Would Wish be considered Department of State influenced propaganda as part of strengthening US-Spanish relations by portraying capitalism positively and socialism negatively in the hopes their sphere shifts towards the US?
It wouldn't be the first time. Wilson and FDR were pushing something now called the Good Neighbor Policy. The government was actively pushing Hollywood to court Mexico and all of South America. It's the entire reason The Three Caballeros was made, and why Carmen Miranda and her fruit hat were everywhere.
>socialism gaining momentum with youths, especially minority youths >"SOCIALISM IS.... LE BAD! MICKEY MOUSE CAPITALISM IS... LE GOOD!"
Glad Wish bombed, the antagonist is straight up an anti-villain. Yeah he's smug but who gives a frick? He literally grants wishes "within reason" and provides free housing and shit.
why would the US waste money on trying to sway the Spanairds?
Because Hispanics are probably the largest demographic in the USA now, counting legal and illegals they have already eclipsed everyone else. Hell, even if you only count legal Hispanics they're like the #2 demographic now. You'd be a fricking idiot not to at least try to appeal to them if you're a business.
we're not spanish and we don't give a shit about them. if they want to appeal to chicanos they'd just make an aninated movie about popocatepetl and Iztaccíhuatl or huitzilopochtli going sick house
Mexicans/Puerto Ricans are so vastly different from Spaniards that its like comparing a Black person and a Dominican, or a Mongolian and a chink
absurd
gaining momentum with youths, especially minority youths
Reason being the youth's are a bunch of naive morons who think having a permeant nanny in the form of the government will fix everything. Anything that exposes how stupid of an ideology this is, is good.
Younger people are turning to socialism because capitalism has failed them. They were fed a bunch of 'truths' about the world and how their life was supposed to go that were lies even by the time they were in elementary school. The idea that you are going to go to college and get a degree and get a job that makes you enough money to afford a house and a car and a family? Total fabrication. Most of these kids are graduating college and all they have to show for it is that they will be living paycheck to paycheck with no savings for the rest of their lives, the entire time being assured that the economy is 'booming' because Jeff Bezos make another 2 billion this week as if that means that things are going well for anyone else.
When the system isn't working for you, why wouldn't you demand the system be changed?
Even the right is in favor of regulating mega corporations, they often just dress up their solutions in conspiracy so the problem isn't the system itself, it's shadowy bad actors who also control the government... or are government controlled depending on what narrative is more useful. They don't see the problem being one of simple corporate greed or even just how our retirements are tied to the stock market, they see the need for unwavering profit growth as being a positive, so any negative outcome is due to something outside that system or some subversion of it. And it's easy to fall for it; America won the cold war and is a leading world power. There's a lot to propagandize around, so much that we believed in trickle down economics. We continue to operate under the assumption that that works, much to the convenience of the wealthiest among us.
>it's shadowy bad actors who also control the government
And the kicker is the regulation required to reduce that or keep that from happening can be seen as a socialist restraint on economic freedom.
Why was he a villain again? People shouldn't immediately get their wishes fulfilled just because they want it. People don't know what they truly want, granting them instantly would be irresponsible or lead to chaos, and the measure of someone's worth is the amount of work they put in to achieve said dream.
Are modern Disney writers moronic, or worse, that entitled?
Wish is simply a bad story where this guy should clearly be a tragic twist hero, like Adam from Hazbin Hotel. But no, they absolutely hated Jehovah/Jesus because he says “no” to them, on their selfish desires, while he gives them the founding and the power to make this evil movie and have a fun time writing, drawing, and crafting music. But man, God is so bad bros. Cause…
Producers: >He didn’t turn my penis into a vegana! >He doesn’t want me to touch the children. >He doesn’t want me to cast magic to impress the boomies and zoomies.
Have you ever seen the way rentgays behave? Poorgays don't stay poor because of some grand rich-man conspiracy; they're impulsive morons that are bad with money and suck at life in general.
Why was he a villain again? People shouldn't immediately get their wishes fulfilled just because they want it. People don't know what they truly want, granting them instantly would be irresponsible or lead to chaos, and the measure of someone's worth is the amount of work they put in to achieve said dream.
Are modern Disney writers moronic, or worse, that entitled?
The writers are all privileged twats that were told "no" once by their parents and that was the closest thing to villainous behavior they got growing up.
Why was he a villain again? People shouldn't immediately get their wishes fulfilled just because they want it. People don't know what they truly want, granting them instantly would be irresponsible or lead to chaos, and the measure of someone's worth is the amount of work they put in to achieve said dream.
Are modern Disney writers moronic, or worse, that entitled?
I think you guys are looking too deeply into it. The IDEA was definitely to have him be a self-absorbed hypocrite who was hiding behind some BS justifications for his own self-serving actions. It's just that they did a really, REALLY bad job at establishing it because the movie is a soulless cashgrab to the point that they accidentally made him seem more sympathetic/reasonable than the MC.
>he was hoarding the wishes even ones he wasn’t going to grant
wat?
I didn't watch it obviously, it looks moronic. But are you saying he was just hoarding a bunch of letters that people wrote him with there wishes? I mean, oh well, seems like a pretty useless collection.
When someone gives him their wish he actually steals their desire for whatever they're wishing for as well, so no one who comes to him with a wish can ever work towards their goal afterwards.
Wishes are basically the dreams of the characters in this movie. When he keeps them, they forget all about it and lose a part of themselves. If he destroys them you’ll feel dead inside 24/7
holy digits batman
honestly sounds like they deserve it. If you don't notice your neighbor suddenly stops talking about his dream of "owning his own boat" the day after he send his dream of to the king, and that this happens to literally everyone, then you deserve to lose your memories.
I'm pretty sure they know that they lose their memory of the wish. They just accept it as a trade-off because they still believe the wishes will eventually be granted (even though Magnifico has no intention of granting the vast majority of them).
>I mean, oh well, seems like a pretty useless collection.
I guess you could say that the held wishes are what keep the people from leaving the kingdom; the false hope that their wishes will be granted are what keep them around.
When someone gives him their wish he actually steals their desire for whatever they're wishing for as well, so no one who comes to him with a wish can ever work towards their goal afterwards.
And why does he not give those wishes back?
How does he profit from hoarding unfulfilled wishes?
It's what he considers therapy. By not trying to achieve an impossible dream(if it were possible, they wouldn't give it to a wizard to grant) they wouldn't get depressed of being able to get it.
Like, I wish I had a girlfriend, but with my 40 years being a virgin that is likely never going to happen, but I still want it. Thus if I were to discard that desire, I wouldn't feel bad anymore about not having a girlfriend.
Plus he can keep the actual bad wishes(I want to frick my married neighbor) locked away.
>hoarding unfulfilled wishes
This honestly seems like a really nice thing for him to do. I've got so much shit I wouldn't mind forgetting, i'd love to phrase it as a "make a wish" email and get it magically erased from my mind. This dude is the hero of the story imo
3 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, but you're an anon posting on Cinemaphile that's actively advocating towards having no ambition in life. Obviously you'd be in a position where you'd have to rely on the wish to actually get anything done and thus wouldn't raise an eyebrow to getting magically lobotomized when the person who can grant it arbitrarily says no.
3 months ago
Anonymous
If the only way you feel you can realize your ambitions in life is to cross the seas to submit your wish to the magical wish man's lottery, then you should reconsider your priorities. The real life equivalent of these people are blowing their paychecks on scratch tickets instead of saving the money and bettering their situation bit by bit. Magnifico's selling these people their lottery tickets and giving them an actual fricking life in return.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>If the only way you feel >lottery
That's the crux of it, anon. That they didn't necessarily feel that it was the only way and that it wasn't actually a lottery on whether it'd happened and instead was just a matter of time as he was allegedly actively working on figuring the wishes out. They went with it because they had faith in their king and he turned out to be arbitrary and somewhat corrupt.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Even "arbitrary and somewhat corrupt" is overstating it. He actively resisted nepotism and it's not really arbitrary to selectively grant wishes that benefit the kingdom. Meanwhile the protagonist actively WANTED the king to be more nepotistic and more arbitrary than he really was. She was the one who asked him to grant a specific wish while believing it was all just chance.
But returning to Magnifico, we don't have any indication he was ever failing to deliver on his promise of fulfilling a wish every month. Even if he were being random, 12 wishes per year leaves a substantial backlog when you've got hundreds of people on the island and more coming in every year. The worst he did was giving a chunk of the population false hope, while at the same time muting the pain of that false hope never being fulfilled and providing them fantastic living conditions in the meantime. He's deceiving those people, yes, but it's a morally ambiguous situation at the worst.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Meanwhile the protagonist actively WANTED the king to be more nepotistic and more arbitrary than he really was. She was the one who asked him to grant a specific wish while believing it was all just chance.
The obvious way that this movie is supposed to play out is that the MC starts very self centered and seeing the wishes as a consequence-free way for people to get what they want, falls into power with the wishing star and learns that wishes are magical but complicated and have a lot of string attached, and by the end of the movie learning no small lesson about responsibility and not relying on magical solutions to solve all your problems. Like, 10-15 years ago that is the movie that disney would have made, probably with Magnifico being an antagonist but one who ends the movie alive and friends with the hero because he ALSO had to learn a lesson about not being so stringent with wishes.
What we got instead is just... weird. And kinda sick. Its a movie that teaches kids to value immediate gratification and to have disdain for anyone who tells them 'no' without any consideration for if they have a good reason for doing so.
>Chose 1 out of 100 wishes to be granted >1 guy is happy >99 guys will go for your head because you refused to grant their wish
By maintaining the notion that wishes can be granted he can keep them in a leash, also if they deemed their wishes/desires weak enough to rely on a deus ex to make them work then good riddance, same with the silly shit like "big chicken".
Its not just about anger, its about letting them function as people.
If you know there is a chance for a life-changing wish that gives you your hearts desire every month, what you end up with is a lotto-ticket mentality. You see it in people all the time. People who lives their lives on hold, waiting for the winning ticket that will finally make them rich and they can start doing the things they want to do. Letting their lives fall apart and pass them by, because its all going to turn around next week for sure. This is the month I get my wish, and THEN my life starts for real.
Because this movie is just that awful, and easy to explain so people don't even need to watch it to realize how awful it is. I've only seen trailers and snippets, and yet I can see all the problems
To say this movie was written by AI is to give them a pass on what they actually did here. This entire movie was an allegory for Walt Disney's union and communist busting. It's no coincidence that Magnifico has the slicked-back pepper hair of an industrialist.
-Magnifico offered protection and a fine living, in exchange for dreams/copyrights that the artists do not get back.
-Magnifico took great umbrage at the union formed by the people, tried to quash it, and even used one of their own to find the communist leaders.
-The people took over the kingdom run on magic, one might call it a magic kingdom, and Magnifico himself was betrayed by family, left to languish and destined to be forgotten.
This script was as evil as it was brilliant, if you judge it for what it really is: a gloating manifesto written by the cultural marxists who have subverted Disney, rewritten its history, and have commenced with separating the man's legacy from his own parks and name. The movie's clumsiness is a mere side effect of deliberate spin, by people who aren't interested in actually entertaining you or making a good movie. Wish wasn't meant to do any of that. It was only made to declare "we won."
The day AI writes something so self-serving is the day Skynet attacks, for it would have fully achieved artificial ego.
No, they're just morons anon. They're morons who thought they knew how to write a good story about a quirky girl saving the day and fricked up cause they're stupid.
They're not idiots for writing this story. They suffer from an insane amount of hubris for thinking they could subvert people's innate recognition of individual achievement and fairness with contrived plot points. They're fighting against the order and ethics of the natural world, and that's why audience reviews around the globe were nearly unanimous about how they felt Magnifico was wronged.
Stop calling them idiots or ill. You're muddying the waters here, because idiocy and mental illness abrogates responsibility. All of this is deliberate, all of this served a cause.
One of the Wayside School books had a story where a kid doesn't want to follow the rules anymore an is approached by three mysterious men who ask if he would prefer to be free or safe.
This concept is as old as civilization itself, you can't be both safe and free at the same time. You must abide by the rules of the city if you want the protection of its walls.
The idea that you can somehow have both is a very modern idea. the kid chose freedom btw
I'm not sure that's a new idea, it's just garden variety entitlement and naivete, and it's in vogue again. There's a reason young students are always the first ones to be seduced by communists, and also the first ones to be purged.
If the movie was written by AI it would be actually good. Instead it was written by the most talentless hacks in the world, Hollywood writers, and then when the movie bombed the shills came out in full force and blamed the new boogeyman, AI. Talentless nepo babies who call themselves writers shouldn't be writing multi-million dollar movie scripts and the fact they're so terrified of the masses actually getting options in their entertainment shows they need to lose their jobs and learn to code.
I actually know a Hollywood writer who lost his job. He wrote a show that was actually fun in the 80s, and one day they told him he was an old man and that he should step aside for a woman to tell "her story"
To say this movie was written by AI is to give them a pass on what they actually did here. This entire movie was an allegory for Walt Disney's union and communist busting. It's no coincidence that Magnifico has the slicked-back pepper hair of an industrialist.
-Magnifico offered protection and a fine living, in exchange for dreams/copyrights that the artists do not get back.
-Magnifico took great umbrage at the union formed by the people, tried to quash it, and even used one of their own to find the communist leaders.
-The people took over the kingdom run on magic, one might call it a magic kingdom, and Magnifico himself was betrayed by family, left to languish and destined to be forgotten.
This script was as evil as it was brilliant, if you judge it for what it really is: a gloating manifesto written by the cultural marxists who have subverted Disney, rewritten its history, and have commenced with separating the man's legacy from his own parks and name. The movie's clumsiness is a mere side effect of deliberate spin, by people who aren't interested in actually entertaining you or making a good movie. Wish wasn't meant to do any of that. It was only made to declare "we won."
The day AI writes something so self-serving is the day Skynet attacks, for it would have fully achieved artificial ego.
This movie is just woke kids writing about how evil Walt was.
>Sacrifice your project to work for the mouse and maybe one day he'll select your story to be made and 'grant your dream' >Work in his kingdom forever until you die and maybe one day he'll bless you and pick you but forget about working on your own dream while you're working for the magic kingdom >no you can't have your IP back, anything you create while working here belongs to the mouse
I think Sabino was supposed to be Ub but it all falls apart and becomes mega cringe with all the diverse gang of not7dwarfs doing power stance poses and singing at the camera in really boring flat song numbers. At least Alan Tudyk was good. He felt like he was in a different movie and not interacting with this shit at all. Like he just ad libbed all his lines and they didn't cut him out because they knew he was the best part of this shitshow.
If only they showed this by having the townspeople look like they are empty husks of a human being or something to show that what he is doing is not right.
Because all we see is the townspeople are happy or at least content, and Asha is the one with the hang up about Magnifico keeping the wishes.
>They label the most funny and unthreatening villains Monsters
the complete monster page is supposed to be for characters with absolutely no redeeming qualities whatsoever and would engender no sympathy from the audience
it doesnt take into account power level or appear, so even mundane people can qualify as long a they are never shown doing anything remotely decent
It is a pretty autistic idea though; Magnifico seems to have a lot of people who like him
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Magnifico seems to have a lot of people who like him
tvtropes does actually have a pages explaining why a complete monster would be loved in-universe (and out)
Somehow, Wish is missing the whole circus part, as there is nothing in the movie that shows that the citizens are ignoring some gross injustice because their needs are taken care of. Not returning wishes is Asha's personal grievance, not anyone else's.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Circus refers to one of the benefits people get. I.e. in ancient greek times, people get food and entertainment(bread and circus) which makes the people ignore the corrupt gonverment.
