Comics for children sell.
Comics for manchildren don't sell.
As long as Marvel and DC remain stagnant, you'll see Cinemaphile complaining that comics don't sell.
>If Marvel doesn't do anything about this they'll start losing money on their comics.
Don't worry, all they have to do is kill some A-list capeshitter to bait fanboys and bring whoever back a year later. Problem solved!
Comics are nothing but an IP farm for Disney and Warner Bros now. They can fail forever and Spider-Man, Batman etc are still going to exist since they can make more cartoons of them forever.
Weirdly, the few and far between non capeshit comics that do come out of America tend to turn into pretty successful movie/tv IPs as well. While publishers still never want to give them a chance or move past publishing more and more capeshit. You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
They are already losing money on comics. For decades marvels been publishing Captain Marvel at a loss just to keep the copyright for the name away from DC, now they just do that but with every title
Marvel doesn't give a shit dude, they're a multi-billion dollar corporations that has way too much money and can fund whatever they want. They will instead give the license to Japanese artists to make manga or new stories and sell them in America AND Japan.
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's embarrassing though, Marvel comics of the past are inspiring most popular movies of our times right now, yet the modern comics are so bad they fail to ride the wave of popularity at all. Like think about it, this is the most popular characters such as Iron Man, Captain America or Ant Man have ever been, and they still can't sell the comics for shit.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Like think about it, this is the most popular characters such as Iron Man, Captain America or Ant Man have ever been, and they still can't sell the comics for shit.
Because kids see Chris Evans and Robert Downey Jr. doing all this crazy CGI shit, and then they go read the comic but don't understand what the frick is going on, stories and art are handled by different people every week or so, and their depictions don't look like Hollywood actors. They would need to redo the whole current structure, but in Marvel's mind, why bother? They could use comics as a niche and bring all the big bucks from their Hollywood and gaming investments. Shit like Spider-Man on Playstation is fricking massive and has done much more to bring Spider-Man to modern audiences than comics ever will. This is just our reality, anon.
>Manga has outsold American comics in every other country, but it's just in the last few years it has begun to devour the American market
Bruh, the writing's been on the wall for comics since The Electric Tale of Pikachu.
>At the time of its release Issue #1 was the best-selling manga issue, and best-selling comic book of any type, in the United States.[1] The issue sold 1.001 million copies, the highest for a single comic book since 1993.[2] The first volume, The Electric Tale of Pikachu!, was released on September 5, 1999.
Also, reminder >Toshihiro Ono (小野 敏洋, Ono Toshihiro) is a Japanese manga artist and graphic novelist. He was born in Aichi, Japan. >He is best known for the Pokémon manga based on the animation series: "The Electric Tale of Pikachu" published by Viz Media (known as Dengeki Pikachu and published by Shogakukan in Japan). He also illustrated the first two volumes of the manga adaption of the Crest of the Stars trilogy, and draws hentai under the pen name of Kamirenjaku Sanpei.[1]
I remember I wanted to make Basement order for MCU, like
>1. Captain Marvel: it introduces Nick Fury, Coulson, aliens >2. Doctor Strange: it introduces Dr. Strange (will pay off in a BIG WAY in Winter Soldier) and magic into Marvel universe and concept of Infinity Stones while feeling adjacent >3. Avengers: it introduces the main cast and Thanos as the big threat, keeps viewer engaged by mysterious characters who they will learn about later
People like to complain, and there's a lot to complain about capeshit nowadays. Also, i think maybe many here have grown reading that stuff, so they feel the shock of the modern changes the most.
2 years ago
Anonymous
so where the FRICK do people talk about CURRENT comic
and you better not fricking say twitter
2 years ago
Anonymous
Honestly, i have no clue. Twitter isn't really a place for any human being with a soul, i don't think anyone has serious or civilizaed discussions about comics or anything in there.
What's the alternative then? I'd guess either here or leddit.
2 years ago
Anonymous
c'mon there mist be at least ONE place i can leave this shithole for
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's a pick your poison situation, aheuah. I like it here sometimes, it's nice to vent and complain. You can also legit discuss stuff, as long as you offer good evidence to support your opinions, and you're prepared for the fact that there will be people there just to take a piss outta you
This isn't true insomuch that the shit that sells is godawful Weekly Shonen Jump battle shonen and garbage like Attack on Titan. It's because that stuff has more "hype" for morons and is better than cape comics at stringing readers along with its plot twists.
The actual good manga isn't what's selling.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>The actual good manga
Do tell what this is.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Holy Grail of Eris, Hiraiyasumi, Liar Satsuki Can See Death, lots of stuff.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Literally who
2 years ago
Anonymous
There's a world beyond Weekly Shonen Jump and Redditcore stuff, anon.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Pretending to like obscure things does not make you sophisticated or interesting
2 years ago
Anonymous
I wish manga were selling more and more because of how much more diverse it is as a medium but it's closer to what you say.
You're still wrong though. Manga sells a bunch because it's much more unabashed children's action / adventure fare than the current state of western comics. That's it. Give it some credit for having a lot less derivations from formula.
I don't like shit like BHA but at least I can take a step back and say 'well at least it is what it says it is on the tin'.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I wonder how much of manga's success and "hype" can be attributed to s weekly release schedule instead of a monthly one? Feels like some Scheherazade shit where every week is a new cliffhanger and people are motivated to keep reading, even for shitty stories
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I wonder how much of manga's success and "hype" can be attributed to s weekly release schedule instead of a monthly one?
A lot of manga are also monthly, so...
2 years ago
Anonymous
Yes but it's usually been WSJ stuff that contributes the most to sales, not Jojolion or whatever
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Yes but it's usually been WSJ stuff that contributes the most to sales
You'd be surprised, quite a few of the bestsellers in America are monthly series.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Why is Toilet Bound Hanako-kun such a blowout success all of the sudden? Saw volumes on Target shelves recently
2 years ago
Anonymous
I think it got big around the time it got an anime back in 2019 or 2020.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>not only is Noragami still ongoing, but still manages to hang onto the chart
It’s shocking it’s never got another season of the anime
2 years ago
Boco
Wow, the modern manga industry is such shit.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Shut the frick up Boco, you moronic waste of human flesh.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Most of those have popular anime which is where the sales come from as anime is basically intended to advertise the manga and in fact some manga have been axed (usually in WSJ) because the anime adaptations didn't provide enough of a sales bump.
At least three series I'm actively reading are getting adaptations next year (Kimi wa Houkago Insomnia, Skip and Loafer and Ippon Again) and I can see Insomnia and Skip and Loafer getting huge boosts so long as the adaptations aren't shit. Summer Time Rendering would probably be pretty damn popular if it was on Crunchyroll instead of Disney+ jail.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>some manga have been axed (usually in WSJ) because the anime adaptations didn't provide enough of a sales bump.
normally is mangas that were alredy bleeding sales and the anime was a last ditch effort to safe it
2 years ago
Anonymous
What's selling in comic world? Does the top ten include five Batman spin-offs?
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's historically much less of a social stigma to read manga in public in Japan than it is to read comics in the US. Especially previous decades before superhero stuff or stereotypically nerdy things became mainstream. A grown man reading Spider-Man on the subway in the 90s was not really a thing that happened as much as a grown man reading a manga on the train to work at the same time period.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I don't think that has much impact on manga's success specifically in America.
Good format and fairly cheap. Plus it’s black and white which makes copying the art work easier (if you’re a kid who wants to be an artist it’s easier to copy manga)
Manga being cheaper certainly factor in, but mainly because there's nothing in western comics being published today that anyone wants to actually read.
The whole direct market comic market is propped up by collectors and variant cover speculation, and it's dying.
I think one of the biggest problems with American comics is distribution. Manga would be far less popular if it was sold the way American comics are- you can't just walk into a barnes and noble and pick up the newest comic book like you can manga, you have to find a dedicated comic store and ask for the wafer-thin 15 page toilet paper book just to read it.
This anon is sort of right, manga doesn't have better stories but it has more diverse stories instead of capeshit. When an American comic that isn't about superheroes somehow actually gets published it usually becomes a cultural touchstone because we're so starved for them
2 years ago
Anonymous
>you can't just walk into a barnes and noble and pick up the newest comic book like you can manga
Yes you can.
2 years ago
Anonymous
where do you live? i've never seen them before in my life
2 years ago
Anonymous
Maybe you're just a moron.
2 years ago
Anonymous
You can get a trade maybe, but not floppy
2 years ago
Anonymous
Who the frick would ever want to buy a floppy? You can buy collected editions of manga or collected editions of comics.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Manga would be far less popular if it was sold the way American comics are-
Most manga is purchased through digital distribution in the west as are comics
2 years ago
Anonymous
Everything is digital though. Are book stores still popular?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Book stores are somewhat popular, most sales are likely still physical since plenty of people just order their physical copies online.
Streaming provided a huge anime boom and easy access to content, that growth obviously spills over into manga because in most cases it's directly adapted.
Since capeshit in convoluted extended universes basically are the US market, all it needed was a viable alternative to take over.
There's no variety, if you don't like capshit you're out of luck basically from the big 2.
Variety. If you like action, romance, mystery, thriller, horror, OP power fantasies, they've got all of that and more. American comics are much narrower in the variety they offer.
Comics have a higher intrinsic collector value than manga
2 years ago
Anonymous
A fraction of people who read comics have any interest in that kind of thing.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Man I collect comics for fun and they're fricking worthless. Outside of shit from 70 years ago comics are barely worth the paper they're printed on. I've scooped up whole runs, dozens of issues for under a hundred bucks.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Comics have a higher intrinsic collector value than manga
Imagine being this deluded.
>Comes in with a longbox of hundreds of comics. >Retailer: Best I can do is $10, most of these are worthless.
2 years ago
Anonymous
This. It's a lot easier to sell a manga collection than a comic collection.
2 years ago
Anonymous
B-but Action Comics #1 is really valuable...
2 years ago
Anonymous
Key Golden Age and Silver Age comics are valuable because they're rare and the demand is high.
But every comic that came after the Silver Age has been worthless. Most comicbook stores don't even want some comics because they take up space and they won't ever sell.
Manga on the other hand is very easy to sell. You can easily get $100 for the complete collection of Naruto. You're still getting scammed, but you're still getting more than 10 times the money for a fraction of the page count.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>But every comic that came after the Silver Age has been worthless
I agree with most of what you type, but there are some valuable Bronze age comics (TMNT issue 1 for example, a 9.8 sold for 250,000 dollars not too long ago)
2 years ago
Anonymous
>TMNT issue 1 for example, a 9.8 sold for 250,000 dollars not too long ago
A CGC 9.8 is going to inflate the price of any book, and especially if it's the first of a brand like TMNT.
But most comics can't even be sold for a couple of cents.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Every single thing people collect is going to have a standout example that sold for a ridiculous amount. That’s not the norm, what 99.9% of people have in their closet isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on
2 years ago
Anonymous
You said "every comic". Go to the cgc forums, there are a ton of bronze age keys selling for thousands, whether its Giant Size X-Men 1 or The Crow 1 . And if you are going to picky, then a bunch of your shitty torn up silver age comics aren't worth 3 dollars either. There was no reason to even mention that about comics after the silver age, there are keys in every age and worthless comics even from the silver age.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Collectors nearly killed the industry.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Implying that the industry is alive.
2 years ago
Anonymous
As I.P farm.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Comics are nothing but an IP farm for Disney and Warner Bros now. They can fail forever and Spider-Man, Batman etc are still going to exist since they can make more cartoons of them forever.
Weirdly, the few and far between non capeshit comics that do come out of America tend to turn into pretty successful movie/tv IPs as well. While publishers still never want to give them a chance or move past publishing more and more capeshit. You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
Really this is all manga is too. It's just that manga printing is incredibly cheap so any money made from even the bad series are still doing okay. But Manga publishers have a much smarter means of maintaining an ever revolving door IP farm for movies, games, and animated series. When one publisher has on average about 10-15 different stories going a month, with 1-2 cancelling and being replaced each month they have a huge reserve of potential media franchises.
Meanwhile DC and Marvel keep the same 10 or so main heroes going, and will occasionally get a flavor of the week added on too like Jamie Reyes in the 00s and Kamala in the 2010s.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>When one publisher has on average about 10-15 different stories going a month
Lol, try 100-120 different stories going each month.
Most publishers publish more than one magazine, with magazines aimed at every audience.
Hell, there's a publisher that's dedicated exclusively to publishing smut magazines, including stuff like Comic LO.
2 years ago
Anonymous
yes but no, manga is really profitable independandly of anime/merchandaising
the IP farm is just an extra that they enjoy but dont focus only on it
2 years ago
Anonymous
Collecting is a niche hobby that doesn't represent the casual reader
2 years ago
Anonymous
This is another plus for manga though. Manga is just printed entertainment, nothing more, Makes it a LOT easier to reprint more without any trouble or increase in price since it's just a standard value across the board.
No comic printed after the 70s is ever going to be worth shit since there are legions upon legions of "Collectors" out there hoarding them all up. Plus publishers doing shit like foil covers, hardbacks, alt covers etc jacking up prices even more. This makes them even less accessible for casual readers.
2 years ago
Anonymous
have a nice day Vinylhomosexual
>Manga and non-capes are full of "woke" stories
Manga is such a large industry that you will find every genre, but the stuff that actually sells, as in carries the industry, is not woke.
>Hear about Dragon Ball Z, all your Mexican employees and wife's black boyfriends recommend you to check it out like it's the best shit ever >But best not watch DBZ anime as it literally skips half the story and context for rest of the series, also has bad dub and bad redone soundtrack, and in general a poor adaptation filled with fillers and padding out because it caught up with manga too quickly >Fine, read manga >It's nothing like people described and just some gag manga for children.
2 years ago
Anonymous
The Mexican employees probably watched the Mexican dub, which was good. And lots of people watched and enjoyed the filler not knowing it was filler.
2 years ago
Anonymous
the dub for both db and dbz are good
or at least the ones i watched
>N-no actually to read this run you need to check out comic X and Y before! Also make sure to read the crossovers with character Z. Also there's a new Crisis event that'll reboot the entire universe soon!
>Does not need 40-60 years of DEEP LORE backstory to get what the frick is going on >Generally made for a wide audience to pick up and read at any time, not just the super dedicated fans >Found in a wide variety of locations across town and very accessible >Most are made for kids and young teens and contain themes that kids and young teens like most >Most protagonists are kids or highschool students >No crossovers or crossover events spilling into other books! One does not need to pick up an issue of One Piece, Demon Slayer, and JuJu Kaisen to know what is happening in Tokyo Revengers this week. >SIGNIFICANTLY wider range of stories, settings, themes, and topics than superheroes in tights.
Basically comics right now are only written to be consumed by the same group that read comics 20 years ago, and nobody else. There is really not much anyone wants to see and it has been near 100% eradicated as a kids market. Comics existed for the last century as the main kids entertainment medium until very recently where it turned into 20 something or older superfans only. Meanwhile Kids fricking love manga.
in a wide variety of locations across town and very accessible
Is it though? I know Barnes and Noble carries a massive variety, but those aren’t everywhere. I think the only store I have ever seen manga in besides that is Target, and their selection is extremely limited
Because japanese authors do a little unexpected thing that is to give their audience what they want, instead of making comics with the sole purpose of pushing an agenda.
People wanted that ending in AOT? Or the last half of Naruto Shippuden?
2 years ago
Anonymous
You aren’t going to win with every story. The most popular titles are usually the ones most likely to end in controversy because there are too many people to please.
And really, AoT got so much flak it’s getting retconned in the anime next year. So yea, they do listen
2 years ago
Anonymous
What now? They're changing the ending of that shit?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Or the last half of Naruto Shippuden?
Yes? Fans were pretty vocal about >We wanna see Madara >We wanna see Narutos dad >We wanna see Naruto Vs Sasuke
You could argue nobody asked for Kaguya but you can't say he didn't give them what they wanted. By Shippuden nobody wanted them acting like ninjas anymore and just wanted ninja themed wizards, so he gave them super mechs made of magic and apparently it kept selling.
Manga is much easier to get into.
Most of manga only has 1 guy in charge of drawing and writing so you get consistency.
With comics, its just a wreck of different writers and artists trying to tell their own stories for the same character.
Also 1 writer, not this series taking wildly different approaches to literally everything after 10issues. Reading any ongoings of the last few years are a fricking nightmare. The next writer comes on board and it might as well be a new title. They will definitely contradict everything the last guy established.
It really is fricking jarring to have the art shift from issue to issue. Also if you want to follow a big event completely, then you have to read a bunch of other tie-in books that have characters you may not give a shit about
2 years ago
Anonymous
Which is now a year round thing. There is ALWAYS an event going on somewhere and now all books require reading some other third party shit I never cared about to get to the end of a single monthly book storyline.
...every goddamn time, especially Marvel
2 years ago
Anonymous
For what it's worth, I actually enjoyed Doomsday Clock. Consistent art and tone from start to finish. Why can't we get more stuff like that?
2 years ago
Anonymous
I cannot get over how Doomsday Clock took more time to put out 12 issues than a tv series.
A fricking tv series was announced, cast, went through preproduction, costume tests, set design, principle filming, on location filming, post production, effects, editing, compositing, and played an entire season from pilot to finale in less time than Johns put out 12 issues of a comic book.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Why not just bundle all this shit into one book anyway? What's the point of floppies?
This is the biggest thing. Unlike capeshit, manga has genras other than soap opera.
2 years ago
Anonymous
that's a big factor sure, but manga would still be outselling capeshit just counting battle shonen so that's not all of it
2 years ago
Anonymous
Would it be fair to say battle shounen is to manga what capeshit is to comics?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Would it be fair to say battle shounen is to manga what capeshit is to comics?
It literally is. This isn't the 90s anymore where you got cool, edgy stuff like YuYu Hakusho, they have grown ass homies getting hyped ffor superheroes.
>No American one note politics >No darkies >No "As seen in issue #47 of special legacy ultimate war part 3" >No world or settings besides American city
i kind of like how a lot of Manga series will take place in their own totally unique world with it's own thing going on. That shit never happens in American books.
I come here and all I see are social justice, gays and anti-white stories and all I can think is "man the newest genshin impact event is great
I get to watch characters I like have fun and interact in humorous ways"
Clear separation of demographics.
If you like yaoi you don't have to worry about your yaoi manga suddenly becoming a hetero romcom where the main male character marries a woman.
If you like harems you don't have to worry about your harem manga suddenly shifting perspective to an otome game narrative about a woman being chased by 12 dudes.
If you like action manga full of gunfights and setpieces you don't have to worry about said manga turning into a story about the daily life of a geologist studying rock deposits.
Everyone gets what they want, and authors know to give their audience what they want (generally speaking).
It's why in the west publishers like Zenescope and publications like Heavy Metal Magazine are largely irrelevant, while something like pic related, which is literally just "softcore" porn can sell 3.5 million volumes in 5 years in Japan.
Variety
Provides something for everyone, while comics basically only have kid's stories, capeshit, and stuff for gay people/women like Gender Queer and March and Smile.
