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Wait you still haven't figured out that Spider-Man are Spider-Woman are the Main Protagonists and not Peter?
Spider-Man isn't the protagonist, Miles is, Spider-Man is just a side character taking care of his daughter
Theyre all spiderman.
They're all versions of Spider-Man, Peter is Spider-Man
they're different kinds of spider-man, just like theres different kind of spiders
But only Peter is the real one
Parker is israeli
Doubtful. Parker is too poor to qualify nor does he practice.
>Actually thinks financial status determines if you're a israelite
You gotta stop watching recommended videos on youtube. Accept Peter for who he is.
Is being israeli an ethnicity or religion? There are blacks claiming to be the original israelites, but they are just a bunch of racist extremists with their head far up their own ass.
There are actually Ethiopian israelites, not the LARPers in the US
They are all the real on in their worlds. This isn’t clone saga where you have Peter Parker vs Ben Reilly where one if them is the clone.
I'll be honest I don't give a frick about the reality of the fictional worlds written by current writers, Paul is real in ASM right now and I don't really take it seriously or consider it a part of ASM
>What if Spiderman was a pregnant black woman
True, Peter Parker is the real one. The others are just off-brand diversity hires
Miles is spiderman, moron. So is Peter. So is Miguel. They are all spiderman.
Miles is A Spider-Man, Miguel is A Spider-Man, Peter is Spider-Man
They are all spiderman. Spiderman (!) is a mantle.
Spider-Man is a mantle is a retcon, and you're spelling it wrong
No, it isn’t a retcon. It was always a mantle. If Peter Parker died in the 70’s and someone else with those powers put on that costume and called themselves spiderman then THEY would be spiderman just as Rhoda WAS Iron Man when he took over for Tony way back in the day.
Also, who the frick cares how it’s spelled?
>Also, who the frick cares how it’s spelled?
Spider-Man does
That's a bad faith actor from Twitter and you're wasting you're time trying to be genuine
I ain’t from Twitter or acting in bad faith. I think it ks silly to throw a tissy-fit about the spelling of a name.
>It was always a mantle
>proceeds to say shit that never happened
If you told me 10 years ago I would go from loving spiderman to absolutely hating him I'd say you were insane. And yet here I am now, hating a superhero I adored so much in the past.
Congrats, you're in the same spot DC fans were in 5 years ago
Enjoy torching your collection out of spite
>If you told me 10 years ago I would go from loving spiderman to absolutely hating him I'd say you were insane.
You clearly weren't paying attention then cause Spiderman was turning into bullshit for a long while with glaring red signs all around.
White fragility, the post.
Black person
Black person
What are you talking about?
That was me after OMD. From where I'm sitting, Spider-Verse seems to be giving him the ending I was so pissed off about that event having taken away from him. The comics seem to have become a conveyer belt that provides kicks to his balls. For all of the faults I have had over the years with Sony's stewardship over the IP, I find this completely acceptable.
>here's your ending bro
>btw it only comes as a trojan horse for Bendis to take over Spider-Man royalties
Russia no longer controls Belgorod btw
Peter has 3 live action films in the making and animated TV shows, if they're trying to take him away they're doing a terrible job
Is there a new Spidey cartoon I don't know about?
Freshman Year
You want them to try a blitzkrieg approach instead of the boiling frog? Be honest are you arguing in bad faith
You have no argument so you retort to a fallacy.
I agree with your core sentiment and even I have to admit that's the most virgin thing you could have said
>seething at the truth being spoken
I have never heard any bad discussion about this movie other than this board
this is all in your head
Or, you just can't stand the fact others feel differently about this movie than the safe spaces you frequently occupy. It's not this board's fault you can't handle other's opinions. Toughen up.
It's not that I can't handle bad opinions, it's that the bad opinions this board has are absolutely moronic are simply aren't true with little to no evidence to back it up other than paranoid assumptions.
I don't know about you but it's almost a meme how people defending Miles never have anything to substantiate their claims on Cinemaphile, I have personally never seen someone successfully argue in his favor myself
I agree with a couple of the critiques levied onto miles that aren't just bad faith or borderline racist but people deadass arguing that Spiderverse was a failure or that it's accolades makes it unworthy of a sequel are borderline stupid.
People deadass would rather see spiderverse fail more as an attempt to spite mile's existance as a character rather than because they disliked the movie. And as a character, confined to movies at least he isn't even offensively bad.
>Spiderverse was a failure
I mean it did make less money than Chicken Little adjusted for inflation, and only slightly more than Bee Movie
>that it's accolades makes it unworthy of a sequel are borderline stupid.
Not everything needs a sequel regardless of accolades, people outside of Cinemaphile expressed concern when two sequels were announced and said they felt ITSV was best left standalone and that a sequel might ruin things, and from the looks of ATSV so far they might potentially be right
I mean sounds like fair criticism but the anon your responding too isn't wrong about what he said either
>I mean it did make less money than Chicken Little adjusted for inflation
Still dosen't make it a complete financial failure, especially considering the factors going against. One of those factors mainly being that its a Sony pictures animated movie which don't tend to make that much money and its lack of promotion. If Spider verse were made by Disney and got the numbers it did I would totally agree with you.
>Not everything needs a sequel regardless of accolades, people outside of Cinemaphile expressed concern when two sequels were announced and said they felt ITSV was best left standalone and that a sequel might ruin things
The reasons I've seen anons stipulate as to why spiderverse didn't deserve sequels was mainly because of miles and his "inability to carry a trilogy", whatever the frick that means, despite his presence in the first movie not being a prominent or even remotely existent factor as to why that movie didn't make a shit ton of money.
Still a very disappointing turnout for a Spider-Man feature, and it was heavily promoted:
https://deadline.com/2018/11/nike-ebay-mcdonalds-spider-man-into-the-spider-verse-marketing-campaign-1202511158/
>The reasons I've seen anons stipulate as to why spiderverse didn't deserve sequels was mainly because of miles and his "inability to carry a trilogy", whatever the frick that means
It means he doesn't really have any stories you could adapt for a sequel, and any story you might create for him you would first need to justify why him specifically and not Peter, kind of proven by the fact the writers already reached for the tired bag of multiverse and crossover tricks as the entire plot for ATSV, things comics have mocked decades ago as tired and played out
>It means he doesn't really have any stories you could adapt for a sequel
If we were talking about a standalone miles movie I'd probably agree with you, but that isn't the case. What ATSV is doing seems more like a natural progression from the concepts introduced in the first movie. Having the characters hop between universes rather than introducing a bunch of em into one universe. What I meant earlier about anon's saying that miles couldn't "carry a trilogy" is that most of em seemed to attribute the box office reception to spider verse as a fault of him specifically being in the protagonist role rather than all other factors and seeing him not being replaced by some other spider person as some sort of agenda being set up on the part of sony despite again, most public perception of his character confined to that movie not being too negative.
