>Dude cuts your wife's head off after psychologically Black personing you for months, and then offering his death to you informs you she was pregnant with your first born.
Motherfricker this is the whole point of the film. J Doe was right, and everyone arguing otherwise like yourself is a tool of the devil. Welcome to the world you built homosexual.
The Point is supposed to be that it's obvious dog breeds are different and humans deny other races are, but the point is shit because dog breeds are breeds. Even says so in the name.
Yeah, nah. David has the opportunity to grieve, and maybe even move forward and find happiness in the future, and John Doe's head got turned into a canoe
David might not have won, but John sure as shit lost
>David might not have won, but John sure as shit lost
Nope. David lost and John won. David gave into John's wishes even after calling him a lunatic who means nothing just minutes before.
was the implication that: he was going to spend life in jail for the murder = the bad guy won? because i'm pretty sure he would have just got a slap on the wrist for killing him and did a couple years all told at the most. thats well worth it to kill the guy that killed your wife and receive closure on the whole thing
He would have done jail time, but who knows how much. Definitely not 1st degree murder. 2nd degree at best. Likely some version of manslaughter due to temporary mania due to the extreme circumstances. I bet he does 3-5 years in jail and then like 5 years of probation. Career over of course.
forgot the guys name but he shot the karate instructor who molested his son in the head at an airport back in the 80's and i think he only did 3 years + probation. pretty sure a cop gets something even more lax than that and then gets treated like a god in jail ie tv in cell, phone, actually good food >Career over of course.
yeah highly doubt that as well. the police look out for each other no way he doesn't land some cushy job with a fat pension somewhere when its all said and done
he actually fricking won, except for his wife dying
>forgot the guys name
Gary Plauchet. I always laugh at the sheriff that was Gary Plauchet's drinking buddy yelling "Why Gary, why!", like it's not super obvious he was the one that told the dad which airport terminal they'd be landing in at what time
>if Miller didn't shoot John Doe, he would go to jail forever and only 6 of the 7 sins would have been completed. His whole plan would be ruined.
Amazing how Cinemaphile is so dumb they can't understand this.
>if Miller didn't shoot John Doe, he would go to jail forever and only 6 of the 7 sins would have been completed. His whole plan would be ruined.
Amazing how Cinemaphile is so dumb they can't understand this.
>you can't kill him because he wants you to kill him
John doe had the sloth guy tied up for a year, and had planned everything long before that, but Brads character had only just relocated to the city when the film/case begun. You're telling me John doe suddenly decided he was envious of Brad midway through the killings and completely forgot about who he was presumably previously envious of enough to kill and do all this shit over originally?
Probably saw and opportunity and took it. The whole envy thing maybe true, maybe not. It was accordingly to the plan.
As for OP's question, like these anons said
he would just get 2 months max unpaid leave
He would have done jail time, but who knows how much. Definitely not 1st degree murder. 2nd degree at best. Likely some version of manslaughter due to temporary mania due to the extreme circumstances. I bet he does 3-5 years in jail and then like 5 years of probation. Career over of course.
he would probably fine, if he goes to jury big chance he walks away an everyone see his as a hero. Just like that dad that killed the pedo that molested his kid irl.
However, if there is a bad implication is that there are more victims out there. With John Doe dead we will never know who he really was, if he ever had help and how much people he killed.
>if he goes to jury big chance he walks away an everyone see his as a hero. Just like that dad that killed the pedo that molested his kid irl.
He's not going to be considered a hero because he's a cop. He's supposed to let the man be arrested, not execute him in front of tons of other cops.
The guy who killed his child's molester? That guy is a hero. He took it upon himself to do what was right and had no professional duty to restrain himself. Mills was basically an opportunist compared to the dad.
Mills and the kid's dad would not get the same prison sentence. The kid's dad would get less time than Mills because Mills took advantage of having the guy basically give himself to Mill's gun and that is definitely not professional, even if his wife was dead.
>He's supposed to let the man be arrested, not execute him in front of tons of other cops.
Indeed, but after the guy killed five people in the most horrific way, then tortured and kille a pregnant woman and presented her head and the fetus in a box to her husband, it's pretty justifiable for anyone to just shoot the bastard.
>it's pretty justifiable for anyone to just shoot the bastard.
any cop knows you can't execute a perp on his knees asking to be killed, you moron. that's a career ender + prison.
Mills fricked up. He should not have given John Doe what he wanted. John Doe literally used him like a puppet.
