>With all possible respect to my friend Tim Seely, my former mentor Marv Wolfman, Devin Grayson, Geoff Johns and others, I find Dick Grayson to be the most boring Wonder Bread boilerplate character ever to pull on spandex. That’s just me. Tens of thousands of fans are *rabid* Dick Grayson fans. For the life of me, I couldn’t explain why. Grayson, in his various iterations, seems, to me, the ultimate expression of what I’m being harangued about around the web: the flattened-out character whose dealt with all of his shortcomings and character flaws. I see Grayson and I wonder, “And now what?”
Yes.
Yes, and since he's popular, he's going to get a book no matter what. Dick Grayson, agent of Spyral is the best direction he had in years. If they were smart, they'd use Dick as an entry point for more spycraft stuff in the greater DCU. You could even combine his secret agent shtick with Barbara's Oracle/Birds of Prey gig and make them the dedicated globetrotting spy couple/book. Could easily work it in with that lazy Leviathan event Bendis put out and have the landscape of espionage in shambles and international relations getting frayed in its wake, and Dick and Babs get involved due to either some old Oracle contact or one of Dick's old Spyral buddies.
I miss Tiger so fricking much.
Dick Grayson is a Gary Stu. Lacks any real flaws, is young and handsome with women who throw themselves at him. Treated as essentially Batman without the emotional damage (so Flawless Batman) and the best leader around. Recently he was the guy who saved everything from a multiversal threat that was basically Crisis x20 because he's so good, pure, wholesome, and awesome that he's the true hero reality needed.
So yes.
Dick doesn't have or need flaws.
The problem I had with Nightwing when I was a kid was just like he was “we have Batman at home”. Like if he’s in Gotham what can he do that Batman can’t? And do it better? Taking him from the Titans-books and giving him to the Bat-books was a huge mistake, he should’ve stayed with the Titans franchise and been a mentor to new generations of heroes instead of store-brand Batman.
>he should’ve stayed with the Titans franchise
Titans is a fricking shit garbage franchise though.
That happened becuase the titans books stopped selling and batman books sold like hotcakes.
>Like if he’s in Gotham what can he do that Batman can’t?
Usually he's in Blüdhaven tho.
Didn't it get nuked?
It's been un-nuked for like 8 years anon
New 52 un-nuked it.
Bludhaven’s Great Value Gotham.
I mean I feel like he's also equally useless on the titans.
>he should’ve stayed with the Titans franchise and been a mentor to new generations of heroes instead of store-brand Batman.
Dick Grayson staying with the Titans long after their expiration date is the reason why he's in such an awful state today
>Taking him from the Titans-books and giving him to the Bat-books was a huge mistake, he should’ve stayed with the Titans franchise and been a mentor to new generations of heroes instead of store-brand Batman.
True
Turning the Titans into a generational team ruined the franchise for 20 years. The Titans aren't the X-Men.
I fail to see why anyone would think this.
The Titans failing to do anything after he left kind of proved he was right to leave. The Bat office saved his character if anything.
>The Bat office saved his character if anything.
Nah, it was far too late going by the Chuck Dixon run. Batman was at its peak during the late 80s when Alan Grant and other younger writers like Morrison were taking shots at him.
Sure, it wasn't the peak of the late 80s or even early 90s, but it was far better than whatever mess the Titans had going for them then. That entire era of Titans history is just ignored now it was so bad.
>Sure, it wasn't the peak of the late 80s or even early 90s, but it was far better than whatever mess the Titans had going for them then.
I know and it still makes me upset. You don't give a character like that to some boomer writing for his next check, you give it to some writer who is young and hungry and wants to leave his mark, like how Jamie Delano and Neil Gaiman did for Hellblazer and Sandman after they were denied Swamp Thing.
It used to get referenced. The last major callback was in Blackest Night.
You need to remember that all of Titans history was wiped with the New 52, and only just came back with Infinite Frontier. Give it time.
And Titans Hunt was fun.