>they felt ITSV was best left standalone and that a sequel might ruin things, and from the looks of ATSV so far they might potentially be right
Why might they be right? The only bad omen i've seen as to the quality of this movie is a WW84 writer being attached. Other than that it dosen't seem too bad.
>Not everything needs a sequel
That’s for audiences to decide when the sequel comes out.
No it can be very apparent from the first movie itself
>true and correct arguments
>torture
it's over
All of these except completely unironically, what the frick were they thinking, this used to be a wholesome family IP
Shut up, people love Spider-Dad.
They'd love him even more if he was the protagonist and not a D-plot in a movie with a dozen A, B, and C plots
Congratulations. You clearly didn't pay attention to his arc in the first movie. He got his happy ending. There is an entire multiversal group of Spiders able to contend with the threat. He is not being irresponsible by not throwing himself into tackling a problem. He is choosing for his family. That is a different but but just as important responsibility. That is growth. That is an good thing. If you just want an action figure, go buy one, then spend the rest of your life having it do the exact same thing until you die, then get mad that it wont keep doing the exact same thing because you aren't there to make it.
>you got RYV now eat your Wells ASM slop
I ain't gonna
I don't care about out character nonsense like that or OMD
I'm surprised they're not going with Ghost Spider for Gwen
Normies already know Peter Parker is Spider-man and don't need to have that explained to them like they do with Miles. Meanwhile audiences love seeing the character they grew up with as a father.
but Marvel refuses to have Peter grow, leaving him as some bum trying to get by because they think that's what readers want to see, their favorite hero suffering all the time and never catching a break. Peter is better off killing himself in despair and having MIles be Marvel's punching for a while until editorial leaves or dies and they finally bring Peter back and happily maried but still a superhero.
I think it's a testament of how much people as a whole love Parker. No other character in media could stand almost 20 years of shit. To put it in prospective, the entire starwars universe almost died with the sequel.
>entire starwars universe almost died with the sequel.
No it didn't lmao
>didn't like the look of this movie and was gonna pass on it
>but mayday is in it
Damn, decisions decisions.
TLJ pretty much killed the sequel trilogy and all of Disney's hopes with it. The only Star Wars thing to do well since the trilogy is over was the Mandalorian, and it didn't take long for people to turn on that as well.
>Damn, decisions decisions.
She is Mayday in name only if that helps
Yeah probably but I'm just happy Marvel remembers Peter isn't just a fricking loser who keeps doing stupid shit while getting shit on by the universe.
>Peter isn't just a fricking loser who keeps doing stupid shit while getting shit on by the universe.
We're talking about a movie series in which Peter is a manchild loser who doesn't want to marry MJ because he's irresponsible and then when he does marry her and have a kid, he takes the kid on a mission to put her in danger because he's irresponsible
Star Wars is still extremely profitable and is anything but dead regardless of the quality of the sequel movies
>inb4 muh galactic starcruiser
Yeah turns out most people can't afford a $5000 per person/night cruise
>can't draw a dime with any of their toys
>galaxy's edge doesn't turn money like they expected
>diminishing returns on every release of film or show save, what, Mandalorian seasons 1 and 2?
Not saying they're going bankrupt by any means, but I am saying this is not the cash cow they were hoping for when it was bought
>can't draw a dime with any of their toys
Toys in general aren't very profitable anymore. Most kids want videogames
>galaxy's edge doesn't turn money like they expected
It's the most popular Disney attraction to the point that you need to set up appointments months in advance for some of their attractions
>diminishing returns on every release of film or show save, what, Mandalorian seasons 1 and 2?
Fair enough
anon, let’s do some basic math. The star wars reboot started in 2015 with TFA. TLJ came out in 2017, meaning the franchise has gone on longer post than it has pre-TLJ.
>entire starwars universe almost died with the sequel.
>No it didn't lmao
Original trilogy had his expanded universe and vg
Prequel had its own thing with clone wars and vg
Sequel has produced only stuff from the past(Mando, andor, obiwan), with less and less success
At this time SW is dead because it can't see to the future anymore. So they will milk old stuff till the bad taste is forgotten, to try again with a complete reboot.
The Prequels were fricking garbage
I was a gigantic star wars mark for most of my life until the sequel trilogy. Awakens was bad enough I saw the writing on the wall and TLJ made my childhood hero Luke look like a fricking moron geek that had a 180 to his character just so they could make him the grumpy wizard trope and then die. I have not bought a single think related to the franchise since, and am celebrating how much a money sink its been for Disney
The had stop making movies for 4 years and was relegated to TV.
It takes time to make movies.
It takes a year and a half to make a blockbuster look and Marvel and Pixar. They planned to release every year after TFA but Iger said to take a break after ROS. That doesn’t happen if a franchise is doing well.
Ok, episode 4 came out in 1977. Episode 5 came out in 1980. That’s about three years. Episode 6 came out in 1983. Hmm! Three years!
Episode 1 came out in 1999. Episode 2 came out in 2002. Episode 3… 2005. Hmmm! Must be a coincidence!
Akso, maybe they want to make sure they do these next FIVE MOVIES THAT WERE ANNOUNCED right. Just a thought.
>Ok, episode 4 came out in 1977. Episode 5 came out in 1980. That’s about three years. Episode 6 came out in 1983. Hmm! Three years!
>Episode 1 came out in 1999. Episode 2 came out in 2002. Episode 3… 2005. Hmmm! Must be a coincidence!
This is because George wanted Star Wars to be an event. Disney wanted a Star Wars movie every year until solo bombed and ROS underperformed. They’ve said this themselves. The Obi Wan movie was turned into a tv show for this very reason.
