His imaginary normie strawman. Millions of chinks and humans worldwide have read or watched TBP and you dont hear about mass suicides. Its just a redditor bloviating.
Except the literal existential crisis is real with this one, I can see people unironically suicide over it.
>Thinking people will care about some Netflix scifi shit the same way they cared about GOT.
Unless there is rape in the first episode it won't have a female audience
Except the literal existential crisis is real with this one, I can see people unironically suicide over it.
>Halfway in the series it's revealed nothing had any point to it and it was hopeless from the start
Normies will have mental breakdown over this
What's up with homosexuals having a vastly over-inflated opinion about how much people care about their homosexual shit? This is honestly kind of pathetic thinking.
China is barbarous zero sum opportunistic parasites in the same way that russia are insanely durable depressed alcoholic nihilist thieves. They were always that way, but the selection pressure of commie famine made it the defining feature of their civilization instead of just a fun cultural flavor.
>the country that keeps to its own and has had the most successful industrialization in the last 200 years is barbarous >but not anyone exporting and domestically generating systematic poverty and famine and destruction in a mostly literal sense that's civilized
>and has had the most successful industrialization in the last 200 years
They simply copied the West, and learned nothing from the mistakes committed in THEIR industrialization, and even managed further nasty mistakes. Bravo I guess. And they only industrialized so rapidly because Westerners decided to export their factories and environmental holocaust to slave-wage Chinese, it had little to do with Chinese ingenuity or determination.
These are the same dipshits who doomed themselves demographically with a government enforced program to exterminate females, who killed millions through starvation by following the dictates of a 40 IQ lunatic who made Trump look coherent.
Fricking Chinese man, not even once.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>They simply copied the West, and learned nothing from the mistakes committed in THEIR industrialization
genuinely a silly billly
>>the country that keeps to its own
false. tibet, hong kong, nepal, taiwan, myanmar, vietnam, etc
>has had the most successful industrialization in the last 200 years is barbarous
only because of the usa building china up. china isn't responsible for building the advanced parts of its country. it bought foreign expertise with essential slave labor profits
5 months ago
Anonymous
>only because of the usa building china up
the most moronic narrative ever invented
it's like saying america only exists because of the french
or the soviets only industrialized because of john deer
or the english only industrialized because of the italians
anon its not star trek. they can't just open up their viewscreen and say "scan for unknown technological signatures!" and then icons of earth and all the other species pop up.
You can’t hide sand particles on a beach but I bet it’ll take you some time to find one particular sand particle, even if it was letting out a noise.
It'd be more like waving a flashlight in a completely dark surroundings while the other guys have night vision goggles on and actively looking for you but eh
just employ tens of thousands of people to search for decades and you will find it, that is the scale at which civilizations operate that have cheap and easy access to their own solar systems resources.
you can always scale things up. and if you believe your own "dark forest game theory" then they will be willing to throw every resource available at a problem that could threaten their existence
While the Droplet attack is the most kino sequence of the entire series, the moronation of humanity during the run-up is beyond comprehension.
>Yes, let's move our ENTIRE fleet minus two ships to intercept this thing and have everyone line up in a grid. There's no possible way the aliens who can fold super computers into single particles can threaten us.
I know humanity was high on their own supply by that point, but no tactician would ever agree to something so fricking moronical.
Sounds like standard LOGH tactics. These c**ts were just begging for some absolute CHAD to turn up with his fleet formed into a SEMICIRCULAR formation, and offer them ABSOLUTELY ZERO CHANCE OF FRICKING ESCAPE.
You gotta remember, up until the droplet attack we had lost faith, regained faith, then got super wienery. It's the attack itself that clues humanity in on how clueless we actually are. Really only that one admiral had a sneaking suspicion that this was way more lopsided than any earthling can suspect, but he couldn't do anything because muh lockstep bug philosophy which is why you can't take this story out of China.
I am confident in muh ships because they are phallic.
Nobody beats the wiener.
But for real, the west would never settle on remaining or defecting. We'd fight a big ass war until there was no one left to frick or flee. Only bugs would all pick one or the other.
you have to understand it was written by a chink and thus is a reflection of their society. the trisolarans are the endgame of what the chinese would be if they ever reached that magnitude of civilization.
>I love how this series assumes aliens are all paranoid gods constantly nuking each other
The book addresses this though. Things weren't that way until the first morons started using laws of physics as a weapon and limited the universe to 3D with a hard limit of the speed of light. In a world where a radio message of "hello" comes at the same speed as a weaponized asteroid you MUST be paranoid. The third book establishes that there were some beings outside of the collapsed universe-bubble who were peaceful because they weren't confined to the light speed.
Wait, it just ups and goes 'a higher dimensional race broke "reality", because'. So god modes? What's the point then? Sounds like it goes full sci-fantasy.
Dude read the books stop asking dumb questions and making stupid assumptions. The book only explains that there were higher dimensional beings which through war destroyed their dimensions and reduced themselves to lower and lower dimensions, just as how the 3D universe is being destroyed by 3D war.
Not at all, it’s completely in line with string theory and entropy.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Horseshit. It's just dumb make-believe about God-Aliens detonating the universe from being 30 dimensions down to 3. Even Marvel comic readers wouldn't buy into this dumb shit.
5 months ago
Anonymous
If you're thinking about M-Theory with the Branes and the Bulk and all that shit, that's a very preliminary model which may prove to have nothing to do with reality like string theory as a whole
I could end all life on earth as an individual with near-future technology. You can't stop a big rock strapped to a rocket accelerated over 100 years to a fraction of light speed. Nuking every other civilization you meet is 100% the correct move.
>implying aliens wouldn't be smart and cunning enough to abuse and rape out psychologies instead of blowing us up for no fricking reason whatsoever
anon life is a resource
Nahhhh. Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets. observing life is absolutely an intellectual resource, even if just out of curiosity. You would rather observe than destroy. Why would you go up to meerkats just to kick their ass?
Staying hidden is more advantageous than being in the open. Humans are so radically different from apes despite being so damn similar to them. It wouldn't be hard at all for aliens to outplay us like fricking babies.
>Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets.
Why are you talking about a book series you CLEARLY never even read?
5 months ago
Anonymous
I know enough to determine it's moronic.
Dude relativity means that everything has a lag. Can't plan for shit. You see an ant, this ant has already sent an armada towards you to frick in the ass a thousand years ago. Can't plot with a lag like that. Just boom any potential danger.
>relativity
Lol.
We know that the universe can't be both local and real. Information DOES move faster than light.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>I know enough
Clearly not. Since you said >Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets
It’s similar to their hate of Inglorious Basterds which is the closest you can get to Sven Hassel novels in film. If only chuds knew how stupid they were, they could actually achieve their goals lol.
>muh chuds
don't reply to me homosexual
I'm not interested on your culture war one side or the other
5 months ago
Anonymous
Three Body Problem is a liberal series I bet that makes you upset 😉
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Three Body Problem is a liberal series
So you didn't read it either huh?
5 months ago
Anonymous
I did, I particularly enjoyed the final daoist message about protecting nature and the universe and the ultimate embodiment of humanity in Cheng Xin’s struggle to show benevolence to the universe.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Three Body Problem is a liberal series I bet that makes you upset 😉
>humanity literally gets enslaved and forced to move to australia because they elected some woman who believed the trisolarians wouldn't kill us after learning about our culture
There I spoonfed you part of the book plot now you can stop making moronic arguments
No you clearly didn't read anything other than plot summaries
5 months ago
Anonymous
Seething chud moron who can’t handle a based story made by a liberal (which is typical in the art world for obvious reasons).
5 months ago
Anonymous
you already exposed the fact that you didn't read the book
here is your last (You) next time come up with better bait
5 months ago
Anonymous
Kek literally grasping at imaginary straws. Love watching a chud unwravel. Almost as much as I loved reading the best sci fi ever written (Three Body Problem trilogy).
5 months ago
Anonymous
Nothing makes me upset, I am a rock in the river of your mom's pussy juice.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets
Yes. Unless you can simulate life on countless planets in your home basement, you aren't going to be going around and destroying countless planets hosting life randomly. You are going to be studying them, not obliterating them. You may even abuse them, or use them as toys, because there is absolutely -NOTHING- their lessers could do about it. Humans barely perceive a fraction of everything. You can't even explain sight to a blind man. Humans would be piss easy to deal with, WITHOUT violence. We are that pathetic. The humans becoming complacent part of the series is the only good part because it's BELIEVABLE. Humans being unlimited in their advancement is a bad part, though. We have limits, and we are seeing it in real life now.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The human advancement in the book was wholly believable provided you arent an imbecile that thought this was hard scifi just because a chink wrote it. This was just a typical xianxia series with a veneer of scifi.
Dude relativity means that everything has a lag. Can't plan for shit. You see an ant, this ant has already sent an armada towards you to frick in the ass a thousand years ago. Can't plot with a lag like that. Just boom any potential danger.
>anon life is a resource
It's dangerous. The moment you learn about someone sometimes millions of years have passed. They might have already sent a nuke towards you millions of years ago despite you only learning about them at this exact moment. Space is shit.
>massive armada presented for literally no reason >somehow none of them notices this thing accelerating
i like dark forest, but this was one of the dumbest bits in the entire book
>massive armada presented for literally no reason
It’s literally explained to you in multiple chapters what a politically contentious matter first contact becomes and why the multiple fleet nations want to be there at the same time. >somehow none of them notices this thing accelerating
They do. The damage is just done super quick.
Three Body Problem discussions on Cinemaphile have been pretty good so far but I have a feeling that’s ending since polcucks have started to join them now that they know Netflix is producing an adaptation. Looks like this thread is just gonna be them seething over China.
this author thought sixty years was enough for human men to lose all features of masculinity and end up becoming indistinguishable from human women lul
typical chink obsessed with femininity
Mediocre book series only taken seriously because it’s written by a Chinese man and the only hard-ish sci fi praised in decades because the Hugos and publishers have been icing straight white males from the genre
It's hilarious because none of them read the books, probably only read the plot summary on wikipedia or something.
If more people had read the book they would be talking about how the guy creates his own perfect waifu tulpa. Or how immensely based the author is considering almost every single bad thing that happens to humanity is directly caused by woman actions. But of course the wikipedia summary doesn't say this so they don't know
Nice strawman homosexual. The wikipedia summary straight up tells you about the chink b***h right away. Youre just a butthurt fanboy that gets in his feefees when people dont mindlessly ballwash your chinkslop.
It’s similar to their hate of Inglorious Basterds which is the closest you can get to Sven Hassel novels in film. If only chuds knew how stupid they were, they could actually achieve their goals lol.
this author thought sixty years was enough for human men to lose all features of masculinity and end up becoming indistinguishable from human women lul
Mediocre book series only taken seriously because it’s written by a Chinese man and the only hard-ish sci fi praised in decades because the Hugos and publishers have been icing straight white males from the genre
So the three body problem refers to the triple star system in Alpha Centauri right? And how the aliens could not solve it despite their advanced tech. Couldn't they just migrate to another solar system? I guess they attack humans to take over earth but still, I dunno haven't read the books.
>Couldn't they just migrate to another solar system? I guess they attack humans to take over earth but still, I dunno haven't read the books.
This is exactly why they invade Earth.
Here, I'll accurately and briefly summarize the entire series for you so you don't need to waste your time:
Book 1 >Woman hates herself and wants to kill humanity. Man discovers aliens by playing VRChat. A boat sails through that laser trap in Resident Evil.
Book 2 >Chinese man creates a tulpa and falls in love before killing her then uses his government powers to get a waifu and be rich. Hugo Chavez tries to blow up Mercury. Donald Rumsfeld wants to make some kinda suicide squad. Someone decides to shoot a brain at the ayys for the fun of it (this doesn't actually happen in the book but is retconned in the third because there were no original plans to continue the series after this book). Chinese man gets waifu taken away, goes to the future, threatens to kill himself and the ayyys kneel before him Vegeta style, resulting in a new Golden Age for humanity.
Book 3 >Dumb woman gets into power, IMMEDIATELY, I mean literally within one second of gaining power, dooms the world and turns humanity into slaves. Ayys discover their love of anime waifus and make one to rule humanity. Astronauts decide to kill the ayys and humanity. The universe realizes 3D is pig disgusting and return to glorious 2D ayynime. Brain shot at ayys actually loved Dumb woman and tells her about 2D anime time after the Ayys decide to resurrect him for who knows what reason. Some guys decide they're just going to create their own universes with blackjack and hookers because the current universe is too lame.
Not exaggerating. You now no longer have to read any of the books. There is no book 4 no matter what anyone tells you and book 3 is objectively the worst in the series.
>uses his government powers to get a waifu and be rich.
Jesus, someone who never read the books giving a plot summary of the book. Blind leading the blind here
>uhh yes, i need you to find a waifu that meets these EXACT criteria, it's part of the plan bro >yes, i also need a giant mansion in the mountains and lots of expensive wine to woo her >NOOOO YOU CAN'T JUST TAKE AWAY MAI WAIFU AND SEND THEM TO THE FUTURE IN ORDER TO FORCE ME TO ACTUALLY WORK!!
Yes. There are however accurate predictions about feminization of men in a very technologically advanced and comfortable society that have nothing to do with the alien conflict.
It is, you’re assuming things based off incomplete information and no understanding of context and narrative. I’m not spoonfeeding you the entire story and subject matter.
There is in the sense that the future language of the world is an amalgamation of chinese and english.
But at no point the book spouts china nationalistic crap. Not that it would make any sense to do from the second book onward anyway
>the future language of the world is an amalgamation of chinese and english
This has to be the most implausible aspect, even more than the physics.
Those are highly incompatible languages (leaving aside Singlish which is just sticking "lah" or "leh" at random on the end of english sentences)
Only to gabble to each other in their squalid homeland. They never try to use it to talk to foreigners. It's completely unsuited to discussing advanced topics.
It wasnt critical at all and you’re confusing its communism era pretext with criticism of the nation to cope with enjoying liberal media while being a chud.
It is by way of making the main characters Chinese and making characters of other nationalities bumbling morons (relatively speaking) or background people. The course of planet Earth's fate is also very largely determined, for better or worse, by actions of Chinese people.
In book 1, Chinese team manages to get behind all the secrets. The antagonist is also Chinese.
Book 2, a Chinese underachiever saves the day. In book 3, a Chinese woman fricks shit up for everyone, but she manages to stay central untill the very end of the story.
Imo, I don't really care and it's not really all that different than what burgers do in their heroistic stories and movies.
Chink foreign propaganda is very smart. The idea is that it's DEMORALISING. Oh, noes, we can do nothing about it, stuff, while they pump their youth with GI Joe cartoons.
