>getting tracked incredibly fast despite leaving no trail
>doesn’t think to check case for tracker until past midpoint of movie
This guy was supposedly a hardcore Vietnam vet and tactical expert.
>getting tracked incredibly fast despite leaving no trail
Methinks the asiatics didn’t have high flutin cartel tech
oh yeah those mexicans cartels, always on the cutting edge
Dumb Black person they have drones
I mean, yeah. They have the money so why wouldn't they invest in security and insurance?
Think the implication is the cartels have got CIA links or at least links with wealthy like-minded Americans like those who co-formed MAS in 1981. In the book the Mexicans refer to Pablo Acosta Villarreal of the Juárez Cartel, who helped Medellin get coke and heroin through Mexico into the USA (before the Guadalajara Cartel took over distribution in the early 1980s). The book is set near the beginning of the Contra War although during the Carter years, and the Iran-Contra paper trail only goes to 1981. Medellin did make significant contributions to the Contras of the year, part of a program to maintain their trafficking routes and regional hegemonies through conflict zones in Central America. In '81-82, a few years after the book is set, Texaco contributed to the forming of Muerte a Secuestradores/MAS (in alliance with Medellín, the Colombian military, industrialists, etc) which was basically a private army for the drug cartels and US corporations used to protect economic interests both in Colombia and the Central American corridor. The deeper ties between US intelligence and the cartels had not yet developed, and a lot of this would crumble in the 1990s as Cali and Medellin imploded and the Mexican cartels would gain prominence (eventually precipitating the current drug war in Mexico), however the ties had started to form, first with American companies and industrialists, and then with American intelligence. It could be that intelligence came first, at the tail end of the 1970s as part of wider US covert involvement in the Colombian civil war and in wider ideological conflicts in Latin America, but there's not a huge amount of direct evidence for that.
Basically, already by 1980 links were growing between Colombian and Mexican cartels, American industrialists and the CIA, even if they had not yet matured into what they would be by the end of the decade. I think it's very possible a lucrative cartel like Juárez could have had a relatively simple two-device radio transponder by 1980, especially for that amount of money, and especially if there were larger parties in play. I always go the impression Stephen Root, Carson Wells and Chigurh worked for a higher entity than the cartel, perhaps some kind of proto-MAS benefitting from American finance, which is why Chigurh is sent in to clean everything up, and then returns to clean THEM up. Think of Carson Wells talking about the missing floor number in the office building (which I think was filmed in Santa Fe but I imagine is supposed to be Houston). It's a reference to buildings missing floor 13 to ensure luck, and the idea of trying to predict and control your fate, but also its Wells acknowledging that the illegal operation has control of an entire secret floor. It implies they're a pretty high faluting organisation.
I don't know if McCarthy intended this detail and depth, most likely not, part of the story is the leanness, the not knowing, the great vista of uncertainty that Ed Tom faces - this new country, new border, new violence. But then his uncle points out - it's always been violent in this part of the world. But the idea of the violence extending to higher levels of society, and being so deeply entwined and entrenched, forces at a scale beyond his ken, is also very compelling. I know this could spoil the point of the novella and the film - which is that the violence of this world is far beyond Ed Tom’s comprehension and he feels old and utterly dispossessed attempting to contend with it. And trying to explain it detracts from that. I just like the idea of Ed Tom not knowing he’s getting hit by little pieces of falling debris from distant Latin American narcoterrorism and CIA covert action in foreign civil wars. When he compares the drugrunners to the small-time cattle rustlers his grandad dealt with.
If any of this was explained in the book or film it would ruin it. But the negative space around the story is still fun to explore.
great painting. I need to visit West Texas
Believable, small-town people getting intertwined in massive conspiracies and forces, manmade or otherwise, is the highest level of kino.
Desperately need more fiction/non-fiction like this. All I can think of is No Country and True Detective
Ladies (male) and gentlemen I present to you: autism!
frick off
No it's just someone who is interested in a subject educating others you absolute fricking cretin
tl;dr
no child left behind really did fail huh
He got tracked once and laid in bed thinking about how they could have found him before he says "there's just no way." By then Chigur is already on him. Not to mention in 1980 such tech wasn't plausible, at least in the sense someone would think. When you think tracking you're thinking a blip on a radar, not a beep that goes off when close. It was extremely unlikely.
