I genuinely think this is gonna fricking destroy whatever good will Disney has left with Marvel fans
>Vanessa actress recast with an Asian woman and everyone’s gonna just pretend nothing happened
>no Foggy Nelson or Karen Page
>Michael Gandolfini showing up as Wilson Fisks son he never mentioned before because for some reason
It’s bizarre to think about and we can’t get concrete numbers, but when the Netflix shows copyright ran out and Disney got them back and put them on Disney Plus. Daredevil has consistently been one of their highest viewed shows. Meanwhile their own productions like Willow were so low in views they removed them from their own service because the tax write off was worth more than having it be available
The quality of the writing is gonna be awful based on literally every other Disney Plus Marvel show. (She hulk writers openly said they didn’t do court scenes because they didn’t know how to do them, what the frick?). With writers this shit. How will they explain how Daredevil season 3’s ending got to where things are now, with Fisk out free and fine, not exposing Daredevil for some reason even though he’s broke his dead, and Daredevil not doing anything about it?
The stunt guys from Daredevil were also not called up. No stuntmen period as far as I know, so looks like Daredevils stunts will be CGI. Easier I guess
Also genuinely just sad that Disney Plus shows will never have the hardcore grittiness that independently made shows on Netflix had the freedom to do. There will be no hard violence. No bloody deaths.
Just people getting knocked out in between quips
I wish we could see Bullseye come back with the same actor and in his own costume and frick shit up but it’d just be embarrassing,
Did you like watch any of the marvel shows? Falcon and Winter soldier had hard violence and bloody deaths, same with Hawkeye. Same with Moon Knight
You're wrong.
>Falcon and Winter soldier had hard violence and bloody deaths
Bloodiest death I remember is John Walker bashing his shield into someone but we don’t actually see it happen.
Also in episode 1 Falcon killed like 6 guys with a drone then made a quip about it. Not sure why he thinks that’s ok but killing a superhuman terrorist isnt
I didn't say it was a good show, but it definitely had blood and gore.
We don't see the gruesome details of Netflix deaths, either. It's not like there was a close-up of the face of the guy who impaled his head or anything.
>this isn’t gruesome
Meh. It's a bit more brutal than your usual death but you mostly just see the silhouette of his head and the close-up of his eyes.
Ok then, off the top of my head
>stick having needles stuck up his fingernails
>Frank castle getting drilled into his feet, then he pulls a razor blade out of his arm to escape.
>castles prison fight
>Fisk decapitating a man with a car door
>tied up police officer getting stabbed in the neck
>bowling alley dude cracking the guys head with a bowling ball
Also you can definitely see blood. Not sure how much more gruesome this needs to be to qualify. Is he meant to fall back and then an extended shot of pieces of brain falling out in slow motion?
You can see blood pretty much in every even mildly edgy piece of media. Call me when one actually has the balls to show some guts or any kind of entrailts rather than pretending people are just walking bags of blood.
>it’s just a drill in a foot, where’s the REAL gore
>I wish we could see Bullseye come back with the same actor and in his own costume and frick shit up
Tbh I'm still disappointed that Season 3 never even tried to give him a version of his costume. It'd be SO EASY to have him file off the horns of the DD costume and slap some black and white paint over it.
On the same note, I was also disappointed that Matt never reclaimed his costume by the end of that season. The Netflix shows had a real aversion to putting the cape in capeshit
It’s funny because they even had him with the bullseye cap in the flashbacks
If i was in charge I’d have just had him spray paint a bullseye on the forehead of the Daredevil mask when he goes on the rampage at the end
>If i was in charge I’d have just had him spray paint a bullseye on the forehead of the Daredevil mask when he goes on the rampage at the end
Exactly, it was the most obvious thing in the world and they just didn't fricking do it
Same thing with DD wearing his own costume by the end. They set up that spare suit in the workshop, and did nothing with it
The spare suit would have been seized by the FBI though, not sure how he’d get that back, it was only there so they could frame Matt as being Daredevil (genuinely wonder how this would work if they caught him though. He really is blind and they could medically prove it. His pupils won’t dilate etc.)
