>gets instantly destroyed at every on screen appearance
>never scores a single kill
>never even has its moment like the Zaku or GM had
>Always got outshined by the Rick Dias
Is there a more pathetic mobile suit?
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Yes. His successor's only screen time was this.
Don’t slander the nemo iii pleas
Such is the nature of Unicorn.
My favorite Unicorn moment was when a Nemo was fighting the Juaggu and falls over dead after taking a shot to its shoulder.
that's right above an engine air intake what the frick do you mean shoulder
pretty sure it's an exhaust. The reactor is shielded
I hate unicorn so much its unreal
I always lose interest around the torrington base episodes and drop it
Funnily enough that’s where the show utterly tanks
>he doesn't like grunt vs grunt
Grunt vs grunt is great. It's the obnoxious zeonwank that's shitty.
isn't there an episode where a nameless byarlant mogs the zeek army?
Yeah, and that battle scene is actually done well because despite the Byarlant's superiority they're still attempting to fight back. Most other battle scenes in Uni look crappy since there's so much sandbagging going on.
I think
kinda nails it. It's little more than a training base atleast with how poorly defended it was by any standard ... especially after the Dakar attack. Doesn't help that they had Deus Ex Zakusniper that somehow managed to sneak into the airspace ... that should have been detected miles away.
Torrington had potential to be a good brawl but it highlights so many simple issues it ruins itself. Hell they could have even let the infantry teams have a shot but they just smeared them as though like 1 team was all the base had.
The more I think about it the stupider it gets...
Does the Nemo show up in ZZ? I can't remember
Yeah I doubt all the veterans in the world would have saved them if they tried to jump a base full of Jegans and ReZELs
Everyone copes with
>muh zeon veterans
All they did was target a Federation base that has been long demoted due its history. Torrington was seen as a reject center of the federation as former Titans were there too. Zeons last great counter attack was versus a poorly supplied backwater base.
As soon as the Jestas show up the battle basically ends, nevermind the Unicorn and Delta. It does suck to watch Nemos, Guncannon Detectors, GMIIIs, all suits that should have the performance to be big players in the Gryps eat shit at the hands of OYW clunkers. The best performing Federation grunts in the Unicorn ground battles were that one GMIII that killed a Juaggu and a Marasai... that was on Zeon's side
one of the nemos got a nice capule kill though, and probably a few more off-screen during the counterattack
The GM IIIs were the only Feddie suits besides the Jestas and Byarlant to actually win any fights though.
A Jesta almost died to a Zaku I too
Sometimes they jerk the Zeeks off a bit too hard
> A Federation grunt in a Jegan pushes the Kshatriya
> The Byaralant Custom styles all over Zeon units at the end of the Torrington attack
> People go wild and cream their pants screaming about "muh skill"
> Zeon unit does something similar
> What the frick is this shit? How dare they? Fricking Zeekshitters!
>> A Federation grunt in a Jegan pushes the Kshatriya
>> The Byaralant Custom styles all over Zeon units at the end of the Torrington attack
A whole two instances. Meanwhile episode 4 jacks Zeon remnants off raw.
The Byarlant Custom/Kai and the Stark Jegan were both high end mobile suits given to aces and were at the top of the edge tech and performance wise from the Late Gryps Conflict to Char's second Neo-Zeon War. That is incomparable to literally pre-Zeta era mobile suits being wanked off to taking down modern day suits and the Feddie pilots being literally lambs to the slaughter.
The Jegan wasn't even cutting edge when it was made, because mass production suits never are. It was top of the line for mass production, but it was still mass production. Which was several years prior when it was introduced. The Stark pack doesn't add much, and the pilot ditched it almost immediately to improve his chances against a unit which made his "top of the line" unit look obsolete in a multitude of ways. The Kshatriya is at least one generation ahead of his unit, even discounting the addition of Newtype technology that pushes it that much further ahead again. The Stark Jegan in that instance is comparable to a GM Sniper against the Qubeley or something in terms of technology gap.
Never mind that a lot of Zeon's success in that battle was due to taking the base by complete surprise anyway.
>Jegan wasn't even cutting edge
But the Stark Jegan was.
Stark Jegan is just a Jegan with thruster and missile packs. Actual cutting edge for grunt performance envelope at that point in the UC0090s is maybe MP Nu, ReZEL, Delta Plus, or the Silver Bullets.
Delta Plus is only a year younger than vanilla Jegan. Which once again proves that just because the particular versions of Jegans we see in Unicorn were relatively new doesn't magically make them better than older but more advanced mobile suits. Hell Hyaku Shiki which it's based on could probably still take on any Jegan ever made with favorable or at the very least even odds.
The Hyaku Shiki would lose to any of the three f91 Jegans which have almost double the speed and Vernier thrusters of the original.
If you remove plot armor, how does the Barzam compare to MK II and Hyaku Shiki spec wise.
ReZELs weren't given to regular ESF forces.
Yes they were, the General Revil had them. General Revil were regular forces, not special forces.