He literally checks the satchel after the first time he's discovered, it's just that by then it's too late because Chigurh is already at the hotel. There are lots of explanations for why they could have discovered his location so quickly besides a literal tracking device -- he was actually quite clever to start investigating the satchel as a possibility. Like anon said here it was also 1980 and technology like that wouldn't even occur to most people.
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identification_friend_or_foe
You all now remember that when he's laid up in the hospital, Carson tells him 'it's called a transponder', to which he replies 'I know what it's called'
It's still reasonable for Llewelyn to have made this mistake, though. Most people, confronted with such a novel situation and without the luxury of gaming it out beforehand like us, wouldn't think clearly and make the smartest moves (see that other under-watched Coen bros film, Blood Simple).
>wouldn't think clearly and make the smartest moves
He has no idea that there's even the possibility of a tracker for the case. Once the possibility arises, he immediate investigates and finds it.
Checked, but you're wrong for thinking he was in error.
No. He does not initially *consider* the possibility, but that's not the same thing as not knowing that such a thing was possible. Since he knows what a transponder is (more specifically, he knows it by name rather than only knowing it was used to track him), it was essentially a failure of imagination; a lack of sufficient merited paranoia.
A failure to accept the full measure of the consequences of his actions: once the gangsters have his truck, any semblance of normality in his life is over permanently, but he doesn't want to face that, so thinks he can ride it out for a while while his wife cools her jets at her mother's.
I mean, he fricks up multiple times right. He goes back to give the guy water for Christ's sake. He's not a perfect operator, he can be careless, and he probably has some stewing PTSD or survivor's guilt after Nam and maybe a bit of a death wish as well. He's smart, and canny, and manages to outwit Chigurh for a while, but he's not perfect. It wouldn't be half as entertaining if he was a perfect operator. Chigurh is more so, but he also can't predict random chance and control his fate - car crash at the end.
Compare the scenes of them patching themselves up after their gunfight - Moss goes to Mexico, buys some kid's beer off him and passes out from blood loss, after being taken to a hospital and being out for over 24 hours. Chigurh steals medical supplies from a pharmacy and then near-expertly patches himself up. They're working on different levels, and if the Mexicans hadn't appeared, chances are Chigurh would have caught him eventually. He was on his way to El Paso after all. The theme then, however, is random happenstance. Moss was running from Chigurh, he didn't expect the Mexicans to just show up out of the blue, guns blazing. And Chigurh was following his own code, his own rules, but they never allowed for the possibility that he could be knocked down in the street by a random motorist. 'If the rule you followed brought you to this, of what use was the rule?'
>Carson tells him 'it's called a transponder', to which he replies 'I know what it's called'
the number of times I have trained some twat and they have claimed to already know something they clearly just learned now from me is astounding. It's an ego thing, especially if they feel overwhelmed and losing control.
>phoneposter
Why keep the cash in the exact same distinct hard to carry around briefcase you found it in? Especially as a cowpoke looking mother fricker, lugging around a black briefcase everywhere is going to make people notice you. I would've emptied out that case and hucked into the river as soon as I reached my truck.
it's even more stupid when you realize that back in 1980, you could just walk up to the airline desk and buy a plane ticket for the next flight out, in cash, no questions asked. they probably had some early baggage scanner, just divide up the money into 3-5 luggage.
i don't know why this movie is seen as good, when the protag is such a dumbass. him fricking up the entire time is what "allows there to be a story at all".
You were all filtered.