No, Priest is one of the most "not muh" writers out there whose totally unable to get why people like stuff that doesnt fit his paradigm and who doesnt have what he considers "fitting traits" (which is why he only really excels at writing fundamentally fricked up people) or relying on cheap drama. Dick has flaws, and he has conflict, sure some are fairly repetitive but its not that different from how bruce's or clark's are consitently.
Also the "with all due respect" thing is off coming from him, this is the man that tanked his biggest friendship over a silly comic book thing.
>Dick has flaws
Such as?
Hot headed, doesn’t take a measured approach as often as Batman (his compassion gets him mistaken for being the “calm” one). Huge show off, bites him in the ass. Afraid of commitment so everyone can ship him with girlfriend of the year. Has a lot of Batman’s talents but has never really been shown as having his foresight.
He's also a complete and utter c**t when pissed off or challenged to the point of wrecking relationships.
The whole "Dick is a ladies' man" thing weirds me out because if you actually read the comics he's in he's had two major long term love interests and damn near every other one comes in the form of a monogamous relationship.
Ladies' man doesn't necessarily mean philanderer or bawd. He's hot and nice to women in universe, which is all that's really required. His overall reputation with women is a bit of a meme though, yes.
Sure, but we're still talking about a guy with a romance/sex life people would find normal for his age being equated with an alt version who has slept with every woman he knows and they love him for it.
>Hod headed
Only when the "cool-headed ones" Bruce, Babs or Tim are around. It's not something he is reproached to be on regular.
>Show off
It's a trait but it doesn't bite him that much in the ass. DC portray him as modest more often than not too.
> afraid of commitment
The result of being write by different writers more than an actual thing explored in the narrative. Taylor goes completely against that atm.
> no foresight
I guess.
Have you never read team books with Dick? He's a hotheaded douchebag there.
Dixon and the other batwriters kept him as one during the mid 90s cause they brought back the daddy issues that Wolfman resolved by the mid 80s. But by the late 90s, after they re-resolved his daddy issues and expanded of the batfamily, Dick got stripped of a lot of his traits. His intelligence went to Tim and Babs and he stopped being so hotheaded to bounce off of Helena.
>Have you never read team books with Dick?
No and I'm not missing much.
> Dick got stripped of a lot of his traits by the late 90s
Yes, it' called flanderizaton and Dick isn't the worst example of it in Batman. Glad to know we agree that the few "traits" he had isn't there anymore, though...
Post Dicks being dicks!
The Wayne Family Adventures crowd thinking he's not a manipulative butthole will just make it so much funnier the next time he pulls some unnecessary manipulative shit on his friends and family.
>Gets Vic a clone body
>Nothing for the cripple redhead
kek
Flaws don’t have to be omnipresent character ticks that exist to drag a character down like some DnD role play mechanic. The point is he is not perfect all the time, but he is very likable most of the time and that’s why he has so many fans but still has potential for storytelling.
Flaws determine your character role/dynamics with others or their struggles in certain scenarios. Flaws can play a minor role, but they're omnipresent. Otherwise you just got a bland tool that can easily be replaced or isn't needed to begin with.
> flaws that drag a character down
You're a moron if you believe this. Anyway, my point was everything said or listed hasn't be used in decades and is merely informed attributes, at best.
You’re describing Jason.
You're gonna wanna sit down for this anon but Dick was those things before Jason came back. Hell some traits Dick had before Jason was changed by COIE and Starlin.
Pre-Crisis Jason was a Dick clone, origin and all. And now because of all the Robins, they’ve had to spread certain traits amongst them to have every one of them matter.
Read a comic published before 2011.
Too hard-headed. Too many gays
>Not Muh
Just admit you hate black people anon.
>tanked his biggest friendship over a silly comic book thing
Care to explain?
Nah. And priests a gay
I like him because Damian Wayne is a better Robin, but he needs an older brother character like Dick around to help him adjust to life as a non brainwashed assassin psychopath. Plus, I want to see him in a polygamous relationship with Babs, Starfire, and Zatanna.
>Zatanna
???
young justice and it's repercussions.
Worse is when people think he's been with Harley because of that godawful Timm movie.
Nah, that one's based as hell. Easily the best part of that movie.
What exactly is the problem with that? Expecially given harley's push to mega giga turbo slootland?