I'm going to be brutally honest with you OP: Netflix DD wasn't that good to begin with
What’s a good cape show in your opinion?
Just wanna get a read. Because as far as I’m concerned, Daredevil was the best superhero show ever made.
>Because as far as I’m concerned, Daredevil was the best superhero show ever made.
Stop watching capeshit.
Grow a personality.
>Daredevil was the best superhero show ever made.
You mean the same show where they were ashamed of his red costume and found any excuse to keep him out of it? The same show with a shit Hand plot no one cared about?
No thank you
>get asked what’s a good cape show
>no answer
We get it. Liking things is lame. You don’t like anything. Most people grow out of that state at around 15 or so but I guess liking things is too normie or whatever. Only hating things is cool
I'm trying to engage in a conversation, gave you an example of why I don't believe the DD show was good, and now you're retorting with childish insults. Don't lump me with the other anon either.
You need to take your own advice and grow up.
The show was as comics accurate as it could ever get. As for it having “any excuse” to not have him wear the costume. That’s nonsense
Season 1 was basically one big origin story, he wears it all through season 2. Never watched defenders because it was boring. Agreed on the hand stuff but I didn’t feel it overrode the good stuff
In season 3 he’s supposed to be on the back foot, and quite literally faces himself in more ways than one. Bullseye isn’t he daredevil suit was kino. Matt struggling with wanting to kill Fisk was kino. Him beating them without needing the Arnold suit was him being the man without fear
Now, can you tell me which comic book show you think is better? Or is this gonna be a “no cape shows are good” thing where it’s never answered
It’s no coincidence the worst parts of daredevil were the shit that they put in to try and make it connect to defenders
>The show was as comics accurate as it could ever get.
Why do you lie so hard? Owl didn't fly, Gladiator nor Bullseye had their costumes, and it's blatantly clear that your infatuation with the show was based on the tone as a contrast to the larger MCU as a whole. They fumbled the lawyer aspect of the material, Karen's B plots were crap, and it's very hard to take you seriously when you unironically use the term "Kino".
And I'll be honest, it's very hard to be black and white when it comes to recommending comic book show adaptations, or adaptations in general. Most of it is watered down from the material, or fail to capture what made the original special just to please a wider audience. I'm not avoiding the question, I'm just trying to convey that it's hard to just say "OH MY GOD THIS IS AMAZING" when I honestly don't feel that way about any show. Some are better than others, getting few things right, but as a whole the market is just oversaturated and not really marketed towards comic fans. It just feels like you just want me to say any show, so you can then try to tear me down and discredit. I hope I'm wrong, but that's how you're coming off
>And I'll be honest, it's very hard to be black and white when it comes to recommending comic book show adaptations, or adaptations in general. Most of it is watered down from the material, or fail to capture what made the original special just to please a wider audience. I'm not avoiding the question, I'm just trying to convey that it's hard to just say "OH MY GOD THIS IS AMAZING" when I honestly don't feel that way about any show. Some are better than others, getting few things right, but as a whole the market is just oversaturated and not really marketed towards comic fans. It just feels like you just want me to say any show, so you can then try to tear me down and discredit. I hope I'm wrong, but that's how you're coming off
A lot of words with zero recommendations.
So I guess the answer to “what’s a better cape show” is none.
Anon it's not my fault that you refuse to actually read my post and engage in a real conversation. You're just being a dick because you can't actually come up with an argument, or contribute to what we're talking about. And you're just proving my point here where you're more concerned about a "GOTTEM" petty spat rather than looking at the material and content we're discussing. I can tell you where some shows shine but still fall flat, Daredevil included, but I don't believe you're actually interested in that.
So are you going to stop being a prick, or do we end the conversation here? Because right now you're just being whiny when not met with blind praise for Daredevil
I don’t consider it a real conversation. Because there’s no point discussing quality with someone who refuses to say what they consider a good quality show as a way to understand what they consider good as a barometer for your taste. Or even to just see you’re being genuine.