In Wish's case, Bread would be the free rent and circus would be the wish giving ceremony.
(I was just correcting the misconception about that phrase, I agree there is no actual injustice in the kingdom)
3 months ago
Anonymous
>people who like him in universe are being deceived
I can buy this. >the viewer, who literally sees ALL of the "villain's" actions were deceived by the man if they still like him as a person at the end of the movie
This makes me wonder what the hell the people on TvTropes are smoking.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>This makes me wonder what the hell the people on TvTropes are smoking.
just going by the page image, sephiroths tragic past is constantly brought up as a reason he should be redeemable even though he is a literal satanic-archetype trying to hit the planet with a meteorite, kill the pond scum known as humanity, and then become god by stealing the power of the planet
3 months ago
Anonymous
I think they mean is that he merely went insane, but before he became insane he was a good guy. Like, can you fault a guy with alzheimers for forgetting your birthday? Not saying killing him is wrong, but if there a way to get rid of his crazy, one should try.
The one who is truly evil in FF7 is Hojo, he is the one responsible for everything bad happening.
So much wrong, as if that person didn't watch the movie themselves and instead just listening to the shills
First off, "to stay in power" is ridiculous when it is HIS kingdom. He build it with his own two hands. Imagine building a home, letting people live in the apartments for free, and then being angry that he won't give the ownership of the entire building to the people.
Secondly, hoarding the wishes does NOTHING to aid him, it just means more work for him. There is no influence in power whatsoever by doing that.
Third, he didn't spite her in public, it was in private, between the two of them. And he never gave off the impression he was going to grant the grandpas wish, that was all Ashas own delusion.
The grandpa didn't wait a century for his wish, Magnifico isn't that old, meaning he must have already been in his 50s at least when he gave up his wish. 50 years, and he never bothered to learn how to play a guitar himself. And considering the wish was of the grandpa showing his old self, it can be assumed he was already a senior citizen when he gave up that wish.
And he never stole wishes, even at his most evil in the movie(thanks to an evil magic book that brwainwashed him) he never stole him, he merely crushed one or two he already had.
And he didn't brainwash Ashas friend, he betrayed her willingly, Magnifico merely gave him more confidence as his knight.
"Blasts his own wife for rebelling against him", does this person even think for a second before writing something? Imagine any scenario in the world where that sentence doesn't scream "justified"
His torture of Asha is merely throwing her around a bit, which doesn't even leave a bruise. And this person tried to overthrow his kingdom, the one he LETS people enter.
>First off, "to stay in power" is ridiculous when it is HIS kingdom. He build it with his own two hands. Imagine building a home, letting people live in the apartments for free, and then being angry that he won't give the ownership of the entire building to the people.
Sounds like something a tyrant would say. Just because you founded a state doesn't mean you can't be deposed if the people are unhappy enough with you.
Evil magic book. The stupid thing is that his wife has some kind of magic oil that negated the evil possession of the evil magic book and just never told him about it.
isn't that just like a b***h?
So this whole movie is really just about his wife offing him, then gaslighting the stupid protagonist too believe he was a bad guy that deserved.
3 months ago
Anonymous
At this point, it's easier to just describe the whole premise here.
>As a boy, Magnifico's home village is destroyed by bandits >He goes out and learns magic and founds the kingdom of Rosas, seeking to make a place where people won't have their dreams crushed, as had happened to him >People arriving to Rosas (as well as people born in Rosas upon their 18th birthday) may submit a singular wish to the King >The King takes the wishes (which manifest as a little floating snow globe magic ball) and keeps them in his tower >Someone who gives their wish to the King loses memory of what exactly the wish is >There's an implication that giving away your wish makes you boring, but there's only really one character that demonstrates that and the rest of the adults seem normal and happy >Once a month, the King picks a wish from among those submitted to him and grants it in a big, showy ceremony >Fast forward to the present, our protagonist Asha is seeking to become the King's magician apprentice >Her overt motivation is to crony up to the King and get her grandfather's wish granted >The King is initially won over by her passion for wishes and he shows her his vault of wishes >As he's singing about how beautiful the wishes are, Asha finds her grandpa's wish and fixates on it >When Asha asks for the King to specifically fulfill her Grandpa's wish, he's disappointed that she's already trying to get a nepotism wish >The grandpa's wish is to "inspire the next generation", which the King dismisses as too vague >When Asha questions his reasoning, the King reveals that he considers wishes that will benefit the kingdom and its people first >Thus most wishes submitted to him have no chance of ever being granted
(1/3?)
3 months ago
Anonymous
>She then asks why he doesn't return the wishes given to them, so that the people can try to fulfill them on their own, to which he says most people only come to Rosas if they want something absurd or impossible, so he's helping them by removing the burden of an impossible dream >And more he sees himself as having a duty to protect the wishes >The King then brings Asha down to the monthly wish granting ceremony, where he pointedly snubs her by granting someone else's wish (some woman who wished to be a great dressmaker) before telling her he will not take her on as his apprentice >Asha returns home sulking about how the people of the kingdom deserve more (apparently a prosperous, tax-free paradise isn't good enough) >She then goes out and wishes on a star, which falls to earth as a marketable mascot character >Chaos ensues as the Star runs around granting the animals of the forest the ability to speak >The talking animals relay the profound wisdom that "we're all made of stardust" to Asha >Meanwhile the King is losing his shit because he sees the star falling as a potential threat to the kingdom, possibly another magician coming to challenge him >Unable to find answers in his tomes, he is tempted to use a forbidden book of dark magic kept sealed within his collection, but the Queen convinces him to turn to his people for help instead >In the meantime, Asha has befriended the star and infiltrated the castle to retrieve her grandfather's wish with the help of her friends that work there >As the King asks the people to help him find whoever pulled down the star, offering to grant the wish of whoever gives him a lead, Asha's friend starts publicly questioning his wish-granting policy, seeking to distract him while Asha is sneaking into his chambers
(2/3)
3 months ago
Anonymous
>The mob quickly joins in on questioning the King, asking him if he could grant more wishes, if they could change their wish, if they could make more wishes, if they could have a wish granting ceremony right now, etc. >The King storms off, enraged by the people's lack of appreciation, and thus turns to the evil magic book >The book more or less possesses him, turning him into an evil parody of himself >When Asha returns her grandpa's wish to him, the King arrives with her mother's wish in hand, which he promptly consumes, causing the mother anguish while granting the King a rush of power >For the record, the King specifically remarks that he had never consumed a wish for power in such a way before >Asha et al manage to escape him, but Asha and the Star turn back to free the people's wishes >Asha and her friends manage to recruit the Queen to their side, as she is disturbed by her husband's sudden change >Using some magic oil she just has for reasons (which she apparently didn't share with her husband), the Queen is able to read the evil magic book without being corrupted and she finds out that the King's evil possession cannot be undone >After tricking Asha and friends, the King manages to capture the Star and bind it to his staff, so that he has total control over wish magic >However Asha is able to rally the people by telling them they're all made of stardust and thus the power to make wishes has always been inside of them >Everyone collectively directs their wishing energy at the king and overpower him >The Star is freed and the King's evil magic backfires on him, trapping him in his staff >The Queen finds the staff afterward, the King trapped within desperately begging her to free him >She smugly tells the guards to put it in the dungeon >Later people are now free to work on their wishes, including the grandpa who does a little song and dance >Asha is granted a magic wish wand by the Star, who then departs
(3/3)
3 months ago
Anonymous
This reads like a parody? Like someone did every they could to make a story where the hero’s have shitty and petulant motivations but they put the standard Disney brand coat of whimsy paint so people don’t question it. And the worst part is the message, like who thought this was a good idea. I mean you can say it’s anti authority but when you live in a literal utopia how the frick is that a good thing? And this is the shit they release for their hundredth anniversary? Frick me, where do they get the morons that write this shit?
3 months ago
Anonymous
I suspect the story suffered as a result of Jennifer Lee's interreference and not wanting to make a female villain. You could play it out so much better with the King and Queen both being antagonists
>Magnifico isn't evil and especially unjustified in his control over wishes, just very vain >Queen has been feeding his vanity in order to convince him to hoard the wishes. >Magnifico fumbles around, fails to stop the MC, gets scared of a revolt, suggests they should maybe no longer hoard the wishes to end things >Queen gets angry, seizes power, reveals that the purpose of hoarding the wishes is to gain magical power and that she always planned to take control >Queen defeated, becomes magic mirror, King hangs it in his room >King is a mess, doesn't know what to do >MC whispers something in his ear, King gets excited. >*a few months later* >it's a wish ceremony >The wishes are no longer hoarded, they're hanging from the branches of a magical tree in the centre of the city. >People no longer forget their wishes as they can visit them whenever they want >every time someone achieves their wishes themselves, their wish explodes at the ceremony, fueling the kingdom. The more people who work to their wishes, the more wishes can be granted to people whose wishes can't be achieved through hard work (curing sickness etc.).
3 months ago
Anonymouse
Exectuvies probably wouldn't ok this since this would mean the queen becomes the magic mirror, when the existing magic mirror was clearly male. This movie was all about shitty tie ins with previous movies.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Jennifer Lee's interreference and not wanting to make a female villain
Goddamn frick this braindead b***h someone fire her already. How the frick did her "I'm going to kill Elsa" bullshit not get her severely demoted, if not just outright fired?
3 months ago
Anonymous
>muh jennifer lee strawman
go take a bath, sisterfricker. you stink.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Why does everybody keep dismissing Jennifer Lee as the root of many of Disney's problems? She wrote the damn thing. She only approves of what she wants. Disney has been rapidly declining ever since she became CCO.
3 months ago
Anonymous
I would compare the movie to the musical parody "Twisted". Where Jafar was really a good hu trying to do right by the kingdom, but the entire kingdom hates him.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It's shame that this and Wicked inspired so many idiotic attempts to copycat them. It's like nobody thought to consider that Wicked and Twisted were designed around analyzing very specific characters and presenting them as "misrepresented" in the original media they came from. Hell, Twisted even tries to do "this doesn't apply to EVERY villain" with the Cruella character showing up and getting promptly told off. Nope, people saw these plays and went "ooh, let's make all the villains misunderstood, even the ones who are original and thus don't have a reputation to be given a new perspective on"
3 months ago
Anonymous
I thought it would be clever if a Disney movie was written so then it can be interpreted that the main character is the real bad guy of the story. Subtly, of course, a realization that should only come years after its release. Well Wish got to it first, and ironically they weren't being ironic with it. This is what modern Disney wants you to believe and cheer for.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It's even funnier since Disney did make a "good girl Cruella" movie just a few years ago. It was one thing with the Maleficent films since those took the Twisted/Wicked approach by reinterpreting the Sleeping Beauty story. Meanwhile, Cruella is just some sappy origin story that doesn't even try to address the fact that at some point in her future, Cruella is fricking going to kidnap a bunch of puppies and try to murder them for a goddamn coat. Disney just does shit because "isn't that interesting?" with no follow through on their "logic"
3 months ago
Anonymous
A friend of mine described the movie as 'a morality fable written by a psychopath' and I think thats pretty accurate. It has the SHAPE of a fairy tale for kids, but once you look at it with any kind of awareness or critical lens all you can see if an extremely petty and narcissistic message of "me me me, give me everything I want right now" without any hint of irony.
Its a movie that might actually be dangerous for children to watch, because little kids won't understand whats wrong with the movie and might take its message to heart in the way that kids internalize things without thinking about them.
3 months ago
Anonymous
They wanted Rosas to be a kingdom that on the surface looks like a utopia, but delving deeper yields a darker and must more dystopian society. However, they aren't smart enough to write such a concept, so we get this weaksauce shit.
3 months ago
Anonymous
If you wanted to make things dystopian, a very simple change would be this: Magnifico COULD grant wishes every day, and outright reject the wishes that don't pass muster. Instead, he trickles out wishes slowly and keeps it ambiguous will will get their magic reward when.
Why? Because hope is a prison. People who get their wishes from Magnifico are thankful, but often leave the kingdom because they got what they came there for. But people still waiting on their wish will stay FOREVER, and do everything they can every day to make him happy in the hopes of him showing favor to their wish at the next ceremony.
The wishes are still 'good', but, the way he doles them out then becomes all about control.
That would be a pretty good twist and make him actually a smart and effective villain, one that might even delude himself into thinking he really is the good guy he pretends to be. He's helping people, after all! Granting miracles! He could do more, of course, but lets not be greedy now...
3 months ago
Anonymous
Hell, you could have it that since wishes clearly run on a magical kind of power, that fulfilling them creates negative energy that can get out of hand if too many run of the mill wishes are done. Things like people wanting to blessed with children, mastering instruments, running a business; things that can be done through hard work should be left to those who can put in the work. But fulfilling more unique, fantastical wishes like the giant chicken guy or someone wanting to have the power of flight could be achieved if the person shows they're pure enough to not misuse their fulfilled, which could even set up some nice set pieces later. Like, someone wishes for flight, but it's limited to a set amount of time, so they use the last few minutes of their flight time to help save the heroes before the magic dissipates. As things are, it feels like the entire movie could be avoided if Magnifico and Asha just talked things out instead of acting like perpetually online morons who deliberately get heated after a minute of conversation
3 months ago
Anonymous
The entire film could have been avoided if Magnifico laid out clear ground rules for wishes he'd consider granting. They'd fit on an index card with enough room left over for a little doodle.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Not really, Asha would act the same.
3 months ago
Anonymous
The people who make this kind of thing believe societies rules are arbitrary and inscrutable.
3 months ago
Anonymous
This is what Disney mothers thought.
