>Could you imagine the great series we could have had if artist got off their high horses and would just accept working with writers who actually know what they're doing?
TGSmurf recently released the latest chapter of Ramia on his patreon, I got the announcement somewhere, which reminded me of this old thread. https://desuarchive.org/co/thread/125200428/
I guess I just want to discuss "good/great artist who thinks they can write but can't." It really gets me every time, it seems like such a waste of art and character design too, not to mention effort.
>western?
Yeah it is because Smurf is French. He really likes manga style so he's doing it that style. Series link if you care to read it: https://mangadex.org/title/65512e8c-71c6-4143-ab88-1f62942e7dd2/ramia-yana?order=asc
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m*nga style art can never be great
Writers can only do dialogue, not the actual drawing. If the artist can't tell stories with pictures, nobody else can change that - only the artist can
This is just a power fantasy and scam of wanting to tell artists what to do. "Get off their high horses" so they can't even decide what to do with their own creativity commie? You claim to know better but you don't submit any examples of your writing.
>Less enjoyable than manga
Guess who writes manga
>wanting to tell artists what to do
Uncharitable take, but as anon has already said, 'editor' is really it, or I think, a writing consultant. Someone who can fix up what he's got.
On the note of an editor or writing consultant, Smurf doesn't think he needs one. Bad art can be carried by a good story, like OPM. But the reverse isn't usually true.
OPM was bad art with a good story, and eventually got an artist to redraw the webcomic. I dunno why smurf is so mental over it. He seems to have learned all the wrong lessons from it too.
I just want a comic with the author's thinly veiled BIG SEXY MUSCLEGIRLS fetish. That's all I ask and TGS' style just doesn't appeal to me. I love the french but I wish they had my breed of degeneracy.
>He seems to have learned all the wrong lessons from it too.
This is more a personal gripe of mine but he's not the only one. I've seen a few manga and comics where their only takeaway from OPM is just making the main character world breakingly overpowered and then playing things straight until character comes in for his LOL I'M TOO STRONK scene. In modern memory that Mashle manga was absolute trash considering how I really hoped it would either ape OPM or Helck decently.
I avoided Mashle because I knew what it was doing from the get-go. Rooster Fighter, on the other hand, is how you make a proper spiritual successor to One-Punch Man.
>On the note of an editor or writing consultant, Smurf doesn't think he needs one.
Yeah, if you're just publishing your stuff on the internet there's nothing to make you listen to your editor except your own humility or respect for their opinion. Lots of artists would still benefit from one, but they can't help people who don't think there's any need for a second opinion.
Oh so you’re a moron that thinks manga is actually made solo. Any manga that made it to America was basically written by an editor after it was picked up by the Japanese publisher.
Goldensmurf is a weird one. I've seen his art and it's fine but it's tasteless coomer shit. And I don't expect his story-telling chops to be any better.
One last thing. Bro has mental problems over One-Punch Man. I remember reading a long time ago that the series was never meant to be taken all that seriously to begin with but his Twitter is full of insane posts about the manga.
Being mentally unstable is fairly common for artists.
What is the story even about besides being coomer bait? I remember reading chapter 1 and 2 when he posted them on another board and not being interested at all due to the shitty writing and even shittier pacing.
Also one look at his twitter reveals a lot about what his target audience is.
I don't think Goldensmurf gets that stories (especially for manga) need to have a theme or a point to it. Even if the art is good, hell, even if the writing is par, without a point to it all, everything's just going to ring hollow.
I think his comic is just an excuse to have some sort of ongoing project and an OCs he can make lewds of when all he wants to do is draw muscle waifus and get patreon bucks for the nudes.
At least, that's the strong impression he makes upon me.
If i were him, i'd just drop the comic and just keep making muscle knights and demons lewds.
>mental problems
All he does is criticize its inconsistent quality. Not all of his criticism is valid but he makes some good points. That is far from mental. Mental is Randy Stair with Danny Phantom. Mental is that fricker who was obsessed with Martha Speaks.
His drawing skill are alright, not great, but alright although it could be better if he fixed his values and stopped doing the hair out focus. His dialogue and bubbles are fricking atrocious though.
These characters are made for porn though, which i have lots of.
It's not about being on a high horse, it's about it being difficult to find and maintain collaborators.
You have to encounter someone who can write, they have to have material out there so you know they can write, you both have to be willing to collaborate, you need to be able to get along with them and have a compatible way of working, and you need for one of you to not be slow or inconsistent in a way that drags the project down. That's not easy, especially when communities with writers and artists don't seem to overlap much.
Most of them don't even need a writer, they just need an editor. Someone who can discuss their ideas with them, give feedback on drafts and correct errors before releasing it to the world.
Like for this one the first thing an editor would do is tell him not to order the words in the first panel right to left. Tiny change, something that could easily be overlooked by the artist, but would be a big improvement.
>Most of them don't even need a writer, they just need an editor
This is why your first paragraph is true but only because this statement is bullshit and yet artists really believe this.
If you didn’t work just as hard on your writing as you did your art, it will not be good. It will be serviceable for an action comic at best and even then it likely won’t service either the art or the story because artists don’t understand pacing and plot.
Also this is exactly the problem. That page/spread isn’t good. We have no reactions, no exchange between panels, nothing worth showing. It’s just pinup art next to a panel.
A writer wouldn’t have even written this. There would be at least three more panels per page.
An editor just throws their hands up, knows this sucks and says “the text needs to be adjusted to improve readability.” Theyre not going to tell them throw it away and start again and so it will always be bad.
Re the story, I honestly think he never bothered with it on the assumption that somewhat fetish-y art+ manga inspired art+ being twitter infamous would give him all the fans that he needs. I don't mean to speak ill of anyone who decides to make their own comics because they're sick of Marvel's/DCs but I get the feeling a lot of them bank on twitter fame to sell.
Something wrong with Tokyo Game Show?
I though it was going to be porn but no. How boring.
I read the first story arc way back when it first came out and it was really shitty. Unpleasant writing aside his art really isn't really all that interesting. The designs aren't interesting the action isn't interesting. It seems like coomer brainrot has gripped this guy from top to bottom so why not just make porn?
>"good/great artist who thinks they can write but can't.
This really comes down to personal taste.
>TGS