He's a simply a bad character, theyve tried EVERYTHING with this guy and it sucks or is mediocre, hes not interesting outside of a ten year old power fantasy or athiest wet dream version of Christ, hes much better as a foil to Batman than he is as a standalone superhero
Theres no tension, theres no real character flaws, all of Superman's "struggles" are fake because he can do anything, so it always comes out as half-assed when he has to actually face diversity
Hes had great moments dont get me wrong, but its time to call a spade a spade and admit hes just a weak character, the weakest out of the core justice league cast and thats why hes used as a plot device or antagonists in all of their best storied
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yawn
The problem with being wholly good while being the strongest character around is that it makes it incredibly difficult for the average writer to tell a compelling story that's also exciting and crowd pleasing. You basically need the best writers at all times, but then again if you have the best writers, every character is gonna look good.
JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure did it by cutting out all the character bullshit. Westoids are just dumb.
>JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure did it by cutting out all the character bullshit.
………….what?
Jojo only used a 'wholly good' protag for the first arc.
Every other protagonist is either a dick or borderline villainous.
Making Superman less OP never works because other writers never scale everything else down with him.
So inevitably Superman ends up looking like a chump getting mogged by Batman or the Green Lantern.
Johnathan is the worst Jojo protag by far lmao. Every other one is nowhere near pure good.
But that’s not true? 90% of the time the Joestar in question isn’t the most powerful; at least not until the very end. Usually they’re up against steep odds, sometimes so bad you question how the frick they can actually kill the enemy, which is part of the fun. The exception to this is Giornio being overpowered right from the start and while I still like him you can see how that went with a lot of fans.
Just make him less OP
They tried that and it sucked. Post Crisis was cancer.
Wonder Woman never recovered
>post crisis
>less OP
>outracing multiversal missiles throughout the universe in a single heart beat
>one shotting the world forger
>being a fricking meta concept
Come on now
He’s the good guy in a bad world. A lot of struggles can come from that.
Unstoppable, immortal and pure heart. Aka no struggle which leads to nothing interesting. He is the fast food of comics. Easy and fast to eat while holding no substance.
Name me an interesting hero.
I don't know, maybe Elektra
Sci-Fi gay frick off and stop spamming your shit bait threads
See
Superman isn't shit
Nice frickup, moron
Are you going to die thinking about superman as well OP? This shit is pathetic
I only check Cinemaphile sporadically but every time I do this moron has a thread where he’s seething about Superman and some moron like
continues to respond. So yes he’s probably going to do this until he dies.
I don't know why people have this take, other than they're completely incapable of understanding his character.
He choses to do good, because he was raised by good people. Superman is the boy scout in blue, a beacon of hope and positivity in the darkest hour. He is not all dark and full of angst, that's batman's shtick.
Today's writers are all edgy woke homosexuals who can't possibly understand his mindset, so it makes sense that none of the modern movies have understood his character,
Excluding All-Star, it's actually a good movie and comic series I would highly recommend checking out at least once.
Look at the original four movies with Christopher Reeve. They nailed what Superman is about.
>He choses to do good, because he was raised by good people.
Wow, so interesting. Yawn
Doing good is significantly harder than doing evil. Evil is lazy. Superman isn't boring. You are.
This. But this is also why there's been such an uptick in the amount of anti hero movies lately. Lazy writing by people who don't have enough brainpower to write a compelling good guy character.
Its actually refreshing nowadays.
Honestly, yes. That's a aspect that I like of the character, he doesn't need trauma to help others, he is just a naturally nice person that likes to help others.
>Look at the original four movies with Christopher Reeve. They nailed what Superman is about.
They buried the IP to the ground lol
>Today's writers are all edgy woke
You can't expect millenials working from an air conditioned apartment to understand what it's like to work a farm in kansas with dirt under your nails tilling the fields.
No Superman writer has ever understood that.
> I'm not even the biggest Superman hater. I actually think that the IP can succeed with the right approach, unlike OP who just gave up with the IP.
Did you forget your own reddit comments already?
>Excluding All-Star, it's actually a good movie and comic series I would highly recommend checking out at least once.
You can't make every Superman story a character study, unless we're willing to remove him from continuity.
>Where did Spider-Man succeed where Superman failed?
Spiderman is easier to write in near any context possible.
