>Go read the story behind Captain America Comics #1. He's a legend for that alone.
The real story is that he was scared shitless and just told everyone he would come down and fight those Nazis.
He did actually kill in war, though, so he wasn't toothless. But that story was pure bluster and it used to be called out as such,
People like to shit on Moore because his early works are so universally beloved and it makes them look edgy. Plus it is really easy with how bad his post-2000 stuff is and his complete inability to not say moronic pretentious shit during interviews. Around these parts all you really get out of shitting on King is a shrug and maybe somebody saying that Vision was alright.
> his complete inability to not say moronic pretentious shit during interviews.
No, you're getting backwards. Moore continually says 100% correct universal truths that make manchildren SEETHE so they either come on Cinemaphile and try to score points by being Cinemaphilentrarian about them or they create and publish shit like Doomsday Clock in a pathetic attempt to take Moore down a peg.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Now tell us the literary merrits of Wendy from Peter Pan eating out Alice from Wonderland.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Seems self-evident, doesn't it?
7 months ago
Anonymous
Never breed
7 months ago
Anonymous
He's like 50/50 on being correct. Absolutely right about superheroes and comics, but pretty fricking stupid when it comes to other things. I saw a quote from him about Conan the barbarian posted on here by an anon and it had to be the most ignorant statement a person could make regarding that character.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The assessment is based on the biographies by L. Sprague de Camp, who was considered an authority on the matter.
Now we know Camp's biographies were libelous.
Moore's never been right about anything in his entire life.
He's been right a lot of the time. Yours is just a knee-jerk response to that anon's exaggeration.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Moore's never been right about anything in his entire life.
People like to forget his ABC stuff (Promethea, Tom Strong, Top 10, LoEG Volume I and II), which ran from 1999 to 2005 or so and rivaled the best of Marvel and DC at the time (to me, ABC was better).
I haven't read it, but Providence also got heaps of praise.
It's pretty much just Neonomicon, Lost Girls, and LoEG Volume III that catch all the shit.
Moore is the Alex Jones of comics: amusing to have around initially until you start to realize how legit batshit insane he actually is
I've enjoyed most of his comics. Batshit creators are the best for a medium like comics.
> his complete inability to not say moronic pretentious shit during interviews.
No, you're getting backwards. Moore continually says 100% correct universal truths that make manchildren SEETHE so they either come on Cinemaphile and try to score points by being Cinemaphilentrarian about them or they create and publish shit like Doomsday Clock in a pathetic attempt to take Moore down a peg.
Shut up, b***h.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Shut up, b***h.
Why? You clearly agree with me.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I do not. I like Moore's comics, not his dick.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You accept his dick into you every time you enjoy one of his comics. It helps that he remains right about everything, though.
> his complete inability to not say moronic pretentious shit during interviews.
No, you're getting backwards. Moore continually says 100% correct universal truths that make manchildren SEETHE so they either come on Cinemaphile and try to score points by being Cinemaphilentrarian about them or they create and publish shit like Doomsday Clock in a pathetic attempt to take Moore down a peg.
and stay mad. Remember about ten years ago when Moore said modern capeshit was creatively bankrupt and running on the fumes of his 80s work and everyone REEEEEEEEEEEd at him but now DC is pinning its hopes on basically Crisis on Infinite Watchmen: Batman v. Rorschach. Moore is always right about everything.
He was really good at coming up with characters and crazy ideas that could only happen in comics. He also had a talent for visual storytelling, which is why Stan Lee would have new artists do pencils over Kirby plots/layouts to learn how to make a page look exciting.
His art was a bit crude even by the standards of the time (DC the industry leader was going for more polished art) but it’s a kids’ superhero comic, nobody cares about crude, they care that insane cool shit is happening on the page.
>His art was a bit crude even by the standards of the time (DC the industry leader was going for more polished art) but it’s a kids’ superhero comic, nobody cares about crude, they care that insane cool shit is happening on the page.
He was really good at coming up with characters and crazy ideas that could only happen in comics. He also had a talent for visual storytelling, which is why Stan Lee would have new artists do pencils over Kirby plots/layouts to learn how to make a page look exciting.
His art was a bit crude even by the standards of the time (DC the industry leader was going for more polished art) but it’s a kids’ superhero comic, nobody cares about crude, they care that insane cool shit is happening on the page.