>The whole dark forest thing only works if you presume every civilization is going to be 100% planet bound.
that's the dumbest counter argument for the dark forest thing I have ever read and that's saying something considering this thread alone.
>His take is no dumber
His (your) take on it is far dumber because if everybody was planet bound Dark Forest would make no sense at all.
That's the thing. The thing he (you) said that is necessary for dark forest to be believable is one of the few things that would actually make it not believable at all.
Instead of hitting a planet with an RKV, just hit the star instead.
That said, RKVs aren't as hard to defend against as you'd think. You'd see them picking up speed ages away, long before they are near light speed. The accelerator beams and the sheer radio noise as it tears through the interstellar gas would make it obvious.
Then you just throw up a screen of dust. Its own speed would tear it into ionised plasma. Then your planetary magnetosphere will deflect it without difficulty.
This is addressed in the book I'm talking about right now. The attack is planned centuries in advance and the objects are small enough to evade our long scanning abilities until its too late. In the book, we have a sophisticated detection system and have colonized the solar system.
This also occurs in KS Robinson's gay stupid book, 3012 or something. I can't remember. KSR is a fricking hack. But yeah, the enemy sends little pebbles decades in advance that don't form one high-speed mass until the last possible second to evade destruction.
Interesting. >little pebbles decades in advance that don't form one high-speed mass until the last possible second to evade destruction.
That's a good trick.
>The whole dark forest thing only works if you presume every civilization is going to be 100% planet bound.
that's the dumbest counter argument for the dark forest thing I have ever read and that's saying something considering this thread alone.
He's right, though. FTL drives are possible in this universe, assuming a civ achieves it, and they start hopping around universe, they can avoid torpedoes at their sun.
I've watched a ton of youtube content and have been spoiled on this series.
I know the solar system gets flattened into 2D. I know a few ships made it out of the solar system and started to colonize other systems eventually. Two characters go to one of these planets and emerge millions of years later. Do the books ever illustrate where humanity is at as a species after these millions of years? Or does the book focus on those two characters
That whole thing happens at the very end of the last book and it focuses on the characters and not the surviving human civilization at that point, yeah. It's not the focus of the books at all.
how is the dark forest first strike thing an issue if apparently there are civilizations in this shit that can change the universal constants and delete spatial dimensions?
Bro please read the books instead of being a summarygay. It’s literally explained to you why such destructive weapons are rarely used in favor of other “less” destructive weapons. I’ll give you a hint - it parallels MAD game theory.
but for real, it has the exact same rules of galactic game theory, there's a pasta that goes around from that novel, something like "if you're in central park in the dark, don't call out"
The same logic applies both ways. The one stalking the night has to be certain he can kill his victim and that he isn't being baited by 20 cops sitting in the bushes.
Don't tell me you never heard of people getting robbed or killed by somebody pretending they are in trouble and need help.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You literally just repeated what I just said you moron.
theres absolutely 0 chance that there is some ancient predator civilization in our galaxy lurking in the dark.
dark forest falls apart when you realize that its impossible to hide anyways, earth has been shouting in central park for hundreds of millions of years and nobody came.
if there was anybody nearby who wanted the real estate or snuff out potential competition, they would have arrived before humans even evolved
Its not about the real estate except for the trisol crisis.
It's about that scene at the end of Casino when the bosses are deciding who to whack. Dark Forest boils down to "why take a chance?"
[...]
The book actually addresses the fact of how loud humanity has been during the radio era of the recent technological age, but the truth is those waves take a long time to travel through space and make any significant impact to humanity’s safety in a significant timeframe. It also tends to get lost in a lot of other galactic “noise” .
radio waves dont matter, the fact that earth is habitable has been broadcast into the universe for hundreds of millions of years through its light spectrum alone.
we're already on the cusp of getting atmospheric data from exoplanets, at the end of this millenium, we will probably be able to keep tabs on every single planet in the galaxy with large enough space telescopes. all the information about everything out there is available, its impossible to hide from someone that just looks for you.
plus the fact that its idiotic to assume that all civilizations would arrive at the stage at the same time, someone must've been the first.
even a headstart of 100k years, the blink of an eye in galactic timescales, gives you such an enormous advantage in this game that you win by default because you can colonize or sterilize every single planet before your competitors even use stone tools.
the fact that earth managed to just get by unbothered is proof that there is nobody else within millions of lightyears from us
5 months ago
Anonymous
Or no one has cracked travelling at speeds faster than light, wormholing, whatever.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You don't need traveling faster than the speed of light. Launching von neumann probes at 75% the speed of light (possible with focused lasers) would colonize the entire galaxy within 1 million years time. And colonize the entire local group in 100 million years time.
We're just alone.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, because a speculative model by a based science man isn't reality, there must be no life says a living thing that emerged from the stuff and laws of a possibly infinite volume.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Maybe they just started half a million years ago?
Wait, it just ups and goes 'a higher dimensional race broke "reality", because'. So god modes? What's the point then? Sounds like it goes full sci-fantasy.
It is, it's just hand-waving science-magic not even worthy of Dr. Who.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Maybe they just started half a million years ago?
We actually did a large survey because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres, we found 0 signatures in the nearest million galaxies including the milky way and andromeda.
IF there is other life out there they are less advanced than us. Of course there is the non-zero chance they are at exactly our level of development, but considering that we will most likely launch our first von neumann probe this century that just seems like cosmic irony and not realistic.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>We actually did a large survey because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres, we found 0 signatures in the nearest million galaxies including the milky way and andromeda.
Do you have a link to that paper?
5 months ago
Anonymous
>because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres
We are still trying to discover how our own planet's core works, but we are SO KNOWLEGABLE about how a theoretical construction we have never seen would behave.
Man, Astrophysicists are like Priests, bullshitters on a lifelong mission to live comfortably selling unprovable bunk and avoiding real work at all costs. They lost my faith when they started filling the entire cosmos with undetectable Dark Angel Feathers to make their maths add up.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Etherchads were vindicated. Bad enough moders sōyentists cant even do math or observations but then they have to ripoff their betters.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Ether was the dark matter of its day >here's in the 19th century, we know how solid materials work >what if there's an imperceptible, extremely rigid solid (not a fluid, a solid) that permeates space >and the transverse vibrations of this solid are what light is >oh the longitudinal vibrations? they're far faster than light and have never been detected but never mind.
5 months ago
Anonymous
this
5 months ago
Anonymous
You’re replying to a pseudo intellectual and then using their pseudo science as a vilification of astrophysicists. No real astrophysicists or proper scientific study has ever claimed they understand the nature of Dyson spheres nor has any engineer or roboticist claim von Neumann machines are possible.
5 months ago
Anonymous
have you ever interacted was a physicist? They would walk in thinking they understand mechanical engineering cause "it's just basic physics" and get shit wrong all the time. A bunch of "theoretical" geniuses
5 months ago
Anonymous
this
It's a basic function of entropy a dyson sphere would have significant amount of infrared signature. In a way it would be visible as very weak "dark" infrared stars on telescopes.
Doesn't even matter how it is constructed or how it works. Aliens that use dyson spheres wouldn't have solved entropy, because they wouldn't need dyson spheres if they had an unlimited energy source by solving entropy.
5 months ago
Anonymous
What if the aliens didnt need to solve entropy because they developed palantíri and were able to scam the Maiar out of renewable low caron footprint energy.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>They lost my faith when they started filling the entire cosmos with undetectable Dark Angel Feathers to make their maths add up.
then you don't understand physics.
i'd recommend the following playlist to catch you up:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD79A28ED01799FE7
tldw dark matter was originally hypothesized to exist because it was the only alternative to massively altering our equations for gravity, which we had no idea how to do while also keeping them consistent with observations in sub-galactic scales.
since then, the dark matter hypothesis has survived some testing. eg we have observed the predicted gravitational lensing it should cause IRL.
we still have no fricking clue what it is, what its made of.
the story with dark energy is similar, except we're even more clueless. but either it exists, or a frickton of our already established theories are way off, which doesn't agree with observations is smaller scales.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>the center of every galaxy is a super-massive black hole >we know gravitational lensing is a real thing >gravitational lensing of the centers of galaxies can't be affecting our observations of galaxies
5 months ago
Anonymous
gravitational lensing has nothing to do with the zwicky paradox
it does however provide evidence for the existence on dark matter, because we have observed it happening without any galaxies being present (and no, not black holes either, the pattern of the lensing is too diffuse)
again, if you want to be caught up, watch that playlist
its VERY light on math.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>gravitational lensing has nothing to do with the zwicky paradox
When we observe galaxies from millions of lightyears away, we're seeing them in a sphere of gravitational lensing generated by the black hole, which would be thinnest at the edges, thickest at the middle.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>We're wrong, but we don't want to admit it so we'll just make some phantom matter up to make our shit work
Am I getting this right? This is literal religion lol
5 months ago
Anonymous
its more like >Newtonian physics have been proven and utilized countless times >observations of galaxies millions of lightyears away don't perfectly coincide with newtonian physics (the inner rings rotate slower than the outer rings)
do we dump all newtonian physics and start from scratch or do we model the dependency in a manner that is consistent?
5 months ago
Anonymous
>do we dump all newtonian physics
Yes.
5 months ago
Anonymous
yea, completely clueless about physics
EVERYTHING in physics is WRONG. literally every fricking thing.
but its USEFUL.
in math, and ONLY in math, you can positively PROVE things. you can PROVE, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that (a + b)^2 = a^2 + 2*a*b + b^2
in every other science, including physics, the best you can do is propose THEORIES. you can't PROVE them, you can only TEST them
does the universe behave the way my theory says it should? can i find this weird shit that my theory predicts out there? if yes, we have a good theory. not a TRUE one, not a PROVEN one, but a USEFUL one.
theories are MODELS, not claims of TRUTH.
out current *best* model for gravity is einsteins general relativity. it has been thoroughly tested and has proven itself to be extremely useful in explaining/predicting the behavior of the universe, at least in sub-galactic scales.
however, we have observations that it doesn't agree with.
like, for instance, stars along the edges of the galaxies that are rotating faster than the predicted mass of said galaxy should allow. and physisists are not dummies, we have good ways of guessing the mass of stars and can extrapolate fairly accurately the mass of galaxies.
so this (and other things, DYOR) is what prompted us to guess "hey, maybe there's some more mass there that doesn't show up in telescopes"
after all, it was either this, or somehow gravity changes behavior at large scales, or maybe everything we know about stars is super wrong, or something equally implausible.
and so far, this hypothesis seems to hold up, see previous mentions of apparent grav lensing absent any visible mass to cause it.
5 months ago
Anonymous
bla bla bla, sounds like some horseshit. If your theory is incorrect, admit it instead of blatantly making shit up to correct for it.
5 months ago
Anonymous
dark matter isn't needed to correct for anything locally.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Again, positing dyson swarms, vn probes, and any class civilization is wildly speculative from the standpoint of a civilization that has yet to meet the lowest criteria. Check your priors and go with what you know is true at this moment; VN probes do not exist, nobody can harvest a star, and life is a thing. You're asking every potential civilization to conform to 20th century human spit balling which may indeed prove wildly off-mark.
We're talking about what WE would do knowing what WE know, with little regard to what is or isn't actually possible. It could be that what we view as an engineering hurdle today is proven an impossibility tomorrow and to base any large scale speculation on our primitive theory is premature. Show me a self replicating probe and we'll have something. Exists on paper is never going to be adequate, I don't care how autistic Von Neumann was.
5 months ago
Anonymous
100% correct but midwits will always deny this because they WANT to believe.
We are most likely not only alone within millions of lightyears but simply completely alone in the entire universe.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Why does humanity being alone scare people? It means we can colonise the galaxy in peace
Also means we know God made us
5 months ago
Anonymous
Stop replying to yourself. Your stupid argument has already been addressed by the book.
5 months ago
Anonymous
humanity being alone means countless other "humanities" have popped up and pooped out over the lifespan of the universe and none of them made it out of their solar systems. that god isn't real and there's nothing in the universe for us but being ground back into inert matter.
5 months ago
Anonymous
believing that everyone else went extinct and we will too is just another false blackpill
its hubris to assume that EVERY SINGLE civilization in the universe simply shit the bed for some reason instead of climbing the darwinian ladder they evolved on.
the idea that we're the first in our corner of the universe is both more realistic and optimistic
5 months ago
Anonymous
Geez, have a bit of levity about it. Even if we are alone, and we do inevitably get pounded back into atoms, at least we get to sparkle for a second. A human is closer to a little fae sprite than anything.
5 months ago
Anonymous
NOOOO REDDIT SAID WE'RE NOT SPECIAL GOD ISN'T REAL NOOOOOO
5 months ago
Anonymous
You misunderstand the nature of the universe and the weapons. It’s like thinking a sole nation that has nukes would just start nuking everyone. Nukes destroy their home as well so it’s not in that nations interest to continuously nuke everyone. They only nuke major threats. Same idea here. The world ending weapons these aliens have eventually destroy the universe so they’d rather not use them all the time.
5 months ago
Anonymous
what the hell are you smoking? you have some arcane knowledge of the types of weapons the yet undiscovered aliens use?
you dont need nukes when the simple fact of being first allows you to arrive at your enemies soil when they are still fish crawling out of the swamp.
the universe is not only incredibly large but also incredibly old, its entirely possible that earth could've hosted intelligent life millions of years ago already if some mass extinctions or evolutionary pathways went just slightly different.
being first is everything that matters in "dark forest" because it lets you do whatever you want and you have all the time in the world to spread everywhere and take everything, without a single shot fired
5 months ago
Anonymous
>you have some arcane knowledge of the types of weapons the yet undiscovered aliens use?
It’s part of the Three Body Trilogy book. You can go leave to go have your christlarp pseudo intellectual debates. We are talking about a Netflix show based on a book ITT.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>the fact that earth managed to just get by unbothered is proof that there is nobody else within millions of lightyears from us
Or that midwit forest is a moronic concept.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>the fact that earth managed to just get by unbothered is proof that there is nobody else within millions of lightyears from us
Or maybe the alien species aren't as cynical as we'd expect
5 months ago
Anonymous
OR
As the book literally explains - the universe is big and aliens cannot easily find earth just from random radio broadcasts, they would need much more specific coordinates.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>dey be super speshul powerfulest smartestest but uhh ehh they ackchyually can't detect humans when it's inconvenient for the plot
5 months ago
Anonymous
To put it in layman terms: radio broadcasts would be coming from a location earth no longer is in. By the time the waves travel any distance big enough to be found by an alien race, the earth would’ve continued in its journey along the spin of the galaxy and would be in a completely different location. For a civ to find a specific planet they would need coordinates based off a whole bunch of other stars around it which would serve as a “fingerprint” of the location. You’re not as smart as the writer of this book bro. I’m sorry.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Holy shit, I'm screencapping this.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I deleted my basedjack folder so just imagine I greentexted this and slapped a basedjack next to it.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Holy shit, I'm screencapping this.