>a beacon of hope and positivity in the darkest hour
Wouldn't this be better done by a character who isn't a flying brick, and has to actually put in effort to overcome obstacles? I feel this story would be better done by an "everyman" type of character.
>I feel this story would be better done by an "everyman" type of character.
I would say yes, but at this point I’m done with the underdog shit. I’ve seen it far too many times already to the point where I feel nothing about the trope.
I just really feel that it's better writing for the overall story to give the reader/viewer hope, rather than to try and have a character be some paragon.
I’ve been numb to entrainment for years now. I do not care anymore because it’s all the same.
SPIDER-MAN!!!
Okay but what about the power wanking, none of what you said pertains to the critism of what was originally posted.
Everybody understands his character, he’s literally the lowest common denominator for a superhero. Unlike what supergays think there’s no untapped secret sauce. He’s just boring. Why is he boring? Because he’s outdated, nearly a century old. It’s why basically every subversion of the character has been successful. Imagine being a good honest reporter in this day and age LOL and a wagie at that. With a b***h for a coworker too. No one wants that.
Cope.
?
You mindbroke the Supergays. Let them enjoy their shitty subpar hero; ot's all they have.
The masses have long moved on to anime and manga anyway. Capeshit and a lot of other western media is in the gutter.
And yet Supergays still exist! Why do they cling to shit that’s in the gutter?
Why don't you gays stick to Cinemaphile?
Smalldick go watch Naruto. Cinemaphile is pro capeshit
Mugger, Goku has a lot of Superman's traits. His origin story is literally a ripoff, and he even works as a farmer. If Superman is so outdated as you say, why is he the most ripped off character ever by far, Mofugger? The only reason why Superman is lagging so much is because DC want to milk Batman as much as possible, and that's because Batgay has become the current worlds favorite "super"hero, yet the world we are living in as of today is a nightmare for good hearted, white heterosexual guys. Batman on the other hand, is a homosexual icon. Also Goku is literally moronic. The same goes for Luffy. Stupid design.
God bless you bro.
Yeah all those Batgays are insane with their homosexual fantasies about getting abducted. They want to erradicate all good from this world, and Superman is literally a champion of Christ.
Nah, I love his comics, animated movies, and live-action shows. And Superman the movie is still charming as hell.
read kino visitor
Where did Spider-Man succeed where Superman failed? Both nice guys that just want to do good
A good movie in the 00s really.
Spider-Man had the Raimi trilogy. Superman had Returns.
>Thread counter didn't move
OP you dumb frick, have you picked up a Spidey comic lately? He's in the shitter, whereas the current Superman book is great.
>whereas the current Superman book is great.
lol
lmao
Going off my experience as a kid who loved Superman and wasn't involved in online circles, eventually his lack of cartoon shows and movies in mainstream media presence hindered my like for him at one point.
I think Batman became my favorite but that was because I kept coming across multiple shows and movies marketed for him. He was kind of in your face in terms of casual content. TDK movie with good word of mouth helped this. Marketing and getting the character right is important.
I got back into Superman years later once I picked up his comics and became aware of the animated DC movies. And now he's my favorite again.
He's right. I'm enjoying Superman's comics now.
Enjoy gay Superman stories then. Superman stopped being good after they killed off the New 52 version.
I liked New 52 Superman too. I'm not much of a gatekeeper. But I love the current Superman run. But I respect your opinion.
Thank you. Can't say I respect yours however.
That's Jon, and not the book we're talking about, you fricking casual. Sci-Fi gay, you're a joke, and your threads fricking suck
Not sci-fi gay but Superman is just inherently gay as a concept. The new book sucks just as much as Spider-Man.
Spiderman was even mostly based off of Superman's blueprint, with the same reporter job, the red and blue costume, the pseudo New York setting, the only difference is Clark lost his dad, and Peter lost his uncle. They even live with adopted parents since Peter lives with his aunt, and Clark with the Kents. There were also a number of official Superman meets Spiderman comics that popped up here and there. (Superman vs Spiderman 1976 is a fun read if you like classic campy saturday morning cartoon vibes.) Both characters hold back from using their full strength, because they know its dangerous.
The difference was that Peter was much more flawed than Clark. He was short tempered and arrogant. He’d let his emotions get the better of him and often fly off the handle. He’d also trash talk his enemies as a way of taking out his anger from his everyday issues. At the end of the day, he was still a good guy. Trying to do the right thing even with the whole world world against him and with his own character flaws. Ditko intended for Peter to grow from this hothead kid into a more Superman-like figure. You can consider Smallville as a “What if Clark Kent was like Peter Parker?”