Zatanna is Bruce’s age, dude.
Yes and no.
Nightwing has potential but is often milquetoast in a way. I think his potential comes as "what if batman had the temperament of superman?" In many ways, he's the inverse of Batman - he maintains friendships, relationships, is generally optimistic - but those key traits don't always make for conflict, which is what drives stories. He doesn't have much of an inner struggle that drives his stories. He just kind of wants to do good.
It also doesn’t work when we do have a Batman with Superman’s temperament. Batman 66, The Batman and BatB portrayed a Batman just like that.
He's completely right yes.
Priest posted this after Nightwing and Titans fans slammed his awful Titans story. The one where he had Damian punch Wally and stop his heart and Dick was just yelling at people not knowing what to do.
That Rebirth Titans/Teen Titans crossover with Slade "Pedo" Deathstroke? Sometimes I think it was that exact moment Rebirth as a concept went to shit.
I still don't understand why Dick was portrayed as wrong for training rose in exchange for Slade not attacking and killing him and his friends.
>Rose gets to get taught by a hero so Slade isn't her only influence
>Slade doesn't attack and kill a bunch of teenagers
Damian is even wrong that Slade was getting in their business over it yet the story portrayed him as right.
He's right. I'm kind of surprised Nightwing threads get so many replies given how vapid the character and his stories are.
I guess women do read comics here.
I like the idea of Nightwing.
A student of a famed hero who forged his own path and identity instead of mooching of his predecessor (hello, Miles Morales) and who has a vastly different personality.
I just wish his comics were better. Nothing I actually read with him was all that compelling.
>I just wish his comics were better. Nothing I actually read with him was all that compelling.
It's been like that since 1995...
Does any character get beaten up more than Nightwing?
Later in that quote Priest said he would have Dick resent Bruce and have Dick look at his time as Robin as abuse.
Better than Dick being an enabler and rolling over whenever Bruce treats him like shit
How is having Dick's closest bond in the DCU being looked at as abuse? That is Frank Miller stuff. Just go read his take on Robin if you want that.
Its a broader issues with capes, some characters simply need to exist even if nobody truly wants to do anything with them. You only ever hear about Nightwing when something incredibly dumb happening. But Dick is too iconic to scrap, and Nightwing is at least a name people recognise. So in some form he will be about, somehow having fans but not saying more than hey remember that time he was killed by a tiny rock?
The problem with Dick is that he used to be the angry/edgy one, and Jason has completely stolen that from him, so now he's just 'the nice one.' This also goes along with a general flattening of every Bat-family character into a bland, 'safe' version that can appeal to the crowd that likes Wayne Family Adventures.
People forget that Dick is the one who's come the closest to actually killing the Joker- actually stopped his heart for a minute, even. But we're never gonna see a scene like that with him again, at least not while Tom Taylor is writing him.
Tom Taylor gets way too much hate. Taylor isn't flattening Nightwing, he's doing a back-to-basics run, a reset after the god-awful Ric Grayson era. Leaping into the Light gave Nightwing an evergreen status quo, he just needs to wrap it up and stop padding the run with this Tony Zucco shit.
>Taylor isn't flattening Nightwing,
He is, but he isn't the first. He's however the first doing a cohesive recap of Nightwing books, starring this flat and flanderized Dick, and without suffering any major interruption. His run has good chances to become the "definitive edition" of what and who Nightwing is.
Seeley's run was a cohesive recap. He covered every major story and villain that he was allowed to touch within the fricked up continuity of the New 52/Rebirth era. Taylor has full access to everything ever published, but decided to do a Dixon/McDaniel Bludhaven and Wolfman/Perez NTT nostalgia run instead.
>His run has good chances to become the "definitive edition" of what and who Nightwing is.
Quite literally zero chance of this happen.
>Tom Taylor gets way too much hate. Taylor isn't flattening Nightwing, he's doing a back-to-basics run, a reset after the god-awful Ric Grayson era.
The only reason people hype him up is because he came not too long after that awful Ric Run. Without his revolving door of Latino writers, nobody would even look in his direction.