DURP all you would need to do is go from the origin in a straight line away from the big bang to find the planet
5 months ago
Anonymous
Stars don't move very far in a hundred or even a thousand years.
5 months ago
Anonymous
... yes they do
5 months ago
Anonymous
Not so far that you're like "holy shit where did that signal come from"
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yes. An alien civilization trying to find us is like us trying to find a specific particle. Uncertainty principle. We can't determine the exact location, velocity, and direction of a particle. Even if we're broadcasting our location, it would take multiple pings to find us.
5 months ago
Anonymous
There are a lot of stars and a lot of planets and it takes hundreds to hundreds of thousands of years for broadcasts to travel around the galaxy between various stars. There’s just no way for a civilization to deduce where it came from.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The galaxy is 100,000 ly wide. I wasn't talking about someone on the other side of the galaxy trying to figure out where we are. I meant someone close enough to reasonably get here slower than light ie within 100 ly or at most 1000ly. At those ranges, stellar motion won't be a serious impediment.
5 months ago
Anonymous
It is a serious impediment even at 100 light years. Even trisolarans needed multiple transmissions with location coordinates to confirm earth’s locations.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Doesn't even matter because their trajectory is extremely predictable on huge time scales. And they super smart incomprehensible tech ayy lmaos would need to somehow point their big rock at the target. Which is apparently super hard because >the earth would’ve continued in its journey along the spin of the galaxy and would be in a completely different location. For a civ to find a specific planet they would need coordinates based off a whole bunch of other stars around it which would serve as a “fingerprint” of the location.
In layman's terms, of course.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Without knowing initial conditions it is almost impossible to deduce such things. That’s the core of the three body problem, only multiplied to a galactic scale.
5 months ago
Anonymous
It's not a three-body problem. It's analogous to plotting trajectory of Mars from Earth. After receiving a continuous transmission from it for some time.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Incorrect.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>It's not a three-body problem.
correct. Its an 18 body problem. and also a [every object in the galaxy] body problem.
5 months ago
Anonymous
It's literally two stars rotating around the same galactic core.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>their trajectory is extremely predictable on huge time scales
I'm not so sure about that. There could be a lot of interactions that are hard to model.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>what is leading the target
5 months ago
Anonymous
Super hard, apparently. But only in layman's terms.
5 months ago
Anonymous
we already found thousands of exoplanets with our current technology
just build two dozen huge space telescopes and you will have surveyed every single planet in the galaxy within a few hundred years.
all the information about their atmospheres and likely habitability. the light off planets is always there, you just have to look.
light lag or active radio broadcasts dont matter at all. you can take a look at the entire galaxy if you just look long and hard enough
5 months ago
Anonymous
You need to know where to look first. That’s where the problem lies. You can try to set up probes for every exoplanet in existence but that will take a lot of time and resources to set up.
5 months ago
Anonymous
just look at every star, planets with civilizations will be around stars.
400 billion stars sounds intimidating at first but the timescale in which to realistically do this would also be hundreds, if not thousands of years
resources available to advanced civilizations + timescales involved make this not impossible at all, even advantageous if you are paranoid about game theory or need a planet to settle on.
the resources are well spent because you will be able to do it again and have intel on everything, forever. just build more telescopes, its a lot easier than sending an invasion fleet and actually going there
5 months ago
Anonymous
>okay we've scanned all 400 billion stars, how long did that take? >4 million years sir >shit okay start again
5 months ago
Anonymous
>guess we just build telescopes until it only takes us a couple decades for a full sweep because we have the resources of an entire solar system at our disposal and this task will be essential for our survival so we will be willing to spend it
5 months ago
Anonymous
>a couple decades for a full sweep
that's 20 billion stars a year.
5 months ago
Anonymous
thousands of telescopes each looking for a couple of minutes at a star to collect data.
not impossible, but very useful information gathering in fact, worthwhile for every capable civilization.
we will likely start doing the same in a few hundred years
5 months ago
Anonymous
it currently takes the webb telescope hours to gather as much light/data as the hubble did in months, and its still not enough to resolve planets around stars.
5 months ago
Anonymous
so the progress in 40 years was good?
going by that curve, a few hundred years will be enough to build good enough telescopes for this job. thats still basically instantaneous in galactic timescales and a viable strategy
5 months ago
Anonymous
>we will likely start doing the same in a few hundred years
We will either be extinct or sharpening arrowheads in a few hundred years with how things are going.
5 months ago
Anonymous
To put it in layman terms: There are visible biosignatures visible even with earth technology (JWST), there could be visible hundreds of millions of years before a technological species even evolves there and broadcast it out to the universe for an insane amount of time so that everyone can clearly see there is life there.
Aliens don't need the fricking radio broadcasts, they either already know you exist and don't care at all. Or we are simply alone and that's why everything looks empty and no stars have been obviously touched yet.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Bro you sound moronic every time you do your christcuck larpery. “Everything looks empty” b***h please we don’t even know what we’re looking at or what to look for. Sit down.
You guys are going to incite the midwits into an autistic frenzy with these talks.
The book actually addresses the fact of how loud humanity has been during the radio era of the recent technological age, but the truth is those waves take a long time to travel through space and make any significant impact to humanity’s safety in a significant timeframe. It also tends to get lost in a lot of other galactic “noise” .
Also our "loudness" only matters to the trisols.
To "out" yourself to the greater universe you need to broadcast your specific coordinates. This is addressed when he picks the dummy star to be destroyed.
The israelite didn't write it, he merely stole it and passed it off as creepypasta, just like the old testament.
Charles Pellegrino and somebody somebody wrote it.
>Charles Pellegrino
This guy came up with quite a realistic antimatter driven starship that could acheive .92 lightspeed without too much difficulty.
The ship in Avatar was based on it, but less based.
>realistic antimatter driven starship that could acheive .92 lightspeed
This is it:
https://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/slowerlight3.php#valkyrie
.92c requires more mass ratio than you probably want for an antimatter ship, but it can do lower speeds much more easily.
No beamed propulsion either, it's a proper starship.
The most realistic part of three body problem is that women cause literally every problem there is and doom our universe in the process. then the punishment for the woman who sealed our fate is that she gets evacuated off the planet so she can live. mandatory reading for if your will ever wavers and you start to think women aren't that bad.
I really like this trilogy. The second and third are difficult to separate, the first a bit weaker. The Sci fi to actual Sci fi nerds might not be groundbreaking, but it's the fact he pulls so much into it and has interesting political and societal themes going on.
I think this series is going to be very difficult to do visually the deeper in it gets, eg how do you represent the bomb in the third book and do it justice.
You’re right. These are true book-stories, meaning that you get the most out of them as books since they are so concept heavy. A good example is Wandering Earth 1/2 which are also stories by Cixin Liu. They’re great movies but at times you can feel a bit “rushed” or “overwhelmed” by the amount of plot and concepts thrown at you and you can tell these stories would be better to read since they feature so many ideas worth exploring. The Three Body series will be similar. They’ll have to cut a lot of stuff to make it more digestible in the show/film form, and I doubt it will be able to come close (let alone surpass) the novels.
Who invented the three body game? Like I get it was etf, but how did they end up with enough information, and what was the purpose of the actual game? I never really understood all of this. What was the timeline between alien response and the game?
The sophons helped the Earth-Trisolaris Organization make the game to create more sympathizers as well as a place for ETO members to gather (such as in the second book with the Wallbreakers). The sophons probably also helped with various processing. At that point the sophons were sharing info and tech with the ETO and Mike Evans.
doesnt say is for there to be a policeman to run to in the scary night park.
You have to hope at least TWO civilizations buddied up to create a star alliance dedicated to stopping this moronic shit so they can flourish. Which is the whole social contract philsophy crap.
That person from the cap also assumes that wimps dont get to the top, but parasitic and even co-dependent species relationships exist. Cooperation is not foreign to survival. Humanity got to where it's at not just through social communities but domestication of other species as well. These ideas are foreign to the chinese tho
They didn’t at the start. Only a select few were in contact with the sophons/trisolarans (ie the Earth Trisolaris Organization). After the discovery of sophons humanity just assumes they’re always around, even after the Earth-Trisolaris Conflict ends and the Trisolarans disappear.
In the 3rd book when they build a room that the sophons can't get into how did they know l that. Like how did humans actually know what sophons were beyond tiny spies.
By that point they had the technology to detect sophons and they also had developed a MAD truce with trisolaris, allowing them to interact with sophons directly. Not to mention the anime girl robot representing all trisolaris and sophons. After the trisolarans leave they still think sophons are around out of suspicion and paranoia even though they no longer detect the sophons. Perhaps they were never able to be 100% sure.
The thing that I felt about the book is how rapidly it continuously changed. Its a trilogy, but the characters change the timeline changes, the enemies ability changes. I just think to do it right normies would be turned off the show. Think about how much more limited the change was in got.
I read half of the first book and was so fricking bored I had to stop. Chink writers are so awful. They write characters as soulless automatons instead of actual human beings.
That’s just your typical sci fi. Try reading Tau Zero by Poul Anderson or Foundation by Isaac Asimov or Rendezvous with Rama by Arthur Clarke. In fact in comparison to those books Three Body trilogy actually has way more emotionality and humanistic nuances.
I think we can all agree it's a bad idea to start reading Party Approved Chink rubbish sci-fi.
Just because they've stolen good space technology from better countries doesn't mean they can write good science fiction.
>Paranoid society of timid cowards write paranoid, timid science fiction.
Remember, these are the guys who built a monumental wall, visible from space, to keep out men with larger penises.
The whole thing is about inadequate asian penises at the end of the day. A foreign element likely has you out-wanged, so it makes sense to destroy him before your gf experiences normal sized genitalia.
When you read about von neumann probes, something humanity is probably capable of creating in the next couple of decades you realize we're actually alone in the universe.
The fact that there are still visible stars at all by definition proves to us that there are no advanced alien species out there.
Humanity is alone or at the very least the most advanced species in this corner in the universe which will be the equivalent of being alone due to us being the only intelligent species in our gravitationally bound local group.
Except no, VN probes are assumed to be an engineering hurdle but may be impossible given our nascent understanding of almost every step involved. You should take stock of what you do know, there is a planet teeming with life, and not bet on super science that reflects our current level of sophistication.
The K scale is wildly speculative. Its like declaring the universe barren because its the 19th century and you don't see any grand steam powered civilizations. We have no idea what is truly going on.
Anyone sophisticated enough to travel/communicate over interstellar distances would also be sophisticated enough to cloak themselves against far more primitive detection.
Again, we are thumbs up our asses on what anything would do. We're taking very human concepts and assigning them to all potential life. For all you know every civilization nopes out in a fit of pessimism and decides to die with their star.
Explain why stars still exist if a SINGLE individual of a SINGLE species could launch a SINGLE VN probe into space and all stars would disappear.
The only conclusion is that there is no advanced life out there. VN probes don't break the laws of physics and are arguably doable with current technology
Anyone sophisticated enough to travel/communicate over interstellar distances would also be sophisticated enough to cloak themselves against far more primitive detection.
False, entropic waste heat will always be detectable. They would need to solve entropy and have infinite energy to be able to hide that signature, at that point they are ascended gods that change the laws of physics, which I don't believe in.
No, we can't build vn probes. We're not remotely close. You're drunk on popsci. Also we're again assuming that they will be harvesting stars and disposing of waste heat. For all you know their concept of energy leaves our understanding of thermodynamics looking like cave scratches.
Everything I'm reading so far tells me this appeals exclusively to midwit redditors and I should ignore it. Le dark forest! Le relativistic bomb! Spooky scary! Give me a fricking break. Hard sci fi always has and always will be dumb since it takes our current understanding of things for granted. The only good science fiction has been written by religious men.
I don’t know if it’s just the translation rom Chinese to English but the books felt like such a slog to read. The ideas and concepts were interesting. 90% of characters felt like caricatures without any depth beyond having one motivation usually.
Absolute favourite part of the story I read up to was
>Alien Trisolarans have already infiltrated earth with countless tiny undetectable droplets allowing them to observe and hear everything, as well as delay human tech progress by altering certain aspects of physics slightly. Aliens have human collaborators working for them too >government selects 4 people to be Wallfacers. People given unlimited funds and power to each create anti trisolaran invasion ideas. These will take hundreds of years so they keep getting put in stasis for 50 years in between checking in on the progress of their programs. They cannot say what they’re doing or make it obvious because otherwise the trisolarans will know about it and be able to stop it. >3 wallfacers were chosen based on credentials. Last one was only chosen because for an unknown reason he was on a list the Trisolarans sent to their human collaborators as somebody to be assassinated ASAP. So human governments knew for some reason they were very afraid of him >this last dude is the one who pulls the checkmate by threatening to reveal earth and Trisolaris location to the rest of the galaxy, having surmised the whole Dark Forest problem and knowing the trisolarans would not invade if it meant their own planet being destroyed and earth too
I stopped reading long before the last books. Eventually it felt like it had kind of run it’s journey and was middling while throwing ideas out there like how there used to be way more dimensions and they keep getting collapsed in galactic wars etc
Also I heard a lot of the more overt political commentary was cut initially because obviously it was originally written in China, published in a Chinese literary magazine and publishing house
Like I said. The version I read had the initial Chinese woman who got into contact with a trisolaran (who told her PLEASE DO NOT SEND ANYTHING ELSE, LITERALLY ANY OTHER MEMBER OF MY SPECIES WHO READS THIS WILL INVADE YOU) decide to keep contacting them anyway. Solely because her whole family had died and suffered under the Chinese communist parties rule and made her hate humanity to the point she was happy for these aliens she’d never met to either wipe us out. Or rule over us.
I find it hard to believe this could have been in the original Chinese version based on their history of censorship. But who knows.
>like how there used to be way more dimensions and they keep getting collapsed in galactic wars etc
This is the kind of idea someone writes about who lives in constant fear of fatal elevator/escalator/everything-else collapse.
Why would they want to assassinate that random guy? Did they have the ability to see the future? If so why did they fail? Either way ANYONE could have thought up a MAD solution, why did it have to be that one idiot?
Why is it praised so much when it devolves into standard techno-magic using scientific words/concepts that a shit-ton of other sci-fi/space operas have done before it? It's it the cynical attitude?
The daoist philologies of the books are really refreshing to read in sci fi. As a fan of deep ecologist literature like Fritjof Capra and Carl Sagan, I found Three Body trilogy very nice. Kurt Vonnegut would be the closest writer to Cixin Liu in my opinion.
They never showed them or even described them as far as I remember. All art online is fan art.
