Good answer.
The Dark Knight is actually another good comparison, considering how the characters in Monster often act like they're in a capeshit with the amount of physical and intellectual feats they're able to pull off.
Any movie about a determined hand of justice chasing an unstoppable force of evil only to question the point of his own compassion is a good comparison.
Why?? It’s as come as you’re gonna get to that dynamic
Good answer.
The Dark Knight is actually another good comparison, considering how the characters in Monster often act like they're in a capeshit with the amount of physical and intellectual feats they're able to pull off.
The Dark Knight is the exact same dynamic as No Country for Old Men. And you’re kidding yourself if you don’t recognize something like Grimmer going werewolf as capeshit-tier.
If that's true then why would I want to watch it but dragged out for 70 episodes? This and 20th Century Boys put me to sleep, I couldn't finish either of them.
I see a lot of hate ITT and it's mostly justifiable, but I'd argue the entire show is worth watching just for that final arc, the slow burn progression in that town and the chaotic events that unfold are fascinating to watch, the way some drunkard nobody ends up being the one to do the deed was actually really nice, it kind of reminds me of that palace invasion in HxH and how chaotic it all was but still made sense at the end, although not as good as Togashi's writing obviously.
>although not as good as Togashi's writing obviously
Holy fricking shit get some tastes Black person.
I refuse to believe you unironically think Urasawa is a better writer than Togashi, if that's the case you're in no position to be calling out anyone on their taste.
In a few years when you stop being dishonest on anonymous imageboards you'll appreciate Urusawa in retrospect.
2 years ago
Anonymous
and in a few years when you stop being underage you'll start to wonder why you fell for that hack's writing in the first place.
>character walks around >things happen for no reason >most of it is frickshit >then it ends for no reason
it's LOST for morons
it pops up in other top 5 lists frequently, for example most I often see anime gays put Johan as one of the best antagonists written in the medium, with some going as far as to say he's the best one in all of fiction, not even joking.
Imagine hating something because of its fanbase/reputation.
Quite pathetic tbh.
I believe there's no better representation of an anime than what it fans sound like when talking about it, reading the comments in that video is enough to realize most of them are easily impressionable teenagers
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I believe there's no better representation of an anime than what it fans sound like when talking about it >using youtube comments as the basis for anything
Thanks for outing yourself as the biggest moron in the room. No need for anyone to waste their time further.
2 years ago
Anonymous
cope
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's just a fact though, just like a capeshitter sounds exactly how I would expect them to, so too does the average Urasawa fanboy, absolutely 0 input as to why they like the manga or what they even like about it.
People who like genuinely good works are often very articulate about the things they liked, but the average Urasawagay can only reply with dimwitted insults like
>bored
You need to be 18+ to start watching media seriously.
[...] >enjoyed Eva being heartbroken
Considering her character growth is done marvelously, yeah. >Johan being a troony
Low iq. >almost none of the plot centers around the premise of Tenma chasing Johan, it's all just episodic garbage no one asked for.
So fricking low iq.
[...]
Must be nice living in your own delusional world.
The amount of shit that flies above your heads is astounding. Even I have my own grips with Monster and it's about details and criticisms you monkeys wouldn't even pick up on. You get hang up over the most pointless stuff, you shouldn't even bother watching anything other than capeshit.
and (you)
I have only ever read Pluto. I'm just baffled at the ability of Togashi fans to pull him into every fricking goddamn discussion, make some kind of useless "point" and then stand their ground causing everyone to hate Togashi by no merit of his own.
[...] >easily impressionable teenagers
As opposed to the easily impressionable 20yearolds here?
I honestly couldn't care less about Togashi, it could've been any other mangaka, from Matsumoto to Ichikawa, most manga artists mop the floor with Urasawa both visually and storytelling wise.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>People who like genuinely good works are often very articulate about the things they liked
It's not like you've made any points either. All you're doing is screeching about Urusawa and calling him a hack because some random youtuber calls Johan the greatest villain in fiction. You're not any smarter than anyone here.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I've already expressed my points of contention far above and no one even attempted to reply to a single one
I genuinely cannot remember ANYTHING between episode 4 and the last town arc, it's all blurry to me, all I remember is him crossdressing as his sister at times and shooting some accomplices he had or scamming a blind old dude, the story was just all over the place, the villain appears for like 15 minutes in the entire show's run, and when he's on screen he's speaking in riddles while autistically looking at windows and pointing at his forehead to get shot, none of these gestures is ever touched upon nor explained, he keeps talking about some scenery of the end or whatever that is and supposedly everyone follows him to get there.
It's basically how I would daydream about being a supervillain without bothering into thinking up of what my motives are or why my subordinates are following me
Monster is an incoherent mess, Johann's character makes no sense, the way he talks is simply unintelligible, I can't see why any one of his goons would follow him or do his bidding when all he's promising in return is some shitty scenery, he's essentially what a dumb person thinks a manipulative person is like.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>the way he talks is simply unintelligible
low iq
2 years ago
Anonymous
thanks for proving my point
now keep sniffing your own farts trying to convince people this shit is actual dialogue
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's funny reading people trying to explain what the frick they're watching and coming up with increasingly convoluted and contradiction explanations instead of just admitting it's bollocks that has no meaning.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>It's funny reading people trying to explain what the frick they're watching and coming up with increasingly convoluted and contradiction explanations instead of just admitting it's bollocks that has no meaning.
EVA fans trying to tackle the old testament inspired parts of the show
2 years ago
Anonymous
Makes perfect sense in context. You dumb?
2 years ago
Anonymous
How so? who the frick even talks like that?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>How so?
In this very episode, Nina informs Johan that he was misremembering the personal experience that fueled his vengeful rage from the beginning. He "woke up" from his delusion. He changes his plan and sees a different ending than the one he'd been looking toward from the beginning. >who the frick even talks like that?
Johan.
2 years ago
Anonymous
and what exactly is this new ending he sees when we didn't even now what the first ending was, at one point he wanted to take over the blind old guy's estate but then he also changed his mind just because.
and why the frick does he point to his forehead like an autist at each turn telling people to shoot him there? >>who the frick even talks like that? >Johan.
Why does he talk like that?
because it seems nothing more than a gimmick to make your shallow character appear ambiguous
2 years ago
Anonymous
>just because
Holy moron.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Watch the show, moron. I'm not going to explain basic plot points to you.
>unable to even address the recurrent forehead shit and vague dialogue after countless posts
I accept your concession.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Watch the show, moron. I'm not going to explain basic plot points to you.
I have only ever read Pluto. I'm just baffled at the ability of Togashi fans to pull him into every fricking goddamn discussion, make some kind of useless "point" and then stand their ground causing everyone to hate Togashi by no merit of his own.
and in a few years when you stop being underage you'll start to wonder why you fell for that hack's writing in the first place.
[...]
[...]
[...]
I believe there's no better representation of an anime than what it fans sound like when talking about it, reading the comments in that video is enough to realize most of them are easily impressionable teenagers
>easily impressionable teenagers
As opposed to the easily impressionable 20yearolds here?
doctor saves a kid who got shot in the head (and loses his job as a result) kid grows up to be a psycho and they chase each other around 1980s Europe. It's arguably the only kino anime.
doctor saves a kid who got shot in the head (and loses his job as a result) kid grows up to be a psycho and they chase each other around 1980s Europe. It's arguably the only kino anime.
when you describe it like this it actually sounds interesting and evokes images of maybe a thrilling cat & mouse anime and European historical scenery or politics during the cold war.
but the actual anime is just a snoozefest after episode 4.
>bored
You need to be 18+ to start watching media seriously.
it's telenovela tier, and not even the fun kind, or are you telling me you enjoyed watching Eva being heartbroken & Johann being a troony?
almost none of the plot centers around the premise of Tenma chasing Johan, it's all just episodic garbage no one asked for.
>enjoyed Eva being heartbroken
Considering her character growth is done marvelously, yeah. >Johan being a troony
Low iq. >almost none of the plot centers around the premise of Tenma chasing Johan, it's all just episodic garbage no one asked for.
So fricking low iq.
no you can't, because it would sound moronic to anyone reading it, even to the people who dislike Togashi.
Must be nice living in your own delusional world.
The amount of shit that flies above your heads is astounding. Even I have my own grips with Monster and it's about details and criticisms you monkeys wouldn't even pick up on. You get hang up over the most pointless stuff, you shouldn't even bother watching anything other than capeshit.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>character walks around >things happen for no reason >most of it is frickshit >then it ends for no reason
it's LOST for morons
2 years ago
Anonymous
>things happen for no reason
There are entire episodes dedicated to flashbacks explaining the characters' motivations.
it's telenovela tier, and not even the fun kind, or are you telling me you enjoyed watching Eva being heartbroken & Johann being a troony?
almost none of the plot centers around the premise of Tenma chasing Johan, it's all just episodic garbage no one asked for.
