That's like saying Gargamel doesn't like Smurfs. He must've had one before
I always just assumed he thought they tasted good after reading about it in a cookbook and after countless failures he continues out of spite
I never understood the "turtle soup" reference as a kid, but apparently it was so popular back in the day that large turtles like sea turtles and alligator snappers were being hunted so aggressively they would have gone extinct had they not gained endangered species protections. Campbell's was canning turtle soup as late as the 1950s, and Heinz kept canning until 1970, only a few years before the Endangered Species Act. Shredder is a villain AND Japanese, so you know he has to be all about eating endangered aquatic life.
He's used like the introductory villain to the turtles but he's by far the most intimidating but also the weakest and least ambitious. I think he fits the turtles in conflict better that laser blasting triceratops' or sentient brains in robot bodies. But in terms of an ongoing story I don't know where you go from there. Shredder and their conflict grounds mutant turtles learning ninjutsu from a rat in the sewers in some way. Dimension X, space travel, mutant cities, I don't know, feels silly in comparison. But this always comes after the Shredder conflict. It's deep twisted tale of revenge and rivalry and family honor, OK now let's go through this portal and fight otherworldly creatures, I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
Very much how I feel. Since the first story was a one-shot, they obviously worked hard to make him memorable, but after that most of the attempts to bring him back felt forced. Even the cartoon seemed to realize this by playing up the dynamic between him and Krang.
>I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
This, whenever the Krang get involved it's like when Batman fights Darkseid, it's hard to get an actual "Batman" plot that doesn't become "Batgod" instead of the many memorable BTAS tragic villain plots where Batman is still a man.
Like why do the turtles live in the sewer when Donatello mastered engineering let-alone is the galaxy's smartest scientist who mastered camouflage and teleportation technology, might as well live on the moon or a space station, an island mansion perhaps and just teleport to NYC when trouble pops up.
He just needs to steal some Foot or Krang tech and their sewer is a functional stargate or genetics lab, that is until the Shredder comes and shreds it!
Maybe they should try the supernatural angle. Shredder who is also good at a lot of other ninja tricks like clones, smoke porting, and freezing his enemies with a stare could level the playing field with the alien cyborg shit.
>I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
I would have loved for the story to stick to normal down to earth villains and left out all the aliens and people form other dimension shit. turtles should have remained more of a weird martial arts story with other triad or gang related things coming along.
normally I lose all interest when a TMNT series moves into space and Triceratons. It's not what I liked in the series. I liked the ninja junkyard gang approach to tossing manhole covers and trashcan lids at street ninjas and gang members thing.
>I liked the ninja junkyard gang approach to tossing manhole covers and trashcan lids at street ninjas and gang members thing.
That sort of thing is one of their biggest unique features as a series. No one else really did that "sewer-level" superhero thing quite like TMNT did. All the wacky aliens and space shit felt like it was meant to mock the silver age comics, but then it became an unironic thing with toy-shilling demanding new and wacky outfits so they could sell more plastic, and now people act like it's not a real TMNT story unless they do every gonzo cliche.
normally I lose all interest when a TMNT series moves into space and Triceratons. It's not what I liked in the series. I liked the ninja junkyard gang approach to tossing manhole covers and trashcan lids at street ninjas and gang members thing.
Personally, I don't mind aliens if it's in moderation. Not stopping full-scale worldwide invasions, but maybe fighting an alien villain group or someone armed with alien tech once in a while seems fine by me.
I think magic stuff is always lame and a bad fit for TMNT, though. I remember completely losing interest in 2003 by the time Tengu Shredder and those spirits showed up.
>I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
I would have loved for the story to stick to normal down to earth villains and left out all the aliens and people form other dimension shit. turtles should have remained more of a weird martial arts story with other triad or gang related things coming along.
Trips of truth. While it's not an exact comparison, I think TMNT writers could learn something from the Yakuza games. Conspiracies and criminal dealings and ambitious small time gangs getting tangled up in trouble that ranges from dangers to the whole city, to problems for a single person. The fact that every version of TMNT feels the need to jump straight to time travel and aliens and taking the turtles out of New York entirely is a problem that comes from everyone copying what was seemingly most popular without realizing that sort of stuff is also what killed so many other TMNT series.
