Why do modern "adventure" cartoons feel like they're actually about gay therapy sessions?

Ok, I'll make something clear first. OBVIOUSLY characters having personal growth over internal conflicts that reflect issues people face in real life is good writing. I don't even want to pretend like I'm one of those morons that worship one-dimensional 80s shonen protagonists and get mad any time a character shows vulnerability. I can appreciate shows about explicitly weak and vulnerable characters like Shinji.

But when modern cartoons do it, a lot of the time it feels really... cheap? Boring? It's almost always character A breaking down and crying over some personal issue, then getting validation and support from character B, and the fans of their show on social media talking about it like it's the peak of "character development" and "tackles very important issues".

SU is one of the biggest and most obvious offenders of this, a show allegedly about adventures of aliens on Earth ends up revolving around this really small-scale conflict of every single character being traumatized from the death of this one person. What about the adventures, the fantasy, the imagination, right?

But this isn't really a SU complaint thread, because it's far from the only show that did this. And fandoms seem to eat it up and endorse it, having almost a fetishistic fixation on characters "breaking down" and "working through their trauma". Even for anime, a lot of discussion revolves around speculating "ooh what trauma does THIS guy have?"

And it's always one of the few generic "safe" flavors of trauma, too. A character losing their parent, a character recovering from an abusive relationship, a character being too harsh on themselves. It's never about something like the trauma of being lonely and having no one to rely on but yourself, there is ALWAYS someone who's gonna give the traumatized character a pat on the back.

I don't know. I used to think I like angst, but this whole culture feels kinda gay and lame to me. Adventure is trauma now, but only specific safe kinds of trauma.

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  1. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I’ve felt this way for a long time. Thanks for finally putting it into words.

  2. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Why do modern "OP’s" threads feel like they're actually about gay therapy sessions?:

  3. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Narcissistic, untalented writers with skewed priorities

  4. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It seems like this because they are stories for a generation of people who have mistaken weakness for virtue.

  5. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    You have concerns about modern cartoons focusing too much on characters' personal traumas, which you find repetitive and predictable. You feel that this trend limits the exploration of other aspects such as adventure and imagination.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Thanks ChatGPT, I knew I can always rely on you.

  6. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    This is going to be another case of OP revealing he only watches a narrow genre aimed at kids based on whatever is getting "discourse" on social media isn't it?

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Well throw out some cultured suggestions then

  7. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Think it might be because animated shows are often compelled to have happy endings, or some form of levity in each episode. Realistic trauma or internal conflict often breeds tragic endings, or will tell a bittersweet story throughout that might be harder to write or make safe for mass-audiences, especially younger ones.

    For a show like SU, you always know that Steven and his buddies will win in the end. So their issues become simple obstacles or story-telling tools, instead of something more meaningful or real.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      its better to just not include any of that drama or at least to not make it the whole pillar on which episodes are built

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      you could do something for kids in an adventure comic like, say, post apocalypse with a boy and a dog but the dog gets a robot virus or something and turns on the boy, biting off his hand and he has to put the dog down (or the dog escapes for later, turns out with help from a scientist boy might be able to save the dog). The simple premise here would constantly contain the 'trauma' of the protagonist every time they look at their robot hand or grapple hook prosthetic or whatever. Point is, it's enough 'drama' for gen audiences and it would still have a lot of relatable and meaningful 'emotional weight' throughout the story. But it's also so simple (pulled it out of my butt right now) and anything like it would do what such cartoons end up doing only a million times better. I can only conclude that, somehow, either there are too many cooks in the kitchen of cartoon writer's room or some executive meddling is turning a simple and easy job near impossible.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      We should have more tragedies. They make good stories.

  8. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >But this isn't really a SU complaint thread, because it's far from the only show that did this
    What else?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Infinity Train
      Owl House
      She-Ra
      Puss in Boots 2
      That announced Spider-Verse short that's gonna copy Puss in Boots 2 (did it already come out? I'm not following)

      It'd be fair to point out that there were things in these cartoons baside characters breaking down and being comforted, but you can still see something resembling a trend.

      In terms of general discussion, Amphibia would've most definitely had this if the fandom had its way. Like I said, pretty much every popular modern shonen discussion is riddled with talking about character trauma. It's not just "internal conflicts" or "struggles" it's always specifically TRAUMA like it's a fetish to these people or something.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Don't forget Young Justice.

        And yeah, the Spider-Man short is on YouTube.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >. Like I said, pretty much every popular modern shonen discussion is riddled with talking about character trauma.
        It is refreshing to have Kaiju Number 8 for that reason.
        >MC
        "I just wanna beat kaiju because me and my childhood friend said we would."
        >CF
        "I just wanna beat kaiju because me and my friend said we would and I'm really fricking good at it."
        >Lieutenant
        "People said swords ain't cool anymore and I'm not having that shit."
        >Silver hair
        "I just really wanted to beat kaiju."
        >Pink hair
        "I wanna prove I'm awesome"

        And it's just that down the line, there's exactly 1 character who's dealing with trauma of her mom and SPOILERS so it doesn't feel like it's just misery for the sake of it.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Owl House had a really good trauma arc of Luz losing her parent. Compare that to Infinity Train which just had Tulip whining over her divorcing parents obnoxiously for a whole season.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Ruined by the whole destruction of another character, they literally had Amity going all "I wanna be the best cute gf!"

          Gratz on your sex change btw

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            >destruction of another character
            Don't you already have dozens of generic alpha b***hes in cartoons to latch onto? Let Amity be an actual likable character.

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              >Boring shitty self insert "not a selfinsert" is now considered a good character
              Oh hey, what is that? Is it really going to have another movie?!

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                I don't care about owl house but this Hispanic is such a wannabe shadman and his edge lord art sucks dick

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Same, I already had him under a meh opinion with loud house ships and all that shit, but then the whole sprig in amphibia began, frick that homosexual

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Have you considered that to some people, your favorite generic alpha b***hes are boring and one-note and they'd prefer to see a functional relationship on-screen?

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Lesbians (lese-girls in this case) are the least functional.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                You sound like a really big homosexual b***h, like goddamn, I can believe you wanting to find some good relationship in cartoons but you have to be really delusional to think that extreme selfinsertism shit was any good.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >it's always specifically TRAUMA like it's a fetish to these people or something.
        There's strong appeal in drama.
        The problem is in modern cartoons and shows the infantantized audience isn't really allowed to be witness to real stakes or loss (since death, societal breakdown and real world themes are scary), so the role of this tumblr-y trauma aspect is to fill in the lack of real tension or problems for the MC. It's to provide drama without actually building a heartwrenching story around necessitating it.

        Like Sugar cannot kill off Connie or cripple Pearl or have any real bad consequences to the characters due to the narcissistic and sheltered audience, forcing all conflict to be contrived and faux-intrapersonal instead.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          In my understanding, drama is appealing when it's a dynamic story where the characters' internal struggles lead them to take dramatic decisions that impact theirs and others' storylines, and the plot as a whole. Not when they just... cry about it. But clearly, there's a big audience for the latter.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Well the problem is you need problems to do something 'about' before you can take dramatic solutions or have internal struggles what to do, decisionwise.
            There are no real stakes or conflicts in SU. The Status Quo is kept prettymuch beginning to end and there are no real threats, the problems are contrived and trivia land there's very little to actually solve or decide. Everything is static but the emotional investment is in incredibly trivial shallow things.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        RWBY too
        It started out as a show all about cool fight scenes but somehow ended up with the last season being about the main character's crippling depression
        ...while also SOMEHOW having tonally deaf slapstick comedy like

        >Things that would have been jokes in the past (like slapstick comedy)
        Good riddance, it's tonally incoherent dog shit when anyone but looney toons does such

        mentions.

        And while a lot of people here complain about shit like SU not having stakes, RWBY does have stakes and brutal traumatizing events happening. But it's not necessarily a good thing in the context of the show. There's such a thing as too much stakes, to the point where most of their setting has gone to shit, things just keep getting worse and it seems impossible for them to defeat the main villain.

        And I think that's part of it too, because the people writing RWBY don't care about a cast of heroes going on adventures and having cool fight scenes and beating their villains, they care about creating a bleak environment where the heroes can be depressed over their failures and spend an entire season "dealing with trauma". The lead writer of the show literally reposts "suffering builds character" memes on twitter. You can count the amount of climactic victories the heroes have had over the course of the show on the fingers of one hand. It's so frustrating when you want to see the characters fight and be proactive and do cool shit and they're sitting there talking about their trauma while barely accomplishing anything in the story.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Who is gay in puss in boots 2?
        Also infinity train? Are you talking about season 4? That was not confirmed but even if it was, the focus wa snot romance or being gay, it was interpersonal relationships and falling out as adults. The season handled that well and maturely.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          >Who is gay in puss in boots 2?
          My mom clocked the voice actor of the little dog as a gay and she was right kek

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Adventure Time, Regular Show

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Man it's amazing how badly regular show got dragged down by that

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Its funny how Gumball was able to do better relationships and lore than these shows while not even making them the main focus of the show.

