a great looking story about two girlbosses at odds with eachother over turning a manlet into a manlet messiah culminating in an obligatory bechdel scene where they appologise to and congratulate eachother after one of them b***hslapping the messiah at the exact moment of his ascendancy. Oh and there's something about a holding the galaxy hostage bythreatening to nuke sand. Smart stuff this movie and totaly not for modern audiences. You can see it was made by a real book respecter.
>Fremen are great, aren't we? >You can't be a Fremen, though. >We're the best! >We have a dumb religion, though, lol. >...but it's not our FAULT we have a dumb religion! ACTUALLY, it's YOUR fault we have a dumb religion! >Not that I'd participate in my culture's religion. That's just dumb. All religion is. >HEY! Stop glorifying my culture's religion!!! >NOOOO! Stop participating in my culture!! STOP IT! >You can't be our savior! You're...! You...! YOU JUST CAN'T! >I don't believe in this shit!!!!!! >I'M not being inconsistent with love and trust and hope and support! YOU ARE!! >I give up!! I'm running away, I'm abandoning you, I'm abandoning my family, my friends, and I'm allowed to because I'm right! Not you! NOT YOU!!
>holy worm shit, you're the first dude in history to survive the genetic memory activating super spice drug and you just became a literal prescient godlike mesiah? Here's a b***hslap to remind you it was worng of you to do this but mostly to put ME through this.
are great, aren't we? >>You can't be a Fremen, though. >>We're the best! >>We have a dumb religion, though, lol. >>...but it's not our FAULT we have a dumb religion! ACTUALLY, it's YOUR fault we have a dumb religion!
This is just Judaism
What a spoiled, naive brat. How is that anything like the support wife and dearest love from the book? She's just throwing a social fit every time she appears on screen, complaining he's the center of attention, not her.
Like, what the frick.
Pretty sure Stilgar was already YANDERE for Paul within a few minutes of the film, and everyone trusted and believed in Stilgar. Paul was pretty much their savior within days.
Chani had nothing whatsoever to do with it. She's actually PISSED when she found out she's worshipped in their religion, too, with how little she knows about her own people. Which is hysterical (I mean that in the hysteria "female uterus insanity" way), seeing as she's the daughter to the planet's most devout religious fanatic in the first place.
In the books/previous cinema, Chani is beloved and is frankly using Paul a bit to further her own gains (successfully, I might add). She actually encourages Paul to marry Irulan, seeing how it's the best political thing possible and she's going to remain his concubine anyway, so who cares?
Not only is she using him to further her own gains but she actually has a character arc: she quite enjoys his mesianic status at first in order to push for conflict but she isn't able to savour the final victory as it's overshadowed by the death of her son
Movie Chani's character arc is basically "i'm always right and so are my homies" to "i'm not only right but i'm left the sole voice of reason among millions" to "i'm still right, screw you guys, i'm going home".
>our goal for many generations has been to one day beat the harkonnens and start terraforming the planet to become a green paradise >but you're not one of us and you're not the one to lead us, you can't survive the desert or speak our language or understand our customs or fight well or see the future >okay you can actually fight better than all of us >and you can ride bigger sandworms than anyone else >and you're one with the desert >and you know our language and understand our customs >and you can actually see the future >and you needed no time at all to lead our people to victory against harkonnens and kickstarted our mission to terraform the planet into a green paradise >but you're... le BAD and you're STILL NOT ONE OF US!!!!
Everyone I've talked to about this movie IRL ended up disliking Chani. I don't know what the directors intended but she just came off as a miserable grouch who held the hype back. The type of person who'd rather live in the mud for a lifetime than accept a nice life granted to her by someone she can't control.
You do know the first book ends on her saying she will be the one remembered as wife after she pushes him to marry Irulan as nothing more than a political ploy? You do, don't you?
I've seen movies that took a book's name and that's it. The book meant something different from the movie. Clearly she's the sympathetic character here
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
realy? because the book meant something alright but the movie was a distorted, convoluted, contrarian, self contradicting shit fest that had no discernable message other than "atheist girlboss always right, yassss queen"
now if you think that means anything then you're entitled to your opinion
... but it's still discarded
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
I'm agreeing with you
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>sympathetic
Just pathetic. I don't sympathize with an angry minority teen girl and I don't have empathy for a naive b***h who actively disowns any accountability for irrational anger.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>Clearly she's the sympathetic character here
Maybe that was the goal but from the limited number of people I talked to, she comes off more as a scorned conservative than anything else.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
That too. She comes off a bit scorned. I think early on she was unsure of him until he started getting popular then she was happy to hop on the D
Just because I'm wrong about literally everything and explicitly hypocritical doesn't make you right! I'm supposed to be Quizno's Ham-on-Rye! Because it's my right to be! And I deserve it!
