>Simon is now selfish and evil for making Betty turn into a demon in order to keep him safe from the crown
MUTOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>Simon is now selfish and evil for making Betty turn into a demon in order to keep him safe from the crown
>Simon is now selfish and evil for making Betty turn into a demon in order to keep him safe from the crown
MUTOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
So the show wants me to believe that this couple is toxic but Bubbline isn’t? The writers should just be honest and say that they prefer gay couples.
This is stupid beyond proportion
The show makes it clear that he was flawed but ultimately she didn't regret it, and they parted ways peacefully
This
You underestimate how much people here hate women.
They're like a hive mind at this point. ATgays will defend ANYTHING about their show.
But they parted ways peacefully and showed that both characters grew from their experience. If you're not trolling you sound like you just don't want to grow up and enjoy life. You'd rather intentionally look for what isn't there to be angry.
t. Muto
>The show makes it clear that he was flawed
yeah by introducing a never before brought up plot point that makes barelly sense or applies to the current dilema.
Never before? Betty was obsessed with Simon all throughout the series since she was introduced.
But when did we get this idea that Simon was oblivious and enabling it? In the episode where she's introduced, he begs her to move on and let him die
In Temple of Mars when we peer into Betty's memories, the way Betty looks back on it gives good enough leeway for this detail about Simon not realizing being added later for it to make sense.
>Simon not realizing
the guy that took care of marceline even when the crown was making him insane, sure thing, let's introduce a flaw that was never there and say he was such a selfish butthole.
It was perfectly plausible given the circumstances. Originally she was a normal woman thrust into crazy world, so clinging to her only meaningful connection to the past was the only rational thing to do, and then she got struck by wizard crazy. Imolying that her becoming GOLB and Simon forced to live alone in an unfamiliar crazy world is somehow a natural consequence of their own choices is just weird.
Now that you mention it is.
It was outright said too. People just want to be mad.
The intended message from Betty to Simon, and the intended takeaway for the viewer, is one of self-care. The idea os that Betty sacrificed too much and it destroyed her, and Simon should consider his own happiness before sacrificing his sanity by putting on the crown.
That's the INTENDED message.
Unfortunately it's conveyed in maybe the worst way possible.
Just within the context of the book and vision the message is in seeing Betty as our perspective character - but Betty's not our perspective, Simon is. If you focus on Simon's behavior rather than Betty's the message becomes "You didn't sacrifice enough, you were careless." That's not intended, but it's how most people will interpret it.
Beyond that we've been spending 8 episodes saying that Fionna's whole world was unwillingly altered when Simon lost the crown's power and that putting on the crown means restoring her world and saving it from cataclysm. This makes a message about self-care here seem callous and incohesive, further contributing to it bouncing off people's brains.
This conflict could have been interesting with different stakes, but it's pretty cut and dry that it's good to not doom an entire universe of people. This bad moral dilemma is then resolved by a literal deus ex machina.
Interesting post anonymous, unfortunately, I want Golbussy.
Honestly, it gives impression that Betty regrets her decision to sacrifice herself for Simon on some level, and projects that dissatisfaction onto him.
Well it's a good thing she said the exact opposite of that for stupid people like you.
People can absolutely say one thing while feeling another. Or even have conflicted feelings on the subject.
Fair but at the same time she was absolutely speaking from the heart now that Simon was finally there with her. I don't think someone blended into an all powerful entity would say anything that wasn't how she was feeling.
And that's something that a 2nd Season or another potential spin off should explore.
>2nd Season
Anon... I don't think there's going to be a second season
I think that would be great to fully delve into.
It's not saying that Simon didn't sacrifice enough for Betty, rather that he didn't notice Betty was sacrificing everything for him. This isn't that Simon was bad or anything, but had he noticed the lengths Betty would go for him, he may have sometimes been able to reign her in so she wouldn't become an obsessed magic woman who summoned Golb to save him.
They both were flawed and made mistakes but they should let go and stop killing themselves over the other.
What did she sacrifice though? Fame? Career? It doesn't seem like that she ever wanted any of that over "THE Simon Petrikow".
The sanity? That was her own hubris ("You forgot your floaties").
Becoming a GOLB? Considering that it was that or becoming NOTHING, I wouldn't say it was a terrible option.
It does feel like they invented that problem out of nowhere
She's not regretting it. She's just saying that she was so eager to be with Simon and do things for him that she missed out on something completely different and that can't be changed.
All she had to communicate that idea with was a shitty CYOA book.
>She's just saying that she was so eager to be with Simon and do things for him that she missed out on something completely different
Which makes it look like she is second guessing her choices.
I am not crazy! I know she swapped Golb's mind. I knew it was Betty. A mortal infecting an immortal. As if I could ever make such a mistake. Never. Never! I just - I just couldn't prove it. She covered her tracks, she got the Ice Wizard at Ooo to give her the crown's wish. You think this is something? You think this is bad? This? This chicanery? She's done worse. That portal! Are you telling me that a woman just happens to jump into one like that? No! *She* orchestrated it! Betty! She survived the mushroom bomb! And I spared her boyfriend! And I shouldn't have. I became Golb's scholar! What was I *thinking*? She'll never change. She'll *never* change! Ever since there was nothing, *always* the same! Couldn't keep her hands out of the magic artifacts! "But not our Betty! Couldn't be precious *Betty*!" Stealing the plotlines! And *SHE* gets to be Golb? What a sick joke! I should've stopped her when I had the chance! And you, you *have* to stop her! You -
I meant to reply to the post below you, sorry. It took me a bit to type all that up so I'm not deleting it though, I'll just live with the SHAME.
Te problem was Simon's, he was the one depressed about Betty's sacrificed and obsessed with contacting Golb instead of keep moving.