Chigur is a metaphor for how bad things can happen to anyone, including good people. It’s literally the entire point of the movie. Arguing about a tracker is nonsensical and absolutely moronic
>ermmm plotholes don't matter, only le heckin metaphors do
a convincing narrative is the meat of any film. without one, the movie is no fun. you sound like the kind of homosexual who listens to theme analyses of movies you've never watched
You aint convincing no one that you aint a Black person son
you hispanics are so incomprehensibly moronic
>uhh, y'alls is homieS!
have a nice day drooling sandBlack person
You don’t even know the difference between a Hispanic and an arab hombre
>shitskin mexicans don't live in a desert
>slurs have precisely one meaning
it boggles the mind
We wuz kangs!
bix nood summerhomosexual
Good morning sirs.
>it was the friends we made along the way.
>Not to mention in 1980 such tech wasn't plausible
oh yeah, transponders had only been around for 40 years and 80 years since transceivers. what 3rd world country are you from that you're this ignorant?
I was born in a trailer park outside Arlen, TX in 1974. Back then, every boy got a tracking device for his tenth birthday and was expected to keep it until adulthood. Tracking devices were very well-known, trust me.
Yeah tracking devices, well known to Texan trailer trash and certainly to Mexican drug runners in 1980
Dumbass zoomers. Trackers have been a thing in movies for a loooooong time. 80s adults were very aware of them
Spy movies used that shit all the time. It was like hi-tech shit then, people knew it existed.
this isnt a movie (from the characters perspective). he also isnt the movie snob type
why are zoomers moronic and unable to understand that technology that is common knowledge in our current era wasnt common knowledge in the era in which the film takes place? its not like he was some special forces SOG guy in vietnam, and the average soldier wasnt going to be that familiar with stuff like tracking devices
Trackers weren't as wide spread a phenomenon as they are now with everyone having a gps on their phone so I'm surprised he even checked for one at all.
Why didn't he and Jean go hide in an outhouse or something? Like, buy a sleeping bag for two and dig a hole in the ground, dumbasses.
He was a foot soldier not head of the CIA
What's his face Woody Harrelson's character was MACVSOG/LRRP, which is spook + intense combat behind enemy lines, and Chiggy still got him. Lew did good all things considered.
What's with all the NCFOM threads lately? Did one guy just watch it and can't stop talking about it?
many such cases
I get NCFOM essays (made some time ago) recommended to me on youtube lately, might be part of it.
Why did he insist on staying in town and fighting? He had $2,000,000 which was a shit ton of money in 1980. He could have just taken his wife and left the country untraceable.
they were already on him. after they knew who he was all they'd ever have to do is ask because in the 1980s people just gave out all your personal information to whoever asked. why do you think phone scams got so popular?
>hello yes I'm looking for Lewellyn Moss? what's his home address and what time does he get home from work?
the real answer is cigar would be comical if he was taking planes to chase llewelyn across countries. It's like horror movies that don't work because of cellphones. You have to imagine there are no planes in no country land.
how many plane tickets is Llewellyn gonna have to buy when his own mother in law won't shut the frick up about where he or his wife are?
don' tell her? b***h might not even know anything exists outside of texas. Literally just move to italy or something. Cigurh will autism out when asked for a passport at the airport and get himself killed.
you really think a professional killer would have trouble getting through an airport in the 1980s?
I have a cousin who with her husband were well known as grifters. When my normally intelligent and sensible wife was going to attend a family reunion with me I specifically warned her not to tell them any information about her family who had just moved near their town. Later on I overhear her telling them about the store the family will be opening and when I pulled her aside to ask why she was doing the thing I specifically warned her about the response was "they seem nice". Some people just haven't been burned enough yet to be careful with what they say.
And some people are just women anon
AND I GOT THE CANCER
You don't hardly see a Mexican in a suit
>Anton buying plane tickets and flying to different countries chasing lewellyn
His mother-in-law would not shut the frick up.
or he could've just not taken what didn't belong to him
No kidding. Personally, I would've skimmed a few bills off the top and moonwalked out of there. 10% for the big guy and nothing more.
This might actually work under the circumstances because they would just assume that one of the gangsters took it and that's what started the fight
They didn't have much in the way of tracking devices in the Vietnam era, especially not in Vietnam by the Vietnamese
>Vietnam vet
so what? literal morons went to vietnam
>tactical expert
when is this implied?