Delta Plus was never mass produced, it was only a prototype.
https://www.mechatalk.net/viewtopic.php?t=14059&start=20
>In light of the new information provided in the MG Delta Plus manual, it turns out that the Delta Plus was developed in UC 0090...
>...A number of these Delta Plus's were manufactured with one being recorded as having been assigned to Londo Bell in 0096 as a replenishment machine.
I believe the relevant section of the MG booklet that is mentioned in that link should be the bottom half of this page scan.
That said, the intention was for the Delta Plus to be a (limited?) MP model. Is the mass-production-type Nu considered just a prototype because it was halted at that stage before adoption, or would it still be considered a mass-production-type because it is after all, literally called the MP Nu? And does that apply in kind to the Delta Plus?
Stark Jegan was just an upgrade kit. Anyway I think people misunderstand why Stark Jegan-san was such a chad: it wasn't because he was evenly matched with a Cyber-Newtype in a superior suit (cause he wasn't, he didn't as much as scratch Kshatriya), it was his attitude: him going "okay, let's go", keeping his cool and staying defiant to the end. His fricking left hand which is all we see of him oozes more charisma than Banagher saying "yeah, but" a hundred times in a row.
>me likey faceless grunt over Gundam MC
This but unironically
Okay, self-inserter.
Nooooo you have to like the main characters we spent 124 gorillion dollars making their kits!
Cool shitposting, but you know that ain't true.
I like Gundam MCs, just not Banana Manager. I don't hate him either, he's just kinda there, all in all Judau-tier.
>Banana
>Judau-tier
Of all the things you can say about israelitedough, "kinda there" is not one of them.
They have a lot in common though, like zeek noblewomen throwing themselves at them for no reason, and cucking blonde guys.
The difference is the execution and the attitude. Judau goes gung-ho while Banagher take several proddings for him to get his ass into gear.
yes and ?
you're a basic b***h
better than a advanced c**t
>a advanced
How is preferring grunts to the super-powered MC suit you're very clearly supposed to like a basic b***h take? If anything it's the opposite.
Because most anons here want to self insert as the nameless grunts that die because "lol lmao talk shit then die alone and forgotten nihilism" instead of trying to invoke plot armor like a real ace pilot.
>invoke plot armor
Well, yeah. Suspension of disbelief breaking down due to there being no believable struggle makes for bad story and no engagement. It's much easier to empathize with faceless, brave, potentially doomed men as it's a story as old as mankind. Most of us are no more than 2 generations from that if not lived it ourselves.
Superheroes with plot armor and newtype hax? Best when they engage one another a la Char and Amuro, and otherwise are just aces by themselves.
Kek, you would've had the biggest dissonance ever to those who lived in the 50's who were all about larger than live fictional heroes. This is the biggest curse that the Millennials carry, they project themselves to grunts as one of their cynical defeatist attitudes in life.
Pfffft. My dad's generation had nerds and larger than life heroes but had that wiped clean by repeat wars. Grow up loser, stop looking at the past with MAGA eyes.
>MAGA
Start by kicking out /misc/ from your mind ghetto.
Be easier if you got lost first, you'd take the trash out as you left.
>He's still going at it.
Spider-Man is 60 years old
Didn't they mention that the Kshatriya was an "old type" that just got upgrades? I forget the exact wording but something about being a prototype received during the second neo zeon war
Just the psycoframe in it, since Neo Zeon can no longer make new psycoframe. I'm pretty sure the Kshatriya is new since it's mentioned to be extremely high performance for its time and a unique donut copy special MS.
>> A Federation grunt in a Jegan pushes the Kshatriya
Because the Kshatriya wasn't using any weapons other than funnels from afar against an entire squad of LONDO BELL pilots. In the end even the Stark Jegan doesn't even scratch the Kshatriya which didn't even use any of its weapons other than the beam saber
>> The Byaralant Custom styles all over Zeon units at the end of the Torrington attack
Against fixed up OYW models
>>> The Byaralant Custom styles all over Zeon units at the end of the Torrington attack
>Against fixed up OYW models
And some Gryps and Neo Zeon 1 models and some of the Zulus.
The Zulus escape unharmed other than being slammed into a wall. In the manga the Byarlant pilot even helps them and other zeon stragglers fight off some pirates and escape safely
One of the Zee Zulus loses both of its arms, but probably survives since we don't see it explode and the Byarlant doesn't follow up with a killing blow because he has to deal with new enemies coming at him right after disabling that particular Zee Zulu.
