It's easy for us to armchair quarterback and criticize Neil for giving in to his thirst for revenge on Waingro. But OTOH there is actually a logic behind it. If Neil just fricks off to Fiji, there is a distinct, non-zero chance that Waingro will find out what happened to Neil, and then somehow come after him or at least make life difficult for him. Neil doesn't want to live with that hanging over his head, he wants the job and the recent frickups completely tied off and he sees his chance to do it. He is succumbing to emotion, yes, but the valid reasoning involved is part of his calculation here.
Reminder that the real villain of the movie was the diner manager for fricking over the replacement driver. Breedan was willing to work a shit job to get a second chance, and had a woman. He had a reason to live. But what pushed him over the edge was having it reinforced that crime pays. Had the manager not been corrupt, Breedan wouldn't necessarily have opted for the job. A cautious Neil would have walked away, and the crew and something like a dozen cops and others would still all be alive, ready to fight another day.
Absolutely, one hundred per cent correct. You are so right on target that I suspect you've read some of my old posts which make this exact same observation and just repeating my correct views. Either way, good for you.
The diner manager is culpable for his corruption, and in a high profile case involving multiple cop killings, and everything leading up to it, I am very confident that the diner manager, and the exact nature of how his corruption (and that of the parole officer he colluded with) helped to precipitate the heist, would be found culpable and charged with something.
You're one of the dumb ones. Of course Donald is criminal scum, and of course he has final responsibility for his own actions. But the blatant corruption of the diner manager, which is criminal in itself, is a clear CONTRIBUTING FACTOR to the fact that the heist even occurred in the first place. Donald had a woman, he was free again, and he was willing to put up with the bullshit job for a time. He would have been less disposed to throw everything away if the guy wasn't stealing 25% of his money.
Neil is right at the point of walking away from the job because it's been compromised, and Donald has to think just a moment before he gives his reply. The entire job is almost about to not happen. Donald's frustration with his job is the tipping point which leads to the carnage. The movie couldn't be clearer on this minor plot detail. The example of the diner manager's corruption is a clear sociological and criminological example of why corruption is harmful in society. It erodes social trust and engenders cynicism, disincentivizing honesty and good behavior. Why go straight if this is what you get? The criminals are violent psychopaths and they do deserve what they get, and at the same time, one of the reasons why they take scores (in Donald's case) is because they don't see any good reason not to. Both of these things are true at the same time, they don't exclude each other.
Also, you meant to use recidivist, not "non-recidivist". Recidivism is the process of returning to criminal behavior, continuing to do crimes after one gets caught, does some time or gets some other punishment.
The central point is that you are incorrect to dismiss the diner manager's corruption and its role as a contributing factor in the heist, as I've clearly shown. There hasn't been any "desperate rambling". The moral of the story is that corruption is bad, and the film shows this just as clearly.
The storytelling/filmmaking in Heat is so next level. This guys and his girlfriend's story has like 5 minutes of screentime yet you still feel it bigly when he makes the wrong choice and then she sees it on the news.
Some parts are good, like Hanna taking out a home invasion crew in Chicago or what McCauleys crew was doing before the events of Heat, however everything that takes place after feels like a mix of what we've seen in nu-MiamiVice and Blackhat - including Chris developing yellow fever for a Triad bosses daughter.
Is Heat 2 actually worth reading? Or is it just another Once Upon a Time in Hollywood situation where it turns out that the big name director/screenwriter is, for some inscrutable reason, not very good at writing prose?
Its decent enough for a paperback crime thriller.
Reads like his movies, terse character dialogue, very specific about heist set ups and firearm tactics.
Mann is based because he blows a gaping hole in all the paranoia about israelites on this board. Mann's whole thing is being a masculine romantic who casts cool dudes who act like dudes and are usually hyper competent in some way, all while having a romance with a beautiful woman.
He's so on this track that he sometimes goes *too* far and gives us jacked Chris Hemsworth as a computer nerd.
Hemsworth literally admitted he wasn't right for the role. I like Mann casting manly men doing manly things, but that casting just didn't really work. It's like the white pimp in Taxi Driver. Gigachad hackers like that don't exist.
I will always be a #mannmaniac for this reason
One of the few guys left in Hollywood who can get away with making movies about masculine subjects without any of the longhouse nonsense other directors feel compelled into jamming in.
It's easy for us to armchair quarterback and criticize Neil for giving in to his thirst for revenge on Waingro. But OTOH there is actually a logic behind it. If Neil just fricks off to Fiji, there is a distinct, non-zero chance that Waingro will find out what happened to Neil, and then somehow come after him or at least make life difficult for him. Neil doesn't want to live with that hanging over his head, he wants the job and the recent frickups completely tied off and he sees his chance to do it. He is succumbing to emotion, yes, but the valid reasoning involved is part of his calculation here.
waigro had to waingo
Reminder that the real villain of the movie was the diner manager for fricking over the replacement driver. Breedan was willing to work a shit job to get a second chance, and had a woman. He had a reason to live. But what pushed him over the edge was having it reinforced that crime pays. Had the manager not been corrupt, Breedan wouldn't necessarily have opted for the job. A cautious Neil would have walked away, and the crew and something like a dozen cops and others would still all be alive, ready to fight another day.