        Truly Euros are just simply better writers than NAgays

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          I wish people would talk about Gumball's story; it's really underrated, and the concept is unique and good in execution. The only bad thing about it is that we never got more.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            We ARE getting more, in fact. At least one more season.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            Explain because to my understanding the two plot points were the Penny romance waht got resolved after she came out of her shell and the forgotten ideas zone that was used in like 3 episodes.

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              >Penny romance.
              It's still ongoing but there are eps in s4 and s6 that focus her and there are other relationships like Darwin and Carrie.

              >ideas zone that was used in like 3 episodes.
              There were 10 eps that focus on that plot could be more in the upcoming season. And other eps that weren't focusing on the void were referencing it.

              Also you forgot the backstories of the Wattersons like the origins, the choices, the father etc

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Also it was apparently the only one to survive the TTGO purge

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            That's because Gumball was the most popular show throughout the 2010's.

            Adventure time and Steven universe did not come close to the general appeal that is Gumball

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Regular Show at least still had good fun episodes into the later seasons

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          S7 was a return to form, which makes it all the more bizzare they then proceed to shit themselves one last time with the space arc in S8.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          S7 was a return to form, which makes it all the more bizzare they then proceed to shit themselves one last time with the space arc in S8.

          S7's eps were just mostly hinting at S8 alot of the eps were focusing on the lorecrap and the melodrama.

          S7 was just the impending doom

  9. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    you're right. here are some things I'd like to see more often:
    >character A reluctantly supporting character B no matter what, even when their actions are morally ambiguous at best and downright evil at most. they may choose to abandon their own morals, despite crippling guilt, in order to continue their unwavering support of character B
    >rival characters who are soft-spoken with understandable motivations instead of the snarky, overtly stuck-up trope where they seemingly know everything and just want to be #1
    >protags that are NOT reluctant. protags who seek out adventure and gleefully broach new worlds with a sense of wonder
    >ridley scott tier aliens, only more extreme, that are not even remotely humanoid but are written well enough to somehow be likable and even relatable in the end
    >characters who succeed solely due to their charm and machiavellian traits. they don't have supernatural abilities or anything, they're just a cut above car salesmen

  10. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    tons of queer creators, the dude that did she-ra and nimona, the one that did steven universe, the one that did owl house...

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      >dude

  11. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    To list a few potential causes:
    * These shows suffer from the same issues as moralizing kids' shows did back in the 90s: they want to talk about Serious Issues, but as kids' shows being broadcast to a wide audience, they can ultimately only do so much.
    * These shows spawn from Tumblr-esque social justice spaces, and thus repeat their cliche ideas about therapy and trauma and whatnot.
    * These shows also spawn from (and cater to) fandom types. Hurt-comfort fics have long been popular, so it makes sense people are into seeing characters suffer only to have someone there to comfort them, to help them overcome their traumas.
    * Taking a bit of a shot in the dark here, but it might be therapeutic for the writers and fans themselves to imagine situations where they can safely overcome their struggles.
    These all lead to a culture in which therapeutic language is valued and—despite the writers' ambitions—a very safe approach is taken when depicting human struggles.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >These shows also spawn from (and cater to) fandom types. Hurt-comfort fics have long been popular, so it makes sense people are into seeing characters suffer only to have someone there to comfort them, to help them overcome their traumas.
      you hit the nail on the head with this one

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Soft/Safe Trauma is fricking annoying. It's artificial tension since there's nothing at stake and it isn't really allowed to show the characters as more believable human beings

      Again, to bring up Eva

      >Shinji saw his mom die in front of him then got abandoned by his father shortly after
      >raised without love so the end result is a panicky self-hating wreck who desperately clings for paternal approval and throws himself into the grinder to do so
      >ends up breaking when his support structure is taken away person by person and figuratively/literally commits suicide

      You can also blame fandom culture: too many people developed parasocial relationships with characters and now get panicked if they aren't being fed hugbox and sanded down conflict-less meandering

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        You know what, I'm going to bring up Eva ONE LAST TIME

        >literally the peak example of pulpy adventure + psychotherapy for the author since it was inspired by Jules Verne and sci-fi novels, as well as other stories

        and the thing about Eva is that it never STOPPED being about the premise: teens in mecha fighting Angels for the fate of the world. if eva was made today in America, Shinji would just be gay for Kaworu and Rei would be gay for Asuka and then they stop fighting Angels halfway through with the ending being SEELE being destroyed in some anticlimactic fight that doesn't really fix any of the bigger problems and Gendo gets forgiven and allowed to keep living

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Gendo gets forgiven and allowed to keep living
          >onions writers not humiliating and viciously killing a proxy for their fathers

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah like 90% of stories are about how the writers’ dads were all abusive narcissists and abused their kids because of their NPD and all the writers need to come to terms with these daddy issues sometimes via evil strawman stand ins for their dads who are abusive narcissists for them to overcome.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              See also: the career of Rian Johnson

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Yeah like 90% of stories are about how the writers’ dads were all abusive narcissists and abused their kids because of their NPD and all the writers need to come to terms with these daddy issues sometimes via evil strawman stand ins for their dads who are abusive narcissists for them to overcome.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Long before the sequels, my dad would tell of how Luke went on to found a new Jedi order and surpass Yoda and accomplish so much legendary stuff. Now that's all gone thanks to these soulless wienerroaches...

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Now that's all gone
                Just read the books and comics about that, play the games about that. The Mouse can't un-write them.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Luke Skywalker isn’t Luke Skywalker anymore. Like all male characters, he’s a stand in for “all Hollywood writers’ narcissistic and abusive dads” (or sometimes boyfriends or husbands).

                So look, now what’s important is that now Luke abuses Kylo Ren and makes him sad, but look, he’s also a disappointing and neglectful dad to Rey, too. Luckily together they overcome their communal narcissistic abusive dad Luke but Kylo is also a narcissistic abuser now because he caught it from Han and Luke (Rey can’t catch it because women are immune) so luckily he dies.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                [...]

                God fricking damn it.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Still can't get over Aharon Rabinowitz looking exactly like someone who'd be named Aharon Rabinowitz. Right down to the sweater vest.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              I think what I liked best about Venture Bros is that Rusty DOESN'T get to overcome his father. He doesn't get to kill him or have the last word or prove himself as morally superior. Shit, even after all the hell Jonas put him through, Rusty still has a sense of respect/love for him. Similarly, Dean goes through his own arc of resenting his father only to end up understanding him in the end. I find that's a lot more real and believable than "I HATE MY DAD /MOM AND I WISH THEY WERE DEAD AND IF I COULD WIN, I'D BE HAPPIER"

              In real life, most people don't get that. For some, they end up never really comprehending how badly they were hurt by the parents and come out with love in their hearts, as warped as it is. For others, they're able to see how badly their parents treated them, but end up able to recognize their parents as people, people who were also hurt/scarred/imperfect...and do the mature thing instead of letting them live in their heads rent-free.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                That’s fair. I feel like some other show might just be Rusty beating up his evil dad while his dad shouts narcissistic abuse at Rusty until his dad is dead while all of the other characters clap and talk about how now Rusty has overcome his abuse via dad murder as a cathartic way for the writers to stick it to their own dads.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                VB literally beat the shit out of every modern adventure show

                >"unlikable" protagonist but genuinely an awful person yet not in an overdramatic/exaggerated/annoying way, all of Rusty's deficits are pretty mundane and he has anti-charisma that loops around to charisma
                >adventure show that never stops being about adventure, exploration, and fun action
                >deconstructs the hero pulp/mystery/adventure/capeshit genres and justifies the conventions in fun ways
                >displays characters as very real and believable, but in awkward, weird, uncomfortable, and mundane ways

                The abusive dad strawman characters are never forgiven, they either have to pay horribly as the final villain or in a sadder ending they were already dead and the “victory” is just the characters accepting that they were evil pieces of shit. That’s a big reason a lot of people find the OT Star Wars ending with Darth Vader extremely “traumatic” and “triggering” and offensive and problematic, for having any sense of peace there.

                Only mothers and other female abusers get forgiven.

                A lot of people don't understand that Vader being forgiven by Luke works because Lucas is super into Buddhism and the Jedi were meant to come across as monks: Luke defeats Vader through unconditional love and compassion rather than feeding into the cycle of suffering with more violence and hatred. Hence the importance of Vader having his mask taken off: in the end, the big scary dragon at the side of the wicked king was just a sad old man with a sword, a sad old man who fell into the clutches of evil and unable to let go of his possessive and selfish attachments to those he loved until it was too late

                >but it was never too late to change

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Yeah but wouldn’t it be way better if instead Darth Vader was like “I’m Making the Galaxy Great Again with my bigly hands” and then he’s just another obvious stand in strawman for Donald Trump/the writers’ dads and Luke beats him up while ranting about how Republicans are narcissistic abusers? And then Leia rolls her eyes and says “ugh, men” and “well, THAT happened” before a new trilogy that’s just all of the characters sitting in therapy and crying about their evil abusive dads?

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                ironic considering that Gendo's death is framed with an immense sense of tragedy, pity, and understanding. for all the shit he put Shinji through, he was a person nonetheless, not some big monster to put down or hug and forgive

                You guys would flip out if an abusive female treated with the same level of pity and humanity.