Their biology describes how they survive on a planet where they have 3 suns and it alternates from super hot to freezing. And how their bodies can essentiallt absorb water, completely dry out into a husk and hibernate until it’s safe again etc
Hard to imagine what the frick that would even look like, sponge bob?
I imagined them as gecko/lizard like that lived in deserts with extremely dry scaly skin that is extremely dark to protect against radiation from multiple stars on a place where water is scarce.
They’re explained as being hyper reflective and they communicate through images/light they reflect on their bodies which is why all their thoughts are constantly exposed and they are naive to lies and human trickery at first. It’s how they create the giant communal von neuman architecture in their history lessons in the VR game.
The third book shining a light on the fact that life shapes the universe is kino. Non environmentalists are losing big time. First us environemtalists had Avatar and now we have Three Body Kino? We are blessed, greenbros.
they're just an idea that works under the assumption that automation will someday work so reliably that you could send self repairing probes on voyages of hundreds of years into the cosmos that use the resources of their arrival solar system (asteroids) to build copies of themselves who in turn survey further stars.
a slow but cheap way to survey the entire galaxy that "only" needs capable AI and not magic tech like hibernation of warp speed to send actual humans.
more elaborate concepts involve those VN probes to build entire space stations/biospheres for the later arrival of humans, or even have some DNA stored and breed them at the arrival destination
VN probes don't necessitate nanobots at all. It could just be very clunky 1960s sputnik probes that setup 2020s 3D printers to print new versions of itself from regolith.
The core could be some LLM like GPT-4 deciding the directives paired with some AI-vision model.
We're literally 10-20 years away from building something like that.
To put it in layman terms: radio broadcasts would be coming from a location earth no longer is in. By the time the waves travel any distance big enough to be found by an alien race, the earth would’ve continued in its journey along the spin of the galaxy and would be in a completely different location. For a civ to find a specific planet they would need coordinates based off a whole bunch of other stars around it which would serve as a “fingerprint” of the location. You’re not as smart as the writer of this book bro. I’m sorry.
because we can't have 100% efficiency (if we could entropy wouldn't exist). The gathering of the energy from the star itself would cause infrared waste heat that we could very easily detect (and have already looked for btw).
>They lost my faith when they started filling the entire cosmos with undetectable Dark Angel Feathers to make their maths add up.
then you don't understand physics.
i'd recommend the following playlist to catch you up:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD79A28ED01799FE7
tldw dark matter was originally hypothesized to exist because it was the only alternative to massively altering our equations for gravity, which we had no idea how to do while also keeping them consistent with observations in sub-galactic scales.
since then, the dark matter hypothesis has survived some testing. eg we have observed the predicted gravitational lensing it should cause IRL.
we still have no fricking clue what it is, what its made of.
the story with dark energy is similar, except we're even more clueless. but either it exists, or a frickton of our already established theories are way off, which doesn't agree with observations is smaller scales.
>Maybe they just started half a million years ago?
We actually did a large survey because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres, we found 0 signatures in the nearest million galaxies including the milky way and andromeda.
IF there is other life out there they are less advanced than us. Of course there is the non-zero chance they are at exactly our level of development, but considering that we will most likely launch our first von neumann probe this century that just seems like cosmic irony and not realistic.
>UMMMM THE THOMSON MODEL OF THE ATOM IS FLAWLESS WE JUST NEED TO MAKE UP A TON OF SHIT TO FILL IN THE GAPS, there's nothing WRONG with the model ITSELF!!! >We're NOT suppressing information and there is NO reproducibility crisis, OKAY GOY?!?!?
You wanna know how you tell a pseudo intellectual apart from a real intellectual? The pseudo intellectual called them “Von Neumann Probes” and the real intellectual calls them “Von Neumann Machines”.
>1. All mass-energy in the universe is finite and created during the big bang and will slowly deplete due to entropy, meaning there is a dwindling supply of stuff to go around for >2. Stars are the most entropy accelerating objects in the universe, wasting away energy and millions of years of potential existence by letting burn >3. Despite us knowing this we still see stars and even can't detect any heat signatures from mega structures designed to prevent the useless burning of precious finite resources (stars)
How do you reconcile this? To me the only logical conclusion seems to be that there are no technological advanced species out there.
because we can't have 100% efficiency (if we could entropy wouldn't exist). The gathering of the energy from the star itself would cause infrared waste heat that we could very easily detect (and have already looked for btw).
These kinds of hypothetical structures are literally impossible lol. It's absurd people give it any sort of weight beyond being a thought exercise. The reason we don't see any extraterrestrial life out there is because the universe is moronicly big and time scales are moronicly massive. If anyone is out there they aren't near us, and if anyone is near us they're not with us in time. What's more, there's no getting out 'there'. We're all trapped in our home systems (if even that) for better or worse.
Black holes are a far more efficient way of converting mass into energy. You feed matter into a spinning black hole, and the accretion disk radiation allows you to recover almost all of the mass-energy of the input matter. Stars are wasteful natural phenomena.
To minimize entropic decay to its absolute minimum. It's still eventually going to happen just at a slower rate.
It's like living 1 year or living a million years. It's a no-brainer to do.
Of course I'm assuming entropy can't be fixed here but if you fix entropy you are literally a god that can change laws of physics at their whims anyway so who cares at that point.
Dark Forest is an excellent metaphor for deterrence as a concept that people started to run with as an iron law of speculative xenopolitics and I don't get why
>and I don't get why
100% projection. The consensus among the genre writers 50 years ago was that cooperation is possible if not outright inevitable. The quality of the average human has gone down. Lower intelligence, poorer culture, inferiority of spirit.
I read the synopsis for all 3 books a few years ago, I felt like I got the gist. Now this one is actually good - its illustrated, quick to read, and actually tackles existential dread in the right way.
science fiction is so fricking moronic >After living there for some time, Cheng Xin and Guan Yifan receive an alien message aimed at all denizens of micro-universes in all languages including Earth's and Trisolaris', stating that the presence of micro-universes deprives the main universe of mass, disrupting its cycle of expansion, collapse and rebirth. Cheng Xin, accompanied by Yifan, wearily reflects on her lifetime of moral duty. They decide to disassemble the contents of the micro-universe and return the mass to the main universe, then join it in death and rebirth. They leave behind a message in a bottle and a self-sustaining terrarium for the denizens of the reborn universe to uncover.
so fricking moronic and gay lmfao
We are either alone in the universe. Or we are GOING to be alone in the universe after we launch our Von Neumann probes and genocide all life in the universe besides humans.
>Hint: The "dark" in dark matter and dark energy stands for "we don't know what this shit is". > >It's not like we don't admit that we have no idea about it.
This thread is a perfect example of why you shouldn't take the dumb shit you read on reddit and Popular Science as gospel. You idiots actually take academics, the slimiest most dishonest people alive at their word about all of this shit? They would NEVER lie and bullshit things to advance their careers and get funding. Definitely not, no siree.
>academics, the slimiest most dishonest people alive
Those are actually priests and politicians.
but its not their word. its what's independently verifiable.
whats independently verifiable about religion?
>you disagree therefore you are a christcuck
Please, I beg of you, try to realize how this shit actually works. Science isn't a religion like you're treating it and the overwhelming majority of uni professors are careerists slime balls who won't hesitate to falsify data and cover for each other if it benefits them to do so.
Oh I’m sorry, I just thought you were moronic because you sounded moronic and were projecting a moronic understanding of science that betrayed your love of moronation. My sincere apologies for calling you a christcuck, because you are clearly much smarter than that.
this is a valid concern, in other sciences.
in physics, there's not a lot of political or monetary incentives to lie about results
and there's not a lot of ways to hide lying either. data from obseratories is generally available, math is math and other people can check it, etc etc
its not like eg a trial for a drug, which is super expensive to conduct and the formula/method for making it is secret/proprietary, so there's slim chance anyone will try to replicate it.
>this is a valid concern, in other sciences. >in physics, there's not a lot of political or monetary incentives to lie about results
Am I talking to literal autists? I'm telling you it doesn't matter. If funding, tenure and awards are on the line all kinds of bullshit will be swept under the rug and forgotten about. This is a systemic problem of academia, its not restricted by any means to sociology journals.
woah dude did you hear Joe Rogan talk about how research institutions had to fit a quota and like suppressed all research? Wow man that means like all science is literally over and wrong.
there is always the incentive to discover something interesting to advance your career
or, if privately funded, to create results pleasing to your funders
but like i explained, quite simply i thought but apparently not, those incentives are not as present in physics, and at the same time lying about results is also much harder, since its very easy and doable for others to doublecheck your work.
the net result is that physics suffers way less from this systemic issue.
if you wanna complain about something, complain about observatories and other labs being hesitant to grant time to people working outside the currently accepted paradigm
which to be fair is kinda rational. and to be even more fair, some observatories and labs have specific policies regarding some amount of time/resources being intentionally spent on contrarian shit/extreme long shots, just in case.
>Be me 8 year old sci-fi fan
"Oh boy there are UFOs and aliens everywhere I'm sure we'll announce it any day now!" >Found out how hard interstellar travel is and that faster than light travel is impossible due to relativity
"Welp UFOs aren't real but aliens surely still exist on their home planets!" >Find out about the lack of technosignatures, biosignatures and general silence in our close neighborhood
"O-okay aliens are really rare and the universe is huge, i'm sure they are still somewhere in this galaxy though!" >Find out about entropy, von neumann probes, dyson swarms, AI alignment problem
"Frick.... we're alone....."
we'll be the gardeners of the universe, bringing life wherever we go.
it doesnt matter if there is someone else out there or not, both possibilities are good for us
>dude my short <30 years on this earth and supreme confidence that we know everything 100% and have the highest grade technology possible have made me realize that there are no aliens out there abloobloo
Truly brave. What a journey of development this anon has gone through. Someone should make a movie about it.
>Find out about the lack of technosignatures, biosignatures
We have no way to detect biosignatures yet, and there are several technosignature candidates
HEY moron! Let me help you, and hopefully other helpless morons.
STEP 1 >Look for context clues >In this case it's in the very first post
>YOU'RE BUGS
Why are the Trisolarians such sinophobes? >look for words you don't recognize >in my case, "Trisolarians"
STEP 2, AND THIS IS A TRICKY ONE! >>>on PC: >Click, Hold and DRAG your cursor over your CONTEXT CLUE (the word "Trisolarian" in this example) >RIGHT CLICK your highlighted word(s) >LEFT CLICK on [ Search Google for "Trisolarian" ] >click on some links that seem promising in your new persuit of knowledge (notice how I followed multiple links, desiretoknowmore.gif) >>>on Mobile: >hold your finger over you CONTEXT CLUE >release after it highlights >tap [ Search Google ] >tap on some links that seem promising in your new persuit of knowledge
STEP 3 >SUCCESS! YOU WERE ABLE TO ANSWER YOUR OWN QUESTION THROUGH YOUR OWN INITIATIVE AND GUMPTION
ALSO STEP 3 >FAILURE! YOU ARE A DUMB SCUMFRICK IDIOT moron AND PROBABLY BARELY SAPIENT!
>YOU'RE BUGS
Why are the Trisolarians such sinophobes?
You’re in one of the spaceships in the front row of the fleet formation during the droplet attack. How do you survive?
>How do you survive?
You don't. You die knowing it was all a waste of time, there was never any hope.
only option was to escape like that other ship
>Blocks your path (and timeline)
Are you ready for first contact from The Dark Forest to be the next Red Wedding for normalgays?
Except the literal existential crisis is real with this one, I can see people unironically suicide over it.
Don’t worry they’ll add a funny black character for diversity
>DEA HEA…
What? That science/physics isn't a constant? OH NO. ITS LIKE MAGIC. NOOOOOOOO-
Physics is already like magic, you b***h. The physicists committing suicide is melodramatic as hell.
What kind of fricking basedboy has an existential crisis over this shit?
>
His imaginary normie strawman. Millions of chinks and humans worldwide have read or watched TBP and you dont hear about mass suicides. Its just a redditor bloviating.
>Thinking people will care about some Netflix scifi shit the same way they cared about GOT.
Unless there is rape in the first episode it won't have a female audience
Unfortunately true sci-fi just isn't mainstream. Normalgays are not into it.
>Halfway in the series it's revealed nothing had any point to it and it was hopeless from the start
Normies will have mental breakdown over this
What's up with homosexuals having a vastly over-inflated opinion about how much people care about their homosexual shit? This is honestly kind of pathetic thinking.
/tv/anons think they're special for reading but only read genreslop, many such cases
Show won’t get greenlit for another season. It’s going to be terrible.
>DUDE, DARK FOREST
>BLOW UP EVERY CIVILIZATION YOU FIND
>UH OH LOOKS LIKE WE'RE 2D NOW
>OH MY GOD EVERYONE IS A DICK
what an amazing book series
>dude I’m a homosexual
k
It's how Asians see the world.
China is barbarous zero sum opportunistic parasites in the same way that russia are insanely durable depressed alcoholic nihilist thieves. They were always that way, but the selection pressure of commie famine made it the defining feature of their civilization instead of just a fun cultural flavor.
>coping
>malding
>seething
Nothing he typed was inaccurate tho.
>the country that keeps to its own and has had the most successful industrialization in the last 200 years is barbarous
>but not anyone exporting and domestically generating systematic poverty and famine and destruction in a mostly literal sense that's civilized
>and has had the most successful industrialization in the last 200 years
They simply copied the West, and learned nothing from the mistakes committed in THEIR industrialization, and even managed further nasty mistakes. Bravo I guess. And they only industrialized so rapidly because Westerners decided to export their factories and environmental holocaust to slave-wage Chinese, it had little to do with Chinese ingenuity or determination.
These are the same dipshits who doomed themselves demographically with a government enforced program to exterminate females, who killed millions through starvation by following the dictates of a 40 IQ lunatic who made Trump look coherent.
Fricking Chinese man, not even once.
>They simply copied the West, and learned nothing from the mistakes committed in THEIR industrialization
genuinely a silly billly
>>the country that keeps to its own
false. tibet, hong kong, nepal, taiwan, myanmar, vietnam, etc
>has had the most successful industrialization in the last 200 years is barbarous
only because of the usa building china up. china isn't responsible for building the advanced parts of its country. it bought foreign expertise with essential slave labor profits
>only because of the usa building china up
the most moronic narrative ever invented
it's like saying america only exists because of the french
or the soviets only industrialized because of john deer
or the english only industrialized because of the italians
>DARK FOREST
It's dumb on the account of you can't hide technosignatures in space
anon its not star trek. they can't just open up their viewscreen and say "scan for unknown technological signatures!" and then icons of earth and all the other species pop up.
It'd be more like waving a flashlight in a completely dark surroundings while the other guys have night vision goggles on and actively looking for you but eh
its more like waving a phone light in hundred acres of dark forest and there's someone looking for you a mile away.
