How can other superhero franchises even compete?
 Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
 Tip Your Landlord Shirt $21.68 |
Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
The Batman family.
How can other superhero franchises even compete?
Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
Tip Your Landlord Shirt $21.68 |
Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
This pic needs to replace Gotham guy with Michael Lane.
They can't which is why Big Daddy Batman has carried DC for 20+ years.
I expect a lot of coping, seething, malding, and other such buzz terms in this thread over Batman and his family.
NOOOOOOOOOOOO MY SUPERHERO NEEDS TO BE AN EDGY INCEL LOSER LIKE ME
asiaticgirl is a fricking embarrassment and I'm tired of her moronic fans saying she's anything more than a failed gimmick. They all want the Batman stories to revolve around her like the mentally ill waifugays they are.
Case in fricking point
Whine some more from that deep pit of yours, you homosexual b***h. You're a moronic shitposter on the same level of the schizos in Spider-Man threads. Don't try and pretend like you have some legitimate case against Cassandra Cain and her fans. You've been seething about a fictional character and the fact people like her for months now. God, you're pathetic. Please DIE!
Based Peter Tomasi shitting on Cass and her cuck fans
Look at this cowardly troll crawling out from the shadows. You only now have the confidence to speak up because someone else did it first. Fricking clown.
I'm anti loner Bats, but you Cassgays have convinced me that pussywhipped baseddad who only exists to groom his adopted asian daughter into taking his mantle is much, MUCH worse.
More like 80+ years. DC literally stands for Detective Comics and there's a reason for that.
And in the end all Batman needs is Robin and Alfred.
Bruce Wayne, Dick Grayson, and Alfred Pennyworth.
The rest can be dropped.
Dick outgrowing Robin is moving away from Gotham is important to his character.
What does that have to do with anything?
Bruce, Dick and Alfred are the only ones that matter.
The Titans cartoon had him move AND kept him as Robin.
He's also under 18 in that cartoon and Dick was Robin for early in the NTT run and the Titans runs before that. The cartoon also foreshadows that he'd become Nightwing eventually
The Robin name came from his mother. He shouldn’t have to “outgrow” it.
That's a retcon, and besides Nightwing as a name is also tied to a connection that is important to Dick.
It’s from the best Robin origin. One that along with The Guantlet, leads perfectly into Robin: Year One.
It still wasn't a thing back when Batman originally fired Dick and passed the mantle to another kid.
>which doesn’t work whenever it’s just a Batman only universe.
And which isn't needed as Nightwing is a name any child speaking english could come up with.
And now Damian keeps both Talia and Ra relevant.
>Nightwing as a name is also tied to a connection that is important to Dick.
His connection to Superman, of which doesn’t work whenever it’s just a Batman only universe.
The Robin name came from Robin Hood.
Because he was created in 1940 and Robin Hood was popular then.
Tomasi said a few years ago that DC editorial doesn't like the Robin Hood angle anymore, hence why they came up with the bullshit of Dick's mom calling him Robin or something.
They wanted to go with the bird angle to match up with Batman since robins and bats are both flying animals.
Didio hated everything cool.
It hasn't stopped other writers from referencing the real origin.
Dick looks unhinged here.
Bad coloring.
This. It's important because it turned him from a relevant sidekick to an irrelevant vigilante with zero good comics.
>Stephanie
And Batgirl for occasional cameos
>Gotham and Gotham Girl
huh?
>Terry
huh????
Replace Gotham with Michael Lane.
Replace Gotham Girl with Harley Quinn.
Replace Terry with Jace Timothy Fox.
Problem solved.
>replacing Terry
Zip the lip, Twip.
>tfw anon still kept Tim
there is literally nothing wrong with Tim Drake
He’s just a Dick clone. Even the adaptations understood this when they give Dick his suit.
>Dick clone
Tell me you frickers have never read any 90's Batman content without telling me directly
>hurrdurr but Tim got Dick's personality and Dick was made dumber
No one ever posts proof of this. Dixon era Tim was not a master detective and still acknowledged Dick as the better, more capable detective. Dick's personality as a trashtalking, daredevil, bold character has been well in place since the 40's and Tim was far more resevered and less confident than Dick was.
Who gives a shit? Point is that Tim’s obsolete. He doesn’t work anymore especially with Damian around. Accept it and move on.
So let's just kill Damian.
>Who gives a shit?
They're entirely different characters.
>no Damien
Ah, a dickgay
>no Damien
>Ah, a dickgay
I thought Dickfans and Damianfans were the most allied.
I feel like most normies like both Nightwing and Red Hood. But when it comes to fan feuding, the Dick fans and the Damian fans get along better than any other two factions.
The Steph and Cass fans are closely allied and will team up to gut a Babs fan like a fish
Damian came into his own in the DickBats era. It was Batman and Robin that made it happen.
is a false-flagging timgay.
They like Red Hood. Nightwing, not so much. Twitter and Tumblr aren’t indicative for the tastes of normies.
