I'm ready for the pendulum to swing back. It's really funny to see people freak out about random positive portrayals of Christianity that doesn't come from actual church groups.
>It's really funny to see people freak out about random positive portrayals of Christianity that doesn't come from actual church groups
When did this happen?
This. I have become so fricking bored of the pseudo-counter-culture narrative. Im ready to go back to the screeching church harpies and "think of the children" and satanic panic from my preteen years. Its all the fricking same anyway.
Not just religion-related media, but Subversion of tropes became a massive thing once the internet hit, because of the general increase of mass media/culture sharing. Then the people who experienced all that early information boom became old enough to have professions in media and control over those stories and started promoting more of that subversion, because it was different and that made profit and drew greater interest. Sometimes folks don't actually fully comprehend how world-wide communication in the general populace is slowly homogenizing even the subversive media. Hence people getting "tired" of the sarcasm/"references" used in pop culture, and are now drawn more often to at least the appearance of genuine emotion.
Why is it that people are far more critical of subversion than playing things straight? What's 15 years of "lol what if God was evil" compared to hundreds of years of culture and media where He's depicted as good?
Incidentally it's the same as the evil Superman or twist villains stuff, for every piece of media that uses it, there's another 10 where the superheroes are actually good and noble and the ugly fricker in black is the bad guy, yet complaints of overuse are given to the former
Because the net effect of "satan is actually good" has lead to mutants, freaks and trannies roaming the streets turning San Francisco and Portland into open air sewers. Morality is clearly not subjective and letting heroin junkies shit in the streets to own the religionists has clearly made society worse. Anyone who disagrees should be forced to live in the shit covered streets at gunpoint.
Other than Breath of Fire 2 and Final Fantasy 13 sequels I have a hard time thinking of JRPGs in which god is actually evil/you kill god. Most of the time it's just an especially powerful wizard or alien who uses angelic imagery.
Even SMT implies Y*wah is an incomplete part of the true god and all demons and gods are fragments of it. Dagdas true neutral ending Even sort if proves this.
>Most of the time it's just an especially powerful wizard or alien who uses angelic imagery.
You're implying "'God' is just an alien that made humanity" isn't a subversion.
Ffx, ff16, maybe ff9 depending on how you interpret necron.
Then there's blasphemous 1 and 2 again, depending on how you view "the miracle." Even though in 2 they mention it's kinda like the miracle wasn't strong enough to manifest as anything other than a plague of deformities and disease.
And then there's age of mythology, though that's basically a retread of Greek, Egyptian, Norse (and Chinese with the extended edition) mythology.
It started with FF7 and FF6, due to the heavy angelic motifs of the final bosses
Though in both cases, they are literally satan
Especially sephiroth, who parallels lucifer rather than God
Being a great hero who falls from grace before trying to usurp the position of god for himself only to be undone by divine intervention, when aeris asks the planet to help on her behalf
Its just one of those things where people see cloud beat up an angel and assume it means you are killing god
When you are actually stopping someone with delusions of godhood
You're kind of missing the interstellar war elements of the ancients. It has religious symbolism but it's somewhat sci Fi in nature when you realize Jenova is the one pulling all the strings.
Why are athiests so quick to call Christcucks insecure for defending their religion? I don't see you guys calling out the israelites and Muslimes despite having far thinner skin.
>Muslims maybe
Lol no. They stopped that shit after that French artist got killed
>Jews >Making fun of themselves
Dude criticizing the israelites straightfaced is one of the fastest ways to get blacklisted from the industry.
Most of the time it's christcucks freaking out over a fictitious evil god that has nothing to do with christianity.
Gods are entertaining mythical creatures, there's a reason why they were in so many stories in ancient times. But now christians decided they have a monopoly on gods and every instance of a god in fiction is a criticism or opposition to their religion.
I love the dichotomy between you lot. It's "punching up based on the author's familiar culture" one moment and then not at all coded the next.
>I love the dichotomy between you lot. It's "punching up based on the author's familiar culture" one moment and then not at all coded the next.
Those can both be true depending on the situation.
>Dude criticizing the israelites straightfaced
Yeah, saying "israelite people are evil" will do that.
Or, you know...
saying "Black people are rapists"
Or "Asians are fricking ugly"
or "gay people are peadophiles"
Any gross generalisation of minorities who have objectively been victim of violences for being minorities will get you cancelled.
Problem is that their is stastical data that shows Blacks are violent, that israelites have huge influence in politics and finance, and thar Gays are per capita more likely to be pedophiles. Not sure where you're getting the idea Asians are ugly though, did you mean suicidal?
>Yeah, saying "israelite people are evil" will do that
It's funny how THAT'S the strawman you want to go with, instead of doing something like criticizing the faults of their religion that often get criticized in Christianity despite being carry-over.
All that disingenuous shit does though is disprove your point entirely; criticizing the israeli religion is so ingrained as taboo in our culture that you instinctively associate the possibility of it with persecution of their people.
Most of the time it's christcucks freaking out over a fictitious evil god that has nothing to do with christianity.
Gods are entertaining mythical creatures, there's a reason why they were in so many stories in ancient times. But now christians decided they have a monopoly on gods and every instance of a god in fiction is a criticism or opposition to their religion.
I'm not a Christcuck I just find it really uncreative >What if good thing bad and bad thing good???
replace god with superman and you'll understand
Why are athiests so quick to call Christcucks insecure for defending their religion? I don't see you guys calling out the israelites and Muslimes despite having far thinner skin.
Most people here are Americans, and Christianity is what they are exposed to more often.
>familiarity breeds contempt
i didn't grow to hate islam until i had to take classes with muslim immigrants who would go on unhinged rants about killing whitey and putting homosexuals in death camps.
Okay post your translation of the ancient greek that's so great then. >no, you see, my job is not to be an authority and offer solutions but merely to criticize
Then you have no arguments and are a homosexual.
>Your only options are to accept the work of King James and a bunch of guys going off a middling Greek translation as 100% correct or to retranslate the book.
Weird forced dichotomy.
That can be said by literally every group, though. Leftists get offended if someone makes fun of their belief, Rightoids get offended, Different religions... You say as if this is something exclusive to the christians, just because you are not christian, yourself.
It's offensive to be talking shit on religions other than the one white people follow. No one will make a cartoon doing that. You know this already anon.
Yep. I remember the last time I ever went into a church parking lot when I was little, the head priest immediately ran outside of the building, a machine in one hand to detect any underage buttholes in one hand, and a cross-shaped dildo in another. That really for real happened, and isn't a story I'm bullshitting based off of shit I read on Reddit.
>>lore treats Satan as God's equal or opposite
Satan being depicted as on par with God is vanishingly rare
Even South Park's God calls Satan a b***h to his face and Satan will just take it.
For people that crave a true duality and have a loose understanding of christianity, what they'd assume to be the equal but opposite force to god is not actually equal or opposite, it's objectively inferior and mirrored. It doesn't put darkness/evil as a primary part of the system but a derivation of it, so people that want that kind of system will just amp satan/lucifer up to be on par with god.
Still, this mostly applies to fanfiction. Most cartoons, books, series and movies that use a christian setting do understand that the devil is inferior to (and at the mercy of) god. If fricking reaper 2007 got it right everything else would.
Sorry that sounds hard what if I rip off the extremely culturally significant imagery of a group of people I hate just to call all of it, and by extension them, bad instead? Cool?
I'm glad people are starting to realize the neo-hipster tradcath matrix as realized by peter thiel and the fact that a lot if stims from the arthoe podcast called redscarepod.
>Everything comes from God >Evil exists >therefore God created a universe with evil >if God could have made the universe without evil but actively chose not to, God is therefore evil in and of itself >if God COULDN'T make the universe without evil, he's either not the actual Almighty in charge or is not actually God as we understand the concept to be
There's really no way of looking at it without getting caught up in a mind frick
>if God could have made the universe without evil but actively chose not to, God is therefore evil in and of itself
If he made us in his image and gave us free will, I don't know if anyone was ever trying to argue that he wasn't "evil" by human standards. It feels weird and inaccurate to judge something that huge and cosmic by our standards to me though.
You are defining things incorrectly.
God is Good, evil is to choose to go against God's will, absolute evil is complete separation from God, it's literally like light and darkness. That's why all sin is the same level of evil in the sight of God and why only sentient creatures can be evil and animals lack the ability.
Why God chose specifically to give us such an ability is not fully known, but it must be good because God chose to do it.
Man's sense of justice is skewed by both his fallen nature and position of power.
It's a bit unhinged to claim something is good because god did it.
God himself said he created both good and evil, light and dark, so clearly god can do evil things that he also defines as evil since all evil came from him.
I don't get where this idea god is perfect and never makes mistakes comes from.
God himself admitted to feeling regret about his own actions and being susceptible to petty emotion.
>God himself admitted to feeling regret about his own actions and being susceptible to petty emotion. >That time God made a bet with Satan that Job would be faithful no matter what horrible shit happens to him
Those extra kids better have been worth it.
Sure, but christianity *does* claim that god is all knowing and all powerful and all good. So once you catch God in the lie on one of those three, you have no reason to believe him on the other two. If God is not actually all powerful, but tried to convince us he was, why should we believe him when he says he is all good, as opposed to that being another deception?
>>if God could have made the universe without evil but actively chose not to, God is therefore evil in and of itself
Begging atheists to read a philosophy book for once in their lives
Nta, but that's not what "appeal to authority" is. At all. Anon's asking you to do your own research, which, while that's a shit counterargument, it should be expected that if you're going to enter an argument and ask people to cOnsIdEr tHe fOlLoWiNg that you at least have a cursory knowledge of the discussion.
Also... >Redditspacer incorrectly cites fallacy
>I love the dichotomy between you lot. It's "punching up based on the author's familiar culture" one moment and then not at all coded the next.
Those can both be true depending on the situation.
They really can't. If you are basing a story element on some ideological factor, you cannot claim divorce from that ideological factor. It's one thing to recognize influence of a work from familiarity, but it's another to explicitly satirize it.
>It's one thing to recognize influence of a work from familiarity, but it's another to explicitly satirize it.
That's what I meant, I guess?
Someone can absolutely write a story where the god is a stand-in for the christian god, but someone else can write a different story where their god serves a different purpose.
In the former case christians are always going to create a link to their god because that's what their life revolves around, even when the writer didn't intend there to be one.