>It does feel like they invented that problem out of nowhere
Yes, he did, to make himself feel guilty and even more out of place. All of that journey was for him to come to terms with what happen.
if that's the message, then why Betty didn't move on when Simon was Ice King?
Because she has an unhealthy behavior that was fee on for years. Is called a tragic character flaw.
I'm aware
The issue is the way it tried to say that
It wound up saying something else instead because the writer was incompetent
I think you got exactly the opposite intended message.
They made very clear that simon was thinking too much NOT about others, and that his obsession with suicide comes from the same place that made betty develop cosmic vegana, ignoring others well being.
Like yelling "I DID NOT ASKED FOR THE RESPOBSABILITY" and having to come up with a way to save Fionna at the moment (except he got lucky and didn't had to put in any effort). In short, Simon was being selfish for being deppresed about things not being his way and should've paid therapy and take his meds, or something along those lines.
>toxic
this isn't what they meant at all. the lesson was that love isn't the same thing for everyone and that may cause an imbalance in a relationship.
one person may choose to sacrifice personal goals out of love, and that's okay. it's their choice.
it was Simon's guilt wracked conscience who tried to push the idea that it wasn't okay and it was something to atone for. Simon shouldn't be looked to for relationship advice, he's a wreck who lost his fiancee to an impossible fantasy scenario and it broke him.
I still fricking hate this show
>s4s troony meme
Opinion discarded
>So the show wants me to believe that this couple is toxic but Bubbline isn’t? The writers should just be honest and say that they prefer gay couples.
In addition to the other replies to your misunderstanding the point is that relationships despite not always being equal can still be good for the person that seems to have sacrificed for it. Most relationships can never be equal because someone is always more invested and someone is always taking something for granted. Just do your best and treat your partner well, you're likely not going to have to become an eldritch creature as a gesture of love anyway.
>prefer gay couples
This is what Hollywood is now. Where have you been? To say that straight people are in any way good is verboeten.
Selfish, yes. Evil, no.
People can be flawed without being evil
>MUTOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Not surprised the most brainless Cinemaphile posters are the one's that leak their diarrhea opinions into this place
do you guys just try to find any little thing to twist out of proportion so you can get upset? do you not realize how unhealthy this type of living is not to mention miserable?
>inb4 political rant / dyke / troony
>do you not realize how unhealthy this type of living is not to mention miserable?
wheredoyouthinkweare.jpg
is-ought fallacy
something happening doesn't mean it should happen, and vice-versa
Seeing people baring their neurosis and psychological complexities in art is just not fun.
Anon, what do you think art is? Asking honestly
Creation of beauty, a manifestation of a certain aesthetic ideal.
And it's actually gives way more honest glimpse into artist's psyche, unlike this exhibitionist crap (the formet shows real "you", the latter what you think of yourself).
If your goal is to make a pretty picture to look at, sure. But art is also the human soul manifest into a physical medium of some kind, it's a means for the artist in question to express things they need to say. If it's about themselves and thier struggles as an individual being figuring out the chaotic minutiae of existence itself, what does it matter? Art is a personal experience, the fact you're there as an audience is an afterthought.
Beauty is not just about the visuals, you know? Well-crafted story just feels beatiful even if its components are bad (actually you could argue that original AT was horrendous from the visuals).
>Art is a personal experience, the fact you're there as an audience is an afterthought.
The problem is that shows like this _do_ care too much about what audience thinks. Instead of letting people see, it tries to impose a certain view on them (this is why I compared it to an act of exhibitionism earlier, it's all about the forcefulness of it).
To put it another way, your issues are _not_ you, or at least not the whole of you. By focusing our attention on them, you're actually obscuring the rest of the picture.
On the contrary, a glimpse into an artist's psychosis through their work is historically and socially a genuinely fascinating experience. The problem is that millennials are boring and pathetic even in their moments of deep craziness.
No, being awkward at flirting does not make you a Byronic protagonist.
>On the contrary, a glimpse into an artist's psychosis through their work is historically and socially a genuinely fascinating experience. The problem is that millennials are boring and pathetic even in their moments of deep craziness.
It's one thing if the artist has an interesting and creative take but all this modern shit is copy pasted from fricking mainstream news or opinion pieces since all the homosexuals that work on that shit and cartoons all live in the same area completely out of touch with everyone else in the world or even in their own country
>why are people discussing shit on a discussion board
If Western animation as a whole wasn't in the toilet because of israelites, gays, darkies, and their shitty projects that suck then maybe there would be some more positive discussion on this board. Cartoons and comics are a fricking dying medium because of the nepotism practiced by the above groups and only smaller creations like Wakfu, Ongezellig, and a couple webcomics like Blastwave are worth discussing. The last good mainstream original cartoon that came out was Over the Garden Wall and that was almost a decade ago. Even that had some moronic SJW undertones but they could be overlooked because the story wasn't complete trash and it was subtle.
>The last good mainstream original cartoon that came out was Over the Garden Wall and that was almost a decade ago.
Makes sense, the Westernized world in general peaked in 2014 and the atmosphere back then was vastly different to now.
>Westernized world in general peaked in 2014
No, that would be the late 90's. Decline was already in progress by 1913 but technology advancement slowed the effect until the late 90's when technology started stagnating hard
>the Westernized world in general peaked in 2014
You have to be 18 to post here
Kinda makes me glad that Regular Show still isn't getting some a spin-off like AT, that was the other big one from early '10s CN and they could milk it if they wanted to but with writers like this it's better for it to stay dead
I'm not happy unless I have something to complain about. I make deliberately impossible and unreasonable demands so I can complain when they aren't met. I don't even watch cartoons. I just spend all day complaining, or looking for things to complain about. Complaining is my life. Complaining is my purpose. Complaining is my reason to exist.
But you should still keep trying to satisfy me even though I have no intention of ever letting you succeed.