>Akso, maybe they want to make sure they do these next FIVE MOVIES THAT WERE ANNOUNCED right. Just a thought.
You know these are recently in development right? They don’t even have scripts and they plan to release them back to back like before so no, it’s not about “getting it right”. It’s because the franchise is dying.
>Solo bombed
>almost all the TV series are being cancelled
>Disney+ losing subscriptions en masse
what layers of cope are you on?
The fact that you only have solo to go on is funny onto of the fact that the subscriber thing is from India and the fact they got rid of cricket streaming. The only one coping is you
Anon, the sequels fumbled the ball, but last I checked, Star Wars is still a much more profitable franchise than Spider-Man, it wasn't going anywhere just because of the TLJ.
>Yeah turns out most people can't afford a $5000 per person/night cruise
What the frick were they thinking?
Yeah from what I have seen of current Spider-man it doesn't look like they are doing the best job with him. But this spiderverse thing is it's own movie series made by different people so I really don't see why people think these movies in particular are the deciding factor of Peter Parker's fate especially when Peter is still the face of spider-man in the MCU which is the biggest thing Marvel has.
>MIles be Marvel's punching
Kek. You know that ain't gonna happen. Miles is treated as a boy scout who doesn't say or do anything wrong. The entire marvel universe bends over for him and blows smoke up his ass.
BasedChina names Peter B. Parker as the TRUE SPIDER-MAN HIMSELF lmao
Interesting they covered up his face here as well
It looks way better that she's holding him by his mask, not his hair.
Who’s they and supposedly what are they taking away from me by making a spiderverse movie?
>Who’s they
White guilt writers malding the most popular superhero in the world is a white man
>and supposedly what are they taking away from me by making a spiderverse movie?
Good Spider-Man stories
Your acting like current spiderman stories are even good right now. Peter in this movie is better off than being cucked in his current comic book run and left penniless on the streets.
>Your acting like current spiderman stories are even good right now.
The adaptations used to be good before multiverse cancer came along.
>Peter in this movie is better off than being cucked in his current comic book run and left penniless on the streets.
Not really, he's still cucked in the movie and at least you're allowed to complain about the comics.
>cucked in the movie
dude has a kid with MJ.
something the writers have been attempting to circumvent for the past over a decade.
I still don't understand how his treatment in the movies is that bad, to me and most other people he's still their favorite character and the fact he has mayday now is a big pull for a lot of people.
>dude has a kid with MJ.
Just as a distraction from the fact they're rewriting Gwen to be Miles' character multiversally as the focus of the trilogy
>I still don't understand how his treatment in the movies is that bad
see
>Just as a distraction from the fact they're rewriting Gwen to be Miles' character multiversally as the focus of the trilogy
The dumbest fricking, lack of evidence assumption you could possibly make. People have wanted him to have a kid forever and him having one was an extension of the arc he had in the previous movie.
>see
We're talking about a movie series in which Peter is a manchild loser who doesn't want to marry MJ because he's irresponsible and then when he does marry her and have a kid, he takes the kid on a mission to put her in danger because he's irresponsible
this is a grievous simplification of his character in the movie.
>The dumbest fricking, lack of evidence assumption you could possibly make.
Amy Pascal literally came out and said the movie is a love story between Gwen and Miles.
>People have wanted him to have a kid forever and him having one was an extension of the arc he had in the previous movie.
Then make that the movie instead of a side feature? If I wanted the Spider-Family as a consolation prize instead of the main attraction I'd go read Renew Your Vows
>this is a grievous simplification of his character in the movie.
That's what happened, you can try to explain it or handwave it but there's no way around the fact they decided to have Peter come off as massively irresponsible in both when they had the freedom to write anything
>Amy Pascal literally came out and said the movie is a love story between Gwen and Miles.
Did you want the peter in this movie to be with an aged down alternate version of Gwen instead of MJ? While I personally don't agree with the ship I also don't really care, the last movie didn't establish whether or not peter b. parker had a gwen in his universe or not.
>Then make that the movie instead of a side feature? If I wanted the Spider-Family as a consolation prize instead of the main attraction I'd go read Renew Your Vows
It's a multiverse spiderman movie starring multiple spider people not a 2D standalone peter parker spiderman movie. You can want that movie and we might get it in the future if things go well, but its dumb to chastise a movie for not giving you a premise you wanted when its simply trying to be something completely different from the literal 9 other peter parker spiderman movies we've gotten.
>That's what happened, you can try to explain it or handwave it but there's no way around the fact they decided to have Peter come off as massively irresponsible in both when they had the freedom to write anything
It literally didn't.
I personally don't get why it's so sacrilegious to have a peter parker learn responsibility instead of him just having it out the jump. Regardless, he was at least responsible enough to prevent miles from coming with the other spider people to stop kingpin for his own safety due to his inexperience. I don't know enough about ATSV to know how dangerous it was bringing his kid along but as far as we know it probably wasn't. Especially considering all that was happening was him chatting with miles and spiderman 2099 in most trailers and clips where she had Mayday with him.
Regardless, i love how your acting like spiderverse is the only piece of spiderman media that made him uncharacteristically irresponsible.
>Did you want the peter in this movie to be with an aged down alternate version of Gwen instead of MJ?
How about just omit showing a version of Peter's first love with another guy.
>the last movie didn't establish whether or not peter b. parker had a gwen in his universe or not.
And the sequel establishes he did.
>It's a multiverse spiderman movie starring multiple spider people not a 2D standalone peter parker spiderman movie.
You said we're getting Family-Man Peter, I said it's nothing worth celebrating since it's just a small part of a multiverse Spider-Man movie.
>its dumb to chastise a movie for not giving you a premise you wanted when its simply trying to be something completely different from the literal 9 other peter parker spiderman movies we've gotten.
Shame it's going in the "completely shit that misses the point of the IP" direction of "completely different" by adapting multiverse cancer instead of the "completely different" direction of finally letting Peter get older and have kids in a major movie as its focus.
>It literally didn't.
It literally did.
>I personally don't get why it's so sacrilegious to have a peter parker learn responsibility instead of him just having it out the jump.
Makes sense for a 15 year old Peter who's yet to lose Ben, it makes zero sense for a middle aged Peter who's been Spider-Man for decades.
>ATSV to know how dangerous it was bringing his kid along but as far as we know it probably wasn't.
