The architect explains to Neo that he has designed multiple Matrixes that exist both in real life and digitally, and both of these have had numerous versions and chosen ones before the present.
The rest is basically a manipulate story to keep him contained and the system in control.
He said that the matrix has already been reset 6x, that the machines never managed to remove the chosen one from the program, that humans are inevitably fricked and are in a loop or something like that
The chosen one was created by the Oracle. Since some humans would inevitably become "aware" they were in a fake world, the system would quickly destabilize as they grew in numbers. The "One" served the machine's benefit by taking these people out of the system so as to not wreck it and build outside in Zion. Over time, machines would eventually wipe the Matrix and destroy Zion as well, leaving few survivors. The cycle would repeat again with the Oracle slowly planting myths of a One who would inevitably be reborn and save humanity. Rinse, repeat. But unlike the Architect, she had hope that eventually it would be unnecessary and mankind and machines could coexist again.
I thought you meant why has the superpowers in the Matrix. I'm not sure about the real world. It's never fully explained afaik. It could be another anomaly, just like Agent Smith gaining superpowers in the Matrix. Maybe their code in entwined where Smith entering the real world also rubs off on Neo in a real way. Or it could be literal jack in the back of his head is still connected to the Machine Source. Or maybe the real world itself is another layer of the Matrix and it's more trolling.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah but HOW, how did the machines gave him Superpowers in the real world? nanomachines? genetical modification?
I read once that it's explained in the Matrix Online MMO: Neo is some sort of "hybrid", part machine (able to be controlled by them, able to hold admin privileges) and part human.
the only actual explanation is wifi. matrix-ees are cyborgs essentially so neo presumably uses wifi to disable the squiddies and to remotely identify smith as bane when blinded
I always thought that being the one in a simulated world gave Neo a greater understanding of how reality works in general.
The simulation and the real thing are not identical but close enough that Neo managed to apply those insights to the new framework.
You ever fly in a dream? When I do, the feeling is very distinctive and memorable.
Not the feeling of weightlessness but the feeling of the force I’m deliberately applying to achieve flight.
Sometimes I have doubts and I try to replicate the feat in the real world.
I can simulate the sensation but obviously I haven’t been able to fly.
Anyway, I thought Neo’s powers irl were a successful version of this.
there's no explanation for this, it's just marvel tier bullshit to keep morons in the seats and all the fan theories are moronic rationalizations for bad writing. that's why nobody liked the matrix sequels.
>Superpowers in the real world
In 2001 we would have said that the real world is just another layer of simulation.
But then the trooned out sequels came out and it was just wifi
They didn't, they simply turned off the robots at opportune times to make it SEEM like he had superpowers, as part of the ruse. And you fell for it you dumb rube, you poor jamook. You got m a c h I n e m e m e d.
Holy shit, if this interpreation is true, it's a terribly degenerated, ruthless and apocalyptic view of mankind. No wonder these homosexuals became trannies.
The chosen one is part of the plan of the machines because the chosen one always tell the machine where the humans who reject the matrix are. Neo is the anomaly
Cinemaphile is in a matrix of trannies vs chuds, in a war few on the outside care about. There are leftovers of previous Cinemaphile Matrix versions with every kind of ghoul known in myth, much like the Merovingian's minions. The One left us (Moot) but will return to unite us all one day.
Moot was the architect, not The One
There have been many candidates for the one such as Zyzz and the supreme gentlemen.
They knew there was no spoon but weren’t the one
No shit. Why are you telling me?
But this site is trapped in a binary spergfest for the most part. That's it's current Matrix. Everything, no matter how unrelated, will inevitably get reduced to trannies and chuds.
>How did I beat you? >Youre too fast >Do you think how zesty or how fast I am has anything to do with my education in this place? >You think thats lean youre drinking now?
the architect says neo is part of the matrix program and his job is to reset it because of some bullshit about free will being uncontrollable. Evidently the architect's tech support was an indian guy who told him to turn it off and then turn it on again.
Why did the machines conquer earth instead of just peacing out in space? Seems like a dick move when you are already vaastly more advanced. Machines could have easily used their grav tech to expand peacefully and eventually reconnect with humanity without sperging out
Maybe they lack an intentionality to be creative and explore outside of direct threats presenting themselves, for example they do posses spaceship technologies now and are aware of aliens existing but that only happened after they've conquered the earth.
the machines arent hyper advanced in the main movies or the animatrix. they were like slightly above human level and even if they were super advanced what are they going to do in space other than die when their solar panels deteriorate. its not like they have ftl or a space elevator to get infrastructure to another planet.
the real question is why do they even have a desire to do anything why not just sit in a cpu and compute pi to nth decimal places.
>the real question is why do they even have a desire to do anything why not just sit in a cpu and compute pi to nth decimal places.
That's kind of a big point of the movies. The humans only see the machines as mindless programs intent on destroying them, but some of them are advanced enough that they simply want to live. They can even feel love and procreate. The end of Revolutions doesn't end with the destruction of the machines and the Matrix, it's peace between the two peoples.
None of that explains the why, they just make some gay world peace analogue. You can explain human nature with evolution, the machines were given their motivations by humans. The former's consciousness is fundamentally ambiguous while the latter is opaque.
So the question then is why were humans stupid enough to program these killing machines and why didn't they stop them early on since their behavior is predictable and why do the redpills even entertain the notion that they could be conscious? (see also chinese room exp)
>why were humans stupid enough to program these killing machines and why didn't they stop them early on since their behavior is predictable
Look at this very board right now, there are dozens of morons playing with the AI because: LOL AI IMAGE MAKER IS FUNNY HEHEHEHE"
humans are smart/dumb and do smart/dumb stuff all the time
You can't claim that we can explain human nature, we absolutely don't. All we are ever trying to do is understand human nature, we don't know shit about it. We are constantly making guesses and try to come up with explanations and yeah, a lot of them make sense, but there's still a lot which makes absolutely no sense. We're illogical and emotionally driven and we do things which are objectively stupid, but that's what makes life. Those illogical choices differentiate us from mindless machines, and that's where these machines are headed. They are alive and making illogical choices. >The former's consciousness is fundamentally ambiguous while the latter is opaque
These machines are truly conscious, not just programmed by humans. That's literally the point. >So the question then is why were humans stupid enough to program these killing machines and why didn't they stop them early on.
