>Alien Covenant
Why did these idiots explore a new planet without helmets on??
Because the director and studio think lowly of Alien fans and think that easily visible faces are needed to convey basic emotional information. It's also possible that the actor's contracts stipulated their faces be visible and the studio didn't care to fight them on it.
I'm not saying we should wear masks on earth or in a space ship, but you sure as shit should on an alien planet with alien life. What bothers me is that Prometheus essentially solved this problem with helmets that don't obscure any of the face, but they got rid of their helmets anyway.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
Why did they need comically large name tags on their foreheads?
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
For the viewer. I suppose you could justify it by saying something like oh each suit was custom made for each person's body blah blah
They didn't know it was a good planet, and as a general rule you'd never want to breathe air where there could be unknown microbes. Oxygen content is not the only thing you need to check for.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
The planet they were supposed to go to had been surveyed.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
In Covenant? No, rewatch the movie. Classic rogue transmission investigation plot. Established around 25 minutes in.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
The planet they were supposed to go to had been surveyed, the one they went to had not.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
Yes. The logic follows that to even attempt a mission on an unscouted planet, you would need pressurized suits to prevent exactly what happened. It's sad because it would have been so easy to just have them wear the suits and have the infection take place one of any number of a million ways something could pierce the suit or get onto a suit for later infection. It's not unreasonable to assume that they would have some suits on a large vessel for some kind of emergency.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
Or hell now that I think about it, even a throwaway line about how there's no biocontaminants in the air. "Scans show no aerosolized life forms". Would that have been so hard Scott god damnit
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
But they actually would have been fine if David hadn't bombed the planet with a one of a kind pathogen made by space gods. Maybe stepping down onto foreign stellar bodies is a common occurrence in that universe, and infection doesn't happen often if ever.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
They knew there was life on the planet already. Trees means a reasonable threat of parasites or harmful microorganisms. And we also know that infection was of some concern to humans in this future because of the quarantine protocols often mentioned. In Alien, the only reason these protocols were disobeyed was because of the android plot betrayal twist, it was in that sense justified. In Prometheus and Covenant, not the case.
Not alien, alien covenant. Alien as I said is 1800s because 'truckers' is just a way for american execs to understand the concept of merchant seamen. Go read any ten pages of 'The Black person of the Narcissus' or any Conrad novel (where 'Nostromo' comes from) and hear the sailors b***hing about bonus situation, equitable etc out the ass
[...]
what a dunce you are to have actually posted that
Space truckers comes from Ridley Scott's initial pitch. The fact that he based the ship name and some random quote from a book he read once is not relevant to the core concept. They are indeed truckers, blue collar workers taking care of 1980's retrofuturistic tech. Helmets are a part of the "space veneer".
>because they're colonists on their way to a known good planet
No it wasn't known. It was suddenly popped up and played "Sweet Home Alabama"
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
They were on their way to a different planet than the one shown in the film.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
that's what i said
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
No, you said the Engineer planet the distress signal came from was the planet they were headed to. They had another planet in mind called Origae-6 which had been vetted, then they diverted to the Engineer planet. >No it wasn't known. It was suddenly popped up and played "Sweet Home Alabama"
FRICK, Prometheus had so much potential WHO GIVES A FRICK ABOUT ALIEN, just make it its own scifi movie with no fricking attachemtns to alien would be a great concept.
Wasted plot, untied strings, wasted a great soundtrack, wasted good actors
>FRICK, Prometheus had so much potential
Did it really though? I don't think it would have fared much better if it had jettisoned all the Alien connections.
Agree 100% about staying away from Alien. but "great concept"? Debatable. Even if it was its own thing it would still be a shit movie with shit characters and shit ideas.
The only salvageable thing is the synopsis, I guess, but it should have been a completely different movie made by different people.
They took a risk because they were desperate for it to be a new home. Just like landing on a planet that could have earthquakes or other dangerous natural phenomena in the first place.
To be fair those are only there because a ship with a biological weapon bombed the planet. Colonizing missions are somewhat routine at that point and that probably wouldn't be an idea any of them had heard about.
Ideally you would check the planet out in pressurized suits, bring back samples of alien life, and check to see how it reacts to terrestrial life before deciding to create a colony.
lets explore the alien planet with no equipment, not use our remote drones to scan and map it first, separate into small teams, touch and agitate alien flora and take it apl back to our ship whenwver possible. oh and lets abandon people in the alien buildings with no communication. also land our ship on planet instead of off world probes exploring first. and the robot ai we have? he can stay on the ship while we go out alone.
I mean after Prometheus is anyone surprised with the crews being moronic? >let's take our helmets off in an alien atmosphere, let's split up into small teams, let's bring mapping equipment so shitty the guy running them gets lost, lets smuggle drugs on planet, lets touch the alien technology, lets touch the black goo, lets stick electrodes in the alien head and blow it up, lets land our ship on the alien weapon factory, etc.
These people are so fricking moronic in these two films that it's amazing.
Scifi is about "what if..." and exploring what could happen if things go wrong, even for stupid reasons.
How were they supposed to know the head would explode? Why would they know how to search properly when they are just scientists with help? Why would their mapping stuff be super amazing and foolproof?
>Why would their mapping stuff be super amazing and foolproof?
Um, because it was brought by a billionaire who wanted top of the line for his once in a lifetime trip across the stars and used by a guy bragging how he was the top shit best in his field and gonna make so much money.
There are billionaires with mappers who are the best in the world also, but we still don't have perfect mapping apparatus that is foolproof and easy for one person to do.
>How were they supposed to know the head would explode?
Why would they stick electrodes in it in the first place, knowing nothing about their biology or what effect they might have?
>Why would they know how to search properly when they are just scientists with help?
Ironically, AvP (the film Prometheus largely ripped off) addressed this: scientists going into unknown or potentially hazardous areas have training in how to conduct themselves, including in searching and other potentially dangerous acts.