>was supposedly a hardcore Vietnam vet and tactical expert.
>had no fricking "agua"
>fricking deep insertion MACVSOG gays would still bring water when they only carried ammo and their radio and rope to get to a helicopter
kek this is the actual foolishness, that and thinking you could carry around a cowpunch thing in your hands
>you could carry around a cowpunch thing in your hands
error, i thought this was unrealistic but apparently not
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captive_bolt_pistol
>thinking you could carry around a cowpunch thing in your hands
they used to be basically starter pistols with a special chamber with rod in them idk why they went with an air powered one in the movie. I don't remember it being specified in the book.
I assume it's because morons would mistake it for an actual pistol.
you can carry captive bolt pistols in your hands
maybe he had agua but he just didn't want to give any to that guy because he was super racist against mexicans
he makes an entire trip back to give him agua later
Unless he intended to piss in the guy's mouth, he clearly had no aqua, which is the most glaring hole in the story
Take le money from le bag.
Yeah well if the dumb ass mother fricker hadn't gone back to gove that dead mother fricker some mountain dew he would have got off scot free
i stopped the movie at that point. it was just too stupid to go back just to give some random guy, who he saw was mortally shot and was probably dead, some water.
>main character is introduced as a hunter
>even if there was no tracking device in the briefcase, he could have been followed somehow.
>he drives directly home
>while at home he doesn't even bother to dump all the money out and thumb through it, count it, strategize
He thinks he's got away scot free, and at that point he's right
ok, if he's that self-interested to take the money, which most people would be, then why return to the scene to try and give that dead guy water, it makes no sense. he was just being superstituous and stupid so the story can be told. i don't expect characters to be perfect and make all the right decisions, but that choice right there to go back and to not dump the money out and count it made it lose all realism.
I think him being tracked was extremely unlikely. All he had to do was take the case and drive 300 miles in literally any direction to be scot-free. Like it wasn't even a "tracker", it was some shitty uranium and Chigur had an geiger counter
Take your wife
Take your kids
Drive
The Mexicans found him even after he lost the tracker.
Why would a vietnam vet know anything about trackers and espionage equipment in general?
a skeleton goes into a bar
orders a beer
and a mop
Why didn't he just take out the money and place it in a bag instead
It's already in a bag, why would you take it out of a bag to put it in a bag
I mean a trustworthy bag
It's a suave looking black briefcase with a lock, of course its trustworthy
Ain't got no bag.
a simple vietnam vet would know nothing about electronic espionage
BUT a black ops CIA Black person from 60-70s would, US gov already had tech like this
ITT: people who know what happens judge the characters actions with the benefit of hindsight
>Agua por favor
Reminder this set off the events of the entire film
That's the point
>WHY DOESN'T THIS CHARACTER IN AN UNUSUAL AND STRESSFUL SITUATION ACT IN A WAY THAT'S 100% LOGICAL AAAAAAAAAAAA I'M GOING INSANE
Realistically speaking fellas, let's say you find a bag of money, like $2mil, are you taking it? And if you're taking it, what's your next move?
I'll be honest, this movie scared me straight when it comes to taking piles of money that aren't mine. God doesn't love me, there are no miracles, why wouldn't that have grave consequences for me?
I'm checking for trackers first and foremost
It's obviously not going to be a big ass tracker like the movie. It's gonna be 2023 tech, which might be the size of a rain of rice that's sewn into the fabric of the bag and can be tracked anywhere in the world.
such a thing doesnt exist. in doubt ditch the bag and microwave the money
>microwave the money
what why, that will ruin the money
so it's warm when you eat it
I like it when the chocolate chips in the money get all melted.
God does love you, and there are miracles. He is the way.
Depends on the circumstance.
If it's like that sorpanos episode where buscemi sees gangstas throwing a bag out of a moving car because they think the cops are on them I would.
If I stumble across a dozen shot up bodies and some money I think I'd call the cops.
Maybe pocket a few thousand.