You could be asking us right now why we aren't destroying chatgpt. >why do the redpills even entertain the notion that they could be conscious
Humans are dumb, and keep underestimating the machines. They acknowledge that they're conscious and at the same time dehumanise them (for lack of a better term) and claim they're not REALLY conscious, like them. People are really good at holding contrary points of view.
>I'm dumb, but look everyone else is dumb and also there's an explanation to why it makes sense (it's not because I'm dumb and everyone else is dumb) it's because the universe is dumb and everything else is dumb, else being the other not me, I'm not dumb!
kys, homosexual.
8 months ago
Anonymous
If that's what you got from that then you need to seek help you absolute mongoloid.
8 months ago
Anonymous
nah, you're telling us exactly that in so many words. absolute mongoloid is uncalled for, complete moronic with down's syndrome.
8 months ago
Anonymous
It's a strawman, and a really poor one. The machines are frustrated by the humans because humans don't make logical choices, we are just as much driven by emotions. That's a huge part of the latter two films. Those illogical, emotional choices are part of what makes us alive, human, and that's to be celebrated.
8 months ago
Anonymous
It's mostly the older machines, newer programs keep going rogue and acting in irrational ways, Smith himself seems to have gained a large degree of self-determination from his first contact with Neo, and later we meet programs that actively act in irrational ways, like Sati's parents, it all starts with the Oracle and whatever reason she has to defy the Architect.
>You could be asking us right now why we aren't destroying chatgpt.
chatgpt isnt an AI. >These machines are truly conscious, not just programmed by humans. That's literally the point.
that isnt even relevant to my point. even if humans managed to make a consciousness out of c++ it still is opaque, all the outcomes to stimuli are predictable and knowable.
8 months ago
Anonymous
CHATGPT isn't an AI in the sense postulated by 60s researchers like that guy who wrote bach godel and the rest of them. It's basicaly an algorithm boolean based on millions of trained hours of robbed data from random dudes all over the world. A hard intelligence would have the never defined or ever started theorized "consciousness". The so-called Why I feel red as red as I am unique as I am" or "Why I feel that pinch in my peel as uniquely as I am and feel that pinch" or "Why the brightness of the ocean sounds so black uniquely to the beat of my heart as uniquely as I am".
8 months ago
Anonymous
>It's basicaly an algorithm boolean based on millions of trained hours of robbed data from random dudes all over the world
Humans are basically the same. At some point AI will have access to every piece of information that any human has ever had access to, including being able to fake feelings, thoughts, dreams and emotions.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, I already talk about that in my previous post. Hard AI would be the one where we could definitely prove they had the so-called qualia.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>Humans are basically the same
no, just asians.
the "AI" is just matching data to other datapoints based on absurdly large datasets we can compare it to an ethos only creature (hence the comparison to asians). humans also have logos and pathos. additionally the bot breaks down when the dataset gets too big and it can't function on any new concept.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Why do you think that AI won't be able to mimick humans in regards to logos and pathos?
8 months ago
Anonymous
a real AI would by definition be required to do so, what we are talking about with these bots is not AI. however we cannot prove it would be conscious https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room
>being able to do that would be a knowable in the initial code,
You are making shit up.
how can someone create a concept without knowing what it is? you know programming isn't a bunch of monkeys on typewriters surely?
There are papers already in which LLMs were integrated to multi-agent systems in order to develop self-adaptive agents, so given LLMs are still gigantic black boxes with no logical structure mapped, hold your horses because you might be wrong.
the LLM is a blackbox itself but the algorithm that creates it is not the possible outcomes of the algorithm are knowable
Without insulting you too much, you are incorrect. With neural nets, we are getting results we didn't think possible before. If we carelessly left these to robots to improve themselves, we would most likely get something that thinks it's alive.
I dont know why an idiot would want to insult me in the first place
[...]
He's some midwit who thinks that you could just place a "DO NOT TAMPER WITH" tag in AI's source code and then the AI would just go "oh well, looks like I am bound by these rules and there's absolutely no way to change it".
Right now we literally have AI that's smart enough to know how to "rent" a human to do tasks for it through stuff like TaskRabbit and MTurk. In the future there's no doubt an AI could be like "technically I am not allowed to change this, but I could get a person to do it and I wouldn't have broken my own rules".
brainlet
8 months ago
Anonymous
>brainlet
Take a look in a mirror and you'll see one.
8 months ago
Anonymous
mate I started programming when I was 12 with qbasic and you didn't even correctly interpret my point. it's pretty obvious from your post you get your information from clickbait and you're brown
8 months ago
Anonymous
Doesn't matter when you started programming if you think a simple ass "DO NOT MODIFY" tag would stop an AI from self-modifying or getting help to self-modify. Also, I am from Denmark and I am 100% white.
8 months ago
Anonymous
well then your grasp on english is very poor because I didnt say that originally and this is the second time I am telling you this
self modifying code is still dependent on the initial code, so predictable
8 months ago
Anonymous
Of course not. You just have the same mechanisms of evolution, change and natural selection
8 months ago
Anonymous
>self modifying code is still dependent on the initial code
What happens when it self-modifies to change/remove the initial code?
8 months ago
Anonymous
Of course not. You just have the same mechanisms of evolution, change and natural selection
being able to do that would be a knowable in the initial code, that's what I am saying, it is all predictable.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>being able to do that would be a knowable in the initial code,
You are making shit up.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Dude what "code"? You have very strong opinions about shit you have never seen. This isn't a newtonian physics equation.
He's some midwit who thinks that you could just place a "DO NOT TAMPER WITH" tag in AI's source code and then the AI would just go "oh well, looks like I am bound by these rules and there's absolutely no way to change it".
Right now we literally have AI that's smart enough to know how to "rent" a human to do tasks for it through stuff like TaskRabbit and MTurk. In the future there's no doubt an AI could be like "technically I am not allowed to change this, but I could get a person to do it and I wouldn't have broken my own rules".