For a few reasons
1. Variety, with manga you have just about every conceivable genre covered. slice of life, action, romance, fantasy. comedy, sports, the list goes on and they are generally pretty consistent. Comics are mostly interested in pushing cape shit and you really have to look for things more suited to your interests.
2. Simple beginning and end points, Other anons mentioned this point but starting a manga is easy, start at chapter 1 and go from there. But Manga (not always or maybe even too soon) eventually end. Full Metal Alchemist had a story, told it to the best of it's ability and ended. Meanwhile Batman has been fighting the same clown for what, 60 years now? and the only thing that has changed is how violent that clown has gotten between depictions and it will probably keep on happening for another 60 years.
3. Consistency, I'm not gonna be reading DBZ only for Goku to stop his fight with Cell to have a monologue about how cool black people are, nor am I going to see an embarrassingly written rape story in Azumanga Daioh. When manga wants to dabble a touchy subject they generally try to weave in carefully into the narrative so that it fits and doesn't come off as a "Sonic Says" moment.
Another problem, though it might fall on the 3rd point you mentioned, is that western comics often have a multitude of writers for the same character. This can lead to problems because it might cause a lack of consistency, since each writer will do the character based on their point of view. When you have 1~2 people responsible for the story, it becomes so much more consistent.
I think comics should indeed have a beggining, mid point and end. Once it reached the end, they could either do a few side stories, or an alternative story, tell a known story from a diffrerent point of view, or just create another character. There's no need to reuse the same characters over and over and over for decades.
2 years ago
Anonymous
For a few reasons
1. Variety, with manga you have just about every conceivable genre covered. slice of life, action, romance, fantasy. comedy, sports, the list goes on and they are generally pretty consistent. Comics are mostly interested in pushing cape shit and you really have to look for things more suited to your interests.
2. Simple beginning and end points, Other anons mentioned this point but starting a manga is easy, start at chapter 1 and go from there. But Manga (not always or maybe even too soon) eventually end. Full Metal Alchemist had a story, told it to the best of it's ability and ended. Meanwhile Batman has been fighting the same clown for what, 60 years now? and the only thing that has changed is how violent that clown has gotten between depictions and it will probably keep on happening for another 60 years.
3. Consistency, I'm not gonna be reading DBZ only for Goku to stop his fight with Cell to have a monologue about how cool black people are, nor am I going to see an embarrassingly written rape story in Azumanga Daioh. When manga wants to dabble a touchy subject they generally try to weave in carefully into the narrative so that it fits and doesn't come off as a "Sonic Says" moment.
>praising your own post
Maybe you shouldn’t have redditspaced both of them
2 years ago
Anonymous
Probably shoulda been a 4th point but yeah, that's another pro for manga. They are generally written by a single person or group of people and thanks to that they know the story, the tone and characters. Comics can have so many writers with different ideas for characters that between writers one character can really become multiple
[...] >praising your own post
Maybe you shouldn’t have redditspaced both of them
>I literally can not conceive the idea human beings can agree with one another
This isn't twitter silly
>Simple beginning and end points
Why don't they push more self-contained stories like The Long Halloween and Red Son? Hell, even normalgays seemed to like that Injustice comic from a few years back
2 years ago
Anonymous
Yeah, i feel that graphic novels that just tell a concise story are often successful. Take Kraven's Last Hunt, for example. It just told kravens downfall, it didn't push it for several unecessary issues. One of the best spiderman stories i've read, and one i'll always remember.
I know "it has something for everyone" is a meme, but Manga has something for everyone. Name your genre and it exists. Can Marvel and DC provide this variety?
Why would Marvel and DC provide something for everyone? They have their target audience the same way Jump has. If you have something else besides capes go look at another publisher.
>several times cheaper >tons of genres >continuity isn't a shitshow >generally relatively consistent quality within a series >generally a relatively big heads up if a series is going to be shit/canceled >appeals to multiple target audiences >willing to overtly use sex to sell
it_is_a_mystery.jpg
>Easily digestible content, manga generally have clear beginnings and a stronger focus thanks to the industry being creator driven. >Far less insular, resulting in a more diverse group of content creators (including far more prolific women working on what they want to create, resulting in titles that draw in a greater margin of the female demographic than comics ever could) >Less politics, less preaching, because shockingly people don't like being preached to.
>Less politics, less preaching, because shockingly people don't like being preached to.
I think you underestimate how much manga preaches/is political. Plenty of fricking manga have messages to them, some of them political, some less so.
Detective Conan incorporates a moral into cases on the regular, YKK's about how global warming is gonna frick us all, GITS:SAC's an anime but was about both appreciating and preserving print media in one season and the plight of refugees in another, shittons of shoujo ai and shounen ai manga naturally address discrimination against gays and lesbians, every other isekai has a racism is bad actually message, there are plenty of girl power manga, etc.
I have no fricking clue where you got the idea that manga isn't preachy. Hell, even harem manga will commonly have an arc about respecting boundaries involving some skeevy butthole hitting on one of the heroines no matter how much she protests if not trying to get an arranged marriage with her.
Also there's a bajillion teachers/farmers/tradesmen/salaried workers are under appreciated manga, and more than a few anti-suicide manga. Manga's just as fricking preachy and political as comics if not more.
2 years ago
Anonymous
So I guess this is just a tacit admission that western comics brand of politics is poison then?
2 years ago
Anonymous
I've read all of YKK and own 40 volumes of Detective Conan and they were not preachy at all. Do you think merely having a message within a story is automatically preachy? Preachiness involves terrible execution.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Preachiness involves terrible execution.
Cool No True Scotsman. b***h, just say western comics have shitty writing if that's what you mean. Preachy means being preached to, it has frick all to do with writing quality.
So I guess this is just a tacit admission that western comics brand of politics is poison then?
>So I guess this is just a tacit admission that western comics brand of politics is poison then?
Such as?
If anything it's a direct admission that the problem isn't politics, it's quality.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Well for example, taking a simple concept as "not being racist to each other" and making it unpalatable by being hypocritical about it like playing favourites or even dismissing or laughing off the suffering of others just because they aren't part of the group that's oppressed the most.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Well for example, taking a simple concept as "not being racist to each other" and making it unpalatable by being hypocritical about it like playing favourites or even dismissing or laughing off the suffering of others just because they aren't part of the group that's oppressed the most.
Yeah, that sounds like shitty writing as opposed to politics.
(prē′chē) adj. preach·i·er, preach·i·est. Inclined or given to tedious and excessive moralizing; didactic.
bitch
Now look up what didactic means, b***h.
2 years ago
Anonymous
you fricking mongoloid, "preachy" DOES NOT mean "to preach". holy shit you are moronic. go suck dick.
2 years ago
Anonymous
> in the manner of a teacher, particularly so as to treat someone in a patronizing way.
"slow-paced, didactic lecturing"
herp fricking derp
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Yeah, that sounds like shitty writing as opposed to politics.
It's both shitty writing and shitty American politics.
Which is kind of the point.
American writers being inundated in shitty and toxic American politics has an immense impact on their writing, which in turn results in it being shitty, predictable, and often times embarrassing (at least to any normal person, and especially to the majority of non-Americans).
Unfortunately this is something that you'll probably never admit to because like most Americans your head is planted so firmly up your ass that you could tongue-punch your prostate.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>It's both shitty writing and shitty American politics.
White dudes, amirite? isn't politics, even if you're obsession with the minority of frickwits that talk like that sways your vote and even if those same frickwits occasionally get writing gigs.
>Something described as "didactic" is often overburdened with instruction to the point of being dull. Or it might be pompously instructive or moralistic.
merriam-webster are alt right trolls!
>di·dac·tic
/dīˈdaktik/
Learn to pronounce
adjective
intended to teach, particularly in having moral instruction as an ulterior motive. >"a didactic novel that set out to expose social injustice"
Oh, hey, a completely fricking on point use of didactic in a sentence.
you fricking mongoloid, "preachy" DOES NOT mean "to preach". holy shit you are moronic. go suck dick.
> in the manner of a teacher, particularly so as to treat someone in a patronizing way.
"slow-paced, didactic lecturing"
herp fricking derp
See above and then choke on my wiener.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>White dudes, amirite?
I'm black actually. >even if you're obsession with the minority of frickwits that talk like that sways your vote and even if those same frickwits occasionally get writing gigs.
No, it just ensures that I read manga instead of comics.
That's part of WHY I've read tons of manga yet can count the number of comics I've read on two hands.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I'm black actually.
I think you misread what I said if you thought that was addressed at you and not in reference to.
>Well for example, taking a simple concept as "not being racist to each other" and making it unpalatable by being hypocritical about it like playing favourites or even dismissing or laughing off the suffering of others just because they aren't part of the group that's oppressed the most.
2 years ago
Anonymous
That's not just done by white writers, it's done by American writers in general, whether they're white, black, Hispanic, or Asian.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I didn't say it was done by white writers. I was using "white dudes, amirite" as a shorthand example for it being done.
You're still not understanding what I'm saying, just let it go.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I was using "white dudes, amirite" as a shorthand example for it being done.
Maybe next time you should put quotation marks in your post if you're trying to quote something said.
But yes, saying "white dudes, amirite" is part of that annoying American politics just as much as if you went "straight dudes, amirite" or "dudes, amirite" or "black dudes, amirite."
It's all annoying gender/race autism that just serves to drive away readers since it's almost always embarrassingly-written and patronizing.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Something described as "didactic" is often overburdened with instruction to the point of being dull. Or it might be pompously instructive or moralistic.
merriam-webster are alt right trolls!
2 years ago
Anonymous
(prē′chē) adj. preach·i·er, preach·i·est. Inclined or given to tedious and excessive moralizing; didactic.
bitch
2 years ago
Anonymous
This guy sums up how politics in American comics is like:
After reading the recent storytimes of pain, I don't see myself purchasing any of this shit. I don't want to be lectured constantly by a short-sighted egomaniac "auteurs" in their endless quest of "self-identity against the entire world and the very fabric of reality itself" >"It's okay to be short"? How dare you! Stop patronizing me! [cries with anger] I'm short, but that's only because of how society puts importance in people's height; short is a social construct! Society must burn down because it threats short people like shit! [people were stunned, because SHE TOLD THE TRUTH!] >What do you mean "I didn't mean to"? You fricking piece of shit! You're not a true ally and you will never be, but keep trying as hard as you can, or you're an every bigger piece of shit! [and then everybody clapped and she became super popular because she seemed like a nice person to be around] >[Conclusion] thanks to my self-introspection, I realized that I only had to believe in my true self to realize how tall I TRULY was. I was actually taller than everyone else all along! It proves that all those peasants have always been beneath my magnificent self. Ah ah, they're so dumb they don't even realize how superior to them I am in every way! I shall squish them all like tiny bugs!
Yeah, I'll pass on that.
Popular manga runs live and die based on their popularity, so they try to make entertaining stories first. American capeshit Virtue Signals first, and tries to write a story second.
> only the best arrives in the global market. imagine the Japanese comic Market are like sea turtles when they first hatch only the good ones come overseas the rest stay in Japan. > ease of access you don't have to go to a specialty shop to obtain manga when it first drops. hell you can just buy it off Amazon it'll be delivered to you the next day or if you preorder it the day of. for Shonen Jump you just have to go on their website and read it for free. > consistent and fast schedule with more content than the average comic book. weekly sometimes monthly but if it's usually monthly that's usually more pages than a floppy. >good art > easy to follow don't have to read a Wikipedia page just to understand where do you start. > doesn't preach to the audience about things they already know or isn't going to change their minds you just being annoying. > dirt cheap $10 for 180 pages sometimes 200 pages unlike Comics $15-20 for 120 Pages Maybe but some only have 80 pages. >dont call out their fans.
People don’t have to drive to a comic book shop in bumfrick nowhere to get them. They’re also cheaper, less constrained by decades of events and continuity, not filled with constant retcons and reboots and they have more variety. Want to read an action series about superheroes? There’s manga for that. Wanna read slice of life gay romances? There’s a manga for that. Wanna read a political thriller with giant robots? You guessed it; there’s a manga for that. American comics that tackle similar themes and genres are all indie and don’t have Marvel movie to get their shit out there, and while Marvel has Marvel money, they’re cheap bastards who refuse to get with the times in terms of distribution. Simply put: manga is managed better.
What is this 'outrageously sexist treatment of women' in western comics ?
Them looking really attractive, just like the men do ?
Can't wait until we get complaints about the incredibly sexist treatment of men in female romance media, oh wait, that will never happen.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Gail Simone's initial claim to fame was talking about "women in refrigerators" and how female characters existed only as accessories for the stories of male characters.
Of course this ignores how secondary male characters were also treated the same way, as this is the nature of secondary characters.
2 years ago
Anonymous
IIRC Simone has somewhat backed off on the WiR thing because she realized that it basically morphed into "nothing bad can ever happen to a female character or its sexist" which is, of course, insane.
I fear that eventually, given enough time, even japan will succumb to this crap and start doing the same as western comics. It's hard, but i can see it becoming a reality in the next 10 years.
Just read old comics.
Don't touch the stuff from the last ten years.
Yeah. Been re-reading kraven's last hunt, maximum carnage and knightfall. Good stuff. I just wish they kept the quality of the stories high nowadays, too. It's not even a matter of just the story itself, but the essence of the comic universe and it's characters; it feels like people forgot what's important, and instead focus on stuff that has no relevance for the plot or characters.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Vinland Saga has already gone from a historical viking manga to having 21st century gender politics and pro-trans propaganda in it so they're well on their way there
2 years ago
Anonymous
Vinland Saga was already gone when they started shilling that shitty Ass Creed game a few years ago.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>but i can see it becoming a reality in the next 10 years.
Don't hold your breath on that one, they just elected multiple politicians who ran on major anti-censorship and anti-westernization platforms, including the guy who created Love Hina.
The only demographics that might end up being fricked by western behaviour and infighting in Japan are shoujo and yaoi, but that's expected because lolwomen.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Oh shit, for real? Ken akamatsu? I used to love love hina back in the day, I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics, auheuaheu
That's good, i'm happy that some of them stand against those changes. Thanks for sharing good news, anon.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics
He basically only got involved because he felt that there was too much censorious American "liberal" influence trying to seep its way into manga.
He also wanted to address the work schedules of mangaka in his platform.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Damn man, that bastard would have my vote for sure. Both of his points sound very good and pertinent for mangakas. I just hope that this new generation of theirs can see that it's for their own good, nothing good will come from them getting westernized in that aspect, i'll tell ya that much.
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's more than that, he's been pretty outspoken against things that he feels limit creative and artistic freedom in general so he sees foreign influence as one aspect of it. Some of the western twitter left tried labeling him as a pedo because he's fought against attempted laws that would do things like ban e-girlcon art when most mangaka, men and women, are against it because they realize that it basically opens the door for wider government censorship of art since not just images but ideas themselves could be censored under the guise of protecting youth or upholding moral decency.
He's also generally pretty strong for creator's rights. He willingly ended Negima in protest of his publisher being one of the publishers fighting to try and get a bill passed that'd give publishers equal copyright to authors for manga and books. He only came back after the law was defeated. He seems pretty principled in being against anything that could be used to limit artistic freedom or take rights away from artists.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Oh shit, for real? Ken akamatsu? I used to love love hina back in the day, I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics, auheuaheu
Akamatsu is personally responsible for helping to stop the censorship crackdown on anime/manga like a decade back, presenting to the Diet multiple times.
Awesome, i already liked him, now i have some mad respect for the man. Hope others can also follow his example, and keep fighting the good fight.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Ken Akamatsu is a godsend when it comes to creative freedoms, he also runs a site where you can download lots of out-of-print manga for free, including banned stuff like Aki Sora.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Oh shit, for real? Ken akamatsu? I used to love love hina back in the day, I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics, auheuaheu
Akamatsu is personally responsible for helping to stop the censorship crackdown on anime/manga like a decade back, presenting to the Diet multiple times.
I'm almost done with Tom King's run of Batman, whichever reboot this is. Felt like a quarter of the dialogue are characters repeating each other or grunts.
It's not a new trend, New 52 Batman was ridiculous while you have comics trying to shove politics into everything. If speeches about privilege end up in a main Batman series, you know everything else is infected.
They’re cheaper, more available, and actually have genre variety. With the big 2 you have to go to a LCS which may or may not be miles away, they come in floppies with fricking ads in the middle and are generally a shitty, overpriced format for the pages you get, and everything is capeshit with Vertigo and Epic dead.
>Authors have more creative freedom >Authors do their own stuff instead of doing pre-existing stuff >Art while hit or miss, is still better >Actually there is a very diverse selection of genres and stories
Well color me surprised.
>More diverse storylines than capeshit #52137 >different genres that appeal to a widespread of demographics >Targets younger demographics than old boomers who can't let go of their childhood obsessions >actually listens to their fanbases when it comes to criticism >doesn't pozzify everything to please Twitterlets
It's over, comics will be remembered as a nostalgic past-time by 2050.
You know, i can actually see it becoming a reality, comics becoming just nostalgic thing of the past. I mean, it already kind of is, but it will eventually become something like Aesop's fables or Grimm's tales. People will do adaptations now and then.
>sales of graphic novels, driven by manga, jumped by 76% in the year >sales of comics increased 53%
Comichron doesn't include manga sales, they only track comic sales, before the pandemic they relied entirely on Diamond sales. I guess they would include any manga sold through comic publishers like Dark Horse printing Berserk but that's it. This is an article that's using Comichron's graph as supplemental material.
>This is an article that's using Comichron's graph as supplemental material.
It's not, it's both comichron and icv2 data, and outright states that it uses NPD Bookscan and ComicHub data in addition to direct market data.
Stop lying your ass off dude, it's pathetic.
>I guess they would include any manga sold through comic publishers like Dark Horse printing Berserk but that's it
Oh you mean the biggest property for Dark Horse for the past four years. Just that type of stuff is included from Dark Horse, which is the third largest manga publisher in the US. Yeah, no big deal.
Why would they use Yoshiyuki Sadamoto's style for the template... Eva/Gainax and Craig of the creek have 0 tonal overlap, they should've chosen something softer in style, and prolly from the late 2000's to 2010's. This style isnt even representative anymore......
Maybe they were going for an easily recognizable style?
2 years ago
Anonymous
I suppose, it just seems odd. Like doing a manga reference to American cartoons and using the 80's GI Joe style, or Scooby Doo style. It's not really representative of how 'anime' looks anymore and feels really dated, idk.
Someday when I am at an auction buying up DC Comics, I will think of you, anon. And then I shall chuckle as I announce a new DC where I get rid of everything from Heroes in Crisis on. There will probably be other things that get retconned, but that's the starting point.
Honestly, it's kinda fun to just pick a random new comic and see how many issues it takes to devolve into weird American agitprop and horribly hamfisted writing that feels like a shitpost.
It's pure writer with low self-esteem fantasy.