Not being able to fly. Limits his powers a lot. But yes spiderman is the closes to superman in Marvel. Both are shit and low iq characters.
Spider-man's character adapted easily to new writing norms and expectations. Superman never got popular because he was a boyscout and ubermensch; he got popular because he went on silly, goofy avengers where he'd get mind controlled into thinking he was a dog and where Lois married a centaur and shit. Spider-man and Batman worked better when the stories shifted towards an older audience.
Golden Age Superman had more grit to him too, IMO. Not sure why that changed.
I think Spiderman just being a lot weaker in most adaptations compared to Superman made it more dramatic
a big big part of it is that anyone with a pistol can kill Spider-Man and most of his villains are straight-up stronger than him
Unless Spider-man got his legs broken no one can kill him with a pistol, he's 20 times faster than a human and got spidersense to predict when it will happen at anywhere and any moment
your missing the point, however unlikely it is because of his senses if Spider-man were to be shot it would be just as bad as if you were shot, meanwhile Superman could just sit there with his arms crossed while being mag dumped by a machine gun.
>he's 20 times faster than a human
not in any movie, show, or game that has ever been made.
Vulnerability.
Superman has an array of powers, can't be killed without ridiculous circumstances, and a stable job. Spider-Man has basic powers, can be killed by any random guy with a gun, and is always just barely scraping by financially. Superman walked so Spider-Man could run.
Superman is the best.
You just can't beat the original. Hell, the entire genera of Superhero, is named after him.
Love my moddies who allow this moron to spam his threads day in and day out. Of course the true morons are the ones who actually take the bait and respond, assuming of course OP isn’t just bumping his own thread like the seething virgin he is.
>atheist wet dream version of Christ
At least try to hide the fact that you are trolling.
He isn't wrong tbh
Superman is a plausibly deniable Christ figure for people who can't accept actual religion in their comics.
He is the one that will save everyone, that will grant them absolution, that will purify this world if only he could succeed against the forces of darkness.
Which is ironic, since the Kents and Clark are canonically christian. Methodist specifically, and is a deep believer in God and Jesus. It just sucks that more modern remakes have left this detail out because everyone in the industry today is zealously athiest.
Superman is Christ without the cruelty and hypocrisy of real world religion
Superman is a great character with lots of avenues for narrative depth. He's the original "overpowered" character with a tragic past, that shit's overdone because it works.
The problem is that he's written by talentless hacks who don't understand or care what he is besides a marketable product.
That said I feel he works the best in the Jon Kent stories because his anxieities of being a father and seeing the contrast between his own and his son's life is the easiest to write stories around. Similarly, the Smallville stuff works better because he's not yet fully in his element and has more uncertainty.
When he's a single man working as a Reporter he's basically at his most free and so there really isn't much tying him down, but that's still meaningful since it shows how much moral consistency and human society matters to him.
In that sense the only thing letting him down is that every decent story HAS been done, so nothing good you write will be original. That's fine, but of course...talentless hacks have to reinvent the wheel, so we get their garbage instead of tried and true storytelling.
>hes much better as a foil to Batman than he is as a standalone superhero
Why are Batgays like this?
>New show is good
>Haters come out from under the rocks they live in
Good to see
>New show is good
Nah people only care about it because of Luz Lane. The show is ungodly boring when you take that away.
Ignorant fools like OP make their statements while fundamentally misunderstanding what makes Superman an interesting character
He doesn't care. He's just an attention prostitute dickhead trying to get a reaction
Anon the only thing more trite and boring than Superman is COMPLAINING about Superman.
Everyone's done it, broken him down, buit him up, make parodies, made subversions, etc.
If anything Superman is fine as the poster image of "superhero". Nothing more or less.
Modern writers are either a) marvel fans or b) diversity hires
The only problem with Superman is that he, for what ever reason, attracts whiny cynical b***hes who don't understand him, but want to twist and bend him into something he isn't. And because they fail to shape him in their myopic image, they hate him for what he truly is.
>it always comes out as half-assed when he has to actually face diversity
freudian slip much anon?
All star Superman
S:tAS did a great job of making him interesting. Really the whole DCAU. The episodes where he teamed up with Doctor Light always comes to mind.