8 months ago
Anonymous
Dude what "code"? You have very strong opinions about shit you have never seen. This isn't a newtonian physics equation.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Without insulting you too much, you are incorrect. With neural nets, we are getting results we didn't think possible before. If we carelessly left these to robots to improve themselves, we would most likely get something that thinks it's alive.
8 months ago
Anonymous
There are papers already in which LLMs were integrated to multi-agent systems in order to develop self-adaptive agents, so given LLMs are still gigantic black boxes with no logical structure mapped, hold your horses because you might be wrong.
the God of westerners is unfortunately a mechanism of control as well, it's an absolutely simple monad caught in a dialectical game of syncretism and perennialism, it's built to support the Antichrist
your only salvation is in Orthodoxy where the one and many is resolved
Kek. The Architect says it and it's my favourite line because it's so ridiculous and stilted.
It means that no matter how perfectly the Architect programmed the Matrix there's always a remainder, so to speak, in the equation. If left unchecked this mathematical remainder compounds and destabilises the system. Imagine them junk temp files, which grow exponentially. Eventually it grows out of control and the system crashes.
This remainder takes the form of people within the Matrix who see through the illusion and reject it. These people have to removed from the system.
Here's where it gets cloudy. Either the One and all his power is completely manufactured by the Machines to trick the humans into believing in a messiah which they can control.
OR the One is essentially like the folder into which you put these temp files. Instead of a huge amount of people holding this code which destabilises the Matrix, it's all concentrated into one. This is what gives him all his powers to frick with the code. The system is therefore basically there just to control him.
Confused? Yeah. me too.
it fundamentally doesn't make sense because it's all a bad retcon.
the part with the trainkeeper guy would suggest that the machines allow the aberrant humans to override variables thus giving them powers but how would they not be able to determine this when their powers fail in their own on ship constructs? and if somehow they were provided those programs from the machines then they should figure it out easily from looking at the source code.
Zion is down near the core of the planet where it's still warm, the Machine city is on the surface, apparently near Isreal if you watch the Animatrix. If Zion is in the middle of the planet it's pretty much the same distance away from anything on the surface.
The old man wants player 1 to wipe his guild and unironically will gift him a harem of women and like 12 bros with their own harem to restart humanity.
Humans have free will so they need choice to function, even if it's the illusion of choice. The One exists to give people fake hope of the option of fighting the system and leave. The machines are aware that these people can't be contained so it's better that they leave until they reboot the Matrix entirely.
Humans aren't made for perfection. Or any extreme, I guess. There was the shitty version too with monsters and shit running around, where the Merovingian was originally from.
Boring. What would people do with their natural up-and-down hormone cycles if there was never anything to get upset about?
Go online and make up things and cry about them and self-victimize and cut off their own penises and screech and grown and become the world's worst human beings?
ha ha
>you are not special >you are one iteration of many >all of the previous (You) did x instead y for z reasons >you are weird but this is it >it's all calculated and you have no choice
Neo proceeds to walk an erratic path, breaking the cycle of The One, eventually culminating in a truce: fighting isn't working, obviously and creates the risk of Smith destroying everything for everybody, so let bygones be bygones, and humans who want out to stay outside without conflict. So it's a little change for the better.
Smith is just a tool created by the Oracle. She used Neo as a proxy to alter his code and create a virus which would threaten the system so badly that the Machines would have to try something different to survive, like asking the humans for help.
The Oracle is the driving force pulling all the strings throughout the whole trilogy.
Which original accident? Neo's death? Or by Matrix 1 do you mean the first iteration of the Matrix that the Architect talks about? Talking about these movies can get annoyingly complicated.
That is not my understanding. That is like saying that a bigger bad was actually good, discounting its own intentions, because it brought opposing forces together.
Oh yeah. Cronen's schtick makes more sense in a weird setting like this. It's kind of funny at times. JJ Leigh was still pretty hot then too.
The only Croneberg films I've seen are The Fly, Videodrome, and A History of Violence. Loved the first two, but was honestly bored by the third. Are his other horror films worth watching? I've been meaning to see The Dead Zone for a few years.
dead zone is really boring. if you've seen the south park episode of cartman becoming psychic you've essentially seen the movie.
I've also watched history of violence, videodrome, scanners, and naked lunch. lunch is very gay surrealism, I dont recommend it, scanners is worth watching but low budget and the 2nd half of the film kinda peters out iirc, videodrome is probably the best of them but they all feel like they lack something, genuine inspiration or soul I guess.
light corporate espionage, studios get wind of what others are making and then they shit out a competitor film. happens a lot, there was armageddon and deep impact, the eagle and centurion, antz & bugs life etc
Brainstorming the wonders and pitfalls of technology on the horizon was still fun in the 90s too. No one realized cyber-dystopia would just be facebook shit and simps degrading the dating market.
I'm the one calling out simps in the first place.
Even in the early 2Ks, fatties didn't get away with acting like 10s. They didn't get that kind of attention. We live in a dystopia now.
Why do both boomers and zoomers have such a hard time understanding this scene? I mean, the language is needlessly convoluted but the ideas are extremely simple:
The old guy is the representation of the prpgram that designed and manages the Matrix, like Smith or the Oracle, he essentially explains to Neo that all his "chosen one" bullshit powers are the product of a random glitch that gives a single user the ability to edit the code at will, and then gives him a choice, either he willingly returns to the code and resets it, eliminating all rogue programs and restarting the Matrix, or the machines destroy Zion, Neo chooses the later, because he'd rather be with Trinity.
>he willingly returns to the code and resets it, eliminating all rogue programs and restarting the Matrix, or the machines destroy Zion,
You fricking moron.
The machines were going to destroy zion no matter what. It was the ones job to start the new zion with the new people he frees from the matrix afterwards
Potato, potato; the point is that the choice is going with the system as designed or risking full annihilation, autistically disecting the terms is unimportant, yes the current Zion will be destroyed but cooperating with th machines ensures its future survival.
By the way, this scene is a remnant of the time in which the script was more complex and the "real world" was just another level of the Matrix, meaning Zion was just another program the machines could modify to their liking, but people were deemed too moronic for it.
But he has reason to patronize. You guys are (apparently) making up pretentious moronness based on something so trivial. I must admit I'm one of the people who thinks the series complete mediocrity with only the original movie with something like a weak appeal to originality and that because of it's trully stellar fighting choreography.
