Out of all the anime shows in gundam which had the most dangerous villain? Not who was the most right or had the best suit, but rather who, if left alone would have the potential to generate the biggest threat to peace and the protag in their respective setting?
I feel like competent villains are actually rare in most of the shows.
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Crux Dogatie wanted to turn the world into a nuclear wasteland. His sons wanted to fire a colony laser at Earth.
Ribbons was well on his way to becoming essentially a god of his new world order. By itself that was pretty bad but the worst part is that since he was so far up his own ass there's no chance in hell he'd have managed to reach an understanding with the ELS so humanity would have been all assimilated and wiped out. within a few months at most.
Honestly the innovades probably would've won. The 00Q could have destroyed a hypothetical alien invasion, while the Qant Seven Sword was simulated to be able to outright stop the final invasion based on data collected during the battle. Consider the fact that the Reborns Gundam was more advanced than the 00R, and the suit was able to make up for the fact it was using inferior Tau drives. I don't think it's out of the question to suggest any successor to the Reborns would've been more powerful than the 00Q especially with true GN drives. Not to mention Innovades don't have normal human limitations and can be cloned into multiple bodies. The Reborns route would have been the Emperor of Mankind route
>while the Qant Seven Sword was simulated to be able to outright stop the final invasion based on data collected during the battle
No, it was based on a simulation of what they expected the ELS invasion would be like, explicitly without taking into account the ELS having the ability to regenerate or to absorb anything they touched. Given those are the only two important powers the ELS have, the simulation was useless.
No, that was the base Qan[T]. According to Gundam Weapons 00 IV the Full Saber (my bad I called it the seven sword before) was simulated after the final battle being able to stop the final battle by itself. The MG manual reference the book directly, in its own words. You're kind of right about some things, like uncertainty about how exactly the battle would turn out if the 00Q FS fought by itself, but in Gundam Weapons it's said that the simulation was based on the final battle data so the abilities of the ELS were known, just not the full extent of how they would use them or whether reinforcements would arrive.
>Had nearly wiped out all of the ELS in only a whole week
>Surely the pilot, Setsuna F. Seiei, wouldn't be able to fight for a whole week.
moron
>The Reborns route would have been the Emperor of Mankind route
But somehow he'd still be worse than Big E.
Gym was absolutely incompetent both as a pilot and a general
Almost everyone in Turn A was incompetent. The earthlings were all in way over their head tech wise and the moon race military had no discipline and would have had little to no actual experience.
Nobody is Turn A is threatening. Every character other than Lauran and Harry are moronic.
>if left alone would have the potential to generate the biggest threat to peace
>foiled by his subordinates going out drinking instead of working
Love it
>wants his people to work on a weekend
Truly the most evil villain ever.
>Hey you don't like it, take it up with the union buddy!
Char in CCA
this is the obvious answer. I can't think of anything more dangerous than literally crashing asteroids into Earth until it depopulates.
Kagatie from Victory was incredibly close to frying the brains of everyone on Earth.
Rau almost annihilated both the colonies and the Earth. The resulting war between the survivors would have resulted in human extinction, there would not have been anywhere for humanity to survive long enough to rebuild. Mars and the moon weren't self-sustaining, Jupiter colonies don't exist in CE. Rau was an extinction level threat as far as Gundam villains go.
Devil Gundam, for obvious reasons.
Scirocco.
Rau probably. He wasn’t just going to kill everyone on Earth, he was going to kill everyone in space too. All of humanity would fall.
Scirocco is obviously one of my favorite gundam villain. Technically speaking Kamille never beat him in a one on one duel. It took the spirit of the dead to stall his machine long enough for kamille to ram him.
Now if you talk about most dangerous villain, I put my money on Katejina. b***h is fricking crazy
If we’re talking just purely dangerous individuals then it would have to be scirocco. This dude could go toe-to-toe with anyone and could scramble brains like nobody’s business.
If we’re talking in general I’d say Delaz and his dirty boys. They didn’t have the backing of axis or any other large neo zeon organization, they were just a bunch of really smart rebels who managed to frick the earth sphere for over a decade.
The Delaz fleet got played like fiddles by the feds though, in fact the only reason they got as far as to drop a colony and wipe the feddie fleet was because Jamitov and Bask allowed them. Well maybe the colony was an added bonus, but they basically achieved nothing on their own and were pawns on a bigger chessboard.
Devil Gundam is the only Gundam Villain that would be a threat to all life in the universe if left unchecked.