>fights
>s
did the Jestas even do anything other than shoot that Zaku Sniper? I heard they saw a lot more action in the novel
They got used as stepping stones in the fight in the upper atmosphere around the Garuda and Garancieres. Later after transferring to space, they chased down the Garancieres which promptly exploded in their faces as a decoy. Their role as comic relief "ace pilots" saved them from taking part in the final battle where I dunno, they probably would have just gotten raped by the Neo Zeong's virus tentacles.
anon was right I also hate Unicorn so much it's unreal
To the credit of the OYW clunkers, several of them were specialized Doms and the Dom in general simply was never matched in ground performance by anything the federation made since sans maybe the Byarlant by virtue of being able to ignore gravity and fly. The Dom is morono fast and can zip around on the ground very easily, while it got outclassed in space pretty quickly, it's still a deadly MS on the ground. They are capable of fighting at extreme speeds and also accurately firing, something alot of old feddy suits couldn't do, especially in tandum. Plus the Feddies had shit pilots who weren't even fighting in terrains that would benefit their mobile suits. The Feddies had suits capable of jumping and performing some complex mid air maneuvers but they were mostly in a city so doing a lot of that was out of the question. The fight is as reasonable and unreasonable as you can think of reasons for it being either tbh
Nah if Zeta was made today they'd still primarily be using GMIIs. The GMII was the budget upgrade of old type GMs they got out of storage because Chad Gato nuked most of their MS force into dust. The GM Quel, while mass produced, wasn't mass produced at the same numbers as the GMII. Plus specs wise the GMII actually has better performance, even if the pilots hated it(suggesting that things outside of listed specs make it suck, likely the general feel of it while piloting compared to a better overall machine with the Quel). To a federation bureaucrat, the GMII was the way to go even if the Quel was a better overall suit
>The GMII was the budget upgrade of old type GMs they got out of storage because Chad Gato nuked most of their MS force into dust.
...WHat? Gato mostly nuked ships which weren't huge MS carriers to begin with.
(Seriously, he did them a favor, the 0083 Salamis Kai was so bad they made a totally different Salamis Kai by Zeta and pretended the ones Gato irradiated didn't even exist.)
There were MS in that fleet for sure, there are even many pictured right before they get blown up. Also this explains why the federation even wanted to adopt Zeon style MS to begin with. This is why we see stuff like the Galbaldy Beta get adopted on an official level, the Federation needed to fill the void left by Gato and we're willing to take anything that was not shit and cheap and easy to produce, thus the Galbaldy Beta was adopted and was cranked out of captured Zeon factories as the new and improved Gelgoog but for Feddy use. The Hi-Zack in a way is the same case but slightly different. You can basically thank Gato for why the Federation ever adopted mono eye MS ever
Wait wait wait, is this implying that the BR-GM would serve as inspiration for the crossbone vanguard MS we later see in F91? At least as a familial design. Barzamchads rise up!
There absolutely were, but most of the fleet there were not carriers or even real dual-purpose ships.
Most of what got destroyed were vessels not just made to fight the "Last war" but made to *lose* the "Last war" a monumental frickup.
>It was FRICKING AWESOME to watch Nemos, Guncannon Detectors, GMIIIs, all suits that should have the performance to be big players in the Gryps eat shit at the hands of OYW clunkers
Fify
It was, honestly
I don't know. This is the same show that later had Full homosexual and his boy toy solo the federation flagship.
Well the ship itself isn't so much the issue as the entire compliment of suits it carries.
And the ship being dumb enough to get in range itself.
And then in the sequel wandering its ass up to a giant bomb.
Wasn't that one piloted by an Ex-Titan?
It would have been the funniest shit ever if it would have been Yazan but I don't recall what happens to him after Zeta.
He ends up on Shangri-La at the start of Zeta. Used Judau and pals to try and steal the Zeta which fails a few times. Eventually says frick it and lives out his days on the farm with Gemon. He has a brief cameo at a Neo Zeon party later in the show but that’s it for animated works. I’m sure some stuff happens with him in spin-offs but I’ve not read them
Start of ZZ excuse me
In Return of Johnny Riden he shows back up.
GM III > Jegan
the huge ad for old grunt suit plamo kits is the good bit
>Is there a more pathetic mobile suit?
not actually having an up to date grunt suit and just a long list of experimental prototypes + specialised suits. Titan's army composition is just Zeon's, but moronic
Wasn't the Barzam a grunt? Though I guess it came too late into the war like the Gelgoog.
The Barzam is a grunt, but it's considered to be on the same performance level as the Gundam Mk.II
Apparently now its good enough to stay in service along with the Jegan.
Probably a color error but I think its at Jaburo or near a scene near the Argama or inside the stolen Garuda.
the bloody MKII lasted through most of the second Zeon war as part of the G-Team so I'm not too surprised
kinda
the bulk of the Titans was still GMs and Hizaks by the end of the Gryps conflict
I guess you could argue that any GMs you see in Zeta would probably retroactively be Quels if Zeta was made today
I mean the new lore suggest that they kept upgrading to point that it was still useful by the Oldsmobile war. Which means it outlasted the gm III and other fed machines by quite a lot.
Also it seems like the new barzam variants are adopting AOZ styling.
The Nemo is implied in zeta to be internally Zeon when it was used to repair a wrecked Gelgoog. Also the Nemo can't be identical to the GM II since the gm II doesn't have a moveable frame and the nemo does.
>the bulk of the Titans was still GMs and Hizaks by the end of the Gryps conflict
The Titans have never used a GM II, aside from the GM Quel and whatever crap comes out of AoZ. The Titans were exclusively using Hizacks, Marasai and Barzams as their grunts. There are no animated scenes of a Titan's GM II.