The guy who shot a pedo planned it in cold blood, Mills found out in the moment his wife was raped and murdered, he wouldn't ever see the inside of a jail cell
Makes me wonder who his original pick was going to be or maybe he didn't have one specific in which case Mills was a boon for him that he took advantage of. Mills nearly catching him definitely told him this was a guy to look into, he does say at the end he admired Mills and it seemed genuine.
Mills almost caught him, surely that aspect alone made an impression on him.
But my point is, there must have been someone he envied enough to originally plan something horrid for before meeting mills. They also should have found evidence of who he was orignally stalking in his place.
The thing that makes the envy target different is that he personally envied mills, which means there was someone else Jon envied to a psychopathic degree for well over a year, then suddenly changed his mind because "your wife is hot".
Probably saw and opportunity and took it. The whole envy thing maybe true, maybe not. It was accordingly to the plan.
As for OP's question, like these anons said [...] [...] he would probably fine, if he goes to jury big chance he walks away an everyone see his as a hero. Just like that dad that killed the pedo that molested his kid irl.
However, if there is a bad implication is that there are more victims out there. With John Doe dead we will never know who he really was, if he ever had help and how much people he killed.
It means he either never had a plan and winged it (which is incredibly hacky writing) or there was some other target initially and he had a sudden change of heart, which is also poor writing.
Doe probably had people picked out who were no more special than any of the other killings before then but when Mills nearly caught him and the police now had Doe's entire apartment to comb over it forced him to make a change of plans. Originally he might have thought he would get away with it but now he probably figured he was going to be fricked regardless so he decided to see what Mills life was like and in that moment decided he would be envy and Mills would become his Wrath. Mills wife wasn't an actual deadly sin victim just a murder that Doe perpetrated in order to complete everything, this way Mills would kill him, complete the deadly sins killing and save Doe from a lifetime sentence in prison.
> no more special than any of the other killings
Firstly, some of the victims like pride where clearly specially picked, otherwise there's no guarantee she would have killed herself (thus fulfilling "pride"). There should have been some evidence for what his original plan was for wrath and envy in his apartment if he did just wing it at the last moment.
But like I said even then that reasoning doesn't work for envy since its himself that's guilty of it. > in that moment decided he would be envy
Which is just terrible writing. There was also no way he would know that mills would become fulfill wrath. You don't do all this meticulous planning for years, torture and killing, just to completely gamble it all at the last moment and just "decide" to be envious. >Mills wife wasn't an actual deadly sin victim just a murder that Doe perpetrated in order to complete everything, this way Mills would kill him, complete the deadly sins killing and save Doe
Im well aware of the plot anon.
> You don't do all this meticulous planning for years, torture and killing, just to completely gamble it all at the last moment and just "decide" to be envious
There’s nothing to suggest he didn’t have two others in mind You don't do all this meticulous planning for years, torture and killing, just to completely gamble it all at the last moment and just "decide" to be envious for Envy and Wrath though, possibly high profile celebrities or politicians who in some murder/suicide thing would have drawn massive Western interest in it and his work complete. All total head cannon I admit but fun to play around with.
In this case he actually did make Spacey win since he wanted to die and wanted to bring down a person who was his exact opposite to make his psycho point.
Pitt's character would have won if he held the trigger, beat the shit out of him then sent Spacey to prison for the rest of his life to get gang-raped in the ass but no he just didn't have the impulse control after finding out what was in the box.
I feel bad but the way he cries by doing these weird jerky transitions between anger and crying is hilarious I can't stop keking. Still fricked, great movie.
I really hate his acting in that scene, really ruins the mood for me. Pitt is a bad actor, Freeman carries that movie. The fricking extras did a better job than him.
>If you kill the mentally unhinged serial killer who raped, murdered and tortured a bunch of people, you are no different from him
Does it bother you to know you breathe the same air as people who unironically believe this?
>If you kill the mentally unhinged serial killer who raped, murdered and tortured a bunch of people, you are no different from him
that's not the point of what happened.
nobody is saying Mills is the same as John Doe. It's just that John Doe actually won and Mills actually lost because John Doe got what he wanted in the end and Mills lost his wife, career and is probably going to prison for a short while only to come out alone and looking for something else to do while people are discussing John Doe's work in pop culture and history...forever.
Paltrow just said on hot ones they made a replica of her head to show in the box and even.though it was supposedly never included, she said her head is visible for like a single frame.so it does appear in the movie super fast. Can anyone confirm?
You don't see her head in the box. An image of her appears for a frame right before Mills shoots, but it isn't her severed head, it's just a photograph.
>and then your honor the defendant cold-bloodedly shot him in the head right after he learned that the sadistic serial killer mr doe had brutally murdered and decapitated his pregnant wife!
