I hate that film criticism is going through its poptimism phase. Watch whatever you goddamn want, but don't demand that your popcorn flicks get the same accolades and critical analysis as movies that have more thought and care put into them. If you watch Vertigo and you're thinking "I wish I was watching a Marvel movie" just drop out of film class.
Why can’t zoomers talk like human beings?
raised on and by the internet. The first generation ever in the history of our species.
That's what happens when the internet caters to the lowest common denominator.
Boomers and millennials are hardly humans
frfr
Ayo what you be sayin' bruh? You lookin' for beef on god bruh fr fr.
mighty sus ngl
They're the first generation exclusively raised on the internet. Part of their issue is that they have no cultural moment that matters. Everything they try to make a moment is forgotten a week or so later. They're all about consuming everything as quickly as possible and then digesting it as soon as they finish their last bite.
Think of it like this, 50~ or so years from now, one of these people have a chance of becoming president.
I'm happy most zoomies are to ignorant to understand the true implications of the sheer horror of your post.
Don't wash your hand so quickly, Cinemaphile pride itself to be a major influence on the Internet culture, well congratulations motherfricker. That mean you had an hand in shaping their minds, participating in the collective dumbing down with your agressive of meme newspeak and anti intellectual thought terminating cliche like "tl;dr/too many words".
You made your bed, lay on it
Only like the second half of Gen Z is like this, Gen Alpha suffers from the issue much greatly.
I'm 20, meaning a zoomer, and I and most of my peers got computers and were really spending a lot of time on the internet only by like age 12.
But I am also not American so.
>I hate that film criticism is going through its poptimism phase
It's not just films. Every medium is cursed forever because of social media letting morons talk past each other and lose their minds obsessing over people who disagree with them. Games have the same problem. Turns out when everyone's forced into the same place they don't have a spirited respectful exchange of ideas, but actually start seething over the people that disagree with them and baying for their blood instead.
If all millennials were genocided, especially the white ones, the world would turn into heaven overnight
>poptimism
I'm literally a reddit refugee and this is the gayest thing I've heard. Never post again.
Popular music will never be art, grow up and listen to real music like the rest of us
It’s a music criticism term that dates back to the 80s.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockism_and_poptimism
Go back
>the whole plot is dumb and unrealistic
>but my stories about space wizards shooting magic beams down from the sky are totes serious
Someone post the Beatles criticism that nailed its acclaim only because it's popular.
Film is about to go through the same thing it seems.
But Hitchwiener is an overrated hack for the record
The fact that so many books still name the Beatles as "the greatest or most significant or most influential" rock band ever only tells you how far rock music still is from becoming a serious art. Jazz critics have long recognized that the greatest jazz musicians of all times are Duke Ellington and John Coltrane, who were not the most famous or richest or best sellers of their times, let alone of all times. Classical critics rank the highly controversial Beethoven over classical musicians who were highly popular in courts around Europe. Rock critics, instead, are still blinded by commercial success. The Beatles sold more than anyone else (not true, by the way), therefore they must have been the greatest. Jazz critics grow up listening to a lot of jazz music of the past, classical critics grow up listening to a lot of classical music of the past. Rock critics are often totally ignorant of the rock music of the past, they barely know the best sellers.
This could easily be put to rest by pointing out some underrated rock artists and giving their work publicity. The Beatles are much better than most rock or pop acts of their day and to this day. I think they earned their place in the spotlight. Maybe a few obscure but great acts slipped through the cracks but the proper response is not to shit on the Beatles for making bank. The proper response is to highlight those overlooked greats and try to learn a thing or two from them.
Every rock critic sucks the dick of King Crimson or Cream though, most would probably put Led Zeppelin above the Beatles.
>Every rock critic sucks the dick of King Crimson
Ersatz shit, F-
they suck the dick of 60's and 80's KC, which really doesn't deserve it. 70's and 90's KC on the other hand is pure kino and of course it never gets any love.
That's just the veil of popularity of the genre itself that allows utter morons to be in positions to give these opinions. Same as how pop culture is full of basic b***hes, rock ia still popular enough for basic b***hes to occupy not only the talents but also the critics. Jazz and classical are now niche enough that the plastic pretenders have fricked off and now the truth can rise out of the scene. If you ignore mainstream sources, a lot of lesser known respectable names have respectable opinions.
>Hitchwiener is an overrated
Based. I only watch real auteurs like Kurosawa, Kubrick, Edward Yang and Vintenberg
>But Hitchwiener is an overrated hack for the record
he's overrated and underrated
people overrate him as some king of terror when the guy obviously made thriller comedies
The Trouble With Harry and North By Northwest are ahead of their time. First one is like Coen brothers movie but made in the 50s, the second one is a parody of Bond movies before Bond movies became a thing. He's also one of the most dynamic directors of his time. North by Northwerst in particular is super fast paced, almost Total Recall tier. It's very unusual for the time. Hitchwiener was much more experimental than he's given credit for and his influence is more formal rather than usual muh plot stuff. That's why FNW directors were raving after him.