*Latino artists
>we're never gonna see a scene like that with him again,
It's no a big loss conscidering that storyline got utterly moronic, and overall just showcase a lot of the issues people have with the comics.
> Dick has a mental break down because he's a murderer now and Bruce goes out if his way to resurrects a serial killer
Yes and no. If you were talking specifically about the post-Fashpoint Nightwing when Priest said this then absolutely. The status quo shifts in the Batman Family in the Nu52 unintentionally resolved all of Dick's intrafamilial hang-ups. Batman and Nightwing suddenly had the strongest relationship in the batfam. Tim was gone. Jason was now a "good" guy. Bruce was wrangling Damian. Babs was the amiable ex. Dick had no real family problems beyond the villain of the week. The character flaws that would normally appear when Dick was running a team and hanging with his friends all disappeared because the New 52 wiped it from continuity.
Imagine Marvel did a reboot and said the All New All Different X-Men never existed. Then they put X-23 or Daken in Wolverine's place in the new X-Men title, saying they were the original Wolverine in the book, and giving Sabretooth his own series where he and Wolverine can't interact as per editorial mandate. Sounds stupid, right? Sounds like it'd hurt a popular character unnecessarily?
Yes Priest was right. Of course he was right.
Jason’s a better and more interesting character anyway. Adaptations should just skip Dick and have him be the first Robin, but still the one who fails. Damian’s the second chance, even if Bruce doesn’t want it.
Jason started as a dick clone, then had a stint as a villain after being dead for 20 years and then became a dick clone again.
Yeah, but Nightwing’s pretty lame. Jason’s got the cooler gimmick.
Jason is fricked. He has no direction and can't use guns anymore because liberal writers don't want to make gun use cool anymore.
Dude, that’s bullshit. Guns are still used in fiction.
they literally got rid of his guns.
Fricking LAME. Frick the comics. The whole medium’s for pansies.
Not really, at most they just made him use rubber bullets.
Again, LAME.
It's mainly cause they don't want Jason to be a murder hobo anymore.
So they turned him into some gay superhero? Frick out of here. Let him do cool vigilante shit away from the fruity superhero shit.
Correction: Jason has the best single adaptable story
There's a reason why everybody just wants Under the Red Hood for the millionth time instead of any other Jason story
So what would it take to have a good adaptable story for Dick or Jason? For Tim it could just be him using poppers for the first time.
The problem is Robin's role as a sidekick. Comic fans may love these characters, but you need to justify their existence in a movie adaptation. Under the Red Hood does this by making Jason the villain. You get Bruce's guilt over Jason and Batman's conflict with Red Hood plus Joker in the middle of it all. It's perfect. To find something like that for the others you need a story that puts the relationship between Batman and Robin or Bruce and Dick at the forefront.
These are only stories that really work:
>The murder of Dick's parents and the origin of Robin.
>A modified version of the Court of Owls, complete with the Haly's Circus subplot.
>Batman & Son/RIP/Batman Reborn, with Nightwing filling both Dick and Tim's roles like the DCAMU did.
>For Tim it could just be him using poppers for the first time.
jej
>then became a dick clone again.
A lot of Jason fans hate it, so I guess being Dick sucks.
Jason fans cant agree on anything, he's the least consistent bat character at least tim and damian just repeat the same 2 plots over and over, but jason is genuinely a different character every era.
They all agree that Winick’s Jason is what they need. Meanwhile, Dick fans are still uncertain about Dick’s real problem.
The problem is a lack of Dickdickery.
My favorite version of Nightwing is the version who resents Batman for being non-stop manipulative but doesn't have the self-awareness to realize he's doing it to other people because it was normalized for him for his entire life. Hurt people hurt people.
And that this was the sort of "fatherly advice" that Bruce would give Dick.
In my opinion Jason should be one of those guys who fricks off for a while and shows up again when things get hot so that his appearances are really special. He’s too violent and kill happy to have be a part of the main squad all the time but when you make just shoot rubber bullets or tazers or whatever his whole schtick becomes lame. At the very least do what Outlaws tried to do and get him the frick away from the “family.”