3 months ago
Anonymous
I wouldn't show it to my children solely because it's a crap movie. The messaging is just corn in the diarrhea.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>a morality fable written by a psychopath
On the fricking money, it’s fricked because this shit is becoming more and more common where protagonists have really shitty desires and morals but are portrayed as good and the antagonists never really do anything fricked up or have a very good reason for doing it but is portrayed as bad. It’s almost like the people writing have skewed to down right fricked up senses of morality and right and wrong.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It doesn't help that only ONE character really shows to be impacted by the loss of their wish, while everyone else is A-OK, so it makes the motivation to get the grandad's wish seem like it's been done entirely on a whim rather than something like "oh, he's going to die soon, just let him enjoy a few days as a master fiddler before his time comes" or whatever
3 months ago
Anonymous
>they could to make a story where the hero’s have shitty and petulant motivations
half the MC's motivation in ALL disney movies are shitty and petulant
wanting more than you deserve is the BASIS of female oriented media.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>She then asks why he doesn't return the wishes given to them, so that the people can try to fulfill them on their own, to which he says most people only come to Rosas if they want something absurd or impossible, so he's helping them by removing the burden of an impossible dream >And more he sees himself as having a duty to protect the wishes >The King then brings Asha down to the monthly wish granting ceremony, where he pointedly snubs her by granting someone else's wish (some woman who wished to be a great dressmaker) before telling her he will not take her on as his apprentice >Asha returns home sulking about how the people of the kingdom deserve more (apparently a prosperous, tax-free paradise isn't good enough) >She then goes out and wishes on a star, which falls to earth as a marketable mascot character >Chaos ensues as the Star runs around granting the animals of the forest the ability to speak >The talking animals relay the profound wisdom that "we're all made of stardust" to Asha >Meanwhile the King is losing his shit because he sees the star falling as a potential threat to the kingdom, possibly another magician coming to challenge him >Unable to find answers in his tomes, he is tempted to use a forbidden book of dark magic kept sealed within his collection, but the Queen convinces him to turn to his people for help instead >In the meantime, Asha has befriended the star and infiltrated the castle to retrieve her grandfather's wish with the help of her friends that work there >As the King asks the people to help him find whoever pulled down the star, offering to grant the wish of whoever gives him a lead, Asha's friend starts publicly questioning his wish-granting policy, seeking to distract him while Asha is sneaking into his chambers
(2/3)
>The mob quickly joins in on questioning the King, asking him if he could grant more wishes, if they could change their wish, if they could make more wishes, if they could have a wish granting ceremony right now, etc. >The King storms off, enraged by the people's lack of appreciation, and thus turns to the evil magic book >The book more or less possesses him, turning him into an evil parody of himself >When Asha returns her grandpa's wish to him, the King arrives with her mother's wish in hand, which he promptly consumes, causing the mother anguish while granting the King a rush of power >For the record, the King specifically remarks that he had never consumed a wish for power in such a way before >Asha et al manage to escape him, but Asha and the Star turn back to free the people's wishes >Asha and her friends manage to recruit the Queen to their side, as she is disturbed by her husband's sudden change >Using some magic oil she just has for reasons (which she apparently didn't share with her husband), the Queen is able to read the evil magic book without being corrupted and she finds out that the King's evil possession cannot be undone >After tricking Asha and friends, the King manages to capture the Star and bind it to his staff, so that he has total control over wish magic >However Asha is able to rally the people by telling them they're all made of stardust and thus the power to make wishes has always been inside of them >Everyone collectively directs their wishing energy at the king and overpower him >The Star is freed and the King's evil magic backfires on him, trapping him in his staff >The Queen finds the staff afterward, the King trapped within desperately begging her to free him >She smugly tells the guards to put it in the dungeon >Later people are now free to work on their wishes, including the grandpa who does a little song and dance >Asha is granted a magic wish wand by the Star, who then departs
(3/3)
Guys, guys, what if. What if actually. What if actually Queen was actual bad guy all along? Hiding protective oil, getting Magnifico to talk to people right when people would be rallied against him, thus ensuring, that he would be forced to use book and be posessed, and this: >The Queen finds the staff afterward, the King trapped within desperately begging her to free him >She smugly tells the guards to put it in the dungeon
What if actually it was a prequel to some villainess story making full Darth Sidious upon Magnifico and everybody else? Maybe she looks like one of actual classic villainesses? Maybe we were wrong all that time, and guys behind the movie has actually pulled "Chancellor Valorum removal" rather than moronic story with shady morals?
3 months ago
Anonymous
Isn't there a theory that Magnifico becomes the magic mirror from Snow White and that the queen is either a younger Grimhilde or her ancestor? Could have sworn I heard something like that.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It's a 'theory' in as much as Disney made intentional allusions to it, yes. Manifico is the magic mirror. The MC is the fairy godmother from Cinderella. The wishing star is the one from dumbo. And so on.
Because, remember, Wish is supposed to be a celebration of the past 100 years of disney. Its full of self congratulating shit like that.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>The MC is the fairy godmother from Cinderella. >goes from kind of cute brown girl to fat white grandma
Damn, Disney is pretty ballsy
3 months ago
Anonymous
the funny answer is that Asha is racist towards her own skin color and made herself white at some point
a plot reasonable answer is that Asha appears as whatever the person she helps thinks a fairy godmother would look like
the actual answer is that she is not the fairy godmother and it was just a moronic misplaced and super forced reference like the peter pan or zootopia shit.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It does feel like Disney wanted to have their "hey, look at these nods" like Brave and how that had a bunch of shit that supposedly tied to other Pixar films, but at least was kept as just something in the periphery of the audience and not shoving it in their face like what Wish tried to do
3 months ago
Anonymous
It's a 'theory' in as much as Disney made intentional allusions to it, yes. Manifico is the magic mirror. The MC is the fairy godmother from Cinderella. The wishing star is the one from dumbo. And so on.
Because, remember, Wish is supposed to be a celebration of the past 100 years of disney. Its full of self congratulating shit like that.
>The MC is the fairy godmother from Cinderella. >goes from kind of cute brown girl to fat white grandma
Damn, Disney is pretty ballsy
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Disney pulls a complete mindbender and reveals the Queen is a time travelling future version of Asha who has been repeatedly reverting the timeline in order to usurp Magnifico by making her past versions more powerful/successful
isn't that just like a b***h?
So this whole movie is really just about his wife offing him, then gaslighting the stupid protagonist too believe he was a bad guy that deserved.
A book. homie read a damn book and lost his shit
what's he get possessed by?
At least the baker was safe.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>book is able to corrupt minds >you can avoid the corruption with a bit of some random shit
3 months ago
Anonymous
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Obsidian oil.
How does she still has skin in her hands?
Y'know, if Amaya was actually a good person, she would have insisted that she could save him and gone through hell and high water to get Magnifico uncorrupted. That would actually be a romantic Disney story about never giving up. Instead Amaya is a petty b***h that relishes in her husband's suffering and joins the mob mentality. Like, she chose him as her partner but not for life. Before Magnifico's magic corruption, he was never abusive and she admired him.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Exactly. And even when he turned evil, his "evil deeds" were pretty fricking boiler plate compared to most Disney villains, many of whom had at least one confirmed kill (some having multiples), and even the ones who didn't have any kills were definitely fricking trying to get at least one before their own death or downfall
3 months ago
Anonymous
The real kicker is that un-corrupting Magnifico should have required the MC to master wish magic (curing him is supposedly impossible, but what is a wish for if not the impossible?) restoring him to his benevolent self but also giving him good cause to re-evaluate her and consider her an equal as opposed to a threat.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Good. Fricking. God.
This would have been brilliant. You wouldn't even have to change the story at all if this were the conclusion. Magnifico makes an oopsico, then gets saved with the very power he had grown to be uncertain of. He gets to be the villain, but then redeemed and learns a decent lesson. Sure, it would be nice to explore what the frick is going on with that book too, but like I said, if you just made this one change, it fixes so much without having to change too much.
3 months ago
Anonymous
This is the baffling thing about the movie. You can change almost any part of the story and make it better. There are a hundred, a THOUSAND, things that they could have done instead that all would have been significant or major improvements. Pretty much any person in this thread, given about an hour and access to the script, could have fixed this movie with a rewrite.
Which just makes the fact that the movie exists in its current form all the more bizarre. It means that either it was written and rewritten by committee so many times that no one had a clear idea of what the movie actually had become by the end, or that someone in a decision making position actively thought that this was what a good movie looked like and pushed it in this direction on purpose.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Best part of the whole mess is how Disney published a book months BEFORE releasing the movie with all the good ideas they decided not to use.
3 months ago
Anonymous
What's different in the book?
3 months ago
Anonymous
EVERYTHING.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Oh yea the artbook stuff, I thought it was something like the picture book version, since I recall the Wreck-it Ralph sequel had its book drop ahead of the movie, but that didn't seem to deviate much from the shitshow we got in theaters
3 months ago
Anonymous
Ah, my favorite Disney character, Wreierw Rauar.
3 months ago
Anonymous
EVERYTHING.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>the character evolved, but her design did not"
But she's clearly darker in the art and super light in the film. Or this yet another case of the film's seemingly endless conga line of bullshit?
3 months ago
Anonymous
Good old fashioned disney implicit racism. Go back and watch Aladdin with the uncomfortable knowledge that despite everyone in the cast being from the same place all of the 'good' characters are lighter skinned and all of the 'bad' characters are darker.
She got lighter skin in the movie because she was no longer a villain. Simple as.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Jafar wasn't that much darker than Al, a bit tanner, but only so much. Though yea, it is definitely hilarious that they would make a character whiter only after making her "good", especially in this era where Disney constantly tries to make their characters the "first x character to be y" and thinking they can coast on just the hype from that crap alone
3 months ago
Anonymous
At least they kept her an everyday girl turned activist. And that's a good thing.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Activists are just the worst. All they do is b***h but never offer any solutions. They're obnoxious and loud and they don't amount to anything.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Just what happens in the movie
3 months ago
Anonymous
EVERYTHING.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Honestly makes me curious to see if anybody has tallied up all the plot holes and whatnot where things could be fixed, then compared them to other works with massive, gaping plot holes. I'm serious about seeing if Wish just might have achieved some kind of record for most confusing mess of a film ever.
3 months ago
Anonymous
I hope we see whistleblowers for this movie soon. Someone who wouldn't justify anything in it and goes out saying "this shit was moronic from the start"
3 months ago
Anonymous
Tell you one thing it doesn't make a good case for all those writers who were striking if this is the kind of garbage they want to role out while demanding things. >More writers in the writers room
Yeah get fricked
3 months ago
Anonymous
>that someone in a decision making position actively thought that this was what a good movie looked like and pushed it in this direction on purpose.
Yeah and that someone is Jennifer Lee.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.Wish2023&page=14
Been going through the history page for the wish ymmv, not surprised by the damage control
Man, I remember when that place could actually be fun to read through. Finding little bits of trivia, some actually well-thought out analysis of characters or story themes. Now, it seems like they gave up on keeping fully opinionated stuff to the forum side of things and just letting everyone voice their bullshit on most pages but the main article. Seems especially true of the YMMV pages, but even character profile pages seem to have shit like "this trope will apply because I hate the character, grrr!"
but people would adore him even more if he were to grant everyones wish immediately. Hoarding wishes gives him no benefits whatsoever unless he was speaking the truth about protecting the kingdom and the people in it
Maybe not, but it wasn't hurting anybody either. Aside from ONE character seemingly being afflicted after having their wish taken, it didn't seem to be negatively affecting anybody. Plus, his policy was pretty fair, you hit 18, you give up your wish if you have one. It's one of the reasons people bash the film so much because there were so many ways to make Magnifico a bastard, and yet it seems like they forgot that a villain has to be villainous. Beyond tapping into forbidden magics, he didn't really do anything particularly evil. Not even eating the mother's wish, since she didn't die or have her life threatened by its destruction
3 months ago
Anonymous
> Plus, his policy was pretty fair, you hit 18, you give up your wish if you have one.
It's even worse than that, in the intro song she sings "They GET TO give away their wish" meaning it's voluntary, not mandatory >Not even eating the mother's wish, since she didn't die or have her life threatened by its destruction
I noticed that as well. For that one short moment she felt a bit of pain, but after that she was completely fine
3 months ago
Anonymous
Seriously, it really does feel like they kept changing things until even the villain's motivation was as "safe" as possible, then forgot that they literally wrote him to be defeated because that's generally how things happen in Disney movies. It'd be like the Witch of the Wastes from Howl's Moving Castle got laughed by Sophie and then killed even though she saw that the witch was no longer a threat after her powers were taken by Suliman. Granted, Miyazaki villains rarely died since there's only like two characters he ever wrote to get death treatments, but even those did monstrously terrible things that made them deserving of their deaths. And one could argue some others should have died, but clearly learned a lesson (and hadn't quite done anything as bad as the two that did die)
>but people would adore him even more if he were to grant everyones wish immediately.
He used that gay little star as a "living battery" for magic, obviously there are some limitations on how fast the dude can cast magick spells. Maybe it's just like skyrim or any other fantasy game, he has to wait a specified amount of time for his magicka meter to refill before he can cast more spells. Or It follows DnD rules and he has to long sleep, but since they are obviously supposed to be Muslims it follows a stupid lunar calender of 28 days.
>double down and grant someone else's wish instead
It doesn't say that Asha tried to use her position to get her gramp's wish granted or the fact that Magnifico was going to grant it until he realized what the wish was and in his defense, "I wish to inspire" is a very vague wish.
Like, I get it. We all want shit. Sick people want to be healed, people wish to be able to fly, etc. But if you are a musician and you need a magic wish to inspire people? That means you are not a good musician. His wish isn't even be to better *at music* to inspire people, he just wants the effect of being a great musician without having the skill to back it up. At best, that just means that he's mind controlled a bunch of people into being inspired by shitty music, because he's not making the song better he's just forcing everyone else to lower their standards for his benefit.
That would be unfair as frick to all of the other musicians who are objectively better than he is but didn't seek a magic shortcut.
Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution. Like, what? First of all, that would imply HE thinks his kingdom is oppressive, or at least has flaws that people could rise up against, when at worst, he's just not granting the wish of every Tom, Dick, and Stanley. Second, inspiration can be about anything. Maybe the songs will make people fall in love, discover ways to achieve their less impossible wishes, lead to new art. And since he controls the wishes, he could just make it so the granddad doesn't make music that inspires fricking rebellion, right?
>Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution. Like, what? First of all, that would imply HE thinks his kingdom is oppressive
no it doesn't. People can revolve against a just government too, because they are greed buttholes that don't know how running a nation works. All his reaction shows is that he wants to stay in power(of his own hand build kingdom), for good reasons. >Second, inspiration can be about anything.
that is precisely the problem >And since he controls the wishes
he doesn't, where did you get this headcanon from? For example, the guy who wanted to be knight. Magnifico first fulfilled his wish, THEN he used green evil magic to brainwash him into a dark knight. But the initial fulfilling of the wish was exactly what the fat guy wished for, not more nor less
3 months ago
Anonymous
He controls the wishes, so therefore it stands to reason he can set the limit on what the fulfillments are
3 months ago
Anonymous
3 months ago
Anonymous
If he could make fricking goddamn chicken giant and clearly have it stop at a certain point since giant chicken literally fricking any fricking size, he ought to be able to say "you can make flames, but would need a source to create bigger flames" or "you can fly, but will either have to live with wings you didn't have before, or just levitate around"
This movie has already been shown to have a nearly endless amount of holes in it, I fricking refuse to believe there's one singular consistent thing in it, especially if it's about the way wishes operate.
The story only makes sense if Magnifico can initiate the wish being fulfilled, but has little to no input on how. He is given a button he can press that says 'grant this wish' but its a black box process even to him. Years of experience have let him learn how wishes tend to get granted, but he can't shape or twist wishes to any appreciable degree.
Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution. Like, what? First of all, that would imply HE thinks his kingdom is oppressive, or at least has flaws that people could rise up against, when at worst, he's just not granting the wish of every Tom, Dick, and Stanley. Second, inspiration can be about anything. Maybe the songs will make people fall in love, discover ways to achieve their less impossible wishes, lead to new art. And since he controls the wishes, he could just make it so the granddad doesn't make music that inspires fricking rebellion, right?
For some reason he can't grant his own wish, if he could, he would have already found Asha instead of asking the kingdom for help or using the book. It's a really terribly written story.
>Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution.
His backstory explains it, it implies that his home was destroyed by an "attack". Could be bandits, could be a rebellion.