8 months ago
Anonymous
*latter, not former.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>but someone else can write a different story where their god serves a different purpose.
The problem is that some people want to have their cake and eat it too by not putting in any worldbuilding effort into crafting their deity, so they just use the Christian god, or rather a god/religion that explicitly shares some similarities, as a default... and then proceed to criticize religion. At that point it's effectively the same thing.
Eh, its not *directly* appeal to authority but its only really one step removed. "Someone wrote a book 800 years ago that says you're wrong, and he was a philosopher so that means he's right" isn't much different from the direct 'I'm an expert so that means I win the argument'. The implicit assumption in anons request was that whoever wrote the philosophy book must, by default, have been correct in their opinion simply because they wrote a book about it.
>but its only really one step removed
No it isn't.
>Someone wrote a book 800 years ago that says you're wrong
Anon did not say that. Anon said read a book. The implication is that you should at least do some very basic research before saying anything that crude as fact when people have debated that shit long before the internet. It's not "I'm an expert," it's "please at least have a familiar subject with something you want to debate." The "implicit implication" (disgusting phrase) that all of this stopped being talked about in the 13th century is amateur.
Eh, its not *directly* appeal to authority but its only really one step removed. "Someone wrote a book 800 years ago that says you're wrong, and he was a philosopher so that means he's right" isn't much different from the direct 'I'm an expert so that means I win the argument'. The implicit assumption in anons request was that whoever wrote the philosophy book must, by default, have been correct in their opinion simply because they wrote a book about it.
>god makes good and evil >god makes man with free will >man starts making anime, furry shit,scat,feetshit,anal and traps >Man blames god for something they did >Everyone blames god for shit that happens >gods face when Mankind does stupid shit
At this point, when i see posts like this, i always wonder if god really is good/evil or if he doesn't care. To the cosmic Spaghettis monster in space we would be the SJW's b***hing about something yet forgetting that free will is a thing and its not his prob to fix your shit
Who does these days? Let me put it this way. If you think you are right, would you ever apologise for your actions?
>who does these days?
Appeal to mass. You can't just assume because you believe everyone's doing it that you should too. It's a lame excuse to be immoral.
Does god?
Yes, and you should make the choice to take responsibility before your action is taken into his hands.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I think you might be taking an ancient fairy tale a bit too serious bro
8 months ago
Anonymous
The irony is that you take life too seriously in your pursuit for what you "know" is justice.
8 months ago
Anonymous
My point is that you believe yourself to be righteous, why would you want to take responsibilty for your actions? After all, if you're right and they're wrong, why should you pick up the pieces of the supposed mess you've made?
8 months ago
Anonymous
The fact you can't comprehend why someone should care for others even if the opposing party is in the wrong shows how vindictive you are. This is why poorhouses spread Christianity through Rome while the pantheon believers just told everyone to suffer.
8 months ago
Anonymous
No my point is that if one believes that they are the rightous one, what does it matter that people think you're the villain for making things worse? What would THEY know? If you're in the right, you wouldn't think you've done anything wrong, and that you're just giving the evil ones their "just desserts". Look at Twitter's incel vs femcel fights.
That's called ethical universalism. It's not a very popular stance.
What people mean by good and evil depends entirely on their philosophical stance.
A moral realist believes that there is an objective property of goodness or badness to actions and objects the same way being round is a property of circles.
A moral universalist believes there's no objective property of being good or evil, but that some rational code of ethics can be agreed upon
A moral subjectivist believes that morals are personal and subjective judgements
There's also stuff like non-cognitivism where moral judgements are recontextualized as expressions rather than claims ("killing is evil" means the same as "down with killing")
Yes, theodicy cannot be reconciled with reality. Not a new thought but not one that's wrong either.
How do you know evil exist? Or even good ?
The problem of Evil in theodicy is an argument form where you assume premises you are trying to disprove and show how they lead to false or impossible conclusions. If God is all-good all-knowing and all-powerful evil shouldn't exist. It existing means one of those premises is wrong.
Good and Evil have to be assumed to exist for the premise that God is all-good to be used in the argument - it doesn't mean the person making the argument believes in objective proscriptive morals
>The problem of Evil in theodicy is an argument form where you assume premises you are trying to disprove and show how they lead to false or impossible conclusions. If God is all-good all-knowing and all-powerful evil shouldn't exist. It existing means one of those premises is wrong. > >Good and Evil have to be assumed to exist for the premise that God is all-good to be used in the argument - it doesn't mean the person making the argument believes in objective proscriptive morals
The point of the whole argument is to put christians in ther place because they are mental infants who actually do think like that.
>if God COULDN'T make the universe without evil, he's either not the actual Almighty in charge or is not actually God as we understand the concept to be
Why is that assumed?
Man, I'm an atheist and even I know half the point of God isn't that he made a universe with evil, he made a universe with the POSSIBILITY of evil, the possibility of suffering and pain, the possibility that everything's gonna suck sometimes.
One of the cornerstones of Christianity (and kinda the other Abrahamic religions) that makes it different to the other beliefs of history is the idea is that he doesn't disallow people from doing bad things or disallow them from making mistakes.
Sorry if this post's janky as shit, I'm doing something else IRL and I'm multitasking.
What about suffering that doesn't come about from mistakes? Like someone could have the healthiest lifestyle ever and still get cancer and suffer and die. You can be perfect and still suffer
Supposedly even the environmental suffering is the result of the world's fall caused by man's sin. The garden had no thorns. Immediately after the fruit fiasco God let them know the sin brought thorns into the world. Thorn, cancer, parasites are all parts of the world's fall. >Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life. It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
Another interesting thing in the Bible is that God doesn't see humans as individual entities. "Sins of the father." Any human can be judged based on any tangentially related ancestor's actions because frick you. Kind of renders the whole concept of sin moot from any practical theological standpoint.
You are blood related to Hitler on some kind of loose massive family tree spanning millenia, so why shouldn't I blame you personally for the Holocaust?
It's always Satan and demons with magic who get played sympathetically (for tumblr sexyman "princess" fantasies), has anybody ever made a story following a sympathetic antichrist?
Chronicles of Wormwood. The guy swears a lot and he can be a jerk sometimes, but ultimately he's not keen on doing what the Antichrist is supposed to do.
Chronicles of Wormwood. The guy swears a lot and he can be a jerk sometimes, but ultimately he's not keen on doing what the Antichrist is supposed to do.
It does get tiring how modern media only seems to criticize religion as a vague or christianity, almost like they’re too terrified to make fun of antyhing else.
It started more so with mocking the dominant culture at the time. More of a punching up before it became a demonization and unsubtle loathing.
Not a Christian, I personally want the religion to die out but the bias of being against Christianity and not being against Judaism, Buddhism and Islam at the same time is kinda meh. Atleast if you're white, sandtribes and Orientals can practice their religions all they want. [s]In their respective afterlives[/s]
>Muh punching up
And yet nobody talks criticizes Islam, or in any of the Eastern religions, even in their home countries, nor does it criticize hedonism.
Makes you think....
I said thats how it started, its very obvious that now they're too afraid to step on anyone else's toes lest they prove themselves a heretic of the new god of equality
Ironic, isn't it? The new God is more revered and worshipped than the old one. You've met the same fate as the pagans.
>Muslims maybe
Lol no. They stopped that shit after that French artist got killed
>Jews >Making fun of themselves
Dude criticizing the israelites straightfaced is one of the fastest ways to get blacklisted from the industry.
[...]
I love the dichotomy between you lot. It's "punching up based on the author's familiar culture" one moment and then not at all coded the next.
The anon who described "muh punching up"
There are more people in the thread Black person, god you must be a newbie
>Muh punching up
And yet nobody talks criticizes Islam, or in any of the Eastern religions, even in their home countries, nor does it criticize hedonism.
Makes you think....
>And yet nobody talks criticizes Islam, or in any of the Eastern religions
This is falsehood. those kind of issues are frequently reported and criticised. It's the very reason you know about it in the first place.
>those kind of issues are frequently reported and criticised
Right, that's why anytime someone mentions homosexuality verses religion in media, it's always some Westboro Baltist Church stand-in and not any of the countries that literally throw homosexuals off of rooftops.
Yes but I don't see jokes about camel fricking, militant and ignorant arabians in the same way I see ignorant, bible and flag redneck conservatives. The simple truth is that its considered poor taste to make fun of Islam and not Christianity. The duality exists stop being willfully ignorant
Superman himself is a subversion of the even older evil superman trope.
Tons of old sci fi is filled with superpowered villians, Siegal and Shuster were specifically subverting that idea by making their character a heroic version.
I don't like comics or cartoons tackling religion because they almost always ignore the elephant in the room that is the dinosaurs and the several million year history of earth prior to the evolution of man.
Yeah dude, because evolutionary theism is a niche concept that nobody ever thought of before now.
Frick, why do homosexuals like this come in and act like they're hot shit for just now realizing some very basic shit that people have been arguing about for decades?
If it's such hot shit then, homosexual, why does no one ever bring it up in these threads? Huh?!
All I see is people b***hing about morals and theology, no one's out here asking why the Bible doesn't provide an answer for the million year old bones of a giant lizard we keep finding in the ground.
>why does no one ever bring it up in these threads? Huh?!
Why does nobody mention an idea that even the Catholic Church long ago accepted to dismiss an argument nobody is making?
Oh yeah I remember the part of the Bible where they list every single fauna in the Garden of Eden down to the individual species's of ladybug.
8 months ago
Anonymous
But they do mention several animals, no?
You'd think a single one of these fricking enormous creatures would be mentioned at all
8 months ago
Anonymous
>You'd think a single one of these fricking enormous creatures
Yeah, I can see how that would be a problem when you set a precedent of biblical interpretation that also argues against the presence of giraffes in God's creation through lack of mention.
8 months ago
Anonymous
When you have metaphor relating to the fierceness, size, and hardiness of animals, it does become a problem
Tell me, what's mightier?
A Tyrannosaurus Rex
Or
Lions, bears, wolves?
Because all three of them are mentioned
Why would they neglect to mention even one of the biggest creatures to walk the earth?
Seriously, look up "animals in the bible" and question how ONLY our modern assortment made their way in
8 months ago
Anonymous
That doesn't address the main point. How is the traditional retelling of the Christian creation myth, that God created the world and everything in it in only a few days, supposed to co-exist with the inherently contradictory nature of natural evolution, which takes place over millions of years?
