Is it just me, or is the Heisei era the worst Godzilla period?
This is the one series where the films genuinely feel dull and repetitive. I'm not sure what Heisei excels at besides having the most iconic suits.
The scenarios are not as varied and fun as the ones in Showa, and technically speaking it looks inferior compared to Millennium and even Showa at times.
Are you moronic? This is when society peaked. Nothing has topped it yet. Minus one doesn’t count because it is cg.
I value Godzilla overall but the peak of suitmation is the Heisei Gamera trilogy. Like objectively the technical aspects are apex, and the story of all three films are amazing in both the human and kaiju scales. Heisei Godzilla suffers from bad writing in a lot of cases, but every movie has some standout points. They do a good job of communicating Godzilla's emotions even with the limitations of the effects ('84, looking at his reflection in the skyscrapers and realizing heisn't the biggest thing around anymore; vs. KG, reuniting with the guy he saved as Godzillasaurus and then blasting him). But the films in general devolve into beam wars and sloppily choreographed fights, while the human story runs off the rails and rips off various popular Western films (Terminator, Aliens, Indiana Jones, etc.). Heisei Godzilla is worthwhile but the only truly good films out of it are '84 and vs. Destroyah. Those included though, that whole era suffers from poor execution of good ideas. Like Spacegodzilla is a great villain who deserves a better movie. The SFX crew did their best, but the writers let them down. Meanwhile the Gamera trilogy is like one cohesive vision from start to finish, with each installment getting better than the last
If you are including non Godzilla, then I still think rebirth of mothra trilogy is better than Gamera. They are kids movies, but are just solid.
Honestly haven't seen the Rebirth trilogy since I was a kid so I can't speak much to that. In my memory though, they are good films with better effects than most Heisei Godzilla, but the have kinda childish stories that almost remind me of Power Rangers (that said, this is from my memory of like 20 years ago). I like the Gamera trilogy because it abandoned the kid friendly trappings of other kaiju films, older Gamera included, and really shows the weight of what's happening. Although even Showa Gamera is pretty gnarly with the bloodworks and whatnot. Actually, similar thought: Showa Gamera, despite in general being inferior films, has better effects and significantly better miniatures and sets than the majority of Showa Godzilla
>Showa Gamera, despite in general being inferior films, has better effects
Maybe some of the effects, but the suits in the Showa Gamera movies are much more "guy in a suit" -looking than the Showa Godzilla movies.
I actually like the first 3 Showa Gamera movies more than the Heisei trilogy though.
Oh for sure, the suits are definitely lower quality. I moreso meant the wire work, the beams, and like I said before especially the miniature sets.
I do like the beam effects and the miniatures. The movies look nice.
This is increasingly becoming the general consensus, and it's right.
>Showa Gamera, despite in general being inferior films, has better effects and significantly better miniatures and sets than the majority of Showa Godzilla
Having watched them recently, this is simply not true, Showa Gamera's effects are much lower quality than what Toho was putting out.
>but the have kinda childish stories that almost remind me of Power Rangers (that said, this is from my memory of like 20 years ago
No that's pretty much what they are, right down to getting a final powerup each movie to beat the big bad after losing round 1.
Only big difference is Mothra getting the Littlefoot's Mom treatment at the start so her son Leo can take over.
Only seen the first two but I liked them, always had a soft spot for Mothra. Need to check out the third one, I know King Ghidorah is the villain.
>Need to check out the third one
Do it. Best of trilogy by far.
Best Ghidorah suit ever.
Yeah from the pics I've seen Ghidorah looks great.
ROM suffered from some really annoying kids scenes but Mothra himself(Fricking weird to say that considering every single other Mothra is a girl) was a real standout, it was cool seeing him grow up and fight tougher and tougher battles. But ultimately unlike Gamera, they're pretty much standalone movies. Gamera Trilogy has a hard continuity where if you didn't see the previous then the next movie is going to have some real hard to figure out questions as to the plot, and obviously it has an actual MC. Mothra Trilogy's closest comparison is the Fairy's and Evil Fairy.
>Heisei Godzilla is worthwhile but the only truly good films out of it are '84 and vs. Destroyah
How in the fricking hell is Biollante not good??? (or God damn phenomenal which it fricking is)
PROS
> Dr Shiragami is among the best human characters of the series.
> Miki Saegusa is also & she is introduced here, although she isn't given as much depth as Shiragami.
> Kuroki & sss9 are iconic & cool.
> Really damn good effects. Biollante's final form is stunning in it's dripping slippery looking glory.