You can’t hide sand particles on a beach but I bet it’ll take you some time to find one particular sand particle, even if it was letting out a noise.
just employ tens of thousands of people to search for decades and you will find it, that is the scale at which civilizations operate that have cheap and easy access to their own solar systems resources.
you can always scale things up. and if you believe your own "dark forest game theory" then they will be willing to throw every resource available at a problem that could threaten their existence
"scaling up" means broadcasting your location
While the Droplet attack is the most kino sequence of the entire series, the moronation of humanity during the run-up is beyond comprehension.
>Yes, let's move our ENTIRE fleet minus two ships to intercept this thing and have everyone line up in a grid. There's no possible way the aliens who can fold super computers into single particles can threaten us.
I know humanity was high on their own supply by that point, but no tactician would ever agree to something so fricking moronical.
Sounds like standard LOGH tactics. These c**ts were just begging for some absolute CHAD to turn up with his fleet formed into a SEMICIRCULAR formation, and offer them ABSOLUTELY ZERO CHANCE OF FRICKING ESCAPE.
You gotta remember, up until the droplet attack we had lost faith, regained faith, then got super wienery. It's the attack itself that clues humanity in on how clueless we actually are. Really only that one admiral had a sneaking suspicion that this was way more lopsided than any earthling can suspect, but he couldn't do anything because muh lockstep bug philosophy which is why you can't take this story out of China.
As far as we knew we had lapped the trisols.
>implying lemmingbrained lockstepping is exclusive to China
You’re displaying the very arrogance that lead to the droplet attack fyi.
I am confident in muh ships because they are phallic.
Nobody beats the wiener.
But for real, the west would never settle on remaining or defecting. We'd fight a big ass war until there was no one left to frick or flee. Only bugs would all pick one or the other.
I’m not wasting time untangling this schizo ass post.
If you spent 5 minutes on this planet you'd know humans are morons.
I don't think aliens even classify us a an intelligent species.
I love how this series assumes aliens are all paranoid gods constantly nuking each other, even the ones comparable to ants
10/10 logic (not)
you have to understand it was written by a chink and thus is a reflection of their society. the trisolarans are the endgame of what the chinese would be if they ever reached that magnitude of civilization.
>you have to understand it was written by a chink and thus is a reflection of their society
bugs?
yes
Yeah chinese are definitely the only nuke-happy superpower....
>I love how this series assumes aliens are all paranoid gods constantly nuking each other
The book addresses this though. Things weren't that way until the first morons started using laws of physics as a weapon and limited the universe to 3D with a hard limit of the speed of light. In a world where a radio message of "hello" comes at the same speed as a weaponized asteroid you MUST be paranoid. The third book establishes that there were some beings outside of the collapsed universe-bubble who were peaceful because they weren't confined to the light speed.
>uhhh no it makes sense because uhhh ... everyone was an butthole since day 1, yeah thats it!
LOL
Wait, it just ups and goes 'a higher dimensional race broke "reality", because'. So god modes? What's the point then? Sounds like it goes full sci-fantasy.
Dude read the books stop asking dumb questions and making stupid assumptions. The book only explains that there were higher dimensional beings which through war destroyed their dimensions and reduced themselves to lower and lower dimensions, just as how the 3D universe is being destroyed by 3D war.
This is stupid sub-capeshit rubbish.
Not at all, it’s completely in line with string theory and entropy.
Horseshit. It's just dumb make-believe about God-Aliens detonating the universe from being 30 dimensions down to 3. Even Marvel comic readers wouldn't buy into this dumb shit.
If you're thinking about M-Theory with the Branes and the Bulk and all that shit, that's a very preliminary model which may prove to have nothing to do with reality like string theory as a whole
I could end all life on earth as an individual with near-future technology. You can't stop a big rock strapped to a rocket accelerated over 100 years to a fraction of light speed. Nuking every other civilization you meet is 100% the correct move.
>implying aliens wouldn't be smart and cunning enough to abuse and rape out psychologies instead of blowing us up for no fricking reason whatsoever
anon life is a resource
>life is a resource
only to the most primitive societies (us)
Nahhhh. Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets. observing life is absolutely an intellectual resource, even if just out of curiosity. You would rather observe than destroy. Why would you go up to meerkats just to kick their ass?
Staying hidden is more advantageous than being in the open. Humans are so radically different from apes despite being so damn similar to them. It wouldn't be hard at all for aliens to outplay us like fricking babies.
>Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets.
Why are you talking about a book series you CLEARLY never even read?
I know enough to determine it's moronic.
>relativity
Lol.
We know that the universe can't be both local and real. Information DOES move faster than light.
>I know enough
Clearly not. Since you said
>Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets
>muh chuds
don't reply to me homosexual
I'm not interested on your culture war one side or the other
Three Body Problem is a liberal series I bet that makes you upset 😉
>Three Body Problem is a liberal series
So you didn't read it either huh?
I did, I particularly enjoyed the final daoist message about protecting nature and the universe and the ultimate embodiment of humanity in Cheng Xin’s struggle to show benevolence to the universe.
>humanity literally gets enslaved and forced to move to australia because they elected some woman who believed the trisolarians wouldn't kill us after learning about our culture
There I spoonfed you part of the book plot now you can stop making moronic arguments
No you clearly didn't read anything other than plot summaries
Seething chud moron who can’t handle a based story made by a liberal (which is typical in the art world for obvious reasons).
you already exposed the fact that you didn't read the book
here is your last (You) next time come up with better bait
Kek literally grasping at imaginary straws. Love watching a chud unwravel. Almost as much as I loved reading the best sci fi ever written (Three Body Problem trilogy).
Nothing makes me upset, I am a rock in the river of your mom's pussy juice.
>Unless you could create/simulate your own life/planets
Yes. Unless you can simulate life on countless planets in your home basement, you aren't going to be going around and destroying countless planets hosting life randomly. You are going to be studying them, not obliterating them. You may even abuse them, or use them as toys, because there is absolutely -NOTHING- their lessers could do about it. Humans barely perceive a fraction of everything. You can't even explain sight to a blind man. Humans would be piss easy to deal with, WITHOUT violence. We are that pathetic. The humans becoming complacent part of the series is the only good part because it's BELIEVABLE. Humans being unlimited in their advancement is a bad part, though. We have limits, and we are seeing it in real life now.
The human advancement in the book was wholly believable provided you arent an imbecile that thought this was hard scifi just because a chink wrote it. This was just a typical xianxia series with a veneer of scifi.
Dude relativity means that everything has a lag. Can't plan for shit. You see an ant, this ant has already sent an armada towards you to frick in the ass a thousand years ago. Can't plot with a lag like that. Just boom any potential danger.
>anon life is a resource
It's dangerous. The moment you learn about someone sometimes millions of years have passed. They might have already sent a nuke towards you millions of years ago despite you only learning about them at this exact moment. Space is shit.
>the moment you learn about someone sometimes millions of years have passed.
It is impossible for our universe to be both local and real. Light being the limit is a spook.
It can be if you consider time as a shape of it lol. And gravity points toward that as being true.
Elaborate
Personally I’m most excited for the Oppenheimer 2.0 storyline around Rey Diaz.
They’ll write him out so they can fit in some trannies and homosexuals that weren’t in the books
>massive armada presented for literally no reason
>somehow none of them notices this thing accelerating
i like dark forest, but this was one of the dumbest bits in the entire book
>massive armada presented for literally no reason
It’s literally explained to you in multiple chapters what a politically contentious matter first contact becomes and why the multiple fleet nations want to be there at the same time.
>somehow none of them notices this thing accelerating
They do. The damage is just done super quick.
You mistake me thinking it's moronic with not 'getting it'.
You mistake you thinking it’s moronic for me not seeing you’re moronic
You're the same loser that defends Death's End.
Your opinions are meaningless.
Stop being Sinophobic.
Three Body Problem discussions on Cinemaphile have been pretty good so far but I have a feeling that’s ending since polcucks have started to join them now that they know Netflix is producing an adaptation. Looks like this thread is just gonna be them seething over China.
China seethe is already here
Im OK with China, but it’s obvious it’s getting praised to kingdom come because it’s chinese
No, it’s not obvious and you’d know that if you actually read the books which deserve the praise,
Too anime and too Chinese in thought for me to like, sorry
Anon, The Martian was praised to kingdom come. It's not a high bar
It's hilarious because none of them read the books, probably only read the plot summary on wikipedia or something.
If more people had read the book they would be talking about how the guy creates his own perfect waifu tulpa. Or how immensely based the author is considering almost every single bad thing that happens to humanity is directly caused by woman actions. But of course the wikipedia summary doesn't say this so they don't know
Nice strawman homosexual. The wikipedia summary straight up tells you about the chink b***h right away. Youre just a butthurt fanboy that gets in his feefees when people dont mindlessly ballwash your chinkslop.
It’s similar to their hate of Inglorious Basterds which is the closest you can get to Sven Hassel novels in film. If only chuds knew how stupid they were, they could actually achieve their goals lol.
Acting like a snotty c**t will make more people shit on your favorite series, keep it up chinky dinky
>I hate chuds
>wow this book is based because a woman is to blame!
Ask me how I know you've never had sex
The xuy you’re replying to gets mad at being called a chud and is literally a chud. Xe loves chuds.
this author thought sixty years was enough for human men to lose all features of masculinity and end up becoming indistinguishable from human women lul
typical chink obsessed with femininity
Chink men already are barely different from chink women though. Have you ever been to China?
Mediocre book series only taken seriously because it’s written by a Chinese man and the only hard-ish sci fi praised in decades because the Hugos and publishers have been icing straight white males from the genre
It won a frickton of awards all over the world. I understand having a dislike toward it though.
>hard SF
>it's about folding reality and some other dumb shit
But you are right it's being pushed because it's made by a Chink
So the three body problem refers to the triple star system in Alpha Centauri right? And how the aliens could not solve it despite their advanced tech. Couldn't they just migrate to another solar system? I guess they attack humans to take over earth but still, I dunno haven't read the books.
>Couldn't they just migrate to another solar system? I guess they attack humans to take over earth but still, I dunno haven't read the books.
This is exactly why they invade Earth.
>I dunno haven't read the books.
yeah we know
Should be
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-body_problem
but since it's by a Chinese, so statistically likely a chicom, it can be anything really.
I'm never reading the books.
Here, I'll accurately and briefly summarize the entire series for you so you don't need to waste your time:
Book 1
>Woman hates herself and wants to kill humanity. Man discovers aliens by playing VRChat. A boat sails through that laser trap in Resident Evil.
Book 2
>Chinese man creates a tulpa and falls in love before killing her then uses his government powers to get a waifu and be rich. Hugo Chavez tries to blow up Mercury. Donald Rumsfeld wants to make some kinda suicide squad. Someone decides to shoot a brain at the ayys for the fun of it (this doesn't actually happen in the book but is retconned in the third because there were no original plans to continue the series after this book). Chinese man gets waifu taken away, goes to the future, threatens to kill himself and the ayyys kneel before him Vegeta style, resulting in a new Golden Age for humanity.
Book 3
>Dumb woman gets into power, IMMEDIATELY, I mean literally within one second of gaining power, dooms the world and turns humanity into slaves. Ayys discover their love of anime waifus and make one to rule humanity. Astronauts decide to kill the ayys and humanity. The universe realizes 3D is pig disgusting and return to glorious 2D ayynime. Brain shot at ayys actually loved Dumb woman and tells her about 2D anime time after the Ayys decide to resurrect him for who knows what reason. Some guys decide they're just going to create their own universes with blackjack and hookers because the current universe is too lame.
Not exaggerating. You now no longer have to read any of the books. There is no book 4 no matter what anyone tells you and book 3 is objectively the worst in the series.
>uses his government powers to get a waifu and be rich.
Jesus, someone who never read the books giving a plot summary of the book. Blind leading the blind here
>uhh yes, i need you to find a waifu that meets these EXACT criteria, it's part of the plan bro
>yes, i also need a giant mansion in the mountains and lots of expensive wine to woo her
>NOOOO YOU CAN'T JUST TAKE AWAY MAI WAIFU AND SEND THEM TO THE FUTURE IN ORDER TO FORCE ME TO ACTUALLY WORK!!
Sounds like a massive waste of time
Sounds like a sci-fi spin on typical chinese Cultivation slop but almost without the absurd power levels
>The aliens are influencing pop culture to make everyone too gay to fight them
People really thought this shit was amazing Sci Fi.
That’s literally not a plot point. Read summaries better moron.
Is what actually happens less stupid than that?
maybe read and find out or keep making up shit
No, just tell me.
Yes. There are however accurate predictions about feminization of men in a very technologically advanced and comfortable society that have nothing to do with the alien conflict.
So the gynocracy and femboy army wasnt just a shitposting thing?
It is, you’re assuming things based off incomplete information and no understanding of context and narrative. I’m not spoonfeeding you the entire story and subject matter.
Where's the hidden CHINA WILL GROW LARGER message in this movie? It has to be there somewhere.
There is in the sense that the future language of the world is an amalgamation of chinese and english.
But at no point the book spouts china nationalistic crap. Not that it would make any sense to do from the second book onward anyway
>the future language of the world is an amalgamation of chinese and english
This has to be the most implausible aspect, even more than the physics.
Those are highly incompatible languages (leaving aside Singlish which is just sticking "lah" or "leh" at random on the end of english sentences)
>it’s implausible a language used by 1.5 billion people + will be part of an amalgamated lingua franca of the future
Please no more seething
Only to gabble to each other in their squalid homeland. They never try to use it to talk to foreigners. It's completely unsuited to discussing advanced topics.
Yes? They're completely different, the rules are totally different. English would never stoop so low as to be a tonal language, that's primitive.
The books were pretty critical of China though calling it out on moronic demographic policies and how it's a dog eat dog country.
It wasnt critical at all and you’re confusing its communism era pretext with criticism of the nation to cope with enjoying liberal media while being a chud.
>It has to be there somewhere.
It is by way of making the main characters Chinese and making characters of other nationalities bumbling morons (relatively speaking) or background people. The course of planet Earth's fate is also very largely determined, for better or worse, by actions of Chinese people.
In book 1, Chinese team manages to get behind all the secrets. The antagonist is also Chinese.
Book 2, a Chinese underachiever saves the day. In book 3, a Chinese woman fricks shit up for everyone, but she manages to stay central untill the very end of the story.
Imo, I don't really care and it's not really all that different than what burgers do in their heroistic stories and movies.
>Earth's fate is also very largely determined, for better or worse, by actions of Chinese people
We're doomed.
Chink foreign propaganda is very smart. The idea is that it's DEMORALISING. Oh, noes, we can do nothing about it, stuff, while they pump their youth with GI Joe cartoons.