It made him a cuck
obsessed
how about we retcon clark kent's character and just copy peter parker character and struggle?
That's just Smallville
His greatest success in the entire 2000s. So I support this
Anyone here watched Superman and Lois? Easily the best tv superman since TAS.
Nobody does watch that show. That's kind of the question.
How is that Superman can get shows that are beloved by its fanbase but ignored for everyone else?
Its surprizing the amount of people who hate on superman will admit they've seen basically nothing of superman, and only watch batman or marvel stuff, yet claim to know anything about his character.
I'm not OP. I'm just surprised at how Superman seem to have like, Zero popularity outside of his fanbase.
I know people in real life who watches it. Not on TV but through streaming. I'm going to pick up myself one day because I heard that it's really good. It just got renewed for another season.
Tyler, the actor playing Clark, fricking nails it. He perfectly understands who Clark is and who Superman is. Clark is a dorky happy go lucky guy, while Superman is serious and stoic, and you can see that Superman is the disguise while Clark is his real identity, if that makes sense. Also the first three seasons are great. The first season takes a bit to get rolling, cause they actually take the time to set up characters and introduce the world, but once it does, you just want to keep watching. And its a completely stand alone superman, no DC crossover stuff at all, even though it is technically connected to the CW DC verse.
Minor spoilers, but its all very out of context.
Oh so hes pretty much a nerd with superpowers
Makes sense, still a pretty mid character thats been done better
I would show some of the fights too, but big spoilers for those, its not a monster of the episode show as much as a monster of the season show. But it strongly sticks to actual comic book style stories, but making original takes and twists on them. The special effects are great. Much better than any tv quality special effects I've seen in the last couple of decades. And the budget for the special effects must have been increased each season because they're really seamless by season 3. The fights are energetic and impactful. This is definately full strength silver age Superman. This is an experienced Superman who knows what he's doing. And the story is more about him struggling to ballance family life with being Superman, more than just Superman struggling to be Superman. At first I didn't like a lot of the side characters, but as the show went on, I actually like basically all the characters, their acting is great. The kids are a little wooden in the first season, but for a lot of them, this is their first time acting in anything, and again, as the seasons go on, they get better too.
Its actually got a really good blend of Reeve-esque campy humor, as well as good dramatic moments that keep you baited. One thing they don't do is make dumb quips every 3 seconds like a marvel movie, so its such a refreshing show after all the marvel stuff. But its also not all dark and brooding like the DCCU stuff.
It's just as quippy as Marvel shit. Snyder actually had a good grasp on what Superman should be.
>Snyder
Why do you keep bringing this guy up?
Did people already forget Zack Snyder was basically a Superman architecture from the 2010s to the 2020s?
How does it compare to Smallville? For me that was CW's best so far. I couldn't finish Flash and Arrow because of how boring it got.
I haven't actually watched any other CW DC before this show, so I can't compair, but I really like it. It dose have some moments where it slows down a little bit much for some moments, but they do that mostly in the first season, and the pacing gets much better in season 2 and 3 as the editing gets better as well.
I'll give it a chance. What originally turned me off was...how the guy looked. It's shallow I know, but after watching Smallville where the main character is very attractive (I see as a part of Superman's character) made me hesitant to watch it.
>Snyder
NTA but what?
Just watch this. Best I could describe him is its like when doctor who gets a new doctor. You don't like him at first, but then by the end, you'd kill a man to keep him in the show.
Shut up, Satan. You've been proved wrong.
Read metropolitan man. It's great.
This. Superman is best when he's deconstructed and out through the wringer. That's why Snyder struck a cord with his version.
>snyder struck a cord
Lol. He struck something. A sewage pipe, maybe.
He is literally the only guy that made Superman recover the investment to make the movie
Superman works better as a slice of life comic but everything in his life is super.
He rarely fought super villains and his best stories were "superman has to get a job in hollywood now because he has a lion head and doesn't want his friends to know" or "lois fell in love with a robot ghost from the future and is going to marry him...i have to stop it..or not, lois is a huge pain in my ass"
The Bronze age with Maggin and Bates was probably as far as you can take the character in a more "fighting supervillain" type of going storylines (marvel style) while still maintaining the appeal of Superman comics.
Post crisis there was an attempt to make Superman "less boring" which oddly made him even more boring. Gone was his "Clark Kent is an act" persona and his wienery Superman persona . They kind of just smooshed them together...now they are on the Epic Super Wholesome era of superman personality (which is nice once in awhile but gets boring)
Didn't Superman use to be a more cheeky character in his early years but then DC started using him to program the masses with antichrist programming instead?