> Great G suit especially in the face (suit is a prototype for the more sinister & muscular gvskg suit which IMO is the best suit of the series)
> Goes back to the original Gojira & Hedorah & gives us a actual message with it's warnings against genetic engineering + bio weapons.
> Biollante has one of the most in depth origins for any Godzilla foe.
> Like 1985, really solid military stuff & quality city sets. And continues the largely dead serious tone.
> Solid score.
SUBJECTIVE PRO OR CON
> IMO a solid & logical geopolitical spy subplot but I have seen some people mock it inexplicably.
> The spiritual aspect of the film IMO is subtle enough to not conflict with the otherwise grounded rest of the film.
> Miki attacking Godzilla with her psychic abilities I could see how it would seem outlandish to some people but I am fine with it.
CONS
> Biollante's stiffness & lack of arms limits the battles only slightly.
> Final battle could have been just a bit longer.
MISSED OPPORTUNITIES
> I would have left in the deleted stop motion clips, just slowed down Godzilla's movements so he didn't seem too agile compared to the suit.
Sorry to make you type all that out but I actually just forgot to include Biollante in my previous post. I agree with pretty much everything you said, it's a great film. Although it does suffer the western copycat stuff I mentioned earlier, with the action movie opening and the espionage plot. Tbh I feel dumb for leaving it out earlier, my bad dawgy. Only thing I really have against it, I have against the whole Heisei series: I hate Miki and all the psychic shit. But that's subjective, as you said.
Like I told the other anon, I was mainly referring to the mini sets and the beam stuff. Although you gotta admit mid-Showa Godzilla has some pretty rough looking suits. Like Son of Godzilla for an egregious example. Toward the end of Showa the suits are great.
>I hate Miki and all the psychic shit.
fuk u
Sorry senpai. I guess hate is an exaggeration because I kinda warmed up to her during my last full rewatch, but that's been a few years. I think what always put me off was this sort of faux meaningfulness I picked up on, like they wanted to write something with some melodrama but it rings hollow for me. I'm not trying to knock it too hard, it's just not really for me, despite loving the movies in plenty of other ways
I thought I remembered a Mothra death sequence or something. I might need to rewatch the trilogy again sometime soon
>I thought I remembered a Mothra death sequence or something.
In fairness this can literally describe almost every single one of the movies where she appears as a moth. The only time she got away from it was the time a completely different Shadow the Hedgehog moth died in her place.
>The only time she got away from it was the time a completely different Shadow the Hedgehog moth died in her place.
She lives through Ebirah, Horror of the Deep too, but her only fight is a minor scrap with Godzilla.
Yeah but in Godzilla vs. Mothra, Mothra basically accepts death because she has to take Battra's place in destroying the asteroid coming in 1999 and leaves earth forever.
She was said to survive and would be coming back eventually. Had to make Space Godzilla somehow
Ah that's right. You know actually speaking of 1999 though, I always wondered what would happen if there was some sort of way to blend the Heisei series with the events of Destroy All Monsters (set in 1999, though I'm sure you know that). Like a comic or video game or something. I guess Save the Earth kinda does that though.
>I guess Save the Earth kinda does that though.
Yeah the Pipeworks games had a universe that took bits from various movies and made it so all the monsters could exist at the same time. In Unleashed, Earth has a mecha force with Heisei Mechagodzilla, Kiryu, MOGUERA, Mecha-King Ghidorah, and Jet Jaguar.
> set in 1999
Oh the dreams they had for that era…
>Had to make Space Godzilla somehow
I unironically love that this guy came into existence and immediately headed for Earth to frick with Godzilla and his kid for seemingly no reason.
I mean really think about it, he spawns into existence via white-hole and just, knows where earth is? He knows the way back? Sure, he could've followed Moguera back post very awful looking space scene seriously rewatch it that space scene is BAD but the only reason Moguera went up there is he was already headed that way. And then he just lands on the one island godzilla lives on and is like "I see a child, and I must beat the shit out of it." And then he doesn't even kill Junior, he traps him.
Remember this guy is at most a couple months old and he has figured out the location of a planet in space and the concept of taking hostages. Did I mention it's my second favorite Heisei movie?
Spacegodzilla basically being a comically evil supergenius who wants nothing but to torment Godzilla is what makes him such a great kaiju. If only the move was good
>I thought I remembered a Mothra death sequence or something
saddest scene in all movies
>Sorry to make you type all that out
I typed it up ages ago, no problem. Sorry I sounded pissed.
>ROM suffered from some really annoying kids scenes
I think ROM2 is the only 1 with bad kids and even they are better than most Showa Gamera kids. ROM3 outright had a good youth cast.