>it's telenovela tier
ah yup you nailed it, that's exactly what it is and like wise for a lot of anime that run more than a few cours. such is the nature of a commercial extruded medium
Monster's biggest "problem" is the fact you can probably cut 75% of the episodes and miss nothing of the main story, but that journey and one-shot characters you see along the way are kind of the point all on their own because they help define the main cast. It makes the show impenetrable to modern anime audience.
The show feels like it's going in a sort of paranormal or demonic direction for a while, but similar to True Detective that ends up being a red herring, unless you are inclined to read between the lines and attribute the guy's influence to something demonic or psychic. Plus there's all that stuff with the monster metaphor and digging up this old Slavic folktale about a demon, that really seems like it's going to be like there's some demon or egregore that is working through the guy. Again, one can interpret it that way, but the show doesn't really give you any strong indication by the end that you should (I kind of do but that's more because I believe in a hidden spiritual dimension to things so that's just how I read life on one level while also knowing how to do more academic reads or whatever, not that I'm one of those people who think that, like, a Kubrick or Lynch movie is specifically ABOUT this or that or is sending a message, I just mean that everything is ultimately downstream of principalities / spirit).
No, I mean, the show keeps hyping up his master manipulation abilities, but we never see a single example of him manipulating anyone or anything else to justify his control over people. He just shows up with people who he's manipulated off-screen to do his bidding and then he disappears to show up with more mindless pawns who happily die for him for no apparent reason.
It's like, you know that sherlock pasta, about it being a show about smart people written by stupid people? That's Monster. A stupid show, written by a stupid person, for stupid people. Which is why his powers are magic. Because the author has no idea how to write a character who's actually capable of doing what he's supposed to be able to do. Because he's stupid.
you expect them to show how he's a master manipulator?? But that takes skill, or at least research to draw from life! Much easier to just say he is a master manipulator and hope you don't ask questions.
That's why it seems for so long like he has some kind of hypnotic or demonic powers, it doesn't make sense he could have that kind of influence. It turns out he's some genetic experiment but still I don't buy that having such high intelligence and charisma can still necessarily influence people *that* fast. I mean obviously sociopaths and charismatic cult leaders certainly have brainwashed people but it doesn't feel it fleshes out a convincing argument for that. So one would maybe assume there's some other heightened or paranormal aspect to it but there doesn't seem to be any sign the author / show wants you to interpret it that way
2 years ago
Anonymous
(same poster again)
I hadn't finished reading your full post before typing out my response but I see you basically made the same point
2 years ago
Anonymous
>So one would maybe assume there's some other heightened or paranormal aspect to it but there doesn't seem to be any sign the author / show wants you to interpret it that way
Seriously? He keeps pointing to his "third eye." He tells Tenma to shoot him and Tenma suddenly envisions the post-war wasteland that he escaped from. He gets people to kill themselves after barely meeting them because he knows exactly what to say to them. Other characters call him an alien. At the end he disappears from the hospital without a trace. I see a lot of people claiming with absolute certainty that there was nothing supernatural going on with Johan, but it's very clear to me that Urasawa left the door creaked open just enough for that interpretation to be reasonable. The problem is there's no definite proof, but that's also by design. The devil never reveals his tricks.
There's more power in the omission than if Urasawa had given him some epic manipulation speeches like in Breaking Bad. Does it mean people are manipulated more quickly and to greater extremes than is realistic? Yeah, but that's kind of the point. You don't know how Johan is doing it. It's scary. And you want to assign some kind of supernatural power to it, even reckoning with human genetic modification to make it make sense, but in the end it could very well have been pure charisma, and that's the scariest part.
2 years ago
Anonymous
If it was pure charisma it would have helped a lot to actually show it at least once. People can and have written charismatic villains and they're usually pretty entertaining.
2 years ago
Anonymous
That's IF it was pure charisma. Again, you never find out, and that's by design. You start out thinking the mystery is "how is he doing all this," by it's actually "why is he doing all this."
No, it's not scary, it breaks immersion and makes it boring and stupid. Like if you'd have him karate-chopping his way through whole villages instead, it's just dumb. Not that that would be too dumb for anime either.
I mean I wasn't shaking in my boots, but it definitely helped with the ominous atmosphere to frame Johan as a sort of mythic character with a mysterious omnipotence.
2 years ago
Anonymous
No, it's not scary, it breaks immersion and makes it boring and stupid. Like if you'd have him karate-chopping his way through whole villages instead, it's just dumb. Not that that would be too dumb for anime either.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>You don't know how Johan is doing it. It's scary.
Wasn't buying it, even while watching it I was just like "okay what's so great about this guy" there was nothing. I mean it doesn't take a huge speech to see how a character can be charismatic/manipulative and have followers. Berserk did it pretty quickly and skillfully with Griffith.
2 years ago
Anonymous
The point of Johan was that he wasn't powerful because of anything he said. People just looked into his eyes and were under his spell.
you fricking moron would you like a horror film to explain the paranormal shit at any point?
You stinking moron, don't you know that mystery adds to this halo effect? Black person b***h, you are a Black person.
2 years ago
Anonymous
we're not talking about a horror film or any paranormal shit, we're simply talking about a character depicted as a manipulative smart villain, that's certainly something you should show for your audience to believe, Psycho Pass manages to show a good manipulative antagonist, Urasawa simply lacks the skills as an author to pull it off, instead he goes around and writing vague shitty lines with meme added ethereal music playing in the background like what that anon posted
thanks for proving my point
now keep sniffing your own farts trying to convince people this shit is actual dialogue
2 years ago
Anonymous
>we're not talking about a horror film or any paranormal shit
This right here betrays the fact that you fundamentally misunderstood the show you were watching.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Makes perfect sense in context. You dumb?
>point out how shit the show is while posting actual scenes from it >y-you just don't get it! you're dumb! you're low iq!
the average Monstergay
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's insanely blatant how much you're arguing in bad faith and for the sole reason that you're absolutely buttblasted at hearing some youtube crowd hail it as peak fiction instead of your favorite anime.
You can't even point out any of Monster's actual flaws, meanwhile posting the most inoffensive scene I can think of, lol. The youtube comments are moronic about it obviously though. Johan just kills people to not leave any trace of his existence.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>You can't even point out any of Monster's actual flaws
the writing is shit
2 years ago
Anonymous
Tell us more about it.
2 years ago
Anonymous
the monster is the purple man from jessica jones but even dumber and without any charismatic scenery chewing
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Psycho Pass manages to show a good manipulative antagonist
Oh the irony, considering Makishima was inspired by Johan.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Makishima was inspired by Johan
source : your ass
they're nothing alike, Makishima is actually believable
2 years ago
Anonymous
>they're nothing alike
kek, you're hilarious
A terrible analyst all around.
2 years ago
Anonymous
its pretty routine that something that was inspired can end up being way better then the thing it was inspired by... with that being said the only redeeming quality of this fricking boring ass long ass shit pacing anime is the creepy kids monster story segments and some scenes with johan.
2 years ago
Anonymous
you are a Black person, what I meant is that through the cinematic medium, there are many more ways to cenvey things, and often better, than just showing things.
You are a Black person, and either an Cinemaphile gay that's lost and would rather watch death note shit, or a Black person boomer who watches capeshit
Urasawa is good at theming and huge emotional moments but it falls apart at the slightest scrutiny
He spends so much time watablishing Johan as the idea of pure evil that does evil for evil’s sake, and no matter how hard humans try to control him, he is stronger than them. Meanwhile the doctor is the ultimate good, trying to defeat him
This works, as a concept, every single episode exists to hammer this metaphor in your head, but there is no actual story, only a frame of it
It's an incredibly enjoyable watch. I don't know how to describe it, but I guess it really captures the bittersweet sensation of when you're traveling, and making short stops in different places, and you wonder about the people and their lives, and maybe connect with someone very strongly at some point, and then have to part ways after two days. Kind of like the way the train scene in Spirited Away feels. Or Lost in Translation, that really gets at it too. But this goes on for much longer so it almost feels like traveling with the character in real time (he's wandering around Germany and a bit of Eastern Europe, from what I recall), and by the time it ends you feel very connected to it
don't even bother, Urasawa has the most boring paneling out there, I challenge anyone to post a single good looking spread Urasawa has made in his career.
by far the most overrated manga "artist" out there, he has no respect for his own medium.
his panel layout is perfectly fine if that's what you're talking about. there is no need for autistic panel layout that all over the place, the best kind is that which is easy to follow.
there 0 individual style in it, his paneling is straight out of some manga 101 textbook, it's dry and soulless, it's like watching a film entirely made out of back and forth shots with no in-between.