>throw a bunch of magnets in the bag with the money
>shake bag around
>any electronics have been deelectronized
>I retire
This. And in real life, they won’t try to shoot you like in the movie. They’ll kidnap you and your family in the middle of the night, drive you out to the middle of nowhere and skin you alive.
>calling the cops on the cartel
Genius.
Hide it somewhere semi-remote or abandoned where only I know where it is. Wait one to 2 months and if it's still there I take the individual bills and mainly use them for anything I can pay for in cash like gas, food, medical expenses etc. I would never put it in my personal bank account, I would just use it as cash to live as comfortably as possible for the rest of my days.
I flip a coin.
1st make sure everyone is dead so no one can attest to me taking it
2nd make sure there are no trackers by moving a bit away from the site a bit and checking every bill
3rd get rid of the original container because trackers can be imbedded in the lining of the case itself and use my shirt as a make shift bag to transport the money
4 go get dressed up and bring cash to a casino to launder
5 use leundered money to buy land
4
Stuff all of it under my foreskin so it blocks all signals from trackers. Cut bros seething rn
I report it to the police and ensure that the money is rightfully returned to the nearest bank.
Take it and run to the other side of the country. Live in a hotel somewhere for a few months to let heat die down, then buy a house in cash somewhere nice, live the rest of my days ordering groceries and playing vidya.
ordering anything to an address is probably quite a good way to get tracked or draw attention to yourself
>buy a house in cash somewhere nice
in some third world shithole then? because believe me you wouldn't be able to pay for a house in cash without raising eyebrows in the first world
aint got no tracker
My favorite is Carsen Wells. If it can be welded he can weld it. TIG or MIG.
how come anton didn't catch llewelyn after he shot the spics? moss was right the on the other side of the wall, how could he escape the motel unnoticed?
>tfw Pool lady dies
I could've saved her, her and those legs
Do you see me?
>goes hunting in a desert at noon without a water bottle
That was supposed to clue you in on the fact that he's a dumbass.
Ain't got no fricking agua.
>aims at deer
>doesn't even try to pick up the body, just walks further and finds dead gansters
yeaah, sure
>Goes to give water to already dead mexican in the middle of the night, when all the other times was paranoid as frick
surely
>story is told from old frick sheriff perspective who can't get story straight to save his life
Moss was working for the bandit guys and started shooting between gansters by sniping someone
I would've found the tracker because I'd be pulling out wads of cash to jerk off on. I wouldn't have stopped until all that money was hit with my splooge.
>why didnt this thing logically haplen why werent we shown this sequence of events
Only moronic, autistic, smelly nerds who watch MauLer discuss films like this
it's a fricking film, not a documentary
a film is an experience
you sit there and you're immersed in the world, the MESSAGE is being transmitted to you
who gives a FRICK if some little detail doesnt make pedantic sense within the physics of the "real world"? nobody even thought of the shit that you're trying to pick apart here
>hardcore Vietnam vet
What does that give you
>and tactical expert.
He was a redneck
>vietnam vet
Anon... he was an expert at smashing farmers
Vietnamese farmer bussy is quite good.
It was in the 70’s moron most people wouldn’t have known that tech existed
Low iq post
It's always weird to me that anyone still has the idea that military experience makes you a tactical genius. Did none of you have friends who joined the military? Being a moron is almost a requirement.
One thing that makes this film so excellent is the almost complete lack of music. No score, no soundtrack, no popular songs, no real incidental music, just a very loose, atmospheric soundscape made with singing bowls to create sustained tones. No melodramatic chase music, no attempt to elicit emotional responses via music. There's music in the credits:
?si=DCyKnbKacimj3G6A
But that's almost it. Except for the diegetic norteño that the Mexican band play when Moss wakes up from his blood-loss sleep. I think it's a really great choice.
>fighting in the Vietnam War involved tracking devices
Dank post, m'lad
>His name' Shigger
>Not to mention in 1980 such tech wasn't plausible
Lmao, it's a cartoon looking radio receiver. It's literally 1920s tech and every kid who watched a Looney Tunes cartoon would instantly recognize one.
moron