                You know, like in fricking SU.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Genocide is bad, actually.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                And being an abusive father isn't?

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            ironic considering that Gendo's death is framed with an immense sense of tragedy, pity, and understanding. for all the shit he put Shinji through, he was a person nonetheless, not some big monster to put down or hug and forgive

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >hug and forgive
              That's reserved for proxies for the writers' mothers. The writers' fathers get nothing but decades of stored up bugman (and bugwoman) bile.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              The abusive dad strawman characters are never forgiven, they either have to pay horribly as the final villain or in a sadder ending they were already dead and the “victory” is just the characters accepting that they were evil pieces of shit. That’s a big reason a lot of people find the OT Star Wars ending with Darth Vader extremely “traumatic” and “triggering” and offensive and problematic, for having any sense of peace there.

              Only mothers and other female abusers get forgiven.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                you should have known shit was going sideways when the fricking wicked witch of the west got a stage play

                and lifetime made a fricking movie about the pedo teacher who raped and got knocked up by a 12 year old boy and played it up like a steamy romance, said teacher was also raping other boys as well.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >, Shinji would just be gay for Kaworu
          That did happen in the anime tbh

        • 1 week ago
          V

          Anime is so strong because weeaboos fail to watch it in Japanese and completely miss the point of the show

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            Nice cope bro.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Actually, fandom culture is all about the opposite problem and can get pretty depraved and unhinged at times, just for the sake of it. Why do you think these people fetishize trauma in the first place?

        I've tried reading some angsty fanfiction and while it doesn't have trauma resolved instantly, it has a lot of wallowing in that trauma with little else going on.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Good point: I suppose that goes hand in hand with Safe Trauma, the other side of the coin

          >sadism for the sake of it, and sadism without any real catharsis: nothing but wallowing and making excuses/contrivances for suffering

          Fanfiction will always torture the characters but not in a way that creates story. And when stuff gets messy in a way that's challenging, fans flip out

          >wallowing in trauma with very little else going on
          >what is Steven Universe?

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            There are a lot of fanfiction stories that are just the characters being sad and/or tortured for 80 chapters with zero plot or other characterization happening and where all if the characters besides the tortured character are these horrible one dimensional as frick flanderized versions of themselves that only exist to torture the character. And that’s great for self indulgent fanfics just like incredibly crappy porn is great but not really what actual stories should ever emulate.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        You're comparing an anime that wasn't made for kids in mind to cartoons made for kids that air(ed) on a kids network.
        I'm sure the creators can do better than what the shows presented but they're tied to censors and the fact those cartoons are, after all, targeted towards kids.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >These shows suffer from the same issues as moralizing kids' shows did back in the 90s: they want to talk about Serious Issues, but as kids' shows being broadcast to a wide audience, they can ultimately only do so much
      Basically said what I meant in 1 line.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      kinda strange that this shit is OLD and ANCIENT therapy talk instead of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy which is more educational and less dependent on 'special argot'
      Freud, Jung, BF Skinner, they didn't have the brain scan data and hard experimental stuff to fit with their theories, they invented special language to half-describe their intuitions (right or wrong, they had no experimental data) and even though we have both drugs to help with real neurological / behavioral problems as well as CBT to tackle depression and issues that CAN be helped (really self help, this 'talk therapy' is more like guided education toward self understanding) we are still flooded in cultural terms with murky, gimmicky, 'deep' and 'profound' nonsense that really doesn't help anyone all cribbed from depth psychology of the 1950s.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        CBT is just way more boring I guess. Does anyone want to see the characters filling out CBT workbooks? A lot of CBT pretty much comes down to 'stop thinking about the problem' which isn't very interesting from a writing or viewing standpoint.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      >Tumblr
      I blame the imbecile manlet homosexual hirsch for that, the excuse of giving "young blood" a chance was a mistake, they needed to demonstrate skill, and a good example of that is his ex, the b***h was constantly trying to say her show was an act of spite, but at the same time trying to sell it to her fans as the most important miracle disney shat on that year.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Hirch was part of the problem but Ward was also guilty of gutting the OG AT staff after season1 and replacing them with tumblr people.
        Really while Flapjack itself was fine the generation of creators that spawned from it are responsible for most of the decay in American animation.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          >gutting the OG AT staff after season1 and replacing them with tumblr people
          Where do you think we'd be if he hadn't done that?

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            Probably with the big Knotting?
            Or maybe Finn breeding Fiona.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            AT would of been a popular 3 season episodic adventure show, held alongside its generational peers of Regular Show and Gumball. Gravity Falls still would of happened, SU never would of been made because Sugar was one of the people Ward recruited, and the Fan-Creator barrier would of lasted one or two more years.
            Anything beyond that is such a massive butterfly effect thanks to SU never being made that its unable to properly predict beyond less lore shows overall.
            Like I know the last wave of lore shows were all Disney projects but the landscape that enabled them to be made like that was because of the GF+SU combo and with one part missing who knows?

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Oh yeah, I was talking Disney specifically, but yeah in the other places like cn or warner other people were responsible of the shit that we have in tv now.

  12. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >SU is one of the biggest and most obvious offenders of this. What about the adventures, the fantasy, the imagination, right?

    The series has (almost) always been character driven. At the start it was this fantasy adventure thing but I feel like after Maximum Capacity it made that shift to focus on the characters' emotions and development. That's why the big arcs had little to do with the actual threat but more to do with the characters involved, those threats are used as plot devices to get to know more about the character emotionally and get them to develop and grow. With SU I don't see characters breaking down as often as people make it out to be, we just get some vulnerable moments where we learn more about them. They're given depth which I respect, not everything has to be this cool lore heavy thing. Specially for a kids show its a nice message.
    I do wish though that we had gotten a series about Rose's past instead of Future. Traumatized Steven is nice and all but it would've been interesting to see those aspects of Rose not shown on-screen. From what Rebecca has told Rose dealt with a lot of self-hatred and having Steven was actually a way of killing herself. They should've explored that more.

    Also the 'safe' flavors of trauma is probably because these are usually kids show. I'm sure the writers could come up with something way darker if given the chance.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Well said anon

  13. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >It's never about something like the trauma of being lonely and having no one to rely on but yourself
    It's not trauma I can personally relate to as a shut-in neet incel.

  14. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Anime is better.

  15. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    A lot of people are in therapy, particularly creatives. A lot of people in therapy have their greatest emotional catharsis... In therapy sessions.
    Shitty writers mistake a therapy style conversation as key to high emotional drama. It *can* be like that, but when it's done poorly it's just as you said: things feel small rather than significant.
    Contrast some Batman TAS episode. Pick one at random. You'll almost always have Batman confronting the villain of the week, who usually has some severe psychological problem. Batman will either use that to outwit them and stop their mad scheme, or offer them genuine compassion when he figures out what's wrong. Often both.
    It works in Batman because the antagonist's psychological problems are part of the challenge for Bruce to solve. It fails in SU (apparently) and other works because it feels more like just having a talk with your anxious friend. One scenario is a test for our hero to show their virtues, the other is just modeling how shrinks talk.

  16. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The biggest reason is that most people working in the industry right now have more interest in working out their interpersonal drama and childhood trauma than entertaining an all-ages audience. They forget to think about other people, particularly the children most of all. There's nothing wrong with angsty adventure, most acclaimed YA/shonen tends to get pretty psychological or introspective. The difference is that in examples like Steven Universe, they're restrained from going as far as 90s or 2000s anime/manga was allowed to go in terms of being a therapy session for the creator, which was what these show runners grew up with.

    Evangelion was one big therapy session for Anno and most people were receptive of it because he was allowed to get messy with it. Uncomfortable. Creepy. Dark. Similarly, books like American Psycho were one big therapy session for the author, and so was Johnny the Homicidal Maniac for Jhonen Vasquez.

    >Johnny/Zim and Eva were two inspirations on SU

    You could never broadcast that kind of venting out onto cartoons aimed at children 6-11, especially not in the 2010s when networks pivoted towards pandering towards younger children more than ever.

  17. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I don't mind this as long as its a new IP. But when they change something made in the 80's or 90's for "modern day audiences" that's where I draw a line. Every generation has its cartoons and media with their preffered theme. This generation deserves its theme of mental instability.

  18. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    No, you are absolutely right. I even like Steven Universe and a lot of these other shows, but you’re right.

    There’s a lot about TRAUMA and all of the characters using therapyspeak instead of having jokes or having adventures. It’s okay sometimes, but annoying when it turns into Tom and Jerry crying about how they’ve domestically abused each other for decades or Richie Rich talking about how he was a literal child soldier because they let him go on adventures as a kid and you’re like WTF.