>I challenge anyone to post a single good looking spread
You fricking brainlet, how would a spread demonstrate good or bad paneling skills? Unless you're a fricking moronic American that read superhero vomit and their "Avengers Assemble" type of double pagers.
The anime is like a 1:1 adaptation of the manga, though. It's just the manga with color, voice acting, and music. Definitely an upgrade.
don't even bother, Urasawa has the most boring paneling out there, I challenge anyone to post a single good looking spread Urasawa has made in his career.
by far the most overrated manga "artist" out there, he has no respect for his own medium.
It has 74, so I don't know where you got that number. The appeal is in the characters' psychology and the storytelling, which can be pretty ridiculous and have a lot of ass-pulls but is no-doubt entertaining with how utterly winding it is.
It written at the level of an avarege mistery novel instead of at a capeshit level like most manga so It stands out alot
The author Is great at making you know and care about even the side characters, and the thriller/mistery part Is pretty well done for the First 2/3 but falls appart hard at the end
The anime has a really slow pace and it's a 1 on 1 adaptation of the manga anyway so no point in watching It, ready the maga
its okay for a while but it really drags out the story over too many filler episodes and the ending plot is kinda moronic
its also weirdly woke with le evil germans abusing the good hearted turk immigrants
>Depicting some Germans as evil is "woke", even though the show is set in Germany and 90% of the characters are good people.
You've got brain rot anon.
don't bother, urasawa can't write an ending to save his life and all of his works turn to garbage half way through. There isn't any point getting sucked into a decent premise just to be dragged along through bullshit that is only there to artificially extend the plot and given an insipid ending as your "reward".
Monster is an experience. You dont even have to watch the whole series. You are free to watch some episodes, and just enjoy the 80s Germany vibe with the well-written characters and stories. When you get tired of it, turn it off and forget untill the next time you will want to experience it.
Its really chill, soothing and enjoyable anime, one of the best ever made.
Name a brother sister acting pair to play the main characters that can convincingly crossdress as each other[spoiler]bonus points if they aren't trannies[/spoiler]
it's mostly praised by people who exclusively watch anime but want their medium to look "mature" for onlookers.
t.used to be a weeb, that's how I used most of Urasawa's works.
it's really telling how this is held up as the paragon of a mature complete artistic work yet when you ask any anime fan their top 5 nobody, absolutely NOBODY ranks it even among their top 10 unless they're just too new to have seen enough else. Not saying it's bad just that it has a ridiculous reputation
it pops up in other top 5 lists frequently, for example most I often see anime gays put Johan as one of the best antagonists written in the medium, with some going as far as to say he's the best one in all of fiction, not even joking.
I honestly can't say. I've seen some awful movies, but i've never seen one where the characters talk to themselves and CONSTANTLY explain what's going on. It's like a fricken alien made that tv show with how insane everyone acts on it.
The guy directed Made in Abyss also - which is also atrociously bad.
>I honestly can't say. I've seen some awful movies, but i've never seen one where the characters talk to themselves and CONSTANTLY explain what's going on.
Almost all anime that's not breezy slice-of-life does this. It's a major weakness for sure
But then again anime is schlock so you shouldn't be holding it to high literary standards or whatever. You just have to take and review it for what it is
>Almost all anime that's not breezy slice-of-life does this. It's a major weakness for sure
It's actually a good tactic for certain stuff like Death Note. Unfortunately 99% of anime is garbage, including Monster.
>>It's actually a good tactic for certain stuff like Death Note. Unfortunately 99% of anime is garbage, including Monster.
I hope you don't mean to imply that fricking Death Note, of all things, is better than Monster.
anime is adapted from manga which constantly has inner monologues and japs are just lazy and directly adapt it instead of trying to convey it visually or through the story
I genuinely cannot remember ANYTHING between episode 4 and the last town arc, it's all blurry to me, all I remember is him crossdressing as his sister at times and shooting some accomplices he had or scamming a blind old dude, the story was just all over the place, the villain appears for like 15 minutes in the entire show's run, and when he's on screen he's speaking in riddles while autistically looking at windows and pointing at his forehead to get shot, none of these gestures is ever touched upon nor explained, he keeps talking about some scenery of the end or whatever that is and supposedly everyone follows him to get there.
It's basically how I would daydream about being a supervillain without bothering into thinking up of what my motives are or why my subordinates are following me
I see a lot of hate ITT and it's mostly justifiable, but I'd argue the entire show is worth watching just for that final arc, the slow burn progression in that town and the chaotic events that unfold are fascinating to watch, the way some drunkard nobody ends up being the one to do the deed was actually really nice, it kind of reminds me of that palace invasion in HxH and how chaotic it all was but still made sense at the end, although not as good as Togashi's writing obviously.
why is that a weird or pathetic thing?
most people generally do not hate an actual good work because it has a shit fanbase, but when the work itself is bad the fanbase only invites further contempt.
I don't go out of my way to dislike bad manga & anime that aren't very known or universally praised by braindead pseuds.
>please guys spoonfeed me the anime because I literally didn't fricking get it
You were more credible when you were saying other writers were better, now I see you're just desperate for someone to explain it to you, holy kek.
I wouldn't even mind if you guys were complaining about too many character plotlines conveniently intersecting, or Tenma being a Mary Sue, or all the time spent on reiterating information and recycling footage. But you're complaining about the ambiguity behind a famously cryptic character as though the ambiguity of his motivation and methods isn't the whole point of the series.
>But you're complaining about the ambiguity behind a famously cryptic character as though the ambiguity of his motivation and methods isn't the whole point of the series.
the problem is the ambiguity is there because Urasawa knows he cannot do better, I've seen what happens when he takes a cryptic character and then shed light on him, it turns into the complete garbage that was 20th century boy's ending, perhaps had he not made that manga I might consider there to be more to Johann's character and it's just an artistic choice, but it was clearly done out of an inability to properly write a good character.
you are a Black person, what I meant is that through the cinematic medium, there are many more ways to cenvey things, and often better, than just showing things.
You are a Black person, and either an Cinemaphile gay that's lost and would rather watch death note shit, or a Black person boomer who watches capeshit
>the cinematic medium
monster is still anime, stop larping you dumb ESL weeb
have a nice day Black person, you're the exact reason why people can't take Monstergays seriously
Omission is a very valid technique that’s as old as fiction itself, and Urasawa uses it to great effect. You are a pleb if you think Johan would be half the character he is had they shown his methods on-screen, no matter how great his “gift of gab.”
he would actually be a better character had that been the case, you think people would consider Holden to be such a great depiction of a smart and calculating villain had McCarthy just went down the omission route and made everything he did off-screen?
Omission doesn't work when you omit your entire fricking character off the screen.
Omission is a very valid technique that’s as old as fiction itself, and Urasawa uses it to great effect. You are a pleb if you think Johan would be half the character he is had they shown his methods on-screen, no matter how great his “gift of gab.”
I see this a lot when writers want to have an epic master manipulator character but have them actually manipulate people mostly off-screen. The writer just knows they don't have the grasp of human psychology to write those scenes, so pretend leaving it ambiguous is their first choice.
Just like how most fans of this shitty technique call anything they don't like genre fiction and admit fully most classical fiction would be genre fiction today anyway? None of the Cinemaphile gays can write, I've seen that.
Just like how most fans of this shitty technique call anything they don't like genre fiction and admit fully most classical fiction would be genre fiction today anyway? None of the Cinemaphile gays can write, I've seen that.
There's nothing wrong with omitting such things, a good author knows their limits and how to circumvent them, otherwise you'd end up with garbage like death note which makes 0 sense after 5 minutes of thinking about it.
There are very very few people in this medium who can write believable smart & manipulative characters, Urasawa is a mystery writer first and foremost, he has no need to delve outside of his expertise.
This is just really my opinion. Remember, I see fiction as entertainment and that's all it'll be. Even if you take it seriously it's a passion, not a vital resource. Even 1984 feels like mostly obvious stuff a lot of people can derive from observing society.
But my opinion is that if you can't write the entirety of the world to at least a competent degree, don't write it. Magic systems are good because they put a part of the world on the table and exude the confidence needed to write an intelligent ploy, this makes it more believable. It's why sports are cool to write about because the upper limit is observable in our world
Without hard limits on things everything is random and happens out of hammerspace. What is the point of reading something like that? You're just looking at some schizo making up random things at that point, right?
>But my opinion is that if you can't write the entirety of the world to at least a competent degree, don't write it.
This is why nerd and pop culture is and always will be fastfood level garbage.
Same with lore gays, which is the same group really.
