I think this is the episode that really soured me on the show. It seems like it's going to teach a brat like Louise a lesson she should learn, 'Sometimes we have to be around people we don't like. Deal with it.' But instead the episode frames it like she's in the right to destroy something that actually brings her father happiness just because she can't tolerate it.
That's why I hate Bob's as a whole 90% of the time Bob is the whipping boy and learns a lesson for daring to try. The show is just torture porn and feels like its a jab at hardworking people that are genuine and try.
>Bob fails even though he gives it his all or gets punished for having blinders on and being autistic
>everyone else can be buttholes and lazy usually win in the end.
It's a miserable show at time and you realize Bob is raising a bunch of future losers or sociopaths. They are never corrected or told to be chill
>
those are legit complaints, but it had a good ending and the music was great.
keep in mind what year it is. by modern standards, he's amazingly respectful to men. he works hard and is competent and capable. We have to take what we can get, until we can take back a little more. Don't let them tear us apart by it not being perfect right away.
I guess but hey, I just ain't a fan. I get your point though it's one of those things where I do despise the sadness that is pussified dads. But that wasn't my point it was more that it's always been a lot of bob has to lose type shenanigans.
But I mean is it? The series basically says that no matter how hard you work life and your family will frick you over. I genuinely hate bob's family know it's just my preference but it's overly depressing and the family is so annoying. They just frick him over and he does nothing not even parenting the kids, and his wife also fricks him over with her autist bs.
Yep, linda kind of sucks what soured me to her was the baseball episode. She actively took something of bob's and sold it, then refused to accept a scam as a scam and actively lost her family 100s of dollars just to be right. She's a terrible mother and fricks bob over almost as much as the kids.
You aren't wrong but I actually like logan as in the end Louise is such a brat I want her to get bullied someone has to teach her a lesson. Also again the thing was Bob was getting something for once and a good kid if they love their parent would just accept it and be done. It really was more louise antagonizing logan like most logan episodes. She actively refused to just look the other way she barely worked either so who cares if logan doesn't.
Actually it's funny they apparently liked the ship as a joke back in the day, but then times changed and they didn't want to get canceled. So they tried to erase it and all their jokes about it.
It's the American Dream.
The PURSUIT of happiness.
Imagine being bob learning your wife left your 9 year old daughter to play with huge gardening shears because she's mad at some other mom.
He didn’t just hire some guy Louise didn’t like, he hired a bully she had history with. Logan and her mom were c**ts and Bob’s family didn’t deserve to be stuck with them.
And she didn’t even cut them by the end.
Logan and his mom maybe c**ts but you know who else are c**ts? Louise and Linda.
Glass fricking houses.
Yeah but they're c**ts in their own spaces.
You kidding?
It's basically King of the Hill but without any likeable characters and if Hank never got karmic wins.
Actually you're exactly right anon, perfect example. Really because we hate on Peggy as being a psycho but she has her moments and usually cares but she's like the worst of the show. But they make all the characters work and they have Similar dynamics. Like I hate teddy he's worst bill we know exactly why bill is bill, and he's punished for being bill at times.
Lol goddamn you really anon, now I can't unsee Bob as modern koth frick. Like it's basically what koth would be if hank wasn't allowed to be ......well a man. hank may have been wrong sometimes and bested but his hard work usually paid off or he usually learned how to cope with a changing world. But Bob's is like if hank was a pussy that got bullied by everyone around him and never got a win like almost ever.
Also yeah even the kids are better as they have more morals and are fun to watch. They grow a lot and can be right as well but they don't own the parents.
>I feel we can now just look at each part of Bob's and compare who each character is in Koth and how they are done better by miles kek.
I've watched every episode of Koth, and while it might not be my favorite show, Hank is one of my favorite characters of all time.
I love Koth definitely a top tier show, I get it not being everyone's fave mostly because it's more of a comedy. But yeah hank is one of the last good badass fathers, his sons in trouble he doesn't run he'll look a guy twice his size in the face and be ready to fight. It's why we love him he maybe flawed but hank is a good guy and usually is the voice of reason.
Is it weird that I dislike the Belchers more than the Griffins?
Don't get me wrong, I can understand why someone wouldn't like Family Guy or its characters, but for some reason, episodes like this, Christmas in a Car, and the Black Garlic episode pisses me off more than any Family Guy episode.