Fricking this. I never actually read the City at War arc, but I always wanted it to be like Batman's No Man's Land, but with the Turtles instead of Batman and the Foot and generic, but scary, New Yoawk gangs instead of super villains.
Every attempt to reinvent him has made him worse. IDW got the closest to making a cool Shredder who was competent and fearsome, but they built him up too much because of the Pantheon wank, and turned him into a worthless character again.
>Teams up with the turtles and Splinter to fight off aliens >Proceeds to stab Splinter in the back at the last second and lets the earth blow up
Safe to say that he is probably the most spiteful version of the character.
He hits that sweet spot where he is perfectly beatable by the protagonists, but even if stronger villains appear, can still be a legitimate threat. Even if the turtles are facing powerful monsters or alien invaders or whatever else crazy bullshit comes their way, the Shredder personally showing up is always a big deal.
He should be basically the same kind of threat since he is just as powerful as the turtles. If they can grab ninja weapons and defeat space dinosaurs, then he should be able to do it too. Whatever they can defeat, he can defeat.
Yes, but it is so moronic I need to make sure as many people as possible know about this moronation. I'm sorry if it might be a little pushy but I just can't let go unnoticed.
If you're looking for outrage and reactions from Cinemaphile, you have to put a comic panel in a twitter screencap and say something purposefully moronic to get their attention. Also, Lita liked being a mutant turtle and there was nothing wrong with her, so changing her against her will is a bad thing. Bob is a homosexual and so are you.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Lita liked being a mutant turtle
Yeah, right. Not sure making the best of a bad thing is the same as liking it but even if it's worth accepting that premise on face value, too bad the writer has the communicative skills of a slug.
3 months ago
Anonymous
The only thing resembling plotlines involving Lita was her trying really hard to be a ninja turtle, and Future Lita showing up and showing how much she loves the life they gave them and calling all of them Dad (and Jennika Mom). I don't know why you think there's any reason why she'd want to turn back.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Wanting is kind of irrelevant because it doesn't have to change jackshit about her current life and she'll have way more options as a human being anyway.
And since when were the wishes of a prepubescent child seen as informed anyway?
3 months ago
Anonymous
You're projecting your tard rage onto a fictional turtle child because you want to be angry for no real reason.
3 months ago
Anonymous
More likely that you have no critical thinking skills.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Mutants reintegrated back into society practically overnight in the comics and the future they've shown is Mutant City becoming a thing and Lita being a mutant turtle. I don't know what you think you're proving by jacking off about how much better you think her life is and how everyone should celebrate a moronic ape using evil shark magic on her unwillingly.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Someone could hand me a briefcase filled with a million dollars in cash without asking if I even wanted it and I don't think it would matter.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, that's not what this is though, moron. Being changed against her will isn't being given a million dollars. It doesn't even necessarily change her life at all.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Wow, and here I thought you were just pretending to be moronic.
3 months ago
Anonymous
You tried making your point repeatedly already and it wasn't remotely convincing. Pretending like you've said something intelligent isn't the same thing as being intelligent.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Cause that future is actually bad? Because a child doesn't necessarily know what is good for them? Because being a literal monstrosity will ruin your life? Campbell is just a moron and you are a bigger moron if you defend this awful writing. Seriously, this "writer" is literally incapable of understanding the implication and taking this garbage on face value and just accepting it is the dumbest fricking bullshit ever.
3 months ago
Anonymous
You didn't read #148 or any of the previous issues did you? Being a mutant literally doesn't matter in the story. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean the story has to be informed and colored by what you demand it should be.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Being a mutant literally doesn't matter in the story
Then it doesn't matter that her mutation was reversed, moron.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It does if she intended to stay a mutant, which we've already covered. There's no benefit to being human and no harm staying a mutant, plus she was happy as a mutant. How fricking dense are you?
