Usually, whenever an initially polarizing character is lucky enough to stick around for over a decade, no matter how polarizing they were at the time of their debut, their detractors inevitably get tiered and move on, pretty much accepting them as part of the norm whether they like it or not (see Damian Wayne).
Miles Morales debuted all the way back in 2011, and has lasted far longer than Peter's other partners/potential successors, and enjoyed numerous appearances outside comics - cartoons, toys, games, and of course the Spider-Verse films.
And despite all this, the outcry against him seems just as prevalent as it was around the time he debuted, to the point where Hollywood filmmakers are meta textually calling out his haters.
He's not even actually replacing Peter as his detractors claim; other works - especially the Insomniac games - have shown that they can co-exist and SHARE the Spider-Mantle. And let's say he were to fully replace Peter as the one and only Spider-Man, but to allow Pete to finally settle down and be happy with MJ and Mayday. Would that be so bad?
And it surely can't be due to racism; it's just too simple and would prove "le shills" right about his haters.
Jon Kent
/thread
Yeah, but Jon Kent is more recent, and everyone loved him. Well, they love YOUNG Jon Kent, but my point still stands.
Miles gets, on average, 3 hate threads a day.
And this isn't a "movie just came out" numbers. That's just his regular level of everyday hate.
Comparatively, Jonathan hasn't had a substantial thread in weeks.
>Miles gets, on average, 3 hate threads a day
Maybe is because discordtards spam blackedbait in Spiderman threads and you spam threads about him?
Jon Kent doesn't have a hatedom. It's more of a disappointdom
>Jon Kent
>/thread
>Yeah, but Jon Kent is more recent, and everyone loved him. Well, they love YOUNG Jon Kent, but my point still stands.
strange miles and jon kent's problems seems to have something in common, a certain someone perhaps. Who knows what that could be.
Most Cinemaphile characters don't receive the kind of ongoing push Miles gets. It's not surprising at all. If they were still trying to put Alpha another instantly-reviled Spider-Sidekick over using the same methods I think you'd see a similar response.
Jon doesn't have a hatedom, he has a despairdom.
>Implying Superman will ever be as popular as Spider-Man to get to this point
Lol, lmao
I dunno, Supes seems to have a lot more obsessive haters, at least.
yes, but the superfans deserve the hate
You've got a problem, my guy.
Jon been gay for like what a year? 2 years? miles been around for nearly 15 years and is still hated on.
Granted he needs a good run.
People hate the writers more than the character in this case
Jon was loved prior to him being aged up. That was the worst fricking thing that happened to his character, god frick Bendis.
If Peter Parker Spiderman had a great series on slowly retiring and beginning to settle down while training Miles as his heir, then sure. It'd work perfectly, just like in movies and video game. However, comic Peter sold his marriage to Mephisto, now works for the guy that cucked him and killed Gwen Stacy, got cucked by Paul, and is probably going to sell more of himself to Mephisto at this rate. Peter is currently the worst spiderman I've ever seen, neglecting almost everything that made Spiderman great and it seems he will never retire.
That just proves my point.
Bendis is not our enemy here; Quesada is.
Bendis is a Blacklover with a cuck fetish he's the enemy of humanity
Bendis is an enemy for many, MANY reasons, but in that particular context you are correct. Ol' Joey Quesadilla is an absolute motherfricker.
For you maybe, but nobody else wants to see Spider-Man “retired” and replaced by a second-rate Bendis creation. The sales bear that out, with Peter always outselling Miles Morales in comics, film and other media. Besides, Miles has only lasted eleven years due to the fact that he’s been relentlessly pushed by certain people (the far left and their fellow travelers in the media) for years while readers have been to frightened to outright reject him for fear of being called racist. If Mikes were not black, he would have gone the way of Alpha years ago.
>If Peter Parker Spiderman had a great series on slowly retiring and beginning to settle down while training Miles as his heir,
Prowler could have worked better as a heir
Prowler is an obscure villian/anti-hero from the 60s. Before he was brought back as Aaron Davis, Miles's uncle nobody new or cared who the Prowler was. Fun fact Hobie Brown (Spider-Punk) is the original Prowler then Rick Lawson and now Aaron Davis. He was never used outside the comicbooks for 50 years. He's a C-lister like Leap-Frog, Big Wheel, Paste Pot Pete, Asbestos Man and Tarantula.
Miles can work as a character but they need to change him into his own character and him is own name like the Scarlet Spider had. The Silver-Spider Anansi, Tarantula, The Clawler, whatever it takes and for the love of god get rid of the black costume. Nothing scream black superhero made by white people like needing to associate them with the color black. Otherwise he's always gonna be "the black spider-man".
They WANT him to always be "the black spider-man", it's the only thing he has going for him. They don't want him to have his own identity because it would immediately turn it into another literally who black tertiary sidekick like The Signal.
He was used in the 90s cartoon and was also just used in the recent spider cartoon where dean venture played pete, he’s also one of the small group of black heros from the 60s who didn’t have BLACK in his name.
>recent spider cartoon where dean venture played pete
That came out after Miles became a thing.
The point i was trying to make is Miles is way more popular the the Prowler and most of the Prowler fame is directly tied to Miles. It doesn't make sense to make the Prowler inherit Peter's Spider-man mantle or to have Miles inherit the Prowler mantle because in both cases Miles is more popular then the Prowler.
Also the Prowler no powers, no super strength, sticky fingers or spider sense. That would be like BlackCat inheriting the mantle of Spider-woman cuz they're kind of the similar.
I don’t CARE about inheriting the mantle I just want pete to be with his own supporting cast. I want those stories about him and the life he leads getting interrupted by his Spider-Man bulldhit that gets in the way. Miles detracts from that in every way, he takes up to much time forcing no side cast getting any time to shine AND he invalidates peter as a hero by being a “better” version of him in game play.
Alright you keep saying that miles CAN be something better and we’re all telling you what he IS over the course of a decade. His “popularity” and his “hate” are one and the same, uncreative israelites making money off of race baiting, which is the core concept his creator pushed throughout his tenure with the character, and that ideology has been picked up by the movie
Hobie is also Hornet
Why would anyone want Miles to succeed Peter when we could have Mayday? Didn’t all of her comics sell more and longer then any of Miles?
>have shown that they can co-exist and SHARE the Spider-Mantle
That literally waters down the entire mythos and intent of why Spiderman was even created in the first place (a response to DC's teen sidekicks)
If everyone is Spiderman, then nobody is
Almost like he's the worst of them all by far and yet still the most pushed by far
Imagine if Duke was forced into every single Batman thing that was released in the last decade as another "Batman", always outperformed him, kept getting more powers and privileges, dated Bruce's exes, had Batman crippled as a character so he could look better in comparison, you'd see a similar outcry from batgays because that would be insane
>Imagine if Duke was forced into every single Batman thing that was released in the last decade as another "Batman", always outperformed him, kept getting more powers and privileges, dated Bruce's exes, had Batman crippled as a character so he could look better in comparison, you'd see a similar outcry from batgays because that would be insane
Excellently summarized.
I wouldn’t mind Duke dating Vicky Vale.
Vicky is to Batman what Cissy Ironwood is to Spider-Man, comparing Vicky to how important Gwen was to Peter both in-universe and narratively is a ridiculous false equivalence.
Hey, now. Vicky Vale is at least Debra Whitman-tier thanks to adaptations.
Did Vickie die?
DC spent over a decade doing just that to Dick Grayson with Tim Drake and Jason Todd and the mass fan outrage was non-existent. Of course a huge part of it is racism.
So non-existent that Jason was killed off by fan vote? That Tim has hatedom to this day?
How to tell if milesgay lies? He opened his mouth.
The comparasion doesn't made sense too.
Jason/Tim were robin in Batman and Dick was in the titan while both Miles/Peter are doing the same thing.
Also , I don't remember Tim beating Joker in Joker's last laugh
The 00s and '10s:
Tim Drake takes Dick Grayson's team.
Tim Drake takes Dick Grayson's friends.
Tim Drake takes Dick Grayson's bedroom.
Tim Drake is pushed as the greatest Robin ever.
<WInick Titans and Morrison DickBats gives a few years gap>
Tim Drake re-takes Dick's friends, now with Dick's entire history with them wiped out.
Jason Todd takes the rest. Same deal.
Jason Todd takes Dick's girlfriend till fan outrage makes them course correct.
They only just fixed it in Infinite Frontier. Where was the outrage?
>Tim Drake takes Dick Grayson's team.
>Tim Drake takes Dick Grayson's friend
It wasn't Grayson team, it was a mix of TT and YJ.
Is like saying that Bart takes Wally team and friends
>Tim Drake takes Dick Grayson's bedroom.
A moronic move that people hated.
>Tim Drake is pushed as the greatest Robin ever
The problem is more that Tim can't move, because Spiderman isn't a sidekick
>Tim Drake re-takes Dick's friends, now with Dick's entire history with them wiped out.
>Jason Todd takes the rest. Same deal.
>Jason Todd takes Dick's girlfriend till fan outrage makes them course correct.
All of the 10s stuff got fan outrage(you even say it in the last).
Again, what happened in the last laugh?
>So non-existent that Jason was killed off by fan vote?
People or at least one person set up a robo caller phone scam system in the 80s to vote to kill him. DC chose not throw out repeat vote from one number and that's what killed Jason. It kind of funny how much some people hated him.
Where do you think things would have gone if they had thrown them out and Jason lived?
>Where do you think things would have gone if they had thrown them out and Jason lived?
I don't know, the writers were making inroads with fans, having Dick giving his blessing. He was always more edge the Dick. He probable would have become become Red Hood but we might no have got Tim at all and maybe Damian would be more like Tim.
>just that to Dick Grayson with Tim Drake and Jason Todd and the mass fan outrage was non-existent.
You know that Bart Allen and Jason Todd were mean to became Flash and Nightwing isn't it?And the first only was 1 year flash and the second never happen because the fan outrage?
Also who became batman in battle for the cowl?
All three of those characters were robins and then seperate heros with different names and wholly different costumes you disingenuous homosexual.
All three robins have been turned into their own independent heroes, and in the eyes of the fans none of them are the direct replacements to Batman, who will never retire.
The difference with Miles is that every miles gay wants Peter to retire so miles can finally replace him. Miles is still in that stage where he never escaped Peter’s shadow and found his Nightwing/Red Hood identity. The difference is even then they were always Robin, not Batman. Miles is always Spider-Man and nothing else. He’s always framed in the context of replacing Peter in a way no other character is.
>The difference with Miles is that every miles gay wants Peter to retire so miles can finally replace him
Now you are just inventing shit. Peter should have mature stories that shown how much history he has as a character and hero, while Miles should have the young inexperience hero stories.
>while Miles should have the young inexperience hero stories.
Nah Peter should have those too, they're his stories after all. No one ever said "Reeves' Batman should've been about Dickbats because it deals with a young inexperienced Batman", Bruce can do both, so can Peter as evidenced by his movies and games crushing anything Miles ever did
Oh yes anon, I want to see a 30-year old Peter getting all that teen angst about the prom.
>No one ever said "Reeves' Batman should've been about Dickbats because it deals with a young inexperienced Batman
This.
Morrison's batman & Robin worked not because dick was a inexperience batman but because it was a less angsty batman with an edgy robin.