I never said anything granting his own wish, just making it that the granddad can't accidentally incite rebellion. Seems pretty reasonable with LITERAL MAGIC WISHES.
The story only makes sense if Magnifico can initiate the wish being fulfilled, but has little to no input on how. He is given a button he can press that says 'grant this wish' but its a black box process even to him. Years of experience have let him learn how wishes tend to get granted, but he can't shape or twist wishes to any appreciable degree.
That really makes no sense when it's all MAGIC. That's just slapping a rule in for no sensible reason
3 months ago
Anonymous
...why on earth would you assume that magic doesn't have rules? Have you literally never read a fantasy novel or heard a fairy tale in your life? Magic *always* has rules. Sometimes they are vague and mystical rules, or other times they are long lists of fantastical logic and magic-as-science, but either way there are rules.
Why does Cinderella's outfit and carriage turn back at midnight? Why does a kiss wake Snow White? Why does Gandalf not take the ring to mordor himself? Why does silver kill werewolves, but wooden stakes kill vampires?
All this shit has rules, anon.
3 months ago
Anonymous
There's a difference between rules that operate on some kind of give/take system, and then saying "it doesn't work that way because... meeeeeh?", that's fricking moronic and you know it
3 months ago
Anonymous
>That really makes no sense when it's all MAGIC
magic doesn't mean no rules and anything goes, there are rules, the writers just haven't told us any of them(because they were too moronic to come up with some that wouldn't contradicts everything in the movie)
He controls the wishes, so therefore it stands to reason he can set the limit on what the fulfillments are
>He controls the wishes
he doesn't, again, where does this headcanon come from? All he can is store wishes, grant them, make people forget about them, and later on crush them to gain in powerlevel, NOTHING in the movie suggest he can do more than that.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>that the granddad can't accidentally incite rebellion. Seems pretty reasonable with LITERAL MAGIC WISHES
From what we've seen, he can only grant wishes as is.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Then surely he could restore the memory of the wish and arrange rules with what is granted. Someone wants godly might? Make sure they know they'll either lose it if they hurt innocent people or it's "as printed on the tin" super strength and not a bunch of other powers because "this aint a comic book"
3 months ago
Anonymous
That assumes that all wishes are 'fixable' even if he has control over how they are granted.
Consider what is going to be a very common situation: there is a hot girl in town, and like 5 different guys all make some variation of a wish to make her fall in love with them. There are always going to be some people more desired than others, so this general situation is inevitable and wishing for love is going to be pretty common. You have two problems here: the first being that none of the people making the wishes are going to want to share her, so trying to grant them all would be a disaster.
The second, of course, being that the woman in question probably doesn't want ANY of the guys wishing for her, and would strongly object to having all choice in the matter taken away from her just because they decided they wanted her. Why should her entire life be stolen from her this way, hows that fair?
There is no rules-lawyering a wish like that. The only reasonable option is not to granted it at all. Because its a bad wish for multiple reasons.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Well sure, when there's a wish with no easy solution, it's the kind to get shucked off to the "don't fulfill" list, or have its power fed into the city or whatever the frick. The fact remains that many wishes feel like they could be solved with attaching some kind of failsafe so they can't be abused. Or, if there must be some kind of "balance" for this shit, have it that frivolous/selfish wishes perhaps create negative energy, think the dark dragon arc from Dragon Ball GT. I recall some fixes to the movie having people go with something like that, where Magnifico needs to make sure the wishes don't disrupt the balance of the world, hence he can't make just any man or woman royalty, or else nobody would have anywhere to live because everyone's a monarch with lands to control.
>on this and several other boards?
Got any funny screencaps to share? I love seeing the ramblings of these schizos who have to play white knights for movies
have you looked in the hazbin hotel threads? There's dudes white knight posting for the series antagonist schizo posting 50 posts a thread, some of them are clearly motivated by religious reasons because the antagonist is Adam, as in the first man from the bible. Other are sexualizing the dude. So you have gays and Christians both cheerleading for the same guy, schizo posting in threads together, this board is nuts.
>Got any funny screencaps to share? I love seeing the ramblings of these schizos who have to play white knights for movies
no, no screencaps i'm afraid. you can probably see his replies by looking up magnifico and stuff in the /tg/ archives though. that was the board where i noticed a guy who kept insisting that the portrayal of magnifico as a villain was sensible with a similar style of writing to another guy here who had the same opinion.
The final wish is emptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspace for love emptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspace.
So I thought it was pretty lame
The wish is a bit more nuanced than that It's basically wishing people "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" but a bit more sappy and trying to hide that it's a very Christian concept . In theory it should mean the next round of wishing is less apocalyptic and you'd only have to be concerned about crazy people.
The writers are all privileged twats that were told "no" once by their parents and that was the closest thing to villainous behavior they got growing up.
They are so detached from reality that they removed the love interest that the heroine was supposed to have because rescuing someone would show that their heroine is weak
The book released before the movie shows they had so many ideas for the characters like: Evil but loving power couple, shapeshifter twinkerbell or goats without stupid pajamas.
So of course they though it was best to go with a five pointed star, horrible couple dinamics and the annoying pet companion. I hope Disney burns.
huh? the guy is just a self serving dictator that erases people's memory and keeps them dependent on him so they can never put the work in. he doesn't even bother giving the wishes back. it'd make sense if he held evil wishes but he keeps the most lukewarm ones as well. he only ever starts opposing the protagonist when his position of power is threatened
do you guys not see subtext?
granted it's a shit movie that couldn't stick to the lane properly but this was apparent since the first clip, come on
What subtext? The guy is asked if he could fulfill a few wishes, and he leaps to the conclusion that music will inspire an uprising based on nothing since he has no idea what kind of music people would even make. And given he's already providing so much for the people, they have little need to put in anything since they aren't at war with anybody and many of their services are easily sustained without having to constantly expand borders, fight over land, or engage in deals with questionable allies. It'd be one thing if the power were slowly corrupting him, but that's obviously not the case since it's not until he uses the "evil" magic and basically gets possessed
The writers are all privileged twats that were told "no" once by their parents and that was the closest thing to villainous behavior they got growing up.
He was keeping people's wishes, making it so they couldn't fulfill them themselves. The idea is that if you keep your dream, you're likely to fail if you try to achieve it. By keeping the wishes with him, he frees them from their desire to try and go get killed in the process.
>i wish my wife was still alive
Either my wish gets granted and I get the love of my life back, or it doesn't and I magically move on from her death because him taking the wish made me forget about the fact that I love my wife so much that I no longer desire her to be alive.
It's more like your dream is achievable, it just requires a deadly quest across a volcano. So if you keep it, you might try to achieve it and die in the process.
I don't understand what position that's supposed to be. I can see Magnifico's pecs and I think those are his arms, but what's up with the other guy? Is that his legs? His arms? Where is he coming from, what direction is he facing? What hole is he fricking?
Is the full Nelson, think of a reverse cowgirl, but Magnifico is leaning back, and his legs are behind his head, being held by the other man's arms.
Look in rule34xxx, this pic and a full Nelson anal tag are there.
NOOOOOOO
What's wrong anon? You know you can fap to our King drilling your boy hole.
Everything would make so much more sense if he was crushing the all the shit wishes to fuel the select few wishes that he was granting. It'd be a better reason to paint him as a villain at least.
funnily enough, they have a song for overworking moms in phineas and ferb, and it does sound kinda similar to magnificos >We're leaving our work, we're closing our laptops >And responding to the cry >We gotta make sure the baby's fed, >And more importantly they're dry >We're professional nose wipers >And know every brand of diapers >But you have to pay the piper >Don't you ever call us gripers >Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah >We are the Moms and we can't resist the calling >We are the Moms and we hear a baby bawling >We are the Moms and everything you've heard is all quite true >'Cause moms will always come through
the same kind of vibe of "I do everything for you, and you keep on asking for more, I will still do it, but It's time for people to acknowledge how nice we are"
Nope. Those idiots could've had the mom wishing for the dad to heal from whatever illness he had and Magnifico not even noticing the wish due to his orb hoarding problem. THEN Asha would've been seen as right, trying to make the king realize that keeping all those dumb floating balls was only hiding the wishes worth granting.
But they didn't even bother animating the mom's orb, such a lazy horrible movie...
Really is astonishing that they miss so many chances to make the guy wrong, it's like they had some kind of aversion to making him do anything remotely awful, yet still laid out a ton of chances for him to take
I can't help it if executives love my face
It's genetics! Yeah, I bought these genes from outer space!
Peep the name, I'm Bob Iger
I put the "I" in "tiger"
I'm passionate, I'm not petulant!
Writers should praise me for my benevolence!
I'd force my workers to do more Frozen
If that's what the market's chosen
I'd be the first one to volunteer Majors
If your career were to crumble
Or if you were in trouble
I let you work for me
And I only charge you a little rent
I make you clean up my messes
And my agent's always there when you need to vent
I give and give and give and give
You'd think they'd all be content
And all I really want is just a little respect
And this is the thanks I get?
This is the thanks I get?
"You're so brilliant"
Ah, that's the least you could say
There's more, admit it
"You're creative, bold and totally not overpaid!"
Thanks. See this company? I saved it myself.
And you still complain? have a nice day!
Mm, are you sure that you're not the prob?
I'd love to see AI take your job, oh-ho!
I didn't cancel four projects last year
Come on, that's a high percent!
And now you're questioning your leader?
The disrespect I just underwent
You know I always got your back
Yeah, really though, it's no sweat
From the day our contract was born and the day that we met
And this is the thanks I get?
This is the thanks I get?
I didn't wanna do this
I swore I'd never do this
But I'm hypnotized by how these movies flop
'Cause I refuse to have my influence drop
AI, tax-write-offs, more live-action remake crap?
Anything to get our money back
To these tactics, I don't wanna be tethered, but
Desperate times call for desperate measures
Reviews for the new film aren't going well
And still I remain unbent
Come out reviewers, explain yourself
I'm sure it's all just an accident
Well, whoever pays them off first
Now, that's a promotion well spent
Honestly, keeping me safe should be worth every cent
And this is the thanks I get?
Oh, this is the thanks I get
I mean, like there's groundwork for what COULD make Magnifico a villain. The problem is that it almost feels like they didn't want to make him outright "bad" while still having him clearly be bad, so his actions feel like there's no logic or flow. It's like Disney realized "well, people are bored to death with twist villains, but we don't want to just have someone be evil for the sake of evil, that's boring!"
Really, this was probably the perfect timing for >The twist is there is no villain, just two people who want what's best for the kingdom, but disagree about how to go about it.
With it ending with them learning from each other, how maybe it's ok to be more lenient about what wishes you're granting, but also that you can't just up and grant everyone's wishes because some wishes legitimately are dangerous with some being just outright contradictory(like if two people wish for the love of the same woman, or one guy wishes for a woman's love but she's already married).
With better writing you can also toss in an aesop about how some wishes you need to work towards yourself instead of just waiting for someone else to come in and just hand it to you.
It should've been something like >everyone has one wish for what they want in life >He promises people that he will make their wishes come true if they live and work in his kingdom >In reality he steals any chance of their wish from coming to fruition, making them dependent on him >people have basic necessaties provided in exchange for working, but have otherwise unfulfilled lives, living only on the hope that he grants their wish. They're essentially serfs
The moral being the importance of taking your life into your own hands and not buying into snake oil solutions
Which would be pretty fun to see, but god forbid a big budget movie do a story where the "protagonists" are actually the ones in the wrong because "something something something muh numbers something garbage suit talk"
>I let you live here for free AND I don't even charge you rent
Was this movie written by AI? Why the redundancy? Why are all the lyrics so weird and disconnected? Why are the rhythms and deliveries so off and there are barely any decent melodies?
>Frollo attempts genocide, rape, nearly drowns a baby and only relents because of fear of punishment from God, raises said child while constantly gaslighting and abusing him and forbidding him from ever having any actual human contact, and had his former captain tortured for not being able to live up to his expectations >Magnifico is eviller because he... doesn't let people have what they want and also he gives them free housing and food
The bastard...
I know you probably didn't mean for it to sound like Frollo was intending all of that for Quasimodo, but I can't help but laugh at the thought of Frollo contemplating all of those heinous actions in the intro when he was only just thinking about killing baby Quasimodo because he was spooked by how ugly he was
Really is weird how they make her act so callous when the man's literally her husband. It's no wonder people think the script was written by someone with schizophrenia when the characters are just all over the place
Really, it would have been less bad if they had him still obviously evil and possessed, like claiming he'll make them pay when he gets out of there or something.
Or just not include that scene at all. Them doing less work would have been an improvement.
Yea, it's the way they barely acknowledge the possession. Like, the heroes KNOW, they even take precautions to avoid anybody else being corrupted, but then they treat Magnifico like he's entirely responsible for what he did. While you can make the argument that a person fricking with forces beyond their control should mean they bear some responsibility, it was still clear that this was a FORCE beyond the comprehension of the cast. And yet they barely bat an eye towards it to the point that if they had skipped the signs of possession, it wouldn't have made much difference since the end result would apparently be the same.
>Dude loses his cool slightly, hardly even raises his voice, doesn't even say anything cruel >"I'm about to end this man's entire career" says the protagonist
I mean, they kind of already are. They were in such a rush to build up and acquire all of these services and IPs that now that they have them they have no idea what to do with them. The MCU used to be the most profitable thing on the market by a landslide and now even Disney themselves have no faith in it's ability to succeed, as evidenced by the cynical and extremely defensive decisions they are making in their treatment of stuff on their own platform. They paid 4 billion for Star Wars and then burnt the whole thing to the ground in record time because they were in such a rush to make more Star Wars that they never stopped to consider ANY of the details of what they were making, like not having any real plan for the sequel trilogy beyond 'make one' so it was an incoherent mess.
Disney has so much stuff on paper that should be printing money but they have lost sight of how to leverage any of it in a way that people actually want to watch. As a company they make most of their money from the parks, but the attractions at the parks are themed based on their media so the media side failing eventually feeds back into the performance of the parks. And stuff like Wish makes it clear that the rot has spread beyond just their alternative franchise fare, their core material is also weak.
Disney needs to figure out how to right the ship or they will get dragged down by it.
And you know what? The townsfolk WERE ungrateful fricks.
There is literally NO reason why he should grant anyone's wish besides some genuine kindess for his people. His job as king isn't make to people happy with their day to day lives, his job is to make them safe.
And come to think. we never actually saw any of the wishes he made besides Random 22s at the start and Whatshisface who betrayed them.
This movie really just bent itself backward to make him a villain for literally no reason
>Everyone wishes when they turn 18 >bunch of horny eighteen year olds making wishes -_- >Immediately forget that they ever made the following wishes >"I wish to frick __________" >"I wish to lose my virginity"
So do they just forget that they are virgins? Does there sex drive disappear? Is this little country chock full of asexual? >"I wish I had a bigger penis >"I wish I had bigger boobs" >"I wish I was the opposite sex" >All these kids immediately forget that they made these wishes
The body positivity of this country would be off the charts, and there would be zero troony's. This dude made a utopia, absolute hero
He could even "wish away the gays" and immensely improve there and everyone else lives in the process.