You could try to engage with the actual writer on their core beliefs, agree on some points, disagree on others, but ultimately you know they would leave the table the moment anything doesn't go their way. But they don't have to engage face-to-face with a thinking human being: they can write a made-up scenario in which a whole cast of background characters all agree with their self-insert... and then you, the actual thinking human being, are supposed to agree with those made-up characters or you're a terrible sack of shit. Meanwhile you only wanted to indulge in your hobby. But for that, you have to pass the writer political filter.
It's unbearable on so many levels.
You can tell when the natural flow of the story is shifting to shoe-horn that unnecessary bullshit. If they made an openly political manifesto in comic form, few people would purchase it, so they have to infect something popular instead. Because it's shoe-horned into something where it doesn't belong, it's always surface-level one-sided straw-men non-arguments that can only be rivaled by a twitter thread.
Pure absolute pointless garbage. It's doesn't further anything, doesn't bring anything to the table, it's just signaling: >I believe in this and you're trash if you don't! >First, don't call me trash. Second, care to explain your position? >If I have to explain it, then you're trash! Frick you!
If there is one single silver lining with all the woke propaganda in comics these days, it's that the writers are so incredibly awful at creating remotely realistic characters/scenarios with which to push their dogma.
Every character is a stand-in for a social justice argument, or a 'privileged oppressor' to be taken down by said social justice argument.
It's really the preachiness that's the problem. One of my favorite manga is Skip and Loafer and one of the central characters is the MC's transgender aunt. But the series is never preachy about her. It never pats itself on the back for being STUNNING and BRAVE for having a transgender character. That's not to say it downplays it as she has her own insecurities related to being a transgender youth in a small, rural town and how she's, at times, envious of her niece for being able to live the type of carefree normal youth that she was unable to have. But it never beats you over the head with her struggles and she largely remains an upbeat supportive rock for her niece, who she loves unconditionally. It also plays into the fact that every character, no matter how seemingly perfect they are, has massive insecurities. The fashionable girl has low self-esteem because she naturally lacks the beauty or likability that others naturally have, the male lead has spent so long going with what others want that he's never sure of what he wants, etc.
She's a characters whose transgender identity is a part of who she is but it's done in a way that contributes to making her an interesting and likable character, not shoting from the rooftops about how you should like her because she's transgender and how do you like THAT, you chuds?
You might be onto something. Comics are not known for their subtlety (see PowerGirl crying over the poignant symbolism of her cleavage) but there's a limit. That's the difference between Ellen Ripley in Alien vs every other recent female character: >I'm a woman! Hear me roar! I don't need no man. >Hi, I'm a man and I'm clumsy but I want to help. >No, be-penised one, you'll only slow me down and get hurt. >But I can-- [trips over an empty cardboard box] >See what I mean? Never send a man do a woman's job! [everybody laughs]
Meanwhile Ripley: >Study the file, because one of these things killed my whole crew. >Ahah, YOLO, it's piece of cake. >[50 minutes later] Nuke it from orbit! That's the only way we can know for sure.
And the modern Aliens remake of that dialog would be: >Sigh. You silly macho-marines: your toxic masculinity kill you all. Including you, Vasquez due to your internalize misogyny. That's why you need to believe all women!
Not quite related but I've read lgbt manga and it seems like unlike the usa where there's ONE agenda they're trying to push, they're more tolerant of other beliefs and identities. Like cis women only lesbian bars co existing in a district with places for trans women too etc. In the usa that would be considered bad and "wrong".
That's exactly it. It's not the end of the world having a gay, trans character or other minorities, it's just that the constant preaching and making a ruckus out of it that makes it insufferable. Don't make a show out of it, don't bash people, don't go against your audience.
>1.47 billion out of the 2.075 billion are literally manga sales in the US. >The remaining 0.435 billion are not even limited to capeshit.
Kek.
Capeshit losing the game on homefield.
It's over Cinemaphilecklovers.
>Century old American Duopoly vs a Green Boi
>This is an article that's using Comichron's graph as supplemental material.
It's not, it's both comichron and icv2 data, and outright states that it uses NPD Bookscan and ComicHub data in addition to direct market data.
Stop lying your ass off dude, it's pathetic.
Might have something to do with the Rippaverse making millions overnight. Goes to show the market for comics is wide open if marvel and DC would just ditch woke leftist pandering
Might have something to do with the Rippaverse making millions overnight. Goes to show the market for comics is wide open if marvel and DC would just ditch woke leftist pandering
Movies of these same characters make billions, comics had no problem selling these same characters until they started to make the stories about woke politics.
Yeah normies like Iron Man when RDJ is playing him and they like sitting through 3 hours of subpar writing when an overinflated vfx budget can convince them what they just saw was the "best film of the summer." Then they don't pick up the books and that's why cape shit continues to struggle compared to other comics like they have for decades. Some superhero being female or a woman being hired as a writer doesn't hurt sales because most people don't give a shit because most people aren't even aware of whatever it is you're shitting your panties over
When have the movies used a recently published story? Infinity War and Endgame borrow from comics almost a decade old. Civil War was more than a decade old.
I mean, Batman/Superman/Wonder Woman etc. seem to be doing okay, but noticeably only when their stories are presented in a neatly packaged and consistent way.
I think most people understand that these are the kinds of characters where their stories are allowed to change to some degree and that's fine, as long as those stories are presented in a way that's easy to follow like in films or TV.
The problem is that comics, or the usual floppy style. are not easy to follow for the average person, compare to say manga or comics that aren't capes. With capes, the writers and artists change on the regular, with each bringing their own style to whatever character they're working with. Sure, that sounds fun in theory, but if you're a fan of the way of way, say, Neal Adams handled Batman, is it going to mean as much to you when some new person takes Batman in a new direction that you don't like because you were already invested in Neal's story? Maybe not, especially if Neal--just using his name as an example, not claiming this happened to him specifically--didn't actually get a chance to finish telling his Batman story, but DC decided to take Batman in a direction anyway. If you're a casual reader and want to know how things ended with that specific Batman or want more of it? Well, tough shit, or so says DC. Too bad tough shit doesn't translate into more sales.
Movies of these same characters make billions, comics had no problem selling these same characters until they started to make the stories about woke politics.
It's not a comic sales' thread without one of you fricks showing up. Manga and non-capes are full of "woke" stories and characters and sales keep climbing and climbing.
>Manga and non-capes are full of "woke" stories
Manga is such a large industry that you will find every genre, but the stuff that actually sells, as in carries the industry, is not woke.
>not woke
The biggest selling manga in the US has a character that is openly lesbian and no, her identity isn't treated as a joke.
List 3 manga series that are woke. I’m genuinely curious
Woke as in the version used by Cinemaphile capeshitters whenever a series actively features blacks and/or LBGT characters?
Chainsaw Man (LGBT+)
Made in Abyss (LBGT+ and blacks)
Bleach (LBGT+ and blacks)
Attack on Titan (LGBT+ and blacks)
Jujutsu Kaisen (LGBT+ and blacks)
And these are just a few that your average normie would recognize. Cinemaphile capeshitters would shit themselves with rage if DC/Marvel put out something like Okaeri Alice or Houseki no Kuni.
But mind you, the rest of Cinemaphile probably wouldn't give a damn, it's just capeshitters that still want to blame everything for their dying genre except the genre itself.
Sorry, no. At this late stage of the Culture Wars, identity and presence alone are enough to be considered woke. This is the future you wanted after all.
>The biggest selling manga in the US has a character that is openly lesbian and no, her identity isn't treated as a joke.
Right, because she as a character is a joke, and she immediately jobs and gets killed by a dude, as does her gaggle of weirdos.
It's annoying to see people thinking that the slightest display of friendship between men is supposed to mean that they're gay.
2 years ago
Anonymous
That's just Americans in general, they do the same with women.
Americans cannot fathom platonic friendships anymore since American culture revolves around sex.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Americans cannot fathom platonic friendships anymore since American culture revolves around sex.
I thought we were sexual prudes? Which is it?
>hey this manga has characters that are dark-skinned and that have designs that could be inspired by people of African descent >Oh, you mean these CHARACTERS THAT DON'T MATCH THAT DESCRIPTION AT ALL???
[...] >I mean laughed at because they are homosexuals which isn’t normal and deserves scorn
Shut the frick up, homosexual.
>You will be hard pressed to find a manga series where the gay character is haha funny and not just a thing to laugh AT for being a freak
I mentioned Bleach, dipshit. Hell, and he openly insults the one openly trans character.
[...]
Show me a capeshit story with characters that are openly LGBT from the start or discover they're LBGT in an organic way and don't get "turned" because their stories are written by actual people and not corporate cucks.
[...]
You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
There are plenty of small publishers out there, anon. and everyone else is moving into the webcomic space. Print floppies like what DC?Marvel puts out is a drowning ship and people are getting out while the getting is good.
[...]
I'm sorry, I didn't realize Americans were responsible for the multi-million dollar industry that is Japanese doujins.
>Shut the frick up, homosexual.
Heterosexual men are more comfortable around maggots than being in the same room as two gay dudes kissing dude. We are genetically designed to see that as abnormal.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Men and women literally cannot be “just friends”. It’s not possible regardless of culture
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Men and women literally cannot be “just friends”
Except, y'know, siblings.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Only people that have zero friends and never interact with anyone else in person say shit like this.
2 years ago
Anonymous
It’s true though. You can’t go out and do things with a female constantly and not have it develop further. It’s not possible
2 years ago
Anonymous
All things media now is this. Absolutely ANY two characters seen near each other are considered fricking now no matter what. Guy and guy, woman and dog, ghost and horse....anything means agenda now no exceptions.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I'd honestly wanna see more platonic relations between male and female characters that don't devolve into a forced love plot.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I think you could make an exception for Naruto, their friendship is weird and they don’t have good chemistry with their female love interests either. The sequel series, Boruto, doesn’t really improve their marital relationships either. Kishi just can’t write women.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Naruto and Sauske NEVER show any semblance of friendship. It’s not till hundreds of chapters later that we are shown a bunch of flashbacks where Naruto and Sauske were totally secret bros despite the fact in the earliest part of the series, Naruto doesn’t know who Sauske is when they first meet in the academy
Yeah to be fair, ever since i was a kid i thought it was a bit weird, but over time i just accepted that they're just supposed to have started off as rivals, but then started to respect and even admire each other. I do find it weird how they would consider each other friends, though.
Still, my point stands that it's annoying to see people assuming a character is into another just because they had a bit of interaction. I get it that peopl like to ship and all for fun, but they shouldn't make a commotion if their 'ship' isn't official.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Naruto and Sauske NEVER show any semblance of friendship. It’s not till hundreds of chapters later that we are shown a bunch of flashbacks where Naruto and Sauske were totally secret bros despite the fact in the earliest part of the series, Naruto doesn’t know who Sauske is when they first meet in the academy
2 years ago
Anonymous
bruhh
2 years ago
Anonymous
>These characters with wives and children are totally gay!
This is a baffling cope.
2 years ago
Anonymous
He said the author tried and he sure as shit did make the entire relationship fricking gay. Jump of course told him to knock that queer shit out.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>He said the author tried and he sure as shit did make the entire relationship fricking gay.
Right, which is just a cope.
2 years ago
Anonymous
You sure are mad, narutard. Cry more.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Cope harder.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Cope
2 years ago
Anonymous
>a man can't care about another man without wanting to frick him
You are literally as bad as twitter.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Serious question anon; do you not have friends that are close to you like this?
2 years ago
Anonymous
I don't have a necklace with my friends' picture on it, no.
2 years ago
Anonymous
That's an edit anon.
2 years ago
Anonymous
1. Sasuke is a dad.
2. Naruto is a dad.
3. You're not a dad.
Case closed.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>3. You're not a dad.
I am. But you will never be one.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>post edit >post naruto
cringe cope, didnt even read if you are pro or anti manga
Goku, Naruto, Deku, Tanjiro, and Gon are all queer coded. And that’s just off the top of my head
2 years ago
Anonymous
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Goku, Naruto, Deku, Tanjiro, and Gon are all queer coded.
2 years ago
Anonymous
See this right here, nothing really states what the frick they are. It's all hearsay and conjecture from the reader if they are anything at all. But why can't that just be personal to the individual reader?
Why is it Americans have to make a big public declaration that X character is gay, they have always been gay and here are little snippets of some back issue that proves it and anyone else saying or thinking otherwise is a whitey the blue eyed devil bigot butthole motherfricker that needs to die right goddamn now fight to be had over it? Why can't one person say Spider-Man is gay and another person thinks he isn't? Why is this a thing in the US?
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's because Americans are mentally ill.
Simple as.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Because:
Publicity, that's the only reason Tom Taylor made John Kent gay and why that was announced on Bisexual awareness day #35.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Nah, but that doesn't explain why Americans online insist that fanfiction and porn should dictate canon, and don't pretend you don't do this because you do it all the fricking time, whether it's capeshit comics, cartoons, TV shows, and yes, even anime.
And it's something that you really only see from Americans, typically gay Americans.
It's like trying to say that Ben and Gwen from Ben 10 should be a canon couple because of how popular all the incest porn of them is online.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Ben and Gwen from Ben 10 should be a canon couple
They should be, id tune in for every episode if they had hot steamy sex every time
2 years ago
Anonymous
Americans work on some weird >I now I am right and everyone else is WRONG!
mindset and they use it against each other way more than they do everyone else in the world. It's sort of the basis behind American tribalism, ideological discussion, religion, and political parties. They cannot just disagree with someone, they have to be justified moral and correct. While everyone else in the world is knowingly evil and bad for being wrong.
They turn almost all things into a good vs evil situation. Anyone that does not agree with them on some random opinion is EEEEVVVVIL and must be stopped.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Idk about the others but it’s laid on pretty thick that Gon and Killua are gays for each other
2 years ago
Anonymous
>are all queer coded
Are amerifats usually this moronic?
2 years ago
Anonymous
You must be if you can’t see it
2 years ago
Anonymous
So that's a yes?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Explain how they are then.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Goku, Naruto, Deku, Tanjiro,
All these characters have female love interests. Just because they're nice doesn't mean they're "queer coded" fricking moron
2 years ago
Anonymous
Having a female love interest doesn’t mean a character isnt gay
2 years ago
Anonymous
Anon, 2 or 3 of those literally breed with their female love interests.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>They have strong relationships of friendship, rivalry, loyalty, or even hatred with other male characters >This means they're gay
2 years ago
Anonymous
2 years ago
Anonymous
>queer coded
take your meds
2 years ago
Anonymous
>it's another buttmad Cinemaphiletard that refutes actual statistics with trolling/schizoposting because reeeee manga
2 years ago
Anonymous
Goku is a turbo autist, Kishimoto projected his family issues in his work, Deku is just spineless, Tanjiro is the ideal son/father/brother/husband and he was one of the first to breed, and Gon fricks cougars.
>Chainsaw Man (LGBT+) >Attack on Titan (LGBT+ and blacks)
I haven't read the others, and I'm not up to date with CM, but you're not gonna compare the way they've done it to current comics spinning the wheel of homosexualry each week to see who gets gayed on, or who gets to lecture the audience about homophobia or some shit.
so you think a lesbian orgy = preachiness? most males would find that scene visually exciting unless they females are drawn like modern american comic style which they are not considering its manga
Comics used to be a medium for kids and found in grocery stores and gas stations.
Now they are a medium for weird adults and only found in "Us Only!" specialty shops
And wanting to change that is somehow destroying the white race or some shit.
This is true. Not many parents are going to take their kid on a special detour to some back alley shithole that sells comics. If they were at eye level at checkout lanes in regular stores the sales numbers would probably skyrocket.
At least, I’d like to think that, but comics are like $5 a pop for 10 mins of reading material to a kid who is terrible at reading
>entire stories revolve around how great it is to be a gay or nig
Again, capeshitters like yourself would piss yourself with rage if you read a story like Okaeri Alice.
>gays are usually treated a joke to be laughed at
The West practically invented the funny gay best friend stereotype, zoomer, and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor. If you actually read
>rather than the western way of making them repulsive
Yeah, because capeshit has undergone an obsession with extreme realism over the last 20 years and it's not like straight women look any better. You capeshit fricks think all you have to do to make a woman look good is to give her a big rack and put her in a bikini and call it a day, it's fricking pathetic.
Manga has had many lesbian and crossdresser characters for a very long time, that does not make something woke.
When a character is defined by their sexuality and equates that with victimhood as in western comics, that is indeed woke.
>When a character is defined by their sexuality
What the frick does that even mean? If a character is one-dimensional in any aspect, that's just bad writing, why is sexuality suddenly an exception?
>and equates that with victimhood
Give me an example of a character who meets both of these standards, because a lot of the shit that capeshitters call "woke" sure as hell doesn't.
>The biggest selling manga in the US has a character that is openly lesbian and no, her identity isn't treated as a joke.
Right, because she as a character is a joke, and she immediately jobs and gets killed by a dude, as does her gaggle of weirdos.
Okay, speedreader-kun.
>Made in Abyss (LBGT+ and blacks)
Lolwut?
There are no blacks in Made in Abyss.
Anime-only detected. I don't know why I even bother mentioning manga on Cinemaphile. You capeshitters don't read
>Anime-only detected. I don't know why I even bother mentioning manga on Cinemaphile.
Are you one of those morons who thinks everyone with dark skin is black?
I can only assume that you're an American in that case.
But anon was right, you are indeed coping like crazy.
>hey this manga has characters that are dark-skinned and that have designs that could be inspired by people of African descent >Oh, you mean these CHARACTERS THAT DON'T MATCH THAT DESCRIPTION AT ALL???
>The West practically invented the funny gay best friend stereotype, zoomer, and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor. If you actually read
By laughed at I don’t mean because they crack a good joke, I mean laughed at because they are homosexuals which isn’t normal and deserves scorn. You will be hard pressed to find a manga series where the gay character is haha funny and not just a thing to laugh AT for being a freak
>I mean laughed at because they are homosexuals which isn’t normal and deserves scorn
Shut the frick up, homosexual.
>You will be hard pressed to find a manga series where the gay character is haha funny and not just a thing to laugh AT for being a freak
I mentioned Bleach, dipshit. Hell, and he openly insults the one openly trans character.
Name a shonen protagonist who was turned gay.
Show me a capeshit story with characters that are openly LGBT from the start or discover they're LBGT in an organic way and don't get "turned" because their stories are written by actual people and not corporate cucks.
Comics are nothing but an IP farm for Disney and Warner Bros now. They can fail forever and Spider-Man, Batman etc are still going to exist since they can make more cartoons of them forever.
Weirdly, the few and far between non capeshit comics that do come out of America tend to turn into pretty successful movie/tv IPs as well. While publishers still never want to give them a chance or move past publishing more and more capeshit. You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
There are plenty of small publishers out there, anon. and everyone else is moving into the webcomic space. Print floppies like what DC?Marvel puts out is a drowning ship and people are getting out while the getting is good.
That's just Americans in general, they do the same with women.