It's not my fault if you can't score while I'm moving the goalposts. Nothing bad can be my fault.
you're posting on the lost cause platform anon
They both have tunnel vision and act against the wishes of their partner. I don't know why this is the message that they were going with. Vampire world has shown that Simon should get the crown. I appreciate that there aren't shills or baiting morons pretending to be shills like with the Castlevania thread but this show still isn't awful yet. It just needs some work unlike Castlevania which sucked on execution and on paper.
Remainder than the only one blaming Simon was Simon, and all of that was so he would just stop and move on.
So what else are we going to do here?
He realized Betty always put him first and sacrificed. Him not realizing that she was always doing that and he needs to accept her fate and know putting on that crown negates the second chance of him living an actually life. He can't undo her fate or redo his past by becoming the ice king. Simon understands that he needs to let go and accept his reality/ so does Finonna since they were a reflection of him whom love and cherish what they already have and fight to keep it.
Maybe it's just my autism speaking but when that whole "choose your own adventure" scene was playing and The issue was one character sacrificing everything for another, I really thought it was about SIMON sacrificing everything. He lost his sanity to save the world, and he's been throwing his life away to get back to Betty. I thought the show was making the opposite point that it was.
I can’t blame you. I got the point they were trying to make, but it’s just something that doesn’t really seem to apply to Simon and Betty? Like the idea that Simon was oblivious to Betty’s sacrifices is something that is only brought up in “Jerry”, literally the third-to-last episode.
He did what he wanted, she did what he wanted, perhaps it wasn't the best path, but it was the path they took, so lamenting that at the end they faced an impossible hard choice is pointless.
I think the clue is in the first choice he makes, when he wants to go back and pick the other the book doesn't let him, because it's not like you can undo what you did. Eventually he goes with what he wanted to do, which of course means the other path stops existing, but that's how it works and it's pointless for him to be regretful about it (like he was at the start of the special, feeling depressed and guilty about the place his choices led him)
>He lost his sanity to save the world
Did he? I just thought he saved Marcy
The whole mini series was building up to Simon being needed as the Ice King for the sake of Ooo....and they didnt do anything interesting with it, they just preached to you Magic = Bad, Escapism = Bad
You're a moron
But... Fionna's world has magic and is part of the magic multiverse now? Simon just didn't needlessly sacrifice himself and ignore Betty's wishes in the end. Because their needless sacrifice loop was moronic.
Would anyone have care about Adventure Time if this is what it was like from the beggiing?
No, I don't so.
It grew with its audience so people that are working and feeling at odds with the choices they made in life but ultimately growing and accepting them enjoy it still. If it started from here the audience would be different but it would likely still get a huge one considering most fans aren't familiar with adventure time and it's hbos top performer whenever it releases somehow.
>but it would likely still get a huge one
How? People never came for the melodrama originally, they came for the adventures and fun interactions between the cast. It wouldn't be as big as it is now if the melodrama started first.
>bad relationship
>both parties in the wrong
>shows both parties being in the wrong
>shows both characters were good people that loved each other but their flaws weren't compatible
>despite that it influenced the world in positive and negative ways and things were a product of their choices and the world they had wasn't bad
>characters expressed how much they meant to each other and moved on
why does Muto HATE men???
I fricking hate you westerners so much, you Black folk would break up after years of relationship and going through hell and back together, just because two of you don't like the same type of cheese and say mean thing to each other sometimes.
You deserve to die alone and have your bloodline ended.
They didn't broke up, she died.
It's not above what happened in the show, it's about how it was written and why.
How it was written is in no way reflective of what you are complaining about.
I haven't done that, but I did take a break from a partner I was having issues with while we went to therapy. We're back together now for a few years after a few years apart and planning to have children. If we hadn't acknowledged we had those issues we would have had a shitty life together where we took out our problems on each other forever but we've been a more stable and healthy relationship now that we both feel secure in who we are as individuals. You're projecting your insecurities and inability to measure up onto two cartoon characters.
Based milk & honey of the human experience enjoyer
No man, what you just said is only a thing in your western world, your asses are so self-centered, you have to look at everything through some lens of your individuality. I can bet my fricking butthole that your "issues" were not real and both of you just have too much fricking ego and no ability to abstract yourself from the situation and look at it from aside and realize how fricking stupid and meaningless whatever you were fighting about was. When you get together you are not puzzle pieces trying to figure iutbif you fit in, you get together and you grow together, grow isn't even a right word, it's more like a change. The only thing that happened in that break of yours is you probably cried, thinking about her, wishing you were back together, while she rode dicks, and once she was done having fun, she came back to the stable thing she had with you. Both of you are still selfish and will jump the ship again the moment things get too hard, when that happens I hope you realise how fricking stupid this mentality you people have about relationship and love.
They cant go against ~~*their*~~ overlords, whatever they say is fact
I hate Satan so much. Jesus Christ is easy mode and no one picks him.
>Well every woman wants to be on sexville
I hate this stupid world. Truthfully, both men and women are twisting up sex relations and there’s so many male and female virgins around than you think.
Women only lie about being virgins because they know it matters to men. They don't count ass, mouth or regretful encounters as sex.
>your asses are so self-centered, you have to look at everything through some lens of your individuality.
Nailed it. I'm married, 16 year relationship, three children. It sounds corny, but love is truly a lifelong journey, not a destination. Passion is short lived. The real gold is in the bond that forms over time, even if it's not as flashy as sexual novelty and butterflies in the stomach. Most never realize that because the second the initial infatuation fades, people start looking for excuses to bail on each other. They've been close long enough by that point that they're starting to see the imperfections in their partner. They've been told that there's a perfect person out there for them and that any amount of sacrifice they have to make to preserve something special is a betrayal of the self. Women were damaged worst here because they're getting hit from two different angles: on one side, they're naturally picky maters and no longer have a culture that encourages lifelong romances, on the other they've been conditioned into disassociating from their natural preference toward homemaking and nurture. As a result of being torn up by the fricking roots they have a terminally nagging sense of "I need to go find myself" and will suck down all life has to offer before realizing that the missing piece isn't out there in the world, it's inside of them, everyone lied to them about it, and they're fricking drowning it to death with stupid bullshit. Relationships are fricked in the west.