8 months ago
Anonymous
>How is the traditional retelling of the Christian creation myth
If you're basing your argument off of "traditional" (read: secondary) retellings, then anything is fair game.
When you have metaphor relating to the fierceness, size, and hardiness of animals, it does become a problem
Tell me, what's mightier?
A Tyrannosaurus Rex
Or
Lions, bears, wolves?
Because all three of them are mentioned
Why would they neglect to mention even one of the biggest creatures to walk the earth?
Seriously, look up "animals in the bible" and question how ONLY our modern assortment made their way in
>Tell me, what's mightier? >A Tyrannosaurus Rex >Or >Lions, bears, wolves?
I'm just going to say it: T-Rexes are overhyped. They're not even the most dangerous dinosaurs of their time. And the Leviathan could definitely kick their asses.
But arguing such misses the point of said power contests. To describe a creature long dead by the time the israelites left Egypt is no different than talking of something like the dragon in the book of Revelations. A man overcoming a lion means more to his people than that type of beast. It's not that fiercer creatures don't exist in the Bible than lions and bears (just namedropped two), it's the animals used are something that give the followers of God a more familiar point of reference.
You could argue that this would be done anyway from a fictitious author trying to better sell a narrative, but that asks why other fantastical creatures would be included altogether.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>The israelites would choose to write about animals they know
You know what, that's a damn good point. I was actually going to mention that monsters could be construed as dinosaurs or as of yet undiscovered prehistoric animals, and in light of the distinct possibility of author favoritism I don't think dinosaurs alone are a very good argument
Because most theist believe in evolution. I mean shit you know a priest one of the major science on the big bang theory some idiot is gonna make a bazinga joke
Because you homosexuals don't fricking read or listen.
These fricking arguments have been going on for fricking decades now between people far better educated on the subjects than you. The church themselves have these debates so they can better proceed in ministering, let alone non church theologians and philosophers.
Fricking hell the >why is their evil in the universe
talk is literal millennia old. Nobody should have to fricking explain Symposium or Leviathan to some mental fricking toddler realizing that the blocks have different colors for the first time.
The most amusing part about a lot of atheist is that, they think they are really smart of stating the obvious and a lot of times they are just plain ignorant about what they are talking about. Seth Macfarlane is a primo example of that phenomenon.
To be fair, everytime Christianity and evolution gets brought up, it's almost always akin to that Ned Flanders vs Evolution episode. And those aren'r strawmen Christians. Evangelicals have monopolised the perception of Christianity, much like how The Taliban has with Islam.
AFAIK most believers of abrhamic faiths are not biblical literalists or creationists. Genesis is assumed to be either metaphorical or from some divine perspective where a "Day" as in "on the first day" etc, could represent hundreds of millions of years or more.
Evolution is incompatible with Christianity because it means humans are not a creation but instead just a mere byproduct of a non-teleological phenomenon.
Evolution is incompatible with *modern* christianity, which claims that the Bible and its contents are literally true. Thats actually a recent phenomenon, for much of history the Bible was understood to be figurative, a book whose fables impart moral lesson and philosophical truths rather than being some kind of accurate history of the world. You go back even a few hundred years and start claiming that everything in the Bible happened literally as described and even the pope would give you a funny look.
It's a shame because I love this idea it's just always done so poorly. You shouldn't be able to comprehend and angel let alone it's moral compass so accept that and run with it instead of undermining your own creative ability by just copy pasting ancient European religious beliefs.
At least copy from Khaballah if you want to be slightly more creative.
Still call myself a Christian, don't bother with church anymore. I'm always interested in stories involving "Christian mythology". Similar to being interested in greek/roman mythology stories.
It's simple really. Atheists these days are cowards. Other religions will either retaliate by force or by suing them to the poorhouse, but Christians are defanged and are unable to fight back.
You don't need to be a Christcuck to see how they label All Christians as evil, but are apologists to other religions. The Taliban is a good example.
you both are. the fricking pilpul from fedoras on this doesn’t fool anyone. both are constantly preaching and it’s annoying as frick. i can’t count the number of times one of you gays has thrown a meltdown over someone saying “prayers to you” or whatever. it’s pathetic
In my setting god is an alien entity that spreads the seed of life to harvest the energy of planets indirectly through whatever intelligent species emerges, and once it's done with them it just causes a rapture and starts anew somewhere else. It's not evil, it's the natural order of things, but life tries to cling on and turns on god and its angels to escape a fate they perceive as unfair.
In a scale of evangelion to every JRPG ever, how original is it?
>“God is the only comfort, He is also the supreme terror: the thing we most need and the thing we most want to hide from. He is our only possible ally, and we have made ourselves His enemies. Some people talk as if meeting the gaze of absolute goodness would be fun. They need to think again. They are still only playing with religion. Goodness is either the great safety or the great danger — according to the way you react to it. and we have reacted the wrong way.”
My setting is God, angels, heaven, hell, demons, satan, all of it is a neutral natural process of endless life and death perpetuating the unstable reality we live in. An ebb and flow of destruction by hell and rebirth by the heavens that if disturbed or broken would lead to the end of everything.
Or you could do what SMT did and say "God, Devils and literally everything in between including humanity bad"
The point in SMT's case is that the concept of good and bad come from whoever is the wielding power. Sure, there is YHWH who is, for a lack of a better term, the custodian of the universe created by the Great Will (Or something, I forget the exact naming right now) to see over the budding life but that's only in certain SMT games whereas in others it is implied he overtook the throne from another god(s). It's why the series has three primary routes of order (The status quo and the throne must be upheld, no matter who is in charge), chaos (Frick the system, we make our own choices) and neutral (Humanity will find their own way).
It's only "All these things are bad" from our outsider perspective but inside the universe morality is just determined who is the winner.
I was not saying it doesn't happen, just that it is not as recurring as in Cinemaphile, where you could even say it has reached the point of exhaustion.
>Helluva Boss
Do we honestly believe the people behind Helluva Boss got inspired by Cinemaphile media to came up with that? I have my doubts.
I had a setting like this in mind >Angels and Demons exist >God is real and good
BUT >Demons have infiltrated the major churches and its institutions >they turned everything upside down as a cruel joke >Hallow's Eve, a day for saints, became the holiday for demons, ghouls, and monsters. >Saturnalia and all those Pagan holidays became Christmas and Easter. >hell, throw in biblically accurate angels being thrown to the wayside as the beautiful white winged Pagan icons became the mainstream idea of angels
The boy fricking and corruption of the Church was just Satan pulling the biggest kekaiku on humanity
Honestly, I thought the complaint was that all the Gnostic Bullshit final bosses tend to have the exact same fricking plot of 'Super Entity hates souls/human spirit/individuality and then the heroes beat them after a friendship speech about humanity'.
And then people misunderstood and started lumping in guys like Sephiroth and Kefka who just crib the aethetic rather than the plot.
I think christians need to get more cultured and realise they already won this war. They dominated the west for a millennia, and consequently the majority of art made at the peak of western creativity and power is christian. You can complain that rick and morty or some anime has this evil church trope, but then shakespeare, bach, dante, handel, etc etc etc all made heavily pro christian artwork. You already won. The only reason this subversion stuff exists is because religion won the art war so hard that distancing yourself from it is the only way to stand out
Fiction is the purview of the elites, the existence of so many stories about 'the church being evil' is because the elites despise organized religion, objective morality and the idea that doing bad things means you suffer when you die, because if you have a lot of money why wouldn't you be on epstein island?
There isn't a elite anymore, other than capitalists and whoever they use for distraction of their shit. You are just a christcuck thinking that every world problem is because they dont believe in your fear of death/lack of puporse copium and you don't understand shit different outside the chamber of what you think.
Which is useful as a tool for the actual authoritarian "elite".
Ahhhhh, to be a teenager again. Its okay buddy, things get better when you actually grow up and grow past understanding the world in a
simple dichotomy.
Here’s a start to actually understanding the world though champ: there are indeed “elites”. Going with your teenager’s understanding of communism, commies called them the “intelligentsia”, or the “bourgeoisie” if theyre wishing to lump the middle class in with them. You being a dipshit with a smartphone would be classed as this as well.
Amazing how simplistic dumbing down the world into 3 groups makes it all seem.
Funny that you say about dumbing down things in groups and thinks im a communist.
8 months ago
Anonymous
You’re whining about le capitalism. Youre either a pussy that calls themselves a “socialist” or so braindead you parrot communist talking points without actually knowing what they entail. Regardless, youre obviously a disengenuous moron.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, because someone cant have individual opinions or talk about malpractice of a system without wanting what they call the reverse on your TV news. Both options turns to shit given time.
Amazing how simplistic dumbing down the world into 3 groups makes it all seem.
8 months ago
Anonymous
D’aww look he’s trying to be smart.
Having a pessimistic outlook on everything doesn’t make you intellectual kid.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>no argument, try making a insult
sad.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>n-no u
Got anything else you want to throw out chief? I await the brilliant analysis of the anon who whines about capitalism but says there are no elites. I am in awe of your independent thinking!
8 months ago
Anonymous
Read again. >Fiction is the purview of the elites, the existence of so many stories about 'the church being evil' is because the elites despise organized religion >There isn't (the old type) elite anymore, >other than< capitalists and >whoever they use for distraction of their shit<
You arent making any argument, just throwing insults and being a extreme moron with the interpretation of what i say.
What a fricking genius, i wouldnt understand the superior ways without your insight.
8 months ago
Anonymous
tl;dr
8 months ago
Anonymous
>Fiction is the purview of the elites, the existence of so many stories about 'the church being evil' is because the elites despise organized religion
You just gonna ignore the tons of fiction that doesn’t have anything to do with this anti-church narrative? Just gonna simplify an entire ages-spanning genre as just a tool of the “elites” (who don’t exist anymore apparently) as a tool to dismantle the church? Whilst also ignoring how the church was itself a tool of control of the elites for the masses. Great understanding of history there. > There isn't (the old type) elite anymore, >other than< capitalists and >whoever they use for distraction of their shit<
This is just more nonsense though. You have this half-assed marxist understanding of history but you clearly don’t even know enough about marxist theory past calling the “elites” capitalists… which somehow still don’t actually exist in your purview.