CHINA NUMBER ONE
AA MY BELOVED
DEHYDRATE
The whole dark forest thing only works if you presume every civilization is going to be 100% planet bound.
nope
>The whole dark forest thing only works if you presume every civilization is going to be 100% planet bound.
that's the dumbest counter argument for the dark forest thing I have ever read and that's saying something considering this thread alone.
Its a fantasy series. His take is no dumber than whatever the chink writer told you to believe.
>His take is no dumber
His (your) take on it is far dumber because if everybody was planet bound Dark Forest would make no sense at all.
That's the thing. The thing he (you) said that is necessary for dark forest to be believable is one of the few things that would actually make it not believable at all.
Yeah cool the chink dm for your DnD campaign said it so it has to be so. Whst an enlightened midwit you are.
Good luck stopping a civilization that starts spreading using von Neumann probes.
probably that's why some civs developed physics bending tech
Instead of hitting a planet with an RKV, just hit the star instead.
That said, RKVs aren't as hard to defend against as you'd think. You'd see them picking up speed ages away, long before they are near light speed. The accelerator beams and the sheer radio noise as it tears through the interstellar gas would make it obvious.
Then you just throw up a screen of dust. Its own speed would tear it into ionised plasma. Then your planetary magnetosphere will deflect it without difficulty.
This is addressed in the book I'm talking about right now. The attack is planned centuries in advance and the objects are small enough to evade our long scanning abilities until its too late. In the book, we have a sophisticated detection system and have colonized the solar system.
This also occurs in KS Robinson's gay stupid book, 3012 or something. I can't remember. KSR is a fricking hack. But yeah, the enemy sends little pebbles decades in advance that don't form one high-speed mass until the last possible second to evade destruction.
Interesting.
>little pebbles decades in advance that don't form one high-speed mass until the last possible second to evade destruction.
That's a good trick.
He's right, though. FTL drives are possible in this universe, assuming a civ achieves it, and they start hopping around universe, they can avoid torpedoes at their sun.
I've watched a ton of youtube content and have been spoiled on this series.
I know the solar system gets flattened into 2D. I know a few ships made it out of the solar system and started to colonize other systems eventually. Two characters go to one of these planets and emerge millions of years later. Do the books ever illustrate where humanity is at as a species after these millions of years? Or does the book focus on those two characters
That whole thing happens at the very end of the last book and it focuses on the characters and not the surviving human civilization at that point, yeah. It's not the focus of the books at all.
What am I looking at here? Is this a flouride molecule in drinking water?
how is the dark forest first strike thing an issue if apparently there are civilizations in this shit that can change the universal constants and delete spatial dimensions?
I mean that’s literally a reason for first strike tactics to exist.
presumably if you have that level of developer-like control of reality a really fast rock or laser coming at you in 3 dimensions wouldn't be a problem
Bro please read the books instead of being a summarygay. It’s literally explained to you why such destructive weapons are rarely used in favor of other “less” destructive weapons. I’ll give you a hint - it parallels MAD game theory.
NO I DON'T WANT TO I WANT TO READ THE 1632 BOOKS AND JACK OFF
t.Bulgarian pikeman with a .50 cal hole in him.
attacking a superior civilization is a bad idea
That is the entire fricking point.
W.t.f. am I looking at and what is this?
Strong interaction matter
One of my sperm travelling down your mother's throat
alien spacecraft
You know I think I read this book. But it was called Revelation Space and was much better at tackling the Fermi-paradox then this Chinese drivel
As much as I love RoEP, TDE borrowed heavily from The Killing Star.
*TDF
but for real, it has the exact same rules of galactic game theory, there's a pasta that goes around from that novel, something like "if you're in central park in the dark, don't call out"
that's directly lifted from TKS
>"if you're in central park in the dark, don't call out"
See this is dumb because maybe you are calling out because you want the guy to come looking for you, and then you jump on him.
But you only use this tactic when you’re absolutely sure you can take on what gets baited
The same logic applies both ways. The one stalking the night has to be certain he can kill his victim and that he isn't being baited by 20 cops sitting in the bushes.
Don't tell me you never heard of people getting robbed or killed by somebody pretending they are in trouble and need help.
You literally just repeated what I just said you moron.
Are you trying to get flattened into 2D? Because that's how you get flattened into 2D.
>Are you trying to get flattened into 2D? Because that's how you get flattened into 2D.
kek
I do hope this series turns ini anime when 2d happens.
theres absolutely 0 chance that there is some ancient predator civilization in our galaxy lurking in the dark.
dark forest falls apart when you realize that its impossible to hide anyways, earth has been shouting in central park for hundreds of millions of years and nobody came.
if there was anybody nearby who wanted the real estate or snuff out potential competition, they would have arrived before humans even evolved
You guys are going to incite the midwits into an autistic frenzy with these talks.
Its not about the real estate except for the trisol crisis.
It's about that scene at the end of Casino when the bosses are deciding who to whack. Dark Forest boils down to "why take a chance?"
radio waves dont matter, the fact that earth is habitable has been broadcast into the universe for hundreds of millions of years through its light spectrum alone.
we're already on the cusp of getting atmospheric data from exoplanets, at the end of this millenium, we will probably be able to keep tabs on every single planet in the galaxy with large enough space telescopes. all the information about everything out there is available, its impossible to hide from someone that just looks for you.
plus the fact that its idiotic to assume that all civilizations would arrive at the stage at the same time, someone must've been the first.
even a headstart of 100k years, the blink of an eye in galactic timescales, gives you such an enormous advantage in this game that you win by default because you can colonize or sterilize every single planet before your competitors even use stone tools.
the fact that earth managed to just get by unbothered is proof that there is nobody else within millions of lightyears from us
Or no one has cracked travelling at speeds faster than light, wormholing, whatever.
You don't need traveling faster than the speed of light. Launching von neumann probes at 75% the speed of light (possible with focused lasers) would colonize the entire galaxy within 1 million years time. And colonize the entire local group in 100 million years time.
We're just alone.
Yes, because a speculative model by a based science man isn't reality, there must be no life says a living thing that emerged from the stuff and laws of a possibly infinite volume.
Maybe they just started half a million years ago?
It is, it's just hand-waving science-magic not even worthy of Dr. Who.
>Maybe they just started half a million years ago?
We actually did a large survey because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres, we found 0 signatures in the nearest million galaxies including the milky way and andromeda.
IF there is other life out there they are less advanced than us. Of course there is the non-zero chance they are at exactly our level of development, but considering that we will most likely launch our first von neumann probe this century that just seems like cosmic irony and not realistic.
>We actually did a large survey because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres, we found 0 signatures in the nearest million galaxies including the milky way and andromeda.
Do you have a link to that paper?
>because you can easily detect waste heat from dyson spheres
We are still trying to discover how our own planet's core works, but we are SO KNOWLEGABLE about how a theoretical construction we have never seen would behave.
Man, Astrophysicists are like Priests, bullshitters on a lifelong mission to live comfortably selling unprovable bunk and avoiding real work at all costs. They lost my faith when they started filling the entire cosmos with undetectable Dark Angel Feathers to make their maths add up.
Etherchads were vindicated. Bad enough moders sōyentists cant even do math or observations but then they have to ripoff their betters.
Ether was the dark matter of its day
>here's in the 19th century, we know how solid materials work
>what if there's an imperceptible, extremely rigid solid (not a fluid, a solid) that permeates space
>and the transverse vibrations of this solid are what light is
>oh the longitudinal vibrations? they're far faster than light and have never been detected but never mind.
this
You’re replying to a pseudo intellectual and then using their pseudo science as a vilification of astrophysicists. No real astrophysicists or proper scientific study has ever claimed they understand the nature of Dyson spheres nor has any engineer or roboticist claim von Neumann machines are possible.
have you ever interacted was a physicist? They would walk in thinking they understand mechanical engineering cause "it's just basic physics" and get shit wrong all the time. A bunch of "theoretical" geniuses
It's a basic function of entropy a dyson sphere would have significant amount of infrared signature. In a way it would be visible as very weak "dark" infrared stars on telescopes.
Doesn't even matter how it is constructed or how it works. Aliens that use dyson spheres wouldn't have solved entropy, because they wouldn't need dyson spheres if they had an unlimited energy source by solving entropy.
What if the aliens didnt need to solve entropy because they developed palantíri and were able to scam the Maiar out of renewable low caron footprint energy.
>They lost my faith when they started filling the entire cosmos with undetectable Dark Angel Feathers to make their maths add up.
then you don't understand physics.
i'd recommend the following playlist to catch you up:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD79A28ED01799FE7
tldw dark matter was originally hypothesized to exist because it was the only alternative to massively altering our equations for gravity, which we had no idea how to do while also keeping them consistent with observations in sub-galactic scales.
since then, the dark matter hypothesis has survived some testing. eg we have observed the predicted gravitational lensing it should cause IRL.
we still have no fricking clue what it is, what its made of.
the story with dark energy is similar, except we're even more clueless. but either it exists, or a frickton of our already established theories are way off, which doesn't agree with observations is smaller scales.
>the center of every galaxy is a super-massive black hole
>we know gravitational lensing is a real thing
>gravitational lensing of the centers of galaxies can't be affecting our observations of galaxies
gravitational lensing has nothing to do with the zwicky paradox
it does however provide evidence for the existence on dark matter, because we have observed it happening without any galaxies being present (and no, not black holes either, the pattern of the lensing is too diffuse)
again, if you want to be caught up, watch that playlist
its VERY light on math.
>gravitational lensing has nothing to do with the zwicky paradox
When we observe galaxies from millions of lightyears away, we're seeing them in a sphere of gravitational lensing generated by the black hole, which would be thinnest at the edges, thickest at the middle.
>We're wrong, but we don't want to admit it so we'll just make some phantom matter up to make our shit work
Am I getting this right? This is literal religion lol
its more like
>Newtonian physics have been proven and utilized countless times
>observations of galaxies millions of lightyears away don't perfectly coincide with newtonian physics (the inner rings rotate slower than the outer rings)
do we dump all newtonian physics and start from scratch or do we model the dependency in a manner that is consistent?
>do we dump all newtonian physics
Yes.
yea, completely clueless about physics
EVERYTHING in physics is WRONG. literally every fricking thing.
but its USEFUL.
in math, and ONLY in math, you can positively PROVE things. you can PROVE, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that (a + b)^2 = a^2 + 2*a*b + b^2
in every other science, including physics, the best you can do is propose THEORIES. you can't PROVE them, you can only TEST them
does the universe behave the way my theory says it should? can i find this weird shit that my theory predicts out there? if yes, we have a good theory. not a TRUE one, not a PROVEN one, but a USEFUL one.
theories are MODELS, not claims of TRUTH.
out current *best* model for gravity is einsteins general relativity. it has been thoroughly tested and has proven itself to be extremely useful in explaining/predicting the behavior of the universe, at least in sub-galactic scales.
however, we have observations that it doesn't agree with.
like, for instance, stars along the edges of the galaxies that are rotating faster than the predicted mass of said galaxy should allow. and physisists are not dummies, we have good ways of guessing the mass of stars and can extrapolate fairly accurately the mass of galaxies.
so this (and other things, DYOR) is what prompted us to guess "hey, maybe there's some more mass there that doesn't show up in telescopes"
after all, it was either this, or somehow gravity changes behavior at large scales, or maybe everything we know about stars is super wrong, or something equally implausible.
and so far, this hypothesis seems to hold up, see previous mentions of apparent grav lensing absent any visible mass to cause it.
bla bla bla, sounds like some horseshit. If your theory is incorrect, admit it instead of blatantly making shit up to correct for it.
dark matter isn't needed to correct for anything locally.
Again, positing dyson swarms, vn probes, and any class civilization is wildly speculative from the standpoint of a civilization that has yet to meet the lowest criteria. Check your priors and go with what you know is true at this moment; VN probes do not exist, nobody can harvest a star, and life is a thing. You're asking every potential civilization to conform to 20th century human spit balling which may indeed prove wildly off-mark.
We're talking about what WE would do knowing what WE know, with little regard to what is or isn't actually possible. It could be that what we view as an engineering hurdle today is proven an impossibility tomorrow and to base any large scale speculation on our primitive theory is premature. Show me a self replicating probe and we'll have something. Exists on paper is never going to be adequate, I don't care how autistic Von Neumann was.
100% correct but midwits will always deny this because they WANT to believe.
We are most likely not only alone within millions of lightyears but simply completely alone in the entire universe.
Why does humanity being alone scare people? It means we can colonise the galaxy in peace
Also means we know God made us
Stop replying to yourself. Your stupid argument has already been addressed by the book.
humanity being alone means countless other "humanities" have popped up and pooped out over the lifespan of the universe and none of them made it out of their solar systems. that god isn't real and there's nothing in the universe for us but being ground back into inert matter.
believing that everyone else went extinct and we will too is just another false blackpill
its hubris to assume that EVERY SINGLE civilization in the universe simply shit the bed for some reason instead of climbing the darwinian ladder they evolved on.
the idea that we're the first in our corner of the universe is both more realistic and optimistic
Geez, have a bit of levity about it. Even if we are alone, and we do inevitably get pounded back into atoms, at least we get to sparkle for a second. A human is closer to a little fae sprite than anything.
NOOOO REDDIT SAID WE'RE NOT SPECIAL GOD ISN'T REAL NOOOOOO
You misunderstand the nature of the universe and the weapons. It’s like thinking a sole nation that has nukes would just start nuking everyone. Nukes destroy their home as well so it’s not in that nations interest to continuously nuke everyone. They only nuke major threats. Same idea here. The world ending weapons these aliens have eventually destroy the universe so they’d rather not use them all the time.
what the hell are you smoking? you have some arcane knowledge of the types of weapons the yet undiscovered aliens use?
you dont need nukes when the simple fact of being first allows you to arrive at your enemies soil when they are still fish crawling out of the swamp.
the universe is not only incredibly large but also incredibly old, its entirely possible that earth could've hosted intelligent life millions of years ago already if some mass extinctions or evolutionary pathways went just slightly different.
being first is everything that matters in "dark forest" because it lets you do whatever you want and you have all the time in the world to spread everywhere and take everything, without a single shot fired
>you have some arcane knowledge of the types of weapons the yet undiscovered aliens use?
It’s part of the Three Body Trilogy book. You can go leave to go have your christlarp pseudo intellectual debates. We are talking about a Netflix show based on a book ITT.
>the fact that earth managed to just get by unbothered is proof that there is nobody else within millions of lightyears from us
Or that midwit forest is a moronic concept.
>the fact that earth managed to just get by unbothered is proof that there is nobody else within millions of lightyears from us
Or maybe the alien species aren't as cynical as we'd expect
OR
As the book literally explains - the universe is big and aliens cannot easily find earth just from random radio broadcasts, they would need much more specific coordinates.