Grunt Versus Grunt when Zeon drags out mobile armors, super special suits like a fricking efreet, Zogok, and modern Zee Zulus.
What did the federation have? Some GM IIIs just barely, the Fricking aqua GMs that were out of date in 0079!, and a custom byarlant made to look more fedddie.
I forgot but why was Zeons last epic battle at Torrington again?
It was pretty close to where their colony drop impacted so they figured it would be symbolic to go out with a bang there.
Laplace coordinates horseshit
That's the only part worth watching. Why are you gay?
>GM III still reigns as the supreme alpha
Fricking chad III more like
Easily my favorite UC grunt.
the beam javelin is king among all weapons
a tragedy he gets SMASHED AND SHAMMED immediately after this
Technically the GM IIs killed that Juaggu, which also makes this the first on screen kill the GM II has ever gotten
One managed a Gouf kill at Jaburo.
good guy grunts are destined to job to give the feeling that the Gundam's enemies are strong and the Gundam is the only trump card.
Leo
Ignoring that one knife throw from Neo destroying Freedom's shield, this. Looks sexier too.
>Looks sexier too.
Disgusting taste
it can drift while launching so i like him
Nah, this scene obviously shows the jobber feddie pilot almost losing control of their Nemo for a while
>feddie
he didn't watch the show, he's just a shitposting moron trying too hard to fit in
the AEUG is the real Earth Federation
it's a zeon grunt suit with a gm-like outer shell
Nemo was heavily inspired by the GM Sniper II and was built partially based on data taken from the captured Gundam Mk II. The only thing Zeon about it is that some of the engineers involved were former Zeonic employees.
You described the GM II, not sure why you put a picture of the Nemo. Try watching Zeta at 1x speed next time.
some AEUG GM II were actually Nemo colored
All the AEUG GM IIs are green. The red ones are EFSF. Titans never used the GM II and went straight to the Hizack (unless the 0083 Rebellion wank decides to retcon that)
Yeah but there are also a couple GM II’s in Zeta that outright use the Nemo color scheme iirc
>Lead your shots to hit this fricking thing, taking into account the Nemo's speed
>Miss every one because the GMII is slower and shittier
Ah I see now how the AEUG won Gryps, very clever
Also the quality of Fed and Titans pilots are just absolute ass.
This literal autopilot Nemo did more in 4 seconds than any actual Nemo pilot in all of Zeta
everyone in zeta was moronic for some reason
All things considered the GM managed to kill a Hygogg
that's expected because GM are canonically superior to any Zeon mobile suit
worth mentioning that internally the GM II and Nemo are almost identical*(though the Nemo does apparently have some very minor performance tweaks compared to the GM II), the Nemo basically exists to give some of the backers of AEUG and Karaba plausible deniability regarding where they're getting their mobile suits, which ties into the name as Nemo can be translated as "No Man" or "Nobody"
*to the point that a lot of the remaining stock of Nemo's ended up getting converted into GM III's after the remnants of AEUG rejoined the Federation
doesn't the nemo use gelgoog-compatible internals
every source I've been able to find corroborates with my claims that it's derived from the GM II
to be fair part of why suits like the Galbaldy Beta and Act Zaku got adopted by the Federation as MP units is that they were very high quality units for their price, remaining surprisingly competitive even into the Gryps War, though most sources I can find claim that the Federation adopted most of the Zeon designs it ended up Mass Producing basically immediately after the OYW once they captured places like Pezun rather than as late as 0083
yeah Gato basically ended up wiping out most of the hardliners in the Federation military who supported a battleship focused force, while most of those who weren't there and thus survived were those who supported a focus on Mobile Suits and ships for transporting and supporting them
>every source I've been able to find corroborates with my claims that it's derived from the GM II
Which sources are those? Mark Simmons mentions the fact that Nemo has a movable frame and the master grade manual as sources for the Nemo not being a derivative or improvement of the GM II.
https://www.mechatalk.net/viewtopic.php?p=299813&sid=c0854a7cc75aeda2e43764f353e39357#p299813
>As one might guess from the fact that it has a movable frame, the internals of the Nemo are radically different from those of the GM II. The Master Grade kit manual goes so far as to state that "Although the Nemo is considered part of the GM series, in fact it could be described as a machine with a Principality technological heritage." Essentially, it takes the Zeon design lineage of the Rick Dias, adds some movable frame knowhow gleaned from the Gundam Mark II and Hyaku Shiki, and wraps it up in a package that superficially matches the "silhouette and functionality" of Federation machines. I guess that makes it the exact opposite of the Hizack!
animation trumps sources for canon
eh I always just took that as being the combination of two things; 1) the designers of the Nemo at Anaheim being former Zeon engineers, and 2) almost all Mobile Suits ultimately descend from the Zaku series(since the Federation started off their own MS development from copying captured Zaku 1's) so I imagine there's a lot more cross compatibility between Zeon and Federation MS than ever really gets admitted(which gels with how often we've seen suits get fixed up with bits from the other faction's suits)
>every source I've been able to find corroborates with my claims that it's derived from the GM II
Doubt. Even databooks that have no English translations show flowcharts where the Nemo at least partly comes from the Rick Dias and the Hyaku Shiki, not from the GM II.