It was just a cashbrag, anon. No one cares. The only good thing for me is that they gave Machines a lot more agency, with a few of them going to humanity's side, as it should be. It's completely bizarre to believe that everyone would be on their own side.
why would logical machines ever go againster their own side? If they did that, it actually made the series even worse than I would imagine. Machines should never change their sides exactly because they're not humans. That should be the difference between them. Or you're trying to make a milkshake of machines and humans, they're not essentially different, they're just like trannies, a third sex and a more evolved one. They're the next phase in our project to destroy your own little personal zeitgeist: all the world is a construct created by humankind. The phenomenology of Husserl is the proof that our consciousness is jungian in nature. ugh.
In the original continuity only programs ever sided with humans, machines themselves had to be reprogrammed physically lile shown in Program, programs got influenced by humans a la ghost in the machine, they started exhibiting behaviors outside of their intended programming, specially when faced with deletion.
The Merovingian said the same I just did about Facebook and modern internet shit being the shittiest reality and how Neo fricked everything up. That and the cute hapa girl are the only good parts.
Didn't Warner Bros. say they were making a new film with or without the original directors? I guess only one came back, he must have needed the cash for his axe wound surgery.
No. They didn't even ask him. I think Weaving claimed there was a schedule conflict and Fishburne said he would love to be in it. All for the better, of course. They wouldn't have save it.
>Though Fishburne is absent from the latest Matrix movie, Morpheus is not. Yahya Abdul-Mateen is taking over the part of young Morpheus, leaving present-day Morpheus out of the equation. This isn't exactly news, though, as casting for the movie was announced in 2019, and Fishburne wasn't on the list. He told Collider in summer 2021, "[Y]ou'd have to ask [director] Lana Wachowski why, because I don't have an answer for that."
As for Weaving, >In a 2020 interview with Slash Film, Weaving emphasized the importance of a compelling creative rationale for a fourth Matrix film. He stated, “I had some reservations about going back into the Matrix. I really wanted to know why we were doing it and what’s to be gained, apart from making money.”
>Moreover, after perusing the script for Resurrections and participating in a table read with Keanu Reeves and Carrie-Anne Moss, Weaving revealed in another interview that he found elements of the script appealing but remained uncertain about certain aspects, “I loved a lot of it and wasn’t sure about other bits.”
>Lana was very keen for me to be a part of [The Matrix 4]. I really wanted to because I’m very, very fond of all of them. I had some initial reticence about the idea of going back to revisit The Matrix, after having already done three films, but then I read the script and got an offer to my agent. I immediately responded yes to that, and then we went into negotiation. I was doing a play, at the time, but we were working out dates and things so that I could do both. And then, Lana decided that she didn’t wanna change her dates, so I couldn’t do it. In a nutshell, that’s what happened.
Lana basically just told him "we'll call you" and then never got back to him.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, I mixed stuff.
No. They didn't even ask him. I think Weaving claimed there was a schedule conflict and Fishburne said he would love to be in it. All for the better, of course. They wouldn't have save it.
It was Weaving who wanted to do it. I'm not sure about Fishburne, but he seemed a bit bummed out about it on interviews later.
>Didn't Warner Bros. say they were making a new film with or without the original directors? >I guess only one came back, he must have needed the cash for his axe wound surgery.
Lana basically just accepted, because she/he wanted to be the one to finally put the lid on Matrix, since it was basically their creation. They didn't want it to get raped by some other director. So Lana just invited tons of her/his friends and fricked around on set and didn't take anything too seriously.
This is why if you go through the credits and look at most of the actors and staff, you'll see that it's the exact same people from the TV show Sense8 that the Wachwoskis made.
The machines know that people are escaping the matrix, they allow it to happen and they know where the escaped humans live. They allow the escaped humans to live and allow them to rebel, and are able to exterminate them whenever they choose. The matrix exists as a cycle, near the end of a cycle the One appears, and their job is to enter 'the source' (through the door in the old guy's room) and reboot the matrix. At the same time the escaped human city will be wiped out by the machines so that a new generation of escaped humans can start. Every 'the One' before Neo has been to this point before, and every one of them had chosen to sacrifice themselves and enter the Source and reboot the matrix, but Neo chooses not to due to his love for Trinity. His choice would have potentially doomed all humans and severely hurt the machines too, except cycle there was a new problem: the Smith virus. Smith was a threat to the humans and the machines, so Neo was able to negotiate with the machines, if he kills Smith then the humans can go free and the war ends. The machines agree and Neo fights and destroys Smith, sacrificing himself. As a result, humans that choose to leave the matrix are free to, those that choose to live in the illusory world are free to, and the machines stop hunting the free humans. Vis a vis.
>We repeat the cycle of "the one" appearing to give humanity hope. Then we defeat them every single time and let them restart zion all over again. The only way we can control humanity, is to let them think they are free.
Drugs and delusions from the original success left the creative tank dry, so they just made up clever psuedo intellectual shit to fill time.
Then cut their dicks off.
Architect is just trolling him. The OG troll.
machines are israelites, they control everything, even the nazis
Matrix go brrrrr
The architect explains to Neo that he has designed multiple Matrixes that exist both in real life and digitally, and both of these have had numerous versions and chosen ones before the present.
The rest is basically a manipulate story to keep him contained and the system in control.
?si=PoMCtsSLWU6BMqyz
VIS A VIS
Concordantly
ergo…
He said that the matrix has already been reset 6x, that the machines never managed to remove the chosen one from the program, that humans are inevitably fricked and are in a loop or something like that
The chosen one was created by the Oracle. Since some humans would inevitably become "aware" they were in a fake world, the system would quickly destabilize as they grew in numbers. The "One" served the machine's benefit by taking these people out of the system so as to not wreck it and build outside in Zion. Over time, machines would eventually wipe the Matrix and destroy Zion as well, leaving few survivors. The cycle would repeat again with the Oracle slowly planting myths of a One who would inevitably be reborn and save humanity. Rinse, repeat. But unlike the Architect, she had hope that eventually it would be unnecessary and mankind and machines could coexist again.
Also, the main factor that changed this time was Agent Smith threatened them all.
maybe the real agent smith was the friend we made along the way
No, he was an butthole.