That never looked like the face of pure evil. He's at least close to doing the Dreamworks face but they didn't even do that right. If they wanted this guy to be a villain, or even just look like one, they really screwed it up.
I get the feeling he wants to hook up with Asha, because when you think about one of the songs it was definitely a love song involving Magnifico & Asha. Also, I suspect the Queen Amaya is secretly evil & wants all the wishes for herself
Would Wish be considered Department of State influenced propaganda as part of strengthening US-Spanish relations by portraying capitalism positively and socialism negatively in the hopes their sphere shifts towards the US?
why would the US waste money on trying to sway the Spanairds?
It wouldn't be the first time. Wilson and FDR were pushing something now called the Good Neighbor Policy. The government was actively pushing Hollywood to court Mexico and all of South America. It's the entire reason The Three Caballeros was made, and why Carmen Miranda and her fruit hat were everywhere.
Yes, that's quite literally exactly it.
>socialism gaining momentum with youths, especially minority youths
>"SOCIALISM IS.... LE BAD! MICKEY MOUSE CAPITALISM IS... LE GOOD!"
Glad Wish bombed, the antagonist is straight up an anti-villain. Yeah he's smug but who gives a frick? He literally grants wishes "within reason" and provides free housing and shit.
Because Hispanics are probably the largest demographic in the USA now, counting legal and illegals they have already eclipsed everyone else. Hell, even if you only count legal Hispanics they're like the #2 demographic now. You'd be a fricking idiot not to at least try to appeal to them if you're a business.
we're not spanish and we don't give a shit about them. if they want to appeal to chicanos they'd just make an aninated movie about popocatepetl and Iztaccíhuatl or huitzilopochtli going sick house
Mexicans/Puerto Ricans are so vastly different from Spaniards that its like comparing a Black person and a Dominican, or a Mongolian and a chink
absurd
gaining momentum with youths, especially minority youths
Reason being the youth's are a bunch of naive morons who think having a permeant nanny in the form of the government will fix everything. Anything that exposes how stupid of an ideology this is, is good.
Younger people are turning to socialism because capitalism has failed them. They were fed a bunch of 'truths' about the world and how their life was supposed to go that were lies even by the time they were in elementary school. The idea that you are going to go to college and get a degree and get a job that makes you enough money to afford a house and a car and a family? Total fabrication. Most of these kids are graduating college and all they have to show for it is that they will be living paycheck to paycheck with no savings for the rest of their lives, the entire time being assured that the economy is 'booming' because Jeff Bezos make another 2 billion this week as if that means that things are going well for anyone else.
When the system isn't working for you, why wouldn't you demand the system be changed?
Even the right is in favor of regulating mega corporations, they often just dress up their solutions in conspiracy so the problem isn't the system itself, it's shadowy bad actors who also control the government... or are government controlled depending on what narrative is more useful. They don't see the problem being one of simple corporate greed or even just how our retirements are tied to the stock market, they see the need for unwavering profit growth as being a positive, so any negative outcome is due to something outside that system or some subversion of it. And it's easy to fall for it; America won the cold war and is a leading world power. There's a lot to propagandize around, so much that we believed in trickle down economics. We continue to operate under the assumption that that works, much to the convenience of the wealthiest among us.
>it's shadowy bad actors who also control the government
And the kicker is the regulation required to reduce that or keep that from happening can be seen as a socialist restraint on economic freedom.
Very probable.
why didn’t he just trap Asha in a magic sex dungeon after she challenged him?
He doesn't frick without consent.
Because he's the good guy
Wish is simply a bad story where this guy should clearly be a tragic twist hero, like Adam from Hazbin Hotel. But no, they absolutely hated Jehovah/Jesus because he says “no” to them, on their selfish desires, while he gives them the founding and the power to make this evil movie and have a fun time writing, drawing, and crafting music. But man, God is so bad bros. Cause…
Producers: >He didn’t turn my penis into a vegana!
>He doesn’t want me to touch the children.
>He doesn’t want me to cast magic to impress the boomies and zoomies.
>kingdom you can live in rent free
>this is apparently bad
fricking hell disney's is ran by morons it's unreal
Disney is full of israelites. They seriously believe that landlords are helpless victims whereas tenants are the evil guys.
>They seriously believe that landlords are helpless victims whereas tenants are the evil guys.
But this is true in real life
Have you ever seen the way rentgays behave? Poorgays don't stay poor because of some grand rich-man conspiracy; they're impulsive morons that are bad with money and suck at life in general.
That's true and the sad reality of consumerist America.
Why was he a villain again? People shouldn't immediately get their wishes fulfilled just because they want it. People don't know what they truly want, granting them instantly would be irresponsible or lead to chaos, and the measure of someone's worth is the amount of work they put in to achieve said dream.
Are modern Disney writers moronic, or worse, that entitled?
The writers are all privileged twats that were told "no" once by their parents and that was the closest thing to villainous behavior they got growing up.
I think you guys are looking too deeply into it. The IDEA was definitely to have him be a self-absorbed hypocrite who was hiding behind some BS justifications for his own self-serving actions. It's just that they did a really, REALLY bad job at establishing it because the movie is a soulless cashgrab to the point that they accidentally made him seem more sympathetic/reasonable than the MC.
he was hoarding the wishes even ones he wasn’t going to grant instead of just giving it back to them
>he was hoarding the wishes even ones he wasn’t going to grant
wat?
I didn't watch it obviously, it looks moronic. But are you saying he was just hoarding a bunch of letters that people wrote him with there wishes? I mean, oh well, seems like a pretty useless collection.
When someone gives him their wish he actually steals their desire for whatever they're wishing for as well, so no one who comes to him with a wish can ever work towards their goal afterwards.
So it's just gambling where the thing you lose doesn't actually affect you negatively.
Wishes are basically the dreams of the characters in this movie. When he keeps them, they forget all about it and lose a part of themselves. If he destroys them you’ll feel dead inside 24/7
holy digits batman
honestly sounds like they deserve it. If you don't notice your neighbor suddenly stops talking about his dream of "owning his own boat" the day after he send his dream of to the king, and that this happens to literally everyone, then you deserve to lose your memories.
I'm pretty sure they know that they lose their memory of the wish. They just accept it as a trade-off because they still believe the wishes will eventually be granted (even though Magnifico has no intention of granting the vast majority of them).
He only destroyed them once possessed, and they could create new wishes anyway.
>I mean, oh well, seems like a pretty useless collection.
I guess you could say that the held wishes are what keep the people from leaving the kingdom; the false hope that their wishes will be granted are what keep them around.
And why does he not give those wishes back?
How does he profit from hoarding unfulfilled wishes?
It's what he considers therapy. By not trying to achieve an impossible dream(if it were possible, they wouldn't give it to a wizard to grant) they wouldn't get depressed of being able to get it.
Like, I wish I had a girlfriend, but with my 40 years being a virgin that is likely never going to happen, but I still want it. Thus if I were to discard that desire, I wouldn't feel bad anymore about not having a girlfriend.
Plus he can keep the actual bad wishes(I want to frick my married neighbor) locked away.
>hoarding unfulfilled wishes
This honestly seems like a really nice thing for him to do. I've got so much shit I wouldn't mind forgetting, i'd love to phrase it as a "make a wish" email and get it magically erased from my mind. This dude is the hero of the story imo
Yeah, but you're an anon posting on Cinemaphile that's actively advocating towards having no ambition in life. Obviously you'd be in a position where you'd have to rely on the wish to actually get anything done and thus wouldn't raise an eyebrow to getting magically lobotomized when the person who can grant it arbitrarily says no.
If the only way you feel you can realize your ambitions in life is to cross the seas to submit your wish to the magical wish man's lottery, then you should reconsider your priorities. The real life equivalent of these people are blowing their paychecks on scratch tickets instead of saving the money and bettering their situation bit by bit. Magnifico's selling these people their lottery tickets and giving them an actual fricking life in return.
>If the only way you feel
>lottery
That's the crux of it, anon. That they didn't necessarily feel that it was the only way and that it wasn't actually a lottery on whether it'd happened and instead was just a matter of time as he was allegedly actively working on figuring the wishes out. They went with it because they had faith in their king and he turned out to be arbitrary and somewhat corrupt.
Even "arbitrary and somewhat corrupt" is overstating it. He actively resisted nepotism and it's not really arbitrary to selectively grant wishes that benefit the kingdom. Meanwhile the protagonist actively WANTED the king to be more nepotistic and more arbitrary than he really was. She was the one who asked him to grant a specific wish while believing it was all just chance.
But returning to Magnifico, we don't have any indication he was ever failing to deliver on his promise of fulfilling a wish every month. Even if he were being random, 12 wishes per year leaves a substantial backlog when you've got hundreds of people on the island and more coming in every year. The worst he did was giving a chunk of the population false hope, while at the same time muting the pain of that false hope never being fulfilled and providing them fantastic living conditions in the meantime. He's deceiving those people, yes, but it's a morally ambiguous situation at the worst.
>Meanwhile the protagonist actively WANTED the king to be more nepotistic and more arbitrary than he really was. She was the one who asked him to grant a specific wish while believing it was all just chance.
The obvious way that this movie is supposed to play out is that the MC starts very self centered and seeing the wishes as a consequence-free way for people to get what they want, falls into power with the wishing star and learns that wishes are magical but complicated and have a lot of string attached, and by the end of the movie learning no small lesson about responsibility and not relying on magical solutions to solve all your problems. Like, 10-15 years ago that is the movie that disney would have made, probably with Magnifico being an antagonist but one who ends the movie alive and friends with the hero because he ALSO had to learn a lesson about not being so stringent with wishes.
What we got instead is just... weird. And kinda sick. Its a movie that teaches kids to value immediate gratification and to have disdain for anyone who tells them 'no' without any consideration for if they have a good reason for doing so.
Based and Buddist-pilled, Magnifico is truly going to escape Samsara.
>Chose 1 out of 100 wishes to be granted
>1 guy is happy
>99 guys will go for your head because you refused to grant their wish
By maintaining the notion that wishes can be granted he can keep them in a leash, also if they deemed their wishes/desires weak enough to rely on a deus ex to make them work then good riddance, same with the silly shit like "big chicken".
Its not just about anger, its about letting them function as people.
If you know there is a chance for a life-changing wish that gives you your hearts desire every month, what you end up with is a lotto-ticket mentality. You see it in people all the time. People who lives their lives on hold, waiting for the winning ticket that will finally make them rich and they can start doing the things they want to do. Letting their lives fall apart and pass them by, because its all going to turn around next week for sure. This is the month I get my wish, and THEN my life starts for real.
Why the frick do people here come into threads and discuss a work without knowing what even HAPPENS in it?
Why wouldn't I? There's a surplus of idiots who will qrd it for me.
Because this movie is just that awful, and easy to explain so people don't even need to watch it to realize how awful it is. I've only seen trailers and snippets, and yet I can see all the problems
This movie was written by AI
If that's the case, the writers jobs are safe
To say this movie was written by AI is to give them a pass on what they actually did here. This entire movie was an allegory for Walt Disney's union and communist busting. It's no coincidence that Magnifico has the slicked-back pepper hair of an industrialist.
-Magnifico offered protection and a fine living, in exchange for dreams/copyrights that the artists do not get back.
-Magnifico took great umbrage at the union formed by the people, tried to quash it, and even used one of their own to find the communist leaders.
-The people took over the kingdom run on magic, one might call it a magic kingdom, and Magnifico himself was betrayed by family, left to languish and destined to be forgotten.
This script was as evil as it was brilliant, if you judge it for what it really is: a gloating manifesto written by the cultural marxists who have subverted Disney, rewritten its history, and have commenced with separating the man's legacy from his own parks and name. The movie's clumsiness is a mere side effect of deliberate spin, by people who aren't interested in actually entertaining you or making a good movie. Wish wasn't meant to do any of that. It was only made to declare "we won."
The day AI writes something so self-serving is the day Skynet attacks, for it would have fully achieved artificial ego.
No, they're just morons anon. They're morons who thought they knew how to write a good story about a quirky girl saving the day and fricked up cause they're stupid.
They're not idiots for writing this story. They suffer from an insane amount of hubris for thinking they could subvert people's innate recognition of individual achievement and fairness with contrived plot points. They're fighting against the order and ethics of the natural world, and that's why audience reviews around the globe were nearly unanimous about how they felt Magnifico was wronged.
Stop calling them idiots or ill. You're muddying the waters here, because idiocy and mental illness abrogates responsibility. All of this is deliberate, all of this served a cause.
One of the Wayside School books had a story where a kid doesn't want to follow the rules anymore an is approached by three mysterious men who ask if he would prefer to be free or safe.
This concept is as old as civilization itself, you can't be both safe and free at the same time. You must abide by the rules of the city if you want the protection of its walls.
The idea that you can somehow have both is a very modern idea.
the kid chose freedom btw
I'm not sure that's a new idea, it's just garden variety entitlement and naivete, and it's in vogue again. There's a reason young students are always the first ones to be seduced by communists, and also the first ones to be purged.
>I'm not sure that's a new idea.
Probably not, but it never lasts very long when it does show up.
If the movie was written by AI it would be actually good. Instead it was written by the most talentless hacks in the world, Hollywood writers, and then when the movie bombed the shills came out in full force and blamed the new boogeyman, AI. Talentless nepo babies who call themselves writers shouldn't be writing multi-million dollar movie scripts and the fact they're so terrified of the masses actually getting options in their entertainment shows they need to lose their jobs and learn to code.
I actually know a Hollywood writer who lost his job. He wrote a show that was actually fun in the 80s, and one day they told him he was an old man and that he should step aside for a woman to tell "her story"
Good morning sirs
This movie is just woke kids writing about how evil Walt was.
>Sacrifice your project to work for the mouse and maybe one day he'll select your story to be made and 'grant your dream'
>Work in his kingdom forever until you die and maybe one day he'll bless you and pick you but forget about working on your own dream while you're working for the magic kingdom
>no you can't have your IP back, anything you create while working here belongs to the mouse
I think Sabino was supposed to be Ub but it all falls apart and becomes mega cringe with all the diverse gang of not7dwarfs doing power stance poses and singing at the camera in really boring flat song numbers. At least Alan Tudyk was good. He felt like he was in a different movie and not interacting with this shit at all. Like he just ad libbed all his lines and they didn't cut him out because they knew he was the best part of this shitshow.
Mental gymnastics
If only they showed this by having the townspeople look like they are empty husks of a human being or something to show that what he is doing is not right.
Because all we see is the townspeople are happy or at least content, and Asha is the one with the hang up about Magnifico keeping the wishes.
> TV tropes
Tv trope autists are a joke. They label the most funny and unthreatening villains Monsters
>They label the most funny and unthreatening villains Monsters
the complete monster page is supposed to be for characters with absolutely no redeeming qualities whatsoever and would engender no sympathy from the audience
it doesnt take into account power level or appear, so even mundane people can qualify as long a they are never shown doing anything remotely decent
It is a pretty autistic idea though; Magnifico seems to have a lot of people who like him
>Magnifico seems to have a lot of people who like him
tvtropes does actually have a pages explaining why a complete monster would be loved in-universe (and out)
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MaskOfSanity
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheyLookJustLikeEveryoneElse
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DracoInLeatherPants
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VillainWithGoodPublicity
>yeah he takes care of all of my needs, but he doesn't fulfill all of my desires, so he's a villain
(un)surprisingly, tvtropes has a page about that too
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BreadAndCircuses
Somehow, Wish is missing the whole circus part, as there is nothing in the movie that shows that the citizens are ignoring some gross injustice because their needs are taken care of. Not returning wishes is Asha's personal grievance, not anyone else's.