I know you're just a Black person Hispanic israelite emulator piece of trash die alone scumbag that should be shot in the street for wasting a god like being like me's time and thus you don't believe what you said, but I think my point bears repeating. A little louder in the back for the /littrannies/.
I still think 1984 is just entertainment but the reason it was so prophetic was that the author exuded a fairly congruent grasp of how the real world operates, btw. His world building was the main character, supporting cast and antagonist all at once.
based bonaparta killing off his half-brother then falling in love with his wife, imprisoning her and torturing his niece and nephew, then completely banishing his son then his son falling for his niece. are you and your dad also in love with the same woman?
Lunge sort of explains Johan's manipulation in Another Monster >At the end of the interview, I asked him about brainwashing — how does one manipulate and control another person this way? >It's simple," Mr. Lunge stated. He asked me where I was currently living. When I answered Vienna, he said, "Then, can you draw me an accurate map of the city, depicting every single road?" I wracked my brain to conjure up a mental map of Vienna, and began drawing a simple map on my notepad, as he intently watched my facial expressions. When I admitted defeat, saying that I could not possibly draw an accurate map, he took what I had written. >"What area of Vienna is this?" He asked >I sheepishly said that it was the neighborhood I lived in, and he responded, "Then to you, this is the center of the city; no, the center of the world," as he looked at me. "When you imagine the place called Vienna, you use your living space as a starting point, and think of roads and places as they relate to your location... And even when given an actual map of Vienna, you most likely see your neighborhood as the center." >"In the very center of yourmind, just like this map, there lies the foundation of your ego — your identity." >"But suddenly, your coordinate axis is removed. There is no meaning to this center... there is a much more appropriate center for your heart. This is the reality of what we call brainwashing." He smiled. "And when a human being's mental axis is removed and they are lost, you gently and carefully entrap them with words, not giving them the opportunity to think, offering them a new place to live... You will find that human beings follow the instructions of whoever furnishes them with this new home... They become surprisingly docile."
And Dr. Gillen >How would he actually go about infiltrating the heart of another person? >By acknowledging their worth. By never frowning upon their actions, and by teaching them that they are not alone in the world. They are elated, believing they have found their one true friend, the only person in the entire universe who understands them. Or, on the contrary, he might belittle them, lambasting their every move and driving them to the darkest pit of mental solitude and ruin. After doing that, he would simply make a little request. Just kill one measly person, that's all..."
>implying she wasn't one of the more realistic portrayals of women
All about chasing that status. You can tell there's a person there, but it's just a shitty person be it due to life or other factors.
yes but she Is so beautiful I love her with everything I have she can utterly ruin my life and I will still give her anything she wants she is the most beautiful person I have ever seen inside and out
Anyone remember the scene where some guy and a girl are cornered and they have a shoot out and I think the guy dies but the girl lives? I even recall some weird handgun with 4 barrels but I might be misremembering. It was with some side characters I think. They're outnumbered in a shootout. Help me recall this, even link the scene if you can or just give me the names of the characters.
Haven't seen it but I'm wondering;
Since it's a thriller about a killer being chased by someone, is it similair to Death Note? Better? Worse? I've seen Death Note and liked that one.
t.normally never watches anime
>Urasawa
he's a fricking hack, monster is avrage as frick at best and 20th century boys are garbage
i'll never waste my time on his garbage writing again
all the great manipulative or smart characters have their thoughts shown, there's not a single character out there whose reasoning was entirely omitted yet turned out to be a well written & believable smart character.
I don't really get how Johan gets such a free pass
I'm looking to write some loldeep like Mushishi and also some other battle shounen shit before I do but I wanted to do some togashi/oda homosexualry at some point. I think it'd be interesting to have an extroverted intuitive (in jungian terms) be a smart character and show his thought process in how he thinks out a multitude of possibilities, I think people underestimate how wise and cunning cheerful social people can be even when dealing with their material surroundings
Introvert or no though I also find Kurapika pretty enthralling ofc. Way more than Light
It's fun. I know it has a way better power system than a successful novelist like Branderson's. Being successful at novels means little, I mean the Twilight girl? Harry Potter...? HxH is really really good
Magic/Power system Black folk are one of the things that's ruining genre fiction. Imagine a genre so creatively bankrupt you have to use that as a selling point.
I want to gut them all like pigs together with all the writer's workshop teachers preaching "show don't tell" and making every fricking novel read like a screenplay.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>this awful post
this is what happens when you spend too much time away from other whites, touch milk
2 years ago
Anonymous
Great argument friend.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Yeah but we're not talking and never will. There is no way anything I say will be listened to by you and your kind never has anything constructive for me to use. How about you answer
How do I portray shounen/YA shit when their profession necessitates they kill people, frens? Do I just play it straight like HxH even if it makes them look like dicks?
, this would actually help me know if I should care about your opinion on this
'why do I care if you care', exactly. I just take a Roger Ebert approach to shit I like. If I like it I like it. I like a lot of weird things that wouldn't befit or fit into genre fiction (I like silent manga and scenery documentaries and shit like Blame) but some of it does and HxH is that speed. I don't need to justify this shit to some pretentious idiot online and I don't care for these labels
2 years ago
Anonymous
I'm not the same guy anon, I'm a different anon who interjected in your conversation here:
Magic/Power system Black folk are one of the things that's ruining genre fiction. Imagine a genre so creatively bankrupt you have to use that as a selling point.
I want to gut them all like pigs together with all the writer's workshop teachers preaching "show don't tell" and making every fricking novel read like a screenplay.
>failed novelist
no such thing, especially looking at the sales of modern LNs in Japan.
the guy is first & foremost a manga artist, he knows how to tell a story through pictures when he needs to.
he can when he wants but he's guilty of not doing it way more, it's my favorite manga but the boat arc is way way to verbose even by his standards especailly since he's just spelling out evrerything and often reapiting stuff that didn0t even need to be expaned once
Anyway this is a perfect exemple of his visual storytelling I'm pretty sure he did it just to prove he can
https://hunterxhuntermanga.online/manga/hunter-x-hunter-chapter-339/
2 years ago
Anonymous
I like it because it's weird and interesting, I went over that. It's good. Togashi just writes from his whimsy and that makes him a great author imo, not that I care who's writing it if it's good. That's good to me
2 years ago
Anonymous
I think the boat arc requires such heavy dialogue to set up the conflict and stakes properly as well as to introduce the various abilities at play, it's basically what the first half of the CA arc was like, as the arc progresses we'll begin to see a more visually inclined approach.
I can't read shit at that resolution, but in the case of Monster, Johan is supposed to feel like an almost otherworldly, demonic threat.
Showing too much of him would ruin it.
It's akin Mads in the Hannibal tv show.
Death Note is moronic, but as far as i remember it does narrate all of Light's reasonings, when he sets up shit, aside from the infamous "Keikaku" plot line, which is indeed absurd and nonsensical.
It's great. Though I really just feel sorry for Kurapike and want him to be back with his frens at this point. There are people who think like your bubble bro IRL and Hunters are like those people and they're all pieces of shit. The cast to me just read as victims of a shitty system, I am glad Killua got out at least.
this is 50% on the author and 50% on the fan traslation, hxh uses more complex and technical japanese than most manga, fan transaltors are mostly barelly litterete and have a bad grasp of both english and japanese so they end up using 5 words when they could have used one
When writing my own character it's going to be hard because in real life jungian application extroverted intuition tends to look like magic when it works anyway, especially the Ne-Fi-Te variation. I just think clearing up the thought process is the best you can do. I believe that if you can't roleplay as one of your characters for 5 years in a concurring field to theirs and do at least 80-90% as successfully as they do, you probably can't write them well. I'm trying something like that.
How do I portray shounen/YA shit when their profession necessitates they kill people, frens? Do I just play it straight like HxH even if it makes them look like dicks?
No Country
Good answer.
The Dark Knight is actually another good comparison, considering how the characters in Monster often act like they're in a capeshit with the amount of physical and intellectual feats they're able to pull off.
>good answer
not really.
Any movie about a determined hand of justice chasing an unstoppable force of evil only to question the point of his own compassion is a good comparison.
Why?? It’s as come as you’re gonna get to that dynamic
Frick off moron.
The Dark Knight is the exact same dynamic as No Country for Old Men. And you’re kidding yourself if you don’t recognize something like Grimmer going werewolf as capeshit-tier.
The Dark Knight and Monster also both bask in the laurels of low standards for their genre (somewhat haphazardly calling anime and capeshit "genres").