  19. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    A generation of writers whose fathers were variously either utterly emasculated or cut out of the picture entirely by their mothers. Fatherless writing.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Yes I'm sure growing up without a father is always the mother's fault.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Correct.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          moron.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            What /LULZ/ does to a mf

            ywnbaw

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          What /LULZ/ does to a mf

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I don't think that's fair. Growing up without a father is statistically shown to mess kids up. Obviously it's not the mother's fault she can't provide everything a father can, the same way a father can't provide everything a mother can, but it does leave a lasting effect on children who grow up without one of their parents.
        Sure you can mitigate it by being the best parent you can be for your child, but the said reality is sometimes even your best isn't enough, and that sucks.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Woman chooses a shitty man to have a child with
        >Shitty man is shitty and leaves
        >Woman is left to raise child on her own
        >"Oh woe is me how could this happen"

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Maybe women shouldn't choose Chad thunderwiener which obviously gonna dump her for being out of her league or Tyrone, women deserve more accountability for their shitty choices

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Divorce stats prove that is most of the time

  20. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The other problem is that a lot of these show runners didn't grow up reading adventure stories and instead watched too much TV: crack up a classic hero pulp like G-8 or Operator 5 or The Spider and you'd be amazed by how much happens in every chapter. Non-stop thrills, tension that never lets up, and new places to go to every other week. Venture Bros is the only cartoon in recent memory to actually FEEL like an adventure story because it never stops being about adventures, even when the premise pivoted and the status quo changed. Stuff is always happening.

    Meanwhile these cartoons forget the adventure part. Owl House barely did anything with the setting. Steven Universe stopped hunting corrupted gems and getting into shenanigans with gem artifacts. Stuff STOPS happening.

    The power of the adventure genre is that it DOESN'T let up from being about exploration and peril: compare the difference between classic Ducktales and nu-Ducktales.

    >DuckTales: LET'S GO EXPLORE THE JUNGLE (goes to jungle, fights dangerous animals, gets an artifact)
    >nu-Ducktales: let's dick around and meander doing very little and only adventure off-screen

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I like nu-Ducktales but damn you are right.

      The only show was like “LET’S GO EXLORE THE PYRAMIDS” and then a serial where that happened for a bunch of episodes. Meanwhile my-Ducktales might be like “Why does Donald Duck have anger issues? Does he have a personality disorder? Is he an abusive parent? Let’s all talk to his therapist” and then nothing actually happens except the characters talking about trauma and therapy and meta Buffyspeak while they take tons of cartoony shit deadly literally.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >only

        Shit meant the old show was about exploring shit and having an adventure.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Everyone who likes NuDuckTales is shit.

  21. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I guess I would suggest watching different shows. SU is popular for its character exploration, I think. The season 1 comfy vibes of adventure are long gone, unfortunately.

    Dungeon Meshi is a recent anime that's adventure kino. I highly recommend.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      kys

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      I was looking at the ttrpg world and it's amazing how ttrpg evolved from just pure dungeon exploration with no background to being about having knowledge and connections with important npcs to going to war with groups of thousands of enemies on a battlefield with different types of scenarios in just 40 years. It was interesting to me as these were the early days of photo users other than comic book nerds and weeks. It's also interesting to see how they all hate their favorite companies and people love the rules that are created around the community more than the original books.

  22. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Mental Health Fetishism

    The modern bourgeois loves medical science as a means to classify ones experiences and responses as definitively wrong or right, applying thier own transgressions in an animated context allows them to control the narrative of thier lives; it's social emotional constructions are a substitute for reality - where how they feel is how everyone does feel

    But mostly they are middling boring mid 30's with little life experience beyond too many drugs and work/personal life complications, thus
    >Gay rock soap opera teen growing pains

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Underrated reply. Pathologizing everything allows them to multiply the self-righteous high. They get to pretend to be smarter and more educated about a complex topic like psychology, they get to show how much they care about people suffering by constantly acknowledging and bringing up theirs and others' mental well-being, and they get another high from preaching methods of addressing and treating those topics, and finally they hit the jackpot by getting to assert that they are a good person by doing all of this all of the time.

      It's emotional masturbation, combined with social posturing and clout chasing, combined with pseudo-intellectual showboating.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        That's the core of all therapy, and in some way of every altruistic thing, helping to create a world that's more comfortable for you. That's how good things generally get done in life.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Psychopath post. Do you truly not understand why people do good things for their own sake and not to score social media ass-pat points?

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            Anon, this is not how psychology works. Every good thing is done for a reason. Often it's not for material gain or social clout, but simply self-gratification, to feel good about yourself. You're subject to this too, and so am I. If you want to deconstruct the core motivations of people's behaviors, it's pretty hypocritical to stop at "their side is evil because there are self-serving impulses beneath their actions, but MY side is righteous because we totally don't have self-serving impulses driving us".

            Maybe hearing that makes you uncomfortable. Trying to figure out how human behavior works is pretty uncomfortable in general, because we are prideful and lie to ourselves a lot by default, every single one of us. This is exactly why many people prefer to just live with their own surface-level perception of how human behavior works and not get down and dirty with deconstructing it. Because that is likely to leave you at least somewhat jaded. So what I'm saying is maybe get off that high horse of judging others for having self-serving reasons behind their actions instead of being some idealized selfless saints. Because that horse is heading down a slippery slope you won't like.

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              Here's where you've missed the point spectacularly, because you're an idiot and a psychopath: The pathologizing and clout chasing is not an act of goodness and it is done solely for self-aggrandizing attention seeking, not out of some altruistic drive to do good.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                And what drives you to be so judgemental of huge groups of people you don't know?

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Lmao nice try. You thought you were really onto something for a minute there, didn't you? Maybe hearing that everyone around you isn't also jacking themselves off for performatively engaging in faux-altruistic behavior makes you uncomfortable.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                jesus you sound unsuferable to be near around.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Cope

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                NTA, you both do. If I didn't know better, you're one anon in stilts.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                >you're one anon in stilts
                ??

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              You're being extremely pedantic. Obviously any voluntary action is satisfying SOMETHING in a person's mind. Altruistic action in people isn't somehow impure just because it's partially motivated by the self.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                >Altruistic action in people isn't somehow impure just because it's partially motivated by the self.
                That's what the other guy was insisting on.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                That's because you didn't understand the difference between altruism and virtue signalling out a narcissistic need to appear altruistic without having to actually be altruistic.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                There is none. Altruism is selfish.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Mutt post.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                I bet you don't return your shopping cart.

  23. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because younger teens want to b***h about their privilege lives.
    >Oh how can I be a victim since I'm also white and middle class! Oh I will whine about being gay and everyone will be influenced by my bravery.

  24. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because millennials are obsessed with homosexualry.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      A lot of gay shit is part of it but only a part, anime is better about having characters that just happen to be gay in it. The issue here is more like instead of having a plot or humor, all the characters navel gaze about their trauma and abuse for 30 minutes every episode. There is a ton of pop psyche and therapyspeak shit. Things that would have been jokes in the past (like slapstick comedy) or a fun part of being in an adventure show (kids goin on adventures) are now “traumatic” and “abusive.”

      The REAL conflict in the show now isn’t about how Johnny Quest and the gang need to defeat Dr. Doom (or whatever) the real conflict and problem is that kids having adventures in the first place is inherently traumatic and abusive and Johnny Quest just needs therapy and a boyfriend.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Things that would have been jokes in the past (like slapstick comedy)
        Good riddance, it's tonally incoherent dog shit when anyone but looney toons does such

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          That’s fair but it’s also dogshit when a show has a joke about a character hitting another character with a giant squeaky mallet while stars fly around their heads and then the fandom and sometimes show have a bunch of shit about how it’s domestic abuse instead of the cartoon just not having slapstick comedy in it in the first place, which is what should happen instead.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It's really funny you bring up Johnny Quest considering Venture Bros' premise is literally about giving the boy adventurer realistic consequences of his childhood
        >he is now a failed scientist and a traumatized self-destructive pathetic wreck who abuses his own children

        except VB works where nu-Ducktales and SU fail because VB is committed to ADVENTURE, even if does choose to deconstruct adventure heroes

        >Rusty is a messy piece of shit but his story is about doing the best he can (and the creators don't need to TELL you he's a piece of shit, they show you and they don't linger on things more than they have to since they fricking trust the audience and also commit to Rusty being interesting over Rusty being cheaply "unlikable" and therefore an easy stand-in to punch down at)

        It's weirdly surprising because Rusty ends up coming across much more mature in terms of his character and in the execution of his story: he's what Rick Sanchez and Bojack Horseman failed to be

        >“Stop with this fairness crap & make some compromises, then go home with your friends in your goofy costumes & brag about how much you got em.”

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          The problem seems to be that a lot of modern media is predicated on the inherent superiority of self-aware deconstruction to the base template, and we need more reconstructive media instead

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            I'd rather media deconstructing the deconstructers.

  25. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Narcissitic sheltered nep babies are using childrens cartoons as their personal therapy and a way to indoctrinate and emotionally scar children.

    You're not deep.
    You're not clever
    You're not even competent

    You're trash and filth who takes the opportunity to emotionally scar the innocent audience with your personal demons and drag them into the pathetic empty hell you call a fricking life.

    Youre the people who come behind those who die after planting trees to leave something for future generations to steal and resell the apples after coating them in poison and chopping down the other trees so no one else can have anything outside of your poisoned fruit.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      woah you have problems

  26. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because they’re written by women

  27. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    This thread is one giant circlejerk.
    Lots and lots of words but no actual substance/specificity at all aside from one example that isn't even Cinemaphile-related.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I mean you can disagree but the argument is that these are the specific examples:

      Infinity Train
      Owl House
      She-Ra
      Puss in Boots 2
      That announced Spider-Verse short that's gonna copy Puss in Boots 2 (did it already come out? I'm not following)

      It'd be fair to point out that there were things in these cartoons baside characters breaking down and being comforted, but you can still see something resembling a trend.