Americans cannot fathom platonic friendships anymore since American culture revolves around sex.
I'm sorry, I didn't realize Americans were responsible for the multi-million dollar industry that is Japanese doujins.
>that could be inspired by people of African descent
Lol, this is such a fricking reach my dude.
There are no black people in Made in Abyss.
I'm sorry you're too American to tell the difference between a black person and an islander.
This smells like it was types by the greasy cheeto stained hands of an angry comic shop owner. This amount of fricking cope is sovereign citizens-tier.
If I were a comic shop owner, I'd be selling manga and I'd be making bank, what the frick would I be coping about? That my the majority of my black and LBGT+ customers actually like interesting stories that feature black and LBGT+ characters and not corporate rehashes?
>I'd be selling manga and I'd be making bank,
You really wouldn't, otherwise we'd have entire chains dedicated to selling manga here in the States. There's a reason why they typically sell them in Barnes and Nobles.
>I didn't realize Americans were responsible for the multi-million dollar industry that is Japanese doujins.
Ironically, Japanese doujin present more actual friendships than modern American media does nowadays.
>Americans cannot fathom platonic friendships anymore since American culture revolves around sex.
I thought we were sexual prudes? Which is it?
[...] >Shut the frick up, homosexual.
Heterosexual men are more comfortable around maggots than being in the same room as two gay dudes kissing dude. We are genetically designed to see that as abnormal.
>I thought we were sexual prudes? Which is it?
It's both.
Americans are just generally kind of deranged.
Americans of the last decade or so are trained to be fricking prudish as 16th century puritans, except gays. They are to be as openly out there and active as fricking possible in as many public spaces as they can get in on in.
but to straight people absolutely anything sex related makes them cringe and recoil hard.
I have honestly wondered if that is a major part of the attraction to the whole LGBT scene. The fact that is represents and is celebrated as just total freedom. Which I suppose it is since they can make out in a Burger King and be praised for it.
Everyone else if they are making out in a Burger King they are prostitutes, or on drugs, and half the time someone will call the police. For some reason in the US just about Any minor level of affection in public is seen as horrific and disgusting, and lots of times it actually is illegal.
People in America are just repressed to the point of losing their goddamn minds, going on shooting sprees, or becoming closet self loathing masturbators since anything and everything straight sex is evil, awful, sinful, and illegal inside city limits. Be gay and one is free to wear a pink crop top and diddle their boyfriend on aisle 8 in a CVS and no one is going to say shit. Ever notice how one does not ever see any positive and affectionate straight relationship on tv any more?
>and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor.
Please show me a single western cartoon, comic, video game, or TV show made in the last 5 years that has a joke like pic related that makes fun of crossdressers or trannies.
I’m honestly surprised Adult Swim was willing to air any references to this part. They skipped the actual meat of that arc, but it’s flashed back to so frequently it’s like it actually did air
>The West practically invented the funny gay best friend stereotype, zoomer, and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor. If you actually read
By laughed at I don’t mean because they crack a good joke, I mean laughed at because they are homosexuals which isn’t normal and deserves scorn. You will be hard pressed to find a manga series where the gay character is haha funny and not just a thing to laugh AT for being a freak
It's even funnier when a western comic writer very clearly is a fan of manga but when they emulate or reference manga/anime, they do so in a condescending way that makes out manga to be inferior
yeah bro, naruto and sasuke are totally gay and that's why they both had female love interests and naruto exclusively had nose bleeds for hot women, definitely gay
But the only people who did that were Americans, and as we've already established, Americans do not understand platonic relationships.
It's also why so many capeshit characters become gay, like Jon Kent.
Because Americans cannot fathom the idea of two males having a strong bond and not wanting to frick each other.
It's also why American families are so fricked up.
Nah, just Americans.
Please stop trying to pretend that you're normal, you're slowly realizing that you are the outlier, which is why your media is so gay nowadays.
>Americans do not understand platonic relationships.
I like how gays here keep focusing on Americans and saying they're the only ones who do not understand platonic relationships when the Japanese love making platonic relationships romantic and literally outpace the Americans when it comes to this in the forms of the many doujjns they pump out.
>when the Japanese love making platonic relationships romantic
A romantic relationship is by definition not platonic. Only Americans will look at a relationship between two men who have a deep bond and see something sexual.
It's why Americans spent so long making porn of the literal siblings in Supernatural.
>Please stop trying to pretend that you're normal
The irony. You're a narutard.
I literally haven't watched Naruto since like 2007, I'm just not a moronic American like you.
>Only Americans will look at a relationship between two men who have a deep bond and see something sexual.
My dude, you are being a intentionally obtuse about this. No, the Japanese are equally guilty of this and often get violent if they don't get their way but for some reason America lives rent free in your head. Probably some homosexual from some backwater European country.
>No, the Japanese are equally guilty of this
Not really.
When the Japs want to make porn of something, they just make porn, they don't go around insisting that "No, t-there's totally this gay subtext that exists in the original property because it makes my dick hard!"
Which is why so many Japanese artists will make porn of adult characters fricking little girls and boys.
They just enjoy the porn, they don't try to insist that because they drew porn of a character fricking a child it suddenly means that said character is actually totally canonically a pedophile.
That's American behaviour.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Not really. >doesn't explain why >changes the topic completely to talk about porn for some reason
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
2 years ago
Anonymous
't explain why
I literally just explained why.
>I think a big issue there is that the US is fricking FILLED with people who want to look at any two characters sharing a scene together and want to scream how that is irrefutable proof of a LGBT relationship at the top of their lungs as some show of solidarity from the studio. and anyone arguing against that is a bigot that must be silenced.
So are the Japanese and this goes for straight and yuri/yaoi relationships. You just never hear about them because they have their own social media/language barrier that separate us.
>So are the Japanese
Not really, especially not to the same degree.
Again, the Japanese draw metric fricktons of e-girl porn, but you don't see them going around insisting that this means that characters are canonically pedophiles.
Americans however will gladly insist that characters are gay based on fanfics and porn, just look at Jon Kent.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Not really, especially not to the same degree.
You right, they're actually worse about it because
Japanese seem to go way harder on characters having a relationship at all as opposed to being some kind of chaste saint that remains pure. Angry fans will burn a writer's house down for giving a protagonist a boyfriend, before they will attack anyone for not being in the right type of relationship they personally want.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>You right, they're actually worse about it because
Japanese seem to go way harder on characters having a relationship at all as opposed to being some kind of chaste saint that remains pure. Angry fans will burn a writer's house down for giving a protagonist a boyfriend, before they will attack anyone for not being in the right type of relationship they personally want.
That's exclusive to yuricucks, who ironically are a lot like their western counterparts.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Yuri draws the lowest of the low for some reason.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Typically it draws from two groups that have a very high rate of mental illness.
Namely self-hating men who want to self-insert as women because they don't like being male and waifugays who are so insecure that a male character existing near the girl they waifu makes them uncomfortable.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Please let seethe about America while Japanese will do shit like this when they don't what they want
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Animation_arson_attack
2 years ago
Anonymous
That guy committed that attack because he thought they plagiarized his shitty novel, not because of any waifu shenanigans.
This scene in particular: https://youtu.be/ZNV0ybrg8uU
Maybe actually read the shit you link next time instead of making an assumption about something you clearly know nothing about, like a typical American.
>Only Americans will look at a relationship between two men who have a deep bond and see something sexual.
My dude, you are being a intentionally obtuse about this. No, the Japanese are equally guilty of this and often get violent if they don't get their way but for some reason America lives rent free in your head. Probably some homosexual from some backwater European country.
I think a big issue there is that the US is fricking FILLED with people who want to look at any two characters sharing a scene together and want to scream how that is irrefutable proof of a LGBT relationship at the top of their lungs as some show of solidarity from the studio. and anyone arguing against that is a bigot that must be silenced.
There are too damn many people demanding to see some level of validation for their own personal lives in all media they consume. They cannot just let a show go with 2 characters sitting on a couch, they MUST conclude that means there is some secret gay thing going on.
>I think a big issue there is that the US is fricking FILLED with people who want to look at any two characters sharing a scene together and want to scream how that is irrefutable proof of a LGBT relationship at the top of their lungs as some show of solidarity from the studio. and anyone arguing against that is a bigot that must be silenced.
So are the Japanese and this goes for straight and yuri/yaoi relationships. You just never hear about them because they have their own social media/language barrier that separate us.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Japanese seem to go way harder on characters having a relationship at all as opposed to being some kind of chaste saint that remains pure. Angry fans will burn a writer's house down for giving a protagonist a boyfriend, before they will attack anyone for not being in the right type of relationship they personally want.
>NOOOOO YOU CAN'T JUST INCLUDE COMIC BOOKS IN THE COMICS SALES FIGURES BECAUSE UM.... >UM... >THEY COME FROM THIS COUNTRY >all the other countries are fine though
Why are weebs so weird about this?
Reminder that japanese manga artists are fricking killing themselves trying to complete their work with horrible work schedules, basically living a life of a slave
Is it not just as bad in the comic industry? I thought they're paid pretty horribly.
Imagine working yourself sick and your comic gets outsold by manga.
It's just FUD that gets posted regularly on Cinemaphile by people who don't understand publishing.
Manga artists are paid the same way all real authors are paid, with royalties on their book sales. The page rates they quote are merely advances.
Manga artists aren't slaves. They don't even earn a "wage," because they're technically self-employed.
The main problem with western comics is the hamfisted sjw shit they have, nobody would bat an eye if they at least did it in an entertaining way, manga has gay and even troony shit and it doesn't feel annoying at all, most of the time is even an important plot point like the troony fire punch had, no wonder most alphabet people are into anime/manga since they appeal more to them
That's just American media in general now. They cannot just have a gay or trans person appear organically in the story and take part in it like everyone else. There must be some very in your face >THIS IS A TRANS PERSON LOOK AT THEM!
thing going on. And it is incredibly jarring for a viewer since it ruins the immersion for twitter bragging points from a writer or director.
>most of the time is even an important plot point like the troony fire punch had
What the frick, no it wasn't, there was barely any lead up to it either. If some character with healing factor said the same shit in a comic, people would still be b***hing about it today
It's like a whole series format of those odd episodes of Star Trek where weird unexplainable shit is going on and you just have to sit through it and not understand a damn thing until the last 5 minutes then it all comes clear. Watchmen is like that until the last episode.
ask yourself why would a newcomer even begin to try to get into big 2 capeshit. Even if you like a character or story they're never going to have a definitive conclusion, the next writer/editor can and likely will shit all over it, and it comes with a frickload of baggage to begin with. They are fundamentally bad for long term story telling outside of being vehicles to reuse IPs. That's why indy, creator owned, manga, etc. are gaining ground with manga outright kicking the shit out of them
>pick up a manga volume >it’s thick, like a few hundred pages >pick up comic >it’s thin and like 10 pages
I feel like Id be better of wiping my ass with comic pages than reading them
>dress up as Spider-Man >theres like 20 others there >dress up as non fotm anime character >get decent attention because you are likely the only one in that outfit
Anyone who thinks western comics are on an upward trajectory based on these reports will be in for a rude awakening in 2023. There are three major problems with 2021 comics sales stats:
1. Pent-up demand carried over from the pandemic era (and goodwill from fans who felt an obligation to save their LCS) boosted 2021 sales. This is an anomaly that will not happen again.
2. Prices rose significantly across the board. So an increase in dollar figures does not represent an increase in readership. It's also not something publishers can do again soon.
3. 2021 is the first year where both DC and Marvel sales figures were estimates. Comichron is almost certainly basing estimates on outdated, pre-shutdown number of retailers. These numbers represent optimistic guesses at best. Garbage in, garbage out.
All of this cheerleading is going to hurt comic shops in the long run. The more they lie about these numbers, the more people put their heads in the sand, the more likely necessary changes will come too late.
Unsurprisingly it's cause of Manga. Manga are (generally) written from start to finish by their original creators, which means you don't have to worry too much stories jumping around or becoming stories they weren't meant to be later on.
Say what you will about One Piece, but as much as it has changed, it's still mostly the same as when it started over 2 decades ago, because Oda's still in charge of the story and art from day one.
Same thing with Demon Slayer. You largely know Demon Slayer's going to stay true to its story and vision, and that its characters and story wont change beyond what creator Koyoharu Gotouge wants.
You dont generally have to worry about weird race swaps, last minute gays, complete tonal shifts, or shitty retcons unless the creator wants to do that, and generally that hasn't been a problem in manga.
With Comics they're all IPs now, and get passed around from writer to writer. Most of whom end up treating any given IP as a chance to push their own personal fan fiction.
They dont care about what character's original personalities were like, they barely care about the character's history, and even if they do they're all too happy to retcon shit for their own personal amusement and/or beliefs.
There's little to no point in investing in western characters or properties, because in 5 or 10 years they're probably going to be completely different characters and properties. Anime characters will largely be the same at their core 10 or 20 years from now. They'll have grown in the narrative in that time period, but they'll still largely be the same character at their core.
Both are among the best the industry has ever produced so I'm not seeing the drawbacks here >b-but muh hiatus MOMMY I WANT IT NOW
Quality is more important than quantity.
INFLATION MEANS POPULARITY
I just got back from a glorified basement clearance event in my hometown. Comics are finally selling what they're worth now that $5 is meaningless.
Because the absolute state of Marvel and DC's "big" heroes at this point is absolutely pathetic.
That's not even getting into the whole status quo stuff where these companies absolutely refuse to let any of these characters make some meaningful growth and in most cases do the opposite where a character regresses.
Seriously is this real!? Did they ruin batman and catwomans relationship? WHY! >I haven't been reading comics for awhile. (been reading manga instead) >WTF HAPPENED?
Yes Batman 125.This isn't a new thing though, Batman has been a cuck in regards to Catwoman for the past several years now.
You were deceived. Spideygays and DDgays don't know what good means, they're cucks that devour anything with the name of their favorite characters on the cover.
Seriously is this real!? Did they ruin batman and catwomans relationship? WHY! >I haven't been reading comics for awhile. (been reading manga instead) >WTF HAPPENED?
>last month >burnt out on superhero comics >look at "independent" comics instead >see the cover for 'Where Starships Go To Die' >read description >"a terrifying new sci-fi thriller from AfterShock Comics. Witness an underwater salvage team's attempt to recover Earth's first interstellar spaceship" >hmm, might be good >start reading >pic related (scenes from first issue)
After reading the recent storytimes of pain, I don't see myself purchasing any of this shit. I don't want to be lectured constantly by a short-sighted egomaniac "auteurs" in their endless quest of "self-identity against the entire world and the very fabric of reality itself" >"It's okay to be short"? How dare you! Stop patronizing me! [cries with anger] I'm short, but that's only because of how society puts importance in people's height; short is a social construct! Society must burn down because it threats short people like shit! [people were stunned, because SHE TOLD THE TRUTH!] >What do you mean "I didn't mean to"? You fricking piece of shit! You're not a true ally and you will never be, but keep trying as hard as you can, or you're an every bigger piece of shit! [and then everybody clapped and she became super popular because she seemed like a nice person to be around] >[Conclusion] thanks to my self-introspection, I realized that I only had to believe in my true self to realize how tall I TRULY was. I was actually taller than everyone else all along! It proves that all those peasants have always been beneath my magnificent self. Ah ah, they're so dumb they don't even realize how superior to them I am in every way! I shall squish them all like tiny bugs!
Yeah, I'll pass on that.
Yea, the people who pretend that "independent" or "creator-owned" comics don't have just as much of the shitty hamfisted writing and moronic American politics as capeshit are in such immense denial that it's almost sad.
Literally the only way you can escape this dumb shit nowadays is by just not consuming American media.
Honestly, it's kinda fun to just pick a random new comic and see how many issues it takes to devolve into weird American agitprop and horribly hamfisted writing that feels like a shitpost.
A comic called The Joneses about people who get superpowers after a pandemic, it's pretty generic.
Setting is very blah and boring, the only interesting part is the secrecy aspect and the whole "superhero family vs supervillain family" thing.
the thing nobody notices about Marvel is when they do Movies and Disney Plus series, they really do use properties that were not as popular in the mainstream. They turned C and D list Characters and titles into A and B list titles. Vision and Scarlett Witch, Shang Chi, Eternals, Thor, even Captain America, their popularity 20 years ago was small compared to now, and many of their back issues are leaving comic bins and hitting aales registers.
Man, this thread is just depressing. I knew the situation of western comics was decadent, but i didn't know it was that bad. I grrew up reading comics here in Brazil back in the 90's, and, while i was never a super addict, they had a place in my heart. And yeah i know that time passes and i'm not the target audience anymore and stuff, but it's just kinda sad to see old friends left in such state, and people pretending it's fine, 'better than it ever was', according to some.
What sucks is that, way i see it, there's really not many alternatives, at least not in western comics.
Anyone thinking this is actual American comics have never left their house. Just go to any Barnes and Noble in America. Manga sections are buzzing with young people looking at new fresh manga, comic sections are dead and just have legacy comic collections dating back to 1960 that zoomers don't fricking care about.
Back Issues of Amazing Spider-Man, Deadpool, Wolverine, and Flash are all being bought up. Sales data is just harder to track for back issues, but many comic dealers are sustaining business based on merchandise, toys, and back issues more than current issues. In a way comic books are like Nike Logo T-Shirts, as the product also serves as marketing and advertising.
You weren't alive in the mid 2005s so you're unaware. But Naruto and Sasuke really are just that queer. More Naruto than Sasuke really, Sasuke doesn't care much at all.
The displays of childhood friendship started happening in filler during the final war arc, Naruto didn't even know who Sasuke was at the start of the series.
>Muh twitter leftists calling every friendship gay
Yeah this is a problem but this specific case has been happening before Twitter existed. Before Tumblr existed, etc.
Sasuke really should've been female.
>Gay boomer continues to cope
Keep going, this is only going to get better and better.
Just further proof that Americans cannot understand the idea of having strong emotions for another male, they will literally insist that dudes with wives and children are actually gay.
No wonder American "families" are so fricked up.
Comics for children sell.
Comics for manchildren don't sell.
As long as Marvel and DC remain stagnant, you'll see Cinemaphile complaining that comics don't sell.
This! They're morons
You're a moron, troony
The last thing they’ve done is remain stagnant you absolute moron. They’ve been undergoing massive woke changes since 2015.
They’re not selling specifically because they stopped being stagnant.
>includes manga sales
Oh no, Cinemaphilecksuckers
No, it doesn't include manga, but it does include Scholastic.
>No, it doesn't include manga
>1.47 billion out of the 2.075 billion are literally manga sales in the US.
>The remaining 0.435 billion are not even limited to capeshit.
Kek.
Capeshit losing the game on homefield.
It's over Cinemaphilecklovers.
Do morons weebs know that western graphic novels are also a thing and not solely a manga thing?
Wouldn't that be in the "all other genres" column?
Are you going to claim manga is a genre now?
Well yes, and certainly in these statistics, are you blind ?
>capeshitters getting btfo
Like clockwork.