Waid and Moessner Flash worked because Wally way to solve crimes and his life wasn't like Barry.
Kamala survived because she was a fangirl and not Carol but muslim
Won't work
Your non character is shit for the very reason he exists. He has no purpose of being anything other than a what if spider-man was black storyline. As he was always intended to be. Trying to push miles in any other media is the Reason fans won't accept him.
This homosexual diminished every spider perosn he comes in contact with.
He destroyed Peter by making him sidelined as a mentor but not really type character.
He destroyed any chance of mayday taking the spider mantle as the true legacy heroine we deserve and want.
He turned spider-gwen into a cliché girlfriend archetype whose sole purpose is to be a blacked meme.
This kid is Cancer and I'm sick of pretending his only reason to exist is not correlated to his skin colour.
Thank you anon, very strong points. Every character is hurt by Miles
Miles is forced into a protagonist role:
Peter suffers, spider gwen exists only as his girlfriend, mayday is screwed over
Miles exists as a side character:
Peter weakened as a protagonist, mayday screwed over
The whole cope of THEY CAN BOTH EXIST actively harms Peter, Mayday, and every single person in the supporting cast and the longevity. There’s no long term idea of Miles. Peter and Mayday have a long term. What happens to miles when he gets older? He’s not envisioned as someone who goes beyond his high school years especially cause his homosexual fans insist on him staying young forever. And then, why not just have mayday?
>He turned spider-gwen into a cliché girlfriend archetype whose sole purpose is to be a blacked meme
this hurts more, and even women who had new character should feel bad
but it shows how many women are dumb and easly get brainwashed just like the girls butching up her breasts cuz toxic feminism and lgbt transgender agenda
>women are dumb
No shit?
Meanwhile…..
100% more likable than miles
i hope he is asian or ginger
Where's his movie. Where's his game. His push every Single cartoon adaption since ultimate. Etc
And why....WHY DO YOU ASSUME ANYONE CARES FOR A JOKE CHARACTER THAT FADED INTO IRRELEVANCEY JUST AS QUICK AS IT DEBUTED.
you goddamn vermin are the most toxic shit I've ever seen.
Next you'll post Ben and Tell me we were okay with him too?. Or that clone saga is well received?.
I'll tell you Ben sucks.
Kaine is infinitely better. I also liked him and glad he became new Scarlet Spider.
He's definitely in my top 3 with Miles.
Aside from the fact my question is rhetorical now You're telling me that you think Ben sucks and you like miles...hmm interesting
>first major appearance is in one of the worst Spider-Man storylines of all time
>take the Spider-Man name
>get your own suit so that people won't confuse you with Peter
>have no iconic storylines outside of the one the you first appeared in
>have no rogue gallery, so you have to steal from Peter's
>have no cool side characters
>be Ben Reilly
Very interesting.
>>just be blond Peter
>> boring as frick. No swagger
>> Kaine comes unto the scene.
>>mogs Ben in every way. Better clone with better power.
Imagine if there was ever a Miles and Kaine team up. The villains would get their asses beat down good.
homie what the frick are you talking about.
Do you have ADHD Or something?.
I though I'll never seen something worse than a milesgay, but you're probably the worse "fan" of Spider-Man in the entire world
Worse Spider-fans
>> OMD lovers
>> Wants Aunt May to live forever and Peter to be eternally in his 20s and living with her
>>Mary Jane/Peter haters
I can’t imagine a crossover between Miles and Ben/Kaine. If I saw them together I think the universe would just realize how irrelevant miles is when next to them and he would be erased from existence
>I think the universe would just realize how irrelevant miles is when next to them and he would be erased from existence
then why does ben keep coming back?
He’s a roach
Then Peter's not the only one Miles will out last . . .
major appearance is in one of the worst Spider-Man storylines of all time
70s Clone Saga was good though
>>take the Spider-Man name
A bad move that happened after he'd already had his own name and costume
>>get your own suit so that people won't confuse you with Peter
Yeah and it's a fantastic suit
>>have no iconic storylines outside of the one the you first appeared in
If we're talking iconic then it's Lost Years and Redemption, two amazing stories, not to mention the other good stories he was in
>>have no rogue gallery, so you have to steal from Peter's
Actually a complaint about Ben's time as Spider-Man was that they didn't really use much of Peter's enemies, instead relying on the new ones like the lady Doc Ock and Armada
>>have no cool side characters
His cast of characters at the Daily Grind were pretty good
Ben's pretty cool
Ben and clone saga were well received, that’s why it got extended and why people came to hate it
Then the same logic should apply to Miles then, shouldn't it?
yeah if they killed him off and then revived him as minor character 20 years later
Well no because Clone Saga actually increased sales while Miles tanked them
it only got hate retrospectively by doing the exact same thing homosexuals at marvel are doing with the spiderverse bullshit if they keep beating the dead horse maybe spiderverse bullshit will get the same treatment as the clone saga
Why are you contrarian gays like this?. Like do you enjoy being "acktukally l" tier trolls?.
Ben was the prototype and blueprint for all the shit memeverse along with the spider saga.
I'm sorry what's a protagonist?.
Having a nuanced take on something isn't contrarian, and I'm not saying that Ben should've taken over as Spider-Man even if I like his costume. I'm just correcting you about Ben because you clearly don't know what you're talking about
>Ben was the prototype and blueprint for all the shit memeverse along with the spider saga
I'm gonna peer through the ESL of this sentence and assume you mean he's the progenitor of Spider-Verse shit and remind you that Jessica, Julia, and Miguel all predate Ben, unless you're gonna argue that the 70s Clone Saga is to blame for all of this which I'd like to see you justify
Jessica Drew was the first spider-man derivative character is all her fault
Her Ultimate counterpart is a literal clone of Peter.
Perhaps Bendis is smarter than you dorks want to give him credit for.
bendis is a literal moron i'm sure he didn't thought much of it
>Having a nuanced take on something isn't contrarian
Your take is subjective contrarian gebbrish. You might as well be a revisionist.
>I'm just correcting you about Ben because you clearly don't know what you're talking about
Correcting? So pushing blondie as spider-man never happened?. The clone Saga getting shat on for years never happened?. Nothing he appeared in is iconic. His stories are mediocre and never pushed through sales. Unlike say mayday. And villains? Oh wow lady doc ock. How original. Daily grind was a shitty generic daily bugle with characters that mirrored Peter's cast.
Ben's a blonde miles.
Buddy. I wrote
I see contrarian co is in the house. So I'll Just leave you guys to it.
>Your take is subjective contrarian gebbrish
I think the word you're looking for is "gibberish" ESLfriend.
>You might as well be a revisionist.
Ben being popular which caused the Clone Saga to be extended isn't revisionist, it's fact. That is just what happened, I don't know what to tell you.
>So pushing blondie as spider-man never happened?
No that happened, and I never said it didn't.
>The clone Saga getting shat on for years never happened?
Again that happened, but isn't relevant to what you said at all regarding his character
>Nothing he appeared in is iconic
Whether you like it or not Clone Saga is iconic, for good and for bad. There's a reason why it's been adapted twice.
>His stories are mediocre and never pushed through sales
Clone Saga is literally the highest Spider-Man ever sold. Ever.
>And villains? Oh wow lady doc ock
Well yeah but that wasn't the point. You said he just took Peter's villains which was untrue, he barely used them. Hell if we're being fair Kaine is a Ben villain originally.
>Daily grind was a shitty generic daily bugle with characters that mirrored Peter's cast
Come on you couldn't even google it? Do you actually think Daily Grind is a newspaper? At least pretend to know what you're talking about
>Ben being popular which caused the Clone Saga to be extended isn't revisionist, it's fact. That is just what happened, I don't know what to tell you
And miles getting pushed is due to his sheer popularity. Nothing to do with ulterior motives. Tale old as time any publicity is good publicity.
>Again that happened, but isn't relevant to what you said at all regarding his character
it's relevant in the same manner the death of Peter is relevant to miles and his package of origin story.
>Whether you like it or not Clone Saga is iconic, for good and for bad. There's a reason why it's been adapted twice
Adapted twice and was hated by the very same poeple who wrote it.
>Well yeah but that wasn't the point. You said he just took Peter's villains which was untrue, he BARELY used them
And I never said he didn't have his some original villains. Yet some of his own gallery is literarily Pete's villains.
>Come on you couldn't even google it? Do you actually think Daily Grind is a newspaper? At least pretend to know what you're talking about
Wtf you on about?. Do I have to spell out everything about the setting and its characters to make a clear comparison?. You do understand that highlighting the tropes here and the characters similarities here not calling them an exact duplicate.
Ben's at least had the courtesy to frick off and become his own shitty thing. I'll give him that much.
Chad?. He got sidelined by the third attempt at cloning Peter. Get real.
I didn't watch the memeverse but I don't think he even had a line. Or even a cameo.
This is idiotic I didn't come here to argue about a has been. Whatever. You Ben fanboys can pretend he's successful or whatever. but by the end of the day your character will never be of any relevancy to normies. And it pains me to say it but even miles is more critically acclaimed.
>I didn't watch the memeverse but I don't think he even had a line. Or even a cameo.
>I didn't watch the movie but I do have a factually incorrect opinion on something that could be easily googled if I took 10 seconds
Well. Did he?.
https://lmgtfy.app/?q=is+ben+reilly+in+across+the+spider+verse
>And miles getting pushed is due to his sheer popularity
He immediately sold worse than Ultimate Peter and he's hovered around 25k ever since
>it's relevant in the same manner the death of Peter is relevant to miles and his package of origin story.
What are you talking about? The Clone Saga being shit on after the fact (and towards the end of it) has nothing to do with Ben's character. That was the point I made. What does Ultimate Peter's death have to do with anything?
>Adapted twice and was hated by the very same poeple who wrote it.
Well no, they became frustrated at all of the in house arguing about how and when it should end. The mini from the 2000s proves that they liked the story enough to try and re-tell it in a more concise way.
>Yet some of his own gallery is literarily Pete's villains
It didn't happen often. There was the Venom storyline and of course the stuff with Norman at the end but not really anything else beyond that. I guess there was also the one where he made an ass of himself with Sandman because he didn't know he was reformed.
>Do I have to spell out everything about the setting and its characters to make a clear comparison?
Yes actually you do because I don't believe that you know any characters from the Daily Grind. Who is the Jonah of the Daily Grind. Who was the Robbie? Who was the Betty?
Prove to me you know what you're talking about
Also your examples are shit. We're talking about Pete. Not women. Spider woman might as well be her own entire original character. And Migie was never a Peter replacement.
Your clone shit opened the pandora box for the dumbest take on spider-man.
can you finally admit that Miles is Peter but black? admit it
miles does not have a movie and his game is just a dlc
Spider-gwen is trans and fricks Miles btw
see
and
Jessica is white in the comics that means she is white in the movie too, oh wait
Miles fans can never answer why miles should have the young teen stories instead of mayday
Because Mayday has the "my father is a super hero and I must decide if I'll follow his steps" while Miles has the "my normal family doesn't know about my secret life as a hero and this messes up my teen years more than normal" ones
>New take on spider-man mytho
>Rehashing old mythos with new skin.
Frick.FUUUUCKKK. nogman literally has zero shit to add.