I thought Black Garlic was fine. Gene fricked up but he spent the entire episode trying his best to focus and make up for it
And even though Bob lost the competition, he made friends with that celebrity chef and they temporarily got a bit of buzz and more customers
That was a win for Bob for once
That's a lot of reason why I'd say Black Garlic is an example of how the kids, Gene especially, should be written. They're weirdos. They're flawed. They kind of screw things up. But they don't MEAN to. And when they do they're quick to try and set things right. That's a good comedy character.
They're "Scrubs weird" though, not Weird weird
"Quirky" as Disney writers do nowadays
>And even though Bob lost the competition, he made friends with that celebrity chef and they temporarily got a bit of buzz and more customers
Most importantly, Jimmy Pesto got dead last.
>Don't get me wrong, I can understand why someone wouldn't like Family Guy or its characters
Well that's sort of the thing. The Griffins for whatever you think of them aren't supposed to be liked. They're supposed to be horrible. That's kind of the joke. The Belchers are meant to be more sympathetic or likable. The show wants you to think they're decent folk so when t hey don't act like it and the show insists or suggests otherwise it's more glaring.
Literally anytime the show tells you that Linda is a good mother.
I can see it but I guess it's because the griffins have never been more than they are. They are buttholes and the belchers are portrayed as a nice family when they are all annoying and horrible I swear Bob is the only one I even remotely like and you feel bad for him. The rest get away with murder, you could also say it's because of the massively difference in their world's. Griffins aren't trying to be nice or wholesome and the belchers are supposed to be more grounded and story focus.
Eps that piss me off are like the Linda letting Bob be harassed by her schizo sister and laughing because he's uncomfortable. Really Gale episodes in general they aren't fun and not realistic we all have awkward family members but we leave them alone. We don't let them do whatever at the expense of the family and our finances.
>also I prefer a more appealing art style over the slightly chaotic vibe of bobs with tons of hair and awkward shapes.
I hate that episode too. I also dislike it when it and other adult cartoon shows throw out their try hard "emmy" episodes, like the Amelia Airheart or Rudi's parents episodes.
Yeah, the kids (Gene especially) and Linda come off as obnoxious. The only time I really like Linda, is when she jumps in to defend Bob, like the water balloon episode.
>earhardt episode
last new one i watched, will never watch that season or the movie again. this is a 12-season show from now on. i can't even begin to say how much that pissed me off.
QRD?
>'Sometimes we have to be around people we don't like. Deal with it.'
But Logan wasn't needed. It'd be one thing if they actually needed another employee and Logan was the only option. Bob wasn't wrong for wanting a plot, he was wrong for forcing Linda and Louise to put up with people they don't like and don't respect them. If Logan was actually a good employee, there would be room for Louise to learn a lesson, but all he did was slack off and he even got employee of the month. Like the episode blatantly spelled out that Bob was prioritizing plants over his actual baby.
>But instead the episode frames it like she's in the right to destroy something that actually brings her father happiness just because she can't tolerate it.
But it doesn't. She even says it wouldn't be right for her to destroy the plants.
It was a very feminist-heavy episode.
Well to be fair they do need another employee and Logan was in the process of turning Bob's Burgers into a popular teen hangout.
There wasn't anything to suggest Logan was actually making things better. That's why Bob giving him employee of the month was the final straw, it's something he had never done and he only did it to make Cynthia happy.
Yeah, I agree this episode was still in the "bad things happen to Bob JUST BECAUSE, OKAY?" era of the show, but the real source of the problem was Cynthia.
>There wasn't anything to suggest Logan was actually making things better
I'd argue differently, there was more foot traffic when he was there with both teenage boys and girls.
Even Tina was miffed by the employee of the month thing. It was a bad move all around.
She should've wanted it more then.
Tina is a bad employee. Bob loves her but she's terrible.
Tina is a bad employee but also probably his best one and I am counting Linda there too.
>B-But she ran the restuarant effectively that one time!
Then why doesn't she do that every time then?
Isn't Linda being a net negative for the diner in reviews of it a running gag? I feel like there's been multiple instances where there was a review of the restaurant that called out the service as being much worse than the food.
I do distinctly remember that bit, I think for the Go-mercial episode.
It's not just Linda
The kids frick around in the restaurant all the time and make customers uncomfortable
At first it started out as kids being kids but now it feels practically intentional.
I always took any "poor service" comment as referring to the kids fricking around all the time. Linda is quirky and sometimes gets customers roped into Teddy's bouts of depression, but she's a great hostess.