The first movie establishes the multiverse is deadly for periods of time longer than a day, they have some sort of device in the sequel that stabilizes them but it's still a huge risk, you wouldn't take your infant kid deep diving because you have an atmospheric suit.
>Regardless, i love how your acting like spiderverse is the only piece of spiderman media that made him uncharacteristically irresponsible.
It's certainly the one where people ignore it happened the most and instead claim the opposite.
I want comic Peter Parker in a panel on the side of his bed with his head in his hands figuring out that he's 40 and wondering to himself why is his life such shit. I want it to be a big panel with a lot of empty space with him in despair at the middle with a small speech bubble going "what is wrong with my life"88kn0
that's brilliant
What are the odds that Peter's kids are born as mutants.
It is so bad that they take the worst things from live action, the heroes without masks lol
It doesn't matter. Miles still can't sell a book so who cares?
He literally has a ongoing right now but I assume you mean he isn't making as much as you think he should make to be worthy of his popularity in other media.
Must sell more then Kamala considering she has a show and a movie and she doesn't have an ongoing and got killed off in another book
I know someone's gonna point out that Ms.Marvel had the lowest viewer numbers on premire so I also want to point out the Ms.Marvel was also competing with Obi-wan
They're both getting an artificial push not based on anything but the creators personal politics
Both creators have had nothing to do with the character for a while now
>money sink
Disney has had nothing but profit since buying Starwars
>Both creators have had nothing to do with the character for a while now
Are you implying the people pushing Miles and Kamala don't share the same politics as the people who made them
Miles sells more than Hulk, Thor, Fantastic Four, Ghost Rider, and Daredevil
Not that it matters. Miles could be Marvel's #1 selling book and you'd just find another excuse anyway.. Fake numbers, or maybe Disney is buying all the books and sticking them in a landfill in Arizona that you have blurry drone footage of. Just like you homosexuals did when Black Panther made a billion.
>you're Spider-Man? pfft we all are
Actual line from the movie
thats a wierd ass line. especially since this isnt the council of spiders but actual multiversal spider people. a spider woman whos been spider womaning for a while wouldnt just call herself spider man unless theres other spider men, majority male in her universe
That's a israelite
Is it supposed to be a Rule of Threes joke?
>Here we have Spider-Man, Siper Woman, and Mayday's Dad.
>making Peter the joke in his own franchise
I'm not laughing
No, there's a ton of posters, you can see it's an Instagram story with lots of images and those are just three of them
Didn't we just have this bait thread the other day?
>Didn't we just have this bait thread the other day?
NPCs are real
They did this because losers were chimping over Miles being called Spiderman because they're smelly racists whose asscheeks are infused to their molding couches. So blame these ugly, mentally deficient, good-for-nothing, mouth-breathing, lard-gurgling, waste of humanity for being so pathetic that even corporations know they're an easy dunking target.
You sound upset
They're allowed to take it from me, Peter is mid. Miles outsold
>whine about how the media never shows white families and is committing """"""white genocide""""" by not emphasizing the value of families that are white and straight
>a movie has a straight white classic hero being a dad
>shriek about how he's being ruined because he's depicted more as a family man than a masked vigilante
Then why didn't they make the movie about Spider-Dad
Maybe because they wanted to a multiverse hopping spiderman movie with a different spider protag who wasn't peter.
It was mostly a creative decision
No they explicitly said they wanted it to be about Miles, and that the multiverse is there to justify his existence. I want family man Pete, but not at the expense of letting Bendis' (P)OC take the wheel.
I still don't get how its a bad thing.
Of course they'd want a concept added on to hook people into the movie about a different spider protag. If this was just another spiderman movie with peter but animated it probably would've just made less money, especially since it would have to compete with the already preexisting MCU movies
>Of course they'd want a concept added on to hook people into the movie about a different spider protag.
Why would you make a movie about a character who needs the whole multiverse mythos of characters to carry him to make him appealing, Venom alone hooked people in his movie.
>If this was just another spiderman movie with peter but animated it probably would've just made less money, especially since it would have to compete with the already preexisting MCU movies
This is a baseless assumption when Spider-Man media makes bank even when it's terrible like TASM, the Gunn Batman will have to compete with Reeves' Batman but neither will be changed into Duke to compensate because Duke is just "Batman but black" like Miles is "Spider-Man but black".
>Venom alone hooked people in his movie.
That's because venom is already a well known Spiderman character who had already appeared in a live action Spiderman movie as opposed to miles and Gwen, who hadn't become mainstream till spider verse. The concept of a Venom movie where he's the anti hero protagonist was enough to pull people into the movie. Same couldn't be said with mfing morbius, a character no one knows about by comparison.
>If this was just another spiderman movie with peter but animated it probably would've just made less money, especially since it would have to compete with the already preexisting MCU movies
This is a baseless assumption when Spider-Man media makes bank even when it's terrible like TASM
It's not a baseless assumption, it's just speculation about a movie that probably wouldn't be made. Lets say a 3D animated spiderman movie starring peter were made instead of spiderverse. It would have to compete with the already pre-existing live action spiderman movie series that is already making billions. Regardless of that Marvel being Marvel would most likely not invest in it unless they somehow KNEW it would make a lot of money.
Hell they hardly believed spider verse would be successful which is why that movie got barely any official promotion so why would they make ANOTHER spiderman reboot just done in 3D when they're already meat riding holland?
Regardless of any of this, this just seems like cope because you dislike the concept of miles being the protag instead of peter for the 4th time more than Spider verses mere existence.
>as opposed to miles and Gwen, who hadn't become mainstream till spider verse.
Literally the entire reason Spider-Gwen exists is because Emma Stone as Gwen in TASM 1 and 2 was huge and her chemistry with Andrew was the highlight of the series, which is what resulted in reviving interest in Gwen in comics.
>Same couldn't be said with mfing morbius, a character no one knows about by comparison.
Yeah maybe they should've let Morbius use the whole multiverse mythos to prop him so his movie could make money, or maybe they should have not made the movie at all if that's what's necessary to make him "work".
>it's just speculation about a movie that probably wouldn't be made.
And I'm speculating the opposite.
>It would have to compete with the already pre-existing live action spiderman movie series
And Gunn's Batman is competing with Reeves' Batman and they're making both anyway. If Joker 2 has a Batman and it makes money, they'll make another spinoff for him, these movies are not competing.