I don’t care about Miles or his gay family drama, I care about Mayday
>my normal family doesn't know about my secret life as a hero and this messes up my teen years more than normal
So like every Cartoon Network/Disney channel totallynotcapeshit released in the 00s?
>Miles has the "my normal family doesn't know about my secret life as a hero and this messes up my teen years more than normal
Nah. I like that Miles' family knows. It's different than the usual hiding the secret identity BS that gets us into stuff like One More Day
>my normal family doesn't know about my secret life as a hero and this messes up my teen years more than normal
Sooo Peter Parker but black?
And trying to live up to his hero's shadow, closer to Wally West or Kyle Ryner in the 90's than to Peter.
Milesgays want Peter dead or retired they are evil and again Miles can be Peter "young" replacement cuz apparently Miles is only 10 years younger than him so even that can not work
Have you talked to people 10 years younger than you?
Miles would be too old to replace Peter when Peter hits "retirement age" plus when you're an adult a 10 year age gap is nothing
black don't crack
we're talking about a 15 year old vs a 25 year old, that's quite the difference. Sure, it'll stop when Miles is 25 and Peter 35 but that will take some years.
How fast should comic book characters age anyway?
The thing is Right now Peter and Miles are "peers" I don't know if the morons at Marvel finally abandoned the idea of Miles replacing Peter, however I've seen very annoying people on Twitter wanting Peter to get fricked over and get replaced by Miles cuz of the spiderverse movie, suddenly not everyone can be Spider-Man for some people
> Introduce miles when Peter is in his 20s, or even his late teens
> Peter gets older and has mayday
> miles runs into the same problem where now he’s late 20s, has no appeal, but unlike Peter doesn’t have mayday to continue his legacy with
The iq of milesgays
> they make Peter older so they can retire him and replace him with miles instead of just having Peter raise mayday
And milesgays wonder why no one likes them
>character from the 60's must ignore all his past stories and not be allowed to grow up
Is like I'm reading Archie comics
Are you moronic? Did you ignore mayday? Idiot.
> waah wah you don’t want Peter to change
> that’s why I want to replace Peter completely with miles that way neither can change
Fricking moron
He will just take over the Spider-man in high-school setting, with bullies, and homework, and shit. What you say is like complaining that the Teen Titans exist when the Justice League is already out there.
Why would anyone want this when they could have Mayday?
Why would I want to see Mayday bullied?
>I did not read a single word of the comment I'm replying to
Not true you dumbass.
We Miles fans want what most of Peter fans do, for him to be allowed to grow up, marry and have kids.
For OMD to be destroyed, so Peter can stop being a man baby.
Miles should be the one having teen adventures and tropes……not a forever in his 20s deadbeat and struggling Peter.
You do realize USM and ASM coexisted together a decade before Miles and that didn't stop OMD from happening. Miles has existed for over a decade and in that period we've had one sidelined adult Peter, and one kinda experienced but not really Peter. Young Spider-Man stories sell, old Spider-Man stories sell, Miles doesn't sell young or old.
Anon nobody fricking likes Tim
Nobody likes Tim NOW.
Back in the day, especially in that era between Identity Crisis and Batman Reborn, people were writing think-pieces on how Tim was perfect and how Dick was shit and irrelevant.
But when a white Robin does it it’s fine
All Robins combined have less presence in Batman media in the last decade than Miles alone in Spider-Man media
Why would I hate Miles? He's the perfect bottom for my trans queen.
Gwen Stacy is a troony and she fricks Miles in the ass, deal with it
If she's already transitioned, then she's already chopped it off.
Sorry to burst your bubble, buckaroo.
Nta but not necessarily. Not every trans perosn goes through a second israeli doctor appointment.
Gwen has her penis and Miles loves that white wiener
>Gwen has her penis
Where? In an ice box?
I'm going to commission Miles sucking off FutaGwen penis with a troony flag backdrop. I just need to find an artist who'd do it.
>Literally who twittergay
love the pink part.
hate the undercut that was supposed to be an accident anyway.
simple as
yeah Cinemaphile hates homies lmao it's not that deep
I honestly respect the outright racism more than the elaborate greentext people try to make to justify their hate lmao
just be racist, who cares man
>yeah Cinemaphile hates homies lmao it's not that deep
Then how come Marvel'a older pre-existing black characters don't catch the same flack?
>Then how come Marvel'a older pre-existing black characters don't catch the same flack?
Black Panther did when his movie came out.
Falcon did when he temporarily took over for Steve, despite the fact that Bucky already did it.
Static...people here don't actually remember any of it.
Its almost like people who read comics arnt actually comically racist and like
>Static
>(Good) Power man
>Jon Stewart
>Mr Terrific
>Bill Foster
>Bill Foster
cmon bro. cmon.
>Jon Stewart
people were b***hing about jon stewart as recently as that last major dc event
Keep in mind that the shit around movies is astroturf. Just check out the threads where people make stupid inflamatory leads constantly with box office.
A bunch of the other shit with Black Panther was about Hudlin and Coates.
>I feel like I'm stuck in a Groundhog Day loop of saying the exact things over and over and over. I think this is my personal hell, but I guess I deserve it so here goes.
We have a bunch of turistas visiting with the reddit shutdown.
>Black Panther did when his movie came out.
>same flack
This isnt the same flack, every mcu movie that gets relased is shitted on Cinemaphile, but after the movie is done no one cares. While for miles even after his movie is over he gets hate thread
WTF are you talking about, people were salty about BP being a huge successful for months after it was released. And the racist b***hing started ages before the movie was even out.
Oh no they do. Still do.
I mean, racists exist but the actual vitriol is far far lower for them compared to Miles
>Black Panther did when his movie came
Well it's dumb to complain about that because that's how you end up with Miles in the first place
They didn't replace whites
here OP THIS THREAD/
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/UfCf2RpzhsU
Grandparent clause, anons think the world started when they were born.
>URBAN JUNGLE ACTION
You aren't black, stop typing like you're black
jar jar
>And it surely can't be due to racism;
Yes it can.
Miles' hatedom is aggressive because certain people at Marvel Comics don't like the character (because he fricks up every argument Marvel has about keeping OMD intact) but can't publicly say it so they go on here and shit on the character
Prove me wrong
>he fricks up every argument Marvel has about keeping OMD intact
And that's bad how?
see
>And that's bad how?
It's bad because they keep spamming Miles hate threads so that they can keep OMD intact
>they keep spamming Miles hate threads so that they can keep OMD intact
Yeah, I got that part. My question is why? Quesada is no longer running editorial, and surely they're aware of the backlash towards OMD, especially how Spider-Verse chooses to give it the figure.
At best a schizo headcanon, at worst actual astroturfing to convince people that Miles and OMD are not a part of the exact same tumor.
Who at Marvel hates this character, he is pushed and shilled by them constantly.
You don't even have to venture out of Spider-Man comics to see shit like Clone Saga or Hobgoblin that prove what people at Marvel do and what people at Marvel like rarely have anything to do with one another.
This. Just look at the What If Miles Morales was Thor comic
I feel like I'm stuck in a Groundhog Day loop of saying the exact things over and over and over. I think this is my personal hell, but I guess I deserve it so here goes.
Ultimate Spider-Man at its peak was a very popular comic and plenty of people are fond of Ultimate Peter even to this day. So when he dies and his replacement fails to measure up. His stories weren't good. His villains weren't good. Miles was bland as frick especially compared to his predecessor. Even the fights were significantly worse (compare Peter vs Harry/Hobgoblin vs any of the conflict-solving Venom Sting fights.) Every character who gets to know Miles exists merely to validate him (they even resurrected Ultimate Peter for that alone). And since his own villains are uninteresting, he keeps leeching off Peter because that's what he is, a leech.
The years went on, nothing changed, yet Marvel keeps pushing and pushing and pushing the guy. He's in comics, videogames, cartoons, animated movies.
Now a decade has passed and it's still the same fricking shit.
And now I'm gonna sit back and watch all these posts calling me racist because at this point this is more predictable than a sunrise.
>So when he dies and his replacement fails to measure up people are understandably frustrated
Ate that part.
>Ultimate Spider-Man at its peak was a very popular comic and plenty of people are fond of Ultimate Peter even to this day
I still miss him
>his replacement fails to measure up. His stories weren't good. His villains weren't good. Miles was bland
TRUTH
>Every character who gets to know Miles exists merely to validate him
THIS 1000x. It always feels like a 'Very special episode' where people break character to be extra nice to the new BRANDMASCOT so ppl will like them.
It makes them so much worse.
>Now a decade has passed and it's still the same fricking shit.
Exactly. It's painful and comics feel like trash now.
>Very special episode
I don't know how, but if you try to google Miles from SM 2017 most relevant pictures will be perfect illustration of this take.
I agree with like 99% of what you're saying. But it seems like Miles in the comics, at least, has begun to stand alone.
Without ultimate may, Gwen or Jonah he's had to develop his own supporting cast. And his interactions with the Champions characterise him as more social than Peter would have been at that stage of his career.
Obviously they still do cringe shit like "Peter had a clone conspiracy, so Miles needs to have a clone story" but they have seemed to have worked at making Miles someone different to Peter 2.0
In fact it's why the meta commentary of AtSV doesn't work. Fans always wanted Miles to be different and it was editorial or the writers who made him conform
>Now a decade has passed and it's still the same fricking shit.
This is a big fricking this, a decade later and Miles still is doing the "I need to prove I am spiderman" stories. If it keeps going it's all that he has a constant cycle of multiple media having Miles struggle with being spiderman. I do wonder if 10 years down the line it will be the same. Another Miles project where the plot is he proves he really is spiderman for the creator to get back at people who don't accept him. Like no other of the supporting spiders get this. Ben and Kaine got their own personas, silk has hers, even Gwen. But Miles will continue to just have the title with every story being how he deserves it as Miles constantly has to reaffirm himself forever. I honestly hope the Prowler Miles stuff becomes more of a thing for him so he can actually carve out a niche for himself.
>This is a big fricking this, a decade later and Miles still is doing the "I need to prove I am spiderman" stories.
If you only watched the movies sure
>and SHARE the Spider-Mantle
Why you people can't understand this is the problem. You can't share the name Spiderman because that will always rub people the wrong way. It will always look like you're trying to replacing the original. It would be a different situation if you were to give the character, his own identity. Look at Riri Williams. She has her detractors whether it is because of her shit stories or just plain racism, but you'll never hear people saying she's trying to replace Tony Stark, because she's not. She's Iron heart, not Iron Man. See why Miles is not welcomed when writers try to pass him as Spiderman?
>Share=replacing
And yet people don’t seem to have any problem with numerous characters in DC sharing a mantle sans Robin
How many characters using the codename Batman, from the same universe, exist in the DC?
Robins often graduate, take their own name and character
>And yet people don’t seem to have any problem with numerous characters in DC sharing a mantle sans Robin
Wow, it's almost as if we read Marvel and not DC for a reason
Who wants their shitty legacy characters and convoluted timelines and constant reboots? Why should Marvel adopt their bad habits?
