All in all, was he a good villain?
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All in all, was he a good villain?
All in all, was he a good villain?
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he started off strong but got worse as the series went on
he was immensely boring
theres a reason horse show only used discord as the main baddie once
reason being
he will destroy bill in the coming death battle
Not really.
He was funny in how he was written, but as a villain, kind of lame.
His original storyboarded introduction was also way better than what we ultimately got.
what was that?
He was interesting, but kinds OP for someone that was expected to menace some small children.
First apperence-wise, he never felt like was supposed to be the endgame villain, more like a reoccuring antagonist. Did this just get changed later down the road becauce Alex couldn't think of a good final villain?
he was always supposed to be the S2 villain, there was just supposed to be one more season after that.
He was definitely always meant to be the ultimate villain, mainly because in the whole show before Weirdmageddon he was always told to be in a dimension that he couldn't escape. It was kinda obvious that for the finale he would somehow escape.
I hate how his design was cool but by the end they couldn't even draw a triangle with a top hat well. Why did he look so cutesy and moronic in the finale.
He was alright but the finale makes a strong case for why he doesn't make a good MAIN villain. Bill Cipher just doesn't have enough motivation beyond 'hurr hurr I'm in the real world now time to take over the world for a fratboy party', which isn't a particularly compelling motivation for a main villain. It also doesn't help that Bill hard falls into the category of characters that were just more interesting as a mystery.
I don't necessarily know who could have been a better endgame villain but Bill worked way better as a third party who sometimes threw his chips on the table.
yeah I noticed this when rewatching GF a while back, Bill looks progressively less cool as the show goes on. No goddamn idea why.
>No goddamn idea why.
That's your brain getting use to him, he became ordinary.
I hate it when this stuff happens. It happened to the lich too. The dudes design was far more detailed and stood out so much more because of it. He was always super eerie in his first appearance.
The Lich changed?
It's because he turned 3D upon entering the dimension. I suppose that also gave his appearance more 'character'.
They drew him normally at various times during Weirdmageddon. I think it was more of a storyboarder style issue whenever he looked moronic.
Well, he only looked 'moronic' because he was making an expression of fear. And the only thing he has that could make an expression was his eye, the only human thing on him. It would be pretty moronic if Bill you could hear the panicking in his voice in that scene and he were making that neutral expression with his eye. Beyond that I didn't see any difference or change in art style between S1 and S2.
His proportions were shit. He looked a lot more stubby and weird.
As evidenced towards his defeat scene they can still draw him panicking without making the eye a solid circle. It's way more impactful and sinister when it's got that warped curve effect. Considering this was specifically animated by one of the artists on the show I'm still going to assume a different storyboarder made him look stupid before this bit.
What's wrong with the way he looks here? I don't see it.
He was pretty two dimensional, honestly.
Carlos!
You cheeky frick.
I always though he was just set up for a bigger villain
Yes, Cinemaphile is just full of contrarians
Started strong, ended weak.
Like everyone says, he worked a lot better as a mystery. Also when his powers were restricted. Once he was omnipotent, he had to be a total idiot to be defeated. His motivation was some generic take over/destroy everything for no particularly interesting reason and as soon as he came to the real world he just sat around and did nothing.
Either they could do the mysterious third party maybe neutral trickster route. Or if he was the main villain, he shouldn't have gotten that far, or had his motives revealed. His big defeat should have been before he crossed over and what he wanted left at least somewhat mysterious for the creepiness factor. He also had to seem more clever when he had no powers or rather limited powers and had to rely or manipulation.
He was a much better villain in Sock Opera than Weirdmageddon.
I agree with a lot of this though I think he was better in Dreamscapers than he was in Sock Opera. Really just a lot of little tiny tears starting to show in Sock Opera imo.
Anyways we got a lot of people here saying he shouldn't have been the main big bad, anyone got any thoughts on what would've worked better instead? I agree entirely but at the same time they kind of left a gap after Lil Gideon got kicked down for an entire season. And as much as I like Lil Gideon, I'm not sure if he would've made a good true final antagonist either.