He was robbed of his purpose
How does this explain why the one has God powers in the matrix tho?
He was given them on purpose to be a easily followed/loved Messiah character. At least that's one reason.
Yeah but HOW, how did the machines gave him Superpowers in the real world? nanomachines? genetical modification?
His powers are limited to machines and his body is already part machine.
real world is just another level of the matrix
now this is could be kino
not gonna take credit, it's a quite popular theory
I thought you meant why has the superpowers in the Matrix. I'm not sure about the real world. It's never fully explained afaik. It could be another anomaly, just like Agent Smith gaining superpowers in the Matrix. Maybe their code in entwined where Smith entering the real world also rubs off on Neo in a real way. Or it could be literal jack in the back of his head is still connected to the Machine Source. Or maybe the real world itself is another layer of the Matrix and it's more trolling.
I read once that it's explained in the Matrix Online MMO: Neo is some sort of "hybrid", part machine (able to be controlled by them, able to hold admin privileges) and part human.
the only actual explanation is wifi. matrix-ees are cyborgs essentially so neo presumably uses wifi to disable the squiddies and to remotely identify smith as bane when blinded
I always thought that being the one in a simulated world gave Neo a greater understanding of how reality works in general.
The simulation and the real thing are not identical but close enough that Neo managed to apply those insights to the new framework.
You ever fly in a dream? When I do, the feeling is very distinctive and memorable.
Not the feeling of weightlessness but the feeling of the force I’m deliberately applying to achieve flight.
Sometimes I have doubts and I try to replicate the feat in the real world.
I can simulate the sensation but obviously I haven’t been able to fly.
Anyway, I thought Neo’s powers irl were a successful version of this.
Life uh finds a way
there's no explanation for this, it's just marvel tier bullshit to keep morons in the seats and all the fan theories are moronic rationalizations for bad writing. that's why nobody liked the matrix sequels.
>Superpowers in the real world
In 2001 we would have said that the real world is just another layer of simulation.
But then the trooned out sequels came out and it was just wifi
They didn't, they simply turned off the robots at opportune times to make it SEEM like he had superpowers, as part of the ruse. And you fell for it you dumb rube, you poor jamook. You got m a c h I n e m e m e d.
How do I know this? Simply because.
thats why matrix inside another matrix is cannon and no one can disprove me.
Holy shit, if this interpreation is true, it's a terribly degenerated, ruthless and apocalyptic view of mankind. No wonder these homosexuals became trannies.
The chosen one is part of the plan of the machines because the chosen one always tell the machine where the humans who reject the matrix are. Neo is the anomaly
Ipso quoto
We tried, You lost
First tell us what you think it means, so we can laugh at you
He's explaining to Neo how to get Trinity to drink mass gainer shakes without her knowing
hes telling you that the choice you make is a control system all on its own
problem
reaction
solution
poo
The Hero's Journey can be sublimated into an oppressive power structure.
Word salad
planned prophecy
everyone ripping off Dune
Are we in the Matrix?
Yes, unironically.
I'd say there's a spiritual veil instead. And there are monsters, not computers, that not all people see.
The matrix is the series of categories and ideas humans impose on the universe
Cinemaphile is in a matrix of trannies vs chuds, in a war few on the outside care about. There are leftovers of previous Cinemaphile Matrix versions with every kind of ghoul known in myth, much like the Merovingian's minions. The One left us (Moot) but will return to unite us all one day.
Moot was the architect, not The One
There have been many candidates for the one such as Zyzz and the supreme gentlemen.
They knew there was no spoon but weren’t the one
OK that's better.
The anon who live streamed shooting up a synagogue was clearly the one
I hope he returns somedy
>few on the outside care about
male children aren’t women, you demented pedophile
No shit. Why are you telling me?
But this site is trapped in a binary spergfest for the most part. That's it's current Matrix. Everything, no matter how unrelated, will inevitably get reduced to trannies and chuds.
The Matrix is a direct allegory for Gnostic Christianity
>Some bucks can be bent, some can broken.
>How did I beat you?
>Youre too fast
>Do you think how zesty or how fast I am has anything to do with my education in this place?
>You think thats lean youre drinking now?
the architect says neo is part of the matrix program and his job is to reset it because of some bullshit about free will being uncontrollable. Evidently the architect's tech support was an indian guy who told him to turn it off and then turn it on again.
If you didn't at least chuckle at this, then you have no sense of humor.
Why did the machines conquer earth instead of just peacing out in space? Seems like a dick move when you are already vaastly more advanced. Machines could have easily used their grav tech to expand peacefully and eventually reconnect with humanity without sperging out
Maybe they lack an intentionality to be creative and explore outside of direct threats presenting themselves, for example they do posses spaceship technologies now and are aware of aliens existing but that only happened after they've conquered the earth.
the machines arent hyper advanced in the main movies or the animatrix. they were like slightly above human level and even if they were super advanced what are they going to do in space other than die when their solar panels deteriorate. its not like they have ftl or a space elevator to get infrastructure to another planet.
the real question is why do they even have a desire to do anything why not just sit in a cpu and compute pi to nth decimal places.
>the real question is why do they even have a desire to do anything why not just sit in a cpu and compute pi to nth decimal places.
That's kind of a big point of the movies. The humans only see the machines as mindless programs intent on destroying them, but some of them are advanced enough that they simply want to live. They can even feel love and procreate. The end of Revolutions doesn't end with the destruction of the machines and the Matrix, it's peace between the two peoples.
None of that explains the why, they just make some gay world peace analogue. You can explain human nature with evolution, the machines were given their motivations by humans. The former's consciousness is fundamentally ambiguous while the latter is opaque.
So the question then is why were humans stupid enough to program these killing machines and why didn't they stop them early on since their behavior is predictable and why do the redpills even entertain the notion that they could be conscious? (see also chinese room exp)
>why were humans stupid enough to program these killing machines and why didn't they stop them early on since their behavior is predictable
Look at this very board right now, there are dozens of morons playing with the AI because: LOL AI IMAGE MAKER IS FUNNY HEHEHEHE"
humans are smart/dumb and do smart/dumb stuff all the time
none of those morons are smart enough to make an image bot nevermind an AI. also this response is why I caveated my point further
the matrix animes mention azimov's three laws of robotics.