If there’s literally none, I’m inclined to think you just don’t like them regardless, so why should I read anything you say? I don’t talk to people who dislike pizza about potential pizzas I may or may not like. I already know you don’t like them
If you do like some, but refuse to say which. Then it reeks of insincerity. So not a real conversation once again
I just told you where the show falls flat, and even offered to explain where other shows, which aren't perfect either, may excel. However you don't present yourself as a person who cares, and again, just come off like a c**t who just wants to discredit people out of some misguided sense of superiority.
Do you even read my posts?
>Owl didn't fly
I'm one of the 5 people on Earth who actually like Owl and wish he was allowed to be more over-the-top and unhinged, but how exactly do you imagine him flying in live-action? That part of his character was always pretty silly and clashed with the street level aesthetic of Daredevil.
>Gladiator nor Bullseye had their costumes
It sucks that Gladiator wasn't properly adapted, but Bullseye's costume is pretty hard to make work in live-action. Also the bigger point is that he's pretty much a completely different character in the series.
>They fumbled the lawyer aspect of the material
What didn't you like about the lawyer scenes?
It's not even just about the flying, but showcasing that he's an animal and not entirely human. Dude is a mob boss for a reason, and quirky just like Hammerhead or Silvermane. This show just has him as a sniveling pencil pusher.
>What didn't you like about the lawyer scenes?
To me they just felt like an obligated afterthought. Stuff where "Oh we have to have courtroom scenes, but can't be bothered to find a good way to weave it into the show's larger plot". The Ben Affleck movie had a similar problem in its directors cut
>with a shit Hand plot no one cared about
To be fair, that's a very accurate adaptation of most Hand stories in the comics
Yeah, the Hand has always sucked. They're the one part of Miller's run and additions to the character I dislike.
And frankly even then, Season 2 is still worth watching for the Punisher alone. It's the only time Berthnal was good in the part, because for some reason they just utterly neutered him in his own show.
The Hand was alright in Miller's run, but almost always pretty meh and boring afterwards.
that's an incredibly low bar
Yeah. So it’s weird literally everybody is up in arms about people liking daredevil. But is too afraid to say what show they do like?
Stop being pussies. Say you hate all cape shows so we can skip the bullshit. Or say which shows you think are better.
You already know we like daredevil. Not sure why you’re dead set on the idea people can’t see it as a great show
probably because it's not great. "Better than a bunch of other shitty shows" doesn't mean it's good by default.
Actually yeah, quality is generally measured in terms of things being better or worse than other things. So it is good by default.
What next? The fastest runner on earth isn’t actually that good because motorcycles exist and they’re faster.
We’re talking about cape shows. And this is the best one. We like it.
If you genuinely think it’s just not good and this Disney plus version won’t be a massive disappointing downgrade. Then you’re the one whose ok with lower standards
"Best cape show" is like saying "fastest paraplegic sprinter"
It’s not “cool” to not like things. That’s more of a teenage mindset.
I don't dislike things to be cool, I just don't pretend to like things because they're popular.
OP why are you losing your shit? You're one man arguing with a room full of people not blindly loving DD's show for some reason. There are PARTS of DD worth commending, but there's a good fair share of criticism to address too. You're demanding other shows as a deflection tactic, and you know it. There are things to pick apart in almost every comic book show, because 9 times out of 10 they're weak adaptions due to who they are marketed to. So if we were to point out a different show, you'd actively pick them apart just like what we're doing here with DD. And it's fair both ways
>You're demanding other shows as a deflection tactic
I’m asking what people do like so I can separate them from the generic “hate everything” Cinemaphile crowd. Sadly nobody has been able to do so yet
Personally I liked Jessica Jones better, but that's cause she a cute I wouldn't say it was better than Daredevil
I really enjoyed Jessica Jones season 1. But that show hinged entirely on Kilgrave.