Bruce and Alfred. Get rid of everyone else. Maybe leave one Robin.
Batman and His Shitty Friends
Literally the only one of the side characters I actually like and she wasn't even included in your stupid homosexual picture
Literally whomst?
Little event called Bruce Wayne: Murderer/Bruce Wayne: Wanted. It's very good. It leads up to OMAC and Brother Eye schenanigans
Is that Sasha?
yes.
The thing about Sasha to me is that because she was only briefly in the batbooks and then moved onto the Greater DCU, I think of her less as a bat-character and more of a general independent one who just started off in Gotham.
Also, her purple hair and cybernetics always makes me think of her as DC's Motoko Kusanagi.
Honestly her story revealed a side of Bruce I wouldn't have expected. He let her rot in jail until an inmate kills her. Just so she could help keep his identity secret. It was a fricked up situation
I completely agree and that's what makes her great. To me Sasha is a Checkmate character. She belongs in the Task Force X books with Waller. I wish more of these extra Batman characters could minimize their connection to him and get launched out into the wider DCU.
Then they’d fade into obscurity.
Well they tried that during nu52. They only let Tim Drake work with the Titans until some events. And it fricking sucked
It was awesome when they did it with Dick in the 80s. It sucked in the Nu52 because they took Dick Grayson's team, stripped all his history with the team, and gave it to Tim Drake.
If they'd let Tim go off with Blue Beetle, or with the Veteran, or any of the alternate paths that were teased pre-IC that were unique to him and weren't just rooting through Dick's cast-offs, he'd be in a much better place today.
They should’ve reset everything to the Silver Age status quo where Dick was Robin and the leader of the Titans. It’d work perfectly with the five year timeline they were going for. Especially since nu52 Kara just showed up on Earth at that time.
Same thing with Red Hood and the Outlaws and even Agent Grayson. Hell even Pracle and her Birds of Prey. Everybody kept asking "where's Batman? Why aren't they working with Batman?"
They've tried to fricking move these characters on. The problem is the sidekicks they replace the other guys with are so shit. It took FOREVER for people to warm up to Damian. And people still want to get rid of him. And characters like Blue Bird and We Wuz Robin are getting quietly swept away.
No, the problem is the fanbase want all the characters in the same place and only interacting with each other. And they're loud and aggressive so DC actually listens to them most of the time.
I'm a fan and I don't want that shit at all. I wanted Bruce to stay dead and thought it was cool when Nightwing had to take over for him. I wish Tim had been the one because that's what it felt like we were going. But whatever. I also preferred when Jason was evil. He was hanging out in Arkham with henchladies. He could've been DC's Punisher.
Honestly we are talking about a guy who dedicated his life to fighting crime because his parents were assassinated by a petty thief. At this point he's had a child with an Assasain and he's in love with a petty thief. He's taken several children and turned them into weapons. It's clear to me that the mission is failed. It's time to hang it up with Bruce.
>Jason was evil
What are you talking about? He was never evil even when DC tried (and failed) to make him a villain.
Dude, get over it. Batman will always be Bruce Wayne. That’ll never change no matter how many times you b***h. Accept it and move on.
>He could've been DC's Punisher.
God please no.
That’s because Tim in the Titans marks the beginning of his identity problem.
Tim being the yard wrangler( along with Cassie) in YJ. That was a fun angle.
Rucka refusing to give Sasha a superhero codename ensured she would be consigned to the dustbin of history for all time and space after his run ended. With that being said, I think the Bruce and Sasha romance is the greatest Batman love story of all time, which is quite a feat.
She couldn’t be Batwoman?
I doubt DC editorial would've let anyone use the Batwoman name at that time. All I know is in the actual run, they make it a point to say Batman refuses to let her have a superhero name and she never gets one. Be interesting to know the behind-the-scenes rationale for that.
Probably because Rucka never intended for her to be a regular bat member. When he left he was able to take her to Checkmate and change her MO and look , which he probably couldn’t if she was Bat-guard or whatever
Rucka later on worker Sasha as Mr Terrific’s woman now in the pages of Checkmate.
Ew.
You take that back!
This was one of the sweetest relationships in 00s DC and Checkmate was the best book of that OYL era.
everybody forgets about Onyx
She’s actually more of a Green Arrow character. Batman just borrowed her for a while.
I had heard Clayface redeemed himself. I didn't want to believe it. You may as well throw Two-Face up there since he trained Harvey and let him take over while he was out of town for 100 days.
All he needs are Alfred, Dick, Tim, Barb, Steph, Jason, Damian, Cass, Lucius, and Harold.
Jason should stay dead or stay evil. Barb should stay as Oracle.Damian replaces Tim. Steph dies and Tim fricks off to lead Young Justice. Cass works with the Birds of Prey. Alfred dies of natural causes and is replaced with Luke Fox, Lucius, and Harold to perform each of Al's duties separately. (medical, inventory, mechanic)
All of the other operatives in Gotham would be Kate, Selina, Michael Lane,Holly, Helena.