>Why would their mapping stuff be super amazing and foolproof?
Why would the rich mega-corp afford drones and an operator that don't get lost in 20 minutes in a location with linear pathways? Who can say?
>Humans in science do dumb shit all the time.
I would have been ok with this if they established that the crew was incompetent early on, but they didn't. In Prometheus, Weyland used top of the line hardware and paid handsomely for the best team they could put together. And then that team acted high inconsistently to play into the plot. It felt forced.
Ridley Scott did the right thing. He made a B movie out of the story and therefore freeing it from the constraints of the "But it's not believable!" crowd of idiots.
Scifi is about pushing the realms of believability with imagination, not sticking to known concepts and ways of doing things.
Ridley should have written a story about scientists doing stuff perfectly 100% of the time and nothing unexpected happens at all. What a great movie that would be OP.
You act like that's impossible? The best stories are when they are doing things perfectly and shit still goes wrong since it's outside their control. Maybe if Ridley had actually written compelling backgrounds and motivations for the Engineers the movie may have worked and been liked. But oops, he just said "they're really cool and have way awesome reasons beyond your understanding. Just like them, trust me!"
Even on Apollo 11 Neil and Buzz were put in quarantine for weeks just incase their were unknown pathogens despite it being extremely unlikely.
Just using common sense I would wear a suit going on a foreign planet that has atmospheric conditions comparable to earth. That means there is life there and who knows what kind of parasites or bacteria you could catch. Or some black spores that go into your face and turn into aliens.
>Even on Apollo 11 Neil and Buzz were put in quarantine for weeks just incase their were unknown pathogens despite it being extremely unlikely.
Well, the Nostromo's crew watched Kane get infected by an alien parasite with their own eyes and they didn't put him in quarantine.
Ash wanted the Alien on the ship and ignored Ripley who wanted him quarantined. Ash was the science officer so he had authority.
Are you moronic? Ripley didn't even want to allow him on the ship because she took quarantine so seriously. They had a strict 24 hour quarantine procedure but it was overruled by Ash, who they thought was their trustworthy medical officer who wanted what was best for all of them. Everyone was acting reasonable in that situation. Ash did what he did because of ulterior motives/programming, not because he went full moron like the people in Prometheus and Covenant.
They could've turned on Ash, if we apply the same logic that's being applied to the crew of Covenant we come to a conclusion that the characters in Alien are also moronic.
Are you moronic? Ripley didn't even want to allow him on the ship because she took quarantine so seriously. They had a strict 24 hour quarantine procedure but it was overruled by Ash, who they thought was their trustworthy medical officer who wanted what was best for all of them. Everyone was acting reasonable in that situation. Ash did what he did because of ulterior motives/programming, not because he went full moron like the people in Prometheus and Covenant.
He could have written a story where the scientists all act like smart people but their fancy tech gets fricked up by some form of space radiation or solar flare, causing their ships to malfunction or crash and the tech they rely on to stop working. Causing them to get lost without their fancy laser mapping tools and not able to use their fancy protective suits etc.
This would also serve as a helpful explanation why the tech isn't so shiny and filled with touchscreens and holograms in Alien and Aliens despite taking place many years after that: because humanity realised that their nice Earth tech gets fricked up in space and so they started building simpler stuff that could be shielded against the random radiation fields and you didn't risk having your bridge touchscreen stop functioning, stranding you.
The movie would have improved a ton if instead of incompetence, it was David sabotaging them from the start. Shooting a dart here and there, ambushing and knocking out one of them and taking his helmet off. It would have been better if they had been the victim of malicious intent and sabotage rather than just sheer stupidity from scientists that are qualified to travel across the stars. It would have made for a good first half and a good reveal as well.
The movie would have improved a ton if David were not in it. No one shares Ridley's obsession for gay androids that hate their creators. And having the android be le secretly evil is extremely played out. Audiences wanted a fricking good ancient alien story and got nothing of the sort.
>Alien Covenant
Why did these idiots explore a new planet without helmets on??
Alien: bunch of space truck drivers act smart from the moment they realise something's off but get fricked over by listening to the "educated" medical officer who's selling them out for company profit.
Aliens: educated corporate guy almost gets the surviving truck driver and a bunch of military grunts killed for company profit but they ultimately survive, in no small way thanks to the help of a little blue collar girl
Prometheus and Covenant: highly educated people, many who are leaders in their fields, get themselves killed by acting extremely moronic at every step of the way
Prometheus and Covenant obviously take place in a different timeline. The tech is filled with touch screens and holograms so even the experts are morons because they live in an infantilised world where the tech does everything, whereas in the OG movies even spacetruckers had to know how to input code.
Heh, the tiny alien always gets me. Why does it look so different to before? It's real comedy. >hello mah baby hello mah honey
If people were making fun of it when they were filming this clip didn't they realise we'd laugh at it too?
Because the movie is obviously set in 1600s with a space veneer. Nerds have no idea how to watch movies. >It's space so it must be le "science fiction" so where is muh science? Worst Alien Ever
They completely forget how the first movie similarly makes no sense as a future movie (because it's set in 1800s).
>Because the movie is obviously set in 1600s with a space veneer. Nerds have no idea how to watch movies.
Possibly the worst take I have ever seen about Alien. The original concept for the first movie was "Space truckers encounter an alien" with the idea of truckers being a concept since what, the 1960's? Space truckers has been the foundation for the series ever since.
Not alien, alien covenant. Alien as I said is 1800s because 'truckers' is just a way for american execs to understand the concept of merchant seamen. Go read any ten pages of 'The Black person of the Narcissus' or any Conrad novel (where 'Nostromo' comes from) and hear the sailors b***hing about bonus situation, equitable etc out the ass
I didn't know 19th century ships had self destruct protocols.
>people complain about the scientists and engineers acting stupid in Prometheus >Director double downs and makes everyone act even stupider in covenant
>scanning technology >can apparently scan for microorganisms
Oh wait it fricking can't because it's a spores that infect the guy that gets the back burster. All their scans could detect is that their was life on the planet and what the atmosphere was made of. Which is something we can do today from lightyears away.