If that's true then why would I want to watch it but dragged out for 70 episodes? This and 20th Century Boys put me to sleep, I couldn't finish either of them.
the MOVIE equivalent is obviously going to be shorter
the manga's a lot more appreciable, they really make the story drag in the anime
fpwp
there is no movie equivalent, simple as
>although not as good as Togashi's writing obviously
Holy fricking shit get some tastes Black person.
I refuse to believe you unironically think Urasawa is a better writer than Togashi, if that's the case you're in no position to be calling out anyone on their taste.
I can send you back your exact sentence at you except with the names reversed.
no you can't, because it would sound moronic to anyone reading it, even to the people who dislike Togashi.
Jesus you Black folk are so obnoxious. You probably put people off Togashi's stuff more than the hiatuses.
it could've been anyone really, the bar is pretty low when it comes to Urasawa's writing
In a few years when you stop being dishonest on anonymous imageboards you'll appreciate Urusawa in retrospect.
and in a few years when you stop being underage you'll start to wonder why you fell for that hack's writing in the first place.
I believe there's no better representation of an anime than what it fans sound like when talking about it, reading the comments in that video is enough to realize most of them are easily impressionable teenagers
>I believe there's no better representation of an anime than what it fans sound like when talking about it
>using youtube comments as the basis for anything
Thanks for outing yourself as the biggest moron in the room. No need for anyone to waste their time further.
cope
It's just a fact though, just like a capeshitter sounds exactly how I would expect them to, so too does the average Urasawa fanboy, absolutely 0 input as to why they like the manga or what they even like about it.
People who like genuinely good works are often very articulate about the things they liked, but the average Urasawagay can only reply with dimwitted insults like
and (you)
I honestly couldn't care less about Togashi, it could've been any other mangaka, from Matsumoto to Ichikawa, most manga artists mop the floor with Urasawa both visually and storytelling wise.
>People who like genuinely good works are often very articulate about the things they liked
It's not like you've made any points either. All you're doing is screeching about Urusawa and calling him a hack because some random youtuber calls Johan the greatest villain in fiction. You're not any smarter than anyone here.
I've already expressed my points of contention far above and no one even attempted to reply to a single one
Monster is an incoherent mess, Johann's character makes no sense, the way he talks is simply unintelligible, I can't see why any one of his goons would follow him or do his bidding when all he's promising in return is some shitty scenery, he's essentially what a dumb person thinks a manipulative person is like.
>the way he talks is simply unintelligible
low iq
thanks for proving my point
now keep sniffing your own farts trying to convince people this shit is actual dialogue
It's funny reading people trying to explain what the frick they're watching and coming up with increasingly convoluted and contradiction explanations instead of just admitting it's bollocks that has no meaning.
>It's funny reading people trying to explain what the frick they're watching and coming up with increasingly convoluted and contradiction explanations instead of just admitting it's bollocks that has no meaning.
EVA fans trying to tackle the old testament inspired parts of the show
Makes perfect sense in context. You dumb?
How so? who the frick even talks like that?
>How so?
In this very episode, Nina informs Johan that he was misremembering the personal experience that fueled his vengeful rage from the beginning. He "woke up" from his delusion. He changes his plan and sees a different ending than the one he'd been looking toward from the beginning.
>who the frick even talks like that?
Johan.
and what exactly is this new ending he sees when we didn't even now what the first ending was, at one point he wanted to take over the blind old guy's estate but then he also changed his mind just because.
and why the frick does he point to his forehead like an autist at each turn telling people to shoot him there?
>>who the frick even talks like that?
>Johan.
Why does he talk like that?
because it seems nothing more than a gimmick to make your shallow character appear ambiguous
>just because
Holy moron.
>unable to even address the recurrent forehead shit and vague dialogue after countless posts
I accept your concession.
Watch the show, moron. I'm not going to explain basic plot points to you.
I have only ever read Pluto. I'm just baffled at the ability of Togashi fans to pull him into every fricking goddamn discussion, make some kind of useless "point" and then stand their ground causing everyone to hate Togashi by no merit of his own.
>easily impressionable teenagers
As opposed to the easily impressionable 20yearolds here?
Watching flys eat horse shit
rupauls drag movie
Mix of Mind Hunter and True Detective
MOVIE
equivalent
MOVIE
what's the appeal? i just peaked wikipedia and it has 81 episodes
it's overrated.
doctor saves a kid who got shot in the head (and loses his job as a result) kid grows up to be a psycho and they chase each other around 1980s Europe. It's arguably the only kino anime.
>kid grows up to be a psycho and they chase each other around 1980s Europe
why would he chase him around Europe
cause he keeps murdering people and the doctor starts to regret saving him/thinks it's his responsibility to stop him
secret special nazi orphanage lore
>characters you want to hatefrick
>It's arguably the only kino anime.
LotGH would like to have a word with you anon
when you describe it like this it actually sounds interesting and evokes images of maybe a thrilling cat & mouse anime and European historical scenery or politics during the cold war.
but the actual anime is just a snoozefest after episode 4.
>but the actual anime is just a snoozefest after episode 4.
If you're moronic maybe.
if you're not bored by it you're moronic yeah
>bored
You need to be 18+ to start watching media seriously.
>enjoyed Eva being heartbroken
Considering her character growth is done marvelously, yeah.
>Johan being a troony
Low iq.
>almost none of the plot centers around the premise of Tenma chasing Johan, it's all just episodic garbage no one asked for.
So fricking low iq.
Must be nice living in your own delusional world.
The amount of shit that flies above your heads is astounding. Even I have my own grips with Monster and it's about details and criticisms you monkeys wouldn't even pick up on. You get hang up over the most pointless stuff, you shouldn't even bother watching anything other than capeshit.
>character walks around
>things happen for no reason
>most of it is frickshit
>then it ends for no reason
it's LOST for morons
>things happen for no reason
There are entire episodes dedicated to flashbacks explaining the characters' motivations.
nah
Uh, yes, there most certainly are.
it's telenovela tier, and not even the fun kind, or are you telling me you enjoyed watching Eva being heartbroken & Johann being a troony?
almost none of the plot centers around the premise of Tenma chasing Johan, it's all just episodic garbage no one asked for.
How did you not enjoy Johan being a troony?
>it's telenovela tier
ah yup you nailed it, that's exactly what it is and like wise for a lot of anime that run more than a few cours. such is the nature of a commercial extruded medium
Monster's biggest "problem" is the fact you can probably cut 75% of the episodes and miss nothing of the main story, but that journey and one-shot characters you see along the way are kind of the point all on their own because they help define the main cast. It makes the show impenetrable to modern anime audience.
>the only kino anime.
Ahem
poor bait anon, at least have a (you)
A cute twink is a master manipulator and serial killer, the only person that can stop him is a doctor that cares too much.
>master manipulator
more like he's professor X using his mind control powers to make people do what he wants them to
The show feels like it's going in a sort of paranormal or demonic direction for a while, but similar to True Detective that ends up being a red herring, unless you are inclined to read between the lines and attribute the guy's influence to something demonic or psychic. Plus there's all that stuff with the monster metaphor and digging up this old Slavic folktale about a demon, that really seems like it's going to be like there's some demon or egregore that is working through the guy. Again, one can interpret it that way, but the show doesn't really give you any strong indication by the end that you should (I kind of do but that's more because I believe in a hidden spiritual dimension to things so that's just how I read life on one level while also knowing how to do more academic reads or whatever, not that I'm one of those people who think that, like, a Kubrick or Lynch movie is specifically ABOUT this or that or is sending a message, I just mean that everything is ultimately downstream of principalities / spirit).
No, I mean, the show keeps hyping up his master manipulation abilities, but we never see a single example of him manipulating anyone or anything else to justify his control over people. He just shows up with people who he's manipulated off-screen to do his bidding and then he disappears to show up with more mindless pawns who happily die for him for no apparent reason.
It's like, you know that sherlock pasta, about it being a show about smart people written by stupid people? That's Monster. A stupid show, written by a stupid person, for stupid people. Which is why his powers are magic. Because the author has no idea how to write a character who's actually capable of doing what he's supposed to be able to do. Because he's stupid.
you expect them to show how he's a master manipulator?? But that takes skill, or at least research to draw from life! Much easier to just say he is a master manipulator and hope you don't ask questions.