You’re literally just parroting marxist buzzwords. You might as well just post “eat le rich christcucks” and frick off with your frankly childish understanding of the world.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>You just gonna ignore the tons of fiction that doesn’t have anything to do with this anti-church narrative? Just gonna simplify an entire ages-spanning genre as just a tool of the “elites” (who don’t exist anymore apparently) as a tool to dismantle the church? Whilst also ignoring how the church was itself a tool of control of the elites for the masses. Great understanding of history there.
That was the comment I replied, you dont even remember what you said homosexual? >more strawmaning and assumptions.
Guess I just realized that's a troll, good one anon.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>That was the comment I replied, you dont even remember what you said homosexual?
Do you? >m-muh strawman
Its not creating a strawman when you point out someone is a fricking moron like you anon.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Still insults. Any argument?
8 months ago
Anonymous
Why bother arguing with a moron like you?
Wouldnt that be what the capitalist “elites” (who dont actually exist) want?
8 months ago
Anonymous
>because someone cant have individual opinions
Dude you type like every lther moronic Reddit migrant. Shut up you special little snowflake.
>There isn't a elite anymore, other than capitalists >christcuck
Redditor migrants are the most moronic people on this website.
Tell me why christians are counter-culture , because californians are making entertainment?
8 months ago
Anonymous
What, are you going to point at some dollar store "animated bible stories" VHS tape still on the shelf and go "S-s-see? Christians have media too!!!"?
8 months ago
Anonymous
Since you want to do that, I see many stories about specific religion/atheist cucking, but in general, that's implemented by all characters believing in god, not including religion simply because their lives dont revolve about it, or playing with the religion because they see it as mythos.
Christian media is only interesting for Christians, one that dont cite it is for everyone. Yeah people started making atheists histories, you aren't the only media and ideology anymore. Boohoo.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>that's implemented by all characters believing in god
"I headcanon everyone as monotheist if their views aren't explicitly stated" is not an argument.
If your demons aren’t actually demonic then there’s no point in calling them demons. Pick any other magical creature. If you really want to do this gay ass middle of the road schtick it’d be Angels/Fey folk/demons.
>Demons aren't angels
Yes, yes they are. In Christian canon demons are fallen angels that sided with Satan. They're effectively just tools for god's use. In the original hebrew canon "Satan" is a title that basically means prosecutor, "Hell" is a literal physical valley in the desert called Gehenna, and demons aren't a thing but Nephilim are
This would actually make sense in the older abrahamic mythos, where Satan literally just worked for god as one of his many servants. The idea of Satan being opposed to god in some grand cosmic battle of good and evil is largely a christian invention, just like the lake of fire is.
So you do a version of the celestial order where everyone is angels, demon is just a job title, and both sides are carrying out the will of god in different ways. Sometimes that means offering hope and salvation to a man undergoing a great trial. Sometimes that means sabotaging someones happiness in the first place so that they have a great trial to undergo and thus need divine hope and salvation.
Angels and demons alike are just showing up and doing their job, happy to be here. The fact that this is all one giant shell game doesn't bother them, because don't worry about it, its all part of The Plan.
I curse god everyday and yet I live a moderately good live. God is a fricking Black person. Yet I continue to do good deeds because it feels good and it's nice to know there is a society that is able to give back. Yet god is a fricking know-nothing Black person. I respect people that go to church and believe in a greater being because that's just the right thing to do and I expect them to do the same and jesus still is a dirty sandBlack person that continued to contradict himself until his dumb feeble death. Holy mary was a prostitute that fricking cheated on her husband and I don't walk up to the altar and scream "God is dead you dumb buttholes" even if it is correct because some people need faith in their lives and that's okay. I don't go into peoples faces telling them to frick off with their schizo religious ideas and prove them wrong by showing them that the earth is round and science has given us everything that is good today as they wouldn't understand anyway. Frick the catholic church though, stepped out as soon as they wanted to see my taxes. Don't get me started on all the other stupid bullshit relidjuns.
[...] >Makes dogshit post >Gets upset when replies meme on him
[...]
You know shit's bad when Jack is one of the more prominent settings that does this.
[...]
Actual demons in JACK are pure evil
It's only the dammed souls that have capacity for good.
https://jackrabbit.thecomicseries.com/archive/
the entire fricking thing for anyone interested (WARNING, lot of poorly drawn furry yiff, gore & shit)
bonus video:
His wife called into Loveline about him. Fun stuff, lmao
How about >God, Angels and the Heavens do not directly interact with Earth, they just start the cycle of humanity >Humanity is given freewill and creates sin >Satan, Lucifer, Demons and Hell is created to be a reflection of humanity's worse sins, morphing and degrading the more sin humanity creates >Evil human dies, they die, go to hell, have to face the worst of their sins until the reach the bottom, where it is eternal nothingness, a void of all that is physical >Hell itself is preparing for the apocalypse, to cleanse the Earth clean of all life and to send humanity to their final judgement >In the final days, the Angels descend to send the demons back to Hell and make the final judgement >Then, using the souls of the damned that was sent to hell, a new humanity is born giving them another chance >This continues forever until every human soul shows they are able to exercise their free will in a productive manner to the Lord. >Hell resets, everything returning to the neutral state until sin is created once again through human free will.
I'd like to see some Muslim based Hells. They have some pretty funky lore with the split between with good, bad and neutral creatures about. Non-believers going to Hell means you can have some decent characters without it being contrived.
So are we actually recommending good comics with religious themes here or just trying to convince strangers on the internet to change their entire worldview? Was curious if anyone had a western Christian comic similar to the Buddha manga series. Bonus points if its old testament stories.
>brain is apparently a meat computer >evidence supporting that is that damage to the brain can affect behavior, memory, and personality >when meat computer is turned off and never turned on again, what does it experience >can't ask a dead guy because nobody who's never been turned on again can be asked things >can't rely on pure science because we can only explain things we have a clear understanding of, and the final death of consciousness is not something any of us have experienced
Fricking existence is a b***h
In the Bible the people in hell get to go to heaven at the end of days
I mean even if you rape a hundred babies to death, is that worth infinity years in hell?
What's the difference between one and a hundred if the punishment is the same?
Well, what's the difference between hundreds of babies and simply wearing clothes with mixed fabrics, or whatever other stupid rules they had.
In my setting the angels are nice and god is nice too. And the demons aren't initially nice because they've been through rough stuff, but a cute naive angel boy meets a grumpy hot demon girl and they help the demons and all become friends.
How about the plot twist is christians were right and god is good?
The only time I’ve seen this done was in the opening scene to the movie, Renfield.
Are you like 17?
I'm ready for the pendulum to swing back. It's really funny to see people freak out about random positive portrayals of Christianity that doesn't come from actual church groups.
>It's really funny to see people freak out about random positive portrayals of Christianity that doesn't come from actual church groups
When did this happen?
>I'm ready for the pendulum to swing back.
This. I have become so fricking bored of the pseudo-counter-culture narrative. Im ready to go back to the screeching church harpies and "think of the children" and satanic panic from my preteen years. Its all the fricking same anyway.
it would be a welcome break from real life
Smiling Friends
>some people really fell for Ascians lies
Apologize to Venat
Well it would certainly be fictional.
Antisemite.
That's just reality
Only Tim Allen christmas movies can do that.
Is that why his followers diddle the children? 2000 year old child diddle cult
God is real, but not any god that humanity has ever imagined.
The irony of a SpongeBob meme calling out a lack of creativity is lost on you zoomers
Your take would make sense if that wasn't a scene from the 1st season.
That doesn't change the fact that SpongeBob memes are as overused as it gets. People slap a new one together damn near once a month.
SpongeBob is the only creative industry cartoon remaining
Lmao if you have to say it it's because you know it's not true
I inspired shit like Helluva Boss because I was trying to set up work about eschatology on this board and elsewhere
Why are you still alive
Spongebob is Black person amerifat goyslop
Frick off with your forced zoomer meme you moronic brown amerifat
>amerifat is soulless and doesn't understand religion
No surprises there.
europoor
That's Squidwarth
>HEAVEN BAD
>HELL GOOD
This shit's been going on for over 15 years now, I'm surprised it's still even a thing
It's an obvious subversion. From every possible standpoint, you cannot be more evil than Satan himself so why not spin that on it's head?
They're over used because they're good.
It's usually
>HELL BAD, BUT HONEST
>HEAVEN ALMOST AS BAD, VERY HYPOCRITICAL
By now disenchantment actually was a fresh take on that. God was a really cool dude somehow.
Not just religion-related media, but Subversion of tropes became a massive thing once the internet hit, because of the general increase of mass media/culture sharing. Then the people who experienced all that early information boom became old enough to have professions in media and control over those stories and started promoting more of that subversion, because it was different and that made profit and drew greater interest. Sometimes folks don't actually fully comprehend how world-wide communication in the general populace is slowly homogenizing even the subversive media. Hence people getting "tired" of the sarcasm/"references" used in pop culture, and are now drawn more often to at least the appearance of genuine emotion.
Why is it that people are far more critical of subversion than playing things straight? What's 15 years of "lol what if God was evil" compared to hundreds of years of culture and media where He's depicted as good?
Incidentally it's the same as the evil Superman or twist villains stuff, for every piece of media that uses it, there's another 10 where the superheroes are actually good and noble and the ugly fricker in black is the bad guy, yet complaints of overuse are given to the former
Because of trends, that's why. It's the difference between eating chicken throughout your life and eating the same chicken dish every day.
Because the net effect of "satan is actually good" has lead to mutants, freaks and trannies roaming the streets turning San Francisco and Portland into open air sewers. Morality is clearly not subjective and letting heroin junkies shit in the streets to own the religionists has clearly made society worse. Anyone who disagrees should be forced to live in the shit covered streets at gunpoint.
why are christcucks so insecure they feel offended over some moron's cartoon about their millenia old cult
I'm not a Christcuck I just find it really uncreative
>What if good thing bad and bad thing good???
There are next to no actual christians here you moronic homosexual
I wish.
Don't drop your fedora.
Don't drop your menorah
I thought you morons all trooned out and killed yourselves
Still a couple of them left, gotta give it another decade or so
I know this is considered more of a JRPG cliche but are there any Cinemaphile that do this?
>why do Christians not like the idea of the holy paradise being evil and the place of eternal torment and evil being good?
Anon…
Some comics by Neil gaiman do this, if an angel appears in one of his works he probably is a jerk.
>but are there any Cinemaphile that do this?