You must realize that not everybody seeks the same style of love as you do. You described your love as a storge romance developing from a friendship. Others seek eros romance which occur in 10% of marriages in which the person they love shares the same chemistry and the passion never fades or ludic love in which a person seeks multiple partners and romance is more of agame.
Men typically are typically ludic lovers until they turn 30 and seek monogamy.
Women seek friendships that turn into romances or pragmatic love which is where loves somebody for their traits such as money, religion or race.
Pragmatic love usually developes into eros love or extreme jealousy and obsession in marriages.
nice over-intellectualization, homosexual.
>10% of marriages
>turn 30 and seek monogamy
is the source for these data by any chance, your ass?
>Passion is short lived. The real gold is in the bond that forms over time, even if it's not as flashy as sexual novelty and butterflies in the stomach.
I envy you Anon, I lost a relationship of 13 years because my gf lost the butterflies in the stomach feeling the last 2 years of the relationship, and then she disappeared from the face of the earth.
>The only thing that happened in that break of yours is you probably cried, thinking about her, wishing you were back together, while she rode dicks, and once she was done having fun, she came back to the stable thing she had with you
Accurate. These people are a disease.
Ok but but how much looser was her c**t
Your children will be fricked up, you missed your peak of fertility
>I let my woman frick dozens of men to get being a bawd out of system before I crawled back to her
Great story bro!
She was a traumatized shut in I helped get used to society again. But being her partner was enabling her. Enjoying every second of her attention was enabling her. She didn't have sex with anyone as I was with her 95% of the time while she readjusted, but not as someone that wanted anything out of her, I was there as her friend. When things felt right for both of us as people, things felt right for us as a couple. You can invent a narrative that paints your world view as correct all you want, you're unhappy and you're always going to he deeply unhappy.
>I know she didn’t frick anyone because I was with her 95% of the time
Sounds like you didn’t take any break at all then moron, you just weren’t fricking her lmao
If it ain’t Swiss she ain’t me Miss.
White people are fricking plague, thank god they are going extinct
Symptom of general social decline and focus on the individual rather than the family unit.
best post itt
>Black person
Ironic coming from an adult with the media literacy of a toddler.
You make dumbass interpretations of something and people will disagree, surprise. You thinking something doesn't make it a fact bite a bullet freak of nature, you will never spread your genes.
Is reddit leaking in? Shills are really up in full force now.
have a nice day, you talk like a bot and that's probably why you're alone.
>cuck
Shilling what? It's describing the show. I didn't even really love the ending and felt it needed another episode or two, but what everyone is saying is accurate. You're just mentally ill.
No that's just how much of a shithole this board is. /tg/ is the same where they have people who can't stand it when people criticize nonwhites and gays for making shitty products and stories. Even the mods will ban you for it on both places if they are in a cranky mood.
>shoehorn your agenda into every conversation even it means swinging at ghosts.
>akcshually no it was the caligaygerinos
>you're a shill if you disagree (doesn't know what we agree and disagree on regarding the finale outside this one part)
>coping this hard because you don't get the circlejerk you want
Anon...
>coping this hard because you don't get the circlejerk you want
I just want there to be good cartoons. Also I am getting the circlejerk I want, way more people are shitting on this than defending it. If you gays want to die on the hill that this travesty of a series has anything resembling good writing then go ahead.
It had some great moments (Farmworld Finn, evil Marceline, the Winter King episode). The finale was a downer though.
>It had some great moments (Farmworld Finn, evil Marceline, the Winter King episode). The finale was a downer though.
One or two good moments does not a good series create
Also, Jerry. The dead world bits definitely managed to live up to original AT "upbeat creepiness".
People shitting on other aspects of the finale doesn't automatically mean they agree with you here. You can criticize the show in all sorts of ways, but if you interpret the Simon and Betty resolution as some Simon toxic shit, you're likely a triggered moron pushing an agenda. If you interpret the message of Fionna's character arc as "Escapism is bad", you're likely a moron pushing an agenda. I see as many people calling out that moronic shit as I see people saying it, keep in mind most of these ghost impressions of people in your head all liked the show up until now too. Just because there's one or two autists spamming negative threads doesn't mean more people are agreeing with you.
>People shitting on other aspects of the finale doesn't automatically mean they agree with you here
I see way more anons lamenting the absolute state of Western animation than defending it. I don't mean exclusively in AT threads. Most people that defend it also defend other cancer culture wars shit and self inserting over having an actual story with good pacing
>I see way more anons lamenting the absolute state of Western animation than defending it.
But we're not talking about the state of Western animation we're talking about this
moron proposition and why it's wrong, if you want to talk about israelites or some shit go make a thread about it on /misc/ and don't respond to separate arguments here. It looks like you're saying right now, "If you disagree with what I think in this one aspect, then you're automatically a proponent of the state of Western animation as a whole" how do you not see how much of a sjw you sound like talking like this and shoving your agenda into every conversation it's the most ironic shit in the world to me
>but we're not talking about the state of Western animation
Shitty stories like this show are a symptom of it and if you don't understand that then all I can say is you need some critical thinking skills.