>He’s too violent and kill happy
Hasn't been the case for many years, just because he's relatively violent and willing to kill, doesn't mean he goes around killing every goon he finds on the street.
Jason SHOULD kill, but also with good judgement and reasoning, otherwise, he's just a straight up villain again.
>otherwise, he's just a straight up villain again.
Unironically I would prefer this to whatever the frick they've been trying to do with him since the New 52.
Sort of. Hating a character who has dealt with all of his shortcomings and character flaws is really no worse and no better than a character who can't get over his shortcomings and character flaws and never seems to learn anything, like how Spider-man is artificially kept a manchild.
>on Cinemaphile
>claims not to like dick
>doubt
Comic book characters are suppose to be static since the main thrust should always been some criminal plot or wacky shenanigans
As soon as they added in “character arcs” in cape comics they failed
Completely agree but the “creatives” they hire think that’s “milquetoast”
The “creatives” they hired are failed Hollywood writers
Also coming up with “original” plots for every issue is harder than just dealing with a character “finding themselves”
I agree
As a dumb child, I was under the impression that Dick and Jason are rivals because one is blue and the other is red. Maybe if this dynamic was actually true, it could be beneficial to both characters?
They kinda were in the mid to late 00s in Nightwing One Year Later and during Dickbats
They were meta wise in new 52 due to DC giving a lot of Dick's shit to Jason
>Nightwing's rival is a dumb, crazy and pathetic redhead stepchild that pose no threat and need help from Robin to escape prison when any thugs can do it alone
Fitting, I guess.
The problem with Nightwing is that they never truly developed Bludhaven and the villains within so he always has to run back to Gotham for relevant events
This is true but we’ll need to dig a tad deeper to get to the reason for this problem, which is a major problem in general. People don’t understand what cities were like when they were crime-ridden anymore. And they feel like making them crime-ridden is racist or classist.
So they quite literally cannot make bludhaven , or more relevant cities like Hub or Gotham, look like shit holes because then they’d be engaging in the idea that social services don’t lower crime only policing does.
So to TLDR it, the progressives they have writing cape shit are some of the most ill suited people in the world to be writing them.
One of Hub City's problems is a complete lack of social services. Though you're off-base with the politics. Taylor's run is a love letter to gentrification and "great man" mentality. Dick's an out of touch billionaire who bought up a bunch of property so he could save the proles from their own incapability and pretend he's just a regular guy. An actual progressive writer would eviscerate Taylor's run.
Raptor was right.
No he wasn’t. Why do these writers think that if these buttholes got money, they’d stop stealing, killing and raping? Bad people exist and there are a lot of them. That bleeding heart shit just makes it easier for them to get fricked up by these guys.
That homie ain’t stealing the PS5 to feed his family, he’s stealing it to play 2K on it. What about the motherfrickers selling heroin to kids? Meth? They ain’t doing that because they’re impoverished, but because they want that spending money.
What about gangs? They kill each other all the time. Even little kids. One gang leader killed a rival gang leader’s 5 year old son just to get back at him. Killing kids isn’t off-limits to these creeps.
What? I mean right about the dialogue in the image I posted. All the so-called "progressive" work Dick is doing in the Taylor run is straight out of the Bush Jr. playbook of compassionate conservatism.
That'd be a step up because it would come with a pro-business, pro-employment agenda. Dick is really just slapping on a coat of paint and parking some food trucks.
>Dick is really just slapping on a coat of paint and parking some food trucks.
The most foolish part is that Dick is pumping money into the most corrupt city in DC and we're supposed to accept that at face value it's saving Bludhaven when in reality every level of the government would be waiting in line to take their piece before it finally reaches the people in need.
Throwing money at the problem rarely ever fixes the problem.
Reminds me of the time the US government pumped millions and millions of dollars into IRL Bludhaven's education system.
https://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/at-13-baltimore-city-high-schools-zero-students-tested-proficient-on-2023-state-math-exam
No, because he's not doing it through government grants, he's buying up massive amounts of land from the city and building "public" spaces on them.
Forgot my image. He's a rich guy doing rich guy things, and he's getting away with it because nobody cares about Bludhaven.