That's why it seems for so long like he has some kind of hypnotic or demonic powers, it doesn't make sense he could have that kind of influence. It turns out he's some genetic experiment but still I don't buy that having such high intelligence and charisma can still necessarily influence people *that* fast. I mean obviously sociopaths and charismatic cult leaders certainly have brainwashed people but it doesn't feel it fleshes out a convincing argument for that. So one would maybe assume there's some other heightened or paranormal aspect to it but there doesn't seem to be any sign the author / show wants you to interpret it that way
(same poster again)
I hadn't finished reading your full post before typing out my response but I see you basically made the same point
>So one would maybe assume there's some other heightened or paranormal aspect to it but there doesn't seem to be any sign the author / show wants you to interpret it that way
Seriously? He keeps pointing to his "third eye." He tells Tenma to shoot him and Tenma suddenly envisions the post-war wasteland that he escaped from. He gets people to kill themselves after barely meeting them because he knows exactly what to say to them. Other characters call him an alien. At the end he disappears from the hospital without a trace. I see a lot of people claiming with absolute certainty that there was nothing supernatural going on with Johan, but it's very clear to me that Urasawa left the door creaked open just enough for that interpretation to be reasonable. The problem is there's no definite proof, but that's also by design. The devil never reveals his tricks.
There's more power in the omission than if Urasawa had given him some epic manipulation speeches like in Breaking Bad. Does it mean people are manipulated more quickly and to greater extremes than is realistic? Yeah, but that's kind of the point. You don't know how Johan is doing it. It's scary. And you want to assign some kind of supernatural power to it, even reckoning with human genetic modification to make it make sense, but in the end it could very well have been pure charisma, and that's the scariest part.
If it was pure charisma it would have helped a lot to actually show it at least once. People can and have written charismatic villains and they're usually pretty entertaining.
That's IF it was pure charisma. Again, you never find out, and that's by design. You start out thinking the mystery is "how is he doing all this," by it's actually "why is he doing all this."
I mean I wasn't shaking in my boots, but it definitely helped with the ominous atmosphere to frame Johan as a sort of mythic character with a mysterious omnipotence.
No, it's not scary, it breaks immersion and makes it boring and stupid. Like if you'd have him karate-chopping his way through whole villages instead, it's just dumb. Not that that would be too dumb for anime either.
>You don't know how Johan is doing it. It's scary.
Wasn't buying it, even while watching it I was just like "okay what's so great about this guy" there was nothing. I mean it doesn't take a huge speech to see how a character can be charismatic/manipulative and have followers. Berserk did it pretty quickly and skillfully with Griffith.
The point of Johan was that he wasn't powerful because of anything he said. People just looked into his eyes and were under his spell.
that doesn't make any sense.
That's what's threatening about it.
You're fricking stupid dude
you fricking moron would you like a horror film to explain the paranormal shit at any point?
You stinking moron, don't you know that mystery adds to this halo effect? Black person b***h, you are a Black person.
we're not talking about a horror film or any paranormal shit, we're simply talking about a character depicted as a manipulative smart villain, that's certainly something you should show for your audience to believe, Psycho Pass manages to show a good manipulative antagonist, Urasawa simply lacks the skills as an author to pull it off, instead he goes around and writing vague shitty lines with meme added ethereal music playing in the background like what that anon posted
>we're not talking about a horror film or any paranormal shit
This right here betrays the fact that you fundamentally misunderstood the show you were watching.
>point out how shit the show is while posting actual scenes from it
>y-you just don't get it! you're dumb! you're low iq!
the average Monstergay
It's insanely blatant how much you're arguing in bad faith and for the sole reason that you're absolutely buttblasted at hearing some youtube crowd hail it as peak fiction instead of your favorite anime.
You can't even point out any of Monster's actual flaws, meanwhile posting the most inoffensive scene I can think of, lol. The youtube comments are moronic about it obviously though. Johan just kills people to not leave any trace of his existence.
>You can't even point out any of Monster's actual flaws
the writing is shit
Tell us more about it.
the monster is the purple man from jessica jones but even dumber and without any charismatic scenery chewing
>Psycho Pass manages to show a good manipulative antagonist
Oh the irony, considering Makishima was inspired by Johan.
>Makishima was inspired by Johan
source : your ass
they're nothing alike, Makishima is actually believable
>they're nothing alike
kek, you're hilarious
A terrible analyst all around.
its pretty routine that something that was inspired can end up being way better then the thing it was inspired by... with that being said the only redeeming quality of this fricking boring ass long ass shit pacing anime is the creepy kids monster story segments and some scenes with johan.
you are a Black person, what I meant is that through the cinematic medium, there are many more ways to cenvey things, and often better, than just showing things.
You are a Black person, and either an Cinemaphile gay that's lost and would rather watch death note shit, or a Black person boomer who watches capeshit
Urasawa is good at theming and huge emotional moments but it falls apart at the slightest scrutiny
He spends so much time watablishing Johan as the idea of pure evil that does evil for evil’s sake, and no matter how hard humans try to control him, he is stronger than them. Meanwhile the doctor is the ultimate good, trying to defeat him
This works, as a concept, every single episode exists to hammer this metaphor in your head, but there is no actual story, only a frame of it
It's an incredibly enjoyable watch. I don't know how to describe it, but I guess it really captures the bittersweet sensation of when you're traveling, and making short stops in different places, and you wonder about the people and their lives, and maybe connect with someone very strongly at some point, and then have to part ways after two days. Kind of like the way the train scene in Spirited Away feels. Or Lost in Translation, that really gets at it too. But this goes on for much longer so it almost feels like traveling with the character in real time (he's wandering around Germany and a bit of Eastern Europe, from what I recall), and by the time it ends you feel very connected to it
Just read it. Usually 99% of anime adaptations are boring as frick.
don't even bother, Urasawa has the most boring paneling out there, I challenge anyone to post a single good looking spread Urasawa has made in his career.
by far the most overrated manga "artist" out there, he has no respect for his own medium.
his panel layout is perfectly fine if that's what you're talking about. there is no need for autistic panel layout that all over the place, the best kind is that which is easy to follow.
there 0 individual style in it, his paneling is straight out of some manga 101 textbook, it's dry and soulless, it's like watching a film entirely made out of back and forth shots with no in-between.
It's just classical. He has an understated style.
>I challenge anyone to post a single good looking spread
You fricking brainlet, how would a spread demonstrate good or bad paneling skills? Unless you're a fricking moronic American that read superhero vomit and their "Avengers Assemble" type of double pagers.
The anime is like a 1:1 adaptation of the manga, though. It's just the manga with color, voice acting, and music. Definitely an upgrade.
pic related (spoiler tagged for OP)
It has 74, so I don't know where you got that number. The appeal is in the characters' psychology and the storytelling, which can be pretty ridiculous and have a lot of ass-pulls but is no-doubt entertaining with how utterly winding it is.
>what's the appeal? i just peaked wikipedia and it has 81 episodes
It's kind of boring, but also chill and there is intrigue.
It written at the level of an avarege mistery novel instead of at a capeshit level like most manga so It stands out alot
The author Is great at making you know and care about even the side characters, and the thriller/mistery part Is pretty well done for the First 2/3 but falls appart hard at the end
The anime has a really slow pace and it's a 1 on 1 adaptation of the manga anyway so no point in watching It, ready the maga
read the manga. read all of urasawa's work. every one is a hitpiece
its okay for a while but it really drags out the story over too many filler episodes and the ending plot is kinda moronic
its also weirdly woke with le evil germans abusing the good hearted turk immigrants
>its also weirdly woke
Take your fricking meds.
take your dilator
>Depicting some Germans as evil is "woke", even though the show is set in Germany and 90% of the characters are good people.
You've got brain rot anon.
A doctor goes after a serial killer. His only training? Skipping rope and shooting for a few months.
don't bother, urasawa can't write an ending to save his life and all of his works turn to garbage half way through. There isn't any point getting sucked into a decent premise just to be dragged along through bullshit that is only there to artificially extend the plot and given an insipid ending as your "reward".
Monster is an experience. You dont even have to watch the whole series. You are free to watch some episodes, and just enjoy the 80s Germany vibe with the well-written characters and stories. When you get tired of it, turn it off and forget untill the next time you will want to experience it.
Its really chill, soothing and enjoyable anime, one of the best ever made.
this is the best answer in favour of it I've seen in this thread.
something like this didn't need to be animated at all.
Name a brother sister acting pair to play the main characters that can convincingly crossdress as each other[spoiler]bonus points if they aren't trannies[/spoiler]
Silence of the Lambs
This is easily the most overrated anime. I fricking hate the detective who uses the air as a typewriter, it's so fricking autistic and dumb.
>This is easily the most overrated anime.
yep, I can't believe I sat through all those episodes waiting for it to get good.
this i feel like i was trolled after i sat through 10 episodes of this, its for people who think nolan movies are deep
that's insulting, Nolan's movies are actually entertaining.