It's undeniable that the Nemo has some commonality with the GM series, but that's because it was intentionally developed as a compatible replacement for GM IIs that AE can just build for the AEUG to use rather than needing to go capture more GM IIs, not that it's just a GM II under the hood with some tweaks.
>worth mentioning that internally the GM II and Nemo are almost identical*
Better post a source if you're going to make a bullshit claim like this
It's been stated for years that the Nemo is basically a love child between the Rick Dias and GM II. Stop being an R-tard that denies any and all information for the sake of starting an argument you dumbfrick.
Try reading
and
moron
The nemo was higher performance than the GMII, was built with moveable frame tech taken from the MK II gundam, and basically exists because they needed something to fill out their forces that could actually go toe to toe against the titans and the repainted GMIIs they were currently using were outdated and low performance in comparison at that point.
don't worry about what the kids at mook school say, you are still daddy's big handsome boy
Rosamia fought off the Zeta in a Nemo. She did really well too iirc
Did the Leo ever score a kill? Or even hit anything for that matter? It exists to be jobbed
So you’ve never seen Wing?
Yes, they get a few kills on Mobile Dolls for example but usually they're blowing up each other. Conveniently of course they are less prone to explosion when main characters use them.
Wait doesn't Fa trash a Hizack in this thing?
Yeah and Kamille whoops Yazan’s Marasai in the Manga
Those buttholes in bandai need to put out another reprint of the MG Nemo, i want another
ENTER, the king of jobbers
>Jobbed for twenty years of non-stop alien attacks
>Doesn't even get an upgrade or successor suit
>Is actually just a civilian suit gussied up in tinfoil parade armor
It's so pathetic.
>Doesn't even get an upgrade or successor suit
My brother in christ, what do you think the Genoace II is?
>Oh no how could my GM III lose to a Zaku! They're jerking off the zeeks again!
All GMs are trash. Always are, always were. There is a reason they cowarded out of having the 08th MS crew run around in GMs, even the coolest and strongest most powerful GMs ever. They treat them like a joke. That's because GM will never escape the shadow of "they went from the White Devil to ~this~?". Zaku II codified what an MS is. RX-78-2 redefined what an MS could be. Meanwhile all GM did was show that Feds are terrible at spending their resources.
The Jegan/Jesta line is okay, I guess.
>All GMs are trash.
GM III only ever appeared to wreck Sp*cenoid shit in any media it had. One of the very best nameless faceless pilots in the Gundam series was an ex-veteran from Londo Bell who gave Marida a shit ton of effort to beat after she had already singlehandily solo'd an entire squad of ReZELs.
by that logic Doms are worse than trash because they never beat a GM in 0079
No, by that logic Doms are cool because they were cooler than the Zeon suits we've seen prior to them, instead of lamer. GM's reputation has less to do with it actual mediocre combat capability and more with the context of its introduction.
Dom isn't cooler than the Zaku and definitely not cooler than the Gouf. Doms are kind of jokes if I'm being honest, the Tri Stars were an embarassment compared to Ramba
>more with the context of its introduction.
...as the MS that won the war?
That's not RX-78-2
which is a running theme with GMs as you should have noticed
NTA but the entire conceit of 0079 is that the RX-78-2 didn't win the war, the White Base's entire adventure was supplemental to the wider conflict. They provided many useful contributions, but to name an immediate example of this being the case, regardless of whether a nuclear weapon is used at the Battle of Odessa in no way changes that the EF could successfully conduct a space assault.
I agree with the idea in concept, but the opposite is demonstrated throughout the UC shows. GM wasn't even as good as Gelgoog, how the frick were they gonna take out Big Zam or Zeong with GMs? And a single mobile armor can wipe out entire fleets. Hell, Sinanju drives off the biggest baddest Fed capital ship with a full compliment of Jegans and ReZELs on its own, with the added caviat of doing it non-lethally. Every time an enemy like that shows up it requires a suit that may not be quite as powerful, but is at least roughly in the same league. So just like RX-78-2 can take on an almost unlimited amount of Zakus at once a dozen or two of GMs (or their later equivalents) can't take out Zeong, the O or Qubeley.
>wasn't even as good as the gelgoog
Statistically, sure, but the Gelgoog rarely if ever got any pilots capable of bringing out its full potential. In both 08th MS Team and MS Igloo they get the honor of being jobbers, in 0079 they also barely show up, and the only mass produced one the White Base team fights is shot down by either the G-Fighter or Core Booster.
It is also not necessarily good to consider Zeon's silver bullets actual long form conflict winners. In some supplamental material, such as Gundam Century, the Big Zam's actual operating time is noted as being extremely low, and that it was on the verge of overheating by the time Amuro and Sleggar cut it down, but even before then the EF understood they would need to attack it with missiles. The Apsalus was crippled by a GM Sniper before Shiro finished it off; to defeat it would require using more of them. Even in 0079 the Zeong, while managing to cut down numerous GMs and a number of EF ships was never noted as actually stopping the entirety of the assault.