Absolutely, one hundred per cent correct. You are so right on target that I suspect you've read some of my old posts which make this exact same observation and just repeating my correct views. Either way, good for you.
The diner manager is culpable for his corruption, and in a high profile case involving multiple cop killings, and everything leading up to it, I am very confident that the diner manager, and the exact nature of how his corruption (and that of the parole officer he colluded with) helped to precipitate the heist, would be found culpable and charged with something.
I had to get it on, man
Are you saying there was no other driver who they could have used in the entire city
On such short notice and someone the crew already knew and trusted? Correct there was no other option
>it's the manager's fault that he's non-recidivist criminal scum
You're one of the dumb ones. Of course Donald is criminal scum, and of course he has final responsibility for his own actions. But the blatant corruption of the diner manager, which is criminal in itself, is a clear CONTRIBUTING FACTOR to the fact that the heist even occurred in the first place. Donald had a woman, he was free again, and he was willing to put up with the bullshit job for a time. He would have been less disposed to throw everything away if the guy wasn't stealing 25% of his money.
Neil is right at the point of walking away from the job because it's been compromised, and Donald has to think just a moment before he gives his reply. The entire job is almost about to not happen. Donald's frustration with his job is the tipping point which leads to the carnage. The movie couldn't be clearer on this minor plot detail. The example of the diner manager's corruption is a clear sociological and criminological example of why corruption is harmful in society. It erodes social trust and engenders cynicism, disincentivizing honesty and good behavior. Why go straight if this is what you get? The criminals are violent psychopaths and they do deserve what they get, and at the same time, one of the reasons why they take scores (in Donald's case) is because they don't see any good reason not to. Both of these things are true at the same time, they don't exclude each other.
Also, you meant to use recidivist, not "non-recidivist". Recidivism is the process of returning to criminal behavior, continuing to do crimes after one gets caught, does some time or gets some other punishment.
Your point? Or are you just going to keep up this desperate rambling?
The central point is that you are incorrect to dismiss the diner manager's corruption and its role as a contributing factor in the heist, as I've clearly shown. There hasn't been any "desperate rambling". The moral of the story is that corruption is bad, and the film shows this just as clearly.
Amazing that he made it all the way from paroled line cook to President of the United States.
>all Black folk look the same
lol based faceblind moron.
The storytelling/filmmaking in Heat is so next level. This guys and his girlfriend's story has like 5 minutes of screentime yet you still feel it bigly when he makes the wrong choice and then she sees it on the news.
He's literally me
KINO
I used to hate the relationship stuff when I first watched this movie but on my second rewatch I saw just how kino it really was
Is Heat 2 any good?
Some parts are good, like Hanna taking out a home invasion crew in Chicago or what McCauleys crew was doing before the events of Heat, however everything that takes place after feels like a mix of what we've seen in nu-MiamiVice and Blackhat - including Chris developing yellow fever for a Triad bosses daughter.
I really wonder how they're going to compress the novel down into a 2 hour something movie. Its a bit rambling tbh.
>Chris developing yellow fever
Understandable
Is it this movie or thief where the old guy goes "dont let me fricking die in here" nevermind I'm pretty sure it's thief. Siri dont hit submit
Thief. And it was Willie Nelson who said it.
How is Mann going to make Heat 2? Zoomer actors can't hold up to Pacino, De Niro, Sizemore, Kilmer, etc.
Is Heat 2 actually worth reading? Or is it just another Once Upon a Time in Hollywood situation where it turns out that the big name director/screenwriter is, for some inscrutable reason, not very good at writing prose?
Its decent enough for a paperback crime thriller.
Reads like his movies, terse character dialogue, very specific about heist set ups and firearm tactics.
GREAT ASS
Sometimes she goes, sometimes she don’t. Way of the road brother.
>Told you I'm not going back.
Right in the feels. Every time.
>got caught because of a woman
sad
many such cases
>>got caught because of a woman
If only men had some kind of warning about women...
Such a ballsy way to end the movie. That song needs the perfect story tone to hit correctly.
Mann is based because he blows a gaping hole in all the paranoia about israelites on this board. Mann's whole thing is being a masculine romantic who casts cool dudes who act like dudes and are usually hyper competent in some way, all while having a romance with a beautiful woman.
He's so on this track that he sometimes goes *too* far and gives us jacked Chris Hemsworth as a computer nerd.
Casting a 6'5 gigachad instead of some scrawny israelite was based as frick and I'm glad it makes nerds seethe
Hemsworth literally admitted he wasn't right for the role. I like Mann casting manly men doing manly things, but that casting just didn't really work. It's like the white pimp in Taxi Driver. Gigachad hackers like that don't exist.
I will always be a #mannmaniac for this reason
One of the few guys left in Hollywood who can get away with making movies about masculine subjects without any of the longhouse nonsense other directors feel compelled into jamming in.
It's a sneed country, city slicker.
>Hello?
>Hi, I'm looking for Shalashaska.
>I am Shalashaska.