>Fremen are great, aren't we? >You can't be a Fremen, though. >We're the best! >We have a dumb religion, though, lol. >...but it's not our FAULT we have a dumb religion! ACTUALLY, it's YOUR fault we have a dumb religion! >Not that I'd participate in my culture's religion. That's just dumb. All religion is.
This is literally American and European israelites
i dont mind denis making chani a vocal minority in the film, like he said it was to highlight that paul was not a good guy.
its most important to remember because the audience is moronic and would think he was a classical hero unless she didn't literally say that the jihad and prophecy was wrong.
Dune is not a story for morons and by dumbing down characters in order to try to create exposition for morons you are dumbing down the story itself and destroying motivation for the characters to act how they do
The reason Paul is not a "good guy" isn't because he doesn't want to do the right thing but rather quite literally because of Chani. She is the reason he rejects the golden path and passes it down to his son. By not having her firstborn die and by making her an insuferable b***h he has litteraly no reason to give her the children (you know, the ones from the title of the third book) at the expense of her own life and his exile.
The reason you think the jihad was a bad thing is because the story wasn't written for you, and, for that matter, it wasn't written for villeneuve either. From the moment Paul drinks the water of life to the moment of the scattering every atrocity serves to prepare humanity. It's not that he's not a "classical hero" but that he, and his son later, set the board for the eventual awakeing of mankind. They're not supposed to be percieved as heroes but as gods or rather godlike. There is actually a book called "GOD emperor" you know... I mean poor Frank did his best at not beeing to subtle but the material is just not for everyone...
>Book Stilgar: >Skilled fighter and mentor, Paul pinpoints the exact moment that he is reduced to a “Creature of Mua’dib” with sadness >Film Stilgar >Starts off the movie as a creature, bumbles about providing comic relief
I was shocked in the scene where the tribe is outside watching a drunken Stilgar surfing is 4 wheel---- worm around for funsies.
That's not Stilgar at all. Why in the Hell is Denis trying to show a facet of "Fremen life is fun, see? Haha!"
the producers wanted to give a moral foil to the jihad and unthinkingly following a messiah, so Chani's character was rewritten.
Not a bad idea, but done with the grace of a hamfisted teenager and doomed from the start.
In a meta sense chani's character was fricked; she was the daughter of Liet-Kynes, the prophet that gave the Fremen the vision of re-greening their planet, and so was herself only half-Fremen. Liet-Kynes had paved the way for an outsider to become a Fremen, and Chani was the closest thing they had to a princess. Paul and Chani had both just lost their fathers. Their connection made sense, even ignoring that Chani, like all Fremen, were hardcore believers and full-power supporters of Paul.
The one trying to hold off from the Jihad was Paul, who knew what it would cost, and this was a huge moral issue and offered a lot of insight into the character as he grew.
They could have written her well even being anti-jihad, but with Liet being gender and race swapped in movie 1 chani was fricked from the beginning.
In the movie she's just some random desert rat that paul takes a liking to, who then just decides to be a b***h the whole time who'd rather roll in the sand for life instead of letting someone she resents free her from it, and the audience is supposed to relate to this completely unlikeable character.
I've never seen such a good movie with such an absurd subplot. It was like watching two films smashed together, really jarring. Credit to the main movie because it still held up. It's like if A New Hope had a PMS'ing Leia with 3x more screentime and we're meant to see her as always right.
My opinion of Dune 1&2 is that production was great, the visuals were the best thing I've seen in a while, acting was good, and music was awesome too. But it was boring. Really didn't inspire me. Attacking the Abrahamic religions through an arguable satire is not going to make your movie the top blockbuster.
If the worm you followed led you to this… of what use was the worm?
I'm about to marathon parts 1 and 2. What am I in for?
lots of empty interiors with some nuggets of kino
a great looking story about two girlbosses at odds with eachother over turning a manlet into a manlet messiah culminating in an obligatory bechdel scene where they appologise to and congratulate eachother after one of them b***hslapping the messiah at the exact moment of his ascendancy. Oh and there's something about a holding the galaxy hostage bythreatening to nuke sand. Smart stuff this movie and totaly not for modern audiences. You can see it was made by a real book respecter.