His panel composition and creativity were insane at the time.
His art looks relatively humdrum these days because his composition was very, very influential. Kinda like how Ellis/Hitch's Authority seems like nothing special. Everybody ended up copying it and made it the new standard.
His compositions, his staging, his action, his choreography. His storytelling, his dynamism. His actual anatomy and art style aside the made comics as exciting as frick, that's why half the characters he invented have lasted this long, it's not the costumes or the stories, it's the fact that when he drew them they came alive. They stuck with you, they were bombastic and exciting. And the reason why they look dated now is because everything that came after is built on what he did. He's the foundation for the western superhero comic. He's fight language and action posing incarnate. And he did it all every day as a 9-5 joe for decades and trucked on come hell or high water.
A shit foundation tbh. Should've been Jack cole's work on Plastic Man. Kirby s tarted the WILDLY FLAILING LIMBS, NO COMPOSITION shit that is why American Fight scenes still look worse than manga.
you're comparing apples and oranges here with eisner and kirby, they had both completely different approaches to creating art. but eisner is probably the better of the two due to the fact that he thought a lot about the language of comics itself as he created.
Trips of truth. I was just comparing them because this is a stupid Cinemaphile argument and someone else was already doing it. I do feel like Eisner deserves more recognition from the average comic fan though.
7 months ago
Anonymous
yeah eisner is probably the better of the two, but kirby is closer to my heart due to the weird crazy shit he came up with.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I think they all have their strengths. If only more recent artists could combine those strengths.
I like to think of Einser as the guy who kept doing art for the sake of it while Kirby went into advertising
7 months ago
Anonymous
That's not true at all, Eisner had the studio, was running a bunch of work, and was doing commercial art like PS Magazine. When he did things like a contract with god, it was after that work dried up and he was a well off man. Kirby was also cranking out pages constantly, when he went onto animation/commercial work it was because he needed the money.
Shoulda woulda coulda, the audience dictates what becomes popular and the medium follows. Plus Kirby was a few years ahead of Cole in the industry so maybe that played a factor. You can hit on Kirby all you want but there's a reason that Cole is in the Jack Kirby hall of fame and not the other way around.
>the audience dictates
No, Marvel just had more cutthroat tactics and a superior marketing machine.
Cole and Kirby started around the same time. Another big factor is that Cole left superheroes in the 50s and eventually took his life before the Silver Age really got rolling.
I like his art even if it is a bit ugly sometimes. He was experimental in a medium that rarely was back then. Also he had some really cool ideas for characters.
That being said the few stories I have read from him have been outright painful reads. Just absolute slogs.
He has the most energetic comic art I've ever seen. I've even seen original pencils in person. Not only are the people energetic, but also static background objects.
>His action scenes do not hold a candle to manga.
You do understand that in the the 1940s when Jack Kirby et all were doing their thing Manga was TRYING to be western comics, literally, right?
If I walked into a comic shop and saw books with art that good today, I'd probably still be reading comics. Comic art today largely consists of sloppy, stylized Bruce Timm-inspired slop, or Greg Land style garbage that has no style whatsoever.
My favourite thing about Kirby's art, is when he does otherworldly realms or corners of space, where he does this weird collage format, it just drives home the alien nature of what these 2d comic characters are witnessing, and I wish it was used to emulate Kirby as much as the Kirby Krackle was
Post art
>appeal to authority
homosexual.
He was doing weird and experiential shit that applied to teenagers meanwhile everyone else was doing dumb kiddy stuff.
What makes OP a legend? His dick is pretty crude and lumpy.
Go read the story behind Captain America Comics #1. He's a legend for that alone.
>Go read the story behind Captain America Comics #1. He's a legend for that alone.
The real story is that he was scared shitless and just told everyone he would come down and fight those Nazis.
He did actually kill in war, though, so he wasn't toothless. But that story was pure bluster and it used to be called out as such,
Stop being a baiting homosexual or at least attack more worthy targets like Alan moore or Geoff johns
Since everyone took the bait, he was a prolific artist and idea man.
His bizarre designs were perfect for four-color comics.
Alan Moore is one of the greats, along with Kirby.
Go shit on Tom King instead.