In reality the DA wouldn't even bring up charges against the dude and he'd be hailed as a hero. John Doe was white after all
The DA would have to bring up charges because cops cant just kill people who are on their knees asking to die, no matter what they do. It would be a lesser charge but a charge for sure. Somerset was right because he understood John Doe while Mills had no grasp of what John Doe was doing because as he said, Mills was a simple man.
John Doe took advantage of a simple man who had no impulse control. He knew Mills would do it. He knew Mills better than Mills could ever know him.
>heh heh i knew i would do something so heinous that you would kill me... all of my female true crime fans are going to be so impressed by this
So what? Am I a genius mastermind if I "manipulate" the state into executing me with capital punishment if I commit a murder?
>lol I envied your wife or whatever, even though there's nothing in the movie to demonstrate this >oh you killed me for murdering and beheading her, lol you're guilty of wrath
In this situation yes, the winning move here would be to make him spend the rest of his life sharing a cell with a psychotic serial rapist and the complete knowledge that his plan was a failure.
>If you kill your enemies, they win >They don't kill the enemy >Enemy turns the tables >Enemy kills them >Enemy wins
The movie was incredibly stupid but I won't deny laughing uncontrollably for a week.
He’s a cop, they aren’t supposed to just ki
>america
nevermind.
>Dude cuts your wife's head off after psychologically Black personing you for months, and then offering his death to you informs you she was pregnant with your first born.
Motherfricker this is the whole point of the film. J Doe was right, and everyone arguing otherwise like yourself is a tool of the devil. Welcome to the world you built homosexual.
...but dogs didn't evolve because of their environment
They're not really talking about dogs, professor.
The Point is supposed to be that it's obvious dog breeds are different and humans deny other races are, but the point is shit because dog breeds are breeds. Even says so in the name.
>it's dumb because dogs can't talk!
Alright, now that the intellectuals have weighed in, we can go back to the thread.
It's dumb because the entire point doesn't make sense homosexual
>J Doe was right
About what exactly?
>I have no enemies
Watched this in theatres whem it came out and then again only recently and had completely forgotten the ending.
Are you moronic?
Lucky. You got to experience it twice
In that instance it was true. He maneuvered them right into what he wanted
Yeah, nah. David has the opportunity to grieve, and maybe even move forward and find happiness in the future, and John Doe's head got turned into a canoe
David might not have won, but John sure as shit lost
>David might not have won, but John sure as shit lost
Nope. David lost and John won. David gave into John's wishes even after calling him a lunatic who means nothing just minutes before.
>I'm dead with a gaping hole in my skull but I still won because of my Machiavellian 5D chess
Nah
Why didn't he shoot johns kneecaps and keep him alive in agony instead?
john won
Should have shot him in the dick.
>Envy your wiener *bang*
Too big-brained, most male characters never make the connection of a villain being fueled by blue balls
was the implication that: he was going to spend life in jail for the murder = the bad guy won? because i'm pretty sure he would have just got a slap on the wrist for killing him and did a couple years all told at the most. thats well worth it to kill the guy that killed your wife and receive closure on the whole thing
he would just get 2 months max unpaid leave
He would have done jail time, but who knows how much. Definitely not 1st degree murder. 2nd degree at best. Likely some version of manslaughter due to temporary mania due to the extreme circumstances. I bet he does 3-5 years in jail and then like 5 years of probation. Career over of course.
forgot the guys name but he shot the karate instructor who molested his son in the head at an airport back in the 80's and i think he only did 3 years + probation. pretty sure a cop gets something even more lax than that and then gets treated like a god in jail ie tv in cell, phone, actually good food
>Career over of course.
yeah highly doubt that as well. the police look out for each other no way he doesn't land some cushy job with a fat pension somewhere when its all said and done
he actually fricking won, except for his wife dying
>forgot the guys name
Gary Plauchet. I always laugh at the sheriff that was Gary Plauchet's drinking buddy yelling "Why Gary, why!", like it's not super obvious he was the one that told the dad which airport terminal they'd be landing in at what time
>His schizo bullshit means he is allowed to kill your wife
Why was Morgan Freeman's character seen as wise?
if Miller didn't shoot John Doe, he would go to jail forever and only 6 of the 7 sins would have been completed. His whole plan would be ruined.
>if Miller didn't shoot John Doe, he would go to jail forever and only 6 of the 7 sins would have been completed. His whole plan would be ruined.
Amazing how Cinemaphile is so dumb they can't understand this.
>you can't kill him because he wants you to kill him
OP that's actually the most accurate depiction of this trope. Good job.