>this i feel like i was trolled after i sat through 10 episodes of this, its for people who think nolan movies are deep
Filtered hard
Something that wastes a ridiculous amount of time and has one of the shittiest endings ever made but is still praised by everyone? Avengers Endgame
it's mostly praised by people who exclusively watch anime but want their medium to look "mature" for onlookers.
t.used to be a weeb, that's how I used most of Urasawa's works.
it's really telling how this is held up as the paragon of a mature complete artistic work yet when you ask any anime fan their top 5 nobody, absolutely NOBODY ranks it even among their top 10 unless they're just too new to have seen enough else. Not saying it's bad just that it has a ridiculous reputation
it pops up in other top 5 lists frequently, for example most I often see anime gays put Johan as one of the best antagonists written in the medium, with some going as far as to say he's the best one in all of fiction, not even joking.
Essaygay pogrom when bros?
I hate anime youtubers so god damn much
>what is the movie equivalent ?
something boring and slow
I honestly can't say. I've seen some awful movies, but i've never seen one where the characters talk to themselves and CONSTANTLY explain what's going on. It's like a fricken alien made that tv show with how insane everyone acts on it.
The guy directed Made in Abyss also - which is also atrociously bad.
>I honestly can't say. I've seen some awful movies, but i've never seen one where the characters talk to themselves and CONSTANTLY explain what's going on.
Almost all anime that's not breezy slice-of-life does this. It's a major weakness for sure
>It's a major weakness for sure
But then again anime is schlock so you shouldn't be holding it to high literary standards or whatever. You just have to take and review it for what it is
>Almost all anime that's not breezy slice-of-life does this. It's a major weakness for sure
It's actually a good tactic for certain stuff like Death Note. Unfortunately 99% of anime is garbage, including Monster.
>>It's actually a good tactic for certain stuff like Death Note. Unfortunately 99% of anime is garbage, including Monster.
I hope you don't mean to imply that fricking Death Note, of all things, is better than Monster.
anime is adapted from manga which constantly has inner monologues and japs are just lazy and directly adapt it instead of trying to convey it visually or through the story
I genuinely cannot remember ANYTHING between episode 4 and the last town arc, it's all blurry to me, all I remember is him crossdressing as his sister at times and shooting some accomplices he had or scamming a blind old dude, the story was just all over the place, the villain appears for like 15 minutes in the entire show's run, and when he's on screen he's speaking in riddles while autistically looking at windows and pointing at his forehead to get shot, none of these gestures is ever touched upon nor explained, he keeps talking about some scenery of the end or whatever that is and supposedly everyone follows him to get there.
It's basically how I would daydream about being a supervillain without bothering into thinking up of what my motives are or why my subordinates are following me
but he's blonde! and from East Germany! Evil! Commie Orphanages! very scary!
im glad this anime is getting the hate it deservers
the concept is pretty good but execution is shit for the most part
execution is fine. it's the obnoxious fanbase that brings it down.
You're right this is a board with extremely high standards towards storytelling after all.
Go have a nice day, homosexual moron.
the dichotomy of Cinemaphile
its not hidden any more because a lot blue checks starting shilling it at the same time
The show is worth a watch only for its opening and ending.
Also it's a great pleb filter.
I watched all episodes of this anime and don't remember either that opening or ending, which means it's shit as far as anime OPs and EDs go.
I see a lot of hate ITT and it's mostly justifiable, but I'd argue the entire show is worth watching just for that final arc, the slow burn progression in that town and the chaotic events that unfold are fascinating to watch, the way some drunkard nobody ends up being the one to do the deed was actually really nice, it kind of reminds me of that palace invasion in HxH and how chaotic it all was but still made sense at the end, although not as good as Togashi's writing obviously.
when did Cinemaphile get so anime? not that I'm complaining
Cinemaphile still hates anime for the most part
Cinemaphile once again showing they not only have shit tastes in movies, but in other media as well
Imagine hating something because of its fanbase/reputation.
Quite pathetic tbh.
why is that a weird or pathetic thing?
most people generally do not hate an actual good work because it has a shit fanbase, but when the work itself is bad the fanbase only invites further contempt.
I don't go out of my way to dislike bad manga & anime that aren't very known or universally praised by braindead pseuds.
I'm embarrassed at this board for wasting 100+ replies on this garbage.
>using youtube screencaps as argumentum
absolutely embarrassing, even by Cinemaphile standards
Should have been 30 episodes max there's a lot of irrelevant shit and plots going nowhere.
a show with 200 episodes about watching paint dry yaaawwwnster is soo shit
Monster reminds me of Hitman. Johan is kinda like agent 47 but in a evil way instead of the trained assassin way.
>please guys spoonfeed me the anime because I literally didn't fricking get it
You were more credible when you were saying other writers were better, now I see you're just desperate for someone to explain it to you, holy kek.
Monster is GOATED, none of you pussy homies ain't gonna change shit about it, word.
I wouldn't even mind if you guys were complaining about too many character plotlines conveniently intersecting, or Tenma being a Mary Sue, or all the time spent on reiterating information and recycling footage. But you're complaining about the ambiguity behind a famously cryptic character as though the ambiguity of his motivation and methods isn't the whole point of the series.
>But you're complaining about the ambiguity behind a famously cryptic character as though the ambiguity of his motivation and methods isn't the whole point of the series.
the problem is the ambiguity is there because Urasawa knows he cannot do better, I've seen what happens when he takes a cryptic character and then shed light on him, it turns into the complete garbage that was 20th century boy's ending, perhaps had he not made that manga I might consider there to be more to Johann's character and it's just an artistic choice, but it was clearly done out of an inability to properly write a good character.
>the cinematic medium
monster is still anime, stop larping you dumb ESL weeb
bein animated or serialized or anything doesn't change the media. Cinema is cinema, good or bad.
have a nice day Black person, you're the exact reason why people can't take Monstergays seriously
he would actually be a better character had that been the case, you think people would consider Holden to be such a great depiction of a smart and calculating villain had McCarthy just went down the omission route and made everything he did off-screen?
Omission doesn't work when you omit your entire fricking character off the screen.
why, because I'm right?
God’s entire character is omitted in the Bible, yet everyone does what he says.
It doesn’t matter why he did it. He knew his limitations and worked around them.
Omission is a very valid technique that’s as old as fiction itself, and Urasawa uses it to great effect. You are a pleb if you think Johan would be half the character he is had they shown his methods on-screen, no matter how great his “gift of gab.”
Nothing about his character in any scenes implies he has the abilities he performs off-screen, homosexual.
The way characters talk about him and the actions they perform at his whim do.
He’s a representation of the ubermensch. He is a flawless human being.
I see this a lot when writers want to have an epic master manipulator character but have them actually manipulate people mostly off-screen. The writer just knows they don't have the grasp of human psychology to write those scenes, so pretend leaving it ambiguous is their first choice.
Just like how most fans of this shitty technique call anything they don't like genre fiction and admit fully most classical fiction would be genre fiction today anyway? None of the Cinemaphile gays can write, I've seen that.
There's nothing wrong with omitting such things, a good author knows their limits and how to circumvent them, otherwise you'd end up with garbage like death note which makes 0 sense after 5 minutes of thinking about it.
There are very very few people in this medium who can write believable smart & manipulative characters, Urasawa is a mystery writer first and foremost, he has no need to delve outside of his expertise.
This is just really my opinion. Remember, I see fiction as entertainment and that's all it'll be. Even if you take it seriously it's a passion, not a vital resource. Even 1984 feels like mostly obvious stuff a lot of people can derive from observing society.
But my opinion is that if you can't write the entirety of the world to at least a competent degree, don't write it. Magic systems are good because they put a part of the world on the table and exude the confidence needed to write an intelligent ploy, this makes it more believable. It's why sports are cool to write about because the upper limit is observable in our world
Without hard limits on things everything is random and happens out of hammerspace. What is the point of reading something like that? You're just looking at some schizo making up random things at that point, right?
checked.
>But my opinion is that if you can't write the entirety of the world to at least a competent degree, don't write it.
This is why nerd and pop culture is and always will be fastfood level garbage.
Same with lore gays, which is the same group really.
I disagree, people like you are why. But thanks for explaining why, asshat
I know you're just a Black person Hispanic israelite emulator piece of trash die alone scumbag that should be shot in the street for wasting a god like being like me's time and thus you don't believe what you said, but I think my point bears repeating. A little louder in the back for the /littrannies/.
I still think 1984 is just entertainment but the reason it was so prophetic was that the author exuded a fairly congruent grasp of how the real world operates, btw. His world building was the main character, supporting cast and antagonist all at once.
He is literally me
He is literally me and Naoki Urasawa.
based bonaparta killing off his half-brother then falling in love with his wife, imprisoning her and torturing his niece and nephew, then completely banishing his son then his son falling for his niece. are you and your dad also in love with the same woman?
Both are dragged out for no reason
Lunge sort of explains Johan's manipulation in Another Monster
>At the end of the interview, I asked him about brainwashing — how does one manipulate and control another person this way?
