Let's settle this: Did she do nothing wrong, or everything wrong?
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 Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
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Let's settle this: Did she do nothing wrong, or everything wrong?
Let's settle this: Did she do nothing wrong, or everything wrong?
|
Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
|
She needed more backstory.
It wasn't enough for her to be mistreated by her boss for the gross overreaction. Something terrible must have happened to her by predators.
Is the obvious systemic oppression not motivation enough?
Where was it anon? Sure she was put down a little by her boss, but where was that pain in the movie? We saw a hustler, a mob boss and work cattle, dogs and cats. Sure, but where was the beggar? The broken, the damaged? The real oppression wasn't present in that movie. Even Nick despite being bullied by his peers for being a predator in the camp was not done in by the strong, it was done by the weak. To a predator. I think the problem is, none of you understand how pain really works, you are all sheltered in a cocoon of your own lies and if you stay there long enough, it will stifle you, and if you are not lucky it might kill you. Where is your art and soul in all of this?
The movie implies that there was oppression in the past, just like real life when the movie came out.
Predators also happen to hold pretty much all positions of power, from the government to the police.
>Predators also happen to hold pretty much all positions of power
You mean like the Water Buffalo police chief. Government agent Sloth. Popstar Gazelle.
>The lion was mayor!
And he clearly had no ill intent. He was just dealing with a spineless coward secretary who never stood up for herself.
>Government agent Sloth. Popstar Gazelle.
A singer and a DMV employee are not positions of power.
>a DMV employee are not positions of power.
Someone's never been to the DMV
Ohoho. I bet you I could write you an origin story that could make your skin crawl. What if, Dawn was not actually from Zootopia originally. What if, she was a spy with a tragic origin to tell? You ever wonder "How" a little sheep gets eyes that big or wide anon? They usually have slits for eyes like goats. How about I tell you a tale of lambs, of wolves... and monsters...
NOW THAT'S MORE LIKE IT!
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Zootopia 2: Bellwether's Origins
She comes from Zoomalia which is a vicious predator-run hellscape with no functioning government.
This is good. It even has the word "mal" in it both for "bad" and for "animal".
However I was thinking, Slav. Maybe an annexed country that got taken down by some evil corrupt preds. Dawn Bellwether is actually Dawnia Bellarusiakov.
>Systemic Oppression
...
She knew her worth and pretended to act stupid and fricking naive to get people to think she was a harmless sheep. She acted like a sheep.
Rather than acting like her worth, standing up for herself, demanding more, like,... Oh, I don't know, the main character, Judy? She stayed in a submissive and complacent role to carry out a fricking evil plan to frick up people based upon their species. Or race.
And?
And nothing. It's the perfect allegory and it's why it's such a good Disney movie. In real life, women, are often paid less than men because studies have shown women act more submissive. Men will walk into an office, demand what they are worth, and often negotiate more. Likewise, people who don't plot and scheme and make an evil plan to overthrow another species of peoples than themselves can succeed, like Judy.
Based
I mean, it's completely true. The lion is a typical male boss who completely ignored her, and she played it up by acting submissive and goofy and clumsy when she actually was not. She was well coordinated and very goal focused. Her whole vendetta is questionable beyond her just being a fricking villain.
Right. Which is the opposite of Judy, who never once backed down and despite her small stature, her attitude and tenacity got her where she was. Despite the fact she was literally dealing with creatures 10 times her size. Which is, another allegory for men/women in the work force. Judy had to work harder due to her status (species) and limitations but she was just as capable once she got there and earned everyone's respect.
Sheep b***h could have done the same thing and maybe even been the boss herself.
So the whole movie is an allegory about the laziniess and the self-inflicted victim status of women? Kind of based.
It is about women, first and foremost.
It's about initiative and drive, second.
It shows two women who are pretty much diametrically opposed in motive and operating style. One stays oppressed and plays into it, the other, refuses, until she is literally at her lowest point and returning home gives her insight. It's a bit of a metaphor about how she can't forget about where she's from or the peoples she comes from ,even if she moves to Zootopia.
One is a weak acting woman who uses the naive act to fool everyone around her, which is also kind of powerful. But in the wrong way. One is a strong and resilient person who has to be beaten down again and again to actually fall, who rises back up instantly.
One gets what she wants, the other, does not.
In that sense, Bellwether did EVERYTHING wrong.
No you fricking Black person gayot wanna be intellectual, women get paid less then men COLLECTIVELY, because most women prefer to work less dangerous jobs then men, these jobs pay more because they're DANGEROUS
God
No shit, they didn't include the dangerous jobs element in the study.
That's only one reason women get paid less. The other is because they don't speak up for themselves as much, even to other women. Like the study was even counting women with women bosses.
>It wasn't enough for her to be mistreated
So in short modern villains are not allowed to be petty and selfish?
Less is more - and this is even more true for good villains.
Less is more in science anon.
Less is less in engineering.
More is more in business.
But THIS is SHOW BUSINESS.
More is... so much more!
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She's a shitty last second twist villain
It's the fact that her mistreatment was so casual by the mayor as if it were routine, and this builds up resentment and hatred over time for her.
I mean there's an argument as to how much of Dawn's schtick was an act. But Lionheart's treatment clearly wasn't.
That would just make her hate him more than his constituency. She would have poisoned him or something. The whole, murder spree on half the city was a gross overreaction that can only be born of something equally horrifying.
>rape
No rape.
There's several fanfictions with this premise, it comes down to her getting a snubbed her whole lige because of her status as a lamb
I don't know, but I'm tired of normies saying that she's a bad villain.