Devil Gundam is why they invented the Moonlight Butterfly
Rau and the Devil Gundam are the two that got the closest to achieving their goals and had the biggest-scale goals: they both wanted to exterminate all human life and they both got seconds away from achieving it. The Devil Gundam only edges Rau out because like said, the Devil Gundam would have gone on to be a universal threat if it had won.
Devil is destroyed by the sun and the distance between star systems is too vast for it to mess with anything outside of the solar system.
Rau. SEED probably has the highest stake in the whole series because he has no other objective other than complete destruction. He's not an idealist, he's not a warrior, he's just a monster.
Hard to tell, several villains had the means to eradicate all life on Earth if they weren't stopped
Ghiren wanted more of a population control thing but he would've succeeded if he didn't have to fire his colony laser too early, and Zeon in general caused the most deaths with their colony drops, but they didn't quite want mass extinction
Char from CCA isn't as much of a threat as other villains tbh, he has little military power and relied on tricking the federation to get Axis
Kagatie had a strong military and got close to his goal but his goal relied on a very specific weapon and manipulating a powerful newtype, so lot of stuff could just go wrong and prevent him from achieving his goal
Dogatie has a world ending weapon and straight up just wanted to kill everyone on earth, but like Char he doesn't have much military power
He had the most reliable world ending weapon and a willingness to wipe out all humans, so maybe that's him
The same reading applies to Callisto, then again they're both manga characters rather than anime
I agree with everyone who said Rau. The man was trying to solo the human race, by escalating the war. He leaked a bunch of info, like weapons plans and attack plans, made the destruction and loss of life worse, and positioned two madmen armed with WMD's, on each side of the conflict, hoping that they will wipe each other out. He was like 15 seconds away from success, and he died thinking he won, because he didn't know Athrun nuked the Justice right before the super weapon fired. Even when he was off his meds and breaking down, he was mocking Patrick Zala, by asking the already unstable man, if he has permission to kill his son.
>the most dangerous villain?
Probably Rau. Guy had absolutely zero restraint in wanting to vaporize mankind from the universe with what limited amount of time he had left to live. He was an omnicidal monster who wanted everyone dead.
Rau also had the most unique reason for wearing a mask. It wasn't to hide that he is related to someone, or some sort of an important person. He just felt disgusted by the fact that he didn't have a face of his own. All he had was the face of someone he hated, so he wore the mask to hide his own face from himself.
I mean he also did have to hide the fact that he looked identical to Al De Flaga too
No one would be autistic enough to make that connection other than Cinemaphileners. People would just call him a lookalike. I don't think people even knew Rau was a natural so they could also think his parents just wanted a guy who looked like Al De Flaga
>I don't think people even knew Rau was a natura
Mu's father had the best genes so he could pass as a coordinator
Well he was a kid the last time his original and him were seen together. Also, I think he went maskless for a bit as a Zaft red coat (when he met Rey and worked for Durandal). I'm guessing as his aging kicked in, he started to look more like Al, and thus he started to resent his face more. By that time he was high enough in the chain of command, that he could wear a goofy mask and not be questioned.
Was Al even that famous? I get he might be known among rich circles but it's also what, twenty years after he supposedly died in his house fire. He is also in the PLANTs, a place full of people who were artificially made attractive. Those who knew him would be back on Earth, decades later so many may have died in that time since. I don't think anyone recognizing him was an issue except for Mu himself.
He was in the NFL so boomers would know him for sure
I thought that was George Glenn. Or did George and Al play on the same football team?
Oh yea you're right
Rau got lucky that both sides were extremist governments that made even Zeon look moderate. Had Patrick and Blue Cosmos' Azrael both been Coup'd sooner and replaced with decentralized governments that were opened to parlay than Rau has absolutely no means to get anything done. His over reliance on the other factions being fanatical is what makes him weak.
Sirocco on the other hand took control of the Titans and climbed up the ranks through his own tact and Cunning. Even if the Titans lost the Gryps war and the Federation was deranged had Scirocco been left alive he would just lay low and infiltrate any faction to once again carefully play the chessboard politics into seizing power. He's not bound by ideology or has any morals. He's pragmatic and nothing is too below him if it means getting what he wants. He kneeled to Jamitov and kissed Hamans ass as a means to an end. Cause he knows they'll get theirs soon enough wants he gets to power.
That makes him more dangerous than Rau. You take away his claws he'll grow them back.
Gym is too hard headed and brash
Gihren is too arrogant to ever kneel.