      In terms of general discussion, Amphibia would've most definitely had this if the fandom had its way. Like I said, pretty much every popular modern shonen discussion is riddled with talking about character trauma. It's not just "internal conflicts" or "struggles" it's always specifically TRAUMA like it's a fetish to these people or something.

  28. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Steven Universe ended 5 years ago anon, you need to let go.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      We're still dealing with its consequences, the industry is filled with beanmouth tumblrinas with shit writing wondering why the industry is crashing down

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        >muh scapegoat

        Protip for anyone who whines like OP does. They're not complaining about kids not getting the entertainment they desire, they're talking about themsselves and using kids as a cover.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          >i-it's projection
          Yeah sure dude, I bet kids cared so much about some homosexual that solved most of his issues by crying and didn't find him lame at all lol, no kid actually liked SU, futhermore, the only reason why it even went as long as it did was because the creator was a israeli women

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            NTA but see

            There is a world outside your bubble. Back when Youtube didn't remove comments under children's videos you could still occasionally find clear underage comments under SU clips on Youtube. Probably still can on pirating websites.

            I saw kids commenting under SU for a fact
            Also who do you think watched all the e-celeb review and theory videos on SU? You really think there was not a single kid in the audience of those?

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              Kids didn't watch shit about solving things in the series, most of their "discussion" was what theory they watched in youtube, sorry to drop that down on you man, but the time where teens would sit and read 40 pages in some blog with details about how the whole psychology of every character works and from that part form their own theories or ideas of hoe to "solve" some character issues are over, those days were over around the 90s when Evangelion and FLCL were the last shows/animes to have watchers actually care enough as to read stuff before going into forums to have discussions over why Shinji should just frick Misato/Rei/Asuka.

              SU and GF caused a massive bunch of youtube channels to raise and whatever % of those being done by teen (at that moment) were those that were subscribed to some other older guy who had experience in doing analysis, so they were pretty much repeating and adding whatever they felt was more important, causing other dozens of thousands to not form an opinion, but rather just repeat opinions/theories of others, really a tragedy as people just have chewed thoughts from some homosexuals.

              GF brought half a generation of teens snd young adults (5 years gap) who believed were "too intelligent" and that they could see what others couldn't, and all because they watched some chewed youtube "what you didn't notice in gf" or some x mins video with every code solved for them to believe they had solved them by themselves.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                >Kids didn't participate
                My mistake

  29. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    What did you expect from a show whose creator came from "Adventure" Time? You know the same show that went on its way to tell you that everything goes back to status quo and was awful at doing drama after the IK backstory reveal

  30. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I feel like some indie shows fall into this camp as well, especially anything Vizzie has ever made, Murder drones and especially TADC

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Murder drones
      That's been mainly about Outer God GLaDOS trying to vore the universe into a black hole.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Out of all these shows Murder drones has had multiple therapy like sessions where characters break down. Of the three it’s the one that’s done it the least overtly but it’s still there. One thing I’ll note is that the one of the only modern show off the top of my head I can think of that avoids this is Smiling friends, which is weird because it’s about making people smile.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          That because Smiling Friends is an absurdist comedy about dealing with internal issues via explicit exterior action.
          Professor Psychotic doesn't have a deep look at himself, nor does the heart to heart with his brother work out. Its only when the homunculus is born that the two set aside their differences to be better parents than their mother was ironically using their trauma as a driving force for good.
          At least to the extent you can in the bounds of a episodic comedy.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Come to think of it, you’re right about Smiling Friends. Maybe the difference is that creators of shit like Steven israeliteniverse just want to trauma circlejerk, not actually have their characters be happy. It’s like how lots of mentally ill people would rather wallow in their misery and blame other people rather than solving their problems themselves.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Murder drones
      That's been mainly about Outer God GLaDOS trying to vore the universe into a black hole.

      Murder Drones does have that one skyfalling therapy scene, but it's not really a flagrant example of the gay crybaby therapy trope. It's a cute scene between the two where Uzi is understandably freaked out by briefly losing control due to the ungodly effects and hunger she is experienced from being host to Basically Eldritch Robo-Satan (tm) and N calms her down. It's a stand-out scene from the show and it's not overused or repetitive. I like it.

      Out of all these shows Murder drones has had multiple therapy like sessions where characters break down. Of the three it’s the one that’s done it the least overtly but it’s still there. One thing I’ll note is that the one of the only modern show off the top of my head I can think of that avoids this is Smiling friends, which is weird because it’s about making people smile.

      >multiple therapy sessions
      Examples? I'm not remembering many from the top of my head. Unless you count Uzi yelling at her dad for leaving her to die or "Tessa" explaining the situation to N and the possibility that he may have to put Uzi down to save the universe as therapy sessions, I guess. Which I would contest, these scenes don't really serve that purpose.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It was a nice scene, also short and doesn't overstay its welcome

        was OK KO fine?

        >OK KO
        God I barely even remember anything about that show apart from the girl with the big ass
        Didn't the dad turn into a gay depressed villain or something?

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          If I remember right, OK KO had an entire episode that was a really half assed allegory for why America needs gun control kek

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Well, one of the upcoming episodes of TADC is about Kinger attacking his friends with a shotgun, and he's usually the most gentle character of them all when he knows where he is or who he's talking to.
      According to Gooseworx, characters turn very unpleasant when they're on the verge of total mental collapse, and it shows with how everyone talks about Kaufmo, the latest victim. He apparently had a history of telling bad jokes no one found that funny, but still got along with everyone when he was sane. But once he got to the end of his rope, he started snapping at everyone for either giving him pity-laughs or not laughing at all. One of his friendships with them was even left in tatters the last time they spoke to each other before he lost himself forever ("How is Kaufmo doing? I hope he's not still mad at me for not laughing at his jokes...").

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      [...]
      Murder Drones does have that one skyfalling therapy scene, but it's not really a flagrant example of the gay crybaby therapy trope. It's a cute scene between the two where Uzi is understandably freaked out by briefly losing control due to the ungodly effects and hunger she is experienced from being host to Basically Eldritch Robo-Satan (tm) and N calms her down. It's a stand-out scene from the show and it's not overused or repetitive. I like it.
      [...]
      >multiple therapy sessions
      Examples? I'm not remembering many from the top of my head. Unless you count Uzi yelling at her dad for leaving her to die or "Tessa" explaining the situation to N and the possibility that he may have to put Uzi down to save the universe as therapy sessions, I guess. Which I would contest, these scenes don't really serve that purpose.

      On the subject of Glitch shows, Digital Circus does revolve around a situation where crafting a bleak, depression-inducing environment like

      RWBY too
      It started out as a show all about cool fight scenes but somehow ended up with the last season being about the main character's crippling depression
      ...while also SOMEHOW having tonally deaf slapstick comedy like [...] mentions.

      And while a lot of people here complain about shit like SU not having stakes, RWBY does have stakes and brutal traumatizing events happening. But it's not necessarily a good thing in the context of the show. There's such a thing as too much stakes, to the point where most of their setting has gone to shit, things just keep getting worse and it seems impossible for them to defeat the main villain.

      And I think that's part of it too, because the people writing RWBY don't care about a cast of heroes going on adventures and having cool fight scenes and beating their villains, they care about creating a bleak environment where the heroes can be depressed over their failures and spend an entire season "dealing with trauma". The lead writer of the show literally reposts "suffering builds character" memes on twitter. You can count the amount of climactic victories the heroes have had over the course of the show on the fingers of one hand. It's so frustrating when you want to see the characters fight and be proactive and do cool shit and they're sitting there talking about their trauma while barely accomplishing anything in the story.

      mentioned is part of the whole point of the show, not something that takes over the wacky slapstick comedy, which actually contributes to the trauma the characters go through.
      In this case, the human cast has been ripped out of their old lives forever, transported to a world of nonsense under the control of an obnoxious and intrusive host. They're given no time to process the situation, as they're regularly sent on adventures where they may be eaten, stabbed, shot, impaled, and put through other situations no one could normally survive through. They only have each other for support, and even then, the bulk of them are already fraying from the strain. And worst of all, they know that if they ever give in to madness and despair over their situation, they'll transform into digital monstrosities that know only to wreak havoc, doomed to be sealed away forever in a pit of darkness so they don't get in the way of the fun adventures.
      I'd say the theme of trauma fits much better here than other modern shows, because that's what it set out to be from the start: a psychological dark comedy about cute cartoon characters who hate their lives and want to leave.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Slapstick always has the issue of forfeiting effective drama. Like when family guy did an episode about domestic abuse, why should I suddenly take it seriously after Peter and Lois routinely beat each other up for laughs? Why should I care for characters who are sociopathic buttholes that don't care about each other? The story has to pick a lane

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      To be fair, one upside of Hazbin having a juvenile "frick you dad Imma hang out with DEMONZ IN HELL!!!" premise is that the show doesn't have to derail itself to talk about the trauma of Christianity, because that trauma is part of the show's premise.