Let me redirect you to any of the 15 HB/HH threads out there right now...
>inb4 "recentivity bias"
Another anon mentioned Neil Gaiman. Spawn also does this to a degree with the Hellspawns being protagonists.
>HB HH
Am I supposed to understand shat those acronyms mean?
what*
Helluva Boss/Hazbin Hotel.
lurk for another ten thousand years newhomosexual
Other than Breath of Fire 2 and Final Fantasy 13 sequels I have a hard time thinking of JRPGs in which god is actually evil/you kill god. Most of the time it's just an especially powerful wizard or alien who uses angelic imagery.
Even SMT implies Y*wah is an incomplete part of the true god and all demons and gods are fragments of it. Dagdas true neutral ending Even sort if proves this.
How else would tradcaths get their persecution complex if they didn't have any demons to fight?
>Most of the time it's just an especially powerful wizard or alien who uses angelic imagery.
You're implying "'God' is just an alien that made humanity" isn't a subversion.
funny how subversions like that end up following one of Christianity rules of "don't play god"
Ffx, ff16, maybe ff9 depending on how you interpret necron.
Then there's blasphemous 1 and 2 again, depending on how you view "the miracle." Even though in 2 they mention it's kinda like the miracle wasn't strong enough to manifest as anything other than a plague of deformities and disease.
And then there's age of mythology, though that's basically a retread of Greek, Egyptian, Norse (and Chinese with the extended edition) mythology.
It started with FF7 and FF6, due to the heavy angelic motifs of the final bosses
Though in both cases, they are literally satan
Especially sephiroth, who parallels lucifer rather than God
Being a great hero who falls from grace before trying to usurp the position of god for himself only to be undone by divine intervention, when aeris asks the planet to help on her behalf
Its just one of those things where people see cloud beat up an angel and assume it means you are killing god
When you are actually stopping someone with delusions of godhood
You're kind of missing the interstellar war elements of the ancients. It has religious symbolism but it's somewhat sci Fi in nature when you realize Jenova is the one pulling all the strings.
If Christians are insecure, what does that make Muslims? They can't even see a crude drawing of their beloved prophet without chimping out.
Gonna be funny watching fedora-tippers wind up beheaded as the west is continually flooded with muslims.
>christcucks
Speaking of insecurity Anon, how have you been recently?
Why are athiests so quick to call Christcucks insecure for defending their religion? I don't see you guys calling out the israelites and Muslimes despite having far thinner skin.
Projection of insecurities from Boomer relatives.
Muslims maybe, israelites make fun of their own religion all the damn time.
>Muslims maybe
Lol no. They stopped that shit after that French artist got killed
>Jews
>Making fun of themselves
Dude criticizing the israelites straightfaced is one of the fastest ways to get blacklisted from the industry.
I love the dichotomy between you lot. It's "punching up based on the author's familiar culture" one moment and then not at all coded the next.
>I love the dichotomy between you lot. It's "punching up based on the author's familiar culture" one moment and then not at all coded the next.
Those can both be true depending on the situation.
>Dude criticizing the israelites straightfaced
Yeah, saying "israelite people are evil" will do that.
Or, you know...
saying "Black people are rapists"
Or "Asians are fricking ugly"
or "gay people are peadophiles"
Any gross generalisation of minorities who have objectively been victim of violences for being minorities will get you cancelled.
Why should it be different for israeli people?
Problem is that their is stastical data that shows Blacks are violent, that israelites have huge influence in politics and finance, and thar Gays are per capita more likely to be pedophiles. Not sure where you're getting the idea Asians are ugly though, did you mean suicidal?
>Yeah, saying "israelite people are evil" will do that
It's funny how THAT'S the strawman you want to go with, instead of doing something like criticizing the faults of their religion that often get criticized in Christianity despite being carry-over.
All that disingenuous shit does though is disprove your point entirely; criticizing the israeli religion is so ingrained as taboo in our culture that you instinctively associate the possibility of it with persecution of their people.
one of them tried to assassinate salman rushdie recently and it wasnt condemned. fatwa and all that
Most of the time it's christcucks freaking out over a fictitious evil god that has nothing to do with christianity.
Gods are entertaining mythical creatures, there's a reason why they were in so many stories in ancient times. But now christians decided they have a monopoly on gods and every instance of a god in fiction is a criticism or opposition to their religion.
>they hated him because he spoke the truth
What "truth"? Saying your favorite show isn't original?
Try being critical of Islam or Judaism.
>the seethe this post caused
Never change champ
replace god with superman and you'll understand
>t. fan of subversive superhero comic #1625847
there really is no talking to you homosexuals, huh?
Your cynical bullshit is ruining the world.
say something contrary about the holocaust
Don't believe in god but
Most people here are Americans, and Christianity is what they are exposed to more often.
>Most people here are Americans, and Christianity is what they are exposed to more often.
Not an excuse
>familiarity breeds contempt
i didn't grow to hate islam until i had to take classes with muslim immigrants who would go on unhinged rants about killing whitey and putting homosexuals in death camps.
Why are fiction writers so upset over Greek Platonic moral theory?
If you tell a person that bad things are bad and they get mad, maybe they are a person who does bad things.
People more often seem to be mad at "book edited by court of King James is definitive on all topics."
Okay post your translation of the ancient greek that's so great then.
>no, you see, my job is not to be an authority and offer solutions but merely to criticize
Then you have no arguments and are a homosexual.
>Your only options are to accept the work of King James and a bunch of guys going off a middling Greek translation as 100% correct or to retranslate the book.
Weird forced dichotomy.
Because its a competitor fiction
>Christians are the only ones who believe in angels
I can smell your stench through the computer screen.
That can be said by literally every group, though. Leftists get offended if someone makes fun of their belief, Rightoids get offended, Different religions... You say as if this is something exclusive to the christians, just because you are not christian, yourself.
But dude... what about muslims or other faiths? Don't you think will react too if you do the same thing with them?
It's offensive to be talking shit on religions other than the one white people follow. No one will make a cartoon doing that. You know this already anon.
What if everyone was bad, including you, the reader turning the pages?
How about
>God is good, but it's from the perspective of an unreliable narrator so he ends up looking evil as a result?
That's basically all anti christian sentiment summed up
>That's basically all anti christian sentiment summed up
no people don't like christianity because you're all fricking hypocrites christgay.
You need to be at least 18 to post here.
Why people keeps forgettings demons are fallen angels and not a whole unrelated species?
Poorly educated
Skipping Sunday school aren't we
Depending on the books and doctrine they're also considered the fallen spirits of the Nephilim, not fallen angels.
Not that they remember that either.
>lore treats Satan as God's equal or opposite
Where did this start? Even Devilman doesn't get this shit wrong and it's Japanese.
>Where did this start?
People who are still bitter that they were force to go to Sunday school and morals as kids.
>Forced to go to Sunday school
>Get molested
Wow, I wonder why people hate christians.
Don't to forget to tip your fedora. Also have fun with school staff apathy.
Yep. I remember the last time I ever went into a church parking lot when I was little, the head priest immediately ran outside of the building, a machine in one hand to detect any underage buttholes in one hand, and a cross-shaped dildo in another. That really for real happened, and isn't a story I'm bullshitting based off of shit I read on Reddit.
You do realise this happens way more at actual schools. Yet, no one hates teachers
>>lore treats Satan as God's equal or opposite
Satan being depicted as on par with God is vanishingly rare
Even South Park's God calls Satan a b***h to his face and Satan will just take it.
For people that crave a true duality and have a loose understanding of christianity, what they'd assume to be the equal but opposite force to god is not actually equal or opposite, it's objectively inferior and mirrored. It doesn't put darkness/evil as a primary part of the system but a derivation of it, so people that want that kind of system will just amp satan/lucifer up to be on par with god.
Still, this mostly applies to fanfiction. Most cartoons, books, series and movies that use a christian setting do understand that the devil is inferior to (and at the mercy of) god. If fricking reaper 2007 got it right everything else would.
>reaper 2007
why did you remind me that it got cancelled?
>reaper 2007
Damn I didn't think anyone else remembered that show. Great devil.
Maybe do something that ISN'T angels and demons for once?
Sorry that sounds hard what if I rip off the extremely culturally significant imagery of a group of people I hate just to call all of it, and by extension them, bad instead? Cool?
Again?!?
IM JUST WRITING WHAT I KNOW IM JUST WRITING MY TRUTH YOURE NOT MY SUPERVISOR
Do we have to portray angels and God as purely good?
According to the zoomer hipster ITT, yes.
?
I'm glad people are starting to realize the neo-hipster tradcath matrix as realized by peter thiel and the fact that a lot if stims from the arthoe podcast called redscarepod.
>Everything comes from God
>Evil exists
>therefore God created a universe with evil
>if God could have made the universe without evil but actively chose not to, God is therefore evil in and of itself
>if God COULDN'T make the universe without evil, he's either not the actual Almighty in charge or is not actually God as we understand the concept to be
There's really no way of looking at it without getting caught up in a mind frick
The same morons that posit the problem of evil have no concept of object separation; you can't argue with such soulless bugmen.
>if God could have made the universe without evil but actively chose not to, God is therefore evil in and of itself
If he made us in his image and gave us free will, I don't know if anyone was ever trying to argue that he wasn't "evil" by human standards. It feels weird and inaccurate to judge something that huge and cosmic by our standards to me though.
You are defining things incorrectly.
God is Good, evil is to choose to go against God's will, absolute evil is complete separation from God, it's literally like light and darkness. That's why all sin is the same level of evil in the sight of God and why only sentient creatures can be evil and animals lack the ability.
Why God chose specifically to give us such an ability is not fully known, but it must be good because God chose to do it.
Man's sense of justice is skewed by both his fallen nature and position of power.
It's a bit unhinged to claim something is good because god did it.
God himself said he created both good and evil, light and dark, so clearly god can do evil things that he also defines as evil since all evil came from him.
I don't get where this idea god is perfect and never makes mistakes comes from.
God himself admitted to feeling regret about his own actions and being susceptible to petty emotion.
>God himself admitted to feeling regret about his own actions and being susceptible to petty emotion.
>That time God made a bet with Satan that Job would be faithful no matter what horrible shit happens to him
Those extra kids better have been worth it.
God created a universe with evil
This is the dumbest "gotcha" that midwits try, and is entirely answered by just spending five minutes on Google.