>Predator and prey defined by Disney: obligate carnivores and herbivores
>Predator and prey defined by nature: a relationship where one animal eats another.
Kind of implies it's still happening somewhere. I think we should hear her side.
>Predator and prey defined by Disney: obligate carnivores and herbivores
>Predator and prey defined by nature: a relationship where one animal eats another.
I don't understand the difference
Some carnivores are eaten by other carnivores.
What are they feeding them?
Fish and birds, which are not sapient in their world.
onions which is why they're all such prissy gays.
No carnivores shouldnt have rights as they literally must kill to stay alive
It seems like there was more there to work with in terms of hints at a deeper back story. But knowing Disney, I'm sure that's as far as that'll go and if she comes back in 2 she'll just be flat evil.
Then again I'm aware I'm biased as I wrote a Bellwether story years ago that went the whole 'history of abuse and familial expectations' route...and I draw a lot of Bellwether smut.
>and I draw a lot of Bellwether smut.
You can't just drop that and move on.
Not much to say. Since writing that fic she sorta became my brand, and she's been a comfort character for me since the early trailers dropped.
You can find my stuff on the usual sites, I think like 100+ of the thousand Bellwether tags are mine.
I'm not sure if I'm allowed to just drop my name or whatever...I don't post a lot on Cinemaphile...just lurk.
I have nothing else to say to you except give you this:
?si=BQ9EIw-2UJpbgSPQ
And give you this:
https://beta.character.ai/chat2?char=N__dJZBjOQkL94fMgR8WSjLMSUBnl0MQQ12hcnLzvng
Yeah I'm gonna beep beep the sheep.
Ah thanks, I've never actually given one of these AI character things a try before. Have given the Bing generator a go though, to varying and sometimes demoralizing results.
she should have shrunke veryone down until they were 1 inch tall
They should turn her into a straightforward villain in the sequel
The twist should be that she was actually right about predators, and Judy has to turn to her for help.
>this origin story
+
>she comes out of prison with a scar on her now glassy right eye
+
>somehow she has fought her way through all the bullying and survived
Birth of a supervillain right there.
>*laughing with a hint of mourning and irony in the dark interrogation room*
>"Did you even know, Judy... Why I actually hate predators?"
You're not allowed to harm her perfect visage in anyway.
This drawing spoiled me the movie plot twist in 2016.
>Despite being 10% of the population, predators commit 50% of the crime in the city
What did she mean by this?
She got caught so she did at least one thing wrong regardless of what you think about the rest.
>Nick, you understand nothing of a prey's infinite potential for cruelty
>"If it's your cruelty Judy, I'd let it happen."
- Nick Wilde, 2016 - 2023
She tried to start a race war for the lols
She had a perfectly good reason to do it.
Sheep israelite allegory uses the predators, white people allegory, as the boogeyman for the "muh oppressed" minority allegories, herbivores.
She shouldn’t have made confessed her plan when there was no reason to and she should have brought her own gun instead of taking one from the heroes.
Is judy evil?
She's just a bit grey
With ewes you lose
You can't just say all sheep look the same.
She wanted the Hopps buns...
Bell Hopps
She wanted to have that carrot
Zootopia 2 will be dark
The bunny will no longer be frickable. They assassinated Lola, Gadget, and pretty much any other frickable character. They'll do it to Judy, too.
Well she'll certainly be written worse that's for sure. Judy at least had flaws in the original movie. Not sure how that slipped through the cracks the first time around.
Anon judy is already a pancake
Her plan really doesn't make much sense without some societal context. Zootopia isn't like Beastars were theres obvious systemic racism and prejudice. Preds and prey mostly got along in the movie before the preds going crazy thing and there didnt appear to be a power imbalance between the two sides.
Disney just tackles real world issies on the surface level without doing any deep diving so they can still sell as many tickets as possible.
We do get the implication there's at least shallow specisim with Judy and Gideon, and I guess how she's perceived in the Police Academy and the ZPD. But compared to something like beastars, where despite them somehow being in a contemporary, civilized society while there's a very real, quantifiable element in all predators where they can snap and eat prey is, the risk doesn't seem as apparent. It definitely needed more context in terms of building that pred/prey racism. And maybe the implication that preds still... predate sometimes. Although there is at least the hint of I guess the pred dominant power structure despite the prey populace if Bellwether is to be taken at face value.
I saw excerpts from the children's book release and that was heartbreaking cause I really though bellwether was cute in the previews. Funny, they delayed the release of the concept art book for a month after the movie, but not those kids books.
>anime gay needs literally every single thing and plot point spelled out for him
Typical.
I'm not defending Beastars. It sucks. The End.
I want to pick her up and cuddle her.
Seconded.
Pic very much related.
do not the nazi sheep
She monologued. How fricking hard is it to not explain your plan to the person that you think is going to die seconds later?
If you've never been in that position, harder than you think.
She wanted to be in charge. She didn't even seem like she hates predators or Lionheart. She just used predators as a means to achieve her goal. There doesn't need to be a tragic back story to make her motivation convincing. If Bellwether thought the city would be better if she was in charge, then that's all she needed to show. But it seemed like she just wanted more power. That's convincing too. Selfishness is always the most convincing motivation for villains.
If she instead took this route, she'd have won.
Why didn't she just kill Nick and frick Judy, is she stupid?
I want her to make me worship and kiss and rub her hooves haha
Poisoning folk with mind altering drugs without their permission is assault, that was pretty bad.