>Marvel would most likely not invest in it unless they somehow KNEW it would make a lot of money.
They KNEW Miles wouldn't make a lot of money, they made the movie anyway, it didn't make a lot of money, they ordered two sequels anyway.
>Hell they hardly believed spider verse would be successful which is why that movie got barely any official promotion so why would they make ANOTHER spiderman reboot just done in 3D when they're already meat riding holland?
Wow I wrote the above point without reading this far and you've made my point for me, why would they make ANOTHER young Spider-Man movie when they could've focused an animated trilogy on Spider-Dad and his kids, which would be radically different compared to any previous Spider-Man movie.
>this just seems like cope because you dislike the concept of miles being the protag instead of peter
Miles is just Peter but black, feels disingenuous to treat them as meaningfully different for narrative purposes.
>Yeah maybe they should've let Morbius use the whole multiverse mythos to prop him so his movie could make money, or maybe they should have not made the movie at all if that's what's necessary to make him "work".
Or maybe the movie should've just been good. Coincidingly with the fact he is an unknown character, the movie bombed is the fact that the movie was review bombed to hell and no one wanted to see it unless it was for the memes.
Even with a gaggle of unknown spiderpeople, spiderverse still made a decent amount for an animated movie at the box office.
>And I'm speculating the opposite.
whats your evidence for the opposite?
>And Gunn's Batman is competing with Reeves' Batman and they're making both anyway.
That's because they're both live action batman movies which are already known for making bank. And this is ignoring the fact that again, they're both live action. A 3D animated Spiderman movie will of course be cannibalized by a live action one, regardless of quality because live action films unfortunately tend to make more money. Mask of the Phantasm, a 2D animated batman movie, absolutely bombed at the box office compared to batman returns, a live action batman movie that came out only a year before.
>They KNEW Miles wouldn't make a lot of money, they made the movie anyway, it didn't make a lot of money, they ordered two sequels anyway.
You keep saying "Miles" like he was the reason the movies didn't make billions or something. They made the movie because it was relatively cheap to make and it still made a decent amount of money, more than most other Sony animated movies, and it got a lot of media attention and praise which is why they greenlighted sequels. It definitely worked out since ATSV is projected to make triple the opening box office revenue in comparison to ITSV.
>Miles is just Peter but black
In the comics sure, the movie does more to differentiate him and that seems to be the general consensus
>In the comics sure,
Not even then. The fact that Miles is a legacy automatically differnetiates them.
One of the earliest Spider-man stories is him trying to join the Fantastic Four and getting rebuffed because Peter is a solo act doing everything by himself and learning the ropes by himself. Miles is the opposite of that.
Peter being a solo act was because no one took him seriously he had a set up lifr of praticing amatuer crime fighting.
Not really, Peter was a solo act because he was untrusting and stand off-ish. Which are two things Miles definitely isn't.
That’s because miles isn’t allowed to have flaws and therefore has nothing to grow out of.
And ATSV seems to be quadrupling on this flaw of his, by making it so every other Spider-Man hates him for his virtuous morality and trying to do things without sacrifices and so that he's the only one that doesn't have to lose parents or fail in saving Gwen from falling.
>One of the earliest Spider-man stories is him trying to join the Fantastic Four and getting rebuffed because Peter is a solo act doing everything by himself and learning the ropes by himself. Miles is the opposite of that.
So he ISNT just a reskin of peter?
That's just something people here say in order to complain about Miles existing at all. When the underlying reason is what it is, the excuses given don't need to be particularly consistent.
>Miles existing at all.
That's the thing, in 616 he justs exists and is in stasis until marvel can replace peter with him and inherit every thing while peter takes a backseat doing nothing of note. In spiderverse, it was great that he became a spider-man of his world and grew into it. Now you have the spiderverse being a crutch for the films while doing nothing for him solo but introduce more Spider-Man and having miles be different from every one else because of course.
>spiderverse still made a decent amount for an animated movie at the box office.
It's the #77 animated movie by box office not adjusted for inflation, if you did it'd be even lower and surpassed by stuff like Shark Tale and Chicken Little like someone in the thread mentioned
>whats your evidence for the opposite?
I have as much as you have for your original claim
>And this is ignoring the fact that again, they're both live action. A 3D animated Spiderman movie will of course be cannibalized by a live action one
There's really no basis for the claim a live action movie would cannibalize an animated one but that two live action ones aren't competing, if anything it's the opposite since they should attract different demographics
>Mask of the Phantasm, a 2D animated batman movie
That was more of a production/promotion/release shitshow fault than anything, I don't know of any other direct-to-video animated movie made in 8 months for $6M and then repurposed for theaters only to play daytime screenings so it's an extreme outlier
>You keep saying "Miles" like he was the reason the movies didn't make billions or something.
Well we know multiverse movies can make a lot of money, and Spider-Man movies, and animated movies, Miles is the only odd factor out we could point to as the culprit for now
>They made the movie because it was relatively cheap to make and it still made a decent amount of money
A Peter movie would've been just as cheap and probably made a lot more money
>more than most other Sony animated movies, and it got a lot of media attention and praise which is why they greenlighted sequels.
It gave about the same ROI as the others compared to the budget, and got outgrossed by every Hotel Transylvania despite that being an original IP and not a gargantuan established one
>It definitely worked out since ATSV is projected to make triple the opening box office revenue in comparison to ITSV.
Just double actually
>In the comics sure, the movie does more to differentiate him and that seems to be the general consensus
Not really, Miles is still black Peter without the compelling stuff in the movie but Peter is older and jaded compared to his usual self so Miles appears different
>Because why would they just have him be a dad out the jump without him earning it?