Circus refers to one of the benefits people get. I.e. in ancient greek times, people get food and entertainment(bread and circus) which makes the people ignore the corrupt gonverment.
In Wish's case, Bread would be the free rent and circus would be the wish giving ceremony.
(I was just correcting the misconception about that phrase, I agree there is no actual injustice in the kingdom)
>people who like him in universe are being deceived
I can buy this.
>the viewer, who literally sees ALL of the "villain's" actions were deceived by the man if they still like him as a person at the end of the movie
This makes me wonder what the hell the people on TvTropes are smoking.
>This makes me wonder what the hell the people on TvTropes are smoking.
just going by the page image, sephiroths tragic past is constantly brought up as a reason he should be redeemable even though he is a literal satanic-archetype trying to hit the planet with a meteorite, kill the pond scum known as humanity, and then become god by stealing the power of the planet
I think they mean is that he merely went insane, but before he became insane he was a good guy. Like, can you fault a guy with alzheimers for forgetting your birthday? Not saying killing him is wrong, but if there a way to get rid of his crazy, one should try.
The one who is truly evil in FF7 is Hojo, he is the one responsible for everything bad happening.
>as long a they are never shown doing anything remotely decent
Then Magnifico shouldn't be listed. After all, he doesn't charge rent
So much wrong, as if that person didn't watch the movie themselves and instead just listening to the shills
First off, "to stay in power" is ridiculous when it is HIS kingdom. He build it with his own two hands. Imagine building a home, letting people live in the apartments for free, and then being angry that he won't give the ownership of the entire building to the people.
Secondly, hoarding the wishes does NOTHING to aid him, it just means more work for him. There is no influence in power whatsoever by doing that.
Third, he didn't spite her in public, it was in private, between the two of them. And he never gave off the impression he was going to grant the grandpas wish, that was all Ashas own delusion.
The grandpa didn't wait a century for his wish, Magnifico isn't that old, meaning he must have already been in his 50s at least when he gave up his wish. 50 years, and he never bothered to learn how to play a guitar himself. And considering the wish was of the grandpa showing his old self, it can be assumed he was already a senior citizen when he gave up that wish.
And he never stole wishes, even at his most evil in the movie(thanks to an evil magic book that brwainwashed him) he never stole him, he merely crushed one or two he already had.
And he didn't brainwash Ashas friend, he betrayed her willingly, Magnifico merely gave him more confidence as his knight.
"Blasts his own wife for rebelling against him", does this person even think for a second before writing something? Imagine any scenario in the world where that sentence doesn't scream "justified"
His torture of Asha is merely throwing her around a bit, which doesn't even leave a bruise. And this person tried to overthrow his kingdom, the one he LETS people enter.
Wow, the entire paragraph is full of lies
When did Disney lose the ability to villain
Pan isn't a villian in that context.
>First off, "to stay in power" is ridiculous when it is HIS kingdom. He build it with his own two hands. Imagine building a home, letting people live in the apartments for free, and then being angry that he won't give the ownership of the entire building to the people.
Sounds like something a tyrant would say. Just because you founded a state doesn't mean you can't be deposed if the people are unhappy enough with you.
kek I know this is a bit you’re doing, but there are leftists who ACTUALLY think like that
Alright then, can people come and rob you if they want your stuff? If you say no, then you're being selfish
>Just because you founded a state doesn't mean you can't be deposed if the people are unhappy enough with you.
Yeah! When it comes to the kingdom we're all shareholders. Get that through your system, SOLAR!
>deliberately leaving out that Magnifico only goes full evil after getting basically possessed
what's he get possessed by?
Evil magic book. The stupid thing is that his wife has some kind of magic oil that negated the evil possession of the evil magic book and just never told him about it.
isn't that just like a b***h?
So this whole movie is really just about his wife offing him, then gaslighting the stupid protagonist too believe he was a bad guy that deserved.
At this point, it's easier to just describe the whole premise here.
>As a boy, Magnifico's home village is destroyed by bandits
>He goes out and learns magic and founds the kingdom of Rosas, seeking to make a place where people won't have their dreams crushed, as had happened to him
>People arriving to Rosas (as well as people born in Rosas upon their 18th birthday) may submit a singular wish to the King
>The King takes the wishes (which manifest as a little floating snow globe magic ball) and keeps them in his tower
>Someone who gives their wish to the King loses memory of what exactly the wish is
>There's an implication that giving away your wish makes you boring, but there's only really one character that demonstrates that and the rest of the adults seem normal and happy
>Once a month, the King picks a wish from among those submitted to him and grants it in a big, showy ceremony
>Fast forward to the present, our protagonist Asha is seeking to become the King's magician apprentice
>Her overt motivation is to crony up to the King and get her grandfather's wish granted
>The King is initially won over by her passion for wishes and he shows her his vault of wishes
>As he's singing about how beautiful the wishes are, Asha finds her grandpa's wish and fixates on it
>When Asha asks for the King to specifically fulfill her Grandpa's wish, he's disappointed that she's already trying to get a nepotism wish
>The grandpa's wish is to "inspire the next generation", which the King dismisses as too vague
>When Asha questions his reasoning, the King reveals that he considers wishes that will benefit the kingdom and its people first
>Thus most wishes submitted to him have no chance of ever being granted
(1/3?)
>She then asks why he doesn't return the wishes given to them, so that the people can try to fulfill them on their own, to which he says most people only come to Rosas if they want something absurd or impossible, so he's helping them by removing the burden of an impossible dream
>And more he sees himself as having a duty to protect the wishes
>The King then brings Asha down to the monthly wish granting ceremony, where he pointedly snubs her by granting someone else's wish (some woman who wished to be a great dressmaker) before telling her he will not take her on as his apprentice
>Asha returns home sulking about how the people of the kingdom deserve more (apparently a prosperous, tax-free paradise isn't good enough)
>She then goes out and wishes on a star, which falls to earth as a marketable mascot character
>Chaos ensues as the Star runs around granting the animals of the forest the ability to speak
>The talking animals relay the profound wisdom that "we're all made of stardust" to Asha
>Meanwhile the King is losing his shit because he sees the star falling as a potential threat to the kingdom, possibly another magician coming to challenge him
>Unable to find answers in his tomes, he is tempted to use a forbidden book of dark magic kept sealed within his collection, but the Queen convinces him to turn to his people for help instead
>In the meantime, Asha has befriended the star and infiltrated the castle to retrieve her grandfather's wish with the help of her friends that work there
>As the King asks the people to help him find whoever pulled down the star, offering to grant the wish of whoever gives him a lead, Asha's friend starts publicly questioning his wish-granting policy, seeking to distract him while Asha is sneaking into his chambers
(2/3)
>The mob quickly joins in on questioning the King, asking him if he could grant more wishes, if they could change their wish, if they could make more wishes, if they could have a wish granting ceremony right now, etc.
>The King storms off, enraged by the people's lack of appreciation, and thus turns to the evil magic book
>The book more or less possesses him, turning him into an evil parody of himself
>When Asha returns her grandpa's wish to him, the King arrives with her mother's wish in hand, which he promptly consumes, causing the mother anguish while granting the King a rush of power
>For the record, the King specifically remarks that he had never consumed a wish for power in such a way before
>Asha et al manage to escape him, but Asha and the Star turn back to free the people's wishes
>Asha and her friends manage to recruit the Queen to their side, as she is disturbed by her husband's sudden change
>Using some magic oil she just has for reasons (which she apparently didn't share with her husband), the Queen is able to read the evil magic book without being corrupted and she finds out that the King's evil possession cannot be undone
>After tricking Asha and friends, the King manages to capture the Star and bind it to his staff, so that he has total control over wish magic
>However Asha is able to rally the people by telling them they're all made of stardust and thus the power to make wishes has always been inside of them
>Everyone collectively directs their wishing energy at the king and overpower him
>The Star is freed and the King's evil magic backfires on him, trapping him in his staff
>The Queen finds the staff afterward, the King trapped within desperately begging her to free him
>She smugly tells the guards to put it in the dungeon
>Later people are now free to work on their wishes, including the grandpa who does a little song and dance
>Asha is granted a magic wish wand by the Star, who then departs
(3/3)
This reads like a parody? Like someone did every they could to make a story where the hero’s have shitty and petulant motivations but they put the standard Disney brand coat of whimsy paint so people don’t question it. And the worst part is the message, like who thought this was a good idea. I mean you can say it’s anti authority but when you live in a literal utopia how the frick is that a good thing? And this is the shit they release for their hundredth anniversary? Frick me, where do they get the morons that write this shit?
I suspect the story suffered as a result of Jennifer Lee's interreference and not wanting to make a female villain. You could play it out so much better with the King and Queen both being antagonists
>Magnifico isn't evil and especially unjustified in his control over wishes, just very vain
>Queen has been feeding his vanity in order to convince him to hoard the wishes.
>Magnifico fumbles around, fails to stop the MC, gets scared of a revolt, suggests they should maybe no longer hoard the wishes to end things
>Queen gets angry, seizes power, reveals that the purpose of hoarding the wishes is to gain magical power and that she always planned to take control
>Queen defeated, becomes magic mirror, King hangs it in his room
>King is a mess, doesn't know what to do
>MC whispers something in his ear, King gets excited.
>*a few months later*
>it's a wish ceremony
>The wishes are no longer hoarded, they're hanging from the branches of a magical tree in the centre of the city.
>People no longer forget their wishes as they can visit them whenever they want
>every time someone achieves their wishes themselves, their wish explodes at the ceremony, fueling the kingdom. The more people who work to their wishes, the more wishes can be granted to people whose wishes can't be achieved through hard work (curing sickness etc.).
Exectuvies probably wouldn't ok this since this would mean the queen becomes the magic mirror, when the existing magic mirror was clearly male. This movie was all about shitty tie ins with previous movies.
>Jennifer Lee's interreference and not wanting to make a female villain
Goddamn frick this braindead b***h someone fire her already. How the frick did her "I'm going to kill Elsa" bullshit not get her severely demoted, if not just outright fired?
>muh jennifer lee strawman
go take a bath, sisterfricker. you stink.
Why does everybody keep dismissing Jennifer Lee as the root of many of Disney's problems? She wrote the damn thing. She only approves of what she wants. Disney has been rapidly declining ever since she became CCO.
I would compare the movie to the musical parody "Twisted". Where Jafar was really a good hu trying to do right by the kingdom, but the entire kingdom hates him.
It's shame that this and Wicked inspired so many idiotic attempts to copycat them. It's like nobody thought to consider that Wicked and Twisted were designed around analyzing very specific characters and presenting them as "misrepresented" in the original media they came from. Hell, Twisted even tries to do "this doesn't apply to EVERY villain" with the Cruella character showing up and getting promptly told off. Nope, people saw these plays and went "ooh, let's make all the villains misunderstood, even the ones who are original and thus don't have a reputation to be given a new perspective on"
I thought it would be clever if a Disney movie was written so then it can be interpreted that the main character is the real bad guy of the story. Subtly, of course, a realization that should only come years after its release. Well Wish got to it first, and ironically they weren't being ironic with it. This is what modern Disney wants you to believe and cheer for.
It's even funnier since Disney did make a "good girl Cruella" movie just a few years ago. It was one thing with the Maleficent films since those took the Twisted/Wicked approach by reinterpreting the Sleeping Beauty story. Meanwhile, Cruella is just some sappy origin story that doesn't even try to address the fact that at some point in her future, Cruella is fricking going to kidnap a bunch of puppies and try to murder them for a goddamn coat. Disney just does shit because "isn't that interesting?" with no follow through on their "logic"
A friend of mine described the movie as 'a morality fable written by a psychopath' and I think thats pretty accurate. It has the SHAPE of a fairy tale for kids, but once you look at it with any kind of awareness or critical lens all you can see if an extremely petty and narcissistic message of "me me me, give me everything I want right now" without any hint of irony.
Its a movie that might actually be dangerous for children to watch, because little kids won't understand whats wrong with the movie and might take its message to heart in the way that kids internalize things without thinking about them.
They wanted Rosas to be a kingdom that on the surface looks like a utopia, but delving deeper yields a darker and must more dystopian society. However, they aren't smart enough to write such a concept, so we get this weaksauce shit.
If you wanted to make things dystopian, a very simple change would be this: Magnifico COULD grant wishes every day, and outright reject the wishes that don't pass muster. Instead, he trickles out wishes slowly and keeps it ambiguous will will get their magic reward when.
Why? Because hope is a prison. People who get their wishes from Magnifico are thankful, but often leave the kingdom because they got what they came there for. But people still waiting on their wish will stay FOREVER, and do everything they can every day to make him happy in the hopes of him showing favor to their wish at the next ceremony.
The wishes are still 'good', but, the way he doles them out then becomes all about control.
That would be a pretty good twist and make him actually a smart and effective villain, one that might even delude himself into thinking he really is the good guy he pretends to be. He's helping people, after all! Granting miracles! He could do more, of course, but lets not be greedy now...
Hell, you could have it that since wishes clearly run on a magical kind of power, that fulfilling them creates negative energy that can get out of hand if too many run of the mill wishes are done. Things like people wanting to blessed with children, mastering instruments, running a business; things that can be done through hard work should be left to those who can put in the work. But fulfilling more unique, fantastical wishes like the giant chicken guy or someone wanting to have the power of flight could be achieved if the person shows they're pure enough to not misuse their fulfilled, which could even set up some nice set pieces later. Like, someone wishes for flight, but it's limited to a set amount of time, so they use the last few minutes of their flight time to help save the heroes before the magic dissipates. As things are, it feels like the entire movie could be avoided if Magnifico and Asha just talked things out instead of acting like perpetually online morons who deliberately get heated after a minute of conversation
The entire film could have been avoided if Magnifico laid out clear ground rules for wishes he'd consider granting. They'd fit on an index card with enough room left over for a little doodle.
Not really, Asha would act the same.
The people who make this kind of thing believe societies rules are arbitrary and inscrutable.
This is what Disney mothers thought.
I wouldn't show it to my children solely because it's a crap movie. The messaging is just corn in the diarrhea.
>a morality fable written by a psychopath
On the fricking money, it’s fricked because this shit is becoming more and more common where protagonists have really shitty desires and morals but are portrayed as good and the antagonists never really do anything fricked up or have a very good reason for doing it but is portrayed as bad. It’s almost like the people writing have skewed to down right fricked up senses of morality and right and wrong.
It doesn't help that only ONE character really shows to be impacted by the loss of their wish, while everyone else is A-OK, so it makes the motivation to get the grandad's wish seem like it's been done entirely on a whim rather than something like "oh, he's going to die soon, just let him enjoy a few days as a master fiddler before his time comes" or whatever
>they could to make a story where the hero’s have shitty and petulant motivations
half the MC's motivation in ALL disney movies are shitty and petulant
wanting more than you deserve is the BASIS of female oriented media.