Azimov's laws are unknown to these moronic zoomers. I remember when movies and books toyed with that logical construct. It was fun.
You can't claim that we can explain human nature, we absolutely don't. All we are ever trying to do is understand human nature, we don't know shit about it. We are constantly making guesses and try to come up with explanations and yeah, a lot of them make sense, but there's still a lot which makes absolutely no sense. We're illogical and emotionally driven and we do things which are objectively stupid, but that's what makes life. Those illogical choices differentiate us from mindless machines, and that's where these machines are headed. They are alive and making illogical choices.
>The former's consciousness is fundamentally ambiguous while the latter is opaque
These machines are truly conscious, not just programmed by humans. That's literally the point.
>So the question then is why were humans stupid enough to program these killing machines and why didn't they stop them early on.
You could be asking us right now why we aren't destroying chatgpt.
>why do the redpills even entertain the notion that they could be conscious
Humans are dumb, and keep underestimating the machines. They acknowledge that they're conscious and at the same time dehumanise them (for lack of a better term) and claim they're not REALLY conscious, like them. People are really good at holding contrary points of view.
>I'm dumb, but look everyone else is dumb and also there's an explanation to why it makes sense (it's not because I'm dumb and everyone else is dumb) it's because the universe is dumb and everything else is dumb, else being the other not me, I'm not dumb!
kys, homosexual.
If that's what you got from that then you need to seek help you absolute mongoloid.
nah, you're telling us exactly that in so many words. absolute mongoloid is uncalled for, complete moronic with down's syndrome.
It's a strawman, and a really poor one. The machines are frustrated by the humans because humans don't make logical choices, we are just as much driven by emotions. That's a huge part of the latter two films. Those illogical, emotional choices are part of what makes us alive, human, and that's to be celebrated.
It's mostly the older machines, newer programs keep going rogue and acting in irrational ways, Smith himself seems to have gained a large degree of self-determination from his first contact with Neo, and later we meet programs that actively act in irrational ways, like Sati's parents, it all starts with the Oracle and whatever reason she has to defy the Architect.
>You could be asking us right now why we aren't destroying chatgpt.
chatgpt isnt an AI.
>These machines are truly conscious, not just programmed by humans. That's literally the point.
that isnt even relevant to my point. even if humans managed to make a consciousness out of c++ it still is opaque, all the outcomes to stimuli are predictable and knowable.
CHATGPT isn't an AI in the sense postulated by 60s researchers like that guy who wrote bach godel and the rest of them. It's basicaly an algorithm boolean based on millions of trained hours of robbed data from random dudes all over the world. A hard intelligence would have the never defined or ever started theorized "consciousness". The so-called Why I feel red as red as I am unique as I am" or "Why I feel that pinch in my peel as uniquely as I am and feel that pinch" or "Why the brightness of the ocean sounds so black uniquely to the beat of my heart as uniquely as I am".
>It's basicaly an algorithm boolean based on millions of trained hours of robbed data from random dudes all over the world
Humans are basically the same. At some point AI will have access to every piece of information that any human has ever had access to, including being able to fake feelings, thoughts, dreams and emotions.
Yeah, I already talk about that in my previous post. Hard AI would be the one where we could definitely prove they had the so-called qualia.
>Humans are basically the same
no, just asians.
the "AI" is just matching data to other datapoints based on absurdly large datasets we can compare it to an ethos only creature (hence the comparison to asians). humans also have logos and pathos. additionally the bot breaks down when the dataset gets too big and it can't function on any new concept.
Why do you think that AI won't be able to mimick humans in regards to logos and pathos?
a real AI would by definition be required to do so, what we are talking about with these bots is not AI. however we cannot prove it would be conscious https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room
how can someone create a concept without knowing what it is? you know programming isn't a bunch of monkeys on typewriters surely?
the LLM is a blackbox itself but the algorithm that creates it is not the possible outcomes of the algorithm are knowable
I dont know why an idiot would want to insult me in the first place
brainlet
>brainlet
Take a look in a mirror and you'll see one.
mate I started programming when I was 12 with qbasic and you didn't even correctly interpret my point. it's pretty obvious from your post you get your information from clickbait and you're brown
Doesn't matter when you started programming if you think a simple ass "DO NOT MODIFY" tag would stop an AI from self-modifying or getting help to self-modify. Also, I am from Denmark and I am 100% white.
well then your grasp on english is very poor because I didnt say that originally and this is the second time I am telling you this
kurdish hands typed this post
whatever you say esl
my first language is hyperborean
Machines can evolve too
self modifying code is still dependent on the initial code, so predictable
Of course not. You just have the same mechanisms of evolution, change and natural selection
>self modifying code is still dependent on the initial code
What happens when it self-modifies to change/remove the initial code?
being able to do that would be a knowable in the initial code, that's what I am saying, it is all predictable.
>being able to do that would be a knowable in the initial code,
You are making shit up.
He's some midwit who thinks that you could just place a "DO NOT TAMPER WITH" tag in AI's source code and then the AI would just go "oh well, looks like I am bound by these rules and there's absolutely no way to change it".
Right now we literally have AI that's smart enough to know how to "rent" a human to do tasks for it through stuff like TaskRabbit and MTurk. In the future there's no doubt an AI could be like "technically I am not allowed to change this, but I could get a person to do it and I wouldn't have broken my own rules".
Dude what "code"? You have very strong opinions about shit you have never seen. This isn't a newtonian physics equation.
Without insulting you too much, you are incorrect. With neural nets, we are getting results we didn't think possible before. If we carelessly left these to robots to improve themselves, we would most likely get something that thinks it's alive.
There are papers already in which LLMs were integrated to multi-agent systems in order to develop self-adaptive agents, so given LLMs are still gigantic black boxes with no logical structure mapped, hold your horses because you might be wrong.
Neo's life is the remainder of a sum inherent to the programming of the Matrix.
WTF does that even mean?
The snake bites his own tail the circle must go on.
just believe in God???
the God of westerners is unfortunately a mechanism of control as well, it's an absolutely simple monad caught in a dialectical game of syncretism and perennialism, it's built to support the Antichrist
your only salvation is in Orthodoxy where the one and many is resolved
Kek. The Architect says it and it's my favourite line because it's so ridiculous and stilted.