You can make it a movie arc, a trilogy arc, or just skip right into the family business if you want to because people already know this stuff, it's how superhero movies stopped showing origin stories for characters who've already had movies that explain those
>If they wanted Spider Dad in a Spiderman trilogy they'd probably inevitably do it with Holland now that its confirmed he's doing 3 more movies
Holland is the Spider-Man for zoomers, it's been three movies and he's just now going to college, and he's looked exactly the same the whole time, I don't think anyone would buy him as a father
>Also I don't know how peter being a dad would be enough to be "radically different to any previous spiderman movie", that just seems like a natural progression for his character that most of the movies haven't had enough time to explore
But we've never seen it explored in anything but comics either way, it's why the upcoming Gunn Batman has Damien, as a fresh take on Batman without resorting to having Bruce give up the cape
>Regardless if Miles or Pete were the protag of 3D animated movie they definitely still need a hook that wasn't just a retelling of another spider man story starring peter
I feel like family Spider-Man could've made a good kids' movie with little Mayday or Anna-May or Ben or all running around like little Spider-Men in the vein of Incredibles, or like an implied soft continuation of the TASM movies since Peter B already looks a lot like Garfield and people wanted him back, he could've even voiced him
Same guy from before btw
>Wow I wrote the above point without reading this far and you've made my point for me, why would they make ANOTHER young Spider-Man movie when they could've focused an animated trilogy on Spider-Dad and his kids, which would be radically different compared to any previous Spider-Man movie.
Because why would they just have him be a dad out the jump without him earning it? If they wanted Spider Dad in a Spiderman trilogy they'd probably inevitably do it with Holland now that its confirmed he's doing 3 more movies. Also I don't know how peter being a dad would be enough to be "radically different to any previous spiderman movie", that just seems like a natural progression for his character that most of the movies haven't had enough time to explore thanks to either being cancelled to early (Raimi/TASM peter) or having not reached that point yet (MCU peter).
Regardless if Miles or Pete were the protag of 3D animated movie they definitely still need a hook that wasn't just a retelling of another spider man story starring peter, or a completely non-mainstream spider person to pull audiences away from the MCU shit.
Miles is a good fit for this movie because the theme of it is that he doesn’t want his story to go like every other spider-man’s. Idk if that’s present in the comics or not but it’s interesting here and it wouldn’t work with Peter considering a good 70%+ of the multiverse is different Peter Parkers
Not really present in the comics since Miles and his whole deal is that he admired 616 Peter to have himself fricking Isekai'd so he could learn how to spider specifically from him.
He has shown to get annoyed that some people like him just based on the fact he is black, he just wants to be Spider-Man.
>Miles is a good fit for this movie because the theme of it is that he doesn’t want his story to go like every other spider-man’s.
What is he doing differently than Spider-Man
>Idk if that’s present in the comics or not but it’s interesting here and it wouldn’t work with Peter considering a good 70%+ of the multiverse is different Peter Parkers
And yet in the movie with two dozen main characters who are all different Spider-People, they chose to have only one Peter
I'm sick of coming into threads and seeing reddithomosexuals like you disingenuously posting.
>Miles sells more than Hulk, Thor, Fantastic Four, Ghost Rider, and Daredevil
The character getting pushed sells more than a bunch of characters nobody cares about?
Because he was the mentor character in the first movie and is a supporting character in this one? Are we really going to pretend there's a lack of movies about Peter?
>Because he was the mentor character in the first movie and is a supporting character in this one?
So? He's the main character of the IP, if a Spider-Family story is what you want to tell, it makes sense to have Peter as the main character for it.
>Are we really going to pretend there's a lack of movies about Peter?
There are certainly none about him being a family man, meanwhile there are 9 Spider-Man movies about a young Spider-Man, and we're supposed to tolerate 2 more because his skin under his costume has more melanin now?
In a culture war you are always the victim
hope everyone complaining about the lack of animated Peter content recently shows up for Freshman Year next year
Too zoggy for me
Who is the goth?
Nico Minoru
>Nico is now in a Spidey thing.
Is this aimed for kids? A blood witch with an fricked family history is not who you'd think gets picked for a Spidey cast.
Do we have a full list of peeps?
Stop pearl clutching
No even intending to but come on, using Nico is a bit odd because she is a bloodwitch. Not somebody you'd think to find as support in Spider-Man.
Why the frick did they give Peter Gankee and call him Ned?
>Spider-Man has THE most iconic supporting cast in comics
>All of the new adaptions refuse to use them
What is wrong with them? It's not even like they're being race swapped they are completely different characters
Since when was Spider-Man in the Venture Bros.?
Since forever
They will to complain that there's a black person in it.
>A black person
Why so disingenuous anon, you're not just here to bad faith shitpost are you
Hey at least him having waves would make more sense.
I haven't seen the VA casting for him but i'm already assuming they're getting the gus fring dude to voice him.
>only black people can have waves
Oh so then every black character being civilized should be whitewahed because only white people can be civilized, because that's not racist at all
Oh. Several black people. That's even worse!
Oh so you are just bad faith shitposting, carry on
What is the "Good faith" way to argue that a character being black in a cartoon matters or diminishes anything in any way?
What is the "Good faith" way to argue that a character being white in a cartoon matters or diminishes anything in any way?
An appeal to tradition maybe? Or something intrinsically white in his background like how Bruce Wayne is from an old money new england family?
Great because with its Romita artstyle Freshman Year appeals to tradition and Peter's background as a 60s New York comic book character where his cast was all white except for one black guy, so it makes no sense to make the cartoon all black and asian except one white guy.
It also makes no sense for a New York college campus to be 99% white, even back in the 60s.
It doesn't have to be, make it racially accurate for the 60s or even the 2020s for all I care, but keep Peter's supporting cast the same race they always were, don't make Peter the literal only white guy in the story, don't raceswap long established characters
Well the bigger issue with Freshman Year is that every single one of the supporting cast has been replaced with a diversity hire. It’s literally unrecognisable. The only character that looks even close to being from the actual side cast is Norman and he was race swapped too.
I don't like MCU Peter
aw tom holland is alright. He's better than andrew garfield, and while I won't say he's an upgrade from toby, i'd say he's comparable. But the movies could have used him better. His trilogy is good, but kind of forgettable.
Tom Holland isn't the problem, it's everything around him that sucks. I find MCU spider-man defenders seem to see spider-man as just a character in a vacuum rather than a comic book that has actually stories in it. If you change everything about Peter Parkers relationships and storylines I don't really consider him Peter Parker anymore.
I can’t stand how he’s written, or how that homosexual Stark is apart of his origin story now, and especially how Uncle Ben basically doesn’t exist.
This is why you don't create teenage superheroes. If adult ones aren't allowed to grow old, how are they going to let Peter grow up?
I wonder if you guys ever stop to think that you're representing white people when you do this.