Apsaras was a one-trick pony for blowing up muh Jaburo, not a fleet killer like Neue Ziel or even a proper combat unit. Not to mention piloted by a madman who never intended to pilot it himself. Also obviously in a show where the powerlevel of the good guys caps out at Ez8, GMs are gonna bit a bit more useful.
>Even in 0079 the Zeong, while managing to cut down numerous GMs and a number of EF ships was never noted as actually stopping the entirety of the assault.
to be fair that has more to do with Char getting distracted by Amuro not too long after he sortied, if Amuro hadn't been present he probably would have gone through the Federation fleet like a chainsaw through butter as Amuro was literally the only pilot the Federation had that could match Char, which probably would have been enough for Zeon to eke out a win at A Baoa Qu, which in turn likely means long term victory for Zeon as the time it would take for the Federation to assemble a new fleet would give them time to get the Colony Laser working again which at minimum would prevent the Federation being able to make another proper full scale assault on either A Baoa Qu or Side 3 to potentially(depending on whether they could sort out the firing rate/breakdown issues it initially has) allowing them to just start making long distance strikes on Federation territory using the Colony Laser(like what we saw in the Novels)
Even if Char beat Amuro, he would've still crippled zeon anon there's no way they can beat the federation.
>Even if Char beat Amuro, he would've still crippled zeon anon there's no way they can beat the federation.
like I said they just have to beat them back from A Baoa Qu to buy enough time to get the Colony Laser going, once they got that they win
also worth mentioning that Char only went after Kycilia on a whim after his whole duel with Amuro, and only succeeded at that due to how chaotic everything was in the battle giving him an opening, he's not really going to get proper chances otherwise unless he decides to openly reveal himself as Casval Rem Deikun and incite a rebellion
Char doesn't have to openly reveal himself because Kycillia shooting Gihren is a given as is the splinter that was going to happen in their forces. Zeon was fricked no matter what
I think someone on here went over that.
Essentially the Zabi infighting sealed the deal on failure. Even assuming she managed to escape the battle she seemed more keen on keeping what gains were made and may have even just settled for a 'peace' option in the aftermath while still maintaining a focal point of leadership in Zeon. As a fighting force though they had lost too many experienced pilots through attrition which is why people always bring up Gelgoog being the posterboy of 'untapped potential' as it gets mogged by Guncannons in space.
I don't recall but another autist around here kinda highlights how even the Ball, while being a floating coffin, simply could overwhelm even the best suits while having superior maneuverability thanks to being little more than thrusters and weapons but they were just shown as 'fodder' to make suits look better despite having many more favorable traits for space combat(as we know, Rule of Cool always trumps true function in shows). And as far as logistics, the Ball is pound for pound better than basically all other options especially if they had being utilized more like carrier based craft than mook-fodder.
>having superior maneuverability thanks to being little more than thrusters and weapon
In the short term, but with only the little arms and maybe the cannon turret for AMBACS they will run out of propellant far far faster.
Which doesn't really matter because there's far more balls than there are their opponents, Igloo shows this, a Ball doesn't need to do a extended fight they fly in bombard and frick off while supporting the GMs tearing into their forces
The Federation had the Solar System undergoing repairs at Solomon. It hasn't got the range of the colony laser, but is a lot more flexible and easy to transport. It'd take days, if not weeks to move the Colony Laser around the moon and into a position where it can fire on any Federation base beyond maybe Solomon itself, but the Solar System can be quickly broken down and transported in normal ships, so could be in firing range of the Colony Laser in a much shorter time frame.
>The Federation had the Solar System undergoing repairs at Solomon. It hasn't got the range of the colony laser, but is a lot more flexible and easy to transport. It'd take days, if not weeks to move the Colony Laser around the moon and into a position where it can fire on any Federation base beyond maybe Solomon itself, but the Solar System can be quickly broken down and transported in normal ships, so could be in firing range of the Colony Laser in a much shorter time frame.
yeah but any fleet large enough to both transport and protect the Solar System is going to be vulnerable to attack by the Colony Laser(or even just a more conventional assault), also actually the Federation didn't even have a working Solar System at the time, it was being transported in the A Baoa Qu assault force that got blasted by the Colony Laser
and this isn't even going into the possibility of Zeon building another Colony Laser down the line
another thing to keep in mind is that in this hypothetical "Zeon wins at A Baoa Qu" scenario is that they had already begun mass production of the Zeong and while by the battle itself only Char's unit was ready out of the several being built at the time, well afterwards is a whole new situation, cause even in the hands of lesser Oldtype pilots the Zeong would probably be a monster of a unit
This isn't Dragon Ball power levels with mobile suits thought. Technically anything can take out anything of the pilots aren't shit. Technically the basic GM is a solid MS
I love that animation errors gave us cool deep lore an helped solidify the fact that the Gryps conflict was a massive shit show on both sides where everyone was throwing everything including the kitchen sink at each other
You shut up about the Jamesgun, Jamesgun is a good lad
>Technically the basic GM is a solid MS
It's already outdated by virtue of not having a natively panoramic wienerpit.