Guys, guys, what if. What if actually. What if actually Queen was actual bad guy all along? Hiding protective oil, getting Magnifico to talk to people right when people would be rallied against him, thus ensuring, that he would be forced to use book and be posessed, and this:
>The Queen finds the staff afterward, the King trapped within desperately begging her to free him
>She smugly tells the guards to put it in the dungeon
What if actually it was a prequel to some villainess story making full Darth Sidious upon Magnifico and everybody else? Maybe she looks like one of actual classic villainesses? Maybe we were wrong all that time, and guys behind the movie has actually pulled "Chancellor Valorum removal" rather than moronic story with shady morals?
Isn't there a theory that Magnifico becomes the magic mirror from Snow White and that the queen is either a younger Grimhilde or her ancestor? Could have sworn I heard something like that.
It's a 'theory' in as much as Disney made intentional allusions to it, yes. Manifico is the magic mirror. The MC is the fairy godmother from Cinderella. The wishing star is the one from dumbo. And so on.
Because, remember, Wish is supposed to be a celebration of the past 100 years of disney. Its full of self congratulating shit like that.
>The MC is the fairy godmother from Cinderella.
>goes from kind of cute brown girl to fat white grandma
Damn, Disney is pretty ballsy
the funny answer is that Asha is racist towards her own skin color and made herself white at some point
a plot reasonable answer is that Asha appears as whatever the person she helps thinks a fairy godmother would look like
the actual answer is that she is not the fairy godmother and it was just a moronic misplaced and super forced reference like the peter pan or zootopia shit.
It does feel like Disney wanted to have their "hey, look at these nods" like Brave and how that had a bunch of shit that supposedly tied to other Pixar films, but at least was kept as just something in the periphery of the audience and not shoving it in their face like what Wish tried to do
>Disney pulls a complete mindbender and reveals the Queen is a time travelling future version of Asha who has been repeatedly reverting the timeline in order to usurp Magnifico by making her past versions more powerful/successful
At least the baker was safe.
>book is able to corrupt minds
>you can avoid the corruption with a bit of some random shit
>Obsidian oil.
How does she still has skin in her hands?
A book. homie read a damn book and lost his shit
Y'know, if Amaya was actually a good person, she would have insisted that she could save him and gone through hell and high water to get Magnifico uncorrupted. That would actually be a romantic Disney story about never giving up. Instead Amaya is a petty b***h that relishes in her husband's suffering and joins the mob mentality. Like, she chose him as her partner but not for life. Before Magnifico's magic corruption, he was never abusive and she admired him.
Exactly. And even when he turned evil, his "evil deeds" were pretty fricking boiler plate compared to most Disney villains, many of whom had at least one confirmed kill (some having multiples), and even the ones who didn't have any kills were definitely fricking trying to get at least one before their own death or downfall
The real kicker is that un-corrupting Magnifico should have required the MC to master wish magic (curing him is supposedly impossible, but what is a wish for if not the impossible?) restoring him to his benevolent self but also giving him good cause to re-evaluate her and consider her an equal as opposed to a threat.
Good. Fricking. God.
This would have been brilliant. You wouldn't even have to change the story at all if this were the conclusion. Magnifico makes an oopsico, then gets saved with the very power he had grown to be uncertain of. He gets to be the villain, but then redeemed and learns a decent lesson. Sure, it would be nice to explore what the frick is going on with that book too, but like I said, if you just made this one change, it fixes so much without having to change too much.
This is the baffling thing about the movie. You can change almost any part of the story and make it better. There are a hundred, a THOUSAND, things that they could have done instead that all would have been significant or major improvements. Pretty much any person in this thread, given about an hour and access to the script, could have fixed this movie with a rewrite.
Which just makes the fact that the movie exists in its current form all the more bizarre. It means that either it was written and rewritten by committee so many times that no one had a clear idea of what the movie actually had become by the end, or that someone in a decision making position actively thought that this was what a good movie looked like and pushed it in this direction on purpose.
Best part of the whole mess is how Disney published a book months BEFORE releasing the movie with all the good ideas they decided not to use.
What's different in the book?
EVERYTHING.
Oh yea the artbook stuff, I thought it was something like the picture book version, since I recall the Wreck-it Ralph sequel had its book drop ahead of the movie, but that didn't seem to deviate much from the shitshow we got in theaters
Ah, my favorite Disney character, Wreierw Rauar.
>the character evolved, but her design did not"
But she's clearly darker in the art and super light in the film. Or this yet another case of the film's seemingly endless conga line of bullshit?
Good old fashioned disney implicit racism. Go back and watch Aladdin with the uncomfortable knowledge that despite everyone in the cast being from the same place all of the 'good' characters are lighter skinned and all of the 'bad' characters are darker.
She got lighter skin in the movie because she was no longer a villain. Simple as.
Jafar wasn't that much darker than Al, a bit tanner, but only so much. Though yea, it is definitely hilarious that they would make a character whiter only after making her "good", especially in this era where Disney constantly tries to make their characters the "first x character to be y" and thinking they can coast on just the hype from that crap alone
At least they kept her an everyday girl turned activist. And that's a good thing.
Activists are just the worst. All they do is b***h but never offer any solutions. They're obnoxious and loud and they don't amount to anything.
Just what happens in the movie
Honestly makes me curious to see if anybody has tallied up all the plot holes and whatnot where things could be fixed, then compared them to other works with massive, gaping plot holes. I'm serious about seeing if Wish just might have achieved some kind of record for most confusing mess of a film ever.
I hope we see whistleblowers for this movie soon. Someone who wouldn't justify anything in it and goes out saying "this shit was moronic from the start"
Tell you one thing it doesn't make a good case for all those writers who were striking if this is the kind of garbage they want to role out while demanding things.
>More writers in the writers room
Yeah get fricked
>that someone in a decision making position actively thought that this was what a good movie looked like and pushed it in this direction on purpose.
Yeah and that someone is Jennifer Lee.
>only to grant someone else's wish instead
Literal super Hitler + Satan
>literal schizo rant
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.Wish2023&page=14
Been going through the history page for the wish ymmv, not surprised by the damage control
Man, I remember when that place could actually be fun to read through. Finding little bits of trivia, some actually well-thought out analysis of characters or story themes. Now, it seems like they gave up on keeping fully opinionated stuff to the forum side of things and just letting everyone voice their bullshit on most pages but the main article. Seems especially true of the YMMV pages, but even character profile pages seem to have shit like "this trope will apply because I hate the character, grrr!"
what does he get out of it though?
People who adore him, but I guess it's bad because he has a penis and men bad or some shit like that
but people would adore him even more if he were to grant everyones wish immediately. Hoarding wishes gives him no benefits whatsoever unless he was speaking the truth about protecting the kingdom and the people in it
Maybe not, but it wasn't hurting anybody either. Aside from ONE character seemingly being afflicted after having their wish taken, it didn't seem to be negatively affecting anybody. Plus, his policy was pretty fair, you hit 18, you give up your wish if you have one. It's one of the reasons people bash the film so much because there were so many ways to make Magnifico a bastard, and yet it seems like they forgot that a villain has to be villainous. Beyond tapping into forbidden magics, he didn't really do anything particularly evil. Not even eating the mother's wish, since she didn't die or have her life threatened by its destruction
> Plus, his policy was pretty fair, you hit 18, you give up your wish if you have one.
It's even worse than that, in the intro song she sings "They GET TO give away their wish" meaning it's voluntary, not mandatory
>Not even eating the mother's wish, since she didn't die or have her life threatened by its destruction
I noticed that as well. For that one short moment she felt a bit of pain, but after that she was completely fine
Seriously, it really does feel like they kept changing things until even the villain's motivation was as "safe" as possible, then forgot that they literally wrote him to be defeated because that's generally how things happen in Disney movies. It'd be like the Witch of the Wastes from Howl's Moving Castle got laughed by Sophie and then killed even though she saw that the witch was no longer a threat after her powers were taken by Suliman. Granted, Miyazaki villains rarely died since there's only like two characters he ever wrote to get death treatments, but even those did monstrously terrible things that made them deserving of their deaths. And one could argue some others should have died, but clearly learned a lesson (and hadn't quite done anything as bad as the two that did die)
>but people would adore him even more if he were to grant everyones wish immediately.
He used that gay little star as a "living battery" for magic, obviously there are some limitations on how fast the dude can cast magick spells. Maybe it's just like skyrim or any other fantasy game, he has to wait a specified amount of time for his magicka meter to refill before he can cast more spells. Or It follows DnD rules and he has to long sleep, but since they are obviously supposed to be Muslims it follows a stupid lunar calender of 28 days.
>double down and grant someone else's wish instead
It doesn't say that Asha tried to use her position to get her gramp's wish granted or the fact that Magnifico was going to grant it until he realized what the wish was and in his defense, "I wish to inspire" is a very vague wish.
That scene was weirdly well done. You can even see the lights dimming slightly with his mood when he realizes what she's trying to do.
>"I wish to inspire" is a very vague wish.
Its not just vague, its unearned.
Like, I get it. We all want shit. Sick people want to be healed, people wish to be able to fly, etc. But if you are a musician and you need a magic wish to inspire people? That means you are not a good musician. His wish isn't even be to better *at music* to inspire people, he just wants the effect of being a great musician without having the skill to back it up. At best, that just means that he's mind controlled a bunch of people into being inspired by shitty music, because he's not making the song better he's just forcing everyone else to lower their standards for his benefit.
That would be unfair as frick to all of the other musicians who are objectively better than he is but didn't seek a magic shortcut.
Its a bad wish.
Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution. Like, what? First of all, that would imply HE thinks his kingdom is oppressive, or at least has flaws that people could rise up against, when at worst, he's just not granting the wish of every Tom, Dick, and Stanley. Second, inspiration can be about anything. Maybe the songs will make people fall in love, discover ways to achieve their less impossible wishes, lead to new art. And since he controls the wishes, he could just make it so the granddad doesn't make music that inspires fricking rebellion, right?
>Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution. Like, what? First of all, that would imply HE thinks his kingdom is oppressive
no it doesn't. People can revolve against a just government too, because they are greed buttholes that don't know how running a nation works. All his reaction shows is that he wants to stay in power(of his own hand build kingdom), for good reasons.
>Second, inspiration can be about anything.
that is precisely the problem
>And since he controls the wishes
he doesn't, where did you get this headcanon from? For example, the guy who wanted to be knight. Magnifico first fulfilled his wish, THEN he used green evil magic to brainwash him into a dark knight. But the initial fulfilling of the wish was exactly what the fat guy wished for, not more nor less
He controls the wishes, so therefore it stands to reason he can set the limit on what the fulfillments are
If he could make fricking goddamn chicken giant and clearly have it stop at a certain point since giant chicken literally fricking any fricking size, he ought to be able to say "you can make flames, but would need a source to create bigger flames" or "you can fly, but will either have to live with wings you didn't have before, or just levitate around"
This movie has already been shown to have a nearly endless amount of holes in it, I fricking refuse to believe there's one singular consistent thing in it, especially if it's about the way wishes operate.
The story only makes sense if Magnifico can initiate the wish being fulfilled, but has little to no input on how. He is given a button he can press that says 'grant this wish' but its a black box process even to him. Years of experience have let him learn how wishes tend to get granted, but he can't shape or twist wishes to any appreciable degree.
>Its a bad wish.
exactly.
For some reason he can't grant his own wish, if he could, he would have already found Asha instead of asking the kingdom for help or using the book. It's a really terribly written story.
>Don't forget Magnifico jumps to the idea that the "inspiration" may lead to revolution.
His backstory explains it, it implies that his home was destroyed by an "attack". Could be bandits, could be a rebellion.
I never said anything granting his own wish, just making it that the granddad can't accidentally incite rebellion. Seems pretty reasonable with LITERAL MAGIC WISHES.
That really makes no sense when it's all MAGIC. That's just slapping a rule in for no sensible reason
...why on earth would you assume that magic doesn't have rules? Have you literally never read a fantasy novel or heard a fairy tale in your life? Magic *always* has rules. Sometimes they are vague and mystical rules, or other times they are long lists of fantastical logic and magic-as-science, but either way there are rules.
Why does Cinderella's outfit and carriage turn back at midnight? Why does a kiss wake Snow White? Why does Gandalf not take the ring to mordor himself? Why does silver kill werewolves, but wooden stakes kill vampires?
All this shit has rules, anon.
There's a difference between rules that operate on some kind of give/take system, and then saying "it doesn't work that way because... meeeeeh?", that's fricking moronic and you know it
>That really makes no sense when it's all MAGIC
magic doesn't mean no rules and anything goes, there are rules, the writers just haven't told us any of them(because they were too moronic to come up with some that wouldn't contradicts everything in the movie)
>He controls the wishes
he doesn't, again, where does this headcanon come from? All he can is store wishes, grant them, make people forget about them, and later on crush them to gain in powerlevel, NOTHING in the movie suggest he can do more than that.
>that the granddad can't accidentally incite rebellion. Seems pretty reasonable with LITERAL MAGIC WISHES
From what we've seen, he can only grant wishes as is.
Then surely he could restore the memory of the wish and arrange rules with what is granted. Someone wants godly might? Make sure they know they'll either lose it if they hurt innocent people or it's "as printed on the tin" super strength and not a bunch of other powers because "this aint a comic book"
That assumes that all wishes are 'fixable' even if he has control over how they are granted.
Consider what is going to be a very common situation: there is a hot girl in town, and like 5 different guys all make some variation of a wish to make her fall in love with them. There are always going to be some people more desired than others, so this general situation is inevitable and wishing for love is going to be pretty common. You have two problems here: the first being that none of the people making the wishes are going to want to share her, so trying to grant them all would be a disaster.
The second, of course, being that the woman in question probably doesn't want ANY of the guys wishing for her, and would strongly object to having all choice in the matter taken away from her just because they decided they wanted her. Why should her entire life be stolen from her this way, hows that fair?
There is no rules-lawyering a wish like that. The only reasonable option is not to granted it at all. Because its a bad wish for multiple reasons.
Well sure, when there's a wish with no easy solution, it's the kind to get shucked off to the "don't fulfill" list, or have its power fed into the city or whatever the frick. The fact remains that many wishes feel like they could be solved with attaching some kind of failsafe so they can't be abused. Or, if there must be some kind of "balance" for this shit, have it that frivolous/selfish wishes perhaps create negative energy, think the dark dragon arc from Dragon Ball GT. I recall some fixes to the movie having people go with something like that, where Magnifico needs to make sure the wishes don't disrupt the balance of the world, hence he can't make just any man or woman royalty, or else nobody would have anywhere to live because everyone's a monarch with lands to control.
Greedy thieves
Ugh, just look at this evil irredeemable monster. If a rat told me to betray him, I would inmediately join the coup against him.
was this made by the same dude who kept defending this movie on this and several other boards?
>on this and several other boards?
Got any funny screencaps to share? I love seeing the ramblings of these schizos who have to play white knights for movies
have you looked in the hazbin hotel threads? There's dudes white knight posting for the series antagonist schizo posting 50 posts a thread, some of them are clearly motivated by religious reasons because the antagonist is Adam, as in the first man from the bible. Other are sexualizing the dude. So you have gays and Christians both cheerleading for the same guy, schizo posting in threads together, this board is nuts.