Yes you can
Give Miles his own mantle and I'll stop hating him, is that simple, he's not Spider-Man
>you'll never hear people saying she's trying to replace Tony Stark
Well I mean there was a time when she blatantly did. The book was even still called Iron Man despite her being the lead and not using that name
I love Luke Cage but hate Jessica Jones, so I'm sure Bendis-created characters are my problem.
Miles' biggest problem was that he was made by a white guy as a diversity pick rather than coming from someone who actually gave a shit like Dwayne Mcduffie.
They put more effort into him in the movie and games which is fine but as long as the structure they're built on sucks it'll take a while to actually make him worth something in the comics themselves.
>et's say he were to fully replace Peter as the one and only Spider-Man, but to allow Pete to finally settle down and be happy with MJ and Mayday. Would that be so bad?
I'm Mexican, so black representation means 0 to me. I'm just tired of most western media giving important roles to blacks -- who, most of the time, are either 'cool', smart, or simply incapable of being the bad guy. That's some condescending shit, if you ask me.
Anyway, regarding Miles: he's fricking boring, looks worse than Pete and gets all the praise and victories. Peter B. Parker comparing meeting him to having a daughter is fricking infuriating.
incapable of being the bad guy
>hasn't seen AtSV yet
You know they're gonna make it so Miles was right and Miguel wasn't (who may or may not be redeemed; if he's redeemed, he's gonna recognize Miles as the best of them). It's fricking obvious.
It’s almost as if Miguel’s entire mentality goes against what Spider-Man stands for. No Spider-Man worth their salt is gonna stand by and let someone die just because someone told them that it’s “for the greater good”. Spider-Man would give it his all to save everyone that he can
Yeah it's fricked up how they they had to force all these other Spider-men to be as little like themselves as possible in order to make Miles look good.
*it's almost as if the whole "canon" shit is contrived crap to create artificial conflict because Spiderverse writers are absolute hacks
FTFY
Yeah that's all great but then you're destroying every universe. That answer is fricking moronic, even if that's gonna be the third movie's message. That's actually what bothers me the most: they make every single Spidey and imbecile just so Miles looks good and "beats them all" (that moment felt like a sort of black redemption, like in a gangster movie, for some reason).
It's almost as if they fricked over Miguel to give a message about people who don't accept Miles as Spider-Man.
>It’s almost as if Miguel’s entire mentality goes against what Spider-Man stands for.
Almost as if Miguel is portrayed as a consequentialist in most spiderman media like edge of time.
Miguel is SpOck i'm calling it now. Finger claws, no sense of humour, surrounded by hundreds of the one person he hates more then anything, slowly boiling in rage. They didn't do any set up or foreshadowing of it in the movie but it work better the Miguel being an Ass hat the whole time.
SpOck also tried replacing Peter like Miguel replaced Miguel. Who's to say SpOck didn't replace Miguel, then realize Miguel life sucked the try to replace a different Miguel.
The spot isn't black.
>Peter B. Parker comparing meeting him to having a daughter is fricking infuriating.
He only said that because his fear of having a child was ellivated once he realized he could properly mentor one (i.e miles) in the first movie. That's why he said miles was the reason why he had her, it was an extension of his character arc in the first film.
>simply incapable of being the bad guy.
Weren't the last 2 major MCU villians black?
Kang, sure. Who's the other?
Also: now think of every other piece of media. Every other big HBO/Netflix series. Any other important film from newish directors. How many of those have a black villain? In how many of those is the black guy incompetent, or the laughingstock?
>Kang, sure. Who's the other?
High Evolutionary, He was from the third GOTG movie. He was such an evil frick and was probably one of the best written MCU villains to come out post thanos, definitely better than all the other GOTG villains.
Off the top of my head the only other characters I could think of are Black Noir and A train from the Boys
I haven't watched any Netflix or HBO shows other than like Barry, Better Call Saul, and Breaking Bad.
Black Manta
Kill Monger
Tobias Whale
High Evolutionary
Electro
The Harder They Fall had Idrid Elba as the bad guy
Candyman softboot
Space Jam 2 had Don Cheadle as the bad guy
Judas and the Black Messiah
Comeback Trail has Morgan Freeman as the gangster squeezing DeNiro
Bad Boys 4 had Will Smith’s character’s son be one of the bad guy lieutenants working for his Latina mom
Rambo Last Blood has cartels be the bad guys
Fast and the Furios: Hobbs and Shaw had Idris as the superhuman villain
Us had the main killer doppelgängers be black
Creed III had Jonathan Majors as the rival bad guy
>In how many of those is the black guy incompetent, or the laughingstock?
Netflix unless it's a black centric show, there is a very high chance that they are all those things and gay
>Hey, I’m Mexican AND a racist
Do you want a medal for that, hermano?
A pretty shitty way of deflecting any sort of criticism, buddy. Having any kind of race in prominent role is all fine, but I'm not cool with blacks pretty much hoarding any meaningful role in recent times. That just looks like an apology and some ploy to get brownie points without actually trying.
You people are just as reactionary as the morons in Cinemaphile -- you see someone criticizing something you like, and instantly you call it racist. I have no idea why you're even in this site.
>but I'm not cool with blacks pretty much hoarding any meaningful role in recent times.
Opposed to when white people are hoarding them?
Which roles? The ones that have characters that have always been white? The roles created by white people? I have no problem with diverse roles when they don't seem like some ham-fisted political commentary on how I should be accepting X race in nonsensical settings.
It IS white guilt + marketing. For example, The Little Mermaid's role has more to do with generating buzz around the casting than with any sort of talent from the actress or resemblance to the character.
I'm a doctor with 3 neuro-oriented subspecialties, buddy. Me and my family are likely way more successful than your redneck ass.
>how I should be accepting X race in nonsensical settings.
So do you equally hate when white people are inserted in where they don’t belong? Or are you just a huge hypocrite?
>But marketing!
Oh so you’re also one of those idiotas who get their feelings hurt by media PR
>So do you equally hate when white people are inserted in where they don’t belong?
Of course, you idiot. The issue seems bigger with blacks because reimagined characters end up being black way more often than any other race.
Where did I say that marketing is hurting my feelings? I'm just saying it is what it is. Are you even reading?
So you know nothing about the long history of whitewashing in media, and on top of that you’re so dishonest you can’t even admit marketing upsets you when you were just b***hing about marketing. Bro, do better
Oh my God, I've been talking to an 'academic' holy shit. Whew.
Buddy, you go have a great day lol.
I’m calling you a racist because you are a stupid frick who whines about black people ”hoarding” roles, I.e. it just upsets you to see black people in prominent roles and you double down on it with classic racist rhetoric like it’s just white guilt apology to give them roles.
Your criticism is also entirely inaccurate, faulty and full of shit. Now do you want a racist medal or not?
>hermano?
that's still racist, at least have the decency to tell him to frick off back to home depot with the rest of his 9 member illegal family
>I'm Mexican, so
t. white as frick or self hating moron. And even so who gives a shit? Tired of this stupid ass "p-please accept me masa" shit mexic**ts on this site are always doing. What a fricking fricking cuck the second they get rid of blacks they're coming for you pedro, no matter how hard you suck their tiny pink wieners these gays whine about everything that doesn't directly cater to them
>NNNNNOOOOO WE'RE BEING GENOCIDED NNNNOOOO
>PLEASE BELIEVE ME IT'S FOR REAL THIS TIME NNNNOOOOO
I'm not sure if you're here from the reddit shutdown of from leftypol, but I'm going to ask you to calm the frick down. Cinemaphile should be love.
You should be able to deal with anon as anon, and the works and opinions of all anons without bizzare fantasies about their race.
Calm down Chicano, you will never be Black btw
Ahem.
>Mettle is black
>Mettle debuted just a year before Miles so you can't cry "you just hate him because his new"
>Mettle is well-liked by Cinemaphile
>his comic is well-liked by Cinemaphile
>Cinemaphile had a massive chimpout when Mettle died
Milesgay fears the Mettle/Fortress because Mettle is a perfect counter for everything they claim Miles detractors are.
Mettle has a power that means you don't have to look at a black guy or even acknowledge he's black though.
he is cleary black coded and just because he ain't singing rap,gang banging and eating fried chicken/watermelon doesn't mean he isn't black, you fricking racist.
I didn't know he was black until this thread. He's less black coded than Piccolo.
where did this piccolo meme come from considering "black coding" for toriyama is drawing a literal golliwog
That's the stupidest cope I've ever heard. You also don't see Miles skin color while he's in costume.
You see all the time in the comic though, there's no mistaking he's black, it's his whole selling point. Mettle being black incidental and unimportant, you never see it so it's easy to ignore.
Miles being black in most media outside the comics is hardly focused on either.
I feel like I'm going crazy, Spiderverse and videogame miles is probably the least obnoxious bit of black representation i've seen in recent media.
That's why he's always taking his mask off on merchandise, so everyone knows.
Cope, stop crying Milesgay your hero likes trannies
>Mettle
god I miss this homie like you wouldn't believe.
>Mettle
The only malloto israelite I will ever love.
He was too pure for this world and was ripped away from us WAY too soon.
He was literally the heart avengers academy and rivaled Peter and other characters for the best boy in Marvel.
He’s not a partner you mong, he’s a replacement. The hates lasted because he’s brought NOTHING of value to the table beyond letting Hollywood know that they don’t need to bother making anything new, they just need to take a popular name, put the “right” skin color on and retell an old story with them
Why do you think the writers of the new spiderverse felt they had to sabotage every other spider character to prop up miles? Because he has NOTHING to offer beyond ire
>didn't bother reading the bottom paragraphs
It’s the same banal argument that ALWAYS gets brought up when people point out the intent of the creator of the character. Simply because he’s ruined pete in ANOTHER medium by making him into a banal teacher who has no friends or life since the narrative has no time them because miles is there taking their place in a shitty way while hogging half of the gameplay, because god forbid I want to play as Peter
Bendis wanted miles to replace Peter, the writers of spiderverse sabotaged MULTIPLE versions of peter because they want miles to replace peter. Why should I care about a game studio waiting until the third game to do the same exact thing?
>n-not black enough
Holy fricking cope.
t. Urban white soi Redditor
Brave to call someone a redditor when your entire response to criticism of Miles Morales is to cry "urr rayciss"
>Brave to call someone a redditor when your entire response to criticism of Miles Morales is to cry "urr rayciss"
Actually the opposite. You hate criticism of Miles because you love corny dorky safe blacks.
Hey, dum-dum. I'm a detractor of Miles. In case if you hadn't realized it yet, that post was a response to this fricking homosexual
>Mettle has a power that means you don't have to look at a black guy or even acknowledge he's black though.
Just didn't want to give him a (You) because he's a wienersucking homosexual.
>Miles Morales debuted all the way back in 2011
Nobody minded him back in Ultimate. He was a token partner but it was an alt universe and we were dealing with annoying alpha.
Then they made him the main Spiderman in Ultimate, which was shit because that Peter was the soul of the ultimate universe.
Then they brought him to 616 and he FELT like what he was, a jumped up overly pushed diversity hire.
His personality was minimal and boring, his name made non sense with his powers, and the rest of comics were shit around '14.
It sucks, he sucks, and none of it has gotten better nearly 10 years out.