>peter is only allowed to have a family if he gives up the spider-man name to gay morales
scummy bastards
I just don't like that Spider-Man's gone from being a friendly neighborhood hero to a fricking friendly multiverse team of identical Spider-Men who all have their own unique powers that make Peter look redundant.
This one page has aged finer than any wine.
Fricking kek, it's perfect.
But I do.like the totemic spider.god.sruff, love me some esoterica.
Spider-Man is the worlds most popular hero, he was always gonna be expanded in being more fantastical and over the top. No matter how his adventures are low in scale, he was always gonns be like Batman, a hero who becomes the hero who represents the reader and lives vicariously in his own fiction be it in a realistic way.
They turned him into the Green Lantern Corps
>Remember what they're trying to take from you
You mean nothing, because there's still 99% more Peter Parker media out there, than his imitators?
>Superman has sex with his wife
>this is destroying his legacy
>Spiderman has a child with his wife
>this, too, is destroying his legacy
I wonder if the Teen Titans movie, if it came today, would have been received with screeching about racemixing because Starfire and Robin kiss
Starfire is white coded
wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
you guys aren't actually serious about all this culture war, ((them)) stuff are you? You don't actually believe there's some kind of evil plot to... do whatever it is? You don't actually think some shadowy group (that is somehow always the israelites) is trying to manipulate media to destroy white people or something, do you? This is just internet posturing, right? Please god tell me this is ironic
okay maybe I might have a little bit of a thing for feet
>Spiderman has his mask on
>Spidergwen has her mask on
>Miles Morales doesn't
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>Is making shit up to be delusional
Smartest Miles hater
Peter's mask is off in the OP pic
Remember Cyborg Spider-Woman? She was everywhere in leaked toys and promo shit and then just disappeared one day, we haven't seen her anywhere for months despite dozens of minutes of footage
Remember when society asks you to check your friends correct their toxic masculinity, this is one of the warning signs: losing something that was never theirs (and is actually still really popular and widely available).
Are we not even pretending we're not Discord raiders anymore
If this ends up reversing OMD then I am all in. Crittical support for comrade Kilometros.
Thank God, they turned Spider-Man back into a kid. The whole mid-life crisis shit is stupid and boring. Spider-Man should always be a teenager.
I mean, I'll be the voice of reason and say that this is a Spiderman side-story where Peter gave up being Spiderman and Miles is his successor. Same as Terry becoming the new Batman after Bruce Wayne retires.
Stop being stupid. Nobody is trying to replace anything. It's just a side-story about one universe's Peter Parker essentially retiring.
Terry basically disappeared after Beyond, Miles has been enjoying a forced multimedia push for 6-7 years now with no signs of stopping
Terry disappearing is a mistake on DC's part. Marvel is keeping Miles though. It's just a difference on the way the characters were handled.
Also, people have to grow up. Peter Parker can't stay a kid forever. We've already seen the universe where Peter Parker lived a successful super hero life until he died (Miles' universe). The Peter of the other universe didn't become a great hero. By Marvel logic, there are also universes where Peter Parker never died and kept being the great Spider Man until he got old and retired.
>disappear the good original character
>keep the cheap recolor knockoff
Classic worst timeline shenanigans
They're not taking shit away. One thing that annoys me is how they're marketing these characters by their actual names and faces rather than their hero identities.
I don't see the big deal with this. Yeah, of course they would say Peter Parker in this instance. They already said Miles was spiderman and if they said "Spiderman is Maydays dad" it would sound dumb and repetitive. Everyone knows Peter is spiderman, no need to repeat that. Just be glad Mayday is in the movie at all and move on
>Just be glad
dumbest mentality but its expected from a moron like you
You know as much as these movies really want to push the meme that Miles is Spider-Man they seem almost allergic to him actually wearing the Spider-Man mask
That's the thing, he's an inherent paradox, they took a character who anyone could identify with because he always wore his mask and you could imagine yourself under it, said NO that's not relatable enough he needs to be BLACK, but now the new supposedly more relatable guy never wears his mask and is only relatable to black people according to the logic of the people who made the movie. There's literally no way to not make Miles come off as bad faith pandering for some ulterior motive.
Why are spidergays so immensely fatherless?
Why are you using twitter and discord insults on Cinemaphile
I'm going to see this movie and there's nothing you can do about it.
It's going to make a ton of money and everyone will be happy, while you sit at home seething in rage.
You sound upset
I am not sure if it's done to make Miles more relatable somehow. Or if it's done out of some sense to mimic Peter since he often struggled for various reasons.
But it really bothers me how they had Miles come from not just any background but a rather successful and well off background. Attending not just any school but a good school.
And then in spite of all that they regularly have Miles ghetto it up and being into ghetto shit and a lot of its assorted culture.
And that just leaves me thinking that Miles as a character was nothing but a mistake to begin with. Even without/before taking Peter and the idea of Spider-Man into account.
The way I often see Miles used, both in comics and in adapted works. It just feels like Miles should have had a different origin that would have been more in-line with how he is actually used or with how he actually acts.
You can't be black and well to do, you pretty much have to be wannabe ghetto twits even if you're fairly middle class and have a moralist cop as a dad.
It's less of a Miles thing and more about mandated youth culture shit that ironically comes from a board of predominantly white people that think this is what kids want.
>You can't be black and well to do, you pretty much have to be wannabe ghetto twits even if you're fairly middle class and have a moralist cop as a dad.
It really sucks though. It makes the very idea of Miles as a character a conceptual failure.
Not really a failure on his part but so long as the writers refuse to party ways with a stereotype of being black it will never allow him to grow.
It's a stereotype that never made sense for Miles though. And even if they rewrite the character moving forward, it won't somehow erase the history of him having been written like that prior.
Quite the effort would be required to course correct the character now. To the point at which I really wonder why one would even bother.
It was kind of a mistake to make Miles to begin with. The way he was anyway.
Might just be best to make an entirely new character altogether.
I mean, they are too scared to have a black character be from the hood.
Look at the Luke Cage show. That's an actual character from the hood, and they turned him into some cornball hotep from rural Georgia.
Well yeah, you can't condone gang violence or hardcore drug usage. Or any of the other shit that comes for hoodrat living that people just fricking assume you're part of and approve of because you're a hoodrat.