If there is life then there's a high probability of pathogens. Viruses don't cross species easily but bacteria and parasites would still be a huge concern.
realistically how long would it take before people felt safe enough to take off their space suits whiles exploring after finding an earth-like life covered planet?
I think people would be paranoid of happening upon an alien pathogen for a very very long fricking time.
I wouldn't care about an alien pathogen, because I'd assume I was too alien for it to infect me. I'd be more worried about there being some plant whose pollen has the properties of asbestos, or there being some even worse kind of version of the Gympie Gympie tree. A random tree branch swats you on the cheek and now you've got nanofibres digging their way into your brain while releasing toxins for years, all because you removed your clear helmet.
We'd let the Australians take theirs off first. >Yeah, izz bad, but you get used to tha spore thingees ticklin' your lungs. A few dodgy coughs every hour and yer back on yer feet in two months. Three tops. She'll love ya, but ya gotta love her first -- and the tail that grows outta yer neck? Well, it's cute when it's not itchin.
The entire alien franchise hinges on characters making dumb decisions and this applies to Alien 1 and 2 which already stretch credibility too far for b-pictures. That's as far as I'm willing to go as far as logic is involved. Simply put, Alien 1 and 2 are already a step down as far as sci-fi fare goes but still they are well made.
>hinges on characters making dumb decisions and this applies to Alien 1 and 2
The hell it does. In Alien the regular people listen to their science officer, the only one with any kind of medical/science training, when he tells them it'll be fine with some extra precautions. He's also the one who convinces them to even check out the distress signal in the first place by saying they'll forfeit their paycheck if they don't, otherwise they'd probably made the smart decision to ignore it. He's not making a dumb decision but following company orders as an automaton that doesn't care about his own survival or that of the crew. The rest of the movie is the crew dealing with the alien as best they can with their knowledge. In Aliens the company is issuing orders for profit, the settler family that finds the eggs does make a kind of dumb decision but it's not the first time someone in desperate need of money risks their life with something they don't understand for the dream of a big payout. The only real dumb decision one of the soldiers makes is ignoring an order and bringing along ammunition that can pierce the reactor but even that was probably a smart decision because they might not have made it out if they hadn't. Outside of that it all goes to hell because they simply had no way of knowing the way the aliens would act because there wasn't a hive in Alien.
Alien certainly isn't your typical "characters make stupid decisions" horror movie, especially not when compared to stuff like petting an alien cobra.
Oh no nonononononono the alien that we encountered in part 1 couldn't possibly have a home planet and couldn't possibly be a species. No it just couldn't possibly happen. After all the advances in science and technology in the year this franchise is set in there is no possible way that there wouldn't be established science about encountering alien species and them having a whole planet full of their own kind. No no no let's ko prepare for contingencies after the centuries upon centuries of arrogant "humans are above gods" attitude that eventually cut them down to size - titanic, Hindenburg, concord explosion, multiple space disasters one which involves astronauts burning up in the shuttle, the thousands of tons of garbage floating above the Earth's atmosphere and all of this in just current year - no no no no lessons were learned from all these disasters involving science and technology. Imagine how many disasters will have happened in 500 years and how many more safety protocols would become standard procedure for space travel. Yea I'm thinking the writers don't know jack shit about writing let alone how to write sci-fi.
>Yea I'm thinking the writers don't know jack shit about writing let alone how to write sci-fi.
Thatìs only valid for the prequels, not for Alien and Aliens
Seethe harder homosexual. Even when I was a teenager I knew the whole space trucker schtick "I'm a kewl space trucker I'm too kewl to make sensible decisions" was stretching logic thin anyway. I gave it a pass because it was well made. The whole scene with Ripley refusing to allow Dallas and the team into the shuttle when Kane has the alien on his face was too dumb. Like if there's a manual override switch right there at the exit door, then Ripley's rant was pointless anyway. If the crew took protocol seriously then ash obviously broke the rules and the moment he opened the door he should have been switched off or locked up by Ripley and Dallas. But NoooooooooNooNooo let's allow ash to break more rules on an alien planet millions of miles from earth 500 years in the future where there's no fricking way some uneducated hillbillies with no common sense from a backwater shithole were given licence to pilot a complex spaceship with precise designs and tolerances, not fricking mention to even pilot that complex a spacecraft you have to multiple degrees and countless hours of training. WHY? You ask fricking why? Because you motherfricker there is no fricking way in motherfricking hell they ever allow hillbilly homosexuals to pilot a space craft in current world let alone allowing their smelly fricking hands anywhere near a highly engineered piece of equipment like the nostromo. If no one is allowing uneducated hillbillies anywhere near a spacecraft in current year it only leads to the conclusion that they will not be allowed to do that in 3000 AD or whenever the frick this franchise is set in. The more plausible thing would be programmed unmanned space crafts sent outside the solar system for such mining jobs. Not to mention the fricking wealth it takes to built one such spacecraft. The space truckers were the idea of hillbilly frickfaces masquerading as yuppie suits WALTER HILL and DAVID GILER.
Frick you and your worthless fricking facehugging shtick b***h.
>hinges on characters making dumb decisions and this applies to Alien 1 and 2
The hell it does. In Alien the regular people listen to their science officer, the only one with any kind of medical/science training, when he tells them it'll be fine with some extra precautions. He's also the one who convinces them to even check out the distress signal in the first place by saying they'll forfeit their paycheck if they don't, otherwise they'd probably made the smart decision to ignore it. He's not making a dumb decision but following company orders as an automaton that doesn't care about his own survival or that of the crew. The rest of the movie is the crew dealing with the alien as best they can with their knowledge. In Aliens the company is issuing orders for profit, the settler family that finds the eggs does make a kind of dumb decision but it's not the first time someone in desperate need of money risks their life with something they don't understand for the dream of a big payout. The only real dumb decision one of the soldiers makes is ignoring an order and bringing along ammunition that can pierce the reactor but even that was probably a smart decision because they might not have made it out if they hadn't. Outside of that it all goes to hell because they simply had no way of knowing the way the aliens would act because there wasn't a hive in Alien.