It's not like religions, including monothiestic ones, haven't had non-omnipotent Gods before.
Sure, but christianity *does* claim that god is all knowing and all powerful and all good. So once you catch God in the lie on one of those three, you have no reason to believe him on the other two. If God is not actually all powerful, but tried to convince us he was, why should we believe him when he says he is all good, as opposed to that being another deception?
>>if God could have made the universe without evil but actively chose not to, God is therefore evil in and of itself
Begging atheists to read a philosophy book for once in their lives
> christian makes an appeal to authority rather than posit an argument of their own
I mean, I can't say I am surprised.
Nta, but that's not what "appeal to authority" is. At all. Anon's asking you to do your own research, which, while that's a shit counterargument, it should be expected that if you're going to enter an argument and ask people to cOnsIdEr tHe fOlLoWiNg that you at least have a cursory knowledge of the discussion.
Also...
>Redditspacer incorrectly cites fallacy
They really can't. If you are basing a story element on some ideological factor, you cannot claim divorce from that ideological factor. It's one thing to recognize influence of a work from familiarity, but it's another to explicitly satirize it.
>It's one thing to recognize influence of a work from familiarity, but it's another to explicitly satirize it.
That's what I meant, I guess?
Someone can absolutely write a story where the god is a stand-in for the christian god, but someone else can write a different story where their god serves a different purpose.
In the former case christians are always going to create a link to their god because that's what their life revolves around, even when the writer didn't intend there to be one.
*latter, not former.
>but someone else can write a different story where their god serves a different purpose.
The problem is that some people want to have their cake and eat it too by not putting in any worldbuilding effort into crafting their deity, so they just use the Christian god, or rather a god/religion that explicitly shares some similarities, as a default... and then proceed to criticize religion. At that point it's effectively the same thing.
>but its only really one step removed
No it isn't.
>Someone wrote a book 800 years ago that says you're wrong
Anon did not say that. Anon said read a book. The implication is that you should at least do some very basic research before saying anything that crude as fact when people have debated that shit long before the internet. It's not "I'm an expert," it's "please at least have a familiar subject with something you want to debate." The "implicit implication" (disgusting phrase) that all of this stopped being talked about in the 13th century is amateur.
Eh, its not *directly* appeal to authority but its only really one step removed. "Someone wrote a book 800 years ago that says you're wrong, and he was a philosopher so that means he's right" isn't much different from the direct 'I'm an expert so that means I win the argument'. The implicit assumption in anons request was that whoever wrote the philosophy book must, by default, have been correct in their opinion simply because they wrote a book about it.
> God created a universe with evil
Yes, we all know this. Stop acting as though you are saying something profound.
>god makes good and evil
>god makes man with free will
>man starts making anime, furry shit,scat,feetshit,anal and traps
>Man blames god for something they did
>Everyone blames god for shit that happens
>gods face when Mankind does stupid shit
At this point, when i see posts like this, i always wonder if god really is good/evil or if he doesn't care. To the cosmic Spaghettis monster in space we would be the SJW's b***hing about something yet forgetting that free will is a thing and its not his prob to fix your shit
>man starts making anime, furry shit, feetshit, anal and traps
Any God that thinks this is cringe is a bad God
It makes them seethe every time.
Take responsibility for your actions.
God would put you in the deepest circle of hell for posting in an ungodly website like this
Yeah, I've heard it before sinner.
>who does these days?
Appeal to mass. You can't just assume because you believe everyone's doing it that you should too. It's a lame excuse to be immoral.
Yes, and you should make the choice to take responsibility before your action is taken into his hands.
I think you might be taking an ancient fairy tale a bit too serious bro
The irony is that you take life too seriously in your pursuit for what you "know" is justice.
My point is that you believe yourself to be righteous, why would you want to take responsibilty for your actions? After all, if you're right and they're wrong, why should you pick up the pieces of the supposed mess you've made?
The fact you can't comprehend why someone should care for others even if the opposing party is in the wrong shows how vindictive you are. This is why poorhouses spread Christianity through Rome while the pantheon believers just told everyone to suffer.
No my point is that if one believes that they are the rightous one, what does it matter that people think you're the villain for making things worse? What would THEY know? If you're in the right, you wouldn't think you've done anything wrong, and that you're just giving the evil ones their "just desserts". Look at Twitter's incel vs femcel fights.
Who does these days? Let me put it this way. If you think you are right, would you ever apologise for your actions?
Does god?
Case in point.
Only the abrahamic religions have this problem. Most other religions bite the on either of those.
How do you know evil exist? Or even good ?
Good and evil boils down to just if you are hurting or helping X, basically if you are doing good or bad to the survival of your species/community.
That's called ethical universalism. It's not a very popular stance.
What people mean by good and evil depends entirely on their philosophical stance.
A moral realist believes that there is an objective property of goodness or badness to actions and objects the same way being round is a property of circles.
A moral universalist believes there's no objective property of being good or evil, but that some rational code of ethics can be agreed upon
A moral subjectivist believes that morals are personal and subjective judgements
There's also stuff like non-cognitivism where moral judgements are recontextualized as expressions rather than claims ("killing is evil" means the same as "down with killing")
Yes, theodicy cannot be reconciled with reality. Not a new thought but not one that's wrong either.
The problem of Evil in theodicy is an argument form where you assume premises you are trying to disprove and show how they lead to false or impossible conclusions. If God is all-good all-knowing and all-powerful evil shouldn't exist. It existing means one of those premises is wrong.
Good and Evil have to be assumed to exist for the premise that God is all-good to be used in the argument - it doesn't mean the person making the argument believes in objective proscriptive morals
>The problem of Evil in theodicy is an argument form where you assume premises you are trying to disprove and show how they lead to false or impossible conclusions. If God is all-good all-knowing and all-powerful evil shouldn't exist. It existing means one of those premises is wrong.
>
>Good and Evil have to be assumed to exist for the premise that God is all-good to be used in the argument - it doesn't mean the person making the argument believes in objective proscriptive morals
The point of the whole argument is to put christians in ther place because they are mental infants who actually do think like that.
>if God COULDN'T make the universe without evil, he's either not the actual Almighty in charge or is not actually God as we understand the concept to be
Why is that assumed?
Why can't god have limitations?
Having at least one other option for any choice feels like a basic requirement for free will. Without it, we would just be automatons, right?
Man, I'm an atheist and even I know half the point of God isn't that he made a universe with evil, he made a universe with the POSSIBILITY of evil, the possibility of suffering and pain, the possibility that everything's gonna suck sometimes.
One of the cornerstones of Christianity (and kinda the other Abrahamic religions) that makes it different to the other beliefs of history is the idea is that he doesn't disallow people from doing bad things or disallow them from making mistakes.
Sorry if this post's janky as shit, I'm doing something else IRL and I'm multitasking.
What about suffering that doesn't come about from mistakes? Like someone could have the healthiest lifestyle ever and still get cancer and suffer and die. You can be perfect and still suffer
Supposedly even the environmental suffering is the result of the world's fall caused by man's sin. The garden had no thorns. Immediately after the fruit fiasco God let them know the sin brought thorns into the world. Thorn, cancer, parasites are all parts of the world's fall.
>Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life. It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
Another interesting thing in the Bible is that God doesn't see humans as individual entities. "Sins of the father." Any human can be judged based on any tangentially related ancestor's actions because frick you. Kind of renders the whole concept of sin moot from any practical theological standpoint.
You are blood related to Hitler on some kind of loose massive family tree spanning millenia, so why shouldn't I blame you personally for the Holocaust?
God isn't good, not even the bible says that.
That's the Hebrew side of God. The post Jesus God is the mellow one.
Oy vey, that's not very kind of you, goyim.
false gods are bad, yes.
It's always Satan and demons with magic who get played sympathetically (for tumblr sexyman "princess" fantasies), has anybody ever made a story following a sympathetic antichrist?
Chronicles of Wormwood. The guy swears a lot and he can be a jerk sometimes, but ultimately he's not keen on doing what the Antichrist is supposed to do.
Hellboy?
Also, Babyteeth.
American Jesus but no one on Cinemaphile is old enough or open minded enough to have remembered/read it.
Damn, that’s a hell of a revelation to just drop on someone like that.
It does get tiring how modern media only seems to criticize religion as a vague or christianity, almost like they’re too terrified to make fun of antyhing else.
*religion as a vague whole or specifically christianity,
It started more so with mocking the dominant culture at the time. More of a punching up before it became a demonization and unsubtle loathing.
Not a Christian, I personally want the religion to die out but the bias of being against Christianity and not being against Judaism, Buddhism and Islam at the same time is kinda meh. Atleast if you're white, sandtribes and Orientals can practice their religions all they want. [s]In their respective afterlives[/s]
>Muh punching up
And yet nobody talks criticizes Islam, or in any of the Eastern religions, even in their home countries, nor does it criticize hedonism.
Makes you think....
I said thats how it started, its very obvious that now they're too afraid to step on anyone else's toes lest they prove themselves a heretic of the new god of equality
Ironic, isn't it? The new God is more revered and worshipped than the old one. You've met the same fate as the pagans.
The anon who described "muh punching up"
There are more people in the thread Black person, god you must be a newbie
>And yet nobody talks criticizes Islam, or in any of the Eastern religions
This is falsehood. those kind of issues are frequently reported and criticised. It's the very reason you know about it in the first place.
>those kind of issues are frequently reported and criticised
Right, that's why anytime someone mentions homosexuality verses religion in media, it's always some Westboro Baltist Church stand-in and not any of the countries that literally throw homosexuals off of rooftops.
Yes but I don't see jokes about camel fricking, militant and ignorant arabians in the same way I see ignorant, bible and flag redneck conservatives. The simple truth is that its considered poor taste to make fun of Islam and not Christianity. The duality exists stop being willfully ignorant
western civilisation and white people die out in direct correlation to it, so congrats for that
>What if Superman... was bad?
Omniman and homelander are great characters
You're just a homosexual contrarian
Superman himself is a subversion of the even older evil superman trope.
Tons of old sci fi is filled with superpowered villians, Siegal and Shuster were specifically subverting that idea by making their character a heroic version.
God isn't good, he's just big and uses his giant fingers to push the people he doesn't like into a big pit
I don't like comics or cartoons tackling religion because they almost always ignore the elephant in the room that is the dinosaurs and the several million year history of earth prior to the evolution of man.