>how do you not see how much of a sjw you sound like talking like this and shoving your agenda into every conversation it's the most ironic shit in the world to me
Because I don't seek for homosexuals to insert their politics into their stories, just to go back to universal stories and compelling themes that are good on rather than letting people make shitty drama based on their political views and sheltered personal experience. The only thing I want the industry to do is kick out these homosexuals who only know how to write their own personal drama and hang ups into shows instead of making a compelling story. Also, unlike SJWs literal nazis like me have zero institutional power. When was the last time a cartoon came out with hamfisted comparisons to israelites being in control of everything? Compare that to all the gay insertions, nonwhite "diversity" insertions, blaming men and upholding women, shitting on traditional values, etc that have been implemented over just telling a compelling story.
>critical thinking skills
You people always say this right before making the most dogshit interpretation of whatever you saw that just so happens to align with something you can get mad about, almost like you're looking for it eh? Check your own biased moron.
>yadda yadda
I already told you I don't give a frick, I disagree with some of what you say, I agree with some of what you say, but I don't care because that's not the point of the conversation braindead fricking mutt. Use your critical thinking skills to read the chain of replies you responded to and then consider why we're arguing. You're injecting this rant (the agenda you want to push) into a completely separate argument and implicitly painting anyone who disagrees with OP as a shill or something, you don't care about truth you just want to yap your fricking piece because this place is your only outlet. Probably said it to you before but paint your ceiling if you have so much trouble living in an iffy world that you can't even process the shit you yourself are doing. The lack of self awareness is insane, I want less gay cartoons but not until after you get euthanised.
>You people always say this right before making the most dogshit interpretation of whatever you saw that just so happens to align with something you can get mad about, almost like you're looking for it eh? Check your own biased moron.
So the products being made has nothing to do with the production teams?
>massive cope about not caring about quality despite being on Cinemaphile, a discussion board for quality
I accept your concession. In addition, I never accused you of being a shill, just an implication of moron or a transplant.
>So the products being made has nothing to do with the production teams?
If your problem is the writing, there's nothing wrong with that. If your problem is "THE WRITERS ARE SAYING SIMON IS A TOCIS MAN AND ALL MEN ARE TOXIC AN", then you're moronic, and that's the argument you were responding to. So you're asking me a question detached from any of my issues with what you initially said. Use your noggin.
>I accept your concession.
Actually rich, create a non-existent argument detached from your initial comment or gripe with it, then tell yourself you won because because "uhh, its a discussion board", IQ off the charts, the West is truly saved.
I think its the other way around. People genuinelt believe that all men are toxic under patriarchy, and thus, Simon must be toxic too (at least this is what I get from trying to reverse-engineer their thought process).
The problem is that this doesn't work: Simon is genuinely sweet guy, who tries his best to be with Betty, and Betty is... well, a a human-shaped void of a character covered in saccharine cliches. Their romance feels like an informed attribute with no substance (and thus can't have flaws).
>Simon must be toxic too (at least this is what I get from trying to reverse-engineer their thought process).
Stop trying to "think critically", it's not for you, and I'm certain it hasn't gotten you anywhere so far.
You're being rude right now. The way I see it, the people behind the show clearly subscribe to "woke" ideology and it clearly influences their show. Why else would they try to problematize Simon and Betty's barely existant dynamic?
(I'd say that "intersectionalist" approach affects all romances in the series in a negative way).
What are you even talking about? They were both presented as having been self centered. Simon wasn't toxic, neither was Betty. They were just flawed. If you decide to bring your own politics into it I guess you can claim that but it wasn't what was represented in the show. Characters don't have to be coddled and shown to be only good heroic figures in relationships just because they're male and could he mistaken for toxic, it's fine to depict them as struggling.
Their dynamic itself was portrayed as unhealthy with Simon being portrayed as a validation-seeker and Betty as his enabler.
>If your problem is "THE WRITERS ARE SAYING SIMON IS A TOCIS MAN AND ALL MEN ARE TOXIC AN"
I didn't say that, I just said the series is shit and elaborated that it's because of a larger problem with the production team and the people that write this trash.
>create a non-existent argument
But it is an argument, I made it.
That guy you are replying to here isn't even me, homosexual.
>I didn't say that
This one complains about "shills" disagreeing with "uhh the writers are saying Simon is toxic"
You respond backing that up (with seemingly full context of what we're arguing about
) and spiel about completely detached shit as if that's what's going on in this thread (forcing your agenda into a separate argument about facts, nothing to do with shilling or defending less debateable flaws)
>devolves into me having to continuously remind you what you were even responding to like an alzheimer's patient
You don't care whether the person you replied to is right or not, any shitting on the show, even inaccurate interpretations, should go unchallenged because of your political alignment. That's essentially what you've been trying to say this whole time while I try to explain to you from the beginning, that the non-existent argument you're creating is one between us that didn't exist. I never engaged with it and told you repeatedly from the beginning that's not the point. Any confusion is on your own moronation and illiteracy, and not being able to follow a simple string of posts, or I guess just being spiteful enough to not care.
>That guy you are replying to here isn't even me, homosexual.
Well, the same I said to him goes to you mutt.
>detached shit
The industry being a nepotistic drama queen social justice filled shithole filled with people who have a huge chip on their shoulders against tradition and white males isn't off topic. Shitty stories are a symptom of this and the root of the problem. I cannot dumb it down any more than that. I don't want homosexuals defending anything about modern cartoons at all. I don't even know what the frick you are talking about with the Simon is "toxic" (which is a homosexual term anyway) shit, I am just agreeing with the sentiment that the show is shit. You don't even understand my train of thought, you are just making huge sweeping assumptions about me. I guess I was right in calling you a moron first unless you are a transplant using moronic outside lingo like "toxic"
Your train of thought isn't difficult to understand, you just can't understand the simplest shit, it's totally irrelevant. That opinion has nothing to do with my issue. Again, next time agree with the sentiment that the show is shit without implying anyone who disagrees with OP is a person >who can't stand it when people criticize nonwhites and gays for making shitty products and stories
the entire reason I replied to you. >>you're a shill if you disagree
I feel like I'm talking to a schizo, it's like you forgot everything you said before or what you were replying to, or you're just so unaware of what anything you said implied, you even admitted you don't understand anything about the discussion going on. I don't know what else to tell you.