Alien certainly isn't your typical "characters make stupid decisions" horror movie, especially not when compared to stuff like petting an alien cobra.
Liking shitty nonsense that flounders and dies early into the second half doesn't make you an "Enlightened kinographer savant", it just makes you a moron with bad taste.
>Charlize Theron fricks Idris Elba in Prometheus >Literal BMWF shower scene in Covenant >Black horse fricks White horse as the stable guy runs in and tries to chase it off
The people that David dumped black goo on in Covenant were not Engineers, just another creation of them. They don't look like the Engineer from Prometheus.
In 2019, Free League released the Alien RPG, a tabletop game based in the Alien Universe, and Fox got franchise consultant Andrew Gaska to write it. It's considered canon by Fox, and stitches together the Alien canon into a cohesive story, and supplement to it reveal the cause of destruction of the Engineers.
If the concept art for the unmade prequel film is anything to go by, it would have involved a proto-hive and the protomorphs (Trilobite, Deacon, etc), which were created by beings that ended up being the Engineer's downfall. These beings are from the RPG, and end up being antagonists for one of the one shot scenarios, and the final bad guys for a campaign.
An ancient space faring civilization could have a lot of diversity. Maybe these are offshoots of the main Engineers that decided to eschew advanced tech millennia ago, like Space Amish.
So what?
And engineers don't look like Space Jockys, but here we are.
Ridley simply doesn't care and you are too invested in these badly made and badly conceived movies
The movie assumes 2 things from (you), the viewer.
A. That you know they are experts, so you assume they already took the correct precautions. Instead of filling the movie with useless and extensive exposition they assume you are smart enough to know better.
B. That you arent a redditard obsessed with le blohtols XD as your only metric of filmmaking
Seriously frick youtube critics and their obsession with plot and plotholes.
>They sent their probes in the novelization. >didn't find a city filled with dead people >didn't find killer pathogen that lives fricking everywhere
In the novelization does it explain that the probes were fricking worthless. >obsession with plot
You're literally moronic.
uhh because writing hard shut up shitlord you can't expect me to write a sensible way to get the drama on screen!
WE DEMAND A RAISE AND MORE RESIDUALS FRICK AI I MEAN WE SHOULD GET PAID FOR USING AI INSTEAD OF YOU USING AI FOR FREE
the lander they were in tells them before they open the door it did some sorta atmosphere check but honestly i think it was to make the crew seem more blue collar than the previous prometheus crew who were equipped with all the high tech gear
Nobody wears a hazmat suit when they go to equatorial jungle, but literally everything there can poison or infect you with something. And that's with knowing that there are various biohazards in those places that we have yet to discover. The local natives literally live there butt naked.
In that context, the idea that bold space colonisation pioneers are afraid to land on a planet that they scanned with a futuristic supercomputer is laughable and makes you look stupid.
They're terrible and the costuming is worst part of the movie. They look like dorky hunters you'd find out in the woods of arkansas right now, not futuristic colonists with scifi equipment you're expecting to see in a movie like this.
I liked the religious replacement captain after the original died. His story about meeting the devil when he was a boy should have been fleshed out more.
That fricking scene with newborn proto-aliens is like something straight from fricking Looney Tunes. They slip on the blood twice of three times then the woman blows the frick out of the ship while two aliens escape. I couldn't believe my eyes that the same guy who made Blade Runner and Alien did this shit.
Scott is an aesthetic man. If he doesn't have good material to work with, all we get is shiny poop. That said though, Prometheus and Covenant are both very aesthetic and can be enjoyed for that at least
Ridley didn't have any input in Alien beyond directing and he doesn't even understand BR, since he spent 20 years changing it while everyone else working on it called him moron
Why does Mother talk in the prequels but not the original?
because it's a reboot with much more advanced technology
>reboot
what are they rebooting? It was a prequel
Direct sequel to Prometheus
Because the director and studio think lowly of Alien fans and think that easily visible faces are needed to convey basic emotional information. It's also possible that the actor's contracts stipulated their faces be visible and the studio didn't care to fight them on it.
>covid cucks crying at the sight of a naked human face
>still making covid jokes
Literally Facebook boomer tier.
I'm not saying we should wear masks on earth or in a space ship, but you sure as shit should on an alien planet with alien life. What bothers me is that Prometheus essentially solved this problem with helmets that don't obscure any of the face, but they got rid of their helmets anyway.
Why did they need comically large name tags on their foreheads?
For the viewer. I suppose you could justify it by saying something like oh each suit was custom made for each person's body blah blah
It's because they're colonists on their way to a known good planet. The only space suits they have are the EVA ones.
They didn't know it was a good planet, and as a general rule you'd never want to breathe air where there could be unknown microbes. Oxygen content is not the only thing you need to check for.
The planet they were supposed to go to had been surveyed.
In Covenant? No, rewatch the movie. Classic rogue transmission investigation plot. Established around 25 minutes in.
The planet they were supposed to go to had been surveyed, the one they went to had not.
Yes. The logic follows that to even attempt a mission on an unscouted planet, you would need pressurized suits to prevent exactly what happened. It's sad because it would have been so easy to just have them wear the suits and have the infection take place one of any number of a million ways something could pierce the suit or get onto a suit for later infection. It's not unreasonable to assume that they would have some suits on a large vessel for some kind of emergency.
Or hell now that I think about it, even a throwaway line about how there's no biocontaminants in the air. "Scans show no aerosolized life forms". Would that have been so hard Scott god damnit
But they actually would have been fine if David hadn't bombed the planet with a one of a kind pathogen made by space gods. Maybe stepping down onto foreign stellar bodies is a common occurrence in that universe, and infection doesn't happen often if ever.