>threatening to nuke sand
Great Houses: if you don't respect my position as new Emperor, I'm going to nuke the spice and end its flow.
>"We refuse to respect your position."
Oh. Shit. You called my bluff. Uhh... shit! Well, jihad, I guess?
"holy war"
jihad is a no no word with modern audiences
>What am I in for
unless you have IMAX at home you're gonna be disappointed
chaBlack person
>Fremen are great, aren't we?
>You can't be a Fremen, though.
>We're the best!
>We have a dumb religion, though, lol.
>...but it's not our FAULT we have a dumb religion! ACTUALLY, it's YOUR fault we have a dumb religion!
>Not that I'd participate in my culture's religion. That's just dumb. All religion is.
>HEY! Stop glorifying my culture's religion!!!
>NOOOO! Stop participating in my culture!! STOP IT!
>You can't be our savior! You're...! You...! YOU JUST CAN'T!
>I don't believe in this shit!!!!!!
>I'M not being inconsistent with love and trust and hope and support! YOU ARE!!
>I give up!! I'm running away, I'm abandoning you, I'm abandoning my family, my friends, and I'm allowed to because I'm right! Not you! NOT YOU!!
>holy worm shit, you're the first dude in history to survive the genetic memory activating super spice drug and you just became a literal prescient godlike mesiah? Here's a b***hslap to remind you it was worng of you to do this but mostly to put ME through this.
If this character was removed, DUNC 2 would have been decent
are great, aren't we?
>>You can't be a Fremen, though.
>>We're the best!
>>We have a dumb religion, though, lol.
>>...but it's not our FAULT we have a dumb religion! ACTUALLY, it's YOUR fault we have a dumb religion!
This is just Judaism
What a spoiled, naive brat. How is that anything like the support wife and dearest love from the book? She's just throwing a social fit every time she appears on screen, complaining he's the center of attention, not her.
Like, what the frick.
He used her to get to where he was. They didn't trust him till he started banging her.
Pretty sure Stilgar was already YANDERE for Paul within a few minutes of the film, and everyone trusted and believed in Stilgar. Paul was pretty much their savior within days.
Chani had nothing whatsoever to do with it. She's actually PISSED when she found out she's worshipped in their religion, too, with how little she knows about her own people. Which is hysterical (I mean that in the hysteria "female uterus insanity" way), seeing as she's the daughter to the planet's most devout religious fanatic in the first place.
In the books/previous cinema, Chani is beloved and is frankly using Paul a bit to further her own gains (successfully, I might add). She actually encourages Paul to marry Irulan, seeing how it's the best political thing possible and she's going to remain his concubine anyway, so who cares?
Not only is she using him to further her own gains but she actually has a character arc: she quite enjoys his mesianic status at first in order to push for conflict but she isn't able to savour the final victory as it's overshadowed by the death of her son
Movie Chani's character arc is basically "i'm always right and so are my homies" to "i'm not only right but i'm left the sole voice of reason among millions" to "i'm still right, screw you guys, i'm going home".
>our goal for many generations has been to one day beat the harkonnens and start terraforming the planet to become a green paradise
>but you're not one of us and you're not the one to lead us, you can't survive the desert or speak our language or understand our customs or fight well or see the future
>okay you can actually fight better than all of us
>and you can ride bigger sandworms than anyone else
>and you're one with the desert
>and you know our language and understand our customs
>and you can actually see the future
>and you needed no time at all to lead our people to victory against harkonnens and kickstarted our mission to terraform the planet into a green paradise
>but you're... le BAD and you're STILL NOT ONE OF US!!!!
Everyone I've talked to about this movie IRL ended up disliking Chani. I don't know what the directors intended but she just came off as a miserable grouch who held the hype back. The type of person who'd rather live in the mud for a lifetime than accept a nice life granted to her by someone she can't control.
Dude, he is going to marry the princess she has a right to be mad. She doesn't want to participate in the stupid war either.
You do know the first book ends on her saying she will be the one remembered as wife after she pushes him to marry Irulan as nothing more than a political ploy? You do, don't you?
I never read the book. I'm talking about the movie which is a separate entity from the book.
>I never read the book
opinion discarded
I've seen movies that took a book's name and that's it. The book meant something different from the movie. Clearly she's the sympathetic character here
realy? because the book meant something alright but the movie was a distorted, convoluted, contrarian, self contradicting shit fest that had no discernable message other than "atheist girlboss always right, yassss queen"
now if you think that means anything then you're entitled to your opinion
... but it's still discarded
I'm agreeing with you
>sympathetic
Just pathetic. I don't sympathize with an angry minority teen girl and I don't have empathy for a naive b***h who actively disowns any accountability for irrational anger.