>dey be super speshul powerfulest smartestest but uhh ehh they ackchyually can't detect humans when it's inconvenient for the plot
To put it in layman terms: radio broadcasts would be coming from a location earth no longer is in. By the time the waves travel any distance big enough to be found by an alien race, the earth would’ve continued in its journey along the spin of the galaxy and would be in a completely different location. For a civ to find a specific planet they would need coordinates based off a whole bunch of other stars around it which would serve as a “fingerprint” of the location. You’re not as smart as the writer of this book bro. I’m sorry.
Holy shit, I'm screencapping this.
I deleted my basedjack folder so just imagine I greentexted this and slapped a basedjack next to it.
DURP all you would need to do is go from the origin in a straight line away from the big bang to find the planet
Stars don't move very far in a hundred or even a thousand years.
... yes they do
Not so far that you're like "holy shit where did that signal come from"
Yes. An alien civilization trying to find us is like us trying to find a specific particle. Uncertainty principle. We can't determine the exact location, velocity, and direction of a particle. Even if we're broadcasting our location, it would take multiple pings to find us.
There are a lot of stars and a lot of planets and it takes hundreds to hundreds of thousands of years for broadcasts to travel around the galaxy between various stars. There’s just no way for a civilization to deduce where it came from.
The galaxy is 100,000 ly wide. I wasn't talking about someone on the other side of the galaxy trying to figure out where we are. I meant someone close enough to reasonably get here slower than light ie within 100 ly or at most 1000ly. At those ranges, stellar motion won't be a serious impediment.
It is a serious impediment even at 100 light years. Even trisolarans needed multiple transmissions with location coordinates to confirm earth’s locations.
Doesn't even matter because their trajectory is extremely predictable on huge time scales. And they super smart incomprehensible tech ayy lmaos would need to somehow point their big rock at the target. Which is apparently super hard because
>the earth would’ve continued in its journey along the spin of the galaxy and would be in a completely different location. For a civ to find a specific planet they would need coordinates based off a whole bunch of other stars around it which would serve as a “fingerprint” of the location.
In layman's terms, of course.
Without knowing initial conditions it is almost impossible to deduce such things. That’s the core of the three body problem, only multiplied to a galactic scale.
It's not a three-body problem. It's analogous to plotting trajectory of Mars from Earth. After receiving a continuous transmission from it for some time.
Incorrect.
>It's not a three-body problem.
correct. Its an 18 body problem. and also a [every object in the galaxy] body problem.
It's literally two stars rotating around the same galactic core.
>their trajectory is extremely predictable on huge time scales
I'm not so sure about that. There could be a lot of interactions that are hard to model.
>what is leading the target
Super hard, apparently. But only in layman's terms.
we already found thousands of exoplanets with our current technology
just build two dozen huge space telescopes and you will have surveyed every single planet in the galaxy within a few hundred years.
all the information about their atmospheres and likely habitability. the light off planets is always there, you just have to look.
light lag or active radio broadcasts dont matter at all. you can take a look at the entire galaxy if you just look long and hard enough
You need to know where to look first. That’s where the problem lies. You can try to set up probes for every exoplanet in existence but that will take a lot of time and resources to set up.
just look at every star, planets with civilizations will be around stars.
400 billion stars sounds intimidating at first but the timescale in which to realistically do this would also be hundreds, if not thousands of years
resources available to advanced civilizations + timescales involved make this not impossible at all, even advantageous if you are paranoid about game theory or need a planet to settle on.
the resources are well spent because you will be able to do it again and have intel on everything, forever. just build more telescopes, its a lot easier than sending an invasion fleet and actually going there
>okay we've scanned all 400 billion stars, how long did that take?
>4 million years sir
>shit okay start again
>guess we just build telescopes until it only takes us a couple decades for a full sweep because we have the resources of an entire solar system at our disposal and this task will be essential for our survival so we will be willing to spend it
>a couple decades for a full sweep
that's 20 billion stars a year.
thousands of telescopes each looking for a couple of minutes at a star to collect data.
not impossible, but very useful information gathering in fact, worthwhile for every capable civilization.
we will likely start doing the same in a few hundred years
it currently takes the webb telescope hours to gather as much light/data as the hubble did in months, and its still not enough to resolve planets around stars.
so the progress in 40 years was good?
going by that curve, a few hundred years will be enough to build good enough telescopes for this job. thats still basically instantaneous in galactic timescales and a viable strategy
>we will likely start doing the same in a few hundred years
We will either be extinct or sharpening arrowheads in a few hundred years with how things are going.
To put it in layman terms: There are visible biosignatures visible even with earth technology (JWST), there could be visible hundreds of millions of years before a technological species even evolves there and broadcast it out to the universe for an insane amount of time so that everyone can clearly see there is life there.
Aliens don't need the fricking radio broadcasts, they either already know you exist and don't care at all. Or we are simply alone and that's why everything looks empty and no stars have been obviously touched yet.
Bro you sound moronic every time you do your christcuck larpery. “Everything looks empty” b***h please we don’t even know what we’re looking at or what to look for. Sit down.
The book actually addresses the fact of how loud humanity has been during the radio era of the recent technological age, but the truth is those waves take a long time to travel through space and make any significant impact to humanity’s safety in a significant timeframe. It also tends to get lost in a lot of other galactic “noise” .
Also our "loudness" only matters to the trisols.
To "out" yourself to the greater universe you need to broadcast your specific coordinates. This is addressed when he picks the dummy star to be destroyed.
Even the trisols needed two "shots" to find us.
>listen to all 3 books on audible during daily commutes
>get to pretend I read them before the adaptation
Life is good.
You only cheated yourself.
Only if you don't pay attention. It's not hard to remember things from an audiobook.
same
yeah I don't remember any name
except AA
Are you blind?
Audiobooks are for the blind.
I don’t have the attention span to read but i can listen.
found it
>flag
Nice try Chaim. Space is our birthright and all xenos must die.
The israelite didn't write it, he merely stole it and passed it off as creepypasta, just like the old testament.
Charles Pellegrino and somebody somebody wrote it.
I'm still turning turning on the antimatter engine. Gotta crack a few eggs to make an omelet.
>Charles Pellegrino
This guy came up with quite a realistic antimatter driven starship that could acheive .92 lightspeed without too much difficulty.
The ship in Avatar was based on it, but less based.
>realistic antimatter driven starship that could acheive .92 lightspeed
This is it:
https://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/slowerlight3.php#valkyrie
.92c requires more mass ratio than you probably want for an antimatter ship, but it can do lower speeds much more easily.
No beamed propulsion either, it's a proper starship.
The most realistic part of three body problem is that women cause literally every problem there is and doom our universe in the process. then the punishment for the woman who sealed our fate is that she gets evacuated off the planet so she can live. mandatory reading for if your will ever wavers and you start to think women aren't that bad.
I really like this trilogy. The second and third are difficult to separate, the first a bit weaker. The Sci fi to actual Sci fi nerds might not be groundbreaking, but it's the fact he pulls so much into it and has interesting political and societal themes going on.
I think this series is going to be very difficult to do visually the deeper in it gets, eg how do you represent the bomb in the third book and do it justice.
You’re right. These are true book-stories, meaning that you get the most out of them as books since they are so concept heavy. A good example is Wandering Earth 1/2 which are also stories by Cixin Liu. They’re great movies but at times you can feel a bit “rushed” or “overwhelmed” by the amount of plot and concepts thrown at you and you can tell these stories would be better to read since they feature so many ideas worth exploring. The Three Body series will be similar. They’ll have to cut a lot of stuff to make it more digestible in the show/film form, and I doubt it will be able to come close (let alone surpass) the novels.
Who invented the three body game? Like I get it was etf, but how did they end up with enough information, and what was the purpose of the actual game? I never really understood all of this. What was the timeline between alien response and the game?
The sophons helped the Earth-Trisolaris Organization make the game to create more sympathizers as well as a place for ETO members to gather (such as in the second book with the Wallbreakers). The sophons probably also helped with various processing. At that point the sophons were sharing info and tech with the ETO and Mike Evans.
Is the author right about aliens, bros? Are they really going to fling a giga nuke at Earth the second they find out there's complex life on it?
Ur only hope like
doesnt say is for there to be a policeman to run to in the scary night park.
You have to hope at least TWO civilizations buddied up to create a star alliance dedicated to stopping this moronic shit so they can flourish. Which is the whole social contract philsophy crap.
That person from the cap also assumes that wimps dont get to the top, but parasitic and even co-dependent species relationships exist. Cooperation is not foreign to survival. Humanity got to where it's at not just through social communities but domestication of other species as well. These ideas are foreign to the chinese tho
>These ideas are foreign to the chinese tho
Well, not entirely.
So you're telling me the only way out of the Dark Forest scenario is love?
Yes. You need to fug them before they fug you
Why are they showing the alien hand in the trailers, considering we get no visual idea of them in the books whatsoever
How did humanity know the sophons were there?
They didn’t at the start. Only a select few were in contact with the sophons/trisolarans (ie the Earth Trisolaris Organization). After the discovery of sophons humanity just assumes they’re always around, even after the Earth-Trisolaris Conflict ends and the Trisolarans disappear.
Yeah, but when they make the electrically charged room in the third, how do they know what the sophons are if the science behind them is blocked
What?
In the 3rd book when they build a room that the sophons can't get into how did they know l that. Like how did humans actually know what sophons were beyond tiny spies.
You should read the books.
By that point they had the technology to detect sophons and they also had developed a MAD truce with trisolaris, allowing them to interact with sophons directly. Not to mention the anime girl robot representing all trisolaris and sophons. After the trisolarans leave they still think sophons are around out of suspicion and paranoia even though they no longer detect the sophons. Perhaps they were never able to be 100% sure.
They were actively fricking with people, specifically scientists' best and brightest. They were also recruiting.
ELIMINATE HUMAN TYRANNY
THE WORLD BELONGS TO TRISOLARIS
The thing that I felt about the book is how rapidly it continuously changed. Its a trilogy, but the characters change the timeline changes, the enemies ability changes. I just think to do it right normies would be turned off the show. Think about how much more limited the change was in got.
I read half of the first book and was so fricking bored I had to stop. Chink writers are so awful. They write characters as soulless automatons instead of actual human beings.
That’s just your typical sci fi. Try reading Tau Zero by Poul Anderson or Foundation by Isaac Asimov or Rendezvous with Rama by Arthur Clarke. In fact in comparison to those books Three Body trilogy actually has way more emotionality and humanistic nuances.
Blindsight is a far better book than TBP or any of the ones you listed.
Its just another good high concept book. It makes no sense to compare the two.
>Blindsight
lol, no. Best first contact scifi is Contact, shame it was already made into an underwhelming movie.
Contact is fricking horrible
Haven't seen it.
I think we can all agree it's a bad idea to start reading Party Approved Chink rubbish sci-fi.
Just because they've stolen good space technology from better countries doesn't mean they can write good science fiction.
Shit, that anon from earlier was spot-on.
slither leave, Qtard. No I don’t care about your nationalistic wars. Pan-Species Communism WILL happen.
>Paranoid society of timid cowards write paranoid, timid science fiction.
Remember, these are the guys who built a monumental wall, visible from space, to keep out men with larger penises.
The whole thing is about inadequate asian penises at the end of the day. A foreign element likely has you out-wanged, so it makes sense to destroy him before your gf experiences normal sized genitalia.
Their future sci-fi seems informed by their past experiences, they get "found" by superior races, get boots on their necks...
Their Captain Kirk is going to be some conniving coward who backstabs his enemies after copious groveling.
When you read about von neumann probes, something humanity is probably capable of creating in the next couple of decades you realize we're actually alone in the universe.
The fact that there are still visible stars at all by definition proves to us that there are no advanced alien species out there.
Humanity is alone or at the very least the most advanced species in this corner in the universe which will be the equivalent of being alone due to us being the only intelligent species in our gravitationally bound local group.
You underestimate how big the universe is
Except no, VN probes are assumed to be an engineering hurdle but may be impossible given our nascent understanding of almost every step involved. You should take stock of what you do know, there is a planet teeming with life, and not bet on super science that reflects our current level of sophistication.
The K scale is wildly speculative. Its like declaring the universe barren because its the 19th century and you don't see any grand steam powered civilizations. We have no idea what is truly going on.
Anyone sophisticated enough to travel/communicate over interstellar distances would also be sophisticated enough to cloak themselves against far more primitive detection.
Again, we are thumbs up our asses on what anything would do. We're taking very human concepts and assigning them to all potential life. For all you know every civilization nopes out in a fit of pessimism and decides to die with their star.
Explain why stars still exist if a SINGLE individual of a SINGLE species could launch a SINGLE VN probe into space and all stars would disappear.
The only conclusion is that there is no advanced life out there. VN probes don't break the laws of physics and are arguably doable with current technology
False, entropic waste heat will always be detectable. They would need to solve entropy and have infinite energy to be able to hide that signature, at that point they are ascended gods that change the laws of physics, which I don't believe in.
No, we can't build vn probes. We're not remotely close. You're drunk on popsci. Also we're again assuming that they will be harvesting stars and disposing of waste heat. For all you know their concept of energy leaves our understanding of thermodynamics looking like cave scratches.
You're really failing to absorb the argument.
Everything I'm reading so far tells me this appeals exclusively to midwit redditors and I should ignore it. Le dark forest! Le relativistic bomb! Spooky scary! Give me a fricking break. Hard sci fi always has and always will be dumb since it takes our current understanding of things for granted. The only good science fiction has been written by religious men.
I don’t know if it’s just the translation rom Chinese to English but the books felt like such a slog to read. The ideas and concepts were interesting. 90% of characters felt like caricatures without any depth beyond having one motivation usually.
Absolute favourite part of the story I read up to was
>Alien Trisolarans have already infiltrated earth with countless tiny undetectable droplets allowing them to observe and hear everything, as well as delay human tech progress by altering certain aspects of physics slightly. Aliens have human collaborators working for them too
>government selects 4 people to be Wallfacers. People given unlimited funds and power to each create anti trisolaran invasion ideas. These will take hundreds of years so they keep getting put in stasis for 50 years in between checking in on the progress of their programs. They cannot say what they’re doing or make it obvious because otherwise the trisolarans will know about it and be able to stop it.