>Your train of thought isn't difficult to understand, you just can't understand the simplest shit, it's totally irrelevant
No, you are the one who is trying to make it seem that way though.
>That opinion has nothing to do with my issue
Your issue is that you think that I think Simon is toxic or whatever when frankly I don't care, true or not there are 1000 other problems with the show and western animation in general right now.
>you're a shill if you disagree
When did I say the word shill? Now in addition to your schizophrenia you are trying to put words in my mouth. I replied to him agreeing that it was shit, not that anyone who disagrees is a shill. Instead I think there are a lot of morons or sunk cost Black folk who are incapable of getting the memo that it sucks.
I said
>No that's just how much of a shithole this board is
Not
>I agree with you there are shills everywhere
You turbo homosexual moron
>No, you are the one who is trying to make it seem that way though.
Yes, it is, because it had nothing to do with my issue... Again. You can say you didn't say shill, but now you say you're implying anyone who disagrees with him is a
>sunk cost Black person who are incapable of getting the memo that it sucks.
I know you don't have any opinion at all scumfrick you're just on this board to stir shit, my problem is your moron logic in implying the people disagreeing with that one moron are shills, sunk cost Black folk, whatever. It's moronic, and yes, that's what your reply implied. If you can't understand that, have a nice day probably.
>Yes, it is, because it had nothing to do with my issue
I don't care about your moronic issue. I am only stating the problem with the industry and you felt the need to voice your homosexual opinion and then you felt the need to put words in my mouth.
>I know you don't have any opinion at all scumfrick you're just on this board to stir shit
My only opinion is that the series had a tiny bit of potential and they ruined it years ago. The industry as a whole needs to get their shit together instead of release trash products like thread related. That is all I want. Threads about good products encourage good discussion, this isn't a good product.
>I don't care about your moronic issue.
Nice, you could have just told me you were a fricking moron 3 hours ago, or the other 5 times I made the issue clear. Congratulations on understanding what you implied and not caring. Your opinion had nothing to do with any of it.
>The industry as a whole needs to get their shit together instead of release trash products like thread related. That is all I want. Threads about good products encourage good discussion, this isn't a good product.
Move out of your parents and do something about it fatass
>Nice, you could have just told me you were a fricking moron 3 hours ago, or the other 5 times I made the issue clear. Congratulations on understanding what you implied and not caring. Your opinion had nothing to do with any of it.
You are the one spouting off topic shit and trying to draw me into something I don't give a frick about and even worse trying to claim I said shit or think shit that I don't think at all you sunk cost homosexual. The series is shit, get over it.
>Move out of your parents and do something about it fatass
Yeah I agree maybe I should firebomb LA production studios or just start wildfires nearb, just like what happened with Kyoto Animation.
Or better yet I could just watch Cinemaphile shit and the occasional good small western product instead of eating shit up that mega corps peddle and trying to kid myself that it's any good you flying homosexual.
Blah blah blah you homosexual, all of this just to try to prove a point to pick a corn out of the pile of shit that is this series, what a hill to die on.
moron
Betty was just seething. All the choices Simon made weren't relevant in the end; the glyphs or enchiridion wouldn't change the fact that he still gets the crown. I bet she still secretly wants him. Her turning into a comet or back to Golb or whatever is all part of some weird reincarnation plan she has.
Doesn’t Beth flat out say it’s not his fault for Betty being unhealthily obsessed over him.
Yeah, Betty wojack'd Simon with the book but Beth said "lmao it's not your fault tho." She then "broke up" (pfft) with Simon and called him an experience. Now she's seething with Golb forever (unless Golb went back to normal)
The point is Betty couldn’t be saved. He had to let her go and she forgives him. Grow up and move on yada yada
>bro, you just had to let her take BBC and none of this would've happened!!
Isn't Simon black too though?
He's a Slav
The brown skin though (mixed heritage, perhaps?)
Yeah, that's what Slavs are.
The Southern subgroup maybe (the rest are pale as they come)
Nice bait.
>anon: Professor Petrikov, I have a question!
>simon: oh Anon, I'm glad you finally want to participate in the class, I was starting to think this was useless, what's your question?
>anon: what would happen if I put my dick inside that thing?
>simon: what?
>anon: I said, what would happen if I...
>Simon: Yes I heard you, but why would you do that?
>anon: I want to frick a universe.
>simon: ....
>anon: I SAID, I WANT TO FRICK A UNIVERSE!
>simon: (sigh) anon, think about what you're saying, this is a universe full of life, with infinite living beings... why are you taking off your pants?
>*Anon slowly approaches the universe*
>simon: anon... don't do it.
>*Anon is getting closer and closer*
>simon: anon, please!
>*Anon takes Fionna and Cake's universe into his hands*
>simon: ANON, GET YOUR DICK OUT OF THAT UNIVERSE! DO NOT DO IT! ANON NOOO!
MEANWHILE IN ANOTHER PLACE.
>*fionna and her friends were watching how the tip of a gigantic wiener was passing through the planet's atmosphere*
>marshal: oh-my-GOD!
>gary: holy licorice! Do you think that dick has all its vaccines?
>fionna: cake...
>cake: yes fionna?
>fionna: do you still have some of those magic strawberries?
>cake: yes, do you plan to go big to stop that thing?
>fionna: eh... yeah... something similar.
>cake: ooh... bad girl, I like the way you think.
>fionna: do you want to join?
>cake: oh yeah, sister.
>fionna: what time is it?
>fionna/cake: ADVENTURE TIME!