John Doe was just some lunatic schizo and killing him was the right choice. He didn't win anything
John doe had the sloth guy tied up for a year, and had planned everything long before that, but Brads character had only just relocated to the city when the film/case begun. You're telling me John doe suddenly decided he was envious of Brad midway through the killings and completely forgot about who he was presumably previously envious of enough to kill and do all this shit over originally?
Mills almost caught him, surely that aspect alone made an impression on him.
Probably saw and opportunity and took it. The whole envy thing maybe true, maybe not. It was accordingly to the plan.
As for OP's question, like these anons said
he would probably fine, if he goes to jury big chance he walks away an everyone see his as a hero. Just like that dad that killed the pedo that molested his kid irl.
However, if there is a bad implication is that there are more victims out there. With John Doe dead we will never know who he really was, if he ever had help and how much people he killed.
>we will never know who he really was
like I'd trust anything that comes out of his mouth.
>if he goes to jury big chance he walks away an everyone see his as a hero. Just like that dad that killed the pedo that molested his kid irl.
He's not going to be considered a hero because he's a cop. He's supposed to let the man be arrested, not execute him in front of tons of other cops.
The guy who killed his child's molester? That guy is a hero. He took it upon himself to do what was right and had no professional duty to restrain himself. Mills was basically an opportunist compared to the dad.
Mills and the kid's dad would not get the same prison sentence. The kid's dad would get less time than Mills because Mills took advantage of having the guy basically give himself to Mill's gun and that is definitely not professional, even if his wife was dead.
>He's supposed to let the man be arrested, not execute him in front of tons of other cops.
Indeed, but after the guy killed five people in the most horrific way, then tortured and kille a pregnant woman and presented her head and the fetus in a box to her husband, it's pretty justifiable for anyone to just shoot the bastard.
>it's pretty justifiable for anyone to just shoot the bastard.
any cop knows you can't execute a perp on his knees asking to be killed, you moron. that's a career ender + prison.
Mills fricked up. He should not have given John Doe what he wanted. John Doe literally used him like a puppet.
>woman
a what?
Are you having a stroke? Get out of 4chins and call 911 homie
you kill a lot of pregnant women?
I only have relationships with women.
>women
what is that?
The guy who shot a pedo planned it in cold blood, Mills found out in the moment his wife was raped and murdered, he wouldn't ever see the inside of a jail cell
Makes me wonder who his original pick was going to be or maybe he didn't have one specific in which case Mills was a boon for him that he took advantage of. Mills nearly catching him definitely told him this was a guy to look into, he does say at the end he admired Mills and it seemed genuine.
But my point is, there must have been someone he envied enough to originally plan something horrid for before meeting mills. They also should have found evidence of who he was orignally stalking in his place.
The thing that makes the envy target different is that he personally envied mills, which means there was someone else Jon envied to a psychopathic degree for well over a year, then suddenly changed his mind because "your wife is hot".
It means he either never had a plan and winged it (which is incredibly hacky writing) or there was some other target initially and he had a sudden change of heart, which is also poor writing.
Doe probably had people picked out who were no more special than any of the other killings before then but when Mills nearly caught him and the police now had Doe's entire apartment to comb over it forced him to make a change of plans. Originally he might have thought he would get away with it but now he probably figured he was going to be fricked regardless so he decided to see what Mills life was like and in that moment decided he would be envy and Mills would become his Wrath. Mills wife wasn't an actual deadly sin victim just a murder that Doe perpetrated in order to complete everything, this way Mills would kill him, complete the deadly sins killing and save Doe from a lifetime sentence in prison.
> no more special than any of the other killings
Firstly, some of the victims like pride where clearly specially picked, otherwise there's no guarantee she would have killed herself (thus fulfilling "pride"). There should have been some evidence for what his original plan was for wrath and envy in his apartment if he did just wing it at the last moment.
But like I said even then that reasoning doesn't work for envy since its himself that's guilty of it.
> in that moment decided he would be envy
Which is just terrible writing. There was also no way he would know that mills would become fulfill wrath. You don't do all this meticulous planning for years, torture and killing, just to completely gamble it all at the last moment and just "decide" to be envious.
>Mills wife wasn't an actual deadly sin victim just a murder that Doe perpetrated in order to complete everything, this way Mills would kill him, complete the deadly sins killing and save Doe
Im well aware of the plot anon.
> You don't do all this meticulous planning for years, torture and killing, just to completely gamble it all at the last moment and just "decide" to be envious
There’s nothing to suggest he didn’t have two others in mind You don't do all this meticulous planning for years, torture and killing, just to completely gamble it all at the last moment and just "decide" to be envious for Envy and Wrath though, possibly high profile celebrities or politicians who in some murder/suicide thing would have drawn massive Western interest in it and his work complete. All total head cannon I admit but fun to play around with.