>Clayface
I miss him bros
>Bette
>Julia
>Helena B
>Gotham and Gotham G
When was the last time these were relevant?
Julia helped Babs help Gordon in Tynion's Joker book.
Gotham was revived as a zombie disguised as Bane in Task Force Z, and Gotham Girl was there to help him once that was revealed.
Helena was basically deuteragonist of Tamaki's 'Tec run.
Azrael is the best one btw
Isn't Azreal supposed to be an avatar of Old Testement God? Shouldn't he work with Spectre?
He's just an autist in a suit, not an actual angel.
You may be thinking of Zauriel.
You're thinking of Michael Lane
whatever happened to this guy
does anyone care about him
>whatever happened to this guy
His arc happened right before New52
>does anyone care about him
DC pretends like he doesn't exists in favor of JPV for some reason, the only reason people remember him is because he was Azrael in the Arkham games
>DC pretends like he doesn't exists in favor of JPV for some reason
The reason is that JPV is cute and based.
I liked Michael's writing better, it was actually set up that the Church had rounded up meta humans to start a holy war
>Fabian Nicieza
I don't read comics made by jobbers
Cartoonist Kayfabe is fricking gay.
Jim Rugg is an actual shitted cuck, too.
He did a good job with Azrael
Perfection.
Agreed.
you know what, sure.
I almost agree, but I just like Jason as the murderhobo part of the family they don't talk about too much. I fully admit to being biased because Under the Red Hood is such a great animated film in a sea of really shit batman ones, but having just one of the Bat Sons go crazy fits a story niche that can't easily be replaced
Add Julia Pennyworth, Ryan Wilder Batwoman and the new black Anarchy to this.
>the new black Anarchy
Who?
>only 1 appearance
>in a fricking GL book of all places
I think you could use Barbara's crippled friend Frankie as the Oracle
Where's my homies Ace and Harold?
Hi Alan Moore
You’re thinking of Alan grant.. even though grant didn’t really like them and just had to add them due to editorial
Alan Moore's killing had a photo of various Batman legacy characters. Not the ones that anon mentions but bringing back old silver age off shoots feels like a Moore thing
I'm just so tired bat-bros. It's too many tertiary characters
Who's to robut?
Gotham and Gotham Girl were such a wasted opportunity. The idea of Batman mentoring actual superpowered heroes is oddly rarely used.
In terms of sheer size of autistic raging fanbase only the X-Men can compete.
Hickman's run outright got X gays unironically cheering on an ethnostate. I doubt Batman could do that, as Bat writers can't get batfamilygays to cheer on child abuse.
In terms of being good characters, most superhero franchises compete.
This is due to the batfamily becoming so large that personality traits from characters have been taken to be given to other characters (eg Dick's intelligence given to Tim). It's also due to writers pandering to batfamily fanon recently (eg Dick becoming a one note sunshine onii-chan who drinks respect women juice).
In terms of power level, if brains and common sense are used most superhero franchises destroy them. But of course Batwank exists so it'll never happen. At best Dick will job while the rest clean house.
My Roster
>Green: Core Group
>Blue: Allies
>Yellow: Good for Future/Alternate Universe stories
>Red: Shit or otherwise superfluous
>Gray: Alfred is great, but I only consider capes/masks to be legit members
make Stephanie yellow. Should've never came back from the dead. And definetly never should've been Batgirl.
>Not making Jason a villain
>Getting rid of Tim
I hate zoomers.
Zoomers are 1997-2012, dude. They grew up with Nolan, JLU, The Batman, and Teen Titans. The Arkham games too.
>1997-2012
Guess what movie came out in those years right in time for the early half to be edgy teenagers.
Guess what game came out when they were still young enough to have more free time and obsession over games
Jason is too nuanced to be a villain.
He’s only a villain because Batman has his no-kill rule. Any other place, he’d be an anti-hero or a typical Action Hero.
Jason IS an anti-hero, it's not like he goes around killing people for jaywalking or something.
He's not even the first anti-hero related to the Bat-Family, Azrael and Huntress both exist.
Red Hood is a criminal.
Yeah, but he's cool.
He hasn’t been cool since Lost Days.
All these characters are criminals.
Dick is the goodest boy.
> the goodest boy
Still a criminal, but true, he can be quite the dog too.
>The goodest boy
wrong member
>Post-Crisis Ace just goes fricking missing in No Man's Land and no one cares to look for him because writers just forgot he existed.
That was fricked honestly..poor dog.
I just assumed he died in No Man’s Land
Sad, Bruce was so happy to have him around but comics never seem to threat pets right.
>Ace I died of old age
>Ace II disappeared in NML
>Ace III is still around
>Titus is still around
>Haley is still around
>Bat-Cow is still around
>Alfred the cat is still around
It's not as bad as you say.
>Haley
Uh... quick rundown?