At this point the Disney movies are literally the only thing propping up the entire capeshit genre.
>manga sales in the US.
This is what's so impressive.
Manga has outsold American comics in every other country, but it's just in the last few years it has begun to devour the American market.
If Marvel doesn't do anything about this they'll start losing money on their comics.
>If Marvel doesn't do anything about this they'll start losing money on their comics.
Don't worry, all they have to do is kill some A-list capeshitter to bait fanboys and bring whoever back a year later. Problem solved!
They don't care, now it's all about crappy movies
Comics are nothing but an IP farm for Disney and Warner Bros now. They can fail forever and Spider-Man, Batman etc are still going to exist since they can make more cartoons of them forever.
Weirdly, the few and far between non capeshit comics that do come out of America tend to turn into pretty successful movie/tv IPs as well. While publishers still never want to give them a chance or move past publishing more and more capeshit. You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
They are already losing money on comics. For decades marvels been publishing Captain Marvel at a loss just to keep the copyright for the name away from DC, now they just do that but with every title
Marvel doesn't give a shit dude, they're a multi-billion dollar corporations that has way too much money and can fund whatever they want. They will instead give the license to Japanese artists to make manga or new stories and sell them in America AND Japan.
It's embarrassing though, Marvel comics of the past are inspiring most popular movies of our times right now, yet the modern comics are so bad they fail to ride the wave of popularity at all. Like think about it, this is the most popular characters such as Iron Man, Captain America or Ant Man have ever been, and they still can't sell the comics for shit.
>Like think about it, this is the most popular characters such as Iron Man, Captain America or Ant Man have ever been, and they still can't sell the comics for shit.
Because kids see Chris Evans and Robert Downey Jr. doing all this crazy CGI shit, and then they go read the comic but don't understand what the frick is going on, stories and art are handled by different people every week or so, and their depictions don't look like Hollywood actors. They would need to redo the whole current structure, but in Marvel's mind, why bother? They could use comics as a niche and bring all the big bucks from their Hollywood and gaming investments. Shit like Spider-Man on Playstation is fricking massive and has done much more to bring Spider-Man to modern audiences than comics ever will. This is just our reality, anon.
I bet the licensed manga will be better too
>Manga has outsold American comics in every other country, but it's just in the last few years it has begun to devour the American market
Bruh, the writing's been on the wall for comics since The Electric Tale of Pikachu.
>At the time of its release Issue #1 was the best-selling manga issue, and best-selling comic book of any type, in the United States.[1] The issue sold 1.001 million copies, the highest for a single comic book since 1993.[2] The first volume, The Electric Tale of Pikachu!, was released on September 5, 1999.
Also, reminder
>Toshihiro Ono (小野 敏洋, Ono Toshihiro) is a Japanese manga artist and graphic novelist. He was born in Aichi, Japan.
>He is best known for the Pokémon manga based on the animation series: "The Electric Tale of Pikachu" published by Viz Media (known as Dengeki Pikachu and published by Shogakukan in Japan). He also illustrated the first two volumes of the manga adaption of the Crest of the Stars trilogy, and draws hentai under the pen name of Kamirenjaku Sanpei.[1]
The moral of the story is hire more futa artists.
>Mother's Basement
Opinion discarded.
>Reading Golden Wind so you know the ending of the next part and which characters survives part 3 before reading part 3
absolute cringe.
that's fricking moronic, why would you ever read jojo parts out of order?
Amerimutt capeshit readers are legitimately moronic is why.
the sad thing is there must of been people tricked into this moron's read order
The descriptions for SBR and JoJolion are funny because they're 100% accurate
I remember I wanted to make Basement order for MCU, like
>1. Captain Marvel: it introduces Nick Fury, Coulson, aliens
>2. Doctor Strange: it introduces Dr. Strange (will pay off in a BIG WAY in Winter Soldier) and magic into Marvel universe and concept of Infinity Stones while feeling adjacent
>3. Avengers: it introduces the main cast and Thanos as the big threat, keeps viewer engaged by mysterious characters who they will learn about later
if this is real someone explain to me WHY the only thing co talks about is capeshit
People like to complain, and there's a lot to complain about capeshit nowadays. Also, i think maybe many here have grown reading that stuff, so they feel the shock of the modern changes the most.
so where the FRICK do people talk about CURRENT comic
and you better not fricking say twitter
Honestly, i have no clue. Twitter isn't really a place for any human being with a soul, i don't think anyone has serious or civilizaed discussions about comics or anything in there.
What's the alternative then? I'd guess either here or leddit.
c'mon there mist be at least ONE place i can leave this shithole for
It's a pick your poison situation, aheuah. I like it here sometimes, it's nice to vent and complain. You can also legit discuss stuff, as long as you offer good evidence to support your opinions, and you're prepared for the fact that there will be people there just to take a piss outta you
>The remaining 0.435 billion are not even limited to capeshit.
It's even worse when you realize TWD Deluxe is released two times a month.
RIP OP, we barely knew him!
Seppuku was his only option after such a shamefur dispray, he did the right thing
Why the frick is manga selling so much?
Because they are actually good.
This isn't true insomuch that the shit that sells is godawful Weekly Shonen Jump battle shonen and garbage like Attack on Titan. It's because that stuff has more "hype" for morons and is better than cape comics at stringing readers along with its plot twists.
The actual good manga isn't what's selling.
>The actual good manga
Do tell what this is.
Holy Grail of Eris, Hiraiyasumi, Liar Satsuki Can See Death, lots of stuff.
Literally who
There's a world beyond Weekly Shonen Jump and Redditcore stuff, anon.
Pretending to like obscure things does not make you sophisticated or interesting
I wish manga were selling more and more because of how much more diverse it is as a medium but it's closer to what you say.
You're still wrong though. Manga sells a bunch because it's much more unabashed children's action / adventure fare than the current state of western comics. That's it. Give it some credit for having a lot less derivations from formula.
I don't like shit like BHA but at least I can take a step back and say 'well at least it is what it says it is on the tin'.
I wonder how much of manga's success and "hype" can be attributed to s weekly release schedule instead of a monthly one? Feels like some Scheherazade shit where every week is a new cliffhanger and people are motivated to keep reading, even for shitty stories
>I wonder how much of manga's success and "hype" can be attributed to s weekly release schedule instead of a monthly one?
A lot of manga are also monthly, so...
Yes but it's usually been WSJ stuff that contributes the most to sales, not Jojolion or whatever
>Yes but it's usually been WSJ stuff that contributes the most to sales
You'd be surprised, quite a few of the bestsellers in America are monthly series.
Why is Toilet Bound Hanako-kun such a blowout success all of the sudden? Saw volumes on Target shelves recently
I think it got big around the time it got an anime back in 2019 or 2020.
>not only is Noragami still ongoing, but still manages to hang onto the chart
It’s shocking it’s never got another season of the anime
Wow, the modern manga industry is such shit.
Shut the frick up Boco, you moronic waste of human flesh.
Most of those have popular anime which is where the sales come from as anime is basically intended to advertise the manga and in fact some manga have been axed (usually in WSJ) because the anime adaptations didn't provide enough of a sales bump.
At least three series I'm actively reading are getting adaptations next year (Kimi wa Houkago Insomnia, Skip and Loafer and Ippon Again) and I can see Insomnia and Skip and Loafer getting huge boosts so long as the adaptations aren't shit. Summer Time Rendering would probably be pretty damn popular if it was on Crunchyroll instead of Disney+ jail.
>some manga have been axed (usually in WSJ) because the anime adaptations didn't provide enough of a sales bump.
normally is mangas that were alredy bleeding sales and the anime was a last ditch effort to safe it
What's selling in comic world? Does the top ten include five Batman spin-offs?
It's historically much less of a social stigma to read manga in public in Japan than it is to read comics in the US. Especially previous decades before superhero stuff or stereotypically nerdy things became mainstream. A grown man reading Spider-Man on the subway in the 90s was not really a thing that happened as much as a grown man reading a manga on the train to work at the same time period.
I don't think that has much impact on manga's success specifically in America.
Good format and fairly cheap. Plus it’s black and white which makes copying the art work easier (if you’re a kid who wants to be an artist it’s easier to copy manga)
>Fairly cheap
$13
$13 for ~200 pages is not expensive compared to western comics.
$13 for 200 pages, as opposed to $15 for 100 pages. Unfortunately manga is just a better deal for most people.
Manga being cheaper certainly factor in, but mainly because there's nothing in western comics being published today that anyone wants to actually read.
The whole direct market comic market is propped up by collectors and variant cover speculation, and it's dying.
Because it tells stories people actually want to read, and has artwork that isn't ugly.
I think one of the biggest problems with American comics is distribution. Manga would be far less popular if it was sold the way American comics are- you can't just walk into a barnes and noble and pick up the newest comic book like you can manga, you have to find a dedicated comic store and ask for the wafer-thin 15 page toilet paper book just to read it.
This anon is sort of right, manga doesn't have better stories but it has more diverse stories instead of capeshit. When an American comic that isn't about superheroes somehow actually gets published it usually becomes a cultural touchstone because we're so starved for them
>you can't just walk into a barnes and noble and pick up the newest comic book like you can manga
Yes you can.
where do you live? i've never seen them before in my life
Maybe you're just a moron.
You can get a trade maybe, but not floppy
Who the frick would ever want to buy a floppy? You can buy collected editions of manga or collected editions of comics.
>Manga would be far less popular if it was sold the way American comics are-
Most manga is purchased through digital distribution in the west as are comics
Everything is digital though. Are book stores still popular?
Book stores are somewhat popular, most sales are likely still physical since plenty of people just order their physical copies online.
Streaming provided a huge anime boom and easy access to content, that growth obviously spills over into manga because in most cases it's directly adapted.
Since capeshit in convoluted extended universes basically are the US market, all it needed was a viable alternative to take over.
There's no variety, if you don't like capshit you're out of luck basically from the big 2.
Variety. If you like action, romance, mystery, thriller, horror, OP power fantasies, they've got all of that and more. American comics are much narrower in the variety they offer.
It's not all the same, but it's all held to a higher standard of quality than capeshit.
Comics have a higher intrinsic collector value than manga
A fraction of people who read comics have any interest in that kind of thing.
Man I collect comics for fun and they're fricking worthless. Outside of shit from 70 years ago comics are barely worth the paper they're printed on. I've scooped up whole runs, dozens of issues for under a hundred bucks.
>Comics have a higher intrinsic collector value than manga
Imagine being this deluded.
>Comes in with a longbox of hundreds of comics.
>Retailer: Best I can do is $10, most of these are worthless.
This. It's a lot easier to sell a manga collection than a comic collection.
B-but Action Comics #1 is really valuable...
Key Golden Age and Silver Age comics are valuable because they're rare and the demand is high.
But every comic that came after the Silver Age has been worthless. Most comicbook stores don't even want some comics because they take up space and they won't ever sell.
Manga on the other hand is very easy to sell. You can easily get $100 for the complete collection of Naruto. You're still getting scammed, but you're still getting more than 10 times the money for a fraction of the page count.
>But every comic that came after the Silver Age has been worthless
I agree with most of what you type, but there are some valuable Bronze age comics (TMNT issue 1 for example, a 9.8 sold for 250,000 dollars not too long ago)
>TMNT issue 1 for example, a 9.8 sold for 250,000 dollars not too long ago
A CGC 9.8 is going to inflate the price of any book, and especially if it's the first of a brand like TMNT.
But most comics can't even be sold for a couple of cents.
Every single thing people collect is going to have a standout example that sold for a ridiculous amount. That’s not the norm, what 99.9% of people have in their closet isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on
You said "every comic". Go to the cgc forums, there are a ton of bronze age keys selling for thousands, whether its Giant Size X-Men 1 or The Crow 1 . And if you are going to picky, then a bunch of your shitty torn up silver age comics aren't worth 3 dollars either. There was no reason to even mention that about comics after the silver age, there are keys in every age and worthless comics even from the silver age.
Collectors nearly killed the industry.
>Implying that the industry is alive.
As I.P farm.
Really this is all manga is too. It's just that manga printing is incredibly cheap so any money made from even the bad series are still doing okay. But Manga publishers have a much smarter means of maintaining an ever revolving door IP farm for movies, games, and animated series. When one publisher has on average about 10-15 different stories going a month, with 1-2 cancelling and being replaced each month they have a huge reserve of potential media franchises.
Meanwhile DC and Marvel keep the same 10 or so main heroes going, and will occasionally get a flavor of the week added on too like Jamie Reyes in the 00s and Kamala in the 2010s.
>When one publisher has on average about 10-15 different stories going a month
Lol, try 100-120 different stories going each month.
Most publishers publish more than one magazine, with magazines aimed at every audience.
Hell, there's a publisher that's dedicated exclusively to publishing smut magazines, including stuff like Comic LO.
yes but no, manga is really profitable independandly of anime/merchandaising
the IP farm is just an extra that they enjoy but dont focus only on it
Collecting is a niche hobby that doesn't represent the casual reader
This is another plus for manga though. Manga is just printed entertainment, nothing more, Makes it a LOT easier to reprint more without any trouble or increase in price since it's just a standard value across the board.
No comic printed after the 70s is ever going to be worth shit since there are legions upon legions of "Collectors" out there hoarding them all up. Plus publishers doing shit like foil covers, hardbacks, alt covers etc jacking up prices even more. This makes them even less accessible for casual readers.
have a nice day Vinylhomosexual
You don't know japanise politics
Cheaper and more variety, DC/Marvel eggs are all in the same basket.
>Hear about Dragon Ball Z, all your Mexican employees and wife's black boyfriends recommend you to check it out like it's the best shit ever
>But best not watch DBZ anime as it literally skips half the story and context for rest of the series, also has bad dub and bad redone soundtrack, and in general a poor adaptation filled with fillers and padding out because it caught up with manga too quickly
>Fine, read manga
>It's nothing like people described and just some gag manga for children.
The Mexican employees probably watched the Mexican dub, which was good. And lots of people watched and enjoyed the filler not knowing it was filler.
the dub for both db and dbz are good
or at least the ones i watched
Batman Volume 3 part 1 volume 1-13 and Volume 3 part 2 volume 1-6 because of a new writer and reboot of the series again.
>N-no actually to read this run you need to check out comic X and Y before! Also make sure to read the crossovers with character Z. Also there's a new Crisis event that'll reboot the entire universe soon!
vs
>just start at the beginning bro
>Does not need 40-60 years of DEEP LORE backstory to get what the frick is going on
>Generally made for a wide audience to pick up and read at any time, not just the super dedicated fans
>Found in a wide variety of locations across town and very accessible
>Most are made for kids and young teens and contain themes that kids and young teens like most
>Most protagonists are kids or highschool students
>No crossovers or crossover events spilling into other books! One does not need to pick up an issue of One Piece, Demon Slayer, and JuJu Kaisen to know what is happening in Tokyo Revengers this week.
>SIGNIFICANTLY wider range of stories, settings, themes, and topics than superheroes in tights.
Basically comics right now are only written to be consumed by the same group that read comics 20 years ago, and nobody else. There is really not much anyone wants to see and it has been near 100% eradicated as a kids market. Comics existed for the last century as the main kids entertainment medium until very recently where it turned into 20 something or older superfans only. Meanwhile Kids fricking love manga.
in a wide variety of locations across town and very accessible
Is it though? I know Barnes and Noble carries a massive variety, but those aren’t everywhere. I think the only store I have ever seen manga in besides that is Target, and their selection is extremely limited
Because japanese authors do a little unexpected thing that is to give their audience what they want, instead of making comics with the sole purpose of pushing an agenda.
People wanted that ending in AOT? Or the last half of Naruto Shippuden?
You aren’t going to win with every story. The most popular titles are usually the ones most likely to end in controversy because there are too many people to please.
And really, AoT got so much flak it’s getting retconned in the anime next year. So yea, they do listen
What now? They're changing the ending of that shit?
>Or the last half of Naruto Shippuden?
Yes? Fans were pretty vocal about
>We wanna see Madara
>We wanna see Narutos dad
>We wanna see Naruto Vs Sasuke
You could argue nobody asked for Kaguya but you can't say he didn't give them what they wanted. By Shippuden nobody wanted them acting like ninjas anymore and just wanted ninja themed wizards, so he gave them super mechs made of magic and apparently it kept selling.
Manga is much easier to get into.
Most of manga only has 1 guy in charge of drawing and writing so you get consistency.
With comics, its just a wreck of different writers and artists trying to tell their own stories for the same character.
Also 1 writer, not this series taking wildly different approaches to literally everything after 10issues. Reading any ongoings of the last few years are a fricking nightmare. The next writer comes on board and it might as well be a new title. They will definitely contradict everything the last guy established.
It really is fricking jarring to have the art shift from issue to issue. Also if you want to follow a big event completely, then you have to read a bunch of other tie-in books that have characters you may not give a shit about
Which is now a year round thing. There is ALWAYS an event going on somewhere and now all books require reading some other third party shit I never cared about to get to the end of a single monthly book storyline.
...every goddamn time, especially Marvel
For what it's worth, I actually enjoyed Doomsday Clock. Consistent art and tone from start to finish. Why can't we get more stuff like that?
I cannot get over how Doomsday Clock took more time to put out 12 issues than a tv series.
A fricking tv series was announced, cast, went through preproduction, costume tests, set design, principle filming, on location filming, post production, effects, editing, compositing, and played an entire season from pilot to finale in less time than Johns put out 12 issues of a comic book.
Why not just bundle all this shit into one book anyway? What's the point of floppies?
>cheap
>clear and easy starting point
>dynamic art that catch the eye
>1 to 1 adaptation that brings series into the public eye
>variety
This is the biggest thing. Unlike capeshit, manga has genras other than soap opera.
that's a big factor sure, but manga would still be outselling capeshit just counting battle shonen so that's not all of it
Would it be fair to say battle shounen is to manga what capeshit is to comics?
>Would it be fair to say battle shounen is to manga what capeshit is to comics?
It literally is. This isn't the 90s anymore where you got cool, edgy stuff like YuYu Hakusho, they have grown ass homies getting hyped ffor superheroes.
MHA is still relevant? Or is there more now?
>No American one note politics
>No darkies
>No "As seen in issue #47 of special legacy ultimate war part 3"
>No world or settings besides American city
i kind of like how a lot of Manga series will take place in their own totally unique world with it's own thing going on. That shit never happens in American books.
Frick you, Killer B was cool.
Eat shit, narutard.
I come here and all I see are social justice, gays and anti-white stories and all I can think is "man the newest genshin impact event is great
I get to watch characters I like have fun and interact in humorous ways"
>"man the newest genshin impact event is great
Dude you're a gachatroony.
better than being a real troony
Because it's all the same
sexy women and no leftists, that's about it.
>and no leftists
lol
learn moonrunes and check nip twitter. The woman who makes Witch Hat Atelier is full blown lefty.
Witch Hat Atelier is one of the most beautiful comics out there right now, please don't ruin things for me
Clear separation of demographics.