>That's not RX-78-2
You mean the suit that had help from the GMs? You do know that the federation is the one who crippled the zeon defense right?
>Feds are terrible at spending their resources
>They win the war through zerg rushing
Dumbass.
literally only one war, the rest had to be carried by notable figures
second zeon war was carried by the g-team really because the feddy higher up were happy with neo-zeon smacking colonies into the earth
OYW was more because not-hitler was moronic thinking the feds would put all their eggs in one basket demolishing half of the zeek's fleet while only managing to remove one of three feddie fleets
The Zeeks also had serious spending issues thanks to M'quve
That sounds like some serious goalpost moving to make Zeon "not look weak" even though they were pretty much exhausted by the time GMs were rolled out.
no? They were rolling out the Rick Doms then while working on all their psychommu experiments and the gelgoog. During final battle command variants in squads were replaced with the gelgoog so you had squads comprised of Doms and then a MS comparable to a rx78
The best thing about the main GM was it's beam weapons, while the suit itself was just damn solid. Nothing that screamed unstoppable. The feddies also sent most of their force with beam weaponry into space to spearhead against Zeon, while fighting on earth was still mostly done by ballistic weapons with GMs and budget/second hand gundams.
and the third point I have which is actually more zeekwank is the California base's amphibious suits were ruining the GMs day, even when the feds tried to improve their GMs to compete with Doms, CA-base amphibious suits rammed steaming logs of their own shit down the cold type's throats. This is even before taking variations into account where the Juaggu exists to be obnoxiously powerful
that post was in no way trying to imply zeon wasn't weak. They had half of their force backstabbed and now they couldn't use the colony laser again while the feddies had two fleets worth of workhorse MS and threw anyone left into balls. As the previous post before me stated the feds won through numbers which they would've still had the advantage if Gihren hadn't gone full moron.
You could also argue most pilots weren't acquainted with the gelgoog, Johny Cringing swapped back to his custom ZakuII hi-mob to dab on a full armour gundam
Pretty much every databook agrees that the only numbers advantage the federation had was ships and support units (balls), which were established to be basically helpless in modern OYW combat. The MG manuals, for example, say around 330 GMs by the end of the war. Meanwhile the MG Zaku II manual says there were thousands of the Zaku family produced. Other sources agree in ambiguous ways. 330 GMs from the first few production batches, an unknown but probably not significant number of GMs in the proceeding batches (some production facilities took a smaller role). Meanwhile thousands of zakus, hundreds of goufs and doms, and <200 gelgoogs. ABQ was also an uphill battle for the federation. They started out with a larger fleet but that was cut in half and they lost all of their top leadership right off the bat and they had to break through a heavily fortified position. The GMs were just better. It's not like the average federation pilot had anymore experience than the average zeek. Prior to ABQ Solomon was the only major fleet deployment and not even all teh feddies fought at Solomon. SIde stories continue to retcon in more feddie MS at Odessa but I've yet to see anything that mentions a large deployment of feddie MS other than some Ground GMs and Gundams + a couple early type GMs testing the waters
All of the background fluff for numbers of MS during the OYW are crazy and inconsistent. Some says it's a couple hundred, some say it's a couple thousand, I think I've seen somewhere where it said several tens of thousands. I find that reducing the numbers take away a lot of the fun of the conflict as a whole. I also find that people often reduce the war down to just the siege on Jaburo and then ABQ when technically there were tons of little fighting all over the place
iirc a lot of the federation's top aces from the OYW ran basic early type GMs for the majority or all of their run as pilots. Alot of GMs we're extremely effective, like the GM Spartan as an example. If you break out of the OYW, the GM Custom performed pretty well and the GM Quel performed extremely well against Zeon remnants. The GM sucks about as much as any mass produced MS which means when grunts fight grunts they are nothing to be sniffed at
The base GM sucks and all the GM variants are explosive improvements to the design. Which is kinda strange when you look at the Zaku II, which is a cool unit with cool variants without the base model being so lame
The GM was rushed into production so of course expect it to look and perform cheap.
Ground GMs and some of the other early variants were rushed into production. The standard GM A/B type took its time and wasn't fielded until what, mid to late November?
Chalk that up to Feds' commie QA.
base GM sucking is a meme, they didn't even perform poorly, they did a hell of a lot better onscreen than the job machine that is the Dom
>The MG manuals, for example, say around 330 GMs
I don't know why this number gets parroted so much on /m/, there are plenty of other sources that dispute this. And if you pull the numbers from every other GM series its more than 330. It's also far fetched the only 330 units were needed to overtake several key strong holds. Imagine if the American's only need 330 sherman tanks and a bunch of shitty howitzers (RB-79) to completely take out Germany.
>Meanwhile the MG Zaku II manual says there were thousands of the Zaku family produced.
3000 Zaku IIs give or take is fairly common take in many source books. That said that is 3000 Zakus produced throughout the war, obviously many of those were destroyed before the end of the OYW.
