Let us go through the Mines of Moria!

i don't think it's that specific - i think oaths work that way because they worked that way in the faerie stories and old legends tolkien was writing in the style of
that's just sort of what people believed i guess, and that belief system comes through

i meant that i don't think the world was designed with gollum in mind

Sauron just got beaten over and over huh? Just kept coming back for more. It was only after all the stronger people had left and only weaklings remained that he finally had a real chance

They answered to their captain Gothmog and directly to Morgoth. Sauron, while being higher ranked than any balrog, wasn't really a part of the equation.

I'm just reading FoTR with my son now (up to after where they peave Lorien now), so I'm not an expert. But before they go into Moria, they express concern about spies of "the Enemy," including animals like the birds. I don't remember id it said anywhere that the orcs of Moria were servants of Sauron or Saruman or in alleigance with them. This page says that Sauron had originally sent the orcs there.
https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Moria-orcs

But it does sound least like the balrog was cooperating with the orcs. I think some have the idea that the balrog was a free agent that only served itself, and I think the movie (which I haven't seen in 20 years) might have had the orcs run away when the balrog came, but this picture seems more true to the book

https://www.studio54.co.uk/gallery/tolkien-gallery/
seems to be by Paul Raymond Gregory

>This page says that Sauron had originally sent the orcs there.
I think if you go just by the book, there is no explanation of why those orcs are there. It's easy enough to imagine they've just been living there for some centuries, and perhaps would join with Sauron if given the chance.
But that being said there is more lore than just what we see in the book, some of it actually written by Tolkien himself, but there is also plenty of lore of dubious quality.

>gandalf the fool
You said it yourself.

>if my enemy kills me, I win!

>take norse paganism and shoehorn in all your israelite on a stick desert religion like some sort of Sonichu abomination
>pretend it's your own original content
Tolkien was always a hack.

lewischuds how will we recover

All the Dwarves names, for example
Elves, as a concept, aswell.

I said as a concept, anon. But Tolkein Dwarves are literally just Norse dwarves
I'm not the angry pagansperg that post was replying too btw, I'm just saying

muh REAL paganism was already distorted by monks transcribing all of the legends
Also if he ripped off anything it was Finnish mythology

>Caradhras
Certain death
>Mine
Goblins and some balrog b***h he can slap with Glamdring

Im convinced its dead internet theory all over.
I mean how many thousand lotr threads have we had over the years?
How many times have someone claimed that the hobbits turn invisible because the ring bolsters their sneakiness? Every thread there are people asking these absolute entry level questions.
I simply dont buy those turnover rates where a new batch of tards visit these threads every day. Yes the thought has occurred that they are just engagement baiting but there are much easier ways to do that

>so what does the ring actually do
>why didnt they fly
>Why didnt Sauron guard the entrance
We need a sticky or a pasta that covers enough of these dumbass inventions, they ruin all interesting discussions when all energy is directed toward the paste-eaters
I would welcome flame wars over who Gil-Galads father was at this point

balrogs are maiar, just like sauron, and gandalf

Le lmao because we arent pulling shit out of our ass when discussing lotr lore in a lotr thread.
Ok buddy

There are 3 main theories, that is the best one. Gonna cry?

Dragons were not maiar homosexual, morgoth creates them only during the first age

See what I mean?
Bait or moronation, dont know dont care.

"It has been said that dragon-fire could
melt and consume the Rings of Power, but there is not now
any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough;
nor was there ever any dragon, not even Ancalagon the Black,
who could have harmed the One Ring, the Ruling Ring, for
that was made by Sauron himself."

Oh no, you made me spend 15 sec finding the paragraph and pasting it here. Gonna cry?

okay Mister Im-Gonna-Deconstruct-That

>Is gandalf an expert on the first age
Yes. He has lived through it all. He predates it.

>Then how did Gandalf slay a Balrog?
You should read about my boy Ecthelion.
>There Gothmog lord of Balrogs beat down Egalmoth, but Ecthelion came inbetween despite being pale as steel. During the duel, Ecthelion was wounded in the hand and lost his sword. Gothmog then was about to deliver a blow with his whip when Ecthelion jumped and drove the spike of his helmet into Gothmog's body. Twining his legs with the enemy's, both fell into the Fountain of the King. Gothmog died there with Ecthelion, sank because of his steel armor.
https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Ecthelion

Sauron was as powerful as he was mostly due to the dark sorcery he learned from Morgoth, and he is an exceedingly dangerous manipulator, but in terms of raw power the Balrogs surpass him.

>Sauron was the most powerul of all Maias
Headcanon. He was a very powerful Maia, but not necessarily the most powerful. Eonwe, Osse, Melian to name a few were on par. Sauron is kind of a b***h actually when you consider his combat track record.
>Not even gothmog the Great would stand a chance
Come on. Gothmog spearheaded pretty much every assault during the first age along with Glaurung while Sauron was cowering in his tower fricking his werewolf servants.

Sauron was the most powerful of Aulë's maia, but not confirmed to be the most powerful of all of the maia. Sauron's strongest powers are his craftsmanship and his trickery.

What about Bakshi's balrog?
This movie is objectively not good at all but I think I've watched it so many times "as a joke" that I've memed myself into liking it for real

the books were popular before the film was. The hobbit hobbit sold 100 mill copies and the tolken estate says lotr sold 150 mill copies (harder to figure out exact sales numbers for the lotr because it was sold in 1, 3 and 7 book formats vs the 1 book hobbit)

Zestrog

Söyrog

this scene is so fricking cool

I'd love a story about someone exploring these deep caverns and finding out about the things that lurk in them

Where did they even land? I'm legit questioning this. Ins't this some bottomless pit?

There's a giant lake, big enough to be a sea or an ocean even, presumably full of unknowable and abominable horrors, below the mountains that Gandalf and the 'rog fell into. From there they climbed back up to the top of the mountains, fighting the entire way until Gandalf finally smeared his ass across the rocks and died shortly after

Jackson's Balrog is so fricking cool it hurts, but the irony is that he created a far more book accurate Balrog when showing Sauron in the Hobbit. A dreadful, man shaped demon of flame and shadow.

>You still have to buy expansions, quest zones, individual quests and pay for your subscription
You don't need to do any of that.
If I just want to frick around in the game for 5-10 hours I'm sure the free version will do nicely.

That sucks, thanks for the heads-up.

This map

isn't from the atlas.