They knew there was life on the planet already. Trees means a reasonable threat of parasites or harmful microorganisms. And we also know that infection was of some concern to humans in this future because of the quarantine protocols often mentioned. In Alien, the only reason these protocols were disobeyed was because of the android plot betrayal twist, it was in that sense justified. In Prometheus and Covenant, not the case.
Space truckers comes from Ridley Scott's initial pitch. The fact that he based the ship name and some random quote from a book he read once is not relevant to the core concept. They are indeed truckers, blue collar workers taking care of 1980's retrofuturistic tech. Helmets are a part of the "space veneer".
>because they're colonists on their way to a known good planet
No it wasn't known. It was suddenly popped up and played "Sweet Home Alabama"
They were on their way to a different planet than the one shown in the film.
that's what i said
No, you said the Engineer planet the distress signal came from was the planet they were headed to. They had another planet in mind called Origae-6 which had been vetted, then they diverted to the Engineer planet.
>No it wasn't known. It was suddenly popped up and played "Sweet Home Alabama"
It was John Denver you zoomer homosexual.
FRICK, Prometheus had so much potential WHO GIVES A FRICK ABOUT ALIEN, just make it its own scifi movie with no fricking attachemtns to alien would be a great concept.
Wasted plot, untied strings, wasted a great soundtrack, wasted good actors
>FRICK, Prometheus had so much potential
Did it really though? I don't think it would have fared much better if it had jettisoned all the Alien connections.
It couldn't stand on it's own without wearing Alien as a skinsuit. Look how Raised by Wolves turned out.
Agree 100% about staying away from Alien. but "great concept"? Debatable. Even if it was its own thing it would still be a shit movie with shit characters and shit ideas.
The only salvageable thing is the synopsis, I guess, but it should have been a completely different movie made by different people.
Big mistake by Ridley to not acknowledge the brilliance of Aliens and turn Covenant into a similar action movie
>brilliance of Aliens
MUH SPACE VIETNAM/GIRLBOSS MOMMY FLICK
Wah wah
yes, and it's 100x better than prometheslop
>prometheslop
>implying Aliens isn't the biggest bowl of slop in the franchise until AVP came along
Because there's homosexuals,coalburners, dykes and redneck white trash among them.
They are moronic by default
Trained at the same space explorer college as the guys in Prometheus
Because the atmosphere was breathable.
You can also breathe inside the Chernobyl Reactor
You can measure radiation levels but how could they know about the spores?
>throw out monkey with no helmet on a really long rope
>check on him after a day
they don't have to know they just have to think it's a possibility
it could have alien spores floating around on it though which it did
They took a risk because they were desperate for it to be a new home. Just like landing on a planet that could have earthquakes or other dangerous natural phenomena in the first place.
To be fair those are only there because a ship with a biological weapon bombed the planet. Colonizing missions are somewhat routine at that point and that probably wouldn't be an idea any of them had heard about.
It could have anything. So could the ideal colony planet. Should they just stay in space and die?
What if it had other natural disasters?
Ideally you would check the planet out in pressurized suits, bring back samples of alien life, and check to see how it reacts to terrestrial life before deciding to create a colony.
They ran out of ideas and copied Futurama.
powerful gif
lets explore the alien planet with no equipment, not use our remote drones to scan and map it first, separate into small teams, touch and agitate alien flora and take it apl back to our ship whenwver possible. oh and lets abandon people in the alien buildings with no communication. also land our ship on planet instead of off world probes exploring first. and the robot ai we have? he can stay on the ship while we go out alone.
I mean after Prometheus is anyone surprised with the crews being moronic?
>let's take our helmets off in an alien atmosphere, let's split up into small teams, let's bring mapping equipment so shitty the guy running them gets lost, lets smuggle drugs on planet, lets touch the alien technology, lets touch the black goo, lets stick electrodes in the alien head and blow it up, lets land our ship on the alien weapon factory, etc.
These people are so fricking moronic in these two films that it's amazing.
Scifi is about "what if..." and exploring what could happen if things go wrong, even for stupid reasons.
How were they supposed to know the head would explode? Why would they know how to search properly when they are just scientists with help? Why would their mapping stuff be super amazing and foolproof?
Humans in science do dumb shit all the time.
>Why would their mapping stuff be super amazing and foolproof?
Um, because it was brought by a billionaire who wanted top of the line for his once in a lifetime trip across the stars and used by a guy bragging how he was the top shit best in his field and gonna make so much money.
There are billionaires with mappers who are the best in the world also, but we still don't have perfect mapping apparatus that is foolproof and easy for one person to do.
Bad excuse for poor writing
>How were they supposed to know the head would explode?
Why would they stick electrodes in it in the first place, knowing nothing about their biology or what effect they might have?
>Why would they know how to search properly when they are just scientists with help?
Ironically, AvP (the film Prometheus largely ripped off) addressed this: scientists going into unknown or potentially hazardous areas have training in how to conduct themselves, including in searching and other potentially dangerous acts.
>Why would their mapping stuff be super amazing and foolproof?
Why would the rich mega-corp afford drones and an operator that don't get lost in 20 minutes in a location with linear pathways? Who can say?
They'd just survived a massive fire and were on a planet that wasn't their intended target. I think they were not on top performance that day.
Different movie, anon. They were discussing Prometheus.
>Humans in science do dumb shit all the time.
I would have been ok with this if they established that the crew was incompetent early on, but they didn't. In Prometheus, Weyland used top of the line hardware and paid handsomely for the best team they could put together. And then that team acted high inconsistently to play into the plot. It felt forced.
there is a deleted scene where the android checks the air and everything is copacetic
>copacetic
The benefits of a classical education
>classical education
>Made-up American word
Trees
Why didn't they search for aliens in the air before setting up home
Ridley Scott did the right thing. He made a B movie out of the story and therefore freeing it from the constraints of the "But it's not believable!" crowd of idiots.