Yeah dude, because evolutionary theism is a niche concept that nobody ever thought of before now.
Frick, why do homosexuals like this come in and act like they're hot shit for just now realizing some very basic shit that people have been arguing about for decades?
If it's such hot shit then, homosexual, why does no one ever bring it up in these threads? Huh?!
All I see is people b***hing about morals and theology, no one's out here asking why the Bible doesn't provide an answer for the million year old bones of a giant lizard we keep finding in the ground.
>no one's out here asking why the Bible doesn't provide an answer for the million year old bones of a giant lizard we keep finding in the ground.
Isn't it "God put them there to test our faith"?
>why does no one ever bring it up in these threads? Huh?!
Why does nobody mention an idea that even the Catholic Church long ago accepted to dismiss an argument nobody is making?
Okay but accepting evolution as true and just ignoring the obvious clashing historical accounts isn't really addressing anything
Oh yeah I remember the part of the Bible where they list every single fauna in the Garden of Eden down to the individual species's of ladybug.
But they do mention several animals, no?
You'd think a single one of these fricking enormous creatures would be mentioned at all
>You'd think a single one of these fricking enormous creatures
Yeah, I can see how that would be a problem when you set a precedent of biblical interpretation that also argues against the presence of giraffes in God's creation through lack of mention.
When you have metaphor relating to the fierceness, size, and hardiness of animals, it does become a problem
Tell me, what's mightier?
A Tyrannosaurus Rex
Or
Lions, bears, wolves?
Because all three of them are mentioned
Why would they neglect to mention even one of the biggest creatures to walk the earth?
Seriously, look up "animals in the bible" and question how ONLY our modern assortment made their way in
That doesn't address the main point. How is the traditional retelling of the Christian creation myth, that God created the world and everything in it in only a few days, supposed to co-exist with the inherently contradictory nature of natural evolution, which takes place over millions of years?
>How is the traditional retelling of the Christian creation myth
If you're basing your argument off of "traditional" (read: secondary) retellings, then anything is fair game.
>Tell me, what's mightier?
>A Tyrannosaurus Rex
>Or
>Lions, bears, wolves?
I'm just going to say it: T-Rexes are overhyped. They're not even the most dangerous dinosaurs of their time. And the Leviathan could definitely kick their asses.
But arguing such misses the point of said power contests. To describe a creature long dead by the time the israelites left Egypt is no different than talking of something like the dragon in the book of Revelations. A man overcoming a lion means more to his people than that type of beast. It's not that fiercer creatures don't exist in the Bible than lions and bears (just namedropped two), it's the animals used are something that give the followers of God a more familiar point of reference.
You could argue that this would be done anyway from a fictitious author trying to better sell a narrative, but that asks why other fantastical creatures would be included altogether.
>The israelites would choose to write about animals they know
You know what, that's a damn good point. I was actually going to mention that monsters could be construed as dinosaurs or as of yet undiscovered prehistoric animals, and in light of the distinct possibility of author favoritism I don't think dinosaurs alone are a very good argument
Because most theist believe in evolution. I mean shit you know a priest one of the major science on the big bang theory some idiot is gonna make a bazinga joke
Because you homosexuals don't fricking read or listen.
These fricking arguments have been going on for fricking decades now between people far better educated on the subjects than you. The church themselves have these debates so they can better proceed in ministering, let alone non church theologians and philosophers.
Fricking hell the
>why is their evil in the universe
talk is literal millennia old. Nobody should have to fricking explain Symposium or Leviathan to some mental fricking toddler realizing that the blocks have different colors for the first time.
The Bible doesn't mention most animals.
The American Evangelical movement has been a disaster for Christianity.
The Bible DOES mention dinosaurs though. Behemoth is a sauropod for example
The most amusing part about a lot of atheist is that, they think they are really smart of stating the obvious and a lot of times they are just plain ignorant about what they are talking about. Seth Macfarlane is a primo example of that phenomenon.
To be fair, everytime Christianity and evolution gets brought up, it's almost always akin to that Ned Flanders vs Evolution episode. And those aren'r strawmen Christians. Evangelicals have monopolised the perception of Christianity, much like how The Taliban has with Islam.
Most theists and even the Pope believe in evolution.
Your average JRPG plot.
>several million year history of earth prior to the evolution of man.
Evolution is actual nonsense of you think about it for more than 5 minutes
Evolution is the most midwit religion to ever exist. It has almost no scientific merit when you actually understand the science and see the flaws.
AFAIK most believers of abrhamic faiths are not biblical literalists or creationists. Genesis is assumed to be either metaphorical or from some divine perspective where a "Day" as in "on the first day" etc, could represent hundreds of millions of years or more.
Evolution is incompatible with Christianity because it means humans are not a creation but instead just a mere byproduct of a non-teleological phenomenon.
Evolution is incompatible with *modern* christianity, which claims that the Bible and its contents are literally true. Thats actually a recent phenomenon, for much of history the Bible was understood to be figurative, a book whose fables impart moral lesson and philosophical truths rather than being some kind of accurate history of the world. You go back even a few hundred years and start claiming that everything in the Bible happened literally as described and even the pope would give you a funny look.
That's certainly a half-empty line of thinking. What is evolution is merely the how and the why is still up for grabs?
Can't people just make a compromise and for the sake of jokes make heaven flawed but still good?
It's a shame because I love this idea it's just always done so poorly. You shouldn't be able to comprehend and angel let alone it's moral compass so accept that and run with it instead of undermining your own creative ability by just copy pasting ancient European religious beliefs.
At least copy from Khaballah if you want to be slightly more creative.
Still call myself a Christian, don't bother with church anymore. I'm always interested in stories involving "Christian mythology". Similar to being interested in greek/roman mythology stories.
What is this?
It's simple really. Atheists these days are cowards. Other religions will either retaliate by force or by suing them to the poorhouse, but Christians are defanged and are unable to fight back.
You don't need to be a Christcuck to see how they label All Christians as evil, but are apologists to other religions. The Taliban is a good example.
>Setting
Frick. You guys know this what's wrong with everything right?
Why did god kill everyone on earth except a few idiots on a boat?
Why are christcucks so whiny all the time?
the fedora tippers aren't worse
Internet Atheism hasn't been a thing since 2014. Let it go.
Do you not know what reddit is?
you both are. the fricking pilpul from fedoras on this doesn’t fool anyone. both are constantly preaching and it’s annoying as frick. i can’t count the number of times one of you gays has thrown a meltdown over someone saying “prayers to you” or whatever. it’s pathetic
In my setting god is an alien entity that spreads the seed of life to harvest the energy of planets indirectly through whatever intelligent species emerges, and once it's done with them it just causes a rapture and starts anew somewhere else. It's not evil, it's the natural order of things, but life tries to cling on and turns on god and its angels to escape a fate they perceive as unfair.
In a scale of evangelion to every JRPG ever, how original is it?
Pretty unoriginal.
I prefer C.S. Lewis' take.
>“God is the only comfort, He is also the supreme terror: the thing we most need and the thing we most want to hide from. He is our only possible ally, and we have made ourselves His enemies. Some people talk as if meeting the gaze of absolute goodness would be fun. They need to think again. They are still only playing with religion. Goodness is either the great safety or the great danger — according to the way you react to it. and we have reacted the wrong way.”
>C.S. Lewis in Mere Christianity
My setting is God, angels, heaven, hell, demons, satan, all of it is a neutral natural process of endless life and death perpetuating the unstable reality we live in. An ebb and flow of destruction by hell and rebirth by the heavens that if disturbed or broken would lead to the end of everything.
Or you could do what SMT did and say "God, Devils and literally everything in between including humanity bad"
But if everything is bad, where do we get the concept of "good"?
Like how could you imagine the color red if you love in a blue world?
The point in SMT's case is that the concept of good and bad come from whoever is the wielding power. Sure, there is YHWH who is, for a lack of a better term, the custodian of the universe created by the Great Will (Or something, I forget the exact naming right now) to see over the budding life but that's only in certain SMT games whereas in others it is implied he overtook the throne from another god(s). It's why the series has three primary routes of order (The status quo and the throne must be upheld, no matter who is in charge), chaos (Frick the system, we make our own choices) and neutral (Humanity will find their own way).
It's only "All these things are bad" from our outsider perspective but inside the universe morality is just determined who is the winner.
The true god in SMT is a humanitygay
This one feels more like a recurring Cinemaphile setting, than a Cinemaphile one... if I'm being honest.
It happens in Cinemaphile too, look at Helluva Boss.
I was not saying it doesn't happen, just that it is not as recurring as in Cinemaphile, where you could even say it has reached the point of exhaustion.
>Helluva Boss
Do we honestly believe the people behind Helluva Boss got inspired by Cinemaphile media to came up with that? I have my doubts.
So, which are the first examples we have of this particular setting in Cinemaphile... or even Western media in general?
I had a setting like this in mind
>Angels and Demons exist
>God is real and good
BUT
>Demons have infiltrated the major churches and its institutions
>they turned everything upside down as a cruel joke
>Hallow's Eve, a day for saints, became the holiday for demons, ghouls, and monsters.
>Saturnalia and all those Pagan holidays became Christmas and Easter.
>hell, throw in biblically accurate angels being thrown to the wayside as the beautiful white winged Pagan icons became the mainstream idea of angels
The boy fricking and corruption of the Church was just Satan pulling the biggest kekaiku on humanity
Warcraft already did the infiltration stuff with the Scarlet Crusade as I recall.
That goat has some nice breasts not gonna lie
Honestly, I thought the complaint was that all the Gnostic Bullshit final bosses tend to have the exact same fricking plot of 'Super Entity hates souls/human spirit/individuality and then the heroes beat them after a friendship speech about humanity'.
And then people misunderstood and started lumping in guys like Sephiroth and Kefka who just crib the aethetic rather than the plot.
>make women evil
>men still like them
I think christians need to get more cultured and realise they already won this war. They dominated the west for a millennia, and consequently the majority of art made at the peak of western creativity and power is christian. You can complain that rick and morty or some anime has this evil church trope, but then shakespeare, bach, dante, handel, etc etc etc all made heavily pro christian artwork. You already won. The only reason this subversion stuff exists is because religion won the art war so hard that distancing yourself from it is the only way to stand out
People who watch anime don’t read books or listen to classical music ambient
I'm kinda wondering what inspired them to give Shang those Shredder gauntlets.