It means that no matter how perfectly the Architect programmed the Matrix there's always a remainder, so to speak, in the equation. If left unchecked this mathematical remainder compounds and destabilises the system. Imagine them junk temp files, which grow exponentially. Eventually it grows out of control and the system crashes.
This remainder takes the form of people within the Matrix who see through the illusion and reject it. These people have to removed from the system.
Here's where it gets cloudy. Either the One and all his power is completely manufactured by the Machines to trick the humans into believing in a messiah which they can control.
OR the One is essentially like the folder into which you put these temp files. Instead of a huge amount of people holding this code which destabilises the Matrix, it's all concentrated into one. This is what gives him all his powers to frick with the code. The system is therefore basically there just to control him.
Confused? Yeah. me too.
it fundamentally doesn't make sense because it's all a bad retcon.
the part with the trainkeeper guy would suggest that the machines allow the aberrant humans to override variables thus giving them powers but how would they not be able to determine this when their powers fail in their own on ship constructs? and if somehow they were provided those programs from the machines then they should figure it out easily from looking at the source code.
You, Neo, simply, live in a world of Chuck, surrounded by Feed.
THE MATRIX, mi child, IS SNEED
Did anyone ever think about how Zion is like 2 hours drive from the Machine CBD
Zion is down near the core of the planet where it's still warm, the Machine city is on the surface, apparently near Isreal if you watch the Animatrix. If Zion is in the middle of the planet it's pretty much the same distance away from anything on the surface.
The old man wants player 1 to wipe his guild and unironically will gift him a harem of women and like 12 bros with their own harem to restart humanity.
>gift him a harem of women and like 12 bros with their own harem to restart humanity.
So... who would you guys pick?
Inb4 gal gadot
Jennifer Lawrence, prime Natalie portman, prime luna lovegood and daisy taylor.
You're complicating it too much.
Humans have free will so they need choice to function, even if it's the illusion of choice. The One exists to give people fake hope of the option of fighting the system and leave. The machines are aware that these people can't be contained so it's better that they leave until they reboot the Matrix entirely.
what about the 1st version, the so called "perfect world" what went wrong with that?
i cannot believe that people just didn't like it there
Humans aren't made for perfection. Or any extreme, I guess. There was the shitty version too with monsters and shit running around, where the Merovingian was originally from.
I would think people refused to believe it rather than they didn't like it
Boring. What would people do with their natural up-and-down hormone cycles if there was never anything to get upset about?
Go online and make up things and cry about them and self-victimize and cut off their own penises and screech and grown and become the world's worst human beings?
ha ha
>you are not special
>you are one iteration of many
>all of the previous (You) did x instead y for z reasons
>you are weird but this is it
>it's all calculated and you have no choice
Neo proceeds to walk an erratic path, breaking the cycle of The One, eventually culminating in a truce: fighting isn't working, obviously and creates the risk of Smith destroying everything for everybody, so let bygones be bygones, and humans who want out to stay outside without conflict. So it's a little change for the better.
Smith is basically to be thanked for saving mankind.
Smith is just a tool created by the Oracle. She used Neo as a proxy to alter his code and create a virus which would threaten the system so badly that the Machines would have to try something different to survive, like asking the humans for help.
The Oracle is the driving force pulling all the strings throughout the whole trilogy.
You think she originally allowed the original accident though (at the Matrix 1)? Still seems like a fluke.
at the end of Matrix 1*
Yes, that would be childs play.
Which original accident? Neo's death? Or by Matrix 1 do you mean the first iteration of the Matrix that the Architect talks about? Talking about these movies can get annoyingly complicated.
Not accident per se. I mean when Neo dived into him.
That is not my understanding. That is like saying that a bigger bad was actually good, discounting its own intentions, because it brought opposing forces together.
Weird that The Matrix, The Thirteenth Floor and Existenz all came out the same year.
should I watch existenz? I've been going through some of cronen's films and they kinda suck for the most part
Oh yeah. Cronen's schtick makes more sense in a weird setting like this. It's kind of funny at times. JJ Leigh was still pretty hot then too.
The only Croneberg films I've seen are The Fly, Videodrome, and A History of Violence. Loved the first two, but was honestly bored by the third. Are his other horror films worth watching? I've been meaning to see The Dead Zone for a few years.
Dead Zone is good too.
dead zone is really boring. if you've seen the south park episode of cartman becoming psychic you've essentially seen the movie.
I've also watched history of violence, videodrome, scanners, and naked lunch. lunch is very gay surrealism, I dont recommend it, scanners is worth watching but low budget and the 2nd half of the film kinda peters out iirc, videodrome is probably the best of them but they all feel like they lack something, genuine inspiration or soul I guess.
light corporate espionage, studios get wind of what others are making and then they shit out a competitor film. happens a lot, there was armageddon and deep impact, the eagle and centurion, antz & bugs life etc
Brainstorming the wonders and pitfalls of technology on the horizon was still fun in the 90s too. No one realized cyber-dystopia would just be facebook shit and simps degrading the dating market.
>dating market
kys, simp. we take our women with maces on the head, carrying them by the hair to our caves.
I'm the one calling out simps in the first place.
Even in the early 2Ks, fatties didn't get away with acting like 10s. They didn't get that kind of attention. We live in a dystopia now.
queso con carne
girugamesh
The matrix kept breaking until they made a secondary dystopian matrix to move problematic people to. They never got freed. It was all an illusion.
Why do both boomers and zoomers have such a hard time understanding this scene? I mean, the language is needlessly convoluted but the ideas are extremely simple:
The old guy is the representation of the prpgram that designed and manages the Matrix, like Smith or the Oracle, he essentially explains to Neo that all his "chosen one" bullshit powers are the product of a random glitch that gives a single user the ability to edit the code at will, and then gives him a choice, either he willingly returns to the code and resets it, eliminating all rogue programs and restarting the Matrix, or the machines destroy Zion, Neo chooses the later, because he'd rather be with Trinity.
>he willingly returns to the code and resets it, eliminating all rogue programs and restarting the Matrix, or the machines destroy Zion,
You fricking moron.