      ...but then again it also sets up doing therapy with bad people to redeem them as part of the premise, and then just never does that.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        That because Smiling Friends is an absurdist comedy about dealing with internal issues via explicit exterior action.
        Professor Psychotic doesn't have a deep look at himself, nor does the heart to heart with his brother work out. Its only when the homunculus is born that the two set aside their differences to be better parents than their mother was ironically using their trauma as a driving force for good.
        At least to the extent you can in the bounds of a episodic comedy.

        >adventure cartoons that didn't have therapy as part of their premise eventually become about therapy and everyone crying
        >the few cartoons that actually do have therapy as part of their premise (Hazbin, SF) barely ever feature any attempts at therapy
        Why does this happen?

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          For HH its because Viv is a style over substance person who fell in love with her high ranking demon OCs and the conflict against heaven and so abandoned the entire thesis of the show by the time it actually got made.
          In SF its because Zack and Micheal view the setup as an excuse to tell funny jokes.
          Also for the other shows its because the livejournal/tumblr generation got into animation leadership positions and just write what the like, which is fanfiction of the hypothetical show you expect their project to be.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Cause g EMITIONSL FANAGE, trauma spreading, shilling shrinks, and ultimately I do trusting and brainwashing the newly traumatized children

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            oh sweet a schizo post

  31. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    i think there should be more shows like beast wars

  32. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >It's almost always character A breaking down and crying over some personal issue, then getting validation and support from character B, and the fans of their show on social media talking about it like it's the peak of "character development" and "tackles very important issues".
    That’s because these shows writers and even creators are usually mentally ill women. They’re clearly just writing what they know in the worst possible way.

  33. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    This is how I feel about a lot of modern character development in general. Whether it be comics, shows, or even anime. A lot of people just do point A to point B making the character contrast heavily with their old self instead of just a subtle change or understanding of past behavior. And the catalyst is always something insanely drastic like death or gaining/losing power. A lot of stuff nowadays lacks nuance which makes the old stuff seem smarter when you'd think it would be the opposite considering how much we can learn from them now.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Nah new stuff has lots of problems but often it objectively has more nuance than old stuff.

  34. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    was OK KO fine?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Ehhhh
      Mid? Mid.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Only thing I know about that show is that Sonic and Tails showed up at some point.

      No shit: https://youtu.be/Ot6zd5dW1Nk?feature=shared

  35. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It's legitimately a symptom of leftoid grooming. If you look at older gen As/younger zoomzooms, they tend to have a pervasive sense of navel-gazing. This isn't their fault, it's how leftists have been literally grooming children in schools for the past two decades:

    https://www.thefp.com/p/how-bad-therapy-hijacked-american-schools

    Neurotic, self-obsessed women target children to become neurotic and self-obsessed to fill the black hole where their sense of self should be. Because THEY have no self-esteem and are constantly breaking down, they assume EVERYONE is. They project this issue onto children to create problems where there are none and then pat themselves on the back for "fixing" them.

  36. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Well the simple reality is a show like Steven Universe is just not an adventure show but it does becomes more like one towards the end
    What a show like SU really is is what I would just call a fantasy sitcom/drama

    People have this idea that just because something has fantastical elements it must be an "adventure"
    And part of the problem is that creators themselves obviously feel this pressure as well
    So a show like SU has to promise this at the start and deliver it by the end but in the middle it inevitably ends up being what it really wanted to be

  37. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It's a good point. Also these shows never like to portray the actual effects of trauma in any way other than the most sanitized and predictable ways possible, notably being sad a lot. You'll never see the "traumatized" characters becoming incredibly hostile and aggressive towards their friends (or anyone else) over non-existent slights, or behaving erratically or in any way that could be perceived as unlikable. Real trauma does horrible things to people, it doesn't just make them a weepy sad softie that needs protecting.
    Ironically, one pretty decent example of a character portrayal of trauma is one who isn't even (explicitly) confirmed to have any. Sucy Manbavaran from LWA is extremely prickly and abrasive at first to everyone around her, and appears borderline sociopathic, but as the series goes on she opens up a lot more and it's revealed she really does care about her friends; in Episode 8 her most treasured memory is revealed to just be meeting Akko...and in the same episode, she seems to have a genuine internal mental breakdown/psychotic episode from what's HEAVILY implied to be revisited childhood trauma. And given she's canonically an orphan from the Philippines, it can't have been anything pleasant or "safe".
    As another example, Asuka from Eva, who is genuinely unpleasant to everyone around her as a coping mechanism for being rejected by her mother after the contact experiment.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      The things you're saying aren't shown are literally in SU Future and mongoloids complained that it was a "bad" example of mental health representation. You can't win with these people.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        SU future was so fricking moronic with Steven's "trauma"
        At no point in the entire series did we get any indication that steven was somehow traumatized from his silly adventures with the gems in early seasons or the later more serious ones
        it literally showed up out of nowhere because the writers wanted a gay melodrama shitfest therapy session
        there was a reason so many people were upset with the awful and poorly written portrayal of mental illness, PTSD and trauma
        the icing on the cake was the "hug, cry and talk about your fee fees will cure your mental illness" scene

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          It's also worth pointing out that childhood trauma from severe injuries and danger comes from sustained, long-term pain and an inability to process or handle stressful situations during their formative years.

          Steven, as a teen, getting banged up, but instantly healing while purposefully going on adventures with the Gems who are protecting him, and also he's got superpowers to protect himself means he's not in danger and he's not going to be hurt for long and he knows it. All of his high stress situations are resolved quickly, too. He's not a kid who got put in the ICU repeatedly and is now in a constant state of anxiety about nearly dying whenever he leaves his room, but that's what they retconned him into.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            The hospital scene with connie's mom was so fricking moronic i swear
            >uh oh steven time to remember all that stored up ~trauma~ you had for years but never expressed or suffered from in anyway
            >cue mental breakdown

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              >You healed everything instantly and in a healthy way, you MUST be suffering

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              >hey Steven, you know how you heal from every injury and have never had a broken bone?
              >well there's signs of ~trauma~ all over your body, even though that should be impossible because you're not even human
              >cue anxiety attack

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              >You healed everything instantly and in a healthy way, you MUST be suffering

              This is literally Ruby's depression arc in the last season of RWBY.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          I mean we did see him react to things that have happened to him throughout the show, specially learning what his mom did which taunted him, we just didn't get to see much of the effect those things had on him because 1. he was a naive kid who thought this was normal 2. he was busy fixing problems that weren't his which kept him entertained from the truth and it wasn't until he didn't have anything else to fix he broke down. Even in SUF he directly says he was so busy fixing everyone's life he didn't realize how fricked up his was.
          Also the 'hug cry and talk about your feelings will cure your mental illness' isn't what they tried to do. It was sort of like the first step from recovering, having people who care and are willing to help you out. But he did went to therapy etc. They should've shown more of the aftermath though.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      You make good points. Modern leftist writing has this habit of making everyone overly friendly and understanding with each other. Like in Borderlands, it's a planet full of crazy psychopaths but apparently they respect pronouns and care about political correctness.

      I remember in the show Recess there was a random character who just didn't like the main character for no reason. I think by the end they still weren't friends and it was basically a lesson that sometimes you just can't be friends with everybody. If it was Steven Universe they would have been able to talk it out and everything would have worked out in the end.

      I actually can't think of a single Steven Universe "villain" that was actually still "bad" all the way through to the end of the show. All the villains: Jasper, Peridot, Lapis, Spinel, the Diamonds, they all end up getting redeemed. There are no true villains in the show.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        i agree but jasper did not get redeemed tbh, she didn't change at all

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          >In "The Future", it seems as though Jasper has taken Steven's advice as she is seen in Little Homeworld instead of wallowing in her cave. She crashes through a wall demanding Steven to take her along with him for protection, however, Steven tells her that he can manage on his own to which she agrees and bids her "Diamond" farewell.
          My memory might be a bit foggy but from what I remember Jasper was literally bowing down to Steven by the end. Maybe that's not really "redemption" but she had essentially been completely neutralized as a villain.

          Steven shattering Jasper was considered a big "oh shit" moment because Steven Universe doesn't just physically defeat any of his villains. They always talk shit out somehow.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      But ehen there are abrasive characters like Vriska and they get forgiven because of their trauma people hate that too.

      And again, fricking SU itself did this with the Diamonds.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        >there are abrasive characters like Vriska
        Don't downplay her as abrasive, she murdered and crippled friends and tried to do the same to almost every other main character. No, it being part of her culture doesn't count since not even half of the trolls tried the same shit.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      I was about to call bull on Sucy being an orphan, but i looked it up and found out theres different canons in LWA. Pic rel is Sucy's mom in the Teri Terio manga

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        That should've happened some 30 years ago.
        Can you even imagine going to court and totaling it all up? Everything since the renaissance?