If you like yaoi you don't have to worry about your yaoi manga suddenly becoming a hetero romcom where the main male character marries a woman.
If you like harems you don't have to worry about your harem manga suddenly shifting perspective to an otome game narrative about a woman being chased by 12 dudes.
If you like action manga full of gunfights and setpieces you don't have to worry about said manga turning into a story about the daily life of a geologist studying rock deposits.
Everyone gets what they want, and authors know to give their audience what they want (generally speaking).
It's why in the west publishers like Zenescope and publications like Heavy Metal Magazine are largely irrelevant, while something like pic related, which is literally just "softcore" porn can sell 3.5 million volumes in 5 years in Japan.
Cute characters!
Variety
Provides something for everyone, while comics basically only have kid's stories, capeshit, and stuff for gay people/women like Gender Queer and March and Smile.
For a few reasons
1. Variety, with manga you have just about every conceivable genre covered. slice of life, action, romance, fantasy. comedy, sports, the list goes on and they are generally pretty consistent. Comics are mostly interested in pushing cape shit and you really have to look for things more suited to your interests.
2. Simple beginning and end points, Other anons mentioned this point but starting a manga is easy, start at chapter 1 and go from there. But Manga (not always or maybe even too soon) eventually end. Full Metal Alchemist had a story, told it to the best of it's ability and ended. Meanwhile Batman has been fighting the same clown for what, 60 years now? and the only thing that has changed is how violent that clown has gotten between depictions and it will probably keep on happening for another 60 years.
3. Consistency, I'm not gonna be reading DBZ only for Goku to stop his fight with Cell to have a monologue about how cool black people are, nor am I going to see an embarrassingly written rape story in Azumanga Daioh. When manga wants to dabble a touchy subject they generally try to weave in carefully into the narrative so that it fits and doesn't come off as a "Sonic Says" moment.
Exactly. Perfect points.
Another problem, though it might fall on the 3rd point you mentioned, is that western comics often have a multitude of writers for the same character. This can lead to problems because it might cause a lack of consistency, since each writer will do the character based on their point of view. When you have 1~2 people responsible for the story, it becomes so much more consistent.
I think comics should indeed have a beggining, mid point and end. Once it reached the end, they could either do a few side stories, or an alternative story, tell a known story from a diffrerent point of view, or just create another character. There's no need to reuse the same characters over and over and over for decades.
>praising your own post
Maybe you shouldn’t have redditspaced both of them
Probably shoulda been a 4th point but yeah, that's another pro for manga. They are generally written by a single person or group of people and thanks to that they know the story, the tone and characters. Comics can have so many writers with different ideas for characters that between writers one character can really become multiple
>I literally can not conceive the idea human beings can agree with one another
This isn't twitter silly
>Simple beginning and end points
Why don't they push more self-contained stories like The Long Halloween and Red Son? Hell, even normalgays seemed to like that Injustice comic from a few years back
Yeah, i feel that graphic novels that just tell a concise story are often successful. Take Kraven's Last Hunt, for example. It just told kravens downfall, it didn't push it for several unecessary issues. One of the best spiderman stories i've read, and one i'll always remember.
>nor am I going to see an embarrassingly written rape story in Azumanga Daioh.
>don't think about gal cleaning don't think about gal cleaning don't think about gal cleaning
I know "it has something for everyone" is a meme, but Manga has something for everyone. Name your genre and it exists. Can Marvel and DC provide this variety?
Why would Marvel and DC provide something for everyone? They have their target audience the same way Jump has. If you have something else besides capes go look at another publisher.
Something for everyone.
>several times cheaper
>tons of genres
>continuity isn't a shitshow
>generally relatively consistent quality within a series
>generally a relatively big heads up if a series is going to be shit/canceled
>appeals to multiple target audiences
>willing to overtly use sex to sell
it_is_a_mystery.jpg
>excellent coom material
>nice art
That's all you needed.
Nah, he's garbage.
Manga can be incredibly pretentious, especially slice of life shit.
>Easily digestible content, manga generally have clear beginnings and a stronger focus thanks to the industry being creator driven.
>Far less insular, resulting in a more diverse group of content creators (including far more prolific women working on what they want to create, resulting in titles that draw in a greater margin of the female demographic than comics ever could)
>Less politics, less preaching, because shockingly people don't like being preached to.
>Less politics, less preaching, because shockingly people don't like being preached to.
I think you underestimate how much manga preaches/is political. Plenty of fricking manga have messages to them, some of them political, some less so.
Detective Conan incorporates a moral into cases on the regular, YKK's about how global warming is gonna frick us all, GITS:SAC's an anime but was about both appreciating and preserving print media in one season and the plight of refugees in another, shittons of shoujo ai and shounen ai manga naturally address discrimination against gays and lesbians, every other isekai has a racism is bad actually message, there are plenty of girl power manga, etc.
I have no fricking clue where you got the idea that manga isn't preachy. Hell, even harem manga will commonly have an arc about respecting boundaries involving some skeevy butthole hitting on one of the heroines no matter how much she protests if not trying to get an arranged marriage with her.
Also there's a bajillion teachers/farmers/tradesmen/salaried workers are under appreciated manga, and more than a few anti-suicide manga. Manga's just as fricking preachy and political as comics if not more.
So I guess this is just a tacit admission that western comics brand of politics is poison then?
I've read all of YKK and own 40 volumes of Detective Conan and they were not preachy at all. Do you think merely having a message within a story is automatically preachy? Preachiness involves terrible execution.
>Preachiness involves terrible execution.
Cool No True Scotsman. b***h, just say western comics have shitty writing if that's what you mean. Preachy means being preached to, it has frick all to do with writing quality.
>So I guess this is just a tacit admission that western comics brand of politics is poison then?
Such as?
If anything it's a direct admission that the problem isn't politics, it's quality.
Well for example, taking a simple concept as "not being racist to each other" and making it unpalatable by being hypocritical about it like playing favourites or even dismissing or laughing off the suffering of others just because they aren't part of the group that's oppressed the most.
>Well for example, taking a simple concept as "not being racist to each other" and making it unpalatable by being hypocritical about it like playing favourites or even dismissing or laughing off the suffering of others just because they aren't part of the group that's oppressed the most.
Yeah, that sounds like shitty writing as opposed to politics.
Now look up what didactic means, b***h.
you fricking mongoloid, "preachy" DOES NOT mean "to preach". holy shit you are moronic. go suck dick.
> in the manner of a teacher, particularly so as to treat someone in a patronizing way.
"slow-paced, didactic lecturing"
herp fricking derp
>Yeah, that sounds like shitty writing as opposed to politics.
It's both shitty writing and shitty American politics.
Which is kind of the point.
American writers being inundated in shitty and toxic American politics has an immense impact on their writing, which in turn results in it being shitty, predictable, and often times embarrassing (at least to any normal person, and especially to the majority of non-Americans).
Unfortunately this is something that you'll probably never admit to because like most Americans your head is planted so firmly up your ass that you could tongue-punch your prostate.
>It's both shitty writing and shitty American politics.
White dudes, amirite? isn't politics, even if you're obsession with the minority of frickwits that talk like that sways your vote and even if those same frickwits occasionally get writing gigs.
>di·dac·tic
/dīˈdaktik/
Learn to pronounce
adjective
intended to teach, particularly in having moral instruction as an ulterior motive.
>"a didactic novel that set out to expose social injustice"
Oh, hey, a completely fricking on point use of didactic in a sentence.
See above and then choke on my wiener.
>White dudes, amirite?
I'm black actually.
>even if you're obsession with the minority of frickwits that talk like that sways your vote and even if those same frickwits occasionally get writing gigs.
No, it just ensures that I read manga instead of comics.
That's part of WHY I've read tons of manga yet can count the number of comics I've read on two hands.
>I'm black actually.
I think you misread what I said if you thought that was addressed at you and not in reference to.
>Well for example, taking a simple concept as "not being racist to each other" and making it unpalatable by being hypocritical about it like playing favourites or even dismissing or laughing off the suffering of others just because they aren't part of the group that's oppressed the most.
That's not just done by white writers, it's done by American writers in general, whether they're white, black, Hispanic, or Asian.
I didn't say it was done by white writers. I was using "white dudes, amirite" as a shorthand example for it being done.
You're still not understanding what I'm saying, just let it go.
>I was using "white dudes, amirite" as a shorthand example for it being done.
Maybe next time you should put quotation marks in your post if you're trying to quote something said.
But yes, saying "white dudes, amirite" is part of that annoying American politics just as much as if you went "straight dudes, amirite" or "dudes, amirite" or "black dudes, amirite."
It's all annoying gender/race autism that just serves to drive away readers since it's almost always embarrassingly-written and patronizing.
>Something described as "didactic" is often overburdened with instruction to the point of being dull. Or it might be pompously instructive or moralistic.
merriam-webster are alt right trolls!
(prē′chē) adj. preach·i·er, preach·i·est. Inclined or given to tedious and excessive moralizing; didactic.
bitch
This guy sums up how politics in American comics is like:
Popular manga runs live and die based on their popularity, so they try to make entertaining stories first. American capeshit Virtue Signals first, and tries to write a story second.
>Popular manga runs live and die based on their popularity
Pretty much this even if we lost some cool manga because of this
because they are actually good
I imagine all of these reasons
> only the best arrives in the global market. imagine the Japanese comic Market are like sea turtles when they first hatch only the good ones come overseas the rest stay in Japan.
> ease of access you don't have to go to a specialty shop to obtain manga when it first drops. hell you can just buy it off Amazon it'll be delivered to you the next day or if you preorder it the day of. for Shonen Jump you just have to go on their website and read it for free.
> consistent and fast schedule with more content than the average comic book. weekly sometimes monthly but if it's usually monthly that's usually more pages than a floppy.
>good art
> easy to follow don't have to read a Wikipedia page just to understand where do you start.
> doesn't preach to the audience about things they already know or isn't going to change their minds you just being annoying.
> dirt cheap $10 for 180 pages sometimes 200 pages unlike Comics $15-20 for 120 Pages Maybe but some only have 80 pages.
>dont call out their fans.
People don’t have to drive to a comic book shop in bumfrick nowhere to get them. They’re also cheaper, less constrained by decades of events and continuity, not filled with constant retcons and reboots and they have more variety. Want to read an action series about superheroes? There’s manga for that. Wanna read slice of life gay romances? There’s a manga for that. Wanna read a political thriller with giant robots? You guessed it; there’s a manga for that. American comics that tackle similar themes and genres are all indie and don’t have Marvel movie to get their shit out there, and while Marvel has Marvel money, they’re cheap bastards who refuse to get with the times in terms of distribution. Simply put: manga is managed better.
I don't know
What is this 'outrageously sexist treatment of women' in western comics ?
Them looking really attractive, just like the men do ?
Can't wait until we get complaints about the incredibly sexist treatment of men in female romance media, oh wait, that will never happen.
Gail Simone's initial claim to fame was talking about "women in refrigerators" and how female characters existed only as accessories for the stories of male characters.
Of course this ignores how secondary male characters were also treated the same way, as this is the nature of secondary characters.
IIRC Simone has somewhat backed off on the WiR thing because she realized that it basically morphed into "nothing bad can ever happen to a female character or its sexist" which is, of course, insane.
I fear that eventually, given enough time, even japan will succumb to this crap and start doing the same as western comics. It's hard, but i can see it becoming a reality in the next 10 years.
Yeah. Been re-reading kraven's last hunt, maximum carnage and knightfall. Good stuff. I just wish they kept the quality of the stories high nowadays, too. It's not even a matter of just the story itself, but the essence of the comic universe and it's characters; it feels like people forgot what's important, and instead focus on stuff that has no relevance for the plot or characters.
Vinland Saga has already gone from a historical viking manga to having 21st century gender politics and pro-trans propaganda in it so they're well on their way there
Vinland Saga was already gone when they started shilling that shitty Ass Creed game a few years ago.
>but i can see it becoming a reality in the next 10 years.
Don't hold your breath on that one, they just elected multiple politicians who ran on major anti-censorship and anti-westernization platforms, including the guy who created Love Hina.
The only demographics that might end up being fricked by western behaviour and infighting in Japan are shoujo and yaoi, but that's expected because lolwomen.
Oh shit, for real? Ken akamatsu? I used to love love hina back in the day, I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics, auheuaheu
That's good, i'm happy that some of them stand against those changes. Thanks for sharing good news, anon.
>I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics
He basically only got involved because he felt that there was too much censorious American "liberal" influence trying to seep its way into manga.
He also wanted to address the work schedules of mangaka in his platform.
Damn man, that bastard would have my vote for sure. Both of his points sound very good and pertinent for mangakas. I just hope that this new generation of theirs can see that it's for their own good, nothing good will come from them getting westernized in that aspect, i'll tell ya that much.
It's more than that, he's been pretty outspoken against things that he feels limit creative and artistic freedom in general so he sees foreign influence as one aspect of it. Some of the western twitter left tried labeling him as a pedo because he's fought against attempted laws that would do things like ban e-girlcon art when most mangaka, men and women, are against it because they realize that it basically opens the door for wider government censorship of art since not just images but ideas themselves could be censored under the guise of protecting youth or upholding moral decency.
He's also generally pretty strong for creator's rights. He willingly ended Negima in protest of his publisher being one of the publishers fighting to try and get a bill passed that'd give publishers equal copyright to authors for manga and books. He only came back after the law was defeated. He seems pretty principled in being against anything that could be used to limit artistic freedom or take rights away from artists.
Awesome, i already liked him, now i have some mad respect for the man. Hope others can also follow his example, and keep fighting the good fight.
Ken Akamatsu is a godsend when it comes to creative freedoms, he also runs a site where you can download lots of out-of-print manga for free, including banned stuff like Aki Sora.
>Oh shit, for real? Ken akamatsu? I used to love love hina back in the day, I'd never imagine him having a hand on politics, auheuaheu
Akamatsu is personally responsible for helping to stop the censorship crackdown on anime/manga like a decade back, presenting to the Diet multiple times.
OH I WONDER WHY MAYBE COMIC BOOKS NEED TO PANDER TO BLUE HAIRED FEMINISTS AND TRANNIES ON TWITTER!
Blue-haired women and trans-women (or is it trans-men?) are certainly an untapped audience.
Yes because no one would tap a troony
I'm almost done with Tom King's run of Batman, whichever reboot this is. Felt like a quarter of the dialogue are characters repeating each other or grunts.
It's not a new trend, New 52 Batman was ridiculous while you have comics trying to shove politics into everything. If speeches about privilege end up in a main Batman series, you know everything else is infected.
Why would you read that shit? Everyone should know by now that Tom King is complete garbage.
They’re cheaper, more available, and actually have genre variety. With the big 2 you have to go to a LCS which may or may not be miles away, they come in floppies with fricking ads in the middle and are generally a shitty, overpriced format for the pages you get, and everything is capeshit with Vertigo and Epic dead.
Way more variety. You're not following the same 10 characters forever.
Much easier to read the stories.
Action is more developped .
>Authors have more creative freedom
>Authors do their own stuff instead of doing pre-existing stuff
>Art while hit or miss, is still better
>Actually there is a very diverse selection of genres and stories
Well color me surprised.
>More diverse storylines than capeshit #52137
>different genres that appeal to a widespread of demographics
>Targets younger demographics than old boomers who can't let go of their childhood obsessions
>actually listens to their fanbases when it comes to criticism
>doesn't pozzify everything to please Twitterlets
It's over, comics will be remembered as a nostalgic past-time by 2050.
You know, i can actually see it becoming a reality, comics becoming just nostalgic thing of the past. I mean, it already kind of is, but it will eventually become something like Aesop's fables or Grimm's tales. People will do adaptations now and then.
Comics will only go away when Communism takes over the planet and people are forced to burn all Comic Books.
>lumping in manga sales with comics
Every time.
OP got BTFO so hard.
>sales of graphic novels, driven by manga, jumped by 76% in the year
>sales of comics increased 53%
Comichron doesn't include manga sales, they only track comic sales, before the pandemic they relied entirely on Diamond sales. I guess they would include any manga sold through comic publishers like Dark Horse printing Berserk but that's it. This is an article that's using Comichron's graph as supplemental material.
Sales aren't even defined for 2020.
But from 2019 to 2021 it went from 19.7 to 24.2 that's just a measly 20% in 2 years, and this probably includes YA comics too.
>This is an article that's using Comichron's graph as supplemental material.
It's not, it's both comichron and icv2 data, and outright states that it uses NPD Bookscan and ComicHub data in addition to direct market data.
Stop lying your ass off dude, it's pathetic.
Manga is just objectively better so of course it's going to sell better.
Streamlined stories, consistent story quality and art, not too wordy, etc.
Getting back into a manga after having dropped it for a year is pretty easy.
Getting back into comics after having dropped it for a year is a chore.
>Manga is just objectively better
If you've read one manga you've read them all. The most popular franchises are all cookie cutter shit
>I guess they would include any manga sold through comic publishers like Dark Horse printing Berserk but that's it
Oh you mean the biggest property for Dark Horse for the past four years. Just that type of stuff is included from Dark Horse, which is the third largest manga publisher in the US. Yeah, no big deal.
>driven by manga
>jumped 76% in the year
Put capeshit out of it's misery already.
Shut the frick ip weebs, manga sales in Japan are crashing, in q0 years time there might be no more new manga being made.
AHAHAAHHAHAHAHAAHAHAAHA
This thread backfired pretty bad huh?
lol no wonder WB has been looking desperate lately.
I'm still not sure who exactly thought this was a good idea.
Why would they use Yoshiyuki Sadamoto's style for the template... Eva/Gainax and Craig of the creek have 0 tonal overlap, they should've chosen something softer in style, and prolly from the late 2000's to 2010's. This style isnt even representative anymore......
Maybe they were going for an easily recognizable style?
I suppose, it just seems odd. Like doing a manga reference to American cartoons and using the 80's GI Joe style, or Scooby Doo style. It's not really representative of how 'anime' looks anymore and feels really dated, idk.
Aren't CN buddies buddies with Studio Trigger and had that one guy doing animation for Steven Universe? What the frick is this shit?
they probably turned insecure after realizing a single animator from japan had more talent than everyone in current cn.
brutal. This looks so much better than any Steven universe episode
Knew it when I saw the thread thumbnail.
GAHAHAHAAHAHAHA
Hey Chuck, how about them american comic book sales?
They lookin' as ugly as the women in San Antonio.
What about the characters, Chuck? How they holding up?
they be doing they best impersonation of them big ol' women own there
How about the quality of the stories, Chuck? Some good writers around, right?
fricking lol
I hope DC responds by making even more characters gay. That should turn the ship around!
Someday when I am at an auction buying up DC Comics, I will think of you, anon. And then I shall chuckle as I announce a new DC where I get rid of everything from Heroes in Crisis on. There will probably be other things that get retconned, but that's the starting point.
OHOOHHHOHO NOOOOOOO
Why does this wokeism writers must put so many unnecessary soap opera and political culture shits into other non slice of life comics?