Fiction is the purview of the elites, the existence of so many stories about 'the church being evil' is because the elites despise organized religion, objective morality and the idea that doing bad things means you suffer when you die, because if you have a lot of money why wouldn't you be on epstein island?
>the elites on fanfic tier stories
Here comes the schizo
People like you have brought the internet IQ from a middling 100 down to a below average 80. Just shut the frick up, moron.
There isn't a elite anymore, other than capitalists and whoever they use for distraction of their shit. You are just a christcuck thinking that every world problem is because they dont believe in your fear of death/lack of puporse copium and you don't understand shit different outside the chamber of what you think.
Which is useful as a tool for the actual authoritarian "elite".
Ahhhhh, to be a teenager again. Its okay buddy, things get better when you actually grow up and grow past understanding the world in a
simple dichotomy.
Here’s a start to actually understanding the world though champ: there are indeed “elites”. Going with your teenager’s understanding of communism, commies called them the “intelligentsia”, or the “bourgeoisie” if theyre wishing to lump the middle class in with them. You being a dipshit with a smartphone would be classed as this as well.
Amazing how simplistic dumbing down the world into 3 groups makes it all seem.
Funny that you say about dumbing down things in groups and thinks im a communist.
You’re whining about le capitalism. Youre either a pussy that calls themselves a “socialist” or so braindead you parrot communist talking points without actually knowing what they entail. Regardless, youre obviously a disengenuous moron.
Yes, because someone cant have individual opinions or talk about malpractice of a system without wanting what they call the reverse on your TV news. Both options turns to shit given time.
Amazing how simplistic dumbing down the world into 3 groups makes it all seem.
D’aww look he’s trying to be smart.
Having a pessimistic outlook on everything doesn’t make you intellectual kid.
>no argument, try making a insult
sad.
>n-no u
Got anything else you want to throw out chief? I await the brilliant analysis of the anon who whines about capitalism but says there are no elites. I am in awe of your independent thinking!
Read again.
>Fiction is the purview of the elites, the existence of so many stories about 'the church being evil' is because the elites despise organized religion
>There isn't (the old type) elite anymore, >other than< capitalists and >whoever they use for distraction of their shit<
You arent making any argument, just throwing insults and being a extreme moron with the interpretation of what i say.
What a fricking genius, i wouldnt understand the superior ways without your insight.
tl;dr
>Fiction is the purview of the elites, the existence of so many stories about 'the church being evil' is because the elites despise organized religion
You just gonna ignore the tons of fiction that doesn’t have anything to do with this anti-church narrative? Just gonna simplify an entire ages-spanning genre as just a tool of the “elites” (who don’t exist anymore apparently) as a tool to dismantle the church? Whilst also ignoring how the church was itself a tool of control of the elites for the masses. Great understanding of history there.
> There isn't (the old type) elite anymore, >other than< capitalists and >whoever they use for distraction of their shit<
This is just more nonsense though. You have this half-assed marxist understanding of history but you clearly don’t even know enough about marxist theory past calling the “elites” capitalists… which somehow still don’t actually exist in your purview.
You’re literally just parroting marxist buzzwords. You might as well just post “eat le rich christcucks” and frick off with your frankly childish understanding of the world.
>You just gonna ignore the tons of fiction that doesn’t have anything to do with this anti-church narrative? Just gonna simplify an entire ages-spanning genre as just a tool of the “elites” (who don’t exist anymore apparently) as a tool to dismantle the church? Whilst also ignoring how the church was itself a tool of control of the elites for the masses. Great understanding of history there.
That was the comment I replied, you dont even remember what you said homosexual?
>more strawmaning and assumptions.
Guess I just realized that's a troll, good one anon.
>That was the comment I replied, you dont even remember what you said homosexual?
Do you?
>m-muh strawman
Its not creating a strawman when you point out someone is a fricking moron like you anon.
Still insults. Any argument?
Why bother arguing with a moron like you?
Wouldnt that be what the capitalist “elites” (who dont actually exist) want?
>because someone cant have individual opinions
Dude you type like every lther moronic Reddit migrant. Shut up you special little snowflake.
>There isn't a elite anymore, other than capitalists
>christcuck
Redditor migrants are the most moronic people on this website.
You're trying to parody npc responses, right?
Tell me why christians are counter-culture , because californians are making entertainment?
What, are you going to point at some dollar store "animated bible stories" VHS tape still on the shelf and go "S-s-see? Christians have media too!!!"?
Since you want to do that, I see many stories about specific religion/atheist cucking, but in general, that's implemented by all characters believing in god, not including religion simply because their lives dont revolve about it, or playing with the religion because they see it as mythos.
Christian media is only interesting for Christians, one that dont cite it is for everyone. Yeah people started making atheists histories, you aren't the only media and ideology anymore. Boohoo.
>that's implemented by all characters believing in god
"I headcanon everyone as monotheist if their views aren't explicitly stated" is not an argument.
How about a setting where both angels and demons are generally good and it's only specific groups from either side causing trouble?
If your demons aren’t actually demonic then there’s no point in calling them demons. Pick any other magical creature. If you really want to do this gay ass middle of the road schtick it’d be Angels/Fey folk/demons.
Demons are just angels anyway
None of them have free will
They're just doing their jobs
Demons aren’t angels though. Individual words have individual meanings anon.
>Demons aren't angels
Yes, yes they are. In Christian canon demons are fallen angels that sided with Satan. They're effectively just tools for god's use.
In the original hebrew canon "Satan" is a title that basically means prosecutor, "Hell" is a literal physical valley in the desert called Gehenna, and demons aren't a thing but Nephilim are
This would actually make sense in the older abrahamic mythos, where Satan literally just worked for god as one of his many servants. The idea of Satan being opposed to god in some grand cosmic battle of good and evil is largely a christian invention, just like the lake of fire is.
So you do a version of the celestial order where everyone is angels, demon is just a job title, and both sides are carrying out the will of god in different ways. Sometimes that means offering hope and salvation to a man undergoing a great trial. Sometimes that means sabotaging someones happiness in the first place so that they have a great trial to undergo and thus need divine hope and salvation.
Angels and demons alike are just showing up and doing their job, happy to be here. The fact that this is all one giant shell game doesn't bother them, because don't worry about it, its all part of The Plan.
I curse god everyday and yet I live a moderately good live. God is a fricking Black person. Yet I continue to do good deeds because it feels good and it's nice to know there is a society that is able to give back. Yet god is a fricking know-nothing Black person. I respect people that go to church and believe in a greater being because that's just the right thing to do and I expect them to do the same and jesus still is a dirty sandBlack person that continued to contradict himself until his dumb feeble death. Holy mary was a prostitute that fricking cheated on her husband and I don't walk up to the altar and scream "God is dead you dumb buttholes" even if it is correct because some people need faith in their lives and that's okay. I don't go into peoples faces telling them to frick off with their schizo religious ideas and prove them wrong by showing them that the earth is round and science has given us everything that is good today as they wouldn't understand anyway. Frick the catholic church though, stepped out as soon as they wanted to see my taxes. Don't get me started on all the other stupid bullshit relidjuns.
Fricking smite me Black folk I'm waiting.
Nice copypasta
>Makes dogshit post
>Gets upset when replies meme on him
You know shit's bad when Jack is one of the more prominent settings that does this.
All these posts and STILL nobody mentions Cinemaphile media portraying angels as bad guys and demons as good guys
In my show angels are everywhere, but invisible. The main character has special glasses to see the angels.
Makes me miss the good ol days
Actual demons in JACK are pure evil
It's only the dammed souls that have capacity for good.
Now post the rest
https://jackrabbit.thecomicseries.com/archive/
the entire fricking thing for anyone interested (WARNING, lot of poorly drawn furry yiff, gore & shit)
bonus video:
His wife called into Loveline about him. Fun stuff, lmao
Happy to see my storytime thread god knows how long ago had an impact.
How about
>God, Angels and the Heavens do not directly interact with Earth, they just start the cycle of humanity
>Humanity is given freewill and creates sin
>Satan, Lucifer, Demons and Hell is created to be a reflection of humanity's worse sins, morphing and degrading the more sin humanity creates
>Evil human dies, they die, go to hell, have to face the worst of their sins until the reach the bottom, where it is eternal nothingness, a void of all that is physical
>Hell itself is preparing for the apocalypse, to cleanse the Earth clean of all life and to send humanity to their final judgement
>In the final days, the Angels descend to send the demons back to Hell and make the final judgement
>Then, using the souls of the damned that was sent to hell, a new humanity is born giving them another chance
>This continues forever until every human soul shows they are able to exercise their free will in a productive manner to the Lord.
>Hell resets, everything returning to the neutral state until sin is created once again through human free will.
I'd like to see some Muslim based Hells. They have some pretty funky lore with the split between with good, bad and neutral creatures about. Non-believers going to Hell means you can have some decent characters without it being contrived.
3,000 people just died in an earthquake for no reason.
God is good.
So are we actually recommending good comics with religious themes here or just trying to convince strangers on the internet to change their entire worldview? Was curious if anyone had a western Christian comic similar to the Buddha manga series. Bonus points if its old testament stories.
You knew what you were getting into when you clicked on this thread, anon.
I' hoped there would be some good recs in-between the bullshit.
If God/mystery Deity is real, I think he can only affect things in passive bits, passively affecting things, basically a luck god
>brain is apparently a meat computer
>evidence supporting that is that damage to the brain can affect behavior, memory, and personality
>when meat computer is turned off and never turned on again, what does it experience
>can't ask a dead guy because nobody who's never been turned on again can be asked things
>can't rely on pure science because we can only explain things we have a clear understanding of, and the final death of consciousness is not something any of us have experienced
Fricking existence is a b***h
If you can be saved, why wouldn't all the rapists and nazis be in heaven?
In the Bible the people in hell get to go to heaven at the end of days
I mean even if you rape a hundred babies to death, is that worth infinity years in hell?
What's the difference between one and a hundred if the punishment is the same?
Well, what's the difference between hundreds of babies and simply wearing clothes with mixed fabrics, or whatever other stupid rules they had.
Castlevania
In my setting the angels are nice and god is nice too. And the demons aren't initially nice because they've been through rough stuff, but a cute naive angel boy meets a grumpy hot demon girl and they help the demons and all become friends.
What were these supposed to be?
they're the fallen angels "encrusted" by matter