Haman, Char, and Meitzer, are too idealistic to ever be flexible in their methods.
Kagaite again relies too much on manipulating Maria and using the Angel Halo
Dogaite lacks any subtlety and pays the piper with his obvious plan.
Devil Gundam is a strong contender but it's drawback is that those infected with DG Cells are easily distinguished from those that aren't. And can be dealt with if you kill it in its early form while it's recovering. It can't really blend in like Scirocco or Ribbons can.
So for me it's up to Ribbons and Scirocco as being the most dangerous to let escape and live.
>Rau got lucky that both sides were extremist governments that made even Zeon look moderate.
See that is not true. Rau worked behind the scenes to make the war more bloody. Patrick had to keep his anger towards his enemies a bit more contained, for the first half of the show, when he still had opposition. And Azrael was a background character until Rau gave him the info about the upcoming attack, which gave him the upper hand and a proper excuse to use a WMD, that forced Zaft to get more aggressive. Basically those two lunatics took charge post ep 30, when the war got really out of hand. He forced everyone's hands, all the while extending the war, because he tipped them off about the attack on Alaska, which allowed them to evacuate the important people, while taking a big part of Zaft forces out, thus making the playing field more even.
But that's a big gamble that two people with traumatic history had the emotional buttons to push them overthe top. Like I said it really banks on someone not brash or diplomatic to take the helm. Plus I don't think he took into account Lacus' influence and how she mustered a sizable force of defectors. So sensible people were in both ZAFT and the EA.
As we saw when Patrick got shot.
That's the entire theme of Seed though. That when big forces move against each other, there are always good individuals who will do the right thing. Rau has a thesis that humanity is not worth it, as they only want self destruction. The existence of Lacus and her force, as hypocritical as it was, proved him wrong. Also, look at both Azrael and Patrick. They had their fingers on the button, and then their second in command's challenged their decision, at the cost of their lives. There are always people who get the order to launch all the bombs, and they decided not to push the button.
Rau, Gym and Fonse Kagatie strike a bargain to control the Earth. They work together but Rau plays his games. He puts Fllay inside the Devil Gundam, shoots Gym to steal the Turn X, then facilitates Kagatie's death to take control of the Angel Halo. The Devil Gundam assimilates the Angel Halo and annihilates humanity. He will Moonlight Butterfly the rest once it's over so there is no trace of humanity after the Rauicide.
I know it was never televised, but the villain of Gaia Gear probably had the most dangerous plan of them all: deport the Spacenoids back to Earth.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyWtqoOQ_UY
Cumpa did basically orchestrate the entire conflict pretty much singlehandedly. Although in his case it's not that he's especially competent but more that he's somewhat competent in a universe where everyone else is comically incompetent.
Everyone keeps pointing out Rau but I want to point out that Durandal had actually won already and only lost in overtime when Lacus flipped off the entire universe and mobilized insurgent forces. Say what you will about Destiny but I thought he was a great villain, they depicted him being an emotional manipulator and abuser very nicely and did a good job of walking us through how he accomplished the things he did. There's an argument that he fricked up by overreaching, doing things like trying to have Lacus assassinated, but honestly if he had succeeded he would've had a clear route to victory so it's not really an error or oversight on him as much as his henchmen.
Durandal never makes a tangible mistake in the series and he plays under a much higher difficulty setting than Rau did.
His plan was vague and lacked urgency. He kinda went 1984/Brave new world on everyone, and uhh Lacus said that those things are wrong, and we need to kick his ass. And well they fought and he lost.
At least Rau got humanity about 10 seconds or less away from blowing up. Sure the colony drop in Destiny, that Durandal organized, did almost that, but not as badly as Rau's plan would have done it. They came back from the Destiny crisis, but had they shot the big weapon at earth, there would have been no coming back.
Durandal was too impatient. 3 times he immediately decided to strike when he didn't need to and fricked himself over. First by attacking Lacus and Kira. They were honestly feeling like he was legit and they might actually go over to his side but then he both made them his enemy and got Kira back in Freedom again. If he hadn't then Kira and Lacus would have gone to Plant where they would have been unable to do much and Minerva would have steamrolled everything EA threw at them (they only had a hard time in Crete and Berlin because of Kira's interference and Kira trashing most of their MS)
Second was Athrun post Angel Down. Yes he wasn't happen and talked back but he was still too depressed and mopey to make any moves and if Durandal had just left him alone he probably would have remained moping in his room and not have moved against him. Instead Durandal decides that if Athrun talks back to him then he's useless to him and send goons after him which ends up with Athrun back on Kira's side to bail him out at Orb and tag team their way to victory at the final battle. Though to be fair that might have been Rey prodding him as he seemed unusually interested in getting rid of Athrun for some reason, whether he wanted Legend for himself or just blamed Athrun as proxy with team AA for Rau.