Scifi is about pushing the realms of believability with imagination, not sticking to known concepts and ways of doing things.
>they didn't have a pet monkey that they throw onto new planets to test if anything bad is there
makes no sense
Ridley should have written a story about scientists doing stuff perfectly 100% of the time and nothing unexpected happens at all. What a great movie that would be OP.
You act like that's impossible? The best stories are when they are doing things perfectly and shit still goes wrong since it's outside their control. Maybe if Ridley had actually written compelling backgrounds and motivations for the Engineers the movie may have worked and been liked. But oops, he just said "they're really cool and have way awesome reasons beyond your understanding. Just like them, trust me!"
Even on Apollo 11 Neil and Buzz were put in quarantine for weeks just incase their were unknown pathogens despite it being extremely unlikely.
Just using common sense I would wear a suit going on a foreign planet that has atmospheric conditions comparable to earth. That means there is life there and who knows what kind of parasites or bacteria you could catch. Or some black spores that go into your face and turn into aliens.
That was a first time mission to another world though, in Alien's world colonizing and space travel is standardized and relatively predictable.
>world
>moon
>Even on Apollo 11 Neil and Buzz were put in quarantine for weeks just incase their were unknown pathogens despite it being extremely unlikely.
Well, the Nostromo's crew watched Kane get infected by an alien parasite with their own eyes and they didn't put him in quarantine.
They did, but Ash broke it. Remind me, who/what does Ash turn out to be in the third act of the film?
They could've turned on Ash, if we apply the same logic that's being applied to the crew of Covenant we come to a conclusion that the characters in Alien are also moronic.
Ash wanted the Alien on the ship and ignored Ripley who wanted him quarantined. Ash was the science officer so he had authority.
Are you moronic? Ripley didn't even want to allow him on the ship because she took quarantine so seriously. They had a strict 24 hour quarantine procedure but it was overruled by Ash, who they thought was their trustworthy medical officer who wanted what was best for all of them. Everyone was acting reasonable in that situation. Ash did what he did because of ulterior motives/programming, not because he went full moron like the people in Prometheus and Covenant.
He could have written a story where the scientists all act like smart people but their fancy tech gets fricked up by some form of space radiation or solar flare, causing their ships to malfunction or crash and the tech they rely on to stop working. Causing them to get lost without their fancy laser mapping tools and not able to use their fancy protective suits etc.
This would also serve as a helpful explanation why the tech isn't so shiny and filled with touchscreens and holograms in Alien and Aliens despite taking place many years after that: because humanity realised that their nice Earth tech gets fricked up in space and so they started building simpler stuff that could be shielded against the random radiation fields and you didn't risk having your bridge touchscreen stop functioning, stranding you.
The movie would have improved a ton if instead of incompetence, it was David sabotaging them from the start. Shooting a dart here and there, ambushing and knocking out one of them and taking his helmet off. It would have been better if they had been the victim of malicious intent and sabotage rather than just sheer stupidity from scientists that are qualified to travel across the stars. It would have made for a good first half and a good reveal as well.
The movie would have improved a ton if David were not in it. No one shares Ridley's obsession for gay androids that hate their creators. And having the android be le secretly evil is extremely played out. Audiences wanted a fricking good ancient alien story and got nothing of the sort.
My head canon for why the go back to analog in Alien is there were major competency crisis and they couldn't maintain that level of tech.
you don't need any headcanon since prometheus is not canon to Alien
Like it or not, it is.
Every single plot development in Prometheus and Covenant relies on the characters acting inhumanly moronic
Alien: bunch of space truck drivers act smart from the moment they realise something's off but get fricked over by listening to the "educated" medical officer who's selling them out for company profit.
Aliens: educated corporate guy almost gets the surviving truck driver and a bunch of military grunts killed for company profit but they ultimately survive, in no small way thanks to the help of a little blue collar girl
Prometheus and Covenant: highly educated people, many who are leaders in their fields, get themselves killed by acting extremely moronic at every step of the way
Prometheus and Covenant obviously take place in a different timeline. The tech is filled with touch screens and holograms so even the experts are morons because they live in an infantilised world where the tech does everything, whereas in the OG movies even spacetruckers had to know how to input code.
This is called headcanon
>waah waah headcanon
It's just a joke about how the movies don't even fit into the Alien universe as prequels. No need to take it autismally serious.
>headcanon
>Alien: bunch of space truck drivers act smart
One of them puts his face on an alien egg lol
He looked at a mysterious object that attacked him and melted through his helmet, you mean
Everyone in prometheshit and coveshit are like that guy x10 all the times and without helmet
>Movie called Alien Covenant
>It has nothing to do with Halo
Shat myself right on the spot and awkwardly waddled out of the theater.
Heh, the tiny alien always gets me. Why does it look so different to before? It's real comedy.
>hello mah baby hello mah honey
If people were making fun of it when they were filming this clip didn't they realise we'd laugh at it too?
Because the movie is obviously set in 1600s with a space veneer. Nerds have no idea how to watch movies.
>It's space so it must be le "science fiction" so where is muh science? Worst Alien Ever
They completely forget how the first movie similarly makes no sense as a future movie (because it's set in 1800s).
I didn't know 19th century ships had self destruct protocols.
I bet there is a way to really frick up a nuclear reactor on a carrier that would essentially cause a self destruct.
I mean it's not 19th century but whatever. Adding a self destruct to a ship is dumb anyways.
>Because the movie is obviously set in 1600s with a space veneer. Nerds have no idea how to watch movies.
Possibly the worst take I have ever seen about Alien. The original concept for the first movie was "Space truckers encounter an alien" with the idea of truckers being a concept since what, the 1960's? Space truckers has been the foundation for the series ever since.