RGM-79B is called the late type in one of the Master Archives (which gets confusing since the RGM-79C GM Kai is also sometimes called the late type). The 79B is the good GM, the 79A are the rushed GMs, there's an instance of the 79As being deployed to Odessa but held back to to maintenance issues and so the GM Ground Types were sent instead.
They're cheaper than mass producing Gundams directly and better than Balls.
That's really the only thing they needed to be.
You have to read sidestory manga if you want your GM-series fanservice
At least the Nemo puts up a fight against other mobile suits and is seen as heroic.
Despite how much love it gets from people, the only time you see the ANF doing something besides exploding is when it's participating in genocide in the middle east and child-murdering.
Truth in television, that's basically every shithole military with russian/chinese gear.
Do you really expect a mobile suit created solely for the purpose to show that some terrorist groups in the middle east have access to some form of a mobile suit to be able to do 'heroic' things like fight off enemy MS and look badass doing it? Its like being upset that a random background grunt working for a supervillain who only has like 3 on screen appearances, has no backstory beyond "hired baddie"
Is it wearing Crocs?
Still did more than
They have time to shine in games.
say the Nemo never accomplished anything.
You must be watching the wrong series.
>in another timeline Nemo was the main antagonist in every Gundam
>Still gets BTFO by Barzam
Even when it does stuff, Nemo still gets the shaft.
>missing an arm
>still stands defiant in the face of the barzam menace
Absolute king.
thoughts on the more zeek-looking nemo from zeta gundam's concept art stage?
also here's some goodies on other gryps MS http://www.ultimatemark.com/gundam/production/zgundam.html
That makes me think of a Galbaldy Beta mixed with the Nemo. I still prefer the Nemo II and III MSVs if we're edging toward Zeek design aesthetics.
Gustav Karl had it worse
Gotta say it's been a while since I watched unicorn but "the grunt fights sucked in Unicorn" is a take I have never seen in the past decade until now.
What? It's a common take on /m/.
Being a gruntgay is understanding that grunts are shown jobbing hard in the animation so that Gundams or main character bad guy suits can look good by comparison, but being a gruntgay is also knowing that there are many, many grunts, and the glorious moments of grunts having epic victories in battles are not seen in animation because Gundams and epic bad guys hog all that time.
It just hit me that those are all on the same scale. The F91 era suit kn the lower left is just THAT much smaller than a Jegan.
iirc the Heavygun has all the same specs as the Jegan except for the fact that it's small
>knowing that there are many, many grunts, and the glorious moments of grunts having epic victories in battles
just a bunch of bros going out to work with no real concern about their allies betraying them because their allies are also dumb grunts
>no real concern about their allies betraying them
No, no concern at all, did that leo look concerned? no he didn't. Should he have? maybe
He looks like he's trying to cosplay as rx-78-2
Nemo has always been the biggest jobber out of literary heroes
Even Dr jekyll is better and he dies half the time
>Yamcha
Okay yeah they paint GMIIs like Nemos
Yeah
Holy shit is that a Nemo
That's a GM with Nemo colours anon.
Frickin smartass AEUG got me again
Just wait till you see the repainted Nemos in Unicorn.
Do New Desides and Task Force Alpha suits count as grunt units?
this slight Nemo redesign is better than the original one
the upward slanted visor makes the nemo look scared and worried all the time, which makes sense, but it's not good design for a military organization
As opposed to the OG GM and its Ideon but with downs visor?
>"Master Chief, do you mind telling me what you're doing on the Argama?"
that kit's ankles suck
this is better, but I don't like how much of jsut grabs parts of the mkii design
also frick changing the nemo's head. Zeta gundam's mecha heads are all fantastic, yet it's always the first thing someone tries to change up (usually removing monoeyes off titan units despite it being the best part of most of them)
Bolinoak Sammahn is the only suit I can think of that has a mid head
>Bolinoak Sammahn is the only suit I can think of that has a mid head
Wrong, the Bolinoak's head is still high on its body. Messala is the one with a head that's mid on its body.
it scores a kill in Zeta when Rosamy is piloting it
I like that there were GMs with the Nemo color scheme, regardless of animation error or done purposefully.
Would make sense to further establish a faction identity and patterns against what the Titans used.
A captured Nemo repainted in EF colours is also seen once. It's definitely a Nemo since it's missing the GM II's chest sensor and it has the Nemo's shoulder verniers and skirt armor
You gays seem to forget the Jamesgun exists.
His shield looks like an angry cat
What's that from? Moon?
Heh but the dumb grunts taging the latest coup win 95% of the time.
Anyone know what kind of weapon the bigass gun near the bottom is?
Looks like some sweet Sniper type Nemo so I'm guessing a custom beam sniper.
Am I reading the bottom right paragraph correctly? Paraphrasing but it sounds like it's saying the Nemo is one step below the Marasai in performance, which is fine since the AEUG already has the Rick Dias. Something about Karaba prioritizing cost effectiveness and using Gundarium Alpha vice Gamma. Makes sense, for a rebel faction you want your grunts extra cheap.