because he didn't want to share the Batwiener
It all makes a horrible kind of sense.
Batman only jerk offs to his Robins. He never molests them because if he crossed that line then he couldn't stop himself from molesting everyone.
Underrated post
Damn fine post
Predictable.
Hi Bruce.
My name is Clarence.
Not according to ths doujins ive read
villain propaganda
How common is it for a Robin to get molested?
Twice per doujin generally
Good post
Batman is actually playing a long con here. It makes it all the more believable that a billionaire Brucie Wayne would be caught in a scandal that he'd touch his kids
why does Bruce keep collecting new boys?
Didn't all three of them volunteer? Obviously, Bruce should have resisted, but Tim was really fricking insistent.
Tim definitely did. But it came along with the perks of getting adopted for Dick and Jason. They probably wouldn't turn down the chance to be a crime fighting hero sidekick when they learned pops was the Bat
He likes them young.
And when they look similar to himself.
well, it was a incredibly fricking stupid
Judd Winick SSSUUUUCCCCKKKKSSS
Yes.
I think this has taken a reasonable “I have a code where I don’t kill people” into an idiotic insane thing because of META.
Joker and other supervillains kill thousands and nearly destroy the Universe and shit on a regular basis. The GOVERNMENT of some country would kill them at this point, or at least not put them in a fricking revolving door prison.
But this is a business, so they have to escape every week to make money for Marvel and DC and they can’t die. For money and plot reasons.
This leads to Batman bending over backwards to SAVE the Joker and acting moronic when really, he wouldn’t bother to save him here.
>You don't understand anin that tongue action is heavenly
if none of the writers ever acknowledged that Batman doesn't kill people, it wouldn't be an issue. most readers can suspend their disbelief and understand how the medium of comics works. Batman doesn't kill the joker because they want to keep using him for new stories. criminals keep breaking out of blackgate and arkham because they need to for the plot to happen.
it's very obvious DC doesn't actually have an in-universe answer to why Batman doesn't kill, and I wish they'd stop trying to invent one because all it does is force people who would've normally suspended their disbelief to confront the nonsensicality of the world, and now the problem is made even worse.
>Batman doesn't kill the joker because they want to keep using him for new stories.
This is such a bullshit reason when you can easily pull stunts like this
what if alfred tried to kill joker? would batman batarang him too? fricking no kill rule sucks. Punisher is right
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The movie version at least made sense. Jason didn't just want the Joker dead, he wanted the catharsis of Batman being forced to choose between them and picking Jason. Batman understood the situation well enough to know that he wouldn't execute the Joker until he got that. So walking away was a much more sensible response than bataranging Jason Todd.
still better than dodging a bullet after it's been fired. TOTALLY NORMAL HUMAN, GUYS
>criminal
is bat channeling dredd here
Batman "no kill rule" worked before they turned Joker and many of his rogue gallery into unrepentant mass murderers. It was within reason. Why gone out of his way to save a guy who gas whole packed theaters or a woman who feeds people to her literal man eating plants?
I always preferred the Joker as a perfect innocent who didn’t understand how fricked up what he’s doing is. He thinks reality operates like The Three stooges, the Simpsons, or Looney Tunes. He just wants to make the public laugh. If brainwashing Superman into publicly sodomozing Jimmy Olsen is what it takes than so be it , but he should usually do things like calling in a school shooting threat, and then, once the students have all left the building, have his minions disguised as police officers arrest all the teachers for the crime of “being boring”, and give every kid an espresso and a puppy. Think a version of Harlequin from “Repent, Harlequin,” said the tick-tock man”. Likewise with the rest of his rogue’s character. If the excuse for why none of these people are ever sent to prison is because “they’re insane” than have them actually act like crazy people. Zsaz should be a normal sane moral individual until he gets another scar, and then he has to find a perfect victim to murder or else he’s convinced his skin will start peeling off or the world will end. He’ll start ripping his skin off if he’s contained and not allowed to kill. Professor Pyg and Humpty Dumpty s already perfect as is. The Riddler should be obsessed with getting Batman to pay attention to him as he’s adopted Bruce as a surrogate replacement father figure after figuring out his identity. He only commits crimes when Bruce puts on the costume because he thinks that means it’s time to play. He knows father doesn’t want to pay attention to him because he’s busy but he’ll make him pay attention to him. He shouldn’t be forcing people into saw trap unless there’s a giant red “i admit Edward Nygma is smarter than me “ button that releases them.