3 months ago
Anonymous
>There's no benefit to being human
Except people won't look at you as a freak and will therefore be more willing to socialise with you and that will earn you a lot of benefits. How moronic are you? Would you honestly be cool with being turned into a freak of nature yourself?
3 months ago
Anonymous
There you go again, projecting what you want the story to be, instead of engaging with them as they actually are. You didn't actually read any of the comics, did you? You're just a pissed off autist who can't grapple with a story where the running theme is that there's nothing at all wrong with mutants being mutants.
3 months ago
Anonymous
What the story is can only be called moronic and it needs to called out for being inept. If the "point" of a story is that it's OK to lie, steal and cheat for personal gain it perfectly fine criticise that aspect of it, you don't just accept it at face value because that was the "point" (and that is still assuming competent writing). The idea that this child should remain a weird turtle creature instead of being turned back into her natural state and that it is so bad that everyone is crying about is extremely moronic.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>What the story is can only be called moronic and it needs to called out for being inept
See, that's a different matter entirely. IDW TMNT is poorly written, but going >HUR DUR WHY THE CHARACTERS ANGRY FOR A THING I DON'T UNDERSTAND??? >MUTANTS BAD REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Isn't a problem with the story. It's a problem with the reader. moron boy up there seething about how he wants to murder the writers and fantasizing about the characters suffering, at length, repeatedly, is utterly baffled by the idea that any of the characters could be okay with being mutants, which most of them are and have been throughout the story. Getting ass-ravaged that the characters are angry that a villain who is working with an evil shark that is trying to erase them from time, has attacked a child with an unknown power, is a reasonable and easy to follow plotline if you have an average IQ, at minimum.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Moron.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Take your meds.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Boy, talk about projection.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Waste of quads trying to win an internet argument with "NO U" responses
Old Hob is a dull mirror villain (probably the least creative kind of villain) with a boring design (oh wow a generic cat man) and lame discount Magneto motivations. The less TMNT touch upon "humans are... le bad" the better, let the X-Men deal with that shit.
>if you’re not saving the entire galaxy from some cosmic evil you’re just a boring slice of life show
This attitude is why nothing good can be made anymore. Everything ever made has to be about Saving The World, or a Show About Nothing. People pretend that there’s no room in between, when everything seems to suggest that’s the only place where there’s any room anymore.
IDW spent a decade building up some evil deities doing a game that threatened the end of the world and it was never clear how the frick that was going to happen and the whole thing amounted to a fistfight in imagination land that solved itself via Deus Ex Orbem.
End of the world plots are overplayed and tedious and only get worse when they're doing that with street-level heroes whose biggest threat is usually a guy who can ninja fight really well.
Turtles fighting Triceratons on a space gladiator arena is cool and I'm tired of pretending it's not.
I generally like street crime aspect, but shit like that is cool and in small doses doesn't hurt anybody. Modern writers know frickall about "small doses" and "moderation" though.
Shredder has a problem in that once he's defeated the threat goes out of him. He only sticks around because he ends up a mook to higher powers or because he's a vengeance fueled whack job. He rarely gets a good, slow-burn build up with a satisfying conclusion.
I don't think he actually likes turtle soup
That's like saying Gargamel doesn't like Smurfs. He must've had one before
I always just assumed he thought they tasted good after reading about it in a cookbook and after countless failures he continues out of spite
I never understood the "turtle soup" reference as a kid, but apparently it was so popular back in the day that large turtles like sea turtles and alligator snappers were being hunted so aggressively they would have gone extinct had they not gained endangered species protections. Campbell's was canning turtle soup as late as the 1950s, and Heinz kept canning until 1970, only a few years before the Endangered Species Act. Shredder is a villain AND Japanese, so you know he has to be all about eating endangered aquatic life.