It's pure writer with low self-esteem fantasy.
You could try to engage with the actual writer on their core beliefs, agree on some points, disagree on others, but ultimately you know they would leave the table the moment anything doesn't go their way. But they don't have to engage face-to-face with a thinking human being: they can write a made-up scenario in which a whole cast of background characters all agree with their self-insert... and then you, the actual thinking human being, are supposed to agree with those made-up characters or you're a terrible sack of shit. Meanwhile you only wanted to indulge in your hobby. But for that, you have to pass the writer political filter.
It's unbearable on so many levels.
You can tell when the natural flow of the story is shifting to shoe-horn that unnecessary bullshit. If they made an openly political manifesto in comic form, few people would purchase it, so they have to infect something popular instead. Because it's shoe-horned into something where it doesn't belong, it's always surface-level one-sided straw-men non-arguments that can only be rivaled by a twitter thread.
Pure absolute pointless garbage. It's doesn't further anything, doesn't bring anything to the table, it's just signaling:
>I believe in this and you're trash if you don't!
>First, don't call me trash. Second, care to explain your position?
>If I have to explain it, then you're trash! Frick you!
Entitled little shits.
If there is one single silver lining with all the woke propaganda in comics these days, it's that the writers are so incredibly awful at creating remotely realistic characters/scenarios with which to push their dogma.
Every character is a stand-in for a social justice argument, or a 'privileged oppressor' to be taken down by said social justice argument.
It's really the preachiness that's the problem. One of my favorite manga is Skip and Loafer and one of the central characters is the MC's transgender aunt. But the series is never preachy about her. It never pats itself on the back for being STUNNING and BRAVE for having a transgender character. That's not to say it downplays it as she has her own insecurities related to being a transgender youth in a small, rural town and how she's, at times, envious of her niece for being able to live the type of carefree normal youth that she was unable to have. But it never beats you over the head with her struggles and she largely remains an upbeat supportive rock for her niece, who she loves unconditionally. It also plays into the fact that every character, no matter how seemingly perfect they are, has massive insecurities. The fashionable girl has low self-esteem because she naturally lacks the beauty or likability that others naturally have, the male lead has spent so long going with what others want that he's never sure of what he wants, etc.
She's a characters whose transgender identity is a part of who she is but it's done in a way that contributes to making her an interesting and likable character, not shoting from the rooftops about how you should like her because she's transgender and how do you like THAT, you chuds?
You might be onto something. Comics are not known for their subtlety (see PowerGirl crying over the poignant symbolism of her cleavage) but there's a limit. That's the difference between Ellen Ripley in Alien vs every other recent female character:
>I'm a woman! Hear me roar! I don't need no man.
>Hi, I'm a man and I'm clumsy but I want to help.
>No, be-penised one, you'll only slow me down and get hurt.
>But I can-- [trips over an empty cardboard box]
>See what I mean? Never send a man do a woman's job! [everybody laughs]
Meanwhile Ripley:
>Study the file, because one of these things killed my whole crew.
>Ahah, YOLO, it's piece of cake.
>[50 minutes later] Nuke it from orbit! That's the only way we can know for sure.
And the modern Aliens remake of that dialog would be:
>Sigh. You silly macho-marines: your toxic masculinity kill you all. Including you, Vasquez due to your internalize misogyny. That's why you need to believe all women!
Not quite related but I've read lgbt manga and it seems like unlike the usa where there's ONE agenda they're trying to push, they're more tolerant of other beliefs and identities. Like cis women only lesbian bars co existing in a district with places for trans women too etc. In the usa that would be considered bad and "wrong".
That's exactly it. It's not the end of the world having a gay, trans character or other minorities, it's just that the constant preaching and making a ruckus out of it that makes it insufferable. Don't make a show out of it, don't bash people, don't go against your audience.
Dumbass OP
Why are you so obviously lying ?
This thread is just embarrassing, OP.
Now do the numbers without scholastic and manga
Why lie? Alternatively why talk out of your ass about things you’re unfamiliar with?
Literally a 1/10 of manga a mid a a pandemy
Rest in shit
S
Okay now compare that market share relative to the population to Japan or 40's America.
WE DID IT RIPPABROS
Did you not see the 2021 date?
Might have something to do with the Rippaverse making millions overnight. Goes to show the market for comics is wide open if marvel and DC would just ditch woke leftist pandering
What
>Century old American Duopoly vs a Green Boi
Hors concours.
Mangachads keep winning.
>all the underage demon slayer cosplayers at the last anime convention I went to
Key Word is Graphic Novel and they are using Manga sales to boost up their bumbers.
I'm happy for you OP, that mean I can stop buy comic all together since you don't need me anymore.
>comics sell when you include the Scamlastic books and manga
multigazillion dollar franchise and still cant sell the books
Nor paying the creators
Aren't all the MCU movies based on stories that were published a decade or decades ago?
"Why can't characters that haven't changed since the early 20th century keep an audience?????"
Movies of these same characters make billions, comics had no problem selling these same characters until they started to make the stories about woke politics.
Yeah normies like Iron Man when RDJ is playing him and they like sitting through 3 hours of subpar writing when an overinflated vfx budget can convince them what they just saw was the "best film of the summer." Then they don't pick up the books and that's why cape shit continues to struggle compared to other comics like they have for decades. Some superhero being female or a woman being hired as a writer doesn't hurt sales because most people don't give a shit because most people aren't even aware of whatever it is you're shitting your panties over
When have the movies used a recently published story? Infinity War and Endgame borrow from comics almost a decade old. Civil War was more than a decade old.
I mean, Batman/Superman/Wonder Woman etc. seem to be doing okay, but noticeably only when their stories are presented in a neatly packaged and consistent way.
I think most people understand that these are the kinds of characters where their stories are allowed to change to some degree and that's fine, as long as those stories are presented in a way that's easy to follow like in films or TV.
The problem is that comics, or the usual floppy style. are not easy to follow for the average person, compare to say manga or comics that aren't capes. With capes, the writers and artists change on the regular, with each bringing their own style to whatever character they're working with. Sure, that sounds fun in theory, but if you're a fan of the way of way, say, Neal Adams handled Batman, is it going to mean as much to you when some new person takes Batman in a new direction that you don't like because you were already invested in Neal's story? Maybe not, especially if Neal--just using his name as an example, not claiming this happened to him specifically--didn't actually get a chance to finish telling his Batman story, but DC decided to take Batman in a direction anyway. If you're a casual reader and want to know how things ended with that specific Batman or want more of it? Well, tough shit, or so says DC. Too bad tough shit doesn't translate into more sales.
It's not a comic sales' thread without one of you fricks showing up. Manga and non-capes are full of "woke" stories and characters and sales keep climbing and climbing.
>Manga and non-capes are full of "woke" stories
Manga is such a large industry that you will find every genre, but the stuff that actually sells, as in carries the industry, is not woke.
>not woke
The biggest selling manga in the US has a character that is openly lesbian and no, her identity isn't treated as a joke.
Woke as in the version used by Cinemaphile capeshitters whenever a series actively features blacks and/or LBGT characters?
Chainsaw Man (LGBT+)
Made in Abyss (LBGT+ and blacks)
Bleach (LBGT+ and blacks)
Attack on Titan (LGBT+ and blacks)
Jujutsu Kaisen (LGBT+ and blacks)
And these are just a few that your average normie would recognize. Cinemaphile capeshitters would shit themselves with rage if DC/Marvel put out something like Okaeri Alice or Houseki no Kuni.
But mind you, the rest of Cinemaphile probably wouldn't give a damn, it's just capeshitters that still want to blame everything for their dying genre except the genre itself.
Manga has had many lesbian and crossdresser characters for a very long time, that does not make something woke.
When a character is defined by their sexuality and equates that with victimhood as in western comics, that is indeed woke.
Sorry, no. At this late stage of the Culture Wars, identity and presence alone are enough to be considered woke. This is the future you wanted after all.
>The biggest selling manga in the US has a character that is openly lesbian and no, her identity isn't treated as a joke.
Right, because she as a character is a joke, and she immediately jobs and gets killed by a dude, as does her gaggle of weirdos.
>Made in Abyss (LBGT+ and blacks)
Lolwut?
There are no blacks in Made in Abyss.
Name a shonen protagonist who was turned gay.
Kishi tried damn hard with Naruto
Naruto literally has a wife and 2 children, anon.
>fanfiction spinoff
>fanfiction
>Written by the original creator
???
You're not even trying, are you?
>What are brotherly bonds
It's annoying to see people thinking that the slightest display of friendship between men is supposed to mean that they're gay.
That's just Americans in general, they do the same with women.
Americans cannot fathom platonic friendships anymore since American culture revolves around sex.
>Americans cannot fathom platonic friendships anymore since American culture revolves around sex.
I thought we were sexual prudes? Which is it?
>Shut the frick up, homosexual.
Heterosexual men are more comfortable around maggots than being in the same room as two gay dudes kissing dude. We are genetically designed to see that as abnormal.
Men and women literally cannot be “just friends”. It’s not possible regardless of culture
>Men and women literally cannot be “just friends”
Except, y'know, siblings.
Only people that have zero friends and never interact with anyone else in person say shit like this.
It’s true though. You can’t go out and do things with a female constantly and not have it develop further. It’s not possible
All things media now is this. Absolutely ANY two characters seen near each other are considered fricking now no matter what. Guy and guy, woman and dog, ghost and horse....anything means agenda now no exceptions.
I'd honestly wanna see more platonic relations between male and female characters that don't devolve into a forced love plot.
I think you could make an exception for Naruto, their friendship is weird and they don’t have good chemistry with their female love interests either. The sequel series, Boruto, doesn’t really improve their marital relationships either. Kishi just can’t write women.
Yeah to be fair, ever since i was a kid i thought it was a bit weird, but over time i just accepted that they're just supposed to have started off as rivals, but then started to respect and even admire each other. I do find it weird how they would consider each other friends, though.
Still, my point stands that it's annoying to see people assuming a character is into another just because they had a bit of interaction. I get it that peopl like to ship and all for fun, but they shouldn't make a commotion if their 'ship' isn't official.
Naruto and Sauske NEVER show any semblance of friendship. It’s not till hundreds of chapters later that we are shown a bunch of flashbacks where Naruto and Sauske were totally secret bros despite the fact in the earliest part of the series, Naruto doesn’t know who Sauske is when they first meet in the academy
bruhh
>These characters with wives and children are totally gay!
This is a baffling cope.
He said the author tried and he sure as shit did make the entire relationship fricking gay. Jump of course told him to knock that queer shit out.
>He said the author tried and he sure as shit did make the entire relationship fricking gay.
Right, which is just a cope.
You sure are mad, narutard. Cry more.
Cope harder.
Cope
>a man can't care about another man without wanting to frick him
You are literally as bad as twitter.
Serious question anon; do you not have friends that are close to you like this?
I don't have a necklace with my friends' picture on it, no.
That's an edit anon.
1. Sasuke is a dad.
2. Naruto is a dad.
3. You're not a dad.
Case closed.
>3. You're not a dad.
I am. But you will never be one.
>post edit
>post naruto
cringe cope, didnt even read if you are pro or anti manga
Goku, Naruto, Deku, Tanjiro, and Gon are all queer coded. And that’s just off the top of my head
>Goku, Naruto, Deku, Tanjiro, and Gon are all queer coded.
See this right here, nothing really states what the frick they are. It's all hearsay and conjecture from the reader if they are anything at all. But why can't that just be personal to the individual reader?
Why is it Americans have to make a big public declaration that X character is gay, they have always been gay and here are little snippets of some back issue that proves it and anyone else saying or thinking otherwise is a whitey the blue eyed devil bigot butthole motherfricker that needs to die right goddamn now fight to be had over it? Why can't one person say Spider-Man is gay and another person thinks he isn't? Why is this a thing in the US?
It's because Americans are mentally ill.
Simple as.
Because:
Publicity, that's the only reason Tom Taylor made John Kent gay and why that was announced on Bisexual awareness day #35.
Nah, but that doesn't explain why Americans online insist that fanfiction and porn should dictate canon, and don't pretend you don't do this because you do it all the fricking time, whether it's capeshit comics, cartoons, TV shows, and yes, even anime.
And it's something that you really only see from Americans, typically gay Americans.
It's like trying to say that Ben and Gwen from Ben 10 should be a canon couple because of how popular all the incest porn of them is online.
>Ben and Gwen from Ben 10 should be a canon couple
They should be, id tune in for every episode if they had hot steamy sex every time
Americans work on some weird
>I now I am right and everyone else is WRONG!
mindset and they use it against each other way more than they do everyone else in the world. It's sort of the basis behind American tribalism, ideological discussion, religion, and political parties. They cannot just disagree with someone, they have to be justified moral and correct. While everyone else in the world is knowingly evil and bad for being wrong.
They turn almost all things into a good vs evil situation. Anyone that does not agree with them on some random opinion is EEEEVVVVIL and must be stopped.
Idk about the others but it’s laid on pretty thick that Gon and Killua are gays for each other
>are all queer coded
Are amerifats usually this moronic?
You must be if you can’t see it
So that's a yes?
Explain how they are then.
>Goku, Naruto, Deku, Tanjiro,
All these characters have female love interests. Just because they're nice doesn't mean they're "queer coded" fricking moron
Having a female love interest doesn’t mean a character isnt gay
Anon, 2 or 3 of those literally breed with their female love interests.
>They have strong relationships of friendship, rivalry, loyalty, or even hatred with other male characters
>This means they're gay
>queer coded
take your meds
>it's another buttmad Cinemaphiletard that refutes actual statistics with trolling/schizoposting because reeeee manga
Goku is a turbo autist, Kishimoto projected his family issues in his work, Deku is just spineless, Tanjiro is the ideal son/father/brother/husband and he was one of the first to breed, and Gon fricks cougars.
>Name a shonen protagonist who was turned gay.
Akira Fudo. b***hes always forget about Devilman and Satan being gay as shit for each other.
Admittedly b***hes ALSO always forget that Devilman is shounen.
>Chainsaw Man (LGBT+)
>Attack on Titan (LGBT+ and blacks)
I haven't read the others, and I'm not up to date with CM, but you're not gonna compare the way they've done it to current comics spinning the wheel of homosexualry each week to see who gets gayed on, or who gets to lecture the audience about homophobia or some shit.
There's a lesbian orgy in it.
so you think a lesbian orgy = preachiness? most males would find that scene visually exciting unless they females are drawn like modern american comic style which they are not considering its manga
No, in Japan it was just fan service.
List 3 manga series that are woke. I’m genuinely curious
How much of it is manga
Comics used to be a medium for kids and found in grocery stores and gas stations.
Now they are a medium for weird adults and only found in "Us Only!" specialty shops
And wanting to change that is somehow destroying the white race or some shit.
This is true. Not many parents are going to take their kid on a special detour to some back alley shithole that sells comics. If they were at eye level at checkout lanes in regular stores the sales numbers would probably skyrocket.
At least, I’d like to think that, but comics are like $5 a pop for 10 mins of reading material to a kid who is terrible at reading
>entire stories revolve around how great it is to be a gay or nig
Again, capeshitters like yourself would piss yourself with rage if you read a story like Okaeri Alice.
>gays are usually treated a joke to be laughed at
The West practically invented the funny gay best friend stereotype, zoomer, and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor. If you actually read
>rather than the western way of making them repulsive
Yeah, because capeshit has undergone an obsession with extreme realism over the last 20 years and it's not like straight women look any better. You capeshit fricks think all you have to do to make a woman look good is to give her a big rack and put her in a bikini and call it a day, it's fricking pathetic.
>When a character is defined by their sexuality
What the frick does that even mean? If a character is one-dimensional in any aspect, that's just bad writing, why is sexuality suddenly an exception?
>and equates that with victimhood
Give me an example of a character who meets both of these standards, because a lot of the shit that capeshitters call "woke" sure as hell doesn't.
Okay, speedreader-kun.
Anime-only detected. I don't know why I even bother mentioning manga on Cinemaphile. You capeshitters don't read
>Anime-only detected. I don't know why I even bother mentioning manga on Cinemaphile.
Are you one of those morons who thinks everyone with dark skin is black?
I can only assume that you're an American in that case.
But anon was right, you are indeed coping like crazy.
>hey this manga has characters that are dark-skinned and that have designs that could be inspired by people of African descent
>Oh, you mean these CHARACTERS THAT DON'T MATCH THAT DESCRIPTION AT ALL???
>I mean laughed at because they are homosexuals which isn’t normal and deserves scorn
Shut the frick up, homosexual.
>You will be hard pressed to find a manga series where the gay character is haha funny and not just a thing to laugh AT for being a freak
I mentioned Bleach, dipshit. Hell, and he openly insults the one openly trans character.
Show me a capeshit story with characters that are openly LGBT from the start or discover they're LBGT in an organic way and don't get "turned" because their stories are written by actual people and not corporate cucks.
You would think things like Men in Black, TMNT, Scott Pilgrim, Sabrina, Road to Perdition, Red, etc proving to make successful film franchises and spinoffs for years would inspire more comic publishers to try their hand at not capeshit from time to time. But nope.
There are plenty of small publishers out there, anon. and everyone else is moving into the webcomic space. Print floppies like what DC?Marvel puts out is a drowning ship and people are getting out while the getting is good.
I'm sorry, I didn't realize Americans were responsible for the multi-million dollar industry that is Japanese doujins.
>that could be inspired by people of African descent
Lol, this is such a fricking reach my dude.
There are no black people in Made in Abyss.
I'm sorry you're too American to tell the difference between a black person and an islander.
This smells like it was types by the greasy cheeto stained hands of an angry comic shop owner. This amount of fricking cope is sovereign citizens-tier.
If I were a comic shop owner, I'd be selling manga and I'd be making bank, what the frick would I be coping about? That my the majority of my black and LBGT+ customers actually like interesting stories that feature black and LBGT+ characters and not corporate rehashes?
>making bank
ohnononononononoo
>I'd be selling manga and I'd be making bank,
You really wouldn't, otherwise we'd have entire chains dedicated to selling manga here in the States. There's a reason why they typically sell them in Barnes and Nobles.
>I didn't realize Americans were responsible for the multi-million dollar industry that is Japanese doujins.
Ironically, Japanese doujin present more actual friendships than modern American media does nowadays.
>I thought we were sexual prudes? Which is it?
It's both.
Americans are just generally kind of deranged.
Americans of the last decade or so are trained to be fricking prudish as 16th century puritans, except gays. They are to be as openly out there and active as fricking possible in as many public spaces as they can get in on in.
but to straight people absolutely anything sex related makes them cringe and recoil hard.
I have honestly wondered if that is a major part of the attraction to the whole LGBT scene. The fact that is represents and is celebrated as just total freedom. Which I suppose it is since they can make out in a Burger King and be praised for it.
Everyone else if they are making out in a Burger King they are prostitutes, or on drugs, and half the time someone will call the police. For some reason in the US just about Any minor level of affection in public is seen as horrific and disgusting, and lots of times it actually is illegal.
