I hate the "gods are just aliens" thing so much. Anyone so powerful would be worshiped as a god somewhere regardless of origin.
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I hate the "gods are just aliens" thing so much. Anyone so powerful would be worshiped as a god somewhere regardless of origin.
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Are we gods then compared to our ancestors?
According to that TNG episode, yes
Until Picard ate shit through the wrong end of an arrow.
We're Morlocks.
We are royalty. At least, in living standards.
Most people ITT have heating, running water, indoor plumbing, decent clean food, electricity, personally owned transportation & an abundance of entertainment & information at our fingertips. People in the first world can even summon people to deliver us food & goods. We all live like kings, & we don't even know it.
I can’t lead an army into battle against my neighbor.
You can't farm, you can't weave, you can't clean meat, you depend on artificial medications
>wizards, magical creatures, magic, dragons
>ackshully it was all le science, robots, aliens and technology 😉
frick this cliche
frick you
I mean in the MM games the whole point is not that magic is actually science but that magic and science are indistinguishable, so they have robot sorcerers and dragon making machines
demi-god is a word
>we're not that much smarter
true story. systems of education and government provide the necessary situation for parents and teachers to instill survival skills for children, which is why anarchists are dumb for not trying to codify and institute government organizations away from capitalists and holding on to that power to keep humanity focused on its own ascendance
They've made the Asgardians actual gods
What with Omnipotence City and the introduction of the Olympians and Ennead
Waititi just really doesn't give a shit about worldbuilding, he has the mind of a woman so he only knows how to subvert and write cheap conflict, rather than create and build fictional universes
>Waititi just really doesn't give a shit about worldbuilding
Marvel Comics has been all over the place with this shit too. The Celestials being Space Gods, the Eternals being God stand-ins, Elder Cthonic supernatural Gods, Abstract Entity-Gods, none of it fits together very well.
>So Thor, are you omnipotent?
>No.
>Are you omniscient?
>No.
>Are you omnipresent?
>No.
>Are you immortal?
>No.
>So what makes you a god?
>I'm really strong?
>Like Hulk?
>And I throw lightning around.
>Like Storm?
How come they never have these conversations?
Because what you described is mostly a Christian view of a God. Many pantheistic religions throughout history did essentially portray gods as just really powerful people.
If that's true, then why do we use the word "gods"? It doesn't really make sense to apply it both to an eternal omniscient being and to beings who despite being more powerful than humans are clearly limited in some capacities.
The term being applied to an "eternal omniscient being" didn't occur until relatively recently in human history. And even then some people argue that "God with a capital G" can be traced to a more low-level pantheistic deity like Yahweh, people just kept making him more and more OP over the years
You can't get more OP than omnipotent. And I don't believe that until relatively recently people just didn't understand that concept or didn't think to apply it. We're not that much smarter than our ancestors were despite our technological advances.
>or didn't think to apply it
It's not necessarily that nobody could imagine or comprehend it, it's that it didn't become mainstream. Some religions feature ridiculously powerful gods(Hinduism) or omnipresent ones(some forms of Buddhism) but the idea of a singular omnipotent, all-knowing, all-good deity is a very specific concept. Much simpler believing flawed, limited gods exist if all you know is a flawed, limited world
>Much simpler believing flawed, limited gods exist if all you know is a flawed, limited world
That's all anyone knows or has ever known to this day, but we can still conceive of things like divine perfection. Besides, to say there are powerful aliens isn't blasphemous or anything from an Abrahamic perspective. It's easy to believe in both if one doesn't fit the "God with a capital G" description.
Our understanding of that limited world has improved over time though. We understand the mechanisms behind natural disasters and how planets are formed instead of chalking it up to some deity chilling in the clouds. We've combed through the earth thoroughly and can look at parts of our universe lightyears away such that any idea of God being physical is no longer in fashion.
>It's easy to believe in both if one doesn't fit the "God with a capital G" description
Maybe not asgardians by themselves, but they know about stuff like the infinity stones, Eternity, etc, beings that might as well be God(or should not coexist with Him at least)
Most gods in human history don't fit those criteria though, and would absolutely be closer to superheroes than the Judeo-Christian God
Thor isn't immortal?
Well I assume he isn't because he's been in apparent danger of death before. Maybe he was just pretending he could die, idk.