I thought the implication was that his research led to the mutagen bomb
I thought so to as well
>Simon is selfish
YOUR PICTURE HAS HIM IN THE MIDDLE OF A CROSS ANON
And you're an annoying autist, simple as.
Ironic coming from a autist
This is an ouroboros.
You have those projected their anger at the own life at the ending missing the entire message and those trying to argue with them.
These people want the show to be saying Simon is bad because they want more reasons to hate it. They are not creatures for whom nuance is effective.
>This is an ouroboros.
About as subtle a statement as the awful writing.
what the hell happened to this thread?
Are we still speaking about Adventure Time and Fionna & Cake or is this a twitter thread/discord argument?
Wait what?
I don't know whats going on here?
Me neither.
I'm less upset about OP's opinion and more upset that being this wrong about a show's message got him a functioning thread instead of shriveling up at page 10 as it should have
>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>I PRAYED AND DEDICATED MYSELF TO A BEING THAT BY IT'S VERY NATURE IS RANDOM AND UNKNOWABLE
>HOW COULD I HAVE NOT BEEN WORSHIPPING IT RIGHT?
The blocks make it look like she has a duck bill
Peak writing in 2023
Do people really misinterpret this scene, or are they just moronic? She never said he was evil. And it wasn't as if he was purposely selfish, Betty just never pushed for her suggestions very hard. This isn't hard to understand.
>get the frick out lich i'm going to frick my husband now
enough, post simonna
they're cute
I'd rather post more Petrigrof
No, post that redhead fiona fangirl
She is pretty cute though
>I TURNED MYSELF INTO AN ELDER GOD SIMON. BOOM. BIG REVEAL. I'M A GOD NOW. WHADDYA THINK ABOUT THAT. I'M GOLBETTYYYY
>scenes virgins will never understand
Said the sexless creature
Who put Simon in the fridge?
betty literally did that to herself
simon had no hand in it
it was 100% her decision, he never told her to do that, he never pressured her to do it, if ashe told him thats what she was going to do she'd have been against it
But its his fault because she did it for him?
fricking women.
Did you forget the part where she said they both could have made some better choices but in the end she didn't regret any of the ones she made?
That part wasn't meant to put blame on either of them, it was to help Simon stop clinging to what ifs and appreciate the good that came out of his choices.
And to stop him from going full moron and basically killing himself by crown when she sacrificed a lot so he woulsnt have to
>Simon has a choice to return to blissful dementia where everyone seemed to like him more and he could live in a world inhabited by weirdos without having to carry the grief of sanity in a world that’s not his and a lost love he’ll never have again
>nooo think of all I sacrificed to force you to take normal pills
This story is pretty sad ngl.
Betty doesn't want Simon to live in regret for the rest of his life. Simon needed to say farewell, and Betty wanted to let him know the reason behind his obsession, so he could move past it.
When will she have the chance?
I just think this specific Simon is neat.
Is this an IT reference?
I've ignored everything AT since the main show ended, should I get into the newer stuff?
As long as you don't hate gays sure.
Betty was the one who summoned Golb in the first place and Simon was not at all responsible for that. It was her experience in the Temple of Mars episode which inspired her to make that choice. She even said in that episode seeing Finn overcome all the obstacles in that episode without giving up motivated her to keep trying for Simon and go to the extreme to do it even though she was about to give up in doing that before. So if you’re going to blame anyone besides Simon and Betty for her summoning Golb, blame Finn.
>"moral" ends up being the world is worth fighting for as it is.
>becomes slightly magical anyway because of forced multiverse immigration
fricking shitty ending, who wrote this crap?
People are grossly interpreting things
No one is evil
Basically Simon and Betty's story is a classic Tragic Love Story, like Romeo and Juliet
Simon and Betty were so in love they would literally sacrifice each other so the other would live, even if in the end the other would probably kill themselves due to the heartbreak and sorrow of loss
If Simon had sacrificed himself instead of Betty, the result would have been the same and Betty would have tried a find ways to save Simon still or become so depressed she self-destructed and an-heroed
What Betty did giving Simon closure was honestly am amazing act of True Love
Instead of letting the person she loves suffer for her, she sacrificed herself to keep him safe at the expense of them being together (the old saying, if you truly love them, you let them go)
A true act of love, putting the well being of the one you love before yourself, Parent's would do the same for their children, it is love beyond reasoning, love makes people blind, etc.
Betty knew that the only way for Simon to be safe is making him to realize how much she had "sacrificed" for him, and how much she had loved him, and that wallowing in depression wouldn't have been what she wanted for him, and she would want Simon to go on to find happiness with no regrets.
If you ever had a loved one or family member who has died irl, if they truly loved and cared about you, would they not want you to go on living to find happiness? This is a pure act of love from Betty, she truly loved Simon with all of her being, with all her soul and heart, she gave everything just so he could be safe, and she had to communicate this devotion and love to Simon so he could truly understand that the best way to honor Betty's memory, was to get laid
Seriously Betty is an ULTRA KEK
Betty is such a massive KEK that she's setting Simon up to have a massive harem of b***hes to fug in orgies, all so Betty can use her omnipresence to watch instead of having him jerk off alone
no she literally became a God and dumped Simon while blaming him for all her problems
No, she died and told him to stop being sad about it and move on.
okay troony keep making shit up in you're head seems like you're good at it anyways
basically this
Betty is dead
even golb is "dead"
Golbetty is a new entity and it realized that Simon was miserable and had to sober him up so he can stop being sad and get some pussy
Finn's mom, Fionna, whoever, he just needs to get laid, for Betty's sake
You are infuriating anon. But I am beyond Bait.