Batman comics as a whole have been crap since 2005. Under the Hood clipped the tendons, Grant Morrison's run drove a stake through the heart.
Post Jasons
Ok
Artist?
You know I think the real mental illness is his codependency
Batman sucks because writers and editors keep trying to defend this stupid no-kill rule when the real solution is just stop using the Joker too much and make more new villains with interesting stories.
The overuse of Ha-Ha Twink has been a detriment to Batman comics in general.
It is more Gotham sucks. Why does batman have to kill the joker? Why can't joker go to trial and be convicted of being a remorseless murderer and sentenced to death?
Canonically? It's a curse from the fragment of Darkseid's power that clung to Batman when he shot the god of evil.
they courts are somehow bent to always try him as insane, the state got rid of the death penalty, and somehow a city full of corruption, rouge cops, and thugs has never tried to "suicide" him. Basically plot convenience
Joker actions and body count put him at federal sphere by a large margin
>government funds black op groups like the suicide squad/task force X
>never used to get rid of a menace like the Joker
From a logical standpoint, nobody wants to deal with the Joker gang. If you were to kill the clown, those lunatics would undoubtedly retaliate, putting you and your family at risk.
Hitman almost did it, but he was being chased by some gay demon and only caught him in the shoulder.
Alright, anons. The gloves are off, DC and Warner are growing desperate, and they've come to (you), yes (you), to finally kill the Clown Prince of Crime, for real, with no take-backs! Well, until they run out of money again and need a twist. Be that as it may, there are rules! Batman can't do it. A member of the Bat family can't do it. Gordon can't do it. And finally, another super hero can't do it. How do you finally put the clown in the ground?
something something he fricks around and kills himself when unleashing his ultimate trump card to his grandest scheme
Have him shot by a random mugger in an alley off panel.
Some rando kills him and gets lauded a hero by everyone in Gotham and he rubs it in Batman's face when Batman calls him nothing but a killer.
>some rando
Nah do a timeline where it was Harvey Dent as two face but every low level scumbag is trying to take credit. Like a whodunnit where all the villains are suspects even the robins and shit.
Yeah but then that random guy would go crazy and start killing people, or he was already some kind of psycho serial killer and the Joker was just his latest victim and the publicity from it allows Batman to catch him for all of his other killings. Whatever it takes to make sure Batman always has the moral high ground, no matter what.
I'd like to think he's an butthole that did a good thing and becomes an annoying little thorn in Batman's side. He also likes to imply that Batman molests his Robins.
Joker is the last straw for a man who's already having a very bad day.
One thing I was surprised about reading some Bronze Age Comics was Batman's' generally neutral stance to the death of his villains, and even random thugs, especially if they were the cause of their own death. I think the hard no kill rule being an in story thing and not an incidental result of Batman simply not being out to hunt criminals like deer makes his character worse.
Arkham City's handling of the Joker's death was about as perfect as you could do it.
He trips, falls down a flight of stairs, and breaks his neck.
"The Suicide Squad Kills the Joker"
Alternatively, this.
Joker is running from Batman through the streets of Gotham and as Joker turns back to taunt Bats, he struck abd killed by a bakery delivery truck.
The truck is stolen, and being driven by Lex Luthor.
Whatever would Lex Luthor need a bakery delivery truck for?
He's committing a terrible crime.