Dick's new dog, a pibbull puppy named after Haly's circus. Sometimes called Bite-wing.
>Pitbull
ugh.
By taking in and raising a creature designed to maim and kill and trying to redeem it, he's just expressing how much he misses Damian.
Damian was just a placeholder to fill the snarky murderous sidekick void Rose left in his life.
>Rose
Be fricking for real. Like Dick wasn't perfectly willing to trade her like a Pokemon to her scumbag dad just to get Deathstroke off his back.
The way some fans talk about Rose, you'd think she was best buddies with the Titans. They barely interact with her, they're not particularly warm or affectionate with each other, and they never think about her except for the exact moments when she's standing right in front of their faces. She's always been treated as a gimmick character to cash in on some fleeting Deathstroke drama, and that's it.
Dick has more of a big brother relationship with Rose than he does with Steph or Cass.
Same with Roy, but swap in Mia, Emiko, and Arrowette.
it was one arc like two reboots ago.
cope
Meet Bite-Wing
I hate Taylor's reddit writing so fricking much.
Tom Taylor didn't write the story.
Rent Free.
Well, he did come up with the heckin' doggo, so I still blame him.
at least he matches bruce in the most moronic decision of having his hand chopped off
I've never seen Bruce do a rape face smile before
Didn't they eat cats and dogs in NML?
Poor good boy
Morrison re-canonized the original Ace and Tom King just had to have his own Ace too, so there are at least three Aces, and Titus, in continuity now. I can't remember if they show Ace in the more recent Beyond comics
I don't get the impression that anyone in Bat editorial from the post Dennis O'Neil/ Bob Schreck era actively read any 90's comics unfortunately. Making a new Bathound is an idea that pops up every few years yet it feels like no one even reads an online recourse to check to see if one existed already
True but the post-Crisis Ace had a whole 3 part story arc so he only version that some readers most likely had connections to besides Sliver Age one and Beyond as the
Tom King one and and the others just kinda shoved in.
This isn't unique to the modern era. Robin had a dog years before Ace was created and nobody ever talks about him.
>Duke was actually a dog original.
kek.
Well they're both animals still.
>They got rid of Ace when Cass join the Batfamily when they could've done an wholesome story about her autistic ass trying to take of him for Alfred.
Isn't Ace a girl?
None of the Ace's are girls.
Taylor please read something other than batfamily fanfics
Seriously. Can we stop pretending that any of these guys aren’t breaking the law? Superheroes get lame as shit doing the whole goody two shoes boy scout thing when they’re fricking vigilantes. They’re taking the law into their own hands by default.
Go to bed Amanda Waller.
>Can we stop pretending
Bat and batfam fans will never stop pretending because the integrity of their faves and their universe depend on it. It's very important for them that their power fantasy have the moral high ground because it's all it has. It doesn't matter if it create an alternative logic where these fighters vigilantes are non-violent, and where disconnect millionaires are praised for acting above the law to enforce what they think is right because it's not one bit fascist. They'd rather diss you out than address a schizophrenic concept destined to stupid american kids.
I don’t really give a shit about any of that. I just want a Batman like BurtonBats where he’s a straight up anti-hero.
This is why I won't read any Batman comics after 1999.
I have no idea who so many of these people are
Alfred Pennyworth
Azrael (John Paul Valley Jr.)
Red Hood (Jason Todd)
Batwoman (Kate Kane)
Flamebird (Bette Kane)
Julia Pennyworth
Batman (Terry McGinnis)
Robin (Damian Wayne)
Batman (Bruce Wayne)
Catwoman (Selina Kyle)
Huntress (Helena Wayne)
Huntress (Helena Bertinelli)
The Signal (Duke Thomas)
Batwing (Luke Fox)
Nightwing (Dick Grayson)
Batgirl (Barbara Gordon)
Orphan (Cassandra Cain)
Bluebird (Harper Row)
Batwing (David Zavimbe)
Gotham (Henry Clover Jr.)
Red Robin (Tim Drake)
Spoiler (Stephanie Brown)
Gotham Girl (Claire Clover)
Clayface (Basil Karlo)
Don't hate him because he's great. He's the perfect sociopath. Best character in the batfam. 10/10.
What ever happened to Gotham Girl?
She had a backup in Tamaki's Detective Comics book, and she cameod in Task Force Z.
What’s her current status quo?
It was more than a cameo, she was vital to the final act of the book.
She got over the death of her brother I guess.
Does Bernard count?
Red: Main BatFamily
Yellow: Sometimes Allies but they work alone
Purple: Only appearing during Events
White: Future
Rest: Doesn't exist
Tim sucks. He’s just a Dick clone. No reason to have him when you already have Dick to begin with. Also, you already have Damian as Robin. There’s no use for Tim.
You could say the same shit about Barbara, Cassandra and Stephanie.
You can’t. OG Tim was almost 1:1 to Pre-Crisis Dick. Dick was every bit the detective that Tim was. An aspect of him that was significantly downplayed to make Tim more special. Adaptations understood this by giving Dick Tim’s suit and weapon. No point in pretending they’re different.