Sock Opera was where Bill started to slip as even back then his motives didn't add up. Why does Bill care whether or not Dipper discovers the journal's secrets or the author's identity? And what was he planning to do with Dipper's body, there's no way he could've started the portal up on his own like that.
What bugged me the most in it was that Bill Cipher, this apparently ancient demon creature who is later shown to have regularly possessed a human body, somehow didn't see it coming that a human body would eventually get exhausted. Season 2 in general just feels like they were writing it on the fly and made episodes that outright contradicted each other like that all the time.
I actually like that better, GF doesn't necessarily feel like a show that needed some big head honcho baddie. Hell considering that Gravity Falls is a supernatural hotspot, the whole Weirdmaggeon thing could've just been an inevitable result of that.
Can't think of a specific main bad that's not just some made up new character.
I think maybe not having a villain, but instead a major apocalyptic unnatural disaster that would consume Gravity Falls might be better. Yeah it's just a save the world plot, but you don't have to limit it to just one guy wanting more power
Ford should've been the main villain of the series
How would that even work?
Pretty simply actually, you don't even have to make him straight up evil just lean into the idea of him somebody who values his research of the unknown above all else. Perhaps he inadvertently causes Weirdmageddon after ignoring Stan's advice to shut the portal down for good. There's already traces of this characterization during Tale of Two Stans where he refuses to destroy the portal or the journals needed to unlock it. It'd make him being a dick to Stan easier to swallow as well as making Mabel's objections to Dipper following in Ford's footsteps a lot more justified.
>Mabel's objections to Dipper following in Ford's footsteps a lot more justified.
Nah. You'd have to change Mabel's reasons altogether for her not wanting him to go to Ford for it to work. It'll just come off as a selfish person not wanting not lose her main victim to another selfish person.
I think with the inevitable demise of Gravity Falls and/or the world being the problem and maybe Bill as the driving force it could have been neat. Gravity Falls being a magnet for the weird would be no coincidence, they could reveal its because of some sort of vast spectral energy that all weirdness thrives off of having been there for centuries. Sort of like a Silent Hill deal, where the general area just exhumes supernatural energy for no particular reason. Everything is stable up until the moment Stanford opened the first portal, after which the energy begins to accumulate in greater amounts resulting in the appearance of characters like Bill and his buddies as well as Time Baby showing up to stake their interests. Gravity Falls is approaching critical mass and will be fully enveloped in "weird energy," causing the entire town to collapse into an alternate dimension where Bill's ilk are common, and slowly pulling the rest of the world in with it like a sandpit. Bill being a seedy little twat, could be an agitator to the event simply because he wants to be a hectic twerp. What he would ultimately seek to do is harness the vast amount of energy in Gravity Falls to become omnipotent and transcend reality, as would most other "weird" creatures. Weirdmageddon could be changed to an all out fight between a ton of monsters seeking to use the energy for themselves, and the townsfolk trying to revert the crisis and save their world. Bill could come out on top through his scheming and cunning, and would be on the cusp of godhood before being cut short by the Pines twins and Stan. The town is brought back to Earth, the portal closes, and Standford finds a way to forever cut off all of the weird energy for good, thus making Gravity Falls a "normal" town.
Mabel should've been the main villain of the series
In the show he was referred to as a 'god of chaos' by someone. He even stated to Stanford when he shackled him that his intention was to have an eternal party with an eternal host (Bill).
>He was a much better villain in Sock Opera than Weirdmageddon.
If you think that he was better because he was less dumb, he was also a bit dumb in Sock Opera in that he didn't know how much less physical strength he had in the body of a sleep-deprived 12 year old who he only self-mutilated as time in his body went on. Doesn't sound smart to me.
Started out strong but as many others have said got worse as the show trailed on. Although he did consistently bring a lot of much needed energy/imagination to the animation. Gravity Falls always kept things a lil too orderly and on-model when it came to the expressions actions, and distortions on the human characters.