He made kino, except for The Birds. Frick that stupid movie, slow as shit and achieves nothing. Not even scary.
Comic books are really one of the great original American art forms like Jazz
Normalhomosexuals were always like this
This. Film classes have always been filled with people with absolute dog shit taste that have no appreciation for what came before it. Their favorite movies are unironically interstellar or Jurassic park. I remember taking one in high school and saying my favorite movie was apocalypse now and no one except the teacher knew what it was.
>tfw Vertigo fails to empower black queer voices
>be homosexual millennial or zoomer
>not thankful to see kino of this century (webm related)
This one webm has more soul than every Disneed product of the 2010s combined
The prequels are a lot of things. Soulless isn't one of them.
The prequels are dry as Hell. They have a few drops of soul mixed with an overwhelming dose of bland and boring. I hope the CGI department learned a thing or two from them because the rest of us sure didn't learn how to make a good movie out of the prequels, or anything post Empire Strikes Back. And just for fun a pet peeve of mine: Why didn't the Star Destroyers have capital ship sized weapons and the rebels have anti capital ship missiles? Budget, probably. That was really immersion breaking to see them use lasers no bigger than what the fighter craft had. I will say one point in favor of Return of the Jedi. Jabba's palace looked fun. Star Wars should have gone more in that direction that the Godawful dreck we were served with the prequels and sequels. Budget again, sure. Also a hatred of the white male fan base and lack of talent on the post Empire writing staff. Stick a fork in it. Star Wars is done.
How are the prequels boring?
So fricking good. No idea why people hate this scene so much.
There’s a couple goofy parts where they’re clearly just spinning the swords around not even trying to fight, but yeah overall it’s super fun. Good scene. But if it’s not perfect RLM will find the flaw and thousands of goobers will parrot it (like I did in college).
It's kino at first but it gets increasingly silly. Eventually they are dueling on a tightrope and clashing swords while surfing on lava. It just goes too far in a couple of places. It could have worked in a goofier movie but this fight was supposed to be very serious and the climatic battle of the entire series.
Prequeltrannies pretend that the prequels are cheesy movies with campy scenes now.
What? They are cheesy movies with campy scenes. Are you really going to deny this?
certified kino
>nooooo stop having fun
Why do you even watch movies? You clearly don't like them and don't think anyone else should.
>homosexual dramas
>movies that have more thought and care put into them
I don't think so. homosexual dramas are made by and for huge homosexuals.
you sure think about homosexuals a lot
What if I don't want to have superficial """"""fun""""" and want to learn and experience?
>fun
Marvel movies are simply not fun, entertaining or engaging in any capacity with the exception of maybe first Iron Man which is okay and GotG movies but I haven't seen the first one since it came out.
They're in a fricking academic setting. I didn't study cinema but I have to assume it's not about what you particularly like, but about getting an overall knowledge of cinema history and techniques, if you want to have fun do it in your own free time.
I've never seen this thread but it feels like it will have a lot of low quality discussion so I'm closing the tab now.
Capeshit suffers from two major problems. One, it is often used as a marketing vehicle for toys or SJW cause of the week, more than a story telling vehicle. Two, it suffers the problem of granting a large number of characters God Tier powers. If everybody important in the script has an easy way to win the fight, you have to explain why they don't use their powers to do so. As this is time consuming and often badly explained it is glossed over. It's the problem of Deus Ex Machine to the Nth degree. Thus, the stories are very predictable and rehashes of plots from mere years ago. At least the folks who rip off Shakespeare have the decency to go back in a time a few hundred years.
Superheroes are inherently juvenile. There's no avoiding that, even if you make "mature" versions of existing superheroes or new ones intended for an adult audience. The guy is still called Batman and he's still wearing spandex; it doesn't matter if it's tacticool according to the tastes of 2009 or not.
Capeshit suffers from more important problem, it's fricking badly made. Early on they actually did proper pacing and directors had input so the films were visually distinct, and weren't a product of the commitee.
Let's get a recent example, Raimi's Doctor Strange. It has a very similar issue to Matrix: Reloaded in that it feels like a middle section of a larger movie. It begins abruptly coming from an already exisiting TV show (which they still kinda retcon) and ends abruptly too. It's tons of shit being thrown at you, without set up. The TV show doesn't work as a set up as it's about a different character and made in a somewhat different style (there are similarities since all the Marvel shit looks pretty much the same but conceptually they're very different). The previous film did set up some characters but it didn't set up the story of the film, in fact Mordo from the original is ignored for the third sequel. The pacing is insane but unlike let's say Total Recall the film isn't very thought out. Total Recall is very reliant on the style, it's insane pacing is one of the most important things, while here it only serves the point of not boring the shit out of ADHD capeshit manchildren. Raimi's style is barely in the film except for some mild gore-ish things and camera angles. And as I mentioned it's similar to Reloaded but Reloaded works if you watch the Matrix trilogy at one go. But with this film the first part is never to be found. It's a part of the ongoing Marvel series of films yes, but no TV show or movie that was made before it works as the first part of the Multiverse of Madness. That's the result of massive studio intervention by people who don't know how to make films and only ask to throw shit at screen because otherwise the consumer will turn on their phone.