If we want to get technical: the Chaos Gods are genuine gods. They are omniscience, omnipotent, omnipresent, exist in a realm that is outside our reality, and they spawn actual fricking daemons and are the manifestation of all sentient life.
Tl;dr 40k > Marvel
still lose to Squirrel Girl
While the statement/logic is valid, MCU Asgardians kind of stopped following it as time went on. Magical just suddenly became a thing, and Thor movies sort of abandoned any semblance of ancient aliens
It never made sense anyways that we'd know all about the god's past and future shit when it's implied to not be very old in-universe
I don't follow. Odin was canonically a few million years old as stated in Ragnarok
>Odin was canonically a few million years old
And that's moronic for a billion reasons. Plus we know their future and shit as well
>And that's moronic for a billion reasons.
Why?
>Plus we know their future and shit as well
What are you talking about? You're not very clear about your point. Explain and use your words, anon
>Why?
Are you fricking kidding me? We're supposed to believe that nothing in their relationships or characters changed for thousands of years?
Anon for frick sake could you ELABORATE and have a coherent thought? I feel like I'm reading half a fricking conversation here
Different anon here. What he implies is probably that while it's impossible to know for sure what a million year old being's mind would be like, it's highly doubtful it would be the same as your regular 60-something old fart, the way Odin is usually portrayed.
Odin wasn't exactly senile. He was more set in his ways grumpy.
Maybe Asgardians just take a super long time to age physically and mentally, like pic related, she's a couple thousand years old and acts like a teenager.
It's weird. Asgard is clearly just another place in the vast universe so the aliens thing checks out, but then you have viking afterlife on another plane of existence that only these specific aliens can go to
It's not just that but Asgardians going from "Its just tech that looks like magic to Midgard" to "Frick it, there's magic now. Check out our giant fire giant and Dwarven smithing"
>Anyone so powerful would be worshiped as a god somewhere regardless of origin.
I mean, they were, weren't they?
Yes. Almost like that's the idea. They're not true gods. Godlike beings sure but not immortal creators.
It's all about context and divinity and dominion. What makes them Gods really? In actual myth they created the World, held dominion over it and other realms, had spiritual powers and knowledge. If they're just a really fricking strong dude who has cool tech, what makes them a God? Is Hulk a God now?
Humans are able to conceive of an omnipotent being. Were these godlike aliens ever able to do so? If so, they might've felt kind of silly accepting the status of gods. It'd be like an ordinary man declaring himself a god because he's so much more powerful than an insect.
Well wouldn't a spiritual god technically be an alien, too? Like all that shit they encounter in Star Trek.
In the context of the MCU, what's the difference between gods and aliens, really? Ancient powerful things exist, magic exists, advanced technology exists. Maybe you don't age, or can see the future, or can conjure objects out of thin air, on can create whole worlds with a mere thought. You can be considered a god by some. Big deal. Gods are only defined as such by people who worship them. Asgardians were seen as gods by ancient humans, but to a modern human they are "just" long-lived magical aliens with advanced knowledge of magic and science.
Yeah, if there is one thing that annoys me in modern superhero movies, it's how ashamed they are about being a comic book movie. And thus they quckly try to get rid of everything that could make people think that it's infantile.
>Anyone so powerful would be worshiped as a god
where do you people even get this idea?
if a alien race showed up on earth tomorrow you wouldn't drop to your knees and start praying to them.
the people who think like this are the same kind of people who think the egyptians were too moronic to build the pyramids.
>if a alien race showed up on earth tomorrow you wouldn't drop to your knees and start praying to them.
No, because we know enough by now, to recognise that they're are in fact an alien species. But people living in ancient Rome or Egypt? Yeah, they would worship their ass.
What do you know that your ancestors didn't that would make you able to discern a god from an alien?
I would be definitly more sceptical than them.
Well I'm skeptical of that claim. Why do you think that?
For starters, the idea of "aliens" themselves is kinda novel. Some ancient civilizations thought the universe was far less vast than it actually is, and that anybody who didn't come from Earth must've been a god or demon
I don't know about that. Even Ptolemy knew that Earth was so tiny compared to the universe that it must be treated as a point.
Didnt Ptolemy also believe Earth was the literal center of the universe, and astrological objects were interchangeable with heavenly ones?
Sort of. The point I was making is that he knew the universe was incalculably large compared to the Earth.
>uummm ackshually sweaty we are too ADVANCED™ to gett tricked 😉
Didn’t you just defeat your own argument?