Cynthia is a better mom then Linda.
wasn't the 'teen hangout' blatantly told that the teens weren't buying anything, just taking up sitting space?
Right and that is entirely Linda's fault for not collecting payment because she's too busy beefing with Cynthia.
Anon, if they aren't buying anything, there's no payment to collect. Linda couldn't collect payment from paying customers, but the teens weren't actually buying anything, they were just loitering.
Bob should have stuck with having the Tabletop teens and the Wi-Fi. Now they'd have a solid base to build on creating a hangout with actual paying customers.
Linda fricked that up with her being as bad as the kids wanting attention from the customers.
Don't forget serving dinner on Valentines Day. Or selling breakfast or craft beers
They occassionally manage to make decent money, but it becomes too much work for Bob and the family so they don't keep it up. And Bob refuses to hire more help
And then they complain that they don't make enough money and can't afford to give their kids a decent life
And when his Millionaire Friend invested making it a Tiki theme.
>Or selling breakfast or craft beers
That one was more of a legal issue.
But you think a man interested in his restaurant earning a profit would try to clear those legal issues up.
They could find another distributor, they have a liquor license
And if anything they also learned that there is a market for daily fresh made bread and early breakfasts
Just like there's a market for serving dinners on busy nights like Valentines.
But they can't effectively tap into any of these markets with only 2 full time staff
>the teenagers are not buying anything and just loitering
frankly this is the reason I'm tired of Bob's Burgers.
Just 10 fricking years of this.
Again, so what? Even if he's not needed, having him around gives her dad access to one of the few things in life that brings him actual joy. Just suck it up and ignore him, for the sake of your dad.
It's even only two weeks too.
A 9-year-old shouldn't have to put up with her teenage bully for her dad's hobby. Cynthia was the problem, not Louise.
>the problem is with Cynthia.
So let's ignore the fact that it's Bob's Business and Louise has zero say of who gets to work there or not, even then I fail to see how Cynthia would be the problem here.
He's clearly only doing it because she keeps reacting. If the just ignores it he'd get bored.
Are we supposed to pretend that Louise wasn't nearly about sensitive about Logan the last time he showed up too?
I hate how it's over a fricking idiom. Bob called his tomatoes his babies and somehow that's the thing that actually crossed the line.
I often think about where the line between genuine sentimentality and saccharine emotional manipulation really is. So many shows try to pull a mother Simpson or a Fry's dog and it never works. Even later Futurama attempts at sentimentality like with Fry and his Dad/Mother just feeling like pale echos of the one with his brother. They'll often meet many of the same beats and elements but it just becomes obvious when it's vacuous reaches for audience feels. You'll see bad shows try to get sold as GOOD AGAIN because of one of this cheap attempts, like there was this Halloween episode of the Simpsons where Lisa gets scared and starts clinging to a toy she had as a kid and I remember people saying it was good writing but it was forced it didn't feel genuine. And I guess that's where the truth is. Mother Simpson and Jurassic Bark had Homer and Fry act like they always do just from perhaps a different angle. Nobody is written to have traits they didn't before, nobody regressed to let the story happen. It was just about having a nice moment once in a while.
>I often think about where the line between genuine sentimentality and saccharine emotional manipulation really is.
Vulnerability, which is more then tinkly background music.
Early season Bob and Linda were relatable failures.
And Bob would punch back on a lot of things
That's my main gripe with present Bob's Burgers. At some point the writers just saw it best for Bob to take every shit deal thrown his way with a mumble and a shrug. I can tolerate toning down the adult jokes, but what I can't stand is the show's voice of reason being such a punching bag with no comedic potential. You need conflict for good comedy. Imagine if Squidward stopped being sassy with customers, or if Rick stopped butting heads with Jerry, even passive-aggressively. Making Bob such a soft-spoken sad sack whose family walks all over him is LAME.
Its weird seeing that clip after a good while, that reallu felt like bobs foundation as a character
He might actually be running a struggling shop literally only to try to spite jimmy pesto
They missed a golden opportunity to have Louise and Logan bonding over their prank wars and completing the Louise Vs Logan triology of "Ear-sy Rider", "Mother-Daughter lazer razor", and this one.
I really believe they saw the shipping stuff and doubled-down on Logan being a bully with the cantaloupe episode.
Was it really that much of a problem?