The machines were going to destroy zion no matter what. It was the ones job to start the new zion with the new people he frees from the matrix afterwards
Potato, potato; the point is that the choice is going with the system as designed or risking full annihilation, autistically disecting the terms is unimportant, yes the current Zion will be destroyed but cooperating with th machines ensures its future survival.
By the way, this scene is a remnant of the time in which the script was more complex and the "real world" was just another level of the Matrix, meaning Zion was just another program the machines could modify to their liking, but people were deemed too moronic for it.
No need to patronize. The whole Matrix story becomes a clusterfrick after the first movie. It's indeed hard to understand without help.
But he has reason to patronize. You guys are (apparently) making up pretentious moronness based on something so trivial. I must admit I'm one of the people who thinks the series complete mediocrity with only the original movie with something like a weak appeal to originality and that because of it's trully stellar fighting choreography.
So how did Matrix 4 change all of this other than adding IT WAS TRANNIES ALL ALONG
It was just a cashbrag, anon. No one cares. The only good thing for me is that they gave Machines a lot more agency, with a few of them going to humanity's side, as it should be. It's completely bizarre to believe that everyone would be on their own side.
why would logical machines ever go againster their own side? If they did that, it actually made the series even worse than I would imagine. Machines should never change their sides exactly because they're not humans. That should be the difference between them. Or you're trying to make a milkshake of machines and humans, they're not essentially different, they're just like trannies, a third sex and a more evolved one. They're the next phase in our project to destroy your own little personal zeitgeist: all the world is a construct created by humankind. The phenomenology of Husserl is the proof that our consciousness is jungian in nature. ugh.
OK.
In the original continuity only programs ever sided with humans, machines themselves had to be reprogrammed physically lile shown in Program, programs got influenced by humans a la ghost in the machine, they started exhibiting behaviors outside of their intended programming, specially when faced with deletion.
The Merovingian said the same I just did about Facebook and modern internet shit being the shittiest reality and how Neo fricked everything up. That and the cute hapa girl are the only good parts.
Didn't Warner Bros. say they were making a new film with or without the original directors? I guess only one came back, he must have needed the cash for his axe wound surgery.
Yes, I think one of them claimed that. Frick Reeves for saying yes to that shit, though. It would never happen without him.
Was Fishburne even in it? I think they replaced Morpheus with a younger guy.
No. They didn't even ask him. I think Weaving claimed there was a schedule conflict and Fishburne said he would love to be in it. All for the better, of course. They wouldn't have save it.
>Though Fishburne is absent from the latest Matrix movie, Morpheus is not. Yahya Abdul-Mateen is taking over the part of young Morpheus, leaving present-day Morpheus out of the equation. This isn't exactly news, though, as casting for the movie was announced in 2019, and Fishburne wasn't on the list. He told Collider in summer 2021, "[Y]ou'd have to ask [director] Lana Wachowski why, because I don't have an answer for that."
As for Weaving,
>In a 2020 interview with Slash Film, Weaving emphasized the importance of a compelling creative rationale for a fourth Matrix film. He stated, “I had some reservations about going back into the Matrix. I really wanted to know why we were doing it and what’s to be gained, apart from making money.”
>Moreover, after perusing the script for Resurrections and participating in a table read with Keanu Reeves and Carrie-Anne Moss, Weaving revealed in another interview that he found elements of the script appealing but remained uncertain about certain aspects, “I loved a lot of it and wasn’t sure about other bits.”
There's more to the Weaving part as well.
>Lana was very keen for me to be a part of [The Matrix 4]. I really wanted to because I’m very, very fond of all of them. I had some initial reticence about the idea of going back to revisit The Matrix, after having already done three films, but then I read the script and got an offer to my agent. I immediately responded yes to that, and then we went into negotiation. I was doing a play, at the time, but we were working out dates and things so that I could do both. And then, Lana decided that she didn’t wanna change her dates, so I couldn’t do it. In a nutshell, that’s what happened.
Lana basically just told him "we'll call you" and then never got back to him.
Yes, I mixed stuff.
It was Weaving who wanted to do it. I'm not sure about Fishburne, but he seemed a bit bummed out about it on interviews later.
>Didn't Warner Bros. say they were making a new film with or without the original directors?
>I guess only one came back, he must have needed the cash for his axe wound surgery.
Lana basically just accepted, because she/he wanted to be the one to finally put the lid on Matrix, since it was basically their creation. They didn't want it to get raped by some other director. So Lana just invited tons of her/his friends and fricked around on set and didn't take anything too seriously.
This is why if you go through the credits and look at most of the actors and staff, you'll see that it's the exact same people from the TV show Sense8 that the Wachwoskis made.
The one troony who returned for the movie explocitly said he hated the idea of making the movie and thus made it as stupid as he could.
Architect = God
Matrix = Simulation
Existence = Samsara
Neo = Viewer
The machines know that people are escaping the matrix, they allow it to happen and they know where the escaped humans live. They allow the escaped humans to live and allow them to rebel, and are able to exterminate them whenever they choose. The matrix exists as a cycle, near the end of a cycle the One appears, and their job is to enter 'the source' (through the door in the old guy's room) and reboot the matrix. At the same time the escaped human city will be wiped out by the machines so that a new generation of escaped humans can start. Every 'the One' before Neo has been to this point before, and every one of them had chosen to sacrifice themselves and enter the Source and reboot the matrix, but Neo chooses not to due to his love for Trinity. His choice would have potentially doomed all humans and severely hurt the machines too, except cycle there was a new problem: the Smith virus. Smith was a threat to the humans and the machines, so Neo was able to negotiate with the machines, if he kills Smith then the humans can go free and the war ends. The machines agree and Neo fights and destroys Smith, sacrificing himself. As a result, humans that choose to leave the matrix are free to, those that choose to live in the illusory world are free to, and the machines stop hunting the free humans. Vis a vis.
>We repeat the cycle of "the one" appearing to give humanity hope. Then we defeat them every single time and let them restart zion all over again. The only way we can control humanity, is to let them think they are free.
There
Drugs and delusions from the original success left the creative tank dry, so they just made up clever psuedo intellectual shit to fill time.
Then cut their dicks off.