He was more "devil may care" early on but even in silver age he still had a bit of an attitude.
Superman was always a shit character, even before the anti Christ propaganda.
>anti Christ propaganda
What
Okay, now it just sounds like you're spouting literally anything because you don't like him.
>he's blind to the propaganda
Enjoy your capeslop while the Antichrist takes over
And what are you going to do when he does? You're on Cinemaphile, so you're useless.
He was always antichrist propaganda. All superhero's are. Transhumanism garbage. These type of people currently exist right now and they're going to frick up everything on earth just like Brightburn. You idiots deserve that for liking capeshit.
Superman is a Methodist Christian who goes to church on sunday and prays at the dinner table.
The setting got too big for that.
And the urban boomers did?
Silver Age Superman line (Superman, Action, Jimmy Olsen, Lois Lane) were the most fun comics ever. Sadly, we will never again see Supes fighting Luthor under a red sun, or Jimmy turning into a giant turtle boy, or Lois becoming super-fat and hiding from Supes. Fun times, fun times.
More like stupid times. This isn't something a respectable medium does.
Why do comics need to be respectable? Comics are supposed to be comics. And many modern comics forget the key adgetive, Comic. As in funny.
Fanta graphics and underground comix show that comic books can be respectable.
Modern writers can't do these kinds of stories without winking at the reader and going "aint this just real stupid, folks"
They were too trained on Joss Whedon writing.
>Joss Whedon
rent free
It is real stupid.
That's why it should stay dead instead of trying to pander to silver age gays.
Idk man just give him an anxiety disorder over feeling like he HAS to save everyone.
Superman works better as being the fantastic charcter in otherwise mundain situations. I much prefer the campy side of superman like in the 60's cartoons, rather than the hyper seriousness of the modern cartoons and movies.
>campy
Code word for shit. He works better as the Vegeta to Batman's Goku.
>when he has to actually face diversity
You mean like rn with black Jimmy Olsen and Luz Lane?
In my view, Superman is the ideal hero. He's meant for simple straight forward stories of the hero defeating the villains, getting the girl, and representing a better tomorrow. Batman and Spider-Man are the idealistic heroes (flawed ideal heroes), ones that everyone can relate to and closest to reality of what it means to be a hero.
Batman is for masturbators. Superman is for people who can love.
watch the original cartoons.
Whatever you queer, I just wanna frick tomboy Lois
You want to frick Luz from Owl House
And Casca
I find it really unfair that none of the natural disasters, terrorist attacks or mass shootings that happened in the last 15 years never got any of our schizos, OP in particular, killed.
>I recognize certain users from reddit here
Lol
Is OP one of them?
Tell Kazuya I said hello
Black person
He’s like DBZ. Why is it always Gokutards.
Shit Kazuya is mindbroken by superman. Most of his comments is just shitting on Superman movies and wanking Batman. This is entertaining as frick.
I think he’s the cuck spammer too.
What a pathetic samegay.
I just want a good Superman game. I mentioned this once in Cinemaphile but I don't think it should be open world but instead be set in semi-linear chapters across various points in Superman's career where you switch between Clark and cape to get the full picture of a situation. Your powers would be less or more developed the further you are in the timeline, early Clark would struggle to adjust his Xray vision properly so it would be a dance of figuring out the correct distance to stand at without arousing suspicion by standing in some restricted to the press area, flight would be a bit more handholdy but a bit clunky in terms of turning and precise movement, later Superman would be able to fly as precisely as intended but would be more difficult without training wheels of the previous chapters, etc.
Add in a Sly 2 esque comic feeling to every chapter and you'd probably have a heavy hitter of a game.
Megaton Rainfall
Kazuya might be the one who made the ratings threads about MAWS.
Imagine seething this much about a superman cartoon.
no that was me I just like tracking how much money things make
This. That's the only thing that matters if a TV show sells or not.
Superman is a modern immigrant's tale more than ever today.
I didn't, you believing that every person criticizing this show is the same person is just weird.
Use your full reddit name.
Ok.
Seriously guys,why you believe that I'm the only guy making all those threads?
I know that my reddit posts are infamous but I didn't made up, it was more about gathering data from multiple sources.