Not alien, alien covenant. Alien as I said is 1800s because 'truckers' is just a way for american execs to understand the concept of merchant seamen. Go read any ten pages of 'The Black person of the Narcissus' or any Conrad novel (where 'Nostromo' comes from) and hear the sailors b***hing about bonus situation, equitable etc out the ass
what a dunce you are to have actually posted that
>people complain about the scientists and engineers acting stupid in Prometheus
>Director double downs and makes everyone act even stupider in covenant
>People think my last movie was shit so I'll make an even worse one so it looks better by comparison!
Ridley Scott knows that his name sells no matter what, so why would he give a shit?
I can't understand how he's stil la selling point
sniff
sniff
huff
huff
Seems okay
Because all of their scanning technology told them it was safe and this was explicitly stated multiple times.
>scanning technology
>can apparently scan for microorganisms
Oh wait it fricking can't because it's a spores that infect the guy that gets the back burster. All their scans could detect is that their was life on the planet and what the atmosphere was made of. Which is something we can do today from lightyears away.
If there is life then there's a high probability of pathogens. Viruses don't cross species easily but bacteria and parasites would still be a huge concern.
realistically how long would it take before people felt safe enough to take off their space suits whiles exploring after finding an earth-like life covered planet?
I think people would be paranoid of happening upon an alien pathogen for a very very long fricking time.
One guy would probably volunteer and they would study him for a while.
I wouldn't care about an alien pathogen, because I'd assume I was too alien for it to infect me. I'd be more worried about there being some plant whose pollen has the properties of asbestos, or there being some even worse kind of version of the Gympie Gympie tree. A random tree branch swats you on the cheek and now you've got nanofibres digging their way into your brain while releasing toxins for years, all because you removed your clear helmet.
>we happened upon the prion planet.
Prometheus does a good job with this.
We'd let the Australians take theirs off first.
>Yeah, izz bad, but you get used to tha spore thingees ticklin' your lungs. A few dodgy coughs every hour and yer back on yer feet in two months. Three tops. She'll love ya, but ya gotta love her first -- and the tail that grows outta yer neck? Well, it's cute when it's not itchin.
They all wanted to be like Flash Gordon when they grew up.
The entire alien franchise hinges on characters making dumb decisions and this applies to Alien 1 and 2 which already stretch credibility too far for b-pictures. That's as far as I'm willing to go as far as logic is involved. Simply put, Alien 1 and 2 are already a step down as far as sci-fi fare goes but still they are well made.
>hinges on characters making dumb decisions and this applies to Alien 1 and 2
The hell it does. In Alien the regular people listen to their science officer, the only one with any kind of medical/science training, when he tells them it'll be fine with some extra precautions. He's also the one who convinces them to even check out the distress signal in the first place by saying they'll forfeit their paycheck if they don't, otherwise they'd probably made the smart decision to ignore it. He's not making a dumb decision but following company orders as an automaton that doesn't care about his own survival or that of the crew. The rest of the movie is the crew dealing with the alien as best they can with their knowledge. In Aliens the company is issuing orders for profit, the settler family that finds the eggs does make a kind of dumb decision but it's not the first time someone in desperate need of money risks their life with something they don't understand for the dream of a big payout. The only real dumb decision one of the soldiers makes is ignoring an order and bringing along ammunition that can pierce the reactor but even that was probably a smart decision because they might not have made it out if they hadn't. Outside of that it all goes to hell because they simply had no way of knowing the way the aliens would act because there wasn't a hive in Alien.
Alien certainly isn't your typical "characters make stupid decisions" horror movie, especially not when compared to stuff like petting an alien cobra.
Oh no nonononononono the alien that we encountered in part 1 couldn't possibly have a home planet and couldn't possibly be a species. No it just couldn't possibly happen. After all the advances in science and technology in the year this franchise is set in there is no possible way that there wouldn't be established science about encountering alien species and them having a whole planet full of their own kind. No no no let's ko prepare for contingencies after the centuries upon centuries of arrogant "humans are above gods" attitude that eventually cut them down to size - titanic, Hindenburg, concord explosion, multiple space disasters one which involves astronauts burning up in the shuttle, the thousands of tons of garbage floating above the Earth's atmosphere and all of this in just current year - no no no no lessons were learned from all these disasters involving science and technology. Imagine how many disasters will have happened in 500 years and how many more safety protocols would become standard procedure for space travel. Yea I'm thinking the writers don't know jack shit about writing let alone how to write sci-fi.
>Yea I'm thinking the writers don't know jack shit about writing let alone how to write sci-fi.
Thatìs only valid for the prequels, not for Alien and Aliens
Seethe harder homosexual. Even when I was a teenager I knew the whole space trucker schtick "I'm a kewl space trucker I'm too kewl to make sensible decisions" was stretching logic thin anyway. I gave it a pass because it was well made. The whole scene with Ripley refusing to allow Dallas and the team into the shuttle when Kane has the alien on his face was too dumb. Like if there's a manual override switch right there at the exit door, then Ripley's rant was pointless anyway. If the crew took protocol seriously then ash obviously broke the rules and the moment he opened the door he should have been switched off or locked up by Ripley and Dallas. But NoooooooooNooNooo let's allow ash to break more rules on an alien planet millions of miles from earth 500 years in the future where there's no fricking way some uneducated hillbillies with no common sense from a backwater shithole were given licence to pilot a complex spaceship with precise designs and tolerances, not fricking mention to even pilot that complex a spacecraft you have to multiple degrees and countless hours of training. WHY? You ask fricking why? Because you motherfricker there is no fricking way in motherfricking hell they ever allow hillbilly homosexuals to pilot a space craft in current world let alone allowing their smelly fricking hands anywhere near a highly engineered piece of equipment like the nostromo. If no one is allowing uneducated hillbillies anywhere near a spacecraft in current year it only leads to the conclusion that they will not be allowed to do that in 3000 AD or whenever the frick this franchise is set in. The more plausible thing would be programmed unmanned space crafts sent outside the solar system for such mining jobs. Not to mention the fricking wealth it takes to built one such spacecraft. The space truckers were the idea of hillbilly frickfaces masquerading as yuppie suits WALTER HILL and DAVID GILER.