People like to shit on Moore because his early works are so universally beloved and it makes them look edgy. Plus it is really easy with how bad his post-2000 stuff is and his complete inability to not say moronic pretentious shit during interviews. Around these parts all you really get out of shitting on King is a shrug and maybe somebody saying that Vision was alright.
> his complete inability to not say moronic pretentious shit during interviews.
No, you're getting backwards. Moore continually says 100% correct universal truths that make manchildren SEETHE so they either come on Cinemaphile and try to score points by being Cinemaphilentrarian about them or they create and publish shit like Doomsday Clock in a pathetic attempt to take Moore down a peg.
Now tell us the literary merrits of Wendy from Peter Pan eating out Alice from Wonderland.
Seems self-evident, doesn't it?
Never breed
He's like 50/50 on being correct. Absolutely right about superheroes and comics, but pretty fricking stupid when it comes to other things. I saw a quote from him about Conan the barbarian posted on here by an anon and it had to be the most ignorant statement a person could make regarding that character.
The assessment is based on the biographies by L. Sprague de Camp, who was considered an authority on the matter.
Now we know Camp's biographies were libelous.
He's been right a lot of the time. Yours is just a knee-jerk response to that anon's exaggeration.
Moore's never been right about anything in his entire life.
People like to forget his ABC stuff (Promethea, Tom Strong, Top 10, LoEG Volume I and II), which ran from 1999 to 2005 or so and rivaled the best of Marvel and DC at the time (to me, ABC was better).
I haven't read it, but Providence also got heaps of praise.
It's pretty much just Neonomicon, Lost Girls, and LoEG Volume III that catch all the shit.
I've enjoyed most of his comics. Batshit creators are the best for a medium like comics.
Shut up, b***h.
>Shut up, b***h.
Why? You clearly agree with me.
I do not. I like Moore's comics, not his dick.
You accept his dick into you every time you enjoy one of his comics. It helps that he remains right about everything, though.
Moore is the Alex Jones of comics: amusing to have around initially until you start to realize how legit batshit insane he actually is
No, see
and stay mad. Remember about ten years ago when Moore said modern capeshit was creatively bankrupt and running on the fumes of his 80s work and everyone REEEEEEEEEEEd at him but now DC is pinning its hopes on basically Crisis on Infinite Watchmen: Batman v. Rorschach. Moore is always right about everything.
He's entirely faking the craziness.
Yes, but just because he was scared doesn't mean anything. He was scared AND WENT TO FACE THE NAZIS ANYWAY.
I meant how he drew the whole book in record time because of his motivation.
>His art was a bit crude even by the standards of the time (DC the industry leader was going for more polished art) but it’s a kids’ superhero comic, nobody cares about crude, they care that insane cool shit is happening on the page.
That's how we got Liefeld
He drew iconic characters that would last a hundred years
He drew Steven Universe?
His prolific output. Dude was drawing four books a month at points. Modern artists can’t even do one a month for a full year.
Add in his stellar composition, Co-writing, uncanny design ability and wonderful imagination in general it’s otherworldly how good he was
He was really good at coming up with characters and crazy ideas that could only happen in comics. He also had a talent for visual storytelling, which is why Stan Lee would have new artists do pencils over Kirby plots/layouts to learn how to make a page look exciting.
His art was a bit crude even by the standards of the time (DC the industry leader was going for more polished art) but it’s a kids’ superhero comic, nobody cares about crude, they care that insane cool shit is happening on the page.
Stylized is the word you're looking for, and that was half the appeal. His work stood out in a field that was fairly conventional artistically.
His panel composition and creativity were insane at the time.
His art looks relatively humdrum these days because his composition was very, very influential. Kinda like how Ellis/Hitch's Authority seems like nothing special. Everybody ended up copying it and made it the new standard.
it took me a while to appreciate it too op
Okay, Kurtz
His compositions, his staging, his action, his choreography. His storytelling, his dynamism. His actual anatomy and art style aside the made comics as exciting as frick, that's why half the characters he invented have lasted this long, it's not the costumes or the stories, it's the fact that when he drew them they came alive. They stuck with you, they were bombastic and exciting. And the reason why they look dated now is because everything that came after is built on what he did. He's the foundation for the western superhero comic. He's fight language and action posing incarnate. And he did it all every day as a 9-5 joe for decades and trucked on come hell or high water.
Jack Kirby was an action factory.