Cassandra has her own niche. Babs and Stephanie are a bit too similar. Could just use Babs as Batgirl, with Cass as her successor. Steph doesn’t work if Tim isn’t around, unless they make Jason the Robin she has the hots for. That and having the Riddler be her dad to elevate her standing in the mythos.
I say make the Bat-Family twice as big.
Batman family pre-new 52
Dick and Bruce are Batman
Tim is Red Robin
Steph is Batgirl
Cass is Black Bat
Barbs is Oracle
Daiman is Robin
Jason is Red Hood with his sidekick Scarlett and a villain
New 52 frick everything up.
>Tim is Red Robin
There has to be a better name.
Flamebird.
Good ass burgers and fries
I think Cinemaphile might be the only place that has proponents for Dick being Robin forever besides a handful of hardcore pre-80's fans. And I suspect it's mostly people who grew up with the TT03 cartoon.
Where Robin was basically Tim in everything but personality
The only correct answer
Cinemaphile hating Damien always amused me. He's probably thee best Robin to date but "muh Bruce shouldn't have biological children"
That's your opinion on him being the best Robin and I simply disagree. Morrison said he intended Damian to be a Batman Jones type character who comes in for one story, turns Batman's world upside down, and then leaves without a trace. He should've stayed dead. He was never intended to be the "evergreen" Robin and DC *still* can't get a handle on his dynamic with Bruce.
Morrison can eat shit. He stole the concept from Kingdom Come
Bruce having biological kids is fine but not with some D-lister like Talia who isn't even one of his popular love interests. Damian's whole origin reads like bad tumblr fanfiction.
Talia’s the daughter of Ra’s Al Ghul. He ain’t D-list. Dude’s in the Top 10.
Especially in continuities where Bruce trains with the League pre-Year One. That’d solidify how important Ra’s and the League are to the character. Would even give a time placement where Damian can be conceived without aging Batman too much.
I never said Ra's. I said Talia. Ra's being in the Top 10 doesn't mean Talia is.
Talia is his daughter, dumbass. Anything to do with her has to do with him. She’s usually a package deal situation when dealing with Ra’s.
moronic opinion.
Talia is the whole reason R'as is as used as he is. He's not the first foreign mastermind villain Batman's ever had. But Talia being Bruce's love interest keeps him relevant. Otherwise he'd be Tzin-Tzin tier.
They're a package deal.
>b-batman begins
Go on long enough talia will appear.
>They're a package deal.
Literally. Anytime Ra’s is in anything Batman-related, Talia is right there with him.
So? Plenty of A-list villains have daughters. That doesn't make them important or popular.
Every Bruce ship is more popular than Bruce X Talia. Catwoman, Zatanna, Wonder Woman, Harley, Ivy...Clark. She isn't as important or popular as you make her out to be.
It keeps everything Batman-centric. Catwoman’s a bad guy, Wonder Woman’s her own thing and Harley is Harley. I like Zatanna but unless you want her to become a Batman character, then she won’t cut it.
Editorial kept everything separated so that it’d be easier to make adaptations from. Shared universes weren’t a thing back then so keeping everything in their own separate brands was necessary to have no overlap.
I'm not saying they are good, I'm saying that they are more popular despite being crack ships. Just because a relationship is canon doesn't mean people will accept that over their fan pairings.
>Zatanna,Wonder Woman, Harley, Ivy
You're a DCAU millennial and your whole point of view is framed by that.
Oldheads don't think of them as legit love interests and younger fans just see it as Bruce Timm's embarrassing Batwank.
Talia is the only one who's never featured in a major cartoon. Are you talking cartoon/normie popularity or comic fan popularity?
She was in BTAS and BatB.
>Talia’s the daughter of Ra’s Al Ghul
And?
And that makes Damian Ra’s grandson.
>Talia who isn't even one of his popular love interests
She was his main love interest from 71 till... 83ish. Basically up till the Nightwing/Jason Todd era.
It all gets ignored in the modern day because they heavily retconned the entire era, but you can't pretend like those books weren't published and weren't popular.
Within the larger picture of Batman mythology, if he's gonna have a kid, it's gonna be Catwoman or Talia. And no way in hell DC would've let it be Catwoman. Talia is hardly D-list, by the way. Fricking Signalman is probably C-list, I don't even know who's on the D-list except maybe the Bouncer or Monarch of Menace or whoever the frick.
>No way in hell it would have been Catwoman
Selina was literally the first one to bear a biological child for Bruce. Helena Wayne aka Huntress
Talia is B list at absolute worst and before Morrisons run she was basically everywhere.
Don't oversell it. Before Morrison the last big Batman/Talia story was Batman: Legacy, and even that was mostly Ra's.
Death and the Maidens was completely self-contained. Talia's time with Luthor and the Society were basically cameos.
Morrison brought her back in a big way.