>Nobody minded him back in Ultimate
I did cuz I liked ultimate Spider-Man but when they killed them off and replaced with Miles I just dropped the comic, however I still had Peter in the main universe, but now Miles is there so is harder to avoid seeing him, he's like cancer
Remember when it was "well if you don't like him then just don't read his comics. He's in a whole other universe"
And then he couldn't keep sales up so 1610 was destroyed.
>well if you don't like him then just don't read his comics
Their terms were acceptable however now is way harder to avoid him, Spider-Man media that doesn't include Miles is very rare these days, that's one of the main reason I don't like him
i do, i also remember that something like a year later they replaced peter with otto
I don't think I've ever seen anyone who genuinely honestly likes this character and can sing his praises. You have reviewers that feel like they HAVE to say they like him because they're virtue signalling white cucks, and you have the blacked trolls who only talk about him in the context of pretending he's some kind of uber-stud that's gonna cuck /yourguy/ and steal your waifu.
Frankly he's just a big nothing of a character who's been forced relentlessly for over a decade just because he's "black Spider-Man" and doesn't have anything else at all going for him. Spider-Man fans already had several other, better, more liked, more developed characters who would have been better successors if anyone did want to tell a story about Peter retiring.
The people screeching WHY WON'T THIS GUY FINALLY GO AWAY? on a daily basis are right, and the people who, when given a chance to make a Spider-Man animated movie, chose to focus it on him, they're insane. In any previous time in Marvel history, characters like Miles, Kamala and Spider-Gwen would have just faded away within 5 years in the face of fan apathy, instead of being forced so much for so long.
>And it surely can't be due to racism; it's just too simple
Occam's Razor
Can it still be called racism if you're just tired of some black fricker once again taking the spotlight?
If it's because he's black then yeah.
Since we're bringing up Bat-family, you know who was cool? Orpheus. Way cooler black Bat-family member than Duke.
>no one cares about Orph-ACK
Shut the frick up.
Yo OP. I think you're genuine, and not a movie spammer or redditard just starting shit. What is the BEST comic story with miles?
If he had more ITSV's instead of bad stories, or stories about how he's a legitimate spider, or stories not forcing him down people's throats, he would not have a hatedom.
He will never be a Spider-Man. He’s just Miles Morales
Isn't he a step-dad
Miles isn't accepted because of him being the most artificial-ass part of Spider-Man lore. He's treated as this iconic part of Spider-Man lore when he is just shoved into anything Spider-Man related and has done nothing to earn that spot. Miles hasn't moved past "I/you deserve to be Spider-Man!" for years.
...And he still needs other Spider-Men to prop him up.
What does someone have to do in order to "deserve" being considered Spider-man?
Other than be white, I mean.
>Other than be white
Maybe the problem with Miles is his a passive agressive fanbase?
Anyway, read the 'what if x became spiderman' most whites got fricked up and failing trying to be him, only Bethy Brand(and Mayday in the 90s) did it.
So no, is not about being white. Because Miguel isn't white
>Maybe the problem with Miles is his a passive agressive fanbase?
Miles really doesn't have a strong fanbase of his comic stories. Consider how rare it is to see a Miles fan post a storytime, or post actually compelling story moments of him. Compare that to fans of Static, Steel, John Stewart, or the boondocks.
His sales number say otherwise. Miles' comic sells better than a lot of other Marvel properties. The latest copium is that he's getting a boost from Peter.
>Consider how rare it is to see a Miles fan post a storytime
Miles gets his issues storytimed when they ocme out, so once a month.
Meanwhile I don't think we've *ever* had a Static storytime in the history of the board. None of the characters you listed really do, and Boondocks threads are just another form of race bait shitposting.
>Miles gets his issues storytimed when they ocme out, so once a month.
I must have missed those threads. We just had a near complete Spiderman 2099 run by a shocking fanboy.
What's Miles best comic story?
When Uncle Aaron gathered up his own sinister six with Francine Frye, Mother bombshell, sandman, hobgoblin and The Spot.
Forcing young Bombshell to join their team.
Miles had to fight all of them as they proceeded to destroy his life and force him to the hospital.
I don't get why they made Aaron the Iron Spider for that.
I also don't get why the person that sold it to him said it was gonna piss someone (referring to Miles) off when Miles has nothing to do with Iron Spider, if anything it would piss off Peter and Tony and they'd be the ones to want to take him down.
It was a pretty mediocre storyline overall, probably the weakest Sinister Six outing and team we've ever had
>When Uncle Aaron gathered up his own sinister six
>His best story is a sinister six story with Ultimate Prowler(gotta shit on this black character to made Miles look strong)
KWAB
>Consider how rare it is to see a Miles fan post a storytime
Storytimes do not mean anything, you lazy motherfricker.
The last time there was any actual effort put into storytiming Miles issues when they came out was during Empire of the Spider and that was because of how bad it was
Same as any other legacy anon. Regardless of race. And have you been even keeping up? They tried making white characters be legacies to spider man, and they cratered as well.
>Same as any other legacy anon.
So actually name the things he has to do.
He was bitten by a spider and he fights crime. What else is there?
>Literally has to make up his own criteria.
has to make up his own criteria.
I asked you guys to list the criteria. You didn't. You still aren't. What does someone have to do to "deserve" being a Spider-man? How is it "earned"?
Why is it so important to have a black spiderman? Why can’t there just be a new character? Why does everything with white characters have to be stretched to meet every empty expectation without regard to story?
>Answering question with a question.
You’re asking a question about why a character shouldn’t be allowed to remain unique, and we’re asking why? It’s a legitimate response, you’re just afraid about your b***h answer
>Can't justify own stance.
Oh.
Also, I never said a thing about him being Spider-Man, I said he's forced to being iconic. Ben Reilly (and even Kaine) earn their spot in the lore by being the Scarlet Spider. Ben is seen more as the Scarlet Spider than in his time(s) as Spider-Man.
Why does he have to be Spider-Man?
It is "earned" through a proper coming of age. Through great humbling. Through self-imposed suffering and one's salvation from that suffering through the daily struggle to do the right thing. What fans don't understand about Spider-Man isn't that Peter's life is a sandbox game of fun and ball games where his identities hardly intersect.
It's a fricking unfair Game of Life where Peter's the reason his life sucks. For as much as the phrase "Peter's his own worst enemy" sucks when applied to Peter's modern direction as a man child, it suits himself as a teenager. People forget that Peter wasn't a watered down nice guy nerd with a heart of gold who got bullied mercilessly, he was originally an angry and selfish nerd who rejected offers of friendship and was arrogant. Peter's choice to not stop the burglar wasn't a single selfish choice that only existed AFTER he got powers (as modern portrayals imply) or a situational one born out of being cheated...Peter was a piece of crap BEFORE the bite and getting powers enabled his vices.
The death of Ben is thematically God punishing Peter for failing to be responsible with the power given to him by random chance. The universe told Peter to be good, just, and to get his shit together and he basically told it to frick off. Peter's greatest failure was because he knew the difference between right and wrong and he still did the wrong thing anyway because he thought he knew better. The Ditko run requires that to be a Spider-Man, you have to actually be human to wear the mask and throw yourself out into the night, and that means being both a good person and a shithead moron.
The problem with Miles and "Modern Peter" and their fans is that they don't want Peter to be a distinct character with edges and vices with an arc, they want him to be a nice guy audience surrogate who's "relatable".
This is why Modern Peter is written/rewritten to have always been a good person who the bite briefly made selfish and then never again, or justified his actions through actually being cheated. It takes away agency from Peter for the sake of making the audience feel better about themselves because it means there's no true, harsh, uncomfortable, and human lesson to actually learn but a digestible pill to easily swallow. Ultimate Peter more or less avoided this (usually), but this has affected everything since the mid to late 90s featuring Peter, and it's only gotten worse with more recent portrayals, and it ABSOLUTELY ruins Miles because of how much he was hit with this on top of being even more a self insert/surrogate for Bendis through living out a power fantasy.
Miles sucks because he's a slurry of Bendis using him as a self insert, the audience using him as a relatable hollow surrogate, and Marvel watering him down to appeal to said audience. He is, and CONTINUES to be MODERN Peter but Also Black (but not really). Spider Verse doesn't count because Miles is such a passive cornball in his own story that any attempts to make him stand out (the urban hip-hop angle, the artistic angle) fail because the film refuses to deliver into these aspects, far too occupied with multiversal shenanigans that it sucks up Miles' agency and the chance to utilize what he brings to the table (a middle class Spider-Man with a happy family and the perspective that bring v Peter coming from a working class family struggling to make ends meet).
In short, you can't FIX Miles and have him "earn" being Spider-Man because to do that would mean a total uprooting of Marvel's work culture concerning the Teen Hero appeal (this same problem applies to ALL the modern teen heroes published by them) as well as removing event culture (which ruins the ability to tell new stories period).
It would mean actually writing the characters as PEOPLE, embarrassing and flawed people. Rude and irrational people. Selfish and hurtful people. That's one of the things Marvel was founded on to distinguish itself from the competition, and everyone seems to have forgotten that.
>Also Black (but not really).
I'm curious as to how you could possibly explain what you mean by that in a way that isn't just going to be hella racist and rely on the worst stereotypes possible.
He’s a corporate friendly safe black for kids
And that one anon is right miles has the most passive aggressive fans ever who are incapable of engaging anything without relying on ERM RAYCISM
Very interesting points, though a little unnecessary because I'm sure you're talking to a guy who's arguing in bad faith
>He's an artificial, forcefully iconic part of Spider-Man lore. A Poochie.
>O-Oh, you mean you're racist!
Consider what has happened to the other Spider-people before Miles. Most of them were white, btw.
>Jess Drew had a big push up in the 70s and 80s, went forgotten and depowered until Bendis had her in New Avengers
>Ben Reilly got killed, then he revived and became the Jackal, then had a crisis, then became Chasm
>Kaine was shuffled to the background, then brought back and regenerated into a cool edgy Spider-Man, then forgotten again
>Mattie Franklin was prepped as the next big shit, she got killed by Kraven a decade ago
>Anya Corazon was hyped as hispanic Spider-Girl, then went to be part of the Spider-verse thing and we're lucky if she shows up once a year
At this point, Miles has nothing going for him beyond 'black teen Spider-Man'. He was interesting in Ultimate, because he was filling a role and trying to find his way in a super broken world where the legacy of Spider-Man hung heavy on his shoulders.
What does he have at 616? Being a kid who suddenly became an Avenger for no single reason? Telling stories Marvel cannot tell anymore because Pete is pushing 30 and they can't do high school Spider-Man with him? If they seem determined to make him work, at least they should remove him from NYC and let him do his own thing away from Peter, otherwise he feels like a Robin; when he should be his own character and grow up without interlapping with Peter Parker's enemies and stories.
>Consider what has happened to the other Spider-people before Miles. Most of them were white, btw.
I am considering that. None of them get 3 threads a day crying about their existence. Only the black one does.
>I am considering that. None of them get 3 threads a day crying about their existence. Only the black one does.
that's because none them have being pushed for a decade straight.
Anya Corazon is MIA after being pushed on and off for a few years.
Mattie Franklin got kill off unceremoniously and disappearing for a decade.
Julia Carpenter is now madam web and was only ever in team books/event books.
Ben they pushed successful for years tell they killed him off and brought back a villian.
Kaine they tried pushing a few years I like it but they gave up on it and he's an event book character now.