Season 2 and 3 was such a massive drop in quality.
I read the Alias comic recently and I can almost understand our. The Alias comic is deeply entwined in the marvel universe. Whole plot lines rely on stuff like her being friends with Carol Danvers, filming captain America with his gf etc.
Can’t really do any of that in the Netflix show.
Even all that said. There were too many episodes. I feel like 8 would’ve been enough
>Season 2 and 3 was such a massive drop in quality.
>Even all that said. There were too many episodes. I feel like 8 would’ve been enough
this describes every Marvel Netflix show
I remember reading al ton about the production years ago. As I recall they had it as a studio mandate that they NEEDED to have 13 episodes
Which unfortunately definitely made some unnecessary filler parts.
Daredevil season 2 IMO managed to balance this cleverly. It’s basically two stories in the first and second half. First the punisher and his trial. Second Elektra and the hand. Ending with both being resolved. Even though the hand was boring
it wasn't really clever, it just resulted in a good half of the season and a shit half of the season
It was clever in the sense that it avoided burnout from one plot being dragged on too long.
Punisher definitely would’ve been lamer if they needed to show 13 episodes worth of him. Look at how bad his show was
AGAIN, sine you're unable to read, there are things to like and dislike in almost every show. You're asking us examples where it's universal praise, when that's not the case either. How is this a hard concept to grasp? Furthermore, you're asking for a public consensus, which is flawed from the get go because we're not damn hive mind. You're actively choosing to pay attention to people who refuse to elaborate with one off hate comments, and now stumbling with someone who doesn't think in black/white criticism.
Can you not see the flaws in DD, even if you yourself like it?
>Can you not see the flaws in DD, even if you yourself like it?
Yes. Mainly with parts of season 2.
But it’s genuinely the best comic book show ever made in my opinion. And that’s why it bothers me so much when I see this train wreck coming for it.
If you consider Daredevil Netflix to not be that good. Do you really think Disney Plus is even going to MATCH the same level of quality? Let alone be better?
Of course not. It’s going to be shit. And I’m just sad considering how much potential it still had.
>But it’s genuinely the best comic book show ever made in my opinion.
And that's YOUR opinion. I can't in good conscious call DD that good given the beforementioned faults.
>Do you really think Disney Plus is even going to MATCH the same level of quality? Let alone be better?
No? That doesn't make the original some feat either though.
This is the truth
People forget the show is beloved for the king pin memes it generated more than anything
I AM THE STAIN ON YOUR SHIRT WHEN YOU ATE A MEATBALL SUB YOU SHOULDNT HAVE
They still make MCU shows?
They are struggling. Invasion nobody gave a shit about and I don't anyone will pay attention to a literal who that is ECHO
Sandrine Holt is a qt so I don't mind the recast.
No Foggy then no buy.
The original show didn't need good writing and only had like one worthwhile stunt sequence per season
>Vanessa actress recast with an Asian woman and everyone’s gonna just pretend nothing happened
If they can recast Bruce Banner, why not fricking Vanessa?
>Michael Gandolfini showing up as Wilson Fisks son he never mentioned before because for some reason
This isn't the MCU's invention. Butch is Chip Zdarsky's donut steel OC who is a result of Fisk's secret affair and hates his dad. He's currently the functioning Kingpin in the comics as Fisk is in the hiding. But you'd have to read comics to know that. As silly as that whole character is, it's nice that they're actuslly bothering to adapt stuff from the modern comics, which also allows us to detect Cinemaphile tourists like you.
>If they can recast Bruce Banner, why not fricking Vanessa?
They didn’t recast Bruce with a person of a completely different race though. It’s just bizarre
Also the actress had a side role in YOU only 2 years ago. She’s hardly some expensive diva who’s too busy. Why not bring her back?
>This isn't the MCU's invention.
Sure. But it goes against the Netflix show's characterization of Fisk as an extremely lonely recluse whose only two emotional connections in the whole world (before Vanessa) were his mom and his assistant Wesley.