From reddit, Cinemaphile, box office analysis, audience reviews, etc.
I'm not even the biggest Superman hater. I actually think that the IP can succeed with the right approach, unlike OP who just gave up with the IP.
>I'm not even the biggest Superman hater.
Who spends this much time taking about something they hate?
> Who spends this much time taking about something they hate?
Honestly, Snyder haters. They turned the threat discussing the ratings of MAWS into another Pro Snyder vs Anti Snyder discussion.
Isn't that still Kazuya?
>call a spade a spade
Cool it with casual racism
Kazuya is a powerlevel homosexual too. I knew it, another dipshit moping over getting their asses kicked in an online argument. Deathbattle really caused this much seethe did it.
I like how everyone was making fun of him over his Persona sperging.
It’s always animegays. They seethe far more over capeshit than those who actually like it.
>All Star Superman
sure is babby's first superman story around here.
just depower him so he doesn't pull shit like hauling planets or lifting suns and prop up his weirdest villains and develop the best ones to meet their full potential.
Why do people always shill baby’s first Superman story around here.
Other than batman, I never seen a superhero cause this much anger online.
...anger?
Sorry but really nobody in this thread seems angry. Frustrated and/or bitter? Sure, but nobody is actually angry.
I bet Powerman can cause more!
Looks neat but not quite what I have in mind.
>redditors dragging power level arguments here
everyone involved in this conversation should Minecraft
Kazuya the cucked b***h.
Why have been a bunch of animecucks shitting up the threads about superheroes lately?
How many “capeshit is dead”/bashing rants are they going to commit to.
they don't like anime either.
Yeah, those guys are coping with the fact that superhero movies are popular. Its silly as frick
>lately
It's been like the past year or two
East vs west threads are like 15% of this board's traffic.
Do those type of threads pop up on Cinemaphile because I don’t give a shit about anime.
Last I've been on Cinemaphile jannies there at least did their job. Frankly it's been years since I've last been on Cinemaphile.
They've been popping up more recently and some of them even stay up till bump limit.
Usually it's just that one guy with really broken english posting about webcomics. Every single thread you can expect the same responses and reaction images
See
Anime won. The only way lost. It's over, take the L.
>said increasingly nervous transgender for the 10th time today
see
Tranime lost. You are begging and pleading on the board of your conqueror. It's over, take the L.
Because you can't prove them wrong
This! Until you prove us wrong, we're going to keep at it until you submit.
Consider this payback.
Shut up chang
I'm busy right now, good luck guys.
Godspeed. Don’t let Supergays get you down.
Syndergays…
Supergays…
It was bait. I wanted to test something and you proved it right.
Invincible himself might be a good parallel to Superman tbh (I always describe Invincible as "What if Zod in disguise was raising Clark Kent?") but like, a lot of the success of Invincible lies in that Invincible suffers multiple failures and defeats, something that as we see with MOS, Superman fanbase can't accept.
Gokucks... we are less popular than an outdated, bad character by our own definition...
>Superman is boring.
>You just hate snyder.
>Anime is better.
>Cuck, cope, seethe, etc.
Why even bother when they don't have an actual argument and just deflect with random unrelated bullshit?
Because Supergays are not worth the effort
you're just mad superman is better than goku
Goku is everything supergays want Superman to be
What, boring?
He actually struggles unlike Superman.
I can tell you've never seen a single Superman cartoon, tv show, comic, novel, or movie.
What struggle does Goku have? His throat getting sore after screaming for 30 minutes straight?
He actually loses his fights, like in the Budokai Tenkaichi
So you admit you've never seen anything Superman related, and have no interest in ever sing anything Superman related.
So why are you here?
He’s trying to make Goku seem like a good character. Goku gets shit on alot by DBgays. They call him boring, a fricking idiot, bland as shit, some think he’s ruining Super etc. Don’t let him fool you. He’s making the assumption that no one here watch or read the manga and interacted with the fans. It’s a clusterfrick of disassociation and people b***hing nonstop.
Stop doing the same thread over and over homosexual
Goku receives the same exact “he’s boring” or “he’s just a moron” criticism among DB fans.
>Spider-Man is better because he's more vulnerable!
>Acting like people don't constantly say that if Peter didn't hold back he'd beat all of his villains at the same time with both hands and a leg tied behind his back
spider-man and superman are the best ones.
Which comicbooks have your read from them?
Superman vs spiderman, 1976