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Frozen, Star Wars, Harry Potter..
          I'll give you SU. Sugar can have everything. I got what I wanted.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Because then it gets "EDGYYY" and that's baaaad.
      Making fun of edgy stuff I feel was warranted at one point, but I feel like it was part of a bad trend where now literally anything with any degree of harshness or dire tonality is considered to be "edgy"

      I feel as though the term "edgy" has gone from meaning
      >"Empty shock value."
      To
      >"I'm offended by literally anything harsh. Don't wrongthink and go against my puritanical, sheltered ideals."
      The term is 100% a thought terminating cliche and an American corpo buzzword, because the only time you ever see it get used is in reference to harmless pop media and not towards anything genuinely pushing boundaries.
      Moreover, there's people whose entire personality is being embarrassed of being into self-serious, somewhat edgy/dramatic shit when they were teens and their inability to suspend disbelief is them capitulating to ghosts.

  38. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    It's because they are, for both the viewers and the staff

  39. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Adventure isn't real.
    You work at getting a good job, build a stable life that can support a family, make babies so they can can do the same and keep life going. Wanting anything else is deviant and gay.

  40. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >Steven Universe
    >Modern
    Actual modern cartoons like Kiff or Hamster & Gretel barely have any conflict, literally most of episode plots subvert any kind of genuine conflict or drama so that everyone is nice (and if they're seemingly not, then they're actually nice deep down) and wholesome.

  41. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >modern "adventure" cartoon
    >Steven Universe
    Are you fricking dumb?

  42. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    The main historical weakness of American animation has always been its inability to make story driven shows and I mean ACTUAL story driven shows where events actually happen instead of “lore” shows. Many of these shows are made by anime fans who crave the storytelling they have, but can’t tell stories to save their life. It also doesn’t help that they’re mainly working for kid’s channels/streaming platforms ran by megacorps that mainly want to continue making shitty, unfunny comedies. They only story based animated series that’s good all the way is Avatar, which is nearing 20 years old at this point.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      >They only story based animated series that’s good all the way is Avatar

      Avatar barely has a story though. The plot is basically just a giant training arc where Aang's training is never taken seriously in the first place and we know that the characters can fly half-way around the planet in a day or two from the start, so everything that happens is either basically episodic drama (sometimes with a scenario where the characters are trapped somewhere for multiple episodes) or characters joining the cause or powering up. By design it could have been wrapped up at any point or extended out indefinitely.

  43. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >asks about modern cartoons
    >posts a cartoon that's ten years old

  44. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    My ex got me into the show. I ended up making a drinking game where you take a shot every time somebody cries and you'd be amazed at how consistently it made you drunk.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      DUDE HOW ARE YOU NOT DEAD?

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      DUDE HOW ARE YOU NOT DEAD?

      Seriously, how the frick are you not dead? I remember out of curiosity like a year ago I decided to take a look if there was any recount and just season 1 was almost 100 times, I never cared to look more over that but I can imagine that grew exponentially

  45. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Kind of related but while watching She-Ra is like they take anything that could be grand and interesting and reduce it to every day angst, Like Catra whole ordeal being reducted to mommy issues or how one of the characters sees her entire kingdom being seize by Hordak and the reaction feels more like a bad breakup eating icecream on the bed instead of complete grief and defeat or even anger at the friends who was suppose to be commanding all this armies.

  46. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >personal growth over internal conflicts that reflect issues people face in real life is good writing.
    It's an ATTEMPT at good writing.

    >It's almost always character A breaking down and crying over some personal issue, then getting validation and support from character B
    This is what happens when someone tries to "write what they know" but what they actually know is the overwrought theatrics of someone who flirts with mental illness and depression as an affectation.. and that's what it comes off as in their shows. Depression just needs one good pep talk to clear up. PTSD is when you have a bad time and then remember having a bad time. Etc. It's a flimsy understanding of what those things are actually are.

    >And fandoms seem to eat it up and endorse it, having almost a fetishistic fixation on characters "breaking down" and "working through their trauma".
    It's because the fandoms are largely made up of the same kind of people who understand mental trauma and mental illness as an affectation. An act you put on to get attention and appear more complex and deep. So when they see someone else putting their exact sort of behavior into a show, they celebrate it because it validates their fake mental illness LARP as an authentic behavior.

  47. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Well how would’ve you done it then?

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Not the anon but I would've just aired The Looney Tunes 24/7, seems like something Cinemaphile would like.

  48. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    obvious answer: they are made by gays, and getting traumas from being called a gay or being misgendered is the only issue they had in their life, so that's the only thing they can relate to and know how to write.

  49. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    You know why. You're not allowed to talk about why either, but oh well.

    Least there's dvds and pirate streams of the old shows. 90s kid here but I liked johnny quest.

  50. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    It’s because modern “adventure” shows are character driven rather than location driven. If you’re “adventure” show’s cast isn’t constantly encountering new exotic sights, people and problems to explored it isn’t an adventure show.

  51. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Surprisingly reflective and insightful thread for Cinemaphile, considering the thumbnail and subject. I believe that these shows take this checklist approach to character development for multiple key reasons.
    >Strict age rating guidelines from the network
    >Short episode runtimes making it difficult to build upon certain themes
    >Writers writing what they know or want, such as Hurt/Comfort fanfic, scenarios where all their problems have an easy fix and a happy ending, moments of triumph where revenge is exacted on those who have traumatized them, etc.
    >Appealing to certain audience sensibilities in order to make the story more "relatable" or the like
    >An attempt at creating depth by subverting classic tropes through the lens of real and serious life, but not being able to commit to deconstruction or playing it straight
    Theres probably others im missing, I'm sure

  52. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    I agree with everything you said, but at the same time my favorite Berserk Moment is when Guts has a panic attack and Casca is there to comfort him.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Guts earned his right to be emotionally unstable in a believable and serious way.

  53. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    counterpoint: i'm a sucker for hurt/comfort

  54. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >even more SU bait
    What are you mad at me for? I'm not on payroll.

  55. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    I don’t necessarily think it’s just because it’s a kids show or has limited run time. The biggest problem I have with SU is that pretty much all stakes with actual negative and serious consequences are resolved often just by convenient coincidence, contrivances, or a superpower that fixes it. All that remains is bad feelings which seems laughable because the average person does not have the luxury of resurrecting tears, speech powers, being the son of god emperors, and being surrounded by immortal and nearly invincible beings. It makes a lot of the emotional drama feel cheap because it’s like watching a ton of privileged people who will have reality solve their issues for them (oh they’re not actually that bad guys!) even if they don’t put nearly the same amount of effort or sacrifice other characters in other series in similar situations are forced to. When people defend this by saying ‘oh but it’s realistic things are only solved by nepotism in real life’ or ‘oh how else would you resolve this but *new superpower*’ or ‘there’s convenience in all stories!’ I don’t think they realize how unsatisfying and lame they sound. It feels very permissive of just steamrolling through compelling story telling that even other cartoons had a good understanding of.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      They really don't value much in other works, if the plot and characters there can be substituted by pure emotional theatrics.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Power can be heartbreaking. Families that have power can get really, really ugly in a way that would shock people. I wanted to go there but Sugar got scared.

      You ever notice how the background worlds aren't as otherworldly and ethereal around 2016?

  56. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    It's a reversal of priorities. When people used to watch Adventure shows they'd put themselves into the shoes and wish to be like the heroes they wash. Now it's the exact opposite. Hacks with no imagination down play the heroic and in order to make the adventure about themselves. They stopped making heroes we wished we were and made heroes we already are. And we suck.

  57. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    This is why i b lined the west its fricking degenerate

  58. 1 week ago
    V

    Trash incompetence degenerate artist animators who are hack writers. Simple as

  59. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Someone throw those pictures of the gems being ok with Black folk being slaves and other shit that they were a part of and never did a thing about.

  60. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >because it's far from the only show that did this.
    I hated the marcygays (specially the entitled spics) who were trying to desperately identify with Marcy's episode where we see the past of the girls and she ends up watching the end of the movie alone, as if that somehow validated her to just take her friends away to almost certain death in a different world which they only survived because the story was meant to let them survive through powers, friends and whatnot.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      I bet you are much more willung to make excuses for Sasha.

  61. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >Even for anime
    Yeah, lately most seem to revolve around giving some character a little bit of trauma, the funniest one I can think right now is the whole "I need to coooom!" from cucksawman, man that was ridiculous.

  62. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >I used to think I like angst
    Dude, go read any of the FGO stuff, as far as I've seen anyone willing to find some good angst in character just needs to read it, avoid the coom pics and doujins and you will be settled.