Peter b***h Parker
>Peter gets to be married with a kid
homie I've wanted that for years and they're giving it to me. I'm still not gonna watch the movie though since I dislike Miles and Gwen.
frick Black folk and frick israelites tbqh
I remember a What If issue that basically said that only Peter could be Spider-Man, and that other characters like Flash or Betty would either die early, or quit.
I CLAPPED
WAZUUH DANJUH
NAHH IMMA DO MAH OWN THANG
YA CUZ UHHHH SHIET MAN IM DA REEL SPIDUH homie SHUT YA ASS UP AN GIMME DAT THANG I WANT CUZ IM OWED IT N SHIET IMMA BE DA FURST N ONLY SPIDUH NIGGUH TO NOT HAV A SAD ENDIN N GET WHAT I AM OWEDD THATS REPARATIUNZ FOH YA SLAVEN ASS BEETCH DAS RITE
as a Hispanic i do so love to see how predictable and pathetic and coddled this one group of people are very sad but i suppose the powers that be must keep the racial discord going so we dont have a class uprising OH WELL
Miles is half Hispanic though.
but he doesnt have the soul of one he has the soul of a thug look im not sorry when i say i dont find the whole whole hoodrat shit annoying allot of people have fricked up lives or come from rough backgrounds doesnt mean you have to ghettoblast your entire life pick up a fricking book or something just stop talking about money b***hes and guns for five fricking minutes
>he has the soul of a thug
Ah yes, because spic's know nothing about that life.
Anyway, how's the that whole "Entire country has become taken over by drug lords" situation going?
Peter is labeled as Mayday's dad because his identity as a father is more important to him now than his identity as Spider-Man
If you were a father, you'd understand.
And that was done only so they could take away Peter's name and give it to Miles, if you had critical thinking you'd understand
>And that was done only so they could take away Peter's name and give it to Miles
so?
So why should I care about a bad faith gesture that only exists as a bait and switch? Would you care about a compliment a female thief told you only to distract you?
Dads are bigger heroes than jerks in spandex
I've been thinking about it and there are a ton of characters that even the woke crowd you guys so hate agree should stay white, but I think the problem is that all those characters, like Batman or Bond or Tarzan, where being old money stuffy white privileged guys is a core part of their backstory. But those are n admission that whites are privileged don't fit your worldview.
Spider-man is on the other hand, is just an average guy from the city hit by random happenstance. Anyone can have a murdered father figure. Anyone can be bitten by a bug. All his stuff can really be anyone. Which is why it hurts you guys so much more to see Gwen, or Silk, and especially to see Miles; because once you remove the barrier of privilege you've got so much more competition.
Except I don't hate any of them, I hate their execution.
Cindy is a direct product of Slott's yellow fever and I dislike that she was made just to frick Peter and then vanish. Especially after she got such a good costume.
I dislike that Spider-Gwen is overwriting Gwen Stacy as a concept and somebody vital to Peter as a character, but otherwise she's just kinda around and doesn't do much. Still has a neat design.
Miles is toothless and it's baffling they haven really managed to do much with him despite how hard he gets pushed. He's Peter but black and they really don't do much to make him unique and his stories boil down to venom blast the problem away.
Don't even get me started on the fricking sword.
They're fine, I just wish they were used more effectively and given better stories, or that we just use the spiders that were already around like Anara or Maddie.
>He's Peter but black
And with living parents that know his secret identity. And in a world where teen superheroes are common as opposed to essentially being the first. And a legacy with mentors as opposed to having to learn everything by himself. And comfortably middle class instead of a broke couch surfer. And relatively bad at science and more into the arts...but yeah other than ALL that they're basically the same.
>And with living parents that know his secret identity.
May has known Peter's identity before and acts essentially and narratively as his mother, and living parents make Miles less relatable
>And in a world where teen superheroes are common as opposed to essentially being the first.
Also done with Peter before
>And a legacy with mentors as opposed to having to learn everything by himself.
Rarely even done with Miles and Peter's successors should be his own kids, it's not compelling when Miles gets everything handed to him anyway
>And comfortably middle class instead of a broke couch surfer.
So a LESS compelling and relatable Spider-Man?
>And relatively bad at science and more into the arts...
Peter needs science to create his gadgets and explain his interests (like the one that led him to the radioactive spider) and to tie into his villains' science theme, Miles gets all his gadgets for free, the spider goes to him, he just gets his villains from Peter etc, the art thing is more of a quirk of flavor than narratively meaningful
>but yeah other than ALL that they're basically the same.
Yeah people usually say "Peter but black and without the interesting stuff" as demonstrated by your list of things that make him different to Peter
>and living parents make Miles less relatable
Not that guy but exactly how does a kid having living parents make him less relatable?
Rather since May is knocking around, Pete's mother figure is also still around.
Again explain how Pete being constantly broke as a nearly thirty year old is in any way relatable, guy should have some shit figured out by now.
Relatability does not a hero make, Miles is dull and redundant but Pete being Marvel's punching bag doesn't make him relatable or compelling, it just keeps grinding him down.
Thinking like this is mental illness, Twitter has warped your mind, characters should be the races they are, new characters shouldn't be made if their only purpose is to represent races, those are called tokens
Sup?
You too?
spiderman is for third worlders and cuckolds now.
>Nico Minoru is a supporting character in the new Spidey cartoon.
Okay but why? Are they pushing the Runaways again?
>Cute little joke about Parker being a dad now in an insta story
>OP gets so triggered over this he has to make a thread here talking about "what 'they' are trying to take from you"
This place literally became reverse tumblr in 2016
>joke
where is the funny then? and of course your disingenuous ass would not mention the fact that even the first movie pushed th moronic shit of "anyone can be spidey"
Always gotta love how easy people fall for outrage marketing
always gotta love morons like you that acts as if he never fell for stupid marketing, probably the biggest morons out there
Never said that LMAO
you would have included yourself if that were the case
its the easiest kind and people like the chode who replied to you will defend it because theyre embarrassed
>Spider-Man has to be marketed on outrage and that's a good thing!
Peter retired after Mayday was born.
Miles is the Spider-Man of his universe.
frick you.
>Peter retired
irresponsable as frick and therefore out of character
>miles is the spider-man of his universe
no, peter is still spider-man even in that universe and even after he died