I wonder how subsequent writers will address Dick having a sister now.
Ignore it like the Spider-Man writers do and wait for the next retcon punch to wipe it from continuity.
I think they're just going to retcon it so she was never related to begin with.
Make her Zucco's real daughter so she can join Sonia and Brian in the ranks of forgotten Zucco children.
And then Melinda and her lesbian bodyguard rape Dick while Babs is forced to watch.
>Babs
>forced to watch
She's gonna be ringside holding a sign that says "KWAB!"
>*puts a blanket over him* "I won't think less of you after your not-sister raped your mouth, Dick."
>"T-thanks Babs..."
>"Just like that sweltering summer, right? The summer of 1992?"
>"This is not the time..."
Anon, Babs has perfect memory. Not only would she know about the sweltering summer of 1992, but also the red hot summer of 1993, and the scorching summer of 2004.
>Anon, Babs has perfect memory.
Yeah, which is why she gets off on the power of wielding Dick's rape PTSD.
>but also the red hot summer of 1993
W-what happened to Dick in the Summer of '93?
Demon Raven.
Holy shit I forget the Titans went on that long. How cursed.
New Titans ran till 1996. Trigon Seed, Technis, etc. Everyone forgets that era. Arsenal, Kyle Rayner GL, Darkstar Donna, Matrix Supergirl, etc.
They'll probably just ignore it.
They’ll ignore it. She has no discernible personality and hasn’t even had a groundbreaking emotional moment with Dick yet. And plot wise she’s added nothing and later writers will probably even get rid of her as mayor in favor of their own OCs.
She's prime murder material. Some writer 5-10 years from now will probably bring her back from limbo to kill her off to have an "important" death.
So.... what happened to all of the criminals after Dick buys the prison?
this is tom taylor writing
tom taylor writes like left liberal from australia
I have no clue as to how people like this character, so yes, I agree. He was only good as Robin.
If I was adapting Batman, I’d just skip Dick and go straight to Jason. He’d be the first Robin.
If I were to skip anyone it'd be Tim.
Dick doesn’t serve a purpose that Jason can’t fulfill. I don’t care for Nightwing or his relationship with Superman. This is a Batman-only thing. Plus, having the very first Robin get killed by the Joker hits harder.
>Dick doesn’t serve a purpose that Jason can’t fulfill.
He's meant to be success story, literally the opposite of Jason.
no wonder the gremlins on Cinemaphile don't get him
So, swap order than
Jason, and then Dick
I'm not the biggest fan of Taylor's writing, but Dick's character is so much better off than basically all DC characters but like 4 probably.
Why are Jason fans obsessed with Dick?
Inferiority complex.
There are a lot of bad things Dick fans did to Jason.
Other way around, fella. It's Dick fans are pretty obsessed with and always feel the need to state their opinions about what Jason should be like.
If anything, it does feel that a lot of Jason fans have giving up on DC and no longer care about comics. So, I highly doubt that they would concern themselves with what Dick is doing.
Comics suck. I just want a Red Hood movie or show.
I think most of them never cared about comics to begin with and the few who did, DC have successfully managed to drive them away.
And if we are being honest here, many people don't seem to care about comics in general these days. Remember how FLASH used to be DC's second best selling book?
I remember when Jason made his appearance in I3 and some people were actually interested in reading his comics, but they were told not to bother. It's amazing how badly DC failed in attracting this potential audience. You can even argue that he is the most popular batboy outside the comic community.
Because he’s cool as frick. People fricking love anti-heroes. He’s got a great look and probably could do pretty well on his own in terms of film and tv.
Man, I miss the helmet.
Fangirls like that shit.
Turning Bludhaven into Atlantic City instead of Baltimore or Philadelphia was a mistake. AC is fricking soulless.
It makes perfect sense though, considering that it's right next to Gotham.
Dick is just a younger Hal Jordan.
Sapphire Twilight any day now boys.
Dick is meant to be THE PERFECT HUMAN BEING. THE CHOSEN ONE.