>3 wallfacers were chosen based on credentials. Last one was only chosen because for an unknown reason he was on a list the Trisolarans sent to their human collaborators as somebody to be assassinated ASAP. So human governments knew for some reason they were very afraid of him
>this last dude is the one who pulls the checkmate by threatening to reveal earth and Trisolaris location to the rest of the galaxy, having surmised the whole Dark Forest problem and knowing the trisolarans would not invade if it meant their own planet being destroyed and earth too
I stopped reading long before the last books. Eventually it felt like it had kind of run it’s journey and was middling while throwing ideas out there like how there used to be way more dimensions and they keep getting collapsed in galactic wars etc
Also I heard a lot of the more overt political commentary was cut initially because obviously it was originally written in China, published in a Chinese literary magazine and publishing house
Like I said. The version I read had the initial Chinese woman who got into contact with a trisolaran (who told her PLEASE DO NOT SEND ANYTHING ELSE, LITERALLY ANY OTHER MEMBER OF MY SPECIES WHO READS THIS WILL INVADE YOU) decide to keep contacting them anyway. Solely because her whole family had died and suffered under the Chinese communist parties rule and made her hate humanity to the point she was happy for these aliens she’d never met to either wipe us out. Or rule over us.
I find it hard to believe this could have been in the original Chinese version based on their history of censorship. But who knows.
>like how there used to be way more dimensions and they keep getting collapsed in galactic wars etc
This is the kind of idea someone writes about who lives in constant fear of fatal elevator/escalator/everything-else collapse.
Why would they want to assassinate that random guy? Did they have the ability to see the future? If so why did they fail? Either way ANYONE could have thought up a MAD solution, why did it have to be that one idiot?
Why is it praised so much when it devolves into standard techno-magic using scientific words/concepts that a shit-ton of other sci-fi/space operas have done before it? It's it the cynical attitude?
The daoist philologies of the books are really refreshing to read in sci fi. As a fan of deep ecologist literature like Fritjof Capra and Carl Sagan, I found Three Body trilogy very nice. Kurt Vonnegut would be the closest writer to Cixin Liu in my opinion.
Chinknadian hands typed this hilarious post.
Will they show the aliens in the tv show?
They never showed them or even described them as far as I remember. All art online is fan art.
Their biology describes how they survive on a planet where they have 3 suns and it alternates from super hot to freezing. And how their bodies can essentiallt absorb water, completely dry out into a husk and hibernate until it’s safe again etc
Hard to imagine what the frick that would even look like, sponge bob?
I imagined them as gecko/lizard like that lived in deserts with extremely dry scaly skin that is extremely dark to protect against radiation from multiple stars on a place where water is scarce.
They’re explained as being hyper reflective and they communicate through images/light they reflect on their bodies which is why all their thoughts are constantly exposed and they are naive to lies and human trickery at first. It’s how they create the giant communal von neuman architecture in their history lessons in the VR game.
If I was in a dark forest you're sure as shit I'd be quiet. And I'd frick up anyone else who made even a tiny noise
The third book shining a light on the fact that life shapes the universe is kino. Non environmentalists are losing big time. First us environemtalists had Avatar and now we have Three Body Kino? We are blessed, greenbros.
more 'space is an ocean' bullshit thats more about current global politics than any thing else
yawn
>christcucks agreeing with bad logic to cope with dark forest theory? It’s more likely than you think!
lots of talk about VN probes in here so im just going to ask
how the frick does these "nano bots" replicate and function
science fiction magic
they're just an idea that works under the assumption that automation will someday work so reliably that you could send self repairing probes on voyages of hundreds of years into the cosmos that use the resources of their arrival solar system (asteroids) to build copies of themselves who in turn survey further stars.
a slow but cheap way to survey the entire galaxy that "only" needs capable AI and not magic tech like hibernation of warp speed to send actual humans.
more elaborate concepts involve those VN probes to build entire space stations/biospheres for the later arrival of humans, or even have some DNA stored and breed them at the arrival destination
VN probes don't necessitate nanobots at all. It could just be very clunky 1960s sputnik probes that setup 2020s 3D printers to print new versions of itself from regolith.
The core could be some LLM like GPT-4 deciding the directives paired with some AI-vision model.
We're literally 10-20 years away from building something like that.
ok so it gets to planet and does what
Starlift the entire star away to stop it from wastefully burning or build a dyson swarm around it to harvest its energy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_lifting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyson_sphere
we can do this in 10-20 years? how do we get the energy back? that's a heck of a pipeline
>UMMMM THE THOMSON MODEL OF THE ATOM IS FLAWLESS WE JUST NEED TO MAKE UP A TON OF SHIT TO FILL IN THE GAPS, there's nothing WRONG with the model ITSELF!!!
>We're NOT suppressing information and there is NO reproducibility crisis, OKAY GOY?!?!?
... anon "dark matter" is exclusively about explaining why galaxies rotate faster at the edges, the opposite of what is expected by newtonian physics.
Hint: The "dark" in dark matter and dark energy stands for "we don't know what this shit is".
It's not like we don't admit that we have no idea about it.
Faith, since the pop basedence these redditors are slurping down might as well be a religion they can't actually explain.
You wanna know how you tell a pseudo intellectual apart from a real intellectual? The pseudo intellectual called them “Von Neumann Probes” and the real intellectual calls them “Von Neumann Machines”.
Non midwits just call them magic doohickeys.
i just want to know what the fricking things are supposed to do
it would be way cooler if instead of nano bots it was like a cumshot a la Prometheus
Von Neumann Machine sounds cooler too, I always imagine something like pic related
Explain this to me.
>1. All mass-energy in the universe is finite and created during the big bang and will slowly deplete due to entropy, meaning there is a dwindling supply of stuff to go around for
>2. Stars are the most entropy accelerating objects in the universe, wasting away energy and millions of years of potential existence by letting burn
>3. Despite us knowing this we still see stars and even can't detect any heat signatures from mega structures designed to prevent the useless burning of precious finite resources (stars)
How do you reconcile this? To me the only logical conclusion seems to be that there are no technological advanced species out there.
... why would we see heat signatures from things designed to not waste heat?
because we can't have 100% efficiency (if we could entropy wouldn't exist). The gathering of the energy from the star itself would cause infrared waste heat that we could very easily detect (and have already looked for btw).
These kinds of hypothetical structures are literally impossible lol. It's absurd people give it any sort of weight beyond being a thought exercise. The reason we don't see any extraterrestrial life out there is because the universe is moronicly big and time scales are moronicly massive. If anyone is out there they aren't near us, and if anyone is near us they're not with us in time. What's more, there's no getting out 'there'. We're all trapped in our home systems (if even that) for better or worse.
>hey lets build a structure to prevent entropic decay
>but lets not build it to prevent entropic decay
even your moronic hypothetical can't maintain any consistency.
Black holes are a far more efficient way of converting mass into energy. You feed matter into a spinning black hole, and the accretion disk radiation allows you to recover almost all of the mass-energy of the input matter. Stars are wasteful natural phenomena.
To minimize entropic decay to its absolute minimum. It's still eventually going to happen just at a slower rate.
It's like living 1 year or living a million years. It's a no-brainer to do.
Of course I'm assuming entropy can't be fixed here but if you fix entropy you are literally a god that can change laws of physics at their whims anyway so who cares at that point.
You keep assuming Dyson spheres must exist. Stop trying to come up with gotchas for your christlarpery with bad logic. It’s embarassing.
Not religious, it was a position I posted in good faith.
Dark Forest is an excellent metaphor for deterrence as a concept that people started to run with as an iron law of speculative xenopolitics and I don't get why
>and I don't get why
100% projection. The consensus among the genre writers 50 years ago was that cooperation is possible if not outright inevitable. The quality of the average human has gone down. Lower intelligence, poorer culture, inferiority of spirit.
Midwits being midwits. Same reason midwits used to elevate the Three Laws of Robotics into a something it wasnt.
I read the synopsis for all 3 books a few years ago, I felt like I got the gist. Now this one is actually good - its illustrated, quick to read, and actually tackles existential dread in the right way.
body horror disguised as scifi, one trick pony
science fiction is so fricking moronic
>After living there for some time, Cheng Xin and Guan Yifan receive an alien message aimed at all denizens of micro-universes in all languages including Earth's and Trisolaris', stating that the presence of micro-universes deprives the main universe of mass, disrupting its cycle of expansion, collapse and rebirth. Cheng Xin, accompanied by Yifan, wearily reflects on her lifetime of moral duty. They decide to disassemble the contents of the micro-universe and return the mass to the main universe, then join it in death and rebirth. They leave behind a message in a bottle and a self-sustaining terrarium for the denizens of the reborn universe to uncover.
so fricking moronic and gay lmfao
Aren't they basically immortal gods by that point and just kinda bored in their bubble?
Zhang bei hei was the most based character in the series
The most accurate sci-fi in terms of predicting mankind's future is Red Dwarf.
We are either alone in the universe. Or we are GOING to be alone in the universe after we launch our Von Neumann probes and genocide all life in the universe besides humans.
Both outcomes are equally scary.
>we are either completely fine or going to be completely fine
how are cityBlack folk so scared of being alone in space
Stop replying to yourself, suburban bible studies graduate.
>Hint: The "dark" in dark matter and dark energy stands for "we don't know what this shit is".
>
>It's not like we don't admit that we have no idea about it.
>Stop replying to yourself, suburban bible studies graduate.
This thread is a perfect example of why you shouldn't take the dumb shit you read on reddit and Popular Science as gospel. You idiots actually take academics, the slimiest most dishonest people alive at their word about all of this shit? They would NEVER lie and bullshit things to advance their careers and get funding. Definitely not, no siree.
calm down bible studies graduate, I’m sure someone will make a israelite tunnels or mel gibson thread for you soon
>you disagree therefore you are a christcuck
Please, I beg of you, try to realize how this shit actually works. Science isn't a religion like you're treating it and the overwhelming majority of uni professors are careerists slime balls who won't hesitate to falsify data and cover for each other if it benefits them to do so.
Oh I’m sorry, I just thought you were moronic because you sounded moronic and were projecting a moronic understanding of science that betrayed your love of moronation. My sincere apologies for calling you a christcuck, because you are clearly much smarter than that.
>academics, the slimiest most dishonest people alive
Those are actually priests and politicians.
but its not their word. its what's independently verifiable.
whats independently verifiable about religion?
Astrophysics PhD here, I personally think Dark Matter doesn't exist but I pretend it does because it's easier to get grants that way
this is a valid concern, in other sciences.
in physics, there's not a lot of political or monetary incentives to lie about results
and there's not a lot of ways to hide lying either. data from obseratories is generally available, math is math and other people can check it, etc etc
its not like eg a trial for a drug, which is super expensive to conduct and the formula/method for making it is secret/proprietary, so there's slim chance anyone will try to replicate it.
>this is a valid concern, in other sciences.
>in physics, there's not a lot of political or monetary incentives to lie about results
Am I talking to literal autists? I'm telling you it doesn't matter. If funding, tenure and awards are on the line all kinds of bullshit will be swept under the rug and forgotten about. This is a systemic problem of academia, its not restricted by any means to sociology journals.
woah dude did you hear Joe Rogan talk about how research institutions had to fit a quota and like suppressed all research? Wow man that means like all science is literally over and wrong.
>He says after spouting JRE guest tier midwit horseshit over an entire thread
there is always the incentive to discover something interesting to advance your career
or, if privately funded, to create results pleasing to your funders
but like i explained, quite simply i thought but apparently not, those incentives are not as present in physics, and at the same time lying about results is also much harder, since its very easy and doable for others to doublecheck your work.
the net result is that physics suffers way less from this systemic issue.
if you wanna complain about something, complain about observatories and other labs being hesitant to grant time to people working outside the currently accepted paradigm
which to be fair is kinda rational. and to be even more fair, some observatories and labs have specific policies regarding some amount of time/resources being intentionally spent on contrarian shit/extreme long shots, just in case.
this shit sounds like a ripoff of douglas adams
A true Dirk Gently adaptation has never been made.
>Be me 8 year old sci-fi fan
"Oh boy there are UFOs and aliens everywhere I'm sure we'll announce it any day now!"
>Found out how hard interstellar travel is and that faster than light travel is impossible due to relativity
"Welp UFOs aren't real but aliens surely still exist on their home planets!"
>Find out about the lack of technosignatures, biosignatures and general silence in our close neighborhood
"O-okay aliens are really rare and the universe is huge, i'm sure they are still somewhere in this galaxy though!"
>Find out about entropy, von neumann probes, dyson swarms, AI alignment problem
"Frick.... we're alone....."
Guts is wrong with context tho
we'll be the gardeners of the universe, bringing life wherever we go.
it doesnt matter if there is someone else out there or not, both possibilities are good for us
>dude my short <30 years on this earth and supreme confidence that we know everything 100% and have the highest grade technology possible have made me realize that there are no aliens out there abloobloo
Truly brave. What a journey of development this anon has gone through. Someone should make a movie about it.
>AI alignment problem
You have to be dumber than rocks to jump on board with Yud and his doomer bullshit.
Ai alignment problem is a legitimate problem and is not invented by yud(chud)kowski, anon
>Find out about the lack of technosignatures, biosignatures
We have no way to detect biosignatures yet, and there are several technosignature candidates
What sissyhypno and JRE does to a mfer. Dont take ayahuasca bro the retreat shaman will literally pimp you out.
My birthday is coming up soon. I'm thinking of getting this trilogy, instead of the Hyperion Cantos series, to read next. Or should I do the opposite?
Get the 3Body Trilly because it’s going to get a Netflix adaptation soon that will bring a whole wave of normies that will ruin it.
I saw and that's what I'm worried about too. I probably will never watch it either since Netflix is dogshit.
HEY moron! Let me help you, and hopefully other helpless morons.
STEP 1
>Look for context clues
>In this case it's in the very first post
Why are the Trisolarians such sinophobes?
>look for words you don't recognize
>in my case, "Trisolarians"
STEP 2, AND THIS IS A TRICKY ONE!
>>>on PC:
>Click, Hold and DRAG your cursor over your CONTEXT CLUE (the word "Trisolarian" in this example)
>RIGHT CLICK your highlighted word(s)
>LEFT CLICK on [ Search Google for "Trisolarian" ]
>click on some links that seem promising in your new persuit of knowledge (notice how I followed multiple links, desiretoknowmore.gif)
>>>on Mobile:
>hold your finger over you CONTEXT CLUE
>release after it highlights
>tap [ Search Google ]
>tap on some links that seem promising in your new persuit of knowledge
STEP 3
>SUCCESS! YOU WERE ABLE TO ANSWER YOUR OWN QUESTION THROUGH YOUR OWN INITIATIVE AND GUMPTION
ALSO STEP 3
>FAILURE! YOU ARE A DUMB SCUMFRICK IDIOT moron AND PROBABLY BARELY SAPIENT!
You will be completely forgotten in 2-3 generations
no, I have children
you've never knew your great-grandfather. he was just some old dude you got dragged to see once or twice.
THREE FULL GENERATIONS? The frick did I do, save the rec center??