He's used like the introductory villain to the turtles but he's by far the most intimidating but also the weakest and least ambitious. I think he fits the turtles in conflict better that laser blasting triceratops' or sentient brains in robot bodies. But in terms of an ongoing story I don't know where you go from there. Shredder and their conflict grounds mutant turtles learning ninjutsu from a rat in the sewers in some way. Dimension X, space travel, mutant cities, I don't know, feels silly in comparison. But this always comes after the Shredder conflict. It's deep twisted tale of revenge and rivalry and family honor, OK now let's go through this portal and fight otherworldly creatures, I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
Very much how I feel. Since the first story was a one-shot, they obviously worked hard to make him memorable, but after that most of the attempts to bring him back felt forced. Even the cartoon seemed to realize this by playing up the dynamic between him and Krang.
>I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
This, whenever the Krang get involved it's like when Batman fights Darkseid, it's hard to get an actual "Batman" plot that doesn't become "Batgod" instead of the many memorable BTAS tragic villain plots where Batman is still a man.
Like why do the turtles live in the sewer when Donatello mastered engineering let-alone is the galaxy's smartest scientist who mastered camouflage and teleportation technology, might as well live on the moon or a space station, an island mansion perhaps and just teleport to NYC when trouble pops up.
Donnie's smart but he can't create resources out of thin air
He just needs to steal some Foot or Krang tech and their sewer is a functional stargate or genetics lab, that is until the Shredder comes and shreds it!
Maybe they should try the supernatural angle. Shredder who is also good at a lot of other ninja tricks like clones, smoke porting, and freezing his enemies with a stare could level the playing field with the alien cyborg shit.
Yeah that would be cool, scaring aliens with the earthly supernatural that is scientifically unknowable is extremely underused.
It would work better if the story just remained street level and they fought mafia goons, gangs, or other low level thugs after Shredder.
But things always escalate to saving the world from dinosaur aliens and talking brains every damn time/
>I think the Turtles need more villains like Shredder something down to earth for teenage mutant ninja turtles living under the streets of New York to fight.
I would have loved for the story to stick to normal down to earth villains and left out all the aliens and people form other dimension shit. turtles should have remained more of a weird martial arts story with other triad or gang related things coming along.
normally I lose all interest when a TMNT series moves into space and Triceratons. It's not what I liked in the series. I liked the ninja junkyard gang approach to tossing manhole covers and trashcan lids at street ninjas and gang members thing.
>I liked the ninja junkyard gang approach to tossing manhole covers and trashcan lids at street ninjas and gang members thing.
That sort of thing is one of their biggest unique features as a series. No one else really did that "sewer-level" superhero thing quite like TMNT did. All the wacky aliens and space shit felt like it was meant to mock the silver age comics, but then it became an unironic thing with toy-shilling demanding new and wacky outfits so they could sell more plastic, and now people act like it's not a real TMNT story unless they do every gonzo cliche.
Personally, I don't mind aliens if it's in moderation. Not stopping full-scale worldwide invasions, but maybe fighting an alien villain group or someone armed with alien tech once in a while seems fine by me.
I think magic stuff is always lame and a bad fit for TMNT, though. I remember completely losing interest in 2003 by the time Tengu Shredder and those spirits showed up.
Trips of truth. While it's not an exact comparison, I think TMNT writers could learn something from the Yakuza games. Conspiracies and criminal dealings and ambitious small time gangs getting tangled up in trouble that ranges from dangers to the whole city, to problems for a single person. The fact that every version of TMNT feels the need to jump straight to time travel and aliens and taking the turtles out of New York entirely is a problem that comes from everyone copying what was seemingly most popular without realizing that sort of stuff is also what killed so many other TMNT series.
Fricking this. I never actually read the City at War arc, but I always wanted it to be like Batman's No Man's Land, but with the Turtles instead of Batman and the Foot and generic, but scary, New Yoawk gangs instead of super villains.
Super Shredder's best designs are the ones where it doesn't just look like regular Shredder with better armor
Every attempt to reinvent him has made him worse. IDW got the closest to making a cool Shredder who was competent and fearsome, but they built him up too much because of the Pantheon wank, and turned him into a worthless character again.
Beat up his muggers unlike Darkseid.
2012 is my favorite version of him. Peak Shredder.