Imagine being so moronic you think Seven Samurai is pretentious.
>not my spidermans nooooo
I fricking hate zoomers so much.
How about instead of sitting there seething, you attempt to defend these films you like so much? Is it because you know deep down, that they’re actually garbage and if you attempted to make an argument for why they’re good, you’d get obliterated?
These are your future directors and critics, America.
Or maybe realize it's not 1932 anymore and shit changes you old bitter frick nugget.
movies have always been bread and circus for the masses. not a legitimate art form in any way.
A medium does not have to be one thing. When you grow up you'll understand this.
>it's true in my mind
Criticism died when saying something nice about capeship became an unwritten law in the movie/entertainment press. Also the same generational shift that clogged Hollywood with millennials and zommer mediocrities has happened in movie criticism: a lot of people with no verve, no feel, no detachment, no insight, nothing to offer except for childish platitudes and cringe faked enthusiasm.
On which planet do you homosexual lives? There is not one month that pass without some tech bro rehashing a variation of "Marvel is not cinema" clickbait
First of all you have to learn how to think: exceptions (people knocking on capeshit) only highlight the current major trend (imbeciles/manchildren/bandwagoning chicks fawning over capeshit on the media).
Twitturd has a fair point know. Marvel movies have some accomplishments and all too many wanabe film snobs get ass chapped over CGI or jerk off to "muh symbolism to x marginalized people/issue that isn't relevant to modern society."
What cinematic accomplishments do they have except for purely statistical ones?
You mean except the most important ones?
If you find pride in praising the relentless consumerism of the masses which is natural, but uninteresting and destructive when plaguing places beyond the normalhomosexual centrals you better off going back to Facebook.
It's not my job to educate you on the basics of film making and what instances of Marvel meets or exceeds expectations. Do you own education and research, but it's no surprise the actual film spectacle, roll storytelling, and camera techniques achieved in a lot of them is pivotal and groundbreaking.
Except they don't and you're just stating false things.
You got nothing but some poopy undies I'm gonna smell later.
>thinking the marvel movies are well made
They literally have said they film all the action scenes before a script is even done because they make them based off plot points already established for the story that set up action scenes with the rest done after which is why the movies come off as dumb. Those scene exist solely to get to the next action set piece.
>complains that Vertigo is unrealistic
>somehow Star Wars and Marvel movies aren't
>He agrees that Vertigo is as bad as capeshit.
Embarrassing. Totally correct, but still embarrassing.
>a black and white scene where a tear drop falls on an apple that is later fed to a donkey is muh kino/sovl
But
>a scene where characters from different movies all come together for the last final fight joined by heroes and fighters from all over the galaxy (places that have been established over years) is not kino
You guys are so pretentious. Vertigo and other old movies are boring and you know it. Marvel movies keep you on the edge for several hours
Nice b8 m8 I r8 8/8
Film snobs on twitter are annoying as frick, I have to admit that making them seethe brings me joy
I'd honestly rather be among the snobs than interacting with mouthbreathing starshit or capeshit plebs
I love pretentious shit. I own it and am ok with it. My music, film, and books I read are way more complex and nuanced than your average persons. I’m ok with that. Some people like McDonald’s. Some want foi gras or ortalans. If you like basic, normie shit that’s cool, just know that I’m better than you, smarter than you, and take in more culturally relevant, intelligent shit than you do. If pretentious means “I think I’m smarter than you because I’m more cultured, educated, and like things with artistic merit” then I’m as pretentious as it gets. With a double shot of pappy van winkle and a Cuban hanging out my mouth.
>culturally relevant
This is the only part thats incorrect.
>intelligent shit
>shit
Hmmm might not be quite as smart as you claim , shitanon.
>contrarian homosexuals are defending capeshit in this thread
lol
>If you watch Vertigo and you're thinking "I wish I was watching a Marvel movie" just drop out of film class.
It's the demographics. Vertigo is a white people movie, of course the New Americans won't like it
he's right about the story of Vertigo being dumb and unrealistic, though.
It's not meant to be a realistic movie. It's a nightmarish mystery where reality is off-kilter
Pretty much, Lynch owes a lot to Hitchwiener especially Vertigo
Why are you going to take a film class and then complain that pop flicks are used as an example of bad cinema, or that they make you watch classic films? Fricking zoomers should just stop taking fentanyl already. Next thing, that guy is going to take a music theory class and complain that they aren't listening to lil trap.
never seen vertigo, what's so good about it?
Well for starters, its fricking gorgeous to look at with Technicolor. People can argue what they like and don't like, but it is an exceptionally polished production that makes it a visual knockout in a visual medium and anyone who disagrees is either disingenuous or doesn't care/value the production or technical qualities the film showcases. You don't need a film class to understand why.
Films like Vertigo were explicit psyops designed to instill a sense of fear in the populace. At least capeshit and sci-fis are labors of love.