>It's simple," Mr. Lunge stated. He asked me where I was currently living. When I answered Vienna, he said, "Then, can you draw me an accurate map of the city, depicting every single road?" I wracked my brain to conjure up a mental map of Vienna, and began drawing a simple map on my notepad, as he intently watched my facial expressions. When I admitted defeat, saying that I could not possibly draw an accurate map, he took what I had written.
>"What area of Vienna is this?" He asked
>I sheepishly said that it was the neighborhood I lived in, and he responded, "Then to you, this is the center of the city; no, the center of the world," as he looked at me. "When you imagine the place called Vienna, you use your living space as a starting point, and think of roads and places as they relate to your location... And even when given an actual map of Vienna, you most likely see your neighborhood as the center."
>"In the very center of yourmind, just like this map, there lies the foundation of your ego — your identity."
>"But suddenly, your coordinate axis is removed. There is no meaning to this center... there is a much more appropriate center for your heart. This is the reality of what we call brainwashing." He smiled. "And when a human being's mental axis is removed and they are lost, you gently and carefully entrap them with words, not giving them the opportunity to think, offering them a new place to live... You will find that human beings follow the instructions of whoever furnishes them with this new home... They become surprisingly docile."
And Dr. Gillen
>How would he actually go about infiltrating the heart of another person?
>By acknowledging their worth. By never frowning upon their actions, and by teaching them that they are not alone in the world. They are elated, believing they have found their one true friend, the only person in the entire universe who understands them. Or, on the contrary, he might belittle them, lambasting their every move and driving them to the darkest pit of mental solitude and ruin. After doing that, he would simply make a little request. Just kill one measly person, that's all..."
There's painfully little Lunge in this thread.
>NOOOOOOOOO YOU CANT JUST SHOOT THE INSANE PSYCHO SERIAL MURDERER HOLDING YOUR SON AT GUNPOINT YOU DESERVE TO GO TO JAAAAAAAAAIL
>ah poor innocent murdererino I guess I have to save him and let him go haha
urasawa is a hack
>morality and ethics are confusing and contradictory
whoa you really got urasawa
Snoozefest.
david sylvian is great as always
literally me
I want to provide for her the rest of my life I dont care if she makes it awful I love her so fricking much she can have all of my money
Forgive your mother
>implying she wasn't one of the more realistic portrayals of women
All about chasing that status. You can tell there's a person there, but it's just a shitty person be it due to life or other factors.
yes but she Is so beautiful I love her with everything I have she can utterly ruin my life and I will still give her anything she wants she is the most beautiful person I have ever seen inside and out
Real femcel moment
god I want to put 3 children in her I bet she would be a great mother I just love everything about her
that escalated quickly
it's more understandable if you watched the series up to that point of course
Being Eva is abject suffering
>If we dont drive out the immigrants then Hamburg will stop being German!
I mean… he wasn’t wrong
any1 got the manga panel of Evas bottom after getting out of the shower
PLEASE
I got banned from Cinemaphile for making an overrated shit thread
That board is literally r3ddit now
Anyone remember the scene where some guy and a girl are cornered and they have a shoot out and I think the guy dies but the girl lives? I even recall some weird handgun with 4 barrels but I might be misremembering. It was with some side characters I think. They're outnumbered in a shootout. Help me recall this, even link the scene if you can or just give me the names of the characters.
Maybe martin reest ?
Haven't seen it but I'm wondering;
Since it's a thriller about a killer being chased by someone, is it similair to Death Note? Better? Worse? I've seen Death Note and liked that one.
t.normally never watches anime
It's a lot more of a character drama, Death Note is like 95% plot.
>Urasawa
he's a fricking hack, monster is avrage as frick at best and 20th century boys are garbage
i'll never waste my time on his garbage writing again
Cast him.
me
Schaferbros, it's our time to shine
Some gay cringy homosexual weeb shit
The Fugitive, duh
DOOOOOOORRRRCTAH TENMAH
b
>omission
This is why I love Kurapika. All his thoughts are shown. I love this fricking arc
all the great manipulative or smart characters have their thoughts shown, there's not a single character out there whose reasoning was entirely omitted yet turned out to be a well written & believable smart character.
I don't really get how Johan gets such a free pass
I'm looking to write some loldeep like Mushishi and also some other battle shounen shit before I do but I wanted to do some togashi/oda homosexualry at some point. I think it'd be interesting to have an extroverted intuitive (in jungian terms) be a smart character and show his thought process in how he thinks out a multitude of possibilities, I think people underestimate how wise and cunning cheerful social people can be even when dealing with their material surroundings
Introvert or no though I also find Kurapika pretty enthralling ofc. Way more than Light
Left looks like shit. The speech bubble-to-art ratio is worse than the denser Death Note issues. It just screams failed novelist.
It's fun. I know it has a way better power system than a successful novelist like Branderson's. Being successful at novels means little, I mean the Twilight girl? Harry Potter...? HxH is really really good
Magic/Power system Black folk are one of the things that's ruining genre fiction. Imagine a genre so creatively bankrupt you have to use that as a selling point.
I want to gut them all like pigs together with all the writer's workshop teachers preaching "show don't tell" and making every fricking novel read like a screenplay.
>this awful post
this is what happens when you spend too much time away from other whites, touch milk
Great argument friend.
Yeah but we're not talking and never will. There is no way anything I say will be listened to by you and your kind never has anything constructive for me to use. How about you answer
, this would actually help me know if I should care about your opinion on this
'why do I care if you care', exactly. I just take a Roger Ebert approach to shit I like. If I like it I like it. I like a lot of weird things that wouldn't befit or fit into genre fiction (I like silent manga and scenery documentaries and shit like Blame) but some of it does and HxH is that speed. I don't need to justify this shit to some pretentious idiot online and I don't care for these labels
I'm not the same guy anon, I'm a different anon who interjected in your conversation here:
it's much easier to fail at manga than a novel.
>failed novelist
no such thing, especially looking at the sales of modern LNs in Japan.
the guy is first & foremost a manga artist, he knows how to tell a story through pictures when he needs to.
he can when he wants but he's guilty of not doing it way more, it's my favorite manga but the boat arc is way way to verbose even by his standards especailly since he's just spelling out evrerything and often reapiting stuff that didn0t even need to be expaned once
Anyway this is a perfect exemple of his visual storytelling I'm pretty sure he did it just to prove he can
https://hunterxhuntermanga.online/manga/hunter-x-hunter-chapter-339/
I like it because it's weird and interesting, I went over that. It's good. Togashi just writes from his whimsy and that makes him a great author imo, not that I care who's writing it if it's good. That's good to me
I think the boat arc requires such heavy dialogue to set up the conflict and stakes properly as well as to introduce the various abilities at play, it's basically what the first half of the CA arc was like, as the arc progresses we'll begin to see a more visually inclined approach.
I can't read shit at that resolution, but in the case of Monster, Johan is supposed to feel like an almost otherworldly, demonic threat.
Showing too much of him would ruin it.
It's akin Mads in the Hannibal tv show.
Death Note is moronic, but as far as i remember it does narrate all of Light's reasonings, when he sets up shit, aside from the infamous "Keikaku" plot line, which is indeed absurd and nonsensical.
>words words words
It's great. Though I really just feel sorry for Kurapike and want him to be back with his frens at this point. There are people who think like your bubble bro IRL and Hunters are like those people and they're all pieces of shit. The cast to me just read as victims of a shitty system, I am glad Killua got out at least.
Gon's kind of an butthole
So many words to convey such a simple thing: Autism.
this is 50% on the author and 50% on the fan traslation, hxh uses more complex and technical japanese than most manga, fan transaltors are mostly barelly litterete and have a bad grasp of both english and japanese so they end up using 5 words when they could have used one
When writing my own character it's going to be hard because in real life jungian application extroverted intuition tends to look like magic when it works anyway, especially the Ne-Fi-Te variation. I just think clearing up the thought process is the best you can do. I believe that if you can't roleplay as one of your characters for 5 years in a concurring field to theirs and do at least 80-90% as successfully as they do, you probably can't write them well. I'm trying something like that.
Chrollo is such an intellect
>saint peter's cross wearing mass murderer doesn't think Judas did anything wrong
who would've thought
>le omission meme
how about you lot go and read a manga with actual smart and well written characters, pic related and One Outs would be a good start
How do I portray shounen/YA shit when their profession necessitates they kill people, frens? Do I just play it straight like HxH even if it makes them look like dicks?
ITT: overrated shit
except hxh, which is kino
Yu Yu Hakusho > Power Gap > literal dogshit > Hiatus x Hiatsus
nope. HxH is kino. YYH is cool too though