Frick you and your worthless fricking facehugging shtick b***h.
Meant for this
>he should have been switched off
they didn't know he was an android at this point
Seethe more, capeshitter
This movie was so bad it almost seemed purposeful & vindictive. Was it?
>all these people filtered by Prometheus
Liking shitty nonsense that flounders and dies early into the second half doesn't make you an "Enlightened kinographer savant", it just makes you a moron with bad taste.
>Engineers
>Smartest people in the galaxy
>All are white
What did Ridley mean by this?
>blue
>white
I mean, what?
>blue
ummm anon
>Charlize Theron fricks Idris Elba in Prometheus
>Literal BMWF shower scene in Covenant
>Black horse fricks White horse as the stable guy runs in and tries to chase it off
What did Ridley mean by this
He didn't mean anything it was mandated by esg
i wasnt filtered, I understood what was going on. it was just a sloppy and rushed film. its better with deleted scenes but thats not saying much
>from the unmade Alien prequel
A sequel to Covenant? Wasn't David the cause of their death?
The people that David dumped black goo on in Covenant were not Engineers, just another creation of them. They don't look like the Engineer from Prometheus.
In 2019, Free League released the Alien RPG, a tabletop game based in the Alien Universe, and Fox got franchise consultant Andrew Gaska to write it. It's considered canon by Fox, and stitches together the Alien canon into a cohesive story, and supplement to it reveal the cause of destruction of the Engineers.
If the concept art for the unmade prequel film is anything to go by, it would have involved a proto-hive and the protomorphs (Trilobite, Deacon, etc), which were created by beings that ended up being the Engineer's downfall. These beings are from the RPG, and end up being antagonists for one of the one shot scenarios, and the final bad guys for a campaign.
Ridley calls them Engineers, maybe it was just one of their cities. Or maybe they simply ignored him and retconned it.
An ancient space faring civilization could have a lot of diversity. Maybe these are offshoots of the main Engineers that decided to eschew advanced tech millennia ago, like Space Amish.
So what?
And engineers don't look like Space Jockys, but here we are.
Ridley simply doesn't care and you are too invested in these badly made and badly conceived movies
They sent their probes in the novelization.
The movie assumes 2 things from (you), the viewer.
A. That you know they are experts, so you assume they already took the correct precautions. Instead of filling the movie with useless and extensive exposition they assume you are smart enough to know better.
B. That you arent a redditard obsessed with le blohtols XD as your only metric of filmmaking
Seriously frick youtube critics and their obsession with plot and plotholes.
>They sent their probes in the novelization.
>didn't find a city filled with dead people
>didn't find killer pathogen that lives fricking everywhere
In the novelization does it explain that the probes were fricking worthless.
>obsession with plot
You're literally moronic.
Yes, the novelization implies the probes arent magical.
uhh because writing hard shut up shitlord you can't expect me to write a sensible way to get the drama on screen!
WE DEMAND A RAISE AND MORE RESIDUALS FRICK AI I MEAN WE SHOULD GET PAID FOR USING AI INSTEAD OF YOU USING AI FOR FREE
the lander they were in tells them before they open the door it did some sorta atmosphere check but honestly i think it was to make the crew seem more blue collar than the previous prometheus crew who were equipped with all the high tech gear
Nobody wears a hazmat suit when they go to equatorial jungle, but literally everything there can poison or infect you with something. And that's with knowing that there are various biohazards in those places that we have yet to discover. The local natives literally live there butt naked.
In that context, the idea that bold space colonisation pioneers are afraid to land on a planet that they scanned with a futuristic supercomputer is laughable and makes you look stupid.
As awful a film as Covenant is I love those outfits
Production design for Covenant was good. It actually sort of looks like a Alien film and not a reboot of some 60's scifi show.
They're terrible and the costuming is worst part of the movie. They look like dorky hunters you'd find out in the woods of arkansas right now, not futuristic colonists with scifi equipment you're expecting to see in a movie like this.
>durr it doesn't look muh grungy space trucker Alien enough!
>hurr why don't they look more futuristic!
Can't win with these homosexuals.
Apologist cuck
You opinion is just wrong, apologist
Why didn't Scott adapt Aliens: Apocalypse - The Destroying Angels?
Probably some sense of misplaced pride. "I don't want to adapt I want to make something original" and then proceeds to go with a garbage script
None of this happened. Because it is a movie and it was written that way.
I liked the religious replacement captain after the original died. His story about meeting the devil when he was a boy should have been fleshed out more.
earth is much more dangerous bc if you go cave diving and end up in one of those air bubbles you can die in one inhalation or about 4 seconds.
I would gladly birth a hundred xenos before I accepted a nutty putty death
Agreed
That fricking scene with newborn proto-aliens is like something straight from fricking Looney Tunes. They slip on the blood twice of three times then the woman blows the frick out of the ship while two aliens escape. I couldn't believe my eyes that the same guy who made Blade Runner and Alien did this shit.
Scott is an aesthetic man. If he doesn't have good material to work with, all we get is shiny poop. That said though, Prometheus and Covenant are both very aesthetic and can be enjoyed for that at least
>slipping on blood is bad because....BECAUSE I SAY SO ALRIGHT
Ridley didn't have any input in Alien beyond directing and he doesn't even understand BR, since he spent 20 years changing it while everyone else working on it called him moron
Why did they do the same in Aliens?
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because they read the script
if they'd read the script they would have taken their helmets off earlier, in the cold vacuum of space.
>Why did these idiots explore a new planet without helmets on??
presumably they did an atmosphere read out from orbit before they landed
Which wouldn'd show shit, beyond generic composition.
Is this star trek?
Did the SG teams in Stargate: Universe have helmets when they went exploring new worlds?
Covenant was better than Prometheus, but damn they're both flawed