Jessica is the only character they try to push anywhere near as much as Miles and trust me people hate it. People accept that she is the original Spider-woman and for every Captain Marvel and Hulk there has to be a Ms Marvel and She Hulk.
You can't really compare any of those, though. Miles successfully carried his own book for basically a decade. Who else did that? Mayday?
But does that book sell, or is just like Ms. Marvel/Captain Marvel, who need to be relaunched over and over in new "volumes"? Mayday ran for over a hundred issues on her own, and even outselling Amazing at some points.
>But does that book sell, or is just like Ms. Marvel/Captain Marvel, who need to be relaunched over and over in new "volumes"? Mayday ran for over a hundred issues on her own, and even outselling Amazing at some points.
This people forget Bendis was the big writer at marvel, His Avenger run was hugely successful, he was the architect of the whole Ultimate universe. He had a lot of pull with in the company and Miles was his pet project. I'm sure he saved it from getting axe when better book with similar sale numbers didn't.
All his comics before spider verse were cancelled.
>Miles successfully carried his own book for basically a decade.
He was literally not allowed to fail, he did numbers far worse than what got Ultimate Peter cancelled, he did on par as the Ultimates that got cancelled, they kept him on anyway
Ultimate Peter didn't get cancelled, Ultimate Spider-Man was still selling well. Bendis wanted to kill Peter.
Why did Bendis want to kill Peter anyway? He still kept writing for Miles so it’s not as if he wanted a break from writing. Did he seriously just kill off a major character solely to replace him with some black kid?
Yes, there's a creepy quote of his about how he thought Donald Glover looked great in the Spider-Man pajamas in Community and that he was glad he was writing that book
Every time I read that Bendis quote I get pissed off. Miles looks nothing like Donald Glover! He doesn’t have his personality either. Donald Glover was famous as Troy at that time and Miles is nothing like that. Bendis says he made him based off of Glover but he looks or acts nothing like him.
He saw Obama being president and thought it was time to replace Spider-Man with a Black, that's his logic and he also wanted to eventually replace main Peter Parker with that same Black
>Miles successfully carried his own book for basically a decade
No he didn't
Miles' numbers were ~30k and he was roped into every fricking even possible. It kept starting at #1 over and over again.
This right here is his fifth volume, 2 in ultimate and 3 in 616. Technically it’s the titles 7th volume over all (ultimate pete had two volumes)
Because as
puts it, even if Anya was a huge push based on their modern Marvel era (which happened to also give us X-23), eventually Marvel realized there was no interest on the character and she was thrown to the sidelines.
With Miles, there's no actual point in which we can sympathize with the character, he feels like a corporate choice in every aspect.
>Peter was always a loner, and actually had to do a trial to join the Avengers, which he rejected because of a misunderstanding
>Hey, Miles! You've only been in 616 a couple months, but how about you, baby Nova and the kid from Jersey want to be in the flagship Avengers team?! Also, you're a cool Spider-Man, kid, not like the fool in the blue and red pajama!
>Peter struggles a lot with his early enemies, and has to learn how to combat Sandman, Electro, Venom, the Lizard or Carnage via trial and error
>Miles spams venom ray and oneshots Blackheart, a character who usually gives guys like Thor, Ghost Rider or Doctor Strange a run for their money
Miles has no defining "if this be my destiny!" moment, or a point where he learns this shit is serious and there's power and responsibility involved. Because even his mom's death was undone the moment he came to 616, absolutely undoing the key growth moment it was on Ultimate Marvel.
It's not as decidedly prominent as it was during Bendis' days, but Miles has this "nothing bad can actually happen" aura because Marvel is extremely afraid of pissing someone off the moment Miles gets his shit kicked in by the Green Goblin or his dad gets killed.
Be his own character and also Miles is not Spider-Man is time for him to get his own mantle and actually do his own thing
Ironheart.
It's because Miles was initially envisioned as a replacement Spider-Man - he wasn't a sidekick or a hanger-on, he was the guy who took over for Ultimate Peter.
When editorial moved him into 616, they never bothered to try and make him fit into a universe where there's already a Spider-Man. He still uses the name, he still uses the villains, he still uses the stories.
There's just nothing TO Miles to help him gain a following beyond being black Spider-Man.
>A spider-man character fights Spider-man villains
Oh the humanity!
He's not Spider-Man though, also even Kaine and Ben got their own villan arcs with new villains, Miles just get the C-list Spider-Man villains to be his villains, he's literally Walmart Peter Parker but black
Great Value Peter
Wish.com Peter
Peter at home
>H.E.A.T.
>so hated his hatebase published propaganda against him in the newspaper
Kyle is in a whole another level
Cinemaphile hate bendis miles
/pol/keks just hate miles because they got afraid black people will frick their women or something
Hint anon ALL miles are bendis miles, anyone who likes miles supports bendis
>He's not even actually replacing Peter as his detractors claim
Putting this ridiculous lie aside, what's the excuse for Miles still being a character with no defining stories, achievements and cast in all medias after 12 years of life support on steroids?
Because most characters don’t just magically get defining stories if they simply are published for certain amount of years, you fricking moron. And that doesn’t even take into account that today you spend six months telling just one story, so you only really have handful of stories to begin with compared to when you usually had 4-6 stories told in the same time when you didn’t write for a trade
They should, especially if they're getting the hardest push any character has ever received in the history of the big two by far. 12 years, several books, several reboots, several events, dimension crossing, all with rockstar treatment, two movies pampering him, with the last one being as subtle and nuanced as a Bendis story, and two games, one all for himself during the PS5's launch. Still not a single trace of identity. Why should Miles exist?
>if they're getting the hardest push any character has ever received in the history of the big two by far.
So not Miles.
I'm very interested to learn what characters have received a harder push than wet toilet paperales.
Deadpool
Go on.
Deadpool is the literal opposite of Miles, people were fricking clamoring for more Deadpool shit, the movie literally only got made because of the demand on the leaked footage. In comparison no one asked for anything Miles-related to be made, ever, he got a movie trilogy because the directors were Bendis' fellow cucks and refused a Spider-Man movie unless it could be about Miles for some inherently unknowable reason.
I mean, it's kind of the Mayday situation again. She started as a one off in a What If? People liked her. Asked for more. And what did get? A COMIC THAT COULD SUSTAIN ITSELF FOR OVER 100 ISSUES! The problem with Miles is the same issue with Gwen, the same issue with Kalama, the same issue with literally every ALL NEW ALL DIFFERENT shit show character. We've entered an era were instead of the fans deciding what's hot, the publishers decide what we like for us and will triple down until we do.
You forgot that Deadpool has a very memorable and colorful personality. Even if you hate "cuhrayzee" shit and find it obnoxious, it's hard to deny.
I may cringe at Waypool fans but I understand where they're coming from in finding Deadpool endearing.
Even Way could be counted as an outlier. A lot of people have written FANTASTIC Deadpool stories. Joe Kelly turned the character around completely. Fabian Niece Niecia... Cable and Deadpool was really good and Uncanny X-force somehow made the LOL WACKY MERC FOR MONEY the goddamn heart and soul of the team.
Yeah I may not always like it but I see where the demand is coming from, he pandered to the meta internet humor demographic years before Rick and Morty did, it may not be merit I'm a fan of but it's merit nonetheless, he justifies his existence and push well.
>>if they're getting the hardest push any character has ever received in the history of the big two by far.
>So not Miles
Delusional
Why do milesgays always argue in bad faith.
homie miles gets pushed even in kindergarten shows involving Spider-Man, get fricking real
My fricking 5 year old niece knows Miles and Gwen by name but not Peter, it’s fricking over bros
Educate your five year old niece. Give her some Peter gems.
That's because your niece knows who spider-man civilian identity is. It goes without saying.
You dumb frick.
>And that doesn’t even take into account that today you spend six months telling just one story
Decompression was a mistake. It took Pete ONE anthology story to get his origin across and it resonated so much harder.
You'd think that, wouldn't you. But here we are. A decade later and no stories worth a damn.
>And that doesn’t even take into account that today you spend six months telling just one story
It's funny that you use this in defense of Miles not realising it's a big part of why his stories are so shit
>Standard storytelling format makes just this one specific character suck
Nice circular logic
storytelling format makes just this one specific character suck
>implying that's what is being said at all
Decompression is terrible and negatively effects every character that has to put up with it, and using it as some cope as to why it's ok that Miles has no good stories after 12 years is pathetic
My thing is that I simply don't understand the point of having two Spider-Men running around. If you want a black Spider-Man, make Peter Parker black and change nothing else about him. I'm not racist so I would have zero problem with the character waking up black one day as long as the stories remained identical and didn't turn into endless lectures about how cool and brave and interesting black people are.
There’s more than one Spider-man running around
bait.
still no character.
no i will not watch your shitty kids movie even if the art style is okay.
Sony deserve three nuclear holocausts.
Literally Bendis’s tripe. He’s the token of any team. Jaime replaced Kord but he fit in naturally even though Ted had the most moronic death of the decade.
Ted died to set up a story arc and a few months later a DIFFERENT writer asked to use the name, he wasn’t killed by his writer who then wrote his replacement in next month. That and technically Ted kord himself was the second blue beetle
Marvel:
>Wants Spider-Man to be a young, single hero
>Also wants him to have a legacy hero because...reasons?
And I'm an OMD guy. And I think it's stupid.
This is the big problem with Miles:
Miles exists in a time period where they want Peter to still be the young relatable Spider-Man. This obviously doesn’t work cause they’re doing the same thing and Spider-Man when he’s young doesn’t really work with a sidekick because being a young loner hero is his thing.
But when Peter gets older, it makes no logical sense to have Miles because he can have Mayday. Even in spider verse the older Peter B was established as a loser failure estranged with MJ to make the (temporary) Miles apprenticeship work.
So miles doesn’t work no matter Peters age. If they’re both young they interfere with each others story. If Peter is old he becomes irrelevant by the time mayday is around, because miles isn’t allowed to get old either.
The entire issue with Miles is that he has no personality, no interesting stories or villains or supporting characters to call his own. He's an off brand Peter but nowhere near as smart, charismatic, or interesting so why should I or anyone want to read or watch his stories? There's nothing about him that makes him worth having around.
imagine how hard he'd have failed if he wasn't spiderman and was just a new identity from the ground up with everything else the same.
would *he be this popular?
Imagine a world where Miles was a mutant
He has an odd assortment of powers (wallcrawling, invisibility, venom touch, slight future-sight). He doesn't have to rip off Pete's origin, he's just doing his own thing.
Imagine if he didn't win the lottery to go to rich-kid school; he could showcase the lack of care some schools have for their kids skipping classes and the bad influence students can have on eachother in poorer schools (all these bad kids can be white and hispanic if you don't want to seem racist)
Imagine if he wasn't gifted Pete's tech (including webbing formula) so he has to find other ways to fight and move than webslinging
Imagine if Miles knows and acknowledges that he's not really a spider, but he really admires ult. Pete. He does his best to become a Spider-man anyway.
Would it be great and fantastic? Probably not given Marvel's writers, but it would have at least been different and possibly interesting. It would have given him some character.
Anyone have any comments on this approach?
Does Miles work better for people who dislike him if he has those differences? Does it ruin Miles for his 'fans'? If so, why?