Dick has seen all the evil, all the suffering and still be PERFECT
that is why he also must be hot, pretty the best
and there is big difference
Hal never had suffering like Dick(gotham,parents,single child,alone,dealing with bruce)
Hal got superpowers and EASY MODE
Dick never got superpowers and is on HARD MODE
>Hal never had suffering like Dick(gotham,parents,single child,alone,dealing with bruce)
The frick you talking about, Hal's life is nonstop suffering until the final villain is defeated.
>Grayson, in his various iterations, seems, to me, the ultimate expression of what I’m being harangued about around the web: the flattened-out character whose dealt with all of his shortcomings and character flaws.
Yeah, but this is kind of the point, though. If there's going to be ONE "perfect" character in comics (and I don't even know if I would go that far in describing Dick), it makes sense for it to be the first Robin.
Because people misunderstood the character, he’s not Batman Spider-Man he’s Cyclops
He hasn’t been Cyclops for like 30 years
Unironically the best pitch I've heard for a modern Titans franchise was copying the 2019 Hickman X-Men book with Nightwing as Cyclops.
He was an original sidekick as Robin, then he kind of transformed into Cyclops when he became a teen/young adult, then became Daredevil when he went solo as Nightwing, and is now probably more Spider-man with shades of Daredevil.
>I met him last year and I asked him about Nightwing. He said he pitched a run where he was going to fix Dick Grayson but Jamie S. Rich rejected it. I asked him about it and he said he was going to give him his own Ra's al Ghul but instead of Lazarus pits he would have nanobots to keep him young and help him fight and he would control Dick's life from the shadows all throughout the run, he'd reveal that he had illegitimate children from past flings and he would reveal that his parents were assassins and the circus traveled all across so they could reach their targets and the target in Gotham was Bruce Wayne. He said he'd have him create his own team of characters like Steel, Triumph, Raptor, Vixen and Power Girl(Tanya) and he would have him get romantically involved with Vixen, he said that was one of the flaws he wanted to exploit when writing Dick that a good looking guy like that would just get bored of the same girl so he'd cheat and stuff and the bastard children plot would build toward it and how he would be forced to grow up and mature. He also said he wanted to write a story similar to one Mark Waid wrote about how Batman had plans to take out the Justice League if they were to turn evil. He said he'd want to do a Nightwing vs Batman arc similar to how he did on Deathstroke and he said he would like to create a new home city for Dick instead of Gotham. He was really mad his pitch got rejected and said that if DC doesn't want him to fix Dick Grayson then he isn't going to beg.
Do you guys think Priest's alleged pitch would've helped Dick even though this is definitely some anon's fanfiction?
A five volume collection of Dick having sex with Vixen in various parts of the world would have unironically saved the character.
Maybe near the start of the New 52 this would have worked where Dick's a lot more lost and directionless. Now with his history back it feels like he has matured more now. The Vixen thing would have been hot though.
>He said he'd have him create his own team of characters like Steel, Triumph, Raptor, Vixen and Power Girl(Tanya) and he would have him get romantically involved with Vixen
Babsbros…
She's too white and straight for that team
WMWW relationships are boring. WMBW are better.
Dick/Vixen will save Dick and Babs' struggling relationship.
Who is even Vixen's normal love interests? Does she have any? All I know is her and John Stewart from the JLU cartoon.
Back during the Justice League Detroit days she and Zatanna fought over a middle aged black guy.
Bronze Tiger
I think she is dating or hooking up with Luke Fox? I remember there was some issue of them together a few months back.
Ostrander put her and Bronze Tiger together in the Suicide Squad. Modern comics have her dating Luke Fox out of nowhere.
>Modern comics have her dating Luke Fox out of nowhere
Because he's black.
>Steel, Triumph, Raptor, Vixen and Power Girl(Tanya)
Black people are the worst. Jamie is a homosexual though no way he’d have rejected this. He loves all this gay, woke shit.
Nah, Vixen is sexo.
rent free
The only things that pitch would've helped are the reputations of Devin Grayson's run and the Ric saga because those would no longer be considered the worst Nightwing runs.