I otherwise love Morrison's Batman run, but I do not think that making Talia in to Ra's was a good thing since we already have Ra's.
He fricked up the entire al Ghul lore massively by retroactively making it so that Ra's' motivation all along was to have a grandson solely so he could possess his body, and Talia was apparently aware of and okay with this. O'Neil's version is objectively superior and I almost miss his simpler Talia.
>Death and the Maidens was completely self-contained.
The frick does that mean? It was still a massive story and had major repercussions in canon, plus her earlier appearances in Tower of Babel and Rucka's Detective run. Talia also cameod in No Man's Land and was in a little story called HUSH, plus she was in the Secret Society as you say.
Just stop, dude. She was a major character.
Selina was a major character in Hush. Talia was an afterthought. It's like saying Starfire is a major character in Nightwing, it's disingenuous.
>It doesn't count becasue it just doesn't okay
>gets outsold by Spider-GOD
Yup.
There should be two BatFamilies. One for Bruce composed of:
>Bruce as Batman
>Alfred
>Barbara's Oracle
>Damian's Robin
>Cassandra's Batgirl
>Helena's Huntress
And one for Dick:
>Dick as Nightwing
>Tim as some sort of Oracle
>Stephanie as Spoiler
>Kate's Batwoman
Dumb idea.
Well
This is an awful idea.
>Damien was supposed to die and stay dead
So was Jason but here we are. To top it off people VOTED for Jason to die
why did they make ra's look so hot in this book
Killed off Bruce
Make Dick the main Batman and Diaman is Robin
Tim is the new Nightwing
Cass is the new Batwoman
Kill off Kate who cares
Barbs is still Oracle
Steph can just go back to Spoiler cause that original costume is fricking cool
and there ya go.
Who the biggest superhero with barely any supporting cast?
The Spectre
Captain Marvel.
Nightwing.
He has a massively famous supporting cast.
and they all suck
Dude the NTT suck.
too many, you only need alfred, robin, nightwing, batgirl, oracle and maybe huntress. Catwoman shouldn't be classed bat family as she's her own thing. All the wearing kind of batsuits would be better as solo operators just trying to live up to batman's lofty ideals and being tolerated as long as they play by his rules. red hood should also not be bat family and just also doing his own thing only lethal. There's a lot of bloat
I'll tell you who'd I'd cut. The two knockoff Kryptonians, Kate, Bette, Julia, Duke and Harper don't need to exist at all. Helena Wayne and Terry should be limited to stories set in the future.
Luke Fox never needed to become a superhero. There shouldn't have been another Batwing after David Zavimbe gave it up. Jason, Steph and Azrael all should have stayed dead. Clayface should never be part of the Batfamily but I like the idea of him finding redemption.
If they're going to bring Babs out of the chair, then finally make her Batwoman in the main continuity for frick's sake. Don't make her go back to Batgirl when she's like in her late-twenties to early thirties now. Dick and Helena Bertinelli should also be off doing their own thing most of the time.
Red Hood’s too cool to get rid of. Dick and Helena can go back to Spyral.
This is a reminder that the Ric Grayson era lasted longer than both DickBats and Agent 37.
>Red Hood’s too cool to get rid of.
Name three good stories involving him other than Under the Red Hood.
Babs was gonna be Batwoman after Infinite Crisis but editorial changed their minds. They reused the Babswoman design from Alex Ross for Kate. That’s why she had red hair.
>two knockoff Kryptonians
Gotham is dead, Gotham Girl has been ignored since King left
Harper Row might as well be dead too, nobody's used her in like 8 years.
She was in the Punchline back ups of the Joker solo
She's essentially Punchline's personal nemesis, and she's really bad at it.
Which one? harper or gg
Harper.
Sorry, Harper
Bluebird came out of retirement to keep an eye on Punchline during her trial but kept getting out played and her brother nearly joined a cult
So Punchline got off scot free and has a bunch of fans who simp for her now
Gotham Girl was in a backup series in Detective Comics in 2022.
She didn’t appear anywhere in 2023 though.
Where’s Clownhunter, Ghost-Maker, Punchline, Harley, Poison Ivy, and Miracle Molly?
>It's not Batman if he's not in it tier
Bruce
>Should always be around tier
Alfred
>Core family tier
Selina, Damian
>Should exist, in the background, doing their own thing and occasionally showing up tier
Babs, Dick
>Is hot so I tolerate her tier
Helena (loose, 00s versions)
> I don't want to hear from the rest of you again tier
the rest
>Core family tier
>Selina
The last few years have been devoted to proving why that is a terrible idea.
Anon, if bad stories were enough to change people's perspectives on characters, no character would be desired.
But she doesn't have any good stories to prove she should be around either
They can't but the batfamily is pretty much just surviving off of batmans name too.
Batman without any of his sidekicks would be extremely boring. He's carried by them as much as they're carried by him.
Aside from all those blockbuster solo batman movies and popular solo batman comics I'm sure you're right.