>no "BURN" bro
NGMI
Betty was following the third benifit of Cuckqueaning
>3. Make sure that your husband is fully satisfied:
>Many women are unable to meet the sexual needs of their husbands because of some reason. Hence, they often feel guilty and feel that they are stopping their husband from living a satisfied sexual life. If you are one of those women, then entering a cuckquean relationship will be the best and the most effective option. This way, you can still be in a happy relationship with your husband without feeling guilty. It will make you feel much better. You can start this kind of relationship in many ways. But initially, you have to find a woman, who you think will be perfect for the both of you.
Betty truly loves Simon and wants the best for him
I'm close to cracking the code schizobros
"And we pull back the veil of static and reach into the source of all being
behind this curtain of patterns, this random pattern generator"
it's a fricking time loop.
>Fionnaverse got repaired and became an official universe
>The mushroom war happened and killed everyone
>somewhere, a simon petrikov is created
>Adventure time
>that simon creates a new Fionnaverse
Is not Simon that created the universe, but Prismo
Prismo and GOLB represent the opposing ends of the destruction-creation cycle. In the end credits Prismo's time room and GOLB's head merge to form the apple seen bottom right. The boss, Malus, who is represented by the apple, maintains balance between these opposing forces. That's my best attempt at making sense of this.
the boss is betty
I don't think so. GOLB seems to operate outside of the cosmic hierarchy. Scarab tells her to stay out of his way.
not GOLB.
Betty.
Betty Grof.
She's part of GOLB now. GOLBetty.
Is she more GOLB or Betty?
>Didn't sought chaos
>Just chilling
>Literally talked to Simon
Did Betty managed to become the new GOLB and only didn't frick Simon because she physically cant?
GOLB, I would say. Her influence probably only extends to Simon-related matters, because her wish was to keep him safe.
So GOLB turns into Betty everytime it is able to see Simon.
and Betty could call in Simon whenever she saw Simon in danger.
Simon could've abused a loophole tbh
>Do stupid adventures that put himself near death (suicides probably doesn't work)
>Transported to GOLBworld
>Sex with Betty
>go back
rinse and repeat and it's like she never fused with GOLB
It would also be funny.
Simon would basically be like Finn, doing the most dangerous, deadly shit whenever he needs a wank.
>'oh......hey simon.'
>'Hey Finn, can you get me to another adventure?I.....Uh.....'
>'you want to frick Betty again.'
>'Yeah.....so.....'
>'Alright, fine.'
>'So......uh.......Simon......When will you find an actual gf and move on?'
>'What do you mean?Me and Betty are totally fine!'
>'I mean....Dont you think this is a bit...unhealthy?I know my coping mechanism is bad but you are literally killibg yourself over and over again...'
>'No, not at all.'
>'Oh....fine....'
cringe
Wonder if a 2nd season will officially introduce us to Malus?
>entire point of the scene was that different choices lead to different paths and you can't undo them and even if the end is unhappy it doesn't mean there are regrets
You want to be opressed so bad it's insane
are they one uping each other on who can throw there life away to save the other. I confused its both selfish and selfless at the same time
To all the morons saying how Betty was more invested in the relationship: why are you forgetting Simon was trapped in a dementia curse for 1000 years? Why are you saying shit like "he should have done more" like WHAT ELSE WAS HE SUPPOSED TO DO HE WAS LUCID FOR LIKE 5 MINUTES IN THE WHOLE ADVENTURE TIME SHOW UNTIL THE FINALE, OF COURSE BETTY WAS MORE INVESTED, SIMON WASN'T HIMSELF THE WHOLE FRICKING TIME!!! If your wife had alzheimer, would you blame her for not being invested enough in your marriage? Fricking disgusting and selfish behavior.
ALL OF MY COLLECTIONS
I'LL SHARE THEM ALL WITH YOU
Imagine the cosmic chaos goddess pussy anons
just imagine....
Rather candy pussy.
I will stick my dick in fire and you can't stop me
Use a fire protection spell dude.
Pillow pussy
She's literally made for reality wrecking chaos bros...
I thought Simon was hanging out with Finn in the Fiona universe.
Anyway that's what you get for consuming media written by a fat 40 year old manchild who thinks the avengers is still cool.
Would you have given him a second chance on the condition that he's not allowed to try and kill anyone?
I would have wished for him to become Fionna world version, ergo female, and proceeded to make her my wife
I wonder if Fionna world had it's own Lich too?
horny eyes
Actually that was her being mad as frick when she looked at the crown.
So that's why my crush slapped me
>S2 is going to be about Fionna and Cake playing wingman for Simon as he seeks love again
Would.
DOES GOLBETTY HAVE BUSH?
One must imagine....
Post Golbetty's please.
Sure thing, pal.
weird, i suddenly feel the urge to kill all life in the universe for her.
Oh my goodness gracious
I didn't get that impression at all, things could have been different if Simon was more considerate but it happened and Betty ultimately doesn't regret their time together even if they ultimately have to move on from each other. People here keep comparing Bubbline unfavorably but ironically Simon and Betty had a much healthier and understanding "breakup" than Bonnie and Marceline did.
Wow Lich's purpose became even more tragically pointless. He said he studied Golb's ways and from this he assumed Golb desired the death of all life because of the bodies left in their wake. Yet in the finale of AT we see that the death caused by Golb is merely a consequence of the chaos and violence that Golb merely existing in a universe causes.
There's no intent there and nothing to learn, yet Lich dedicated himself to be a scholar of Golb and an agent of them.
There was never any point to what Lich was doing because ultimately it didn't want all life to die, it doesn't want anything. Golb just is.
Lich returns and tries to cleanse GOLB from Betty, attributing his indifference to her influence.
I have once again been on an emotional rollercoaster.
Adventure Time does it again.
I don't care what anyone says I loved Lich's inclusion in this show.
>his skull is trapped within the shape
MORE LICH KINO IS STILL POSSIBLE ANONS.
WE MUST NOT FALL.
Marcy and Simon comic is being storytimed here
in case you want to read an ending to Simon and Betty's story that doesn't suck.