>Priest not reading the Court of Owls and not knowing Haly's circus is already a circus full of assassins
>Nightwing vs Batman in a preptime vs preptime bat-bowl
>Steel, Raptor, and Tanya out of nowhere
I believe it
>Priest pushing Triumph
>Priest not knowing Bludhaven exists
LOL no.
>the flattened-out character whose dealt with all of his shortcomings and character flaws.
>I see Grayson and I wonder, “And now what?”
That's your job as the writer, Christopher. You've got a well-adjusted character, now you have to give him a challenge to overcome.
I take it Priest has never written Superman either?
He's writing a noncanon Superman mini right now where he's dealing with ptsd of course.
Shit taste. Superman: Lost is great.
He’s writing that awful 12 parter, Lost. It’s awful.
He's writing a Superman mini right now where Superman is cheating on Lois with a blackcoded alien
Absolutely.
And remember, his is currently the face of DC's current era.
>boringwing is the face of Yawn of DC
Pretty fitting if you ask me.
Dawn of DC is somehow worse than Infinite Frontier
>this is the DAWN of DC
>btw here's Dick leading a team that hasn't been good since 1986
>I find Dick Grayson to be the most boring Wonder Bread boilerplate character ever to pull on spandex. That’s just me. Tens of thousands of fans are *rabid* Dick Grayson fans
Pretty based and true. I frankly don't understand the appeal of this character besides being a self-insert.
One anon said this about him and I think it's pretty accurate.
>Dick's problem is that a lot of his fans care more about his status than having a good story. They act more like his agent who wants to see success through him than simply enjoying him (I legit saw some commenting that they don't like Taylor's run, but they are cool with it as long as it makes him more popular). DC knows that which is why they keep delivering lib services about "how important he is" which anyone with enough sense knows that it would lead to nothing because he is really not that important and will never escape Batman's shadow.
Didio was running around telling everyone how unimportant Dick Grayson was, carving off parts of him to give to the legacy Robins.
Well, he isn't wrong. You can rid of Dick and nothing of value would be lost. Batman already saw a lot of success in media already without him.
This wasn't saying Batman is a stand-alone hero, this was saying Dick Grayson didn't matter as long as there was a Robin who could be in the batcave with Batman and Alfred, or in Titans Tower with Raven and Beast Boy.
That's actually not wrong either, to be honest.
It's a bad take and Didio deserved the backlash he got for it
>Was Priest right
Yes, always.
Eh the problem with Dick is he has no great solo stories. People are like he's the DC Daredevil and I'm like okay then where is his 'Born Again'? Everything great about Nightwing hangs on other characters either Batman or the Titans. Dude needs some serious me time away from the same 10 characters to see who the frick he is. Maybe throw his ass into the Wildstorm universe for a few years to put some hair on his chest.
>Everything great about Nightwing hangs on other characters either Batman or the Titans
They are the only interesting parts about him. There's a reason why his solo books are boring because he isn't interesting in his own.
That's such a stupid complaint. How long would you read a Joker or Catwoman book if you knew Batman would never ever show up. How long would you read a Cyclops or Storm series if they weren't allowed to use the X-Men?
Then, shouldn't have a book of his own to begin if he is incapable of building his own cast away from Batman and maybe should be back to being a supporting character like he is meant to.
Joker actually had a successful movie without Batman and his latest book didn't even have Batman showing up. Never mind the fact that he has his own anime coming soon. This is really not a good comparison.
>Maybe throw his ass into the Wildstorm universe
Jim Lee threw the Wildstorm universe into DC and won't shut up about it.
>Dude needs some serious me time away from the same 10 characters to see who the frick he is
You're basically asking for another Higgins or Ric Grayson run.
>he has no great solo stories.
And that won't change. This is the natural result of when "this secondary character is popular enough to get a spin-off" is purely motivated by corporate interest or a market, rather than a creative desire to brush or expand on something the main serie couldn't. Being popular enough to "support" a forever on-going adds another level of creative bankrupcy to it.
The problems are general to capeshit but Nightwing is a perfect example of that. It's about the only thing that make him worth talking about too.
Priest was just seething because people shat on his shitty Deathstroke/Titans crossover.
Seething or not, he isn't wrong. Nightwing is a boring character with some rapid fans