I've always thought that at least not having Pete's tech would've been a good approach. Back when an anon was storytiming the entirety of Ultimate, which meant all of Miles, and the beginning of his comic, him coming off fresh from Ultimate Peter's death, it wasn't that bad. Him getting the webshooters from May (and Ganke making the webfluid) was awful. If they had toned down Venom Blast, which anybody would ask for, taken away the webs, and forced him to be stealthier with his invisibility, I think he would've been a lot better. Of course he wouldn't be as witty as Peter, he'd be terrified to death half the fricking time since he's barely 13 in-universe. Work that in with his invisibility powers instead of making him just Peter 2.0 but with a shitty insta-win button. That's what I started thinking, at least, so I can definitely see where you're coming from. The admiration of a K.I.A Peter Parker is a foundational part of Ultimate Miles so 616 Miles having nothing like it is such a waste.
A bad character's hatedom only lasts as long as said character is both written poorly and is also pushed.
Miles has been getting a non-stop push since his creation and he has always been written poorly (and always will be because he's an inherently bad character)
I'm a blackanon who liked Insomniac Miles and the animated version but found the comics underwhelming. My problem is Bendis writing him like a pet character.
Also, he shouldn't be called Spider-Man. Maybe Anansi or something. Like how Bart Allen was Impulse for a while.
>I'm a blackanon who liked Insomniac Miles and the animated version but found the comics underwhelming. My problem is Bendis writing him like a pet character.
giving him an electric sword, better spider powers etc. It's just shit, I'm white but I've never been against say black panther or luke cage. I detest miles because their ideas about how to make him a hero are : better than peter, better than everyone else, he's just gotta have more! Static Shock is a better fricking character, Dr. Voodoo is a better character, Bishop is a better character. I could fricking go on.
Spiderverse Miles is great. Insomniac Miles is okay. The other stuff I've seen him in has basically just been "Woo, Venom Blast" panels on Cinemaphile.
>Spiderverse Miles is great.
No
Whats wrong with Spiderverse miles?
Nothing. They just can't separate every other Miles from the original.
He's literally Peter except not interesting
What's interesting about him? He's not as awful as his comic version but that's sort of the problem in itself. The best he can be is not godawful. He's at his absolute peak generic and bland. He only looks good because the bar is on the ground. We should not be striving for or celebrating mediocrity.
Pic related really sums it up doesn't it
Ditko's design is iconic and got little refinement, like Batman and Superman, it's all basically there from the start
What makes Miles' suit stand out from all the other alternate Spider suits? The second best one is the symbiote suit, its just clean
>What makes Miles' suit stand out from all the other alternate Spider suits?
How often Bendis told us that Miles's suit is totally better than Peter's. That's about it. Ben didn't need that crutch
Ben's outfit was so good they brought it out of rotation for Mayday.
It fits her more I think, Ben looks better in the scarlet suit anyways
What stands out is the writers telling you what to think. Mile's costume is quite frankly one of the most boring outfits I think I've ever seen on a super. In fact I'll even go further and say it's just badly designed. There's no good color balance. There's a bit of a mix up top but it's empty. Compare to the black suit which has the HUGE white spider that not only contrasts the black space but actually fills in the empty gaps. It's CLEAN but it has a good grasp on balance and design.
I do enjoy this one for Miles from the insomniac game. Better colors for him, spider has a skull thing going on, takes cues from two inspirations in his life, eyes are a bit smaller contrast to scarlet having bigger eyes. Fits him a lot better in my opinion.
I dunno. It's BETTER in the sense that's not so boring but it's got a vibe of "edgy alternate universe" version. Mile's is just so milquetoast and indistinct a character that it's hard to say what kind of outfit would really suit him. This one just feels like all those action figure variants Slott was shitting out.
>I dunno. It's BETTER in the sense that's not so boring but it's got a vibe of "edgy alternate universe" version.
Which I think is why I enjoy it more, being an anti-hero who's caught between two mentors on opposite sides of the street could be an interesting angle.
Could be. But that's not his character.
REDDIT LOST
You know why people hate Miles? It's not because he's black. It's not because he's a second Spider-man. It's not even because he's a boring non character with no identity, story or an original thread on his web. It's because no matter what they do with Spider-man, as a brand, now they are dead set on FORCING him into every goddamn angle. People hate Miles because no matter how much it doesn't work, Marvel is trying to FORCE us to love him. And it's been going on for years. People don't HATE miles. THEY'RE EXHAUSTED by Miles. They're tired of Marvel shoving this character into every angle. They're tired of him dragging the entire universe down to his level every time they want to insist he's actually super awesome. They can't leave it well enough alone. Better and more interesting concepts, spider related or otherwise have risen and fell with far less of an effort than Marvel is dead set on pushing here. If Miles came out even 5 years earlier than he did he would be little more than event fodder or shoved on some New Warriors joke team that's only ever brought up as a joke.
Nothing that Cinemaphile hates has ever been this successful comicbook wise.
Its especially challenging to Cinemaphile because this breaks all of their narratives that nu-marvel IP's cant replace their predecessors. Miles proved Cinemaphile wrong in every aspect.
Great comics, great movies, massive merchandise success, massive gaming success. House hold name. They were wrong in all aspects. Their
>Great comics
>Great comics
Name them, and articulate what makes them good
>Nothing that Cinemaphile hates has ever been this successful comicbook wise.
You mean relentlessly pushed despite no demand
>Great comics
Nah they're shit
>great movies
They're not his movies
>massive merchandise success
[citation needed]
>massive gaming success
He was a quota inclusion and did terribly given the circumstances
>House hold name
Not his own, make a movie called "Miles Morales" where he's solo and we'll see how household he really is
>They're not his movies
tbf even if its not SOLELY his movies, he is the main protag and is given the best media portrayal in those movies.
Because no one would watch it otherwise. You could make a spider verse movie without miles, they needed other attractions to get people to watch him.
So most fans of Miles are tourist, fake fans and trannies got it, that's why they made Spider-Gwen a troony, to reflect the people that like him
Characters like lady thor or iron heart are temporary and barely exist. Ultimately they don’t do shit to the characters they riff off from
Miles actively degrades Spider-Man with everything he does
>copy paste peters origin
>is still just called “Spider-Man” even though Peter is literally still Spider-Man, not even a legacy character at that point, just a copycat that’s accepted for some reason
>gets dumb can beat anything powers that render him OP
>major media stories are all about him being the best Spider-Man
>is even given peters Gwen Stacy to date because that’s not weird at all
Is there any other character that’s remotely similar to this?
Better than the original in every way. Lazy as frick writing. Somehow has romance with the original characters romantic interest?
Can some moronic milesgay explain to me how Peter can be OK with someone else being Spider-Man at the same time as him? He'll how is anyone in the Marvel universe ok with 2 people sharing the same codename it is as stupid as female Wolverine taking his mutant name or Lady Thor taking thor's name, Thor is a name not a title
>And it surely can't be due to racism
Frick Black folk. Frick trannies. And double-frick Black folk who frick trannies.
So how would you turn Miles into a good spider man besides just deleting him from existence?
he has to go back to his home universe
Frick if I don't agree with this, him being a followup to Ultimate spidey had at least had potential in living in the shadow of spiderman as Into the spiderverse showed.
shit I remember when the Ultimate setting was on its last legs and there was some vaguely interesting stuff with him interacting with the Spidey gang and ultimates to a mixed reaction.
I was about to ask that question. What would make a genuinely interesting new character?
If I had too hot take, not making him a near carbon copy of Peter but black hispanic is a good start.
I'd probably keep his parents as they were and his Uncle as a more long term villian, maybe setting up his death at Mile's hands or alternatively his dad being killed by his as one of the first major stories.
I'd probably drop miles academic/technical interest as well, I appreciated the first spiderverse movie showed miles struggling at school and secondly he had a clear love of street art, honing in on that as both a passion and proficency is a nice difference even if it doesn't clearly add much to his crime fighting capabilities.
You could probably have some fun bouncing him off the old spidey cast but probably only initially, having him inherit them only cheapens it in the long term so building his own spiderfamily would be a serious priority. the thought of JJJ taking aim at miles for being a cheap knockoff could be entertaining.
I wouldn't, because any avenue that could be explored with him could be done with a better character that has come before
If I really can't just wipe him from existence, then the main priority is making him more distinct from Peter. Give him a new costume, come up with different angles for capeshit shenanigans, and give him a personality revamp
I had a thought a while back, kind of like
says, of making Miles not that smart. Peter's a borderline genius; why not make Miles just have a completely average intelligence? If he gets outclassed by an enemy, he won't be able to just science up some nifty gadget to solve things like Peter does. Maybe he accidentally gets himself into trouble a lot, because he doesn't think things through fully, or he acts first and thinks later more often than not? You'd have to play up the 'he's a good kid' aspect to balance that out, so he doesn't seem like a complete idiot
The only problems I can see with this idea is that it'd be difficult to get right. Go too far in one direction and he'll be a complete idiot whose constant mistakes are idiotic and frustrating, rather than endearing and understandable. Too far in the other, and you don't make him different enough. Also, this whole idea essentially means making the black Spider-Man the dumber one, and I think that could be a problem for some people in its own right.
Peter above most geniuses iirc. Miles is gifted, but Peter is apparently one of the smartest characters in Marvel comics.
Peter is above most geniuses iirc.*
Change his codename, he needs a new superhero name, is literally that simple
If Cinemaphile had been around in the 90s I'm sure the seethe over Emerald Twilight and Kyle taking over wouldn't been comparable
>If Cinemaphile had been around in the 90s I'm sure the seethe over Emerald Twilight and Kyle taking over wouldn't been comparable
Kyle got a lot of seethe.
Until this day , 80s fans still complain at Kyle like how they seethe at Morrison's X men or Geoff's Wally
Morrison's X-Men started us on our way to the garbage fire that is current X-Men
Is Miles the character most emblematic of the problems that engulfed capeshit in the 2010s? Legacy character, minority character, pushed specifically with the cross-media IP potential in mind, pushing characters for social clout in spite of bad sales and negative fan reaction, overly defensive reaction by creators to fan hate? None of these were brand new but they all have seemed to come to a head in the past decade.
Yes. He was the first and worst one who inspired everything else. Letting bendis kill Spider-Man and replace him with some literally who should be a franchise killer but marvel was kept him around not because of fan demand but psyops and astroturfing
It's a natural reaction to how "pushed" he feels, people don't like being force fed anything. Also being a spawn of Bendis doesn't help as he's a hack that's ruined both Marvel and DC at different times.
I've never seen another Cinemaphile character whose fans don't call them by a pet name. Just think about insisting this little fella is Spider-Man and yet still calling him Miles in your head.
I think I've heard him called "Spi-D" once or twice.
Think that was from one of his cartoon appearances. The toons also gave him Kid Arachnid and Spin, all of which are instantly stand out more for Miles.
Yeah you were the one that called him that? Milesgays are so pathetic Jesus Christ
I've never heard Wondie before.
Night Monkey
Spider-thunder
Shock-web
Mirage
Slinger
Frick. Literally any name is good is the character has good STORIES and wasn't a sick attempt at destroying another beloved character.