People in America are just repressed to the point of losing their goddamn minds, going on shooting sprees, or becoming closet self loathing masturbators since anything and everything straight sex is evil, awful, sinful, and illegal inside city limits. Be gay and one is free to wear a pink crop top and diddle their boyfriend on aisle 8 in a CVS and no one is going to say shit. Ever notice how one does not ever see any positive and affectionate straight relationship on tv any more?
>and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor.
Please show me a single western cartoon, comic, video game, or TV show made in the last 5 years that has a joke like pic related that makes fun of crossdressers or trannies.
I’m honestly surprised Adult Swim was willing to air any references to this part. They skipped the actual meat of that arc, but it’s flashed back to so frequently it’s like it actually did air
>The West practically invented the funny gay best friend stereotype, zoomer, and plenty of western stories about LBGT+ people have a focus on humor. If you actually read
By laughed at I don’t mean because they crack a good joke, I mean laughed at because they are homosexuals which isn’t normal and deserves scorn. You will be hard pressed to find a manga series where the gay character is haha funny and not just a thing to laugh AT for being a freak
>comics are for manchildren
>so are action manga
>but guys the reason comics do bad is because of manchildren!
It's even funnier when a western comic writer very clearly is a fan of manga but when they emulate or reference manga/anime, they do so in a condescending way that makes out manga to be inferior
yeah bro, naruto and sasuke are totally gay and that's why they both had female love interests and naruto exclusively had nose bleeds for hot women, definitely gay
>all this cope
There's a reason why everyone called Naruto and Sasuke gay back in the mid 2000s.
people call Sherlock and Watson gay for each other
dumblr fatties and twatter users aren't people
>people call Sherlock and Watson gay for each other
the show or the books?
But the only people who did that were Americans, and as we've already established, Americans do not understand platonic relationships.
It's also why so many capeshit characters become gay, like Jon Kent.
Because Americans cannot fathom the idea of two males having a strong bond and not wanting to frick each other.
It's also why American families are so fricked up.
Nah, everyone did. Because it was homosexual as shit.
Nah, just Americans.
Please stop trying to pretend that you're normal, you're slowly realizing that you are the outlier, which is why your media is so gay nowadays.
>Please stop trying to pretend that you're normal
The irony. You're a narutard.
>Americans do not understand platonic relationships.
I like how gays here keep focusing on Americans and saying they're the only ones who do not understand platonic relationships when the Japanese love making platonic relationships romantic and literally outpace the Americans when it comes to this in the forms of the many doujjns they pump out.
>when the Japanese love making platonic relationships romantic
A romantic relationship is by definition not platonic. Only Americans will look at a relationship between two men who have a deep bond and see something sexual.
It's why Americans spent so long making porn of the literal siblings in Supernatural.
I literally haven't watched Naruto since like 2007, I'm just not a moronic American like you.
You wouldn't be this angry about this if you weren't a narutard.
Whatever helps you cope.
>No, the Japanese are equally guilty of this
Not really.
When the Japs want to make porn of something, they just make porn, they don't go around insisting that "No, t-there's totally this gay subtext that exists in the original property because it makes my dick hard!"
Which is why so many Japanese artists will make porn of adult characters fricking little girls and boys.
They just enjoy the porn, they don't try to insist that because they drew porn of a character fricking a child it suddenly means that said character is actually totally canonically a pedophile.
That's American behaviour.
>Not really.
>doesn't explain why
>changes the topic completely to talk about porn for some reason
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
't explain why
I literally just explained why.
>So are the Japanese
Not really, especially not to the same degree.
Again, the Japanese draw metric fricktons of e-girl porn, but you don't see them going around insisting that this means that characters are canonically pedophiles.
Americans however will gladly insist that characters are gay based on fanfics and porn, just look at Jon Kent.
>Not really, especially not to the same degree.
You right, they're actually worse about it because
>You right, they're actually worse about it because
That's exclusive to yuricucks, who ironically are a lot like their western counterparts.
Yuri draws the lowest of the low for some reason.
Typically it draws from two groups that have a very high rate of mental illness.
Namely self-hating men who want to self-insert as women because they don't like being male and waifugays who are so insecure that a male character existing near the girl they waifu makes them uncomfortable.
Please let seethe about America while Japanese will do shit like this when they don't what they want
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Animation_arson_attack
That guy committed that attack because he thought they plagiarized his shitty novel, not because of any waifu shenanigans.
This scene in particular: https://youtu.be/ZNV0ybrg8uU
Maybe actually read the shit you link next time instead of making an assumption about something you clearly know nothing about, like a typical American.
>Only Americans will look at a relationship between two men who have a deep bond and see something sexual.
My dude, you are being a intentionally obtuse about this. No, the Japanese are equally guilty of this and often get violent if they don't get their way but for some reason America lives rent free in your head. Probably some homosexual from some backwater European country.
I think a big issue there is that the US is fricking FILLED with people who want to look at any two characters sharing a scene together and want to scream how that is irrefutable proof of a LGBT relationship at the top of their lungs as some show of solidarity from the studio. and anyone arguing against that is a bigot that must be silenced.
There are too damn many people demanding to see some level of validation for their own personal lives in all media they consume. They cannot just let a show go with 2 characters sitting on a couch, they MUST conclude that means there is some secret gay thing going on.
>I think a big issue there is that the US is fricking FILLED with people who want to look at any two characters sharing a scene together and want to scream how that is irrefutable proof of a LGBT relationship at the top of their lungs as some show of solidarity from the studio. and anyone arguing against that is a bigot that must be silenced.
So are the Japanese and this goes for straight and yuri/yaoi relationships. You just never hear about them because they have their own social media/language barrier that separate us.
Japanese seem to go way harder on characters having a relationship at all as opposed to being some kind of chaste saint that remains pure. Angry fans will burn a writer's house down for giving a protagonist a boyfriend, before they will attack anyone for not being in the right type of relationship they personally want.
Or they will make demands of writers for years until they give in and make characters gay like the Marceline and Bubblegum thing.
The Japs do the right thing and the Yanks get mad at them for it?
>NOOOOO YOU CAN'T JUST INCLUDE COMIC BOOKS IN THE COMICS SALES FIGURES BECAUSE UM....
>UM...
>THEY COME FROM THIS COUNTRY
>all the other countries are fine though
Why are weebs so weird about this?
Because Japan contributes 76% to the number and there is a clear difference between manga and comics
most of that is scholastic and manga
Also this
They have boobs.
Something women are not allowed to have anymore apparently.
Reminder that japanese manga artists are fricking killing themselves trying to complete their work with horrible work schedules, basically living a life of a slave
I wish, maybe then Teisou Gyakuten Sekai wouldn't take so long to release a chapter.
>basically living a life of a slave
Living off royalties.
Net worth: $55 million.
What country are you from and how do I become a citizen?
>using a big 3 author, post series completion as your example
This is not the norm
That's just working in Japan.
Why are the Japanese like this
Centuries of grooming that not working 80 hours a week + overtime is shameful. It’s not just manga authors, it’s damn near every career over there
>he doesn't take it easy with years of hiatus
Togashi has Jump by the balls, they (and anyone else after seeing what Togashi does) won’t an author get that kind of grip ever again
Is it not just as bad in the comic industry? I thought they're paid pretty horribly.
Imagine working yourself sick and your comic gets outsold by manga.
It's just FUD that gets posted regularly on Cinemaphile by people who don't understand publishing.
Manga artists are paid the same way all real authors are paid, with royalties on their book sales. The page rates they quote are merely advances.
Manga artists aren't slaves. They don't even earn a "wage," because they're technically self-employed.
Based, we need more of that so we don't get pansy lazy asses like Madureira, Bolland, Campbell and Hughes.
The main problem with western comics is the hamfisted sjw shit they have, nobody would bat an eye if they at least did it in an entertaining way, manga has gay and even troony shit and it doesn't feel annoying at all, most of the time is even an important plot point like the troony fire punch had, no wonder most alphabet people are into anime/manga since they appeal more to them
That's just American media in general now. They cannot just have a gay or trans person appear organically in the story and take part in it like everyone else. There must be some very in your face
>THIS IS A TRANS PERSON LOOK AT THEM!
thing going on. And it is incredibly jarring for a viewer since it ruins the immersion for twitter bragging points from a writer or director.
>most of the time is even an important plot point like the troony fire punch had
What the frick, no it wasn't, there was barely any lead up to it either. If some character with healing factor said the same shit in a comic, people would still be b***hing about it today
It's like a whole series format of those odd episodes of Star Trek where weird unexplainable shit is going on and you just have to sit through it and not understand a damn thing until the last 5 minutes then it all comes clear. Watchmen is like that until the last episode.
ask yourself why would a newcomer even begin to try to get into big 2 capeshit. Even if you like a character or story they're never going to have a definitive conclusion, the next writer/editor can and likely will shit all over it, and it comes with a frickload of baggage to begin with. They are fundamentally bad for long term story telling outside of being vehicles to reuse IPs. That's why indy, creator owned, manga, etc. are gaining ground with manga outright kicking the shit out of them
>pick up a manga volume
>it’s thick, like a few hundred pages
>pick up comic
>it’s thin and like 10 pages
I feel like Id be better of wiping my ass with comic pages than reading them
Not even zoomers give a shit about capeshit.
capesistahs...y-you said zoomers were crazy for miles morals and nu-carols danvers...
Oh no no no no, what happened comicgays?
>dress up as Spider-Man
>theres like 20 others there
>dress up as non fotm anime character
>get decent attention because you are likely the only one in that outfit
>The industry is literally just manga, Dog Man and Bad Guys
>Comic sales jumped 62%
So that's what, six readers now?
So school libraries restocked Dogman I guess
>Comic Sales jumped 62%
OH I wonder why.
i liked this scene from chainsaw man where the plot and action screeched to a halt so the characters could issue a psa about latinx
This reminds of how Savage Dragon killed off a major character by having her be an anti-vaxxer who dies of COVID.
The girl in the second panel, who holds a marker like that?
Anyone who thinks western comics are on an upward trajectory based on these reports will be in for a rude awakening in 2023. There are three major problems with 2021 comics sales stats:
1. Pent-up demand carried over from the pandemic era (and goodwill from fans who felt an obligation to save their LCS) boosted 2021 sales. This is an anomaly that will not happen again.
2. Prices rose significantly across the board. So an increase in dollar figures does not represent an increase in readership. It's also not something publishers can do again soon.
3. 2021 is the first year where both DC and Marvel sales figures were estimates. Comichron is almost certainly basing estimates on outdated, pre-shutdown number of retailers. These numbers represent optimistic guesses at best. Garbage in, garbage out.
All of this cheerleading is going to hurt comic shops in the long run. The more they lie about these numbers, the more people put their heads in the sand, the more likely necessary changes will come too late.
Every single person in the US was given $2,000 for free to spend on random crap, and that also includes manga sales.
Unsurprisingly it's cause of Manga. Manga are (generally) written from start to finish by their original creators, which means you don't have to worry too much stories jumping around or becoming stories they weren't meant to be later on.
Say what you will about One Piece, but as much as it has changed, it's still mostly the same as when it started over 2 decades ago, because Oda's still in charge of the story and art from day one.
Same thing with Demon Slayer. You largely know Demon Slayer's going to stay true to its story and vision, and that its characters and story wont change beyond what creator Koyoharu Gotouge wants.
You dont generally have to worry about weird race swaps, last minute gays, complete tonal shifts, or shitty retcons unless the creator wants to do that, and generally that hasn't been a problem in manga.
With Comics they're all IPs now, and get passed around from writer to writer. Most of whom end up treating any given IP as a chance to push their own personal fan fiction.
They dont care about what character's original personalities were like, they barely care about the character's history, and even if they do they're all too happy to retcon shit for their own personal amusement and/or beliefs.
There's little to no point in investing in western characters or properties, because in 5 or 10 years they're probably going to be completely different characters and properties. Anime characters will largely be the same at their core 10 or 20 years from now. They'll have grown in the narrative in that time period, but they'll still largely be the same character at their core.
Drawbacks of relying on one person's vision should be obvious though, look at HxH, Berserk etc.
Better for a story to die out than become shit or become something it never should have been.
Both are among the best the industry has ever produced so I'm not seeing the drawbacks here
>b-but muh hiatus MOMMY I WANT IT NOW
Quality is more important than quantity.
the 3 great classics loved by all manga readers?
Are manga really planned to finish from the start or is a lot of it filler while working on an ending?
INFLATION MEANS POPULARITY
I just got back from a glorified basement clearance event in my hometown. Comics are finally selling what they're worth now that $5 is meaningless.
Comics need to get away from capeshit.
Dogman and Manga
it's nice baby, now let's see without scholastics and manga
Reminder that the more manga grows, the more shelf space comics lose. Book and comic stores aren't exactly expanding nowadays.
Won't be long before comic and webcomic become synonymous.
Because the absolute state of Marvel and DC's "big" heroes at this point is absolutely pathetic.
That's not even getting into the whole status quo stuff where these companies absolutely refuse to let any of these characters make some meaningful growth and in most cases do the opposite where a character regresses.
Batman being cucked ?
IS THIS REAL!?
Yes Batman 125.This isn't a new thing though, Batman has been a cuck in regards to Catwoman for the past several years now.
Let me guess, Tom King?
No, this is Chip Zdarsky... DC is dead
I thought Zdarsky was supposed to be good? People were hyping up Spider-Man Life Story and his Daredevil run
You were deceived. Spideygays and DDgays don't know what good means, they're cucks that devour anything with the name of their favorite characters on the cover.
Seriously is this real!? Did they ruin batman and catwomans relationship? WHY!
>I haven't been reading comics for awhile. (been reading manga instead)
>WTF HAPPENED?
Oh man 62 more comics were sold across America!
>how come nobody reads capeshit anymore
Gee I wonder why
>last month
>burnt out on superhero comics
>look at "independent" comics instead
>see the cover for 'Where Starships Go To Die' >read description
>"a terrifying new sci-fi thriller from AfterShock Comics. Witness an underwater salvage team's attempt to recover Earth's first interstellar spaceship"
>hmm, might be good
>start reading
>pic related (scenes from first issue)
inescapable
SUCH A SYMBOL OF HATE!
kek, they're really taking 'harping on one string' to the next level
After reading the recent storytimes of pain, I don't see myself purchasing any of this shit. I don't want to be lectured constantly by a short-sighted egomaniac "auteurs" in their endless quest of "self-identity against the entire world and the very fabric of reality itself"
>"It's okay to be short"? How dare you! Stop patronizing me! [cries with anger] I'm short, but that's only because of how society puts importance in people's height; short is a social construct! Society must burn down because it threats short people like shit! [people were stunned, because SHE TOLD THE TRUTH!]
>What do you mean "I didn't mean to"? You fricking piece of shit! You're not a true ally and you will never be, but keep trying as hard as you can, or you're an every bigger piece of shit! [and then everybody clapped and she became super popular because she seemed like a nice person to be around]
>[Conclusion] thanks to my self-introspection, I realized that I only had to believe in my true self to realize how tall I TRULY was. I was actually taller than everyone else all along! It proves that all those peasants have always been beneath my magnificent self. Ah ah, they're so dumb they don't even realize how superior to them I am in every way! I shall squish them all like tiny bugs!
Yeah, I'll pass on that.
Yea, the people who pretend that "independent" or "creator-owned" comics don't have just as much of the shitty hamfisted writing and moronic American politics as capeshit are in such immense denial that it's almost sad.
Literally the only way you can escape this dumb shit nowadays is by just not consuming American media.
Honestly, it's kinda fun to just pick a random new comic and see how many issues it takes to devolve into weird American agitprop and horribly hamfisted writing that feels like a shitpost.
... it's like they want the western comics industry to die as soon as possible
Out of curiosity, what is this from?
A comic called The Joneses about people who get superpowers after a pandemic, it's pretty generic.
Setting is very blah and boring, the only interesting part is the secrecy aspect and the whole "superhero family vs supervillain family" thing.
/a/sisters are laughing at us again...
Luckily for us we still have colored pages and pretentious graphic novels.
>entertainment has gotten extremely boring, aimless, and stagnant.
how true
I'm sure they are conflating english translated manga sales with comic books sales again
the thing nobody notices about Marvel is when they do Movies and Disney Plus series, they really do use properties that were not as popular in the mainstream. They turned C and D list Characters and titles into A and B list titles. Vision and Scarlett Witch, Shang Chi, Eternals, Thor, even Captain America, their popularity 20 years ago was small compared to now, and many of their back issues are leaving comic bins and hitting aales registers.
What happened in 2021?
Man, this thread is just depressing. I knew the situation of western comics was decadent, but i didn't know it was that bad. I grrew up reading comics here in Brazil back in the 90's, and, while i was never a super addict, they had a place in my heart. And yeah i know that time passes and i'm not the target audience anymore and stuff, but it's just kinda sad to see old friends left in such state, and people pretending it's fine, 'better than it ever was', according to some.
What sucks is that, way i see it, there's really not many alternatives, at least not in western comics.
Just read old comics.
Don't touch the stuff from the last ten years.
Anyone thinking this is actual American comics have never left their house. Just go to any Barnes and Noble in America. Manga sections are buzzing with young people looking at new fresh manga, comic sections are dead and just have legacy comic collections dating back to 1960 that zoomers don't fricking care about.
Back Issues of Amazing Spider-Man, Deadpool, Wolverine, and Flash are all being bought up. Sales data is just harder to track for back issues, but many comic dealers are sustaining business based on merchandise, toys, and back issues more than current issues. In a way comic books are like Nike Logo T-Shirts, as the product also serves as marketing and advertising.
>All this cope itt by from zoomer Narutards
You weren't alive in the mid 2005s so you're unaware. But Naruto and Sasuke really are just that queer. More Naruto than Sasuke really, Sasuke doesn't care much at all.
The displays of childhood friendship started happening in filler during the final war arc, Naruto didn't even know who Sasuke was at the start of the series.
>Muh twitter leftists calling every friendship gay
Yeah this is a problem but this specific case has been happening before Twitter existed. Before Tumblr existed, etc.
Sasuke really should've been female.
>Gay boomer coping that the characters he projected onto were hetero and have wives and children
Ahh, my favorite.
>Hyperventilates and falls unconscious upon finding out his lover is now a wanted criminal
This isn't Sam and Frodo anon.
>Gay boomer continues to cope
Keep going, this is only going to get better and better.
Just further proof that Americans cannot understand the idea of having strong emotions for another male, they will literally insist that dudes with wives and children are actually gay.
No wonder American "families" are so fricked up.
I'm not American.
Prove it.
How?
There is gonna be another spawn and Batman crossover with sccc had sold out all of that spawn meeting thanks to spawn 300 and mk11
Bros I think I've uncovered the Japanese's secret....
>Kunai look like filled condoms
>Implying those are kunais
>the city of OP
Are we counting webcomics?
>Are we counting webcomics?
They're deader than regular floppies because, like floppies, they never evolved with the times.