He didnt even see him because waller was blowing him
heh heh bueno...
excelente
>Joker is apprehended by Batman after blowing up medical factory and sent to Arkham as usual
>the same old song and dance
>Joker manipulates the other prisoners into creating an opportunity for him to escape, as always
>except he finds out the dudes he was manipulating were randomly sent to solitary
>the trial begins, the Joker pleads insanity, and the prosecution tries to argue otherwise, as always
>the judge actually accepts the argument this time and he's sentenced to death
>Batman apparently tried to get into Arkham to see Joker, but the guards managed to catch and expel him
>Joker finds out his execution is a massive media event where a bunch of death-related supers are being called into to oversee the execution and make sure he's 100% dead and his soul isn't coming back
>Joker's really sweating and can't figure out why this is happening
>on the night before his execution, Batman manages to finally break in
>he explains that this is all happening because he cost Big Phrama trillions and now a whole lot of people are calling in favors to get rid of him and all of Joker's contingency plans he had prepared have been dismantled
>final Joker story is a huge chaotic mess where a whole lot of different parties show up to either try to stop the execution, make sure it happens, or just stop everyone from killing each other. Joker thinks it's hilarious.
>After three days of shit happening, Joker has maintained tons of injuries, is on his last legs, and has one last conversation with Batman where he tries one last time to get him to do the deed. Batman refuses and Joker laughs and disappears into the night, saying if he doesn't do it, there are a million other people in Gotham who will
>Joker is found shot dead in the alley a few days later
>final scene is the pharma guy sitting down and a whoopie cushion goes off. Horror spreads over his face as he realizes Joker had been here and probably set up lots of other "surprises" for him before he died.
I kind of like it.
>Joker is found shot dead in the alley a few days later
This part does not sit well with me but you almost got it.
I think Arkham Asylum series already covered this rather well and if I recall correctly Batman & Robin series already had a villain dying after tripping on a banana peel.
I feel his end should be more like an analogy for a stand up routine where he is ultimately defeated by hecklers and his joke bombing but the audience loves it and receives a stand ovation at the end with the punchline being that the joker finally managed to make people laugh but he never got to hear it.
Joker threatens Baby Doll for no raisin so Killer Croc just fricking eats him. A couple of days later he shits him out on the steps of Gotham Police HQ, and the final little fart he poops out onto the pile of crap is his plastic flower. The fricking End.
Joker holds a dive bar hostage to try his new standup routine. He chokes on a peanut while laughing at a joke and the audience laughs out of fear as he dies on stage, last thing he hears is their faked laughter at his unfnny jokes.
What
said. Let Charlie Collins finish the job.
Joker gets Pancreatic cancer, sets things-up to leave as big a mark on Gotham as he can.
Batman apprehends Joker and one of the cops that takes him away puts a cap in him and dumps the dead body into the river
I was perfectly content with how he died in the first Burton movie. It was pathetic and creepy and it fit him.
A large sized one-shot where Joker gets hit by a car while in an abandoned part of Gotham and gets fricked up pretty bad by it. He desperately tries to make it to the warehouse where he was setting up his latest scheme is, having to deal with aggressive vagrants and reflecting on shit all the while. He finally collapses and bleeds out laughing because of some ironic twist, like it's the wrong warehouse, or the delivery of his shit got delayed, or his henchmen inside can't hear him/turn him away because he's out of his colors, or gets beaten to death by the other vagrants who come back towards the end.
He slips on a banana peel that he set up for batman to trip on during a fight with him, which causes him to fall into the same ace chemical plant tub thing. Obviously the irony is that he was literally trying to turn batman into himself and also that he died in the same place he was "born"
Joker takes bat viagra to taunt Batman but chokes on it while laughing when he tried to take it.
One of Joker's own henchmen kills him, and said henchman takes over the gang with terrifying efficiency.
He slips in the shower and dies.
Other villians of goth ham collectively decide they've had enough of his shit, Harley included. They each create a plan involving pretending to help Joker out with his latest scheme except they can't decide whose to go with. They end up going through with all of them except they keep failing because Batman is protecting Joker through them all. Eventually Harley's the only one left, runs up to "Mistah J" acting all worried and fires a fake gun in his face, laughing about how of course she wouldn't hurt him. She then pulls a second gun and ventilates his skull without warning.