>Teams up with the turtles and Splinter to fight off aliens
>Proceeds to stab Splinter in the back at the last second and lets the earth blow up
Safe to say that he is probably the most spiteful version of the character.
Even 03 Shredder? That one was willing to erase himself along with every universe to get rid of the turtles.
He hits that sweet spot where he is perfectly beatable by the protagonists, but even if stronger villains appear, can still be a legitimate threat. Even if the turtles are facing powerful monsters or alien invaders or whatever else crazy bullshit comes their way, the Shredder personally showing up is always a big deal.
He should be basically the same kind of threat since he is just as powerful as the turtles. If they can grab ninja weapons and defeat space dinosaurs, then he should be able to do it too. Whatever they can defeat, he can defeat.
I like him best when he is just a regular guy who is rally good at beating the shit out of people.
I hate all the mutants, aliens and cyborg shredders
he never did anything wrong and i'm tired of pretending otherwise
Can he shred on a guitar?
should die in the season 1 finale
also a human
also no alien help
>A good thing happens to a character
>Everyone acts as if it's a horrible fate
... I know the writer sucks... But what the frick?
https://screenrant.com/tmnt-149-preview-teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-armaggon/
what the frick didn't you just post this in another thread
Yes, but it is so moronic I need to make sure as many people as possible know about this moronation. I'm sorry if it might be a little pushy but I just can't let go unnoticed.
You're assuming anyone on Cinemaphile reads comics or cares about Lita.
I assume they can recognise and/or care that characters react in moronic way.
If you're looking for outrage and reactions from Cinemaphile, you have to put a comic panel in a twitter screencap and say something purposefully moronic to get their attention. Also, Lita liked being a mutant turtle and there was nothing wrong with her, so changing her against her will is a bad thing. Bob is a homosexual and so are you.
>Lita liked being a mutant turtle
Yeah, right. Not sure making the best of a bad thing is the same as liking it but even if it's worth accepting that premise on face value, too bad the writer has the communicative skills of a slug.
The only thing resembling plotlines involving Lita was her trying really hard to be a ninja turtle, and Future Lita showing up and showing how much she loves the life they gave them and calling all of them Dad (and Jennika Mom). I don't know why you think there's any reason why she'd want to turn back.
Wanting is kind of irrelevant because it doesn't have to change jackshit about her current life and she'll have way more options as a human being anyway.
And since when were the wishes of a prepubescent child seen as informed anyway?
You're projecting your tard rage onto a fictional turtle child because you want to be angry for no real reason.
More likely that you have no critical thinking skills.
Mutants reintegrated back into society practically overnight in the comics and the future they've shown is Mutant City becoming a thing and Lita being a mutant turtle. I don't know what you think you're proving by jacking off about how much better you think her life is and how everyone should celebrate a moronic ape using evil shark magic on her unwillingly.
Someone could hand me a briefcase filled with a million dollars in cash without asking if I even wanted it and I don't think it would matter.
Yeah, that's not what this is though, moron. Being changed against her will isn't being given a million dollars. It doesn't even necessarily change her life at all.
Wow, and here I thought you were just pretending to be moronic.
You tried making your point repeatedly already and it wasn't remotely convincing. Pretending like you've said something intelligent isn't the same thing as being intelligent.
Cause that future is actually bad? Because a child doesn't necessarily know what is good for them? Because being a literal monstrosity will ruin your life? Campbell is just a moron and you are a bigger moron if you defend this awful writing. Seriously, this "writer" is literally incapable of understanding the implication and taking this garbage on face value and just accepting it is the dumbest fricking bullshit ever.
You didn't read #148 or any of the previous issues did you? Being a mutant literally doesn't matter in the story. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean the story has to be informed and colored by what you demand it should be.
>Being a mutant literally doesn't matter in the story
Then it doesn't matter that her mutation was reversed, moron.
It does if she intended to stay a mutant, which we've already covered. There's no benefit to being human and no harm staying a mutant, plus she was happy as a mutant. How fricking dense are you?