A shit foundation tbh. Should've been Jack cole's work on Plastic Man. Kirby s tarted the WILDLY FLAILING LIMBS, NO COMPOSITION shit that is why American Fight scenes still look worse than manga.
it's alright, in this day and age, you can be a complete moron with no taste and still lead to a fulfilling life.
>Should've been Jack cole's work on Plastic Man.
I actually agree. Jack Cole and Will Eisner's art were a lot more animated.
>Will Eisner
I am not going to go full "Kirby bad" but I will say that I like Will Eisner way better as an artist and a writer any day.
you're comparing apples and oranges here with eisner and kirby, they had both completely different approaches to creating art. but eisner is probably the better of the two due to the fact that he thought a lot about the language of comics itself as he created.
Trips of truth. I was just comparing them because this is a stupid Cinemaphile argument and someone else was already doing it. I do feel like Eisner deserves more recognition from the average comic fan though.
yeah eisner is probably the better of the two, but kirby is closer to my heart due to the weird crazy shit he came up with.
I think they all have their strengths. If only more recent artists could combine those strengths.
I like to think of Einser as the guy who kept doing art for the sake of it while Kirby went into advertising
That's not true at all, Eisner had the studio, was running a bunch of work, and was doing commercial art like PS Magazine. When he did things like a contract with god, it was after that work dried up and he was a well off man. Kirby was also cranking out pages constantly, when he went onto animation/commercial work it was because he needed the money.
Shoulda woulda coulda, the audience dictates what becomes popular and the medium follows. Plus Kirby was a few years ahead of Cole in the industry so maybe that played a factor. You can hit on Kirby all you want but there's a reason that Cole is in the Jack Kirby hall of fame and not the other way around.
>the audience dictates
No, Marvel just had more cutthroat tactics and a superior marketing machine.
Cole and Kirby started around the same time. Another big factor is that Cole left superheroes in the 50s and eventually took his life before the Silver Age really got rolling.
I like his art even if it is a bit ugly sometimes. He was experimental in a medium that rarely was back then. Also he had some really cool ideas for characters.
That being said the few stories I have read from him have been outright painful reads. Just absolute slogs.
His originality of design. When you see his art and his design you can't compare to other artists
there's a reason some people call him a great representative of american abstract art
That's amazing
1. His comics SOLD. And kept selling for like 30 years.
2. He was one of the fastest artists ever in comics. Dude was a publisher/editor's dream come true. Never had to worry about him missing deadlines.
3. His art was fundamentally rock solid. Make very few mistakes. On top of that, he was also stylistically unique.
comics code made it so people only knew capeshit, it's easy to seem great by the standards of capeshit
the particles and his HUGE forehead
He has the most energetic comic art I've ever seen. I've even seen original pencils in person. Not only are the people energetic, but also static background objects.
His action scenes do not hold a candle to manga.
>manga
Most manga is a confusing mess and doesn't convey action well at all. Unless you just meant Dragon Ball.
he probably was referring to shonen jump fightgay manga. all of which, despite not being dragonball are heavily influenced by it to a certain extent
>His action scenes do not hold a candle to manga.
You do understand that in the the 1940s when Jack Kirby et all were doing their thing Manga was TRYING to be western comics, literally, right?
NGL that does look more energetic than any american comic I've seen, modern or classic
That's because you don't read comics.
>speedlines make me think things are moving
Brainlet
>NGL that does look more energetic than any american comic I've seen, modern or classic
Have a random page of Sonic the Hedgehog.
Fleetway and Archie never looked this good.
>Fleetway and Archie never looked this good.
That is a page from Archie you smoothbrain.
Heheheheheheheheh.
>His art is pretty crude and lumpy
If I walked into a comic shop and saw books with art that good today, I'd probably still be reading comics. Comic art today largely consists of sloppy, stylized Bruce Timm-inspired slop, or Greg Land style garbage that has no style whatsoever.
>Comic art today largely consists of sloppy, stylized Bruce Timm-inspired
NO ONE in modern comics is inspired by Bruce Timm.
My favourite thing about Kirby's art, is when he does otherworldly realms or corners of space, where he does this weird collage format, it just drives home the alien nature of what these 2d comic characters are witnessing, and I wish it was used to emulate Kirby as much as the Kirby Krackle was
I fricking love his collage art
Interesting ideas, good writing, art feels alive