They already fricked that up in Hawkeye, by showing him (in the scenes set around a few months to a bit over a year after the Chitauri attack on New York, which is the Netflix show initial timeframe too) having close friends, picking up his friend's daughter from school and later "adopting" her, and being a loan shark who meets with his "customers" in person.
Now he's gonna have had an affair that produced a secret son, too.
I prefer charismatic gigachad Kingpin to autistic Kingpin tbh
THANK YOU. Netflix Autist Fisk really irks me. This isn't the Kingpin of crime that I know
That's fine.
But they should stop pretending this is a continuation in any capacity of the old show, and just say "it's a new story with different versions of the characters, played by some of the same actors".
Anon we don't care about Born Again. Find better things to focus on, and let the MCU peter out
>doesn't read modern Marvel
>this means he's a Cinemaphile tourist
Frick off. Marvel hasn't been good in years.
anyone with sense stopped reading Big 2 comics years ago
>The stunt guys from Daredevil were also not called up. No stuntmen period as far as I know, so looks like Daredevils stunts will be CGI. Easier I guess
Let's not fricking pretend like them very blatantly punching air in Netflix was the height of stunt work.
We’re really gonna act like that show didn’t have the best stunts on television because… they didn’t literally punch each other and hurt each other?
>the best stunts on television
Not that anon but how many movies have you seen exactly? There is stunt work from the 80s that would blow your mind. This wasn't anything special
Because they were very visible instances of them punching air that could've at least been edited out or filmed differently. I mean, sure, deadlines are a b***h, but still.
I dunno how true all the info in your post is about casting/re-casting, but the ONLY point I think will be good about Born Again at all is the fact that it's 18 episodes long. That means that it'll hopefully close to actual fricking television, as opposed to the usual Disney+ MO of doing only 6 episodes per show in the vain hope that people will think that means it's some prestige event miniseries.
But even aside from that fact, it'll probably still only be crap at best. This is a Disney+ Marvel show we're talking about, after all.
>no Foggy Nelson or Karen Page
I don't really care about the other stuff but this one seems really odd to me but I think it basically says they won't even attempt to focus on the legal stuff and civilian reactions to things going on. Which makes me think this will be less grounded and that's from a show that had a subplot about a japanese ninja clan trying to summon a demon.
Considering the other D+ Marvel shows, they're probably adapting the modern comics before anything else. Which means Zdarsky's run, or Shadowlands or whatever
>Shadowlands
Considering the other D+ shows I'm already just not watching it.
>Shadowland
>modern comics
Anon, Shadowland was 13 years ago...
By modern, I mean 21st century
Lmao, chudcels are really pretending Daredevil was a good show? It was some juvenile shit. It never tackled REAL issues, just manboy scenes with “epic” hallway fights.
Falcon and Winter soldier is so far above it it’s not even funny
Nice try, shillbot
I'm not gonna watch this politically correct shit.
It'll be fun to see "I don't need no man" Elektra, wearing a red burqa, probably with a dyke hair and kicking Daredevil in the balls.
From Captain Marvel this is Kevin Feige's MCU, all the idiotic ideas including Captain Marvel came from his head
What a stupid way to hold a sword.
actress recast with an Asian woman and everyone’s gonna just pretend nothing happened
>>no Foggy Nelson or Karen Page
Gandolfini showing up as Wilson Fisks son he never mentioned before because for some reason
This MCU Daredevil is a completely different show from Netflix Daredevil. Why would you expect anything to be the same?
Yeah, why would they expect it to be the same daredevil just because the same daredevil guy is back, and the same kingpin actor is back. Makes perfect sense to reboot it but keep the main actors. It’s such a good idea, the DCEU did it
Do you think they’re even gonna pretend Daredevil Netflix is canon?
Kingpin was just a huge string man in Daredevil, but he seemed genuinely superhuman in Hawkeye. homie got hit by a car and an explosive arrow and was unscathed
Only explanation I could think of is he bought one of those superhuman serums off the black market.