  63. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Actually, Steven Universe is a prolonged therapy session for people dealing with a suicide of a loved one. (Rose/pink)

    >Pink didn’t think anyone cared about her much less if she were dead (fricking wrong)
    >She continued to have a pretty low opinion of herself as Rose and only was able to love “herself” by loving Steven.
    >Everyone is dealing with the unfinished business of Rose or trying to honor her memory in some way
    >Never get some magical closure of a chance to speak with the dead, leaving them all with questions that’ll never be answered
    >As the loved ones gather and connect from different facets of Rose’s life they learn unsettling truths about her and have to figure out how to deal with this altered picture of her.
    >Steven, having not personally known Rose is left to try to help mediate and get everyone through but this creates a terrible strain on himself and he fails to care for his own mental health.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Ok but why did they have to abandon the cool space opera the fans wanted to teal with that trauma is boring safe ways.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        I dunno. If I were to guess it’d be because Sugar isn’t a great writer* and because if anyone’s ever dealt with a family member committing suicide it kind of becomes this all-consuming drama. When you think about it, Steven Universe even interrupted gay romance for more suicide drama (Ruby and Sapphire’s wedding getting crashed by the Diamonds)

        *I remember reading somewhere Sugar actually came to agree with the assessment Rose was a terrible person. But the greater and greater mistakes she kept making were further and further in the past and others were a side effect of not having the foresight to foresee how deeply she would actually impact people who cared about her. So, idiot and kind of selfish at times? Sure. A terrible person? Sugar you fricked up understanding a character you wrote.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Sugar was never a strong willed showrunner and let her staff walk all over her.
          The entire Zuke situation is a perfect example while also being one of the few time Sugar put her foot down over something.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            Nah, Sugar's a slave driver. I would know. The process just doesn't work like you think it does.

            Season 1 is when Sugar and I are in our honeymoon phase. By Future we're trying to stab and humiliate one another as much as possible. I'm amazed Future had any good moments at all.

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              Sugar is humiliating me through Steven and I'm destroying the pacing and logic of the show in return. SU's the first show I subverted on purpose.

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              Sugar is humiliating me through Steven and I'm destroying the pacing and logic of the show in return. SU's the first show I subverted on purpose.

              Your forgot your name

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Anon

  64. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    steven's "trauma" is NOTHING compared to what Florya went trough so frick you and frick steven universe.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Man not op, but I think the whole rant is to point out that the shit that steven universe and other cartoons that were out at the same time or after that suck because their angst is just boring, and sorry that statement feels like it could include this movie you bring, I remember it felt like they had animal suffering/abuse pushed in, way too much, just for shock value.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        the closest thing i can imagine rn is what Mark Grayson has to endure which is more relevant.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      >comparing a children's cartoon to a gritty slav war movie
      >African children mentality
      Autism.

  65. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    SU ended up being a story about a decaying empire run by a gerontocracy. Hits a little too close to home. So Sugar makes me do ANOTHER story about Spinel.

  66. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Future was meant to be more shonen-like. Steven is approaching manhood. And Sugar subverted the shit out of it.

    It would have been very interesting to have a super powered kid approach manhood in an ultra-feminist, liberal household.

  67. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >What about the adventures, the fantasy, the imagination, right?
    Just wait until we get our Lars of the Stars spinoff

  68. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    >It's never about something like the trauma of being lonely and having no one to rely on but yourself, there is ALWAYS someone who's gonna give the traumatized character a pat on the back.
    Feel like this was a bit more revealing than OP intended

  69. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    I think you need to consider for Cartoon Network it still was a kids shows so any real trauma was left to the fans, it's sanitized but because probably Cartoon Network would've said no, on top of that, Rebecca is not the best showrunner out there... yep.

    My friend has genuine childhood trauma and she barely sees herself represented well in US media, the closest in animated form is stuff like Tangled but that's a movie.

    This can't be fixed, your show can't go places if you know kids will watch it and lately companies are obsessed with selling shows to children only.

    However, it has to be said that not even stuff like Daria gets to be that profound so maybe creators were and still are not ready to show real trauma, which would ironically trigger some people and make them look away.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      I refuse to believe any child willingly watched SU

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        I don't know how true this is everywhere else but in my elementary school the show was pretty popular since there were kids who would talk about it and even share their theories with others.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          I can only imagine how gay the kids who were watching fricking SU in elementary school are.
          Fricking zoomers.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            People in my country, including kids, don't really care about gay shit on media but find gay people revolting in real life.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          I refuse to believe any child willingly watched SU

          Sadly I can say I saw it as well, the guy exposed about it, he was like 16

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        That's the thing, what Cartoon Networks thinks children are is actually austimos and manchildren.

        I'm not autistic, I just don't care what people call me. But these shows usually catch the attention of other people, let's start that Steven Universe was aired on TV when TV was already dying.

        I did see children watching it, I do have proof. I also have proof of young queer people watching it and connecting to it. So that's that.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          It is my great ambition to make one of these adventure shows that doesn't devolve into relationship drama and gender-based naval gazing so that I might deliberately alienate queer viewers.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            https://hard-drive.net/hd/entertainment/childrens-cartoon-not-reaching-intended-audience-of-queer-twenty-somethings/

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        It was a show watched by 12-22 year olds in its first season.
        I would know I was 14 when the show started aired and talked about it with my friends.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        There is a world outside your bubble. Back when Youtube didn't remove comments under children's videos you could still occasionally find clear underage comments under SU clips on Youtube. Probably still can on pirating websites.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        So you weren't around for 2013 at all? Before CN bashed SU's momentum in like a metal pipe to the knees, it was EVERYWHERE wherever you asked and interest in the show peaked at Stronger Than You even though undersmell took the credit later on which to this day is still the best song to come out of SU, argue with ya mum. It's during the lull of season 3 and 4 that it dropped off from the trending sphere because of those wretched Stevenbombs.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          Steven Universe also still occupies so much cultural clout with Gen-Z who grew up on the show too, especially with online nerds and cosplayers. It's like Regular Show to them, only a little gayer.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            >It's like Adventure time to them, only a little gayer.
            Fify, Regular show doesn't have much clout like both of those shows. But Gumball is the most popular out of all of them

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      What grown ass goddamn woman wants to see her personal trauma represented in childrens entertainment that's supposed to help take your mind off of it or grow in spite of it?

      I don't believe that shit.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        Go to the animation community on other social media, they're always praising when kids shows do that by saying "it is important for *kids* bla bla bla" but is obvious they're talking about themselves.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          She's a sick fricking creep who wants to tramadump on an audience who is free of it and should be protected from it?

          These sick fricks are the ones directing animation direction in this country.
          Fricked up.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        >supposed to help take your mind off of it
        Flawed escapist mindset. Implying art isn't supposed to propagate good values and lead the people to the bright future.

        • 1 week ago
          Anonymous

          It's not, it's just meant to be an expression of thought and emotion. Applying an intent to control and direct others is corruption and degradation.

          • 1 week ago
            Anonymous

            >it's just meant to be an expression of thought and emotion
            ...and this can't include the creator's trauma?

            • 1 week ago
              Anonymous

              You confuse things

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                >art is to express things, dictating things to others is morally wrong
                >however, I also dictate that you only express certain things in art
                You talk like a sneaky politician.

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                Sure bud

              • 1 week ago
                Anonymous

                NTA but he has a point there

  70. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    How would’ve you guys handle trauma in a show? Do you make the MC be traumatized over something and they just can’t stop thinking about it? Or just make the MC not be traumatized by it and thinking they could’ve done it better?

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Show real pain, the thing with Pink Pearl having an actual scar was a good direction. Have Steven be actually hurt or have him dealing with people he can't save. Teach people how to properly do cut-offs. Make his untreated trauma be more serious, let him kill someone and let it stay dead, if you don't have actual consequences you get detached.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Have actual traumatizing things happen to them.
      Someone who's not a sheltered upper middle class suburbanite isn't going to sympathize with a character acting traumatized because someone was mean to them or someone microaggressed them or some shit.

      • 1 week ago
        Anonymous

        When's the last time we got an actual poor kid? Oh to not fully romanticize it.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Have more situation where the only way out is through, and after its done you just need to keep living your life and let it fade with time.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Preferably, I would have made it reflect in the character's actions during a specific arc the events of which narratively tie into the trauma rather than stop the plot to have a cry.
      And even more preferably, this wouldn't be random trauma thrown in for the sake of it out of nowhere for the sake of having le ebin trauma arc XD, but something that logically follows from the character's initial traits and is foreshadowed beforehand.

    • 1 week ago
      Anonymous

      Conan model: Heroes aren't homosexuals and regardless of what they go through they're more likely to be pissed off at the traitorous bullshit of their enemies than have a saddy ;_; moment.
      If they face some lovecraftian horror bullshit though they can temporarily be struck to terror by it at least, a good, strong, deep range of emotions; but none of them are being a fricking homosexual about things.

      And yes that does include Krull almost contemplating himself to death in a mirror, he managed to do it without coming across as a Californiod.

  71. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    Because the writers use the show as therapy sessiosn for them.

    This is actually very common for a bunch of early millennials. Typically its the ones that are in very left wing cities that they moved to after leaving their "shithole" middle america towns. Its a way for them to get to advertise how much of a victim they are and their problems to other people and i have no idea why they do it. If im watching your show/podcast/video or whatever i don't want to hear this shit.

  72. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    I don’t have anything against it per se. I thing it’s good to show characters’ more vulnerable side because it helps to empathize with them. What I hate is the way SU and similars do it. You basically have to make the characters break down in tears in every episode as if they were little children. They also never really get over anything. They just b***h and moan for validation and trauma porn. It’s a terrible example for kids bc it basically tells them it’s good to be a hyper emotional adult unable to face and overcome internal struggles.

  73. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    stooben wheres my coffee?

  74. 1 week ago
    Anonymous

    They are made by non-straight people for children, allegedly. That's all there is to it no needs for all those words.

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