Finally was the Destiny Plan. Durandal basically won, other than failing to take control of Orb. Everyone but team Lacus thought he was the good guy and if he'd just held his ground for awhile and and focused on rebuilding and slowly selling the Destiny Plan overtime, Team Lacus couldn't have attacked without looking like the bad guys and/or would have just not made a move against him to begin in and they would have been in an uneasy truce. Instead Durandal demands the world take on the Destiny Plan immediately under threat of Death Ray, and promptly starts plans to fire it at Orb which allows Team Lacus to take him out while looking justified.
I am certain that Durandal was retconned mid-show. Rewrites happened during Destiny, that's for sure. I think he was a much more sinister villain in the show, and when they thought about his Destiny plan, they wanted to make him less evil. I am 100% sure that the following events were all supposed to lead into a big reveal, that he was behind it all:
>The Armory One theft
The three guys had inside help, and it went down exactly when Durandal was there, and ready to give chase
>The Junius 7 drop
An unrelated event that happened exactly as he was passing by that place. It's either really bad writing, or he set those events into motion, to kickstart his villain plot
>Making a fake Lacus, and trying to assassinate the real one
Elite Zaft MS attacking the only people he considers a threat, is pretty obvious.
Basically all these pieces would work together in a big villain reveal.
Don't forget, he knew about the Destroy before the Alliance used it and used its rampage to further his own goals.
That's just good information warfare.
Yes and no. Similar to the other incidents, he manipulated events so they'd end up playing out in a way that felt too convenient.
He could have sent a unit to destroy it before it deployed, but he let's it steamroll his forced and cities just so Shinn (and by extension, Zaft) could save the day and be hailed as a hero... then Kira appears and fricked it all up. Durandal was so pissed he started Operation Angel down right then and there.
I agree. Having seen enough media, I was also picking up on all of these hints. Seems like the original plan was to have Durandal set up the awful war, so that he can have his Destiny plan set into motion. Then the writers fell in love with him, ignored all the setup, and basically said that everything happened naturally, and then Durandal did the Destiny plan. No classic Gundam villain Scheming.
A bit annoying that Destiny portrayed Durandal the way it did. Because there was no reason for me to want Kira and his lackeys to win, even though the show focuses heavily on them during the last stretch
Remind me, when does Dacosta find Durandal's notes? I recall finding it really silly that randomly found the main antagonist's diary detailing his evil plan, but no one mentions it in these discussions, so it's likely I'm just misremembering that entire event.
No you remember right, he finds the notes in Mendel colony.
I wanna say it was either the episode Strike Freedom debuted or the one before it.
In Destiny Dacosta returns to the Mendel colony but finds it in ruins, everything is cleared out except for random floating trash. He just happens upon a journal that belonged to Durandal.
>Durandal never makes a tangible mistake
Wrong. He trusted Athrun.
>Say what you will about Destiny but I thought he was a great villain, they depicted him being an emotional manipulator and abuser very nicely and did a good job of walking us through how he accomplished the things he did.
The problem is that it's really, really, really, REALLY fricking obvious he's evil from the start. Like anyone with a functioning brain should've said "that dude is fricking evil, he's up to something even if I don't know what". It's not just Kira/Lacus/Athrun just magically knowing not to trust him, it's so goddamn obvious.
To be fair, the characters in-universe don't see Durandal smirking at the camera with shifty eyes like the viewers do.
If he succeeded even harder prior to Destiny Plan the PLANT Supreme Council would've been vaporized by Requiem instead of the three (?) PLANT colonies getting sliced because of Yzak's accidental interference.
Scirocco seems like Kishida fumiko in reality for being male feminist. Kishida banned bikini from anime in 2022 summer.
>Scirocco
>male feminist
you didn't understand him. He was just manipulating them because he was just that good and crazy newtype women made for perfect fodder to throw at his enemies
Just like Kishida who claim themself to be a feminist but taking away the space and Job from decent females? Like Banning Gravure, banning Racing girl, getting rid of Female washroom, and replacing with washroom for everyone.... and Banning Porn from Japan by New fricking bill on AV.
>Paptimus Sombrero