>Sorry to make you type all that out but I actually just forgot to include Biollante in my previous post.
lmao
it's actually easily the best era overall.
homosexual
I like them all but there's something about the showa Godzila & Gameras (and the various Honda-directed kaiju films) that are so comfy I could watch those any time
>I like them all but there's something about the showa Godzila & Gameras (and the various Honda-directed kaiju films) that are so comfy
It's a very comfy genre.
The old King Kong movies are comfy too
>king kong 1933
>son of kong
>mighty joe young 1949
>king kong 1976
And picrel but that's included as a Honda movie.
I watched King Kong Lives today. I know it gets a lot of shit, but the fact they built so much of it around a romantic plot of two people in monkey suits was really endearing and even with the King Kong Dies ending, it didn't feel as brutal and cruel as the helicopter execution in '76.
I used to get that at Blockbuster all the time when I was a kid, I don't think I even knew about the 1976 Kong, pretty sure I thought it was a sequel to the original 1933. Then I saw Son of Kong on AMC monsterfest one year and I was very confused.
I haven't seen it yet but I plan to watch it eventually and see how I feel. I liked Son of Kong and 1976 a lot and those get shat on sometimes too.
>Leaves off the cinematic masterpiece of Queen Kong
You sexist
I'd put Heisei above Reiwa or Monsterverse but it was definitely weaker than Showa or Millennium/
anyone that likes Millennium is a midwit and should be murdered
Millennium has the best movies outside of Showa
>against mechagodzilla
>gmk
>2000
Dude I am a massive fan of 2000 and while its no longer my 3rd favorite as it used to be I still notably like GMK but 85 & Biollante are far better.
I like 2000 more than 85/Return of Godzilla and Goji vs Biollante but it comes down to personal taste.
I'll never get why people say this. I find 2000 more engaging than most of the Heisei movies because the human side of the film is stronger.
G2K is a snoozefest
>Is it just me, or is the Heisei era the worst Godzilla period?
No, it's the best. Millennium is the worst so far.
it's just you op, heisei is the best. there are like 80 godzilla movies, of course they feel repetitive. heisei had the best setups, best godzilla suits, best destruction and best movies
>I'm not sure what Heisei excels at besides having the most iconic suits.
It's unmatched for a consistent continuity and storyline. Sure, Early Showa especially had A storyline and continuity, but it was fairly loose and there's very little carryover once you get passed Ghidorah The Three Headed Monster. Mothra turned from larva to moth between Sea Monster but then was back to Larva pretty much forever after that, and despite being the mainline heroic one she never showed up when threats like Gigan or Megalon attacked.
Heisei on the other hand is a series in the truest sense. Every single movie directly causes and leads into the next, you see the full story of Godzilla himself from start to dazzling finish. You see him start out mindless, grow stronger, grow a heart, and eventually learn to care about his adopted son and give his life force to him. You see Junior from hatchling to becoming the next Godzilla. Previous monsters cause the next monster. Characters carry over between movies and we get to see those like Miki change.
There just isn't another Godzilla era that has this. Either from being too loose like Showa or just hitting the reset button every movie like Millenium/Reiwa. Heisei stands unique.
>Mothra turned from larva to moth between Sea Monster but then was back to Larva pretty much forever after that
Mothra only appears one other time in Showa after vs the Sea Monster, and it's in Destroy All Monsters which takes place in the distant future of the 1990s. The grown Mothra from Sea Monster, that appeared in the previous movies as a larva, probably died in the big timeskip.
It's so funny to me how people try to actually make continuity with showa movies after Astro Monster as if they actually cared about that
>see Gigan isn't in DAM because he dies in Zone Fighter!
I mean, they did. Certain things weren't explained but Vs Gigan and Megalon obviously were pretty closely tied and not just because of reusing Gigan stock footage.
They didn't care that much about continuity, but they did intend for the movies to take place in the same world and occasionally did include continuity nods. One example of a later one is the human characters in Godzilla vs Gigan already recognizing the sounds of Ghidorah because he's attacked Earth before.
Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla is THE most underrated film in the franchise
Yes I agree Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla from 1974 directed by Jun Fukuda is fantastic. However, Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla II from 1993 directed by Takao Okawara is slightly less than mid.
>godzilla vs mechagodzilla
>terror of mechagodzilla
>godzilla vs mechagodzilla 2
>godzilla against mechagodzilla
>godzilla tokyo sos
They're all good, Mechagodzilla is one of Godzilla's best opponents.