In this case he actually did make Spacey win since he wanted to die and wanted to bring down a person who was his exact opposite to make his psycho point.
Pitt's character would have won if he held the trigger, beat the shit out of him then sent Spacey to prison for the rest of his life to get gang-raped in the ass but no he just didn't have the impulse control after finding out what was in the box.
they win a trip to hell.
I feel bad but the way he cries by doing these weird jerky transitions between anger and crying is hilarious I can't stop keking. Still fricked, great movie.
I really hate his acting in that scene, really ruins the mood for me. Pitt is a bad actor, Freeman carries that movie. The fricking extras did a better job than him.
Fun fact, the guy who made/supplied the wiener knife thing is the guy who shot Brandon Lee who felt so guilty after he went into hiding for ages
That's not very fun
I… feel bad now.
That's the beauty of the movie in the last line. Somerset sees everything that happens and even though he's a cynic he's not broken.
The world is a beautiful place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part.
>The world is a beautiful place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part.
dude! that IS the last line of the movie!
Who gives a shit
>I’m Batman.
>If you kill the mentally unhinged serial killer who raped, murdered and tortured a bunch of people, you are no different from him
Does it bother you to know you breathe the same air as people who unironically believe this?
It bothers me that I breathe the same air as people who don't.
>If you kill the mentally unhinged serial killer who raped, murdered and tortured a bunch of people, you are no different from him
that's not the point of what happened.
nobody is saying Mills is the same as John Doe. It's just that John Doe actually won and Mills actually lost because John Doe got what he wanted in the end and Mills lost his wife, career and is probably going to prison for a short while only to come out alone and looking for something else to do while people are discussing John Doe's work in pop culture and history...forever.
>you are no different from him
That's not the point, dumbass
John Doe DID win tho. Not killing him would have ruined his entire plan.
Paltrow just said on hot ones they made a replica of her head to show in the box and even.though it was supposedly never included, she said her head is visible for like a single frame.so it does appear in the movie super fast. Can anyone confirm?
Yeah it's one of those 'blink and you missed it' editing to imply Mills' mind snapping.
You don't see her head in the box. An image of her appears for a frame right before Mills shoots, but it isn't her severed head, it's just a photograph.
>if you rescue him from the cave, he dies
>and then your honor the defendant cold-bloodedly shot him in the head right after he learned that the sadistic serial killer mr doe had brutally murdered and decapitated his pregnant wife!
In reality the DA wouldn't even bring up charges against the dude and he'd be hailed as a hero. John Doe was white after all
The DA would have to bring up charges because cops cant just kill people who are on their knees asking to die, no matter what they do. It would be a lesser charge but a charge for sure. Somerset was right because he understood John Doe while Mills had no grasp of what John Doe was doing because as he said, Mills was a simple man.
John Doe took advantage of a simple man who had no impulse control. He knew Mills would do it. He knew Mills better than Mills could ever know him.
>heh heh i knew i would do something so heinous that you would kill me... all of my female true crime fans are going to be so impressed by this
So what? Am I a genius mastermind if I "manipulate" the state into executing me with capital punishment if I commit a murder?
>He knew Mills better than Mills could ever know him.
Young hot-headed guy with a gun kills guy that murdered his family, wow! Keikaku my shit senpai!
know your enemy
And use that you kill them
do I?
btw
>if you kill him he wins
bullshit
>you are your greatest enemy
>have a nice day
>enemy loses
Ukraine unironically thinks this
>speaking for an entire country
that's interesting
So what was in the box?
ladypenis
Se7en is fricking dumb
>lol I envied your wife or whatever, even though there's nothing in the movie to demonstrate this
>oh you killed me for murdering and beheading her, lol you're guilty of wrath
John Doe was a hack fraud
>guilty of wrath
>gets slap on the wrist and 5 months probation
Being outsmarted by se7en is just sad
If my wife and unborn child are murdered, I really don't care if some lunatic dies thinking he won.
>JUST killing a lunatic while he choped your prego wifes head off
homie you make him bleed and watch through his fallen out eye balls of the sockets
In this situation yes, the winning move here would be to make him spend the rest of his life sharing a cell with a psychotic serial rapist and the complete knowledge that his plan was a failure.
>If you kill your enemies, they win
>They don't kill the enemy
>Enemy turns the tables
>Enemy kills them
>Enemy wins
The movie was incredibly stupid but I won't deny laughing uncontrollably for a week.
he did let him win though lol. if he didn't kill him, then john doe would have seethed in jail for the rest of his life