There are no Batman movies that don't have any of his supports (Alfred is in all of them).
Anon means crime fighting. Alfred’s the butler. He doesn’t fight alongside Batman.
No he doesn't, he means popularity and Batman by himself is not popular. He needs at least some other characters to be actually entertaining.
Tim and Cass are the superior pairing and I'm tired of pretending it's not
Same with Nightwing and Starfire
Nah, Tim sucks. Pair her with Azrael. He’s cool.
>Same with Nightwing and Starfire
Ewwww no
Have Dick become a heroic take on Owlman and Tim take over as Nightwing
Why do some fans think Tim should become Nightwing instead of creating an identity that's all his own? It dooms Tim to staying stuck in Dick's shadow and fricks Dick out of an identity he's built up for nearly 40 years. Seems like a lose-lose.
Nobody liked Drake, so it's back to square one
Well, there has to be a good name for Tim out there, one that isn't a restaurant or his own fricking last name.
Fruitbat
The answer is so simple. Just make Damian leave the Robin role, and have Tim be the only Robin. My man made Robin into a solo hero name, and he can do it again. Damian go find another name ever since Dick booted Tim out of the mantle after Final Crisis.
Damian is here to stay whether you like it or not. Accept it and move on.
Damian is a more interesting character than Tim.
There isn't a single Tim-as-Robin Batman story from the past 20 years where they couldn't just rework it for Nightwing or Batgirl.
Absolutely pathetic.
That's moronic.
You're now in charge of DC Comics' Bat-Group.
Pitch 5 Batman-related comics. You can pick up to 10 characters from this collage to star in them.
Batman and Detective Comics are mandatory titles, but the rest are up to you.
What do you do?
>Batman:
Focused on Dick being Batman again after Bruce disappeared or whatever, Damian returns as his Robin, Tim is acting like Dick's Oracle/Alfred and Helena joins in the family to support Dick.
>Detective Comics:
Kate Kane, Duke Thomas, Harper Row, Azrael, Julia and Luke as a Team of some sorts
>Batgirls: Babs, Steph and Cass moving to Bludhaven to deal with Poison Ivy and Harley Quinn as they decide to take over the city. Cameos from the Birds of Prey
>Robin: Son of Batman
Focused on Damian as he resumes his role as Robin and how he deals with Bruce's death as well as fixing his relationship with the rest of the family
>Catwoman:
Selina returning to her criminal life after Bruce's death, but she's also looking for any clue for why he disappeared all of the sudden
What the frick is the obsession with making Dick Batman again?
Morrison Era is extremely popular and lauded by Bat-fans as the last time Batbooks were good (true), so everyone thinks killing Bruce off for good is the solution (instead of hiring better editors and writers)
Also Dick was Batman after Knightfall, one of Batman's top 3 most famous story arcs
I like Grayson, and him being Batman is nice. Plus writers don't know how to fricking write Bruce for quite sometime
Lack of creativity.
Frick a line of comics, pitch an event.
Slow burn in Nightwing teasing an evil at the heart of Spyral and the return of Otto Netz. Bring in Flamebird as a supporting character and try to reconcile her time as Bat-Girl with Kathy's big reveal as Agent 0.
Run a storyline in parallel through Birds of Prey that returns the book to its sexy international espionage roots, leaning on Babs' old Task Force X connections, leading to the return of Leviathan.
Both books would lead up to Batman: Ouroboros, the bombastic return of both orgs as the twin snakes forever eating each other's tails and the Batman family leveraging their individual connections across the DCU's covert-ops super-teams to help save the day.
It's a bat-book, but the end goal is to unfrick the private spy agencies after Bendis ruined them, and maybe launch a couple of new titles from it all.
Comics are dead so why even?
Batman
Bruce and Alfred and Damien
Detective Comics
Nightwing with Nightwing and Babs/Oracle
Outsiders:
Signal, Batwing, Cass, Flamebird, Batwoman, Harper, Tim, Steph, Huntress
Outcasts:
Red Hood, Catwoman, Azrael
Batwoman and the Outsiders
Frick outta here. BATMAN and the Outsiders.
>Batman
Dick, Damian, Babs and Cassandra
>Detective Comics
Tim, Stephanie, Luke (not as Batwing, but like Lucius), Bette and Azrael (Michael)
>Outlaws
Jason, Selina, Helena, Azrael (JP)
>Outsiders
Julia, Duke, Helena Wayne from the future, Duke and Basil Karlo
Batman:
Batman, Alfred, Damien, Gordon
Nightwing:
Nightwing, Babs, Clayface
Detective comics: “The day shift” Duke, Gotham Girl, Flamebird, Julia, Spoiler with Harper Row on tech
Outsiders: “the night shift” Batwoman, Cass, Luke, Helena Bertinelli, Tim with Harper Row on tech
Outkasts: Azrael, Red Hood, Catwoman, Helena Wayne
Superman family is better!
World's Finest should at least have a Cass/Kon backup story.