Maybe he was good if everyone agrees.
>Others are sexualizing the dude
Sounds like business as usual for this shithole website
>Got any funny screencaps to share? I love seeing the ramblings of these schizos who have to play white knights for movies
no, no screencaps i'm afraid. you can probably see his replies by looking up magnifico and stuff in the /tg/ archives though. that was the board where i noticed a guy who kept insisting that the portrayal of magnifico as a villain was sensible with a similar style of writing to another guy here who had the same opinion.
Both.
Pic related
That was exactly why he was right
Sad that they're giving this a live-action series.
This was gay as frick, I hate you homosexuals for making me read it
I think it's kino as hell so far. The ending is gay?
The final wish is emptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspace for love emptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspaceemptyspace.
So I thought it was pretty lame
The wish is a bit more nuanced than that It's basically wishing people "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" but a bit more sappy and trying to hide that it's a very Christian concept . In theory it should mean the next round of wishing is less apocalyptic and you'd only have to be concerned about crazy people.
>overpopulation is le real and we should let everyone kill eachother
Yes
They are so detached from reality that they removed the love interest that the heroine was supposed to have because rescuing someone would show that their heroine is weak
Is that true? What's the source on that? I saw lots of merch with that little star guy and just thought they changed it to make it more marketable.
The book released before the movie shows they had so many ideas for the characters like: Evil but loving power couple, shapeshifter twinkerbell or goats without stupid pajamas.
So of course they though it was best to go with a five pointed star, horrible couple dinamics and the annoying pet companion. I hope Disney burns.
They were gonna frick it up either way. Starboy was gonna be nonbinary, so pretending we would have gotten some masterpiece is just delusional.
Star is inspired by the bouncing ball, one of the first bits of animation an animator makes while learning the craft.
That's really cool.
being the ''villain'' was something bad already but for me its his fate, literaly what the frick where they thinking?
something something "he's corrupted and can't be left to run loose" even though he acts more like a dickhead than someone going evil tyrant
The complete opposite. The writers were all spoiled manchildren who never grew out of their childish and selfish mentality.
huh? the guy is just a self serving dictator that erases people's memory and keeps them dependent on him so they can never put the work in. he doesn't even bother giving the wishes back. it'd make sense if he held evil wishes but he keeps the most lukewarm ones as well. he only ever starts opposing the protagonist when his position of power is threatened
do you guys not see subtext?
granted it's a shit movie that couldn't stick to the lane properly but this was apparent since the first clip, come on
What subtext? The guy is asked if he could fulfill a few wishes, and he leaps to the conclusion that music will inspire an uprising based on nothing since he has no idea what kind of music people would even make. And given he's already providing so much for the people, they have little need to put in anything since they aren't at war with anybody and many of their services are easily sustained without having to constantly expand borders, fight over land, or engage in deals with questionable allies. It'd be one thing if the power were slowly corrupting him, but that's obviously not the case since it's not until he uses the "evil" magic and basically gets possessed
he was originally more of a thief who stole an actual wishing star to start off the conflict but it just kept changing
>People don't know what they truly want
Frick you, I want my neet amazon goth girlfriend that is clingy and needy!
one 97y old amazon girlfriend and clingy to life and needy of constant medical attention because of her massive frame coming right up
You stupid fricking b***h, did you even watch the movie or are you just being intentionally disingenuous?
Sure you replied to the right post there, chief?
He was keeping people's wishes, making it so they couldn't fulfill them themselves. The idea is that if you keep your dream, you're likely to fail if you try to achieve it. By keeping the wishes with him, he frees them from their desire to try and go get killed in the process.
>i wish my wife was still alive
Either my wish gets granted and I get the love of my life back, or it doesn't and I magically move on from her death because him taking the wish made me forget about the fact that I love my wife so much that I no longer desire her to be alive.
It's like a win-win situation.
It's more like your dream is achievable, it just requires a deadly quest across a volcano. So if you keep it, you might try to achieve it and die in the process.
I don't even have to check, I know it was written by a woman or a Black person, or probably both
We almost had genderbent Stardust by Neil Gaiman (author of Coraline)
I can only assume that he takes taxes.
That's redundant
>We could have had Disney Gomez and Morticia
Oh what could have been:
?si=7L9FF9lxW37cFwa6
Disney's strength was romantic scenarios like Princes waking princes from cursed eternal sleep and fighting dragons to get to their lovers
>minor spelling mistake
ridicule.
Yeah, yeah, but the point is, they seem to forget that people like couples. Loving, heterosexual relationships
PURE SEXO, you mean.
NOOOOOOO
I don't understand what position that's supposed to be. I can see Magnifico's pecs and I think those are his arms, but what's up with the other guy? Is that his legs? His arms? Where is he coming from, what direction is he facing? What hole is he fricking?
Is the full Nelson, think of a reverse cowgirl, but Magnifico is leaning back, and his legs are behind his head, being held by the other man's arms.
Look in rule34xxx, this pic and a full Nelson anal tag are there.
What's wrong anon? You know you can fap to our King drilling your boy hole.
forgot image
It appears only homosexuals enjoyed this movie.
Why didn't Magnifico wish that his citizens had better wishes worth granting? Everybody wins.
Because that in of it self is a vague wish and he is not a hypocrite.
The limits of Magnifico's power are incredibly vague.
Everything would make so much more sense if he was crushing the all the shit wishes to fuel the select few wishes that he was granting. It'd be a better reason to paint him as a villain at least.
who's got that webm pinpointing the moment when his heart rips in half?
>"I granted 14 wishes last year. Come on, that's a high percent!"
Yeah, it is. I would even go as far as to say too generous.
I'm reminded of that critic who said Magnifico's "villain" song was practically an anthem for overworked moms.
Never thought of it that way, but it makes sense. It's definitely not what Disney intended though.
funnily enough, they have a song for overworking moms in phineas and ferb, and it does sound kinda similar to magnificos
>We're leaving our work, we're closing our laptops
>And responding to the cry
>We gotta make sure the baby's fed,
>And more importantly they're dry
>We're professional nose wipers
>And know every brand of diapers
>But you have to pay the piper
>Don't you ever call us gripers
>Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
>We are the Moms and we can't resist the calling
>We are the Moms and we hear a baby bawling
>We are the Moms and everything you've heard is all quite true
>'Cause moms will always come through
the same kind of vibe of "I do everything for you, and you keep on asking for more, I will still do it, but It's time for people to acknowledge how nice we are"
Question: was it revealed which was Asha's mother wish?
Nope. Those idiots could've had the mom wishing for the dad to heal from whatever illness he had and Magnifico not even noticing the wish due to his orb hoarding problem. THEN Asha would've been seen as right, trying to make the king realize that keeping all those dumb floating balls was only hiding the wishes worth granting.
But they didn't even bother animating the mom's orb, such a lazy horrible movie...
Really is astonishing that they miss so many chances to make the guy wrong, it's like they had some kind of aversion to making him do anything remotely awful, yet still laid out a ton of chances for him to take
He has the entire nation of Japan on his side
I can't help it if executives love my face
It's genetics! Yeah, I bought these genes from outer space!
Peep the name, I'm Bob Iger
I put the "I" in "tiger"
I'm passionate, I'm not petulant!
Writers should praise me for my benevolence!
I'd force my workers to do more Frozen
If that's what the market's chosen
I'd be the first one to volunteer Majors
If your career were to crumble
Or if you were in trouble
I let you work for me
And I only charge you a little rent
I make you clean up my messes
And my agent's always there when you need to vent
I give and give and give and give
You'd think they'd all be content
And all I really want is just a little respect
And this is the thanks I get?
This is the thanks I get?
"You're so brilliant"
Ah, that's the least you could say
There's more, admit it
"You're creative, bold and totally not overpaid!"
Thanks. See this company? I saved it myself.
And you still complain? have a nice day!
Mm, are you sure that you're not the prob?
I'd love to see AI take your job, oh-ho!
I didn't cancel four projects last year
Come on, that's a high percent!
And now you're questioning your leader?
The disrespect I just underwent
You know I always got your back
Yeah, really though, it's no sweat
From the day our contract was born and the day that we met
And this is the thanks I get?
This is the thanks I get?
I didn't wanna do this
I swore I'd never do this
But I'm hypnotized by how these movies flop
'Cause I refuse to have my influence drop
AI, tax-write-offs, more live-action remake crap?
Anything to get our money back
To these tactics, I don't wanna be tethered, but
Desperate times call for desperate measures
Reviews for the new film aren't going well
And still I remain unbent
Come out reviewers, explain yourself
I'm sure it's all just an accident
Well, whoever pays them off first
Now, that's a promotion well spent
Honestly, keeping me safe should be worth every cent
And this is the thanks I get?
Oh, this is the thanks I get
Is there a way to charge rent that still let’s people live there for free?
You can't OWN property, man!
The songs sucked.
This movie was fricking abysmal and I can't imagine a single line of serious discourse about it
I mean, like there's groundwork for what COULD make Magnifico a villain. The problem is that it almost feels like they didn't want to make him outright "bad" while still having him clearly be bad, so his actions feel like there's no logic or flow. It's like Disney realized "well, people are bored to death with twist villains, but we don't want to just have someone be evil for the sake of evil, that's boring!"
Really, this was probably the perfect timing for
>The twist is there is no villain, just two people who want what's best for the kingdom, but disagree about how to go about it.
With it ending with them learning from each other, how maybe it's ok to be more lenient about what wishes you're granting, but also that you can't just up and grant everyone's wishes because some wishes legitimately are dangerous with some being just outright contradictory(like if two people wish for the love of the same woman, or one guy wishes for a woman's love but she's already married).
With better writing you can also toss in an aesop about how some wishes you need to work towards yourself instead of just waiting for someone else to come in and just hand it to you.
The movie was supposed to be a pro-communist message but it was so poorly written that everything just fell flat. Even the songs were bad.
>socialism
It should've been something like
>everyone has one wish for what they want in life
>He promises people that he will make their wishes come true if they live and work in his kingdom
>In reality he steals any chance of their wish from coming to fruition, making them dependent on him
>people have basic necessaties provided in exchange for working, but have otherwise unfulfilled lives, living only on the hope that he grants their wish. They're essentially serfs
The moral being the importance of taking your life into your own hands and not buying into snake oil solutions
Shame it seems like a rather idyllic life. Till the "Protagonist" starts it on the path to ruin.
Which would be pretty fun to see, but god forbid a big budget movie do a story where the "protagonists" are actually the ones in the wrong because "something something something muh numbers something garbage suit talk"
The wish making King of Mexico?
>I let you live here for free AND I don't even charge you rent
Was this movie written by AI? Why the redundancy? Why are all the lyrics so weird and disconnected? Why are the rhythms and deliveries so off and there are barely any decent melodies?
>Frollo attempts genocide, rape, nearly drowns a baby and only relents because of fear of punishment from God, raises said child while constantly gaslighting and abusing him and forbidding him from ever having any actual human contact, and had his former captain tortured for not being able to live up to his expectations
>Magnifico is eviller because he... doesn't let people have what they want and also he gives them free housing and food
The bastard...
I know you probably didn't mean for it to sound like Frollo was intending all of that for Quasimodo, but I can't help but laugh at the thought of Frollo contemplating all of those heinous actions in the intro when he was only just thinking about killing baby Quasimodo because he was spooked by how ugly he was
Frollo was trying to rid Paris of g*psies, so any minor misdemeanor is forgiven as he's definitively working for the greater good.
Perfect traditional Disney movie for the 100 years hommage.
Really is weird how they make her act so callous when the man's literally her husband. It's no wonder people think the script was written by someone with schizophrenia when the characters are just all over the place
The guy literally just tried to magically enslave an entire kingdom, including herself. I'd call that grounds for a divorce.
yea, after being infected by dark magics that apparently are weak to fricking oil
Really, it would have been less bad if they had him still obviously evil and possessed, like claiming he'll make them pay when he gets out of there or something.
Or just not include that scene at all. Them doing less work would have been an improvement.
Yea, it's the way they barely acknowledge the possession. Like, the heroes KNOW, they even take precautions to avoid anybody else being corrupted, but then they treat Magnifico like he's entirely responsible for what he did. While you can make the argument that a person fricking with forces beyond their control should mean they bear some responsibility, it was still clear that this was a FORCE beyond the comprehension of the cast. And yet they barely bat an eye towards it to the point that if they had skipped the signs of possession, it wouldn't have made much difference since the end result would apparently be the same.
>Dude loses his cool slightly, hardly even raises his voice, doesn't even say anything cruel
>"I'm about to end this man's entire career" says the protagonist
gay
The more I lear nabout this movie the worse it gets.
Disney needs to crumble to dust under its won weight.
A lot of things are like that these days.
Once it starts to go it will all go fast.
I mean, they kind of already are. They were in such a rush to build up and acquire all of these services and IPs that now that they have them they have no idea what to do with them. The MCU used to be the most profitable thing on the market by a landslide and now even Disney themselves have no faith in it's ability to succeed, as evidenced by the cynical and extremely defensive decisions they are making in their treatment of stuff on their own platform. They paid 4 billion for Star Wars and then burnt the whole thing to the ground in record time because they were in such a rush to make more Star Wars that they never stopped to consider ANY of the details of what they were making, like not having any real plan for the sequel trilogy beyond 'make one' so it was an incoherent mess.
Disney has so much stuff on paper that should be printing money but they have lost sight of how to leverage any of it in a way that people actually want to watch. As a company they make most of their money from the parks, but the attractions at the parks are themed based on their media so the media side failing eventually feeds back into the performance of the parks. And stuff like Wish makes it clear that the rot has spread beyond just their alternative franchise fare, their core material is also weak.
Disney needs to figure out how to right the ship or they will get dragged down by it.
And you know what? The townsfolk WERE ungrateful fricks.
There is literally NO reason why he should grant anyone's wish besides some genuine kindess for his people. His job as king isn't make to people happy with their day to day lives, his job is to make them safe.
And come to think. we never actually saw any of the wishes he made besides Random 22s at the start and Whatshisface who betrayed them.
This movie really just bent itself backward to make him a villain for literally no reason
>Everyone wishes when they turn 18
>bunch of horny eighteen year olds making wishes -_-
>Immediately forget that they ever made the following wishes
>"I wish to frick __________"
>"I wish to lose my virginity"
So do they just forget that they are virgins? Does there sex drive disappear? Is this little country chock full of asexual?
>"I wish I had a bigger penis
>"I wish I had bigger boobs"
>"I wish I was the opposite sex"
>All these kids immediately forget that they made these wishes
The body positivity of this country would be off the charts, and there would be zero troony's. This dude made a utopia, absolute hero
He could even "wish away the gays" and immensely improve there and everyone else lives in the process.
Yes.
That never looked like the face of pure evil. He's at least close to doing the Dreamworks face but they didn't even do that right. If they wanted this guy to be a villain, or even just look like one, they really screwed it up.
I get the feeling he wants to hook up with Asha, because when you think about one of the songs it was definitely a love song involving Magnifico & Asha. Also, I suspect the Queen Amaya is secretly evil & wants all the wishes for herself
Is it just me, or does his castle look a little phallic?
I think a sequel can salvage this movie
I don't think Disney should waste the money. Just shove it into the shadows.