Bring back Tommy and Natt with the a Lazarus pit in a separate issue if the revived Hitman series. Later on down the series (after issue 15 or 20) have Hacken accidentally run over the Joker.
my self insert who somehow has the same martial prowess as the batman defeats him and then rape him in front of the batman
I always kinda thought it might be funny if Joker got killed by someone who didn't know they were killing the Joker, so that his last thoughts would be fury when he realizes he's going to go out with a whimper and that he's not going to be able to see Batman's reaction.
Random, but what's wrong with Scott Snyder? It's like he can't control the right side of his face.
Dennis O’Neil’s Batman
I prefer it when Joker just somehow manages to survive impossible situations rather than being deliberately saved
this
pay attention, hacks
Wasn't Red Hood and the Outlaws good?
It was never good.
Should young boys even be allowed to fight crime, feels like a law is being broken here
Telltale Batman got it right. He won't kill you but is ok with stabbing, brutalizing, impaling and brain damaging his foes
I like the idea that like half of gothams hospitals are just full of horribly maimed/lame criminals and its a massive drain on taxpayers and little pop up shops to keep up with the demand of wheelchairs are everywhere. just miles and miles of people lined up at unemployment offices all wearing neck braces and shit. Doctors and surgeons from around the world moving to gotham because the sheer amount of work available
Makes sense.
The frequent bone crunching in the arkham games shows that.
Toss in an opiod crisis because of how many fricking victims of batman are now in constant pain. City officials panicking when they hear batmans expanded his "jurisdiction" to their location
>oh frick we gonna need to find some funding for some fricking methadone clinics and wheel chair access cobstruction fricking ASAP
>literally slits his son's throat to save the Joker
What is the defense for this? Jason has already killed people so it's not like Bruce is stopping him from being a murderer.
Just because he murdered before doesn’t mean Batman can sit back and let him murder someone.
a man killing his killer should be allowed. It's like the ultimate exception
Batman throws a tantrum when somebody does a no-no
>saving a man’s life from a murderer is “throwing a tantrum”
Edgytards…
just admit that you have a fetish for clowns with big chins, buttman.
Yes it literally is in this case.
No it’s not. Noone is allowed to commitirder just because they feel butthurt, Jason
>commitirder
My favorite German bratwurst.
If the law keeps an insane mass murderer alive to keep mass murdering the law is by definition invalid.
No it’s not, Killing is wrong. Batman tried to stop Joker when he killed Jason, so he should stop Jason now.
>Killing is wrong
what does batman do about doomsday?
Doomsday has never died. Even after Superman “killed” him he woke up minutes later but they had him chained up by then and hank henshaw threw him into space
Superman tried though. What is the ethical argument for not killing Doomsday
That Doomsday’s a living sentient person. Interestingly the 2nd time Superman fought Doomsday he had developed speech and Superman purposefully spared him after he won the fight. Then Doomsday helped him fight Imperiex
Normally I would agree, but come on. It's the Joker. No jury in the world would convict him. For that particular murder, at least.
Because if Bruce let Jason kill the Joker he'd have to bring him on on a murder charge. Admittedly it'd probably be ruled a justifiable homicide, but I can't exactly blame him for not taking a cold, legalistic viewpoint of doing that to his surrogate son who he previously failed to save.
>What is the defense for this?
There isn't. It's why DC never reference UTRH in details and change it here or there. For them it just boil down to "Jason come back as a villain and Batman won." The end.
>killing is le wrong but slitting throat is le good
>saving a murderer’s life from his former victim is “throwing a tantrum”
>t.manchild wo dress as a bat because he is vengeance and the night
Batgays are on another level when it come to coping and mental gymnastics.
He's the world's greatest detective, he knows about his existence as a marketable character. He can't tell anyone else about it though as they might zero-sum.
Why?