>Clearly she's the sympathetic character here
Maybe that was the goal but from the limited number of people I talked to, she comes off more as a scorned conservative than anything else.
That too. She comes off a bit scorned. I think early on she was unsure of him until he started getting popular then she was happy to hop on the D
Just because I'm wrong about literally everything and explicitly hypocritical doesn't make you right! I'm supposed to be Quizno's Ham-on-Rye! Because it's my right to be! And I deserve it!
>Fremen are great, aren't we?
>You can't be a Fremen, though.
>We're the best!
>We have a dumb religion, though, lol.
>...but it's not our FAULT we have a dumb religion! ACTUALLY, it's YOUR fault we have a dumb religion!
>Not that I'd participate in my culture's religion. That's just dumb. All religion is.
This is literally American and European israelites
The changes from the book are moronic and make the film worse overall with an inconsistency that is present throughout.
keep your stupid comments in your pocket
i dont mind denis making chani a vocal minority in the film, like he said it was to highlight that paul was not a good guy.
its most important to remember because the audience is moronic and would think he was a classical hero unless she didn't literally say that the jihad and prophecy was wrong.
Dune is not a story for morons and by dumbing down characters in order to try to create exposition for morons you are dumbing down the story itself and destroying motivation for the characters to act how they do
The reason Paul is not a "good guy" isn't because he doesn't want to do the right thing but rather quite literally because of Chani. She is the reason he rejects the golden path and passes it down to his son. By not having her firstborn die and by making her an insuferable b***h he has litteraly no reason to give her the children (you know, the ones from the title of the third book) at the expense of her own life and his exile.
The reason you think the jihad was a bad thing is because the story wasn't written for you, and, for that matter, it wasn't written for villeneuve either. From the moment Paul drinks the water of life to the moment of the scattering every atrocity serves to prepare humanity. It's not that he's not a "classical hero" but that he, and his son later, set the board for the eventual awakeing of mankind. They're not supposed to be percieved as heroes but as gods or rather godlike. There is actually a book called "GOD emperor" you know... I mean poor Frank did his best at not beeing to subtle but the material is just not for everyone...
Absolutely nobody in the audience would think that. This is why atheists should not make movies. They don't respect humanity.
>Book Stilgar:
>Skilled fighter and mentor, Paul pinpoints the exact moment that he is reduced to a “Creature of Mua’dib” with sadness
>Film Stilgar
>Starts off the movie as a creature, bumbles about providing comic relief
I was shocked in the scene where the tribe is outside watching a drunken Stilgar surfing is 4 wheel---- worm around for funsies.
That's not Stilgar at all. Why in the Hell is Denis trying to show a facet of "Fremen life is fun, see? Haha!"
the producers wanted to give a moral foil to the jihad and unthinkingly following a messiah, so Chani's character was rewritten.
Not a bad idea, but done with the grace of a hamfisted teenager and doomed from the start.
In a meta sense chani's character was fricked; she was the daughter of Liet-Kynes, the prophet that gave the Fremen the vision of re-greening their planet, and so was herself only half-Fremen. Liet-Kynes had paved the way for an outsider to become a Fremen, and Chani was the closest thing they had to a princess. Paul and Chani had both just lost their fathers. Their connection made sense, even ignoring that Chani, like all Fremen, were hardcore believers and full-power supporters of Paul.
The one trying to hold off from the Jihad was Paul, who knew what it would cost, and this was a huge moral issue and offered a lot of insight into the character as he grew.
They could have written her well even being anti-jihad, but with Liet being gender and race swapped in movie 1 chani was fricked from the beginning.
In the movie she's just some random desert rat that paul takes a liking to, who then just decides to be a b***h the whole time who'd rather roll in the sand for life instead of letting someone she resents free her from it, and the audience is supposed to relate to this completely unlikeable character.
I've never seen such a good movie with such an absurd subplot. It was like watching two films smashed together, really jarring. Credit to the main movie because it still held up. It's like if A New Hope had a PMS'ing Leia with 3x more screentime and we're meant to see her as always right.
easily the best character
My opinion of Dune 1&2 is that production was great, the visuals were the best thing I've seen in a while, acting was good, and music was awesome too. But it was boring. Really didn't inspire me. Attacking the Abrahamic religions through an arguable satire is not going to make your movie the top blockbuster.