>There's no benefit to being human
Except people won't look at you as a freak and will therefore be more willing to socialise with you and that will earn you a lot of benefits. How moronic are you? Would you honestly be cool with being turned into a freak of nature yourself?
There you go again, projecting what you want the story to be, instead of engaging with them as they actually are. You didn't actually read any of the comics, did you? You're just a pissed off autist who can't grapple with a story where the running theme is that there's nothing at all wrong with mutants being mutants.
What the story is can only be called moronic and it needs to called out for being inept. If the "point" of a story is that it's OK to lie, steal and cheat for personal gain it perfectly fine criticise that aspect of it, you don't just accept it at face value because that was the "point" (and that is still assuming competent writing). The idea that this child should remain a weird turtle creature instead of being turned back into her natural state and that it is so bad that everyone is crying about is extremely moronic.
>What the story is can only be called moronic and it needs to called out for being inept
See, that's a different matter entirely. IDW TMNT is poorly written, but going
>HUR DUR WHY THE CHARACTERS ANGRY FOR A THING I DON'T UNDERSTAND???
>MUTANTS BAD REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Isn't a problem with the story. It's a problem with the reader. moron boy up there seething about how he wants to murder the writers and fantasizing about the characters suffering, at length, repeatedly, is utterly baffled by the idea that any of the characters could be okay with being mutants, which most of them are and have been throughout the story. Getting ass-ravaged that the characters are angry that a villain who is working with an evil shark that is trying to erase them from time, has attacked a child with an unknown power, is a reasonable and easy to follow plotline if you have an average IQ, at minimum.
Moron.
Take your meds.
Boy, talk about projection.
Waste of quads trying to win an internet argument with "NO U" responses
cute
Shredder stop shredding! Shredder stop shredding! Shredder! STOP SHREDDING!
>The main villain of the franchise is the first boss in that dies in the first issue in the Mirage comics.
???
Wasn't Joker supposed to die in his first appearance but Finger quickly changed it because he liked him too much to kill him off?
Eastman and Laird hated when villains got away.
Also, as far as they knew there was never going to be a series, just a silly one shot.
At the time, he wasn't "the main villain of the franchise" and there was no franchise intended.
Old Hob is a dull mirror villain (probably the least creative kind of villain) with a boring design (oh wow a generic cat man) and lame discount Magneto motivations. The less TMNT touch upon "humans are... le bad" the better, let the X-Men deal with that shit.
>if you’re not saving the entire galaxy from some cosmic evil you’re just a boring slice of life show
This attitude is why nothing good can be made anymore. Everything ever made has to be about Saving The World, or a Show About Nothing. People pretend that there’s no room in between, when everything seems to suggest that’s the only place where there’s any room anymore.
IDW spent a decade building up some evil deities doing a game that threatened the end of the world and it was never clear how the frick that was going to happen and the whole thing amounted to a fistfight in imagination land that solved itself via Deus Ex Orbem.
End of the world plots are overplayed and tedious and only get worse when they're doing that with street-level heroes whose biggest threat is usually a guy who can ninja fight really well.
Turtles fighting Triceratons on a space gladiator arena is cool and I'm tired of pretending it's not.
I generally like street crime aspect, but shit like that is cool and in small doses doesn't hurt anybody. Modern writers know frickall about "small doses" and "moderation" though.
extremely dangerous villain that is forced to job or not participate way too often
I miss Uncle Phil
its very hit or miss regarding whether he's a good character or not. Some people just can't write him well.
80s Shredder was the best.
Which version?
Shredder has a problem in that once he's defeated the threat goes out of him. He only sticks around because he ends up a mook to higher powers or because he's a vengeance fueled whack job. He rarely gets a good, slow-burn build up with a satisfying conclusion.
I like him in his doule role as a bumbling idiot AND an extremely competent and deadly ninja that can take on all four turtles singlehandedly and win
Based. Shredder and Krang as the old married couple of NYC villainy is one of the funniest dynamics in cartoons.
Shredder is so malleable
Funny how the brits objected to nunchakus and sais but never said anything about the dude covered in razors
why where they scared of nunchuks?