>Mechagodzilla's first appearance always has him hard defeating Godzilla before eventually being defeated later on
It's kind of funny how even the american film kept this tradition. First time MG shows up he is going to frick up Godzilla and then later Godzilla wins. Against even had the only time Godzilla ever got permanently scarred.
Only Showa movies are truly good. The mechaG designs are great in the later films but the movies themselves suck. Not totally irredeemable, they all have good parts but they dropped the ball somewhere in the films as a whole.
In GvK, Kong is the one who defeats Mechagodzilla. Which is bullshit and pretty much makes Kong the protagonist of the whole monsterverse. But Idc about the american films very much
MG2 rules.
Being a kids movie isn’t a criticism. The audience allows them to put the budget on what matters. Strong designs, good effects, good lighting. The main reason I like them is because my son will watch them with me. The other movies I have to watch alone so the entire experience feels hollow.
>The other movies I have to watch alone so the entire experience feels hollow.
What? Why wouldn't you watch Godzilla films with your son?
It had some good monster designs and ideas. And vs Destroyah is good. And some of the fights were decent.
But most of the stories of these movies were legit worse than the Showa era.
Like Godzilla vs Ghidorah is laughable how for legit awful it is.
I've never seen a movie with worse time travel frick ups. Someone who worked on that script was packing hella chromosomes
>But most of the stories of these movies were legit worse than the Showa era.
>Like Godzilla vs Ghidorah is laughable how for legit awful it is.
You saying this just makes me think you don't recall the movie where a woman survives an exploding plane at cruising altitude because, and this is a direct quote, she must've 'Fallen between dimensions'.
This woman? Princess of a Foreign kingdom who's father had just been killed by a standard hitman and was now ruled by a guy in a white getup who sends the hitman off to find said princess, who they can only identify by the royal necklace. They apparently do not know what she looks like. But that's okay because the woman at the time believes she is a martian due to alien brain waves being cast down that she picks up and now believes herself a prophet and seemingly seems to be just that when she accurately guesses monsters waking up/arriving. Eventually a psychiatrist figures out that she's a human so the hitman suggests shock therapy to this doctor and sabotages it to a lethal amount, only to have the power lines destroyed at the last second and then when he just tries to kill her she spontaneously gets her memory back and doesn't remember any of it except being saved.
This was a Godzilla movie. Guess which one!
>believes she is a martian
venusian in the japanese version thoughever
Well Japanese version also clarifies that she actually is part Venusian because they came down and "Assimilated with humans", somehow, and lost all but their power of prophecy in what has to be an extra irony of it all.
And both of these were discovered because she was hypnotized.
>You know I wasn't sure but now that you're influencing me I'm fairly certain I have the mind of an actual person from another planet via genetics or brainwaves or whatever explanation they intended for the word assimilation. Thank you, doctor, for your hypnosis that lets me figure this out.
By the way the Martian thing was just to tie it into the Monster Zero movie which was coming next. Ironically US made a closer continuity that way.
Holy shit you somehow completely missed that was princess was actually possessed by a Venusian. You are so fricking moronic and should feel bad for posting here. No wonder you're praising Heisei.
>Holy shit you somehow completely missed that was princess was actually possessed by a Venusian.
Incorrect, American has her receive Martian brainwaves, Japenese has her be an actual literal descendant of those from venus who through interbreeding lost all of their powers except seeing the future.
Heisei still is great regardless and so is Monster Avengers.
Stupid autistic motherfricker,
> American
NO ONE CARES
>Japenese has her be an actual literal descendant of those from venus
Yes, which is what let a Venusian possess her, stupid.
>This was a Godzilla movie. Guess which one!
It's easy to guess when it's one of the best movies in the series, that's Ghidorah.
>Minus One <<<< Shin.
Minus One failed to capture the spirit and charm of the original and actively invited unfavorable comparisons by shoehorning in visual callbacks.
The explosions were cool.
why does everyone keep comparing these two films
Two modern stabs at rebooting Godzilla by aping the original. I just think Shin does better at adapting the government/ military/ citizenry rallying to research and stop Godzilla.
I've been slowly making my way through the series. Just saw pic rel and it was a lot of fun! The surf rock caught me completely off guard.
Not really looking forward to Son of Godzilla, but who knows, it might have some entertainment value.
Son of Godzilla is good and similar to Ebirah. It's All Monsters Attack that you should be nervous about.
one of you have these osts right??
https://www.tohokingdom.com/cd/rebirth_of_mothra_comp_pony.htm
https://www.tohokingdom.com/cd/rebirth_of_mothra3_comp_toshiba.htm
I need the extra tracks!
Poor bait, Ronald. 98' sucked and you need to get over it.