Gross, why?
CassKon will never happen.
It’s was a cute flirtation when they both had ongoings.
But now, they’re already fighting for panel time and they’ve both matured since then anyway.
>Supergirl
>Now an old hag
Shameful.
You're thinking of Power Girl.
Before Jon Kent turned gay supes had like the most kino family. They all just seem like nice people to be around
So what’s changed since Jon became queer for you then?
:
Jace Fox, Selina, Helena Wayne, Talia
:
Malcolm Hutch, Bette, Harper Row, Defacer
:
Michael Lane, Julia Pennyworth, Miracle Molly, Holly Robinson
:
Luke, Barbara, Kate, Huntress Bertinelli
Comics:
Duke, Cass, Steph, Gotham Girl, Maps
Too many family members for one franchise.
Does Bruce know all of these guys?
Best member of the senpai, is also their only teen MILF
Nightwing Red
Bump
Kys
I can think of several ways to get rid of all this bat-bloat but they just have to keep bringing back legacy characters for no reason. This is like tossing in Debrah Whitman and Earworm in the next spider-man movie
>who?
Exactly. Nobody cares but they'd make a cameo. Why? Just because
Kinda sad they never made Creeper a full fledged member, he had potential
Creeper has nothing to do with Batman. Why take a solid stand-alone IP and tie him to the most overrated character in superhero comics?
They already did it with the Outsiders, Zatanna, etc.
Because he only knows him from the DCAU . Many such cases
Actually anon, I was introduced to him via the DCAU yes, but I loved his Len Kaminski and Steve Niles runs. At the very least, I feel like a connection of sorts to the Batfamily would lend well to getting him exposure and his psychological/body horror schtick in those runs cements him pretty well as a Gotham character who fits within the Batman radar. I also like how those runs portrayed him as one of Batman's first metahuman encounters as well as showed Batman's rogues more afraid of him than Batman.
They can't. Batman has everything going for him both good and bad. Other franchises seem awkward when they branch out with new characters cause they either seem unnecessary (when not having the same skillset/powers) or redundant (when they do have the same powers/skillset). Also Batman has none of the legal issues other superheroes have like how DC lost the rights to Clark as Superboy thus killing the Legion of Superheroes and necessitating a need for a reboot. My guy here is lucky to even be included in anything with Batman cause otherwise DC and "DC fans" wants to kill him or make him retire.
everyone in Gotham- every fricking citizen- is either a superhero or villain
Not Bernard
who's that?
Tim's boyfriend.
Kys
Bernard is a supervillain with mind control powers who turned Tim homosexual and raped him.
Was Jezebel arm candy only or did she fight some crime ala plainclothes?
She had a daughter with Blockbuster.
With both of them dead now, Nightwing is her care taker.
Dick shunted her off to Themyscira.
I will only keep Batman and Red Hood. The rest can be thrown away.
Why do you people act like they are stepping on each other's toes? I don't really see what's the issue of their numbers.
Everyone wants to change the formula, and that usually includes getting rid of characters they don't like/care much for.
Honestly, Batman having so many characters is one of the reasons why I perfer him over other heroes. I'm someone who usually performs having a big cast in stories.
>performs
*perfer
Because most of them are redundant. They don’t add anything with the exception of a small few. Less is more.
They aren’t stepping on each other's toes because Dick is the only one who gets the spotlight.
This is more the result of DC's incompetent and fanbyism getting in the way than an issue of having many characters
You're like a Miles or Bengay complaining that Peter takes up too much of the spotlight.
because when you stop to think about it it fricks everything up. Bruce watches his parents' murders at age 8. He trains for years and becomes Batman at age 24. Let's say Dick started being Batman's sidekick at 12 years old. And then Barbara started a few years later at 16. Dick quits once he reaches college age and Jason starts at 12. Jason dies Barb gets crippled and after a few more years Tim joins at 12 or 13 and is Robin for many years. Jason returns and is in his 20's. Cassandra and Stephanie come in. Stephanie dies. Cassandra fricks off. Damian is now revealed because Batman had his seed stolen by Talia. He's 10.
So how old is Batman at this point? In his 40's when Damian? Am I to assume he's on a steady supply of Lazarus Pool water?
Batman’s 35 always. Big characters don’t age while the lesser ones do. Batman and Superman are much too iconic to be altered significantly in such fashion.
I love the Bat family!
family
Steph’s breasts keeping this thread alive
Steph starred in the only good part of the current shitty animal event.
Stephs story wasn't even the best story in that one-shot, let alone the entire event.
Dick > Bruce > Alfred > Jason > Tim > Barbara = Terry > Damien >>>>>>>>>>>> the rest > the non-white ones
I don’t count catwoman or huntress but I guess they’d both be right around Jason
Where the hell is Man-Bat? He actually had a running feature in the old Batman Family comic.
They shouldn't, and DC should cut this Bat family crap out already. I don'y even know who the jackass im between Batwing and Tim is.