One last thing about the portal which bugs me, we spent an entire season and a half hyping this interdimensional gateway up and we never actually see where it leads. Bill doesn't even use it to enter the mortal dimension
I hated his voice acting and how he needed to constantly shout every line that progressively got worse and worse
You can thank Alex for that
I'm *POSITIVE* Alex has said that Bill wasn't supposed to be the big bad and there was something even bigger in play, as if Bill was just the boss of the first season, but the way he ended the series made him just use Bill. But I can't find it anywhere.
I remember hearing this, but not where.
Well, I heard that VERY early Bill was just a running joke character that showed up in Dipper's dreams spouting conspiracy theories. Maybe either with no relevance but a gag or maybe sometimes one of his gibberings would be a real clue.
Because I also feel like I've heard that once they got out of this brainstorming phase, Bill was always meant to be the main villain. Maybe that really early drafting is the confusion and also why the character is kind of off.
No.
>he started out strong
He did not, he was the exact same cringy evil Spongebob in his first appearance
he never felt like he was supposed to be a final boss
I was scared shitless of him so yes he was a good villain
lol homosexual
homie its 2012 the jay z illuminati conspiracies are at their peak im like 10 years old and the main villain of the cartoon I watch the most besides Phineas and Ferb is a triangle with an eye. Of course I would be scared. Re-watching this, all the shit I used to consider mysterious and creepy are just silly now
Ps. Man I miss those jayz hello kitty conspiracy theory days, good times
have a nice day
You had no childhood lil bro I feel bad for you
How old are you, anon? Serious question.
My childhood horror was Extreme Ghostbusters
By the time I watched GF, nothing about it was even mildly scary to me.
If someone was 10 in 2012, how old are they in 2023? You lazy moron
He was basically Alex screaming "SCREW YOU DAD IM NOT GOING TO DO MY HOMEWORK OR CLEAN MY ROOM" while shitting in a trashcan and stabbing his co-workers with an x-acto knife.
His plan to turn everyone on Earth (or even just Gravity Falls) into gold statues seems to have not been particularly well thought out considering he needs to constantly refresh the debuff on people he has turned.
you can't make a almost omnipotent character a villain because he's forced to fail, they should have gone with Mr. Mxy route and make Bill have his own game rules
Why are showrunners so afraid of just having a simple, fun, recurring villain that never change their evil ways or am I the only one noticing this?
Where is Alex Hirsch nowadays?
He’s M.I.A. A lot of people are concerned for his well-being.
Probably just sick of the internet. I don't blame him
Veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrry big cohencidence of him, to disappear from the internet right after his pedo buddy Justin got caught....
Cinemaphile is for users over 18, sport.
>Covering for pedophiles
moron
Roiland didn't have the Get Outta Hell israelite Card like Harmon did. Harmon did the same shit and was even worse to his wife while gettimg a barely legal replacement after his divorce. Hirsch is hiding because the tribe will sacrifice him to take flak away from one of their useful idiots like Spacey or in-house putzes like Jonah Hill.
This show needed a third season. It just wrapped up and amped up too fast at the end. Alex talked about other episodes he wanted to make but he just sounded whiny and like he was too done to continue.
I remember thinking the whole ending with Bill was way too much and it'd be better if he kept tormenting Dipper alone up until the very end. Wendy ended up being lackluster and her ending felt rushed. She's a remarkable boring character for Gravity Falls, where everyone has secrets. Robbie was definitely being set up to be more than he was, the teens in general could've been expanded on. I really wish I could've seen that Mabel Labyrinth themed episode more than anything.
Sure
Why the frick did people dickride this piece of shit so much anyway? He was fricking annoying and unfunny. Every time I hear morons talking how "scary" he was, I want to bash their skulls in with a clawhammer.
t. Grunkle Stan
Nah, he was great for hype, but his actual tenure as the main villain was pretty shit.