For me it was the episode where the family was ok with tina being a bawd
she's a woman, woman can do whatever they want and men's feelings don't matter
they didnt sing, so good ep.
The latest Christmas episode was so fricking annoying. It really felt like a spiritual successor to Christmas in the Car. Linda was unbearable with wanting her own tree. This episode really highlights how annoying these characters have become. Frick this show.
So who's been Flanders the most? I'd argue Tina.
It's Louise.
And Linda, Linda is more her sister now than her Sister. Usallly.
Fuuuuck, you're right. I'd still do the absolute nastiest things to Linda, but she really has devolved into a second Gayle for the most part. What makes it worse is that Linda actually has the authority to enable the kids and Gayle's questionable behavior.
>I'd still do the absolute nastiest things to Linda
real
Tina went from most autistic Belcher to least Autistic Belcher.
You know I could even deal with all the flanderization shit but the biggest problem facing the show is that it's just so boring. It's boring. Episodes aren't about conflicts and shenanigans gone awry, they're just characters talking about nothing, repeating their points and just being noise. Have you ever hung out with a niece or a nephew or just some friends kid, and they tell you a joke and regardless of if the joke is funny or not they keep just calling attention to it going did you hear the joke I just told you?! DID YOU! I JUST TOLD YOU A JOKE! That's the show.
You divided the production talent base across multiple shows. That was never going to go well.
In English please.
You had the core producing staff split between multiple shows and in in the case of Central Park becoming obsessed with making a Musical and the story falling apart.
The movie was like a litmus test.
Is this some kinda weird thing?
The idea that Bob hired someone like Logan to work at the restuarant quid pro quo for a plot in the community garden is actually a divisive one in the fandom, where people evem siding with Bob or Louise.
Bob's Burgers is nothing if not weird
It used to be at least.
Exactly. Bob's is nothing now. They still come up with some charming stories, sure, but the humor has gotten fricking awful and the character assassination drags a lot of it down. I basically only watch it out of a sense of obligation at this point. I've been with it since Day 1.
>the character assassination drags a lot of it down.
No Belcher should be a fricking introvert, why did the show ever assume that avoiding social interactions is good comedy.
I only watch because Linda is bae
Somebody pointed out to me how in early seasons Bob and his family were the town weirdos but in later seasons they're end up being the least interesting people in town.
Louise gave as good has she got.
That's why it worked.
At some point they thought they'd turn Louise into some super criminal mastermind. Even her lock picking early on was really dumb but it got so much worse.
That's not the problem with louise's writing.
Louise needs to her little girl interaction with actual female actors playing them quota up.
And that's not just me saying that but Kristen Schaal herself.
I quite agree.
She needs more interaction with her peers.
And not just in her usual "I'm not like the other girls" type either but actively engaging and having fun with them.
I find it so pretentious that Louise can't just be friends with other little girls, she has to be dragged kicking and screaming like in that soccer episode.
I could never figure out why Louise hated the idea of a slumber party in the first place when a sleepover lets her do everything she likes to do like eating junk food, watching scary movies, and of course staying up till midnight.
be open up to new experinces with new people is such a better message then you're a special snowflake who needs other special snowflakes to be your friend , who will only show up two more times in ten years.
>Louise not going monster hunting with Jessica and 5th grade Megan
>Louise not selling thundergirl cookies with Harley
>Louise not playing soccer with Jodie and Maya
>Louise not enjoying a pixie promenade with Millie and Abby aka Mabel
>Louise not going to pool parties with Kaylee Morganstern and Chloe Barbash
Just all the shit Louise could be doing but isn't.
It's like she doesn't WANT to connect with her age group.
Is she, perhaps, scared?
>no wonder no one likes women-Louise Belcher
I'm thinking it's internalized misogyny as the boy band episode, the sleepover episode, and the pixie episode shows that Louise literally just think lesser of girls.
To me it's flabbergasting how little the writers seem to be interested to challenging this viewpoint and almost to implicitly support the idea that every little girls besides Louise is an uninteresting cookie cutter sheep.
>Is she, perhaps, scared?
Scared of what, being judged? Caring for people outside her immediate family? Having too much fun?
The pixie episode does get into the idea that Louise is self-conscious of how she isn't performing femininity right; though that sentiment does seem to exist only in that episode.
>best we could is Louise whining about it
Bob and Tina are the only decent people in the belcher family, despite the first one being spiteful as full and the second close being kinda close to become a sexual offender. Gene at best is neutral