> He's not even actually replacing Peter as his detractors claim; other works - especially the Insomniac games - have shown that they can co-exist and SHARE the Spider-Mantle.
All I see is Peter being sabotaged. Whenever miles is there Peter acts like a moron. And currently peters comic is some of the worst storylines I’ve ever read. They are gearing up to replace Peter
Nobody hates minorities more than other minorities. Whites are just the only ones who get called on it.
You're acting like black hate crime on Asians ain't no thing. Black people are super racist to almost everything breathing on the planet. They go out of their way to shit on north Africans living IN NORTH AFRICA for having light skin.
Ethnics don't really hate whites as they do Blacks. Because whites are such pussies. if one of them starts acting like a chimp. Raise your Voice a bit and they'll start scattering like wiener roaches.
Hence the insult : snow roach.
Frick multiverse shit
The whole bullshit of "ANYONE CAN WEAR THE MASK" just completely demeans not only the concept of Spider-man but ironically himself because if it can be anyone then there's nothing that makes him unique. His whole shtick is whining BUT I WANT TO BE SPIDER-MAN TOOOOOO!
It's because Spider-Shits are the worst fanbase. You could black any other comic hero and still never get the same online toxicity.
Makes sense. I didn't hear any outrage when Supes and Bats got their own black counterparts. Sure, they were both alternate universes, but so was Miles initially.
dc is a dead brand and the people that only give a frick about those comics are coomers and shippers, homosexual
Buzzword Cope
you know i'm right
The only reason miles keeps getting hated is because miles keeps escalating how big his media is.
Damian Wayne doesn’t have a big video game or a big studio movie centered around him. Miles does. The other problem is that Miles is always presented in a context where he is replacing Peter or being set up as his heir. He literally only exists because Peter died and bendis made some fricking black kid the new Spider-Man instead of focusing on Jessica Drew or the other cast. Then, in spider verse, miles can still only exist because of the death of Peter Parker, and he is literally, on a meta level, an anomaly that threatens the fabric of the universe. Miles doesn’t have any actual stories, and there is an inherent insecurity in him because everyone knows he’s not a good character. That’s why he needs constant cope and meta writing rather than actual storytelling.
Miles’ hatedom is only in response to the increasing amount of large mainstream media hes a major focus of, as well as Miles constantly engaging and embodying in the criticisms his haters have of him. Miles doesn’t have any character, so all he can do is double down on his existence, which leads to spider verse where they have to character assassinate every Spider-Man and threaten the universe to keep him alive.
Ben Reilly was poorly received in the 90s because people thought he would replace Peter as Spider-Man. Miles has the same treatment, except this time miles has mass media and is black so normies defend him. Even as his existence harms Spider-Man as an idea.
The problem with miles is he’s inherently trash and gets in the way of Peter’s arc. Peter makes more sense getting older and having a daughter of his own blood to raise as the conclusion to his arc. Miles existence interferes with that since everyone wants miles to be Peter’s heir even though logically by the time mayday is around miles will be irrelevant so he’s a waste of time. And then
>And then
?
Bendis' Miles sucked. Just boring.
Spider-verse's Miles is a great character.
Video game Miles is kinda meh.
And no iteration of Miles should be called "Spider-man" when Spider-man is already an existing, living character. That is the dumbest shit. Different characters should have different names.
Tell that to Jay Garrik and Barry Allen.
It's cuz Spider-Man is so popular and Petergays are insecure about Miles possibly replacing him.
This doesn't happen with like Batman or Superman really. Barely anyone wants Dick as Batman.
Because milesgays want to replace Peter
Like, I'd mind less if that means they wanted to give Miles the whole package, aka let his parents die, girlfriend dumps him, have everyone hate him in-universe for shit he didn't do, have the KKK reform solely to picket his house, have Mephisto openly take a dump on him, etc.
But we know they only want him to have Peter's superhero name and have the comics keep sucking his dick the entire rest of the eternity. They don't get how fricking easy they have it compared to the idiots who stick with Peter Parker as their main spider.
There’s an idea of “modern Spider-Man”. It’s sort of existed ever since ultimate Spider-Man, and it’s continued with MCU Spider-man, and all the spidey shows after spectacular. It has Peter as this very infantile, young, immature sweet little kid who is adopted by the avengers and has fun little crossovers or whatever. This is something that marvel has been doing with miles; making him more and more kid friendly, having nothing bad ever happen to him, making him constantly crossover with other heroes and get everything handed to him. I think marvel and miles fans want this version of miles/Spider-Man to replace Peter, so he can have lame little adventures where his dick is sucked forever
I quite like MCU Peter but Fandom!MCU Peter is horrid exactly for what you said, he is "baby" and Tony is his dad (or all of the avengers but mostly Tony) and 90% of his fics and fanart are about that and god it's annoying
>Peter gays
Opinion disregarded.
You don't even deserve the (you)
They should just make Miles the darker Spider-Man. Have him work at night fighting street-level villains while Peter fights more fantastical supervillains in the daytime.
Peter fricks up whatever colorful villain of the week in his own book, while Miles fights drug dealers, gangsters, rapists, serial killers, etc. who might have superpowers sometimes. The fricking black costume already blends in to the darkness.
Miles is already a darker Spider-Man
>I don't think I've seen another Cinemaphile character with a more dedicated, longer-lasting FORCED BY AGENDAS
everybody loves peter, out of nowhere murder him and force a shitty brat with MORE POWERS cuz special inclusive snowflave gary stu
yeah no shit why would people hate him i wonder
>He's not even actually replacing Peter
They are doing exactly that, you fricking troony
And let's say he were to fully replace Peter as the one and only Spider-Man, but to allow Pete to finally settle down and be happy with MJ and Mayday. Would that be so bad?
Yes, Miles is not Spider-Man and will never be Spider-Man, the only one that can "take" the place of Peter is his daughter not a fricking moronic homosexual like Black morales
Milesgays see Peter with mayday, and instead of wanting Peter to raise mayday as his successor, they want Peter and mayday to retire into irrelevancy, and for miles to be the new Spider-Man that replaces them, and then wonder why everyone accuses them of wanting to replace Spider-Man
>have shown that they can co-exist and SHARE the Spider-Mantle.
Yes, at the cost of a good story.
>The phrase I get all the time is that I'm always trying to 'shove my agenda down their throat'. Which seems sexually charged to me, I dunno. [...] 'He's getting rid of the white guys!' You know, never part of the plan never even considered, but it freaked people out so they're reading this stuff looking for proof. But there is a hardcore piece of the audience whose bat goes up whenever you go into these issues and they don't even realize it. And you know what kills me about is that when they're writing about it they're always hyper rational. [...] It's obviously a quota! And you know the quota arguments on fictional teams crak me up because who's actually losing a job here? Which fictional character is losing a job? There's no connection -- they're not talking about what's going on the comic books. They're talking about what they think is going on in their lives, and that's not really going on either.
there is nothing interesting or likeable about miles morales
literally fricking nothing
You can easily make Miles an universally liked hero if you simply gave him his own identity, the only people that would be mad at that are morons and blacks that want to take shit from everybody (people that don't read or consume any comic book related media)
Read every word. I legit can't COMPUTE how someone calls himself a Spider-Man fan then laughs at this.
you legit can't have to hate spider-man to like miles as a character. Or be one heck of a leftypol unhinged freak.
Kek. Even I can't COMPUTE. My grammar went down the shitter Just trying to process it.
I legit can't COMPUTE how can someone call themselves a Spider-Man fan then laughs at this sad state of affairs.
you legit Must hate spider-man to like miles as a character. Or be one heck of a leftypol unhinged freak who can only think in terms of owning la heckin raysist
Do you have any pics of people hating Ben Reilly and Buckycap? I’d love to see that kek
I'd have to go digging honestly, most of the stuff about Ben Reilly we know because when Marvel nixed it they put out statements about the volume of physical death threats mailed to the offices, this was slightly before e-mail was a big thing, so this was tens of thousands of physical letters.
With Buckycap my favorite was this comic someone drew of a little kid standing in front of him going "Oh wow, so you're the new Captain America? Huh, and you carry a gun now? Could I see it?" Bucky hands it to him, and the kid immediately shoots him between the eyes, his expression becoming angry, "You're not Captain America! >:("
> thousands of angry fans mad at moronic Spider-Man writers
War never changes
The reason miles is bad:
Peter Parker is Spider-Man, right? So what is miles morales? Also spiderman
In ultimate, he became spider man after Peter. In spider verse, he became spider man after Peter died
He’s not a super hero with his own identity. He’s a spider man replacement and a Peter Parker replacement. That’s why he never has has his own identity. They’ve tried Spy-D and fricking Spin, but it’s not as the same as Peter Parker BEING Spider-Man. Miles’ identity is Miles Morales because he’s not a classic superhero, he’s a replacement whose super power, his defining trait, is his ethnicity and replacing Peter Parker. He only exists to replace Peter and that’s why he struggles to coexist alongside him because he was literally not created to be anything other then Spider-Man and replace Peter
I think the only way to salvage Miles is to make a fricking villain. Just like they did with Ultimate Reed Richards. That way his OP powerset would make sense as capeshit villains are supposed to be powerful for the hero to overcome them.
Spider that bit him was infused with the same serum that made Norman into Green Goblin and Harry into Hobgoblin. It's not much of a stretch.
Marvel already done Phil Urich dirty like that, so it won't be the first time.
*make him a fricking villain
I'm so sorry. I slept only 2 and half hours today.
How come residents of 616 called Alpha a Poochie but not Miles
Because Miles is Bendis' nepo baby.
Whatever happened to this guy? Would he make a good nemesis for Miles?
Died on the way back to his home planet
Alpha had the decency to frick off
Cause Miles got folded into their universe via cosmic frickery so it's like he was always there. Also because unironically he had zoomers cooming on youtube in-universe about him being so heckin brown and valid
The idea of a different Spider-Man underneath the mask is nothing new. Spider-Man 2099's exposure to the mainstream is evident of this. But Spider-Man 2099 has his own enemies while Miles hardly has any an they're really not all that interesting.
Miles used to live in his own universe, hopefully after ultimate invasion Miles goes back to his home and doesn't return and he still doesn't go back at the very least the should make him a proper supporting character for Spider-Man
>Spider-Man 2099 has his own enemies
You mean "Future versions" of Peter's enemies?
Yes because he's in the future, that's the whole idea, where's as miles enemies are literally the exact same as Peter's and in the same fricking time. He is redundant. There is not one single Miles story that couldn't have just been Peter.
Also, very few of Miguel's enemies are successors of Peter's.
benchads, I kneel
>bendischads
FTFY
Miles is redundant. A carbon copy with a few bells and whistles to make it less obvious. Everything about him including his rogues and storylines are all regurgitated Peter stories. Miles’ only real ability is the power of pandering.
What's wrong with hating Miles because he's black? Literally 95% of his fans like him because he's black
>Literally 95% of his fans like him because he's black
actually true, that's the reason people defend him on this threads too
>And miles getting pushed is due to his sheer popularity. Nothing to do with ulterior motives
BENDIS HAS ADOPTED BLACK KIDS
So this is the power of antibengay?
Well he's clearly an ESL. I don't think he's the original anti-Bengay either
Imagine if Miles was in MC2 and got with May.
The impending rape ruins it. Unneccessary