How are any of these characters except for OL Haman, Haman clones? You could argue Lady Une, Fran, Carta and Banana are similar to each other but not to Haman.
Treize is not a Char clone. The thing that sets those girls apart from Haman is their undying loyalty to their love interest. Une, Banana, Carta and Fram would never try and kill their love interest because they believe in him. They aren't power hungry like Haman is. She didn't want to be Char's lover. She wanted Char to be her lover. She wanted to lead using him and Mineva.
I think she would absolutely 100% submit to Char IF he was guaranted to be faithful and not leave her, but Char is a lying moron who is only faithful to himself. You can't submit and give yourself 100% to a person like that.
I honestly cannot understand why anyone who saw Zeta or ZZ thinks this, because Haman in both is 100% committed to being the one in charge at any cost. She continually offers Char a choice to join her, but only ever to work under her and after she grows tired of it and thinks she has killed Char, she shows only the a smidgen of regret. In a "well, that was a waste" manner. Her attitude is even more explicit in ZZ, where she outright refuses to change or compromise even the tiniest bit to have a relationship with Judau; either he submits to her, or she'll never yield. She outright kills herself rather than accept a world where she can't be the one in charge.
If Char joined her, he would have been a lapdog to her whim, regardless of his fidelity. And honestly, I'm not even sure she'd care about his fidelity, at least so long as he kept any infidelities private i.e. so that they don't affect her public image, and thus her control.
When looking for a Haman clone you need to ask yourself how much does this woman resemble the sexuality and just overall menace of Elizabeth Taylor's Cleopatra?
and say it's complicated. Julius Caesar was nobody's lapdog, but he was still a simp for this woman and building statues of Cleopatra in the temple of Venus. Cleopatra wasn't a lapdog either, never married Caesar, but declared her son with him a God. They had a complicated relationship with each other on their terms, but neither of them submitted to the other.
Haman has abandonment issues. She wants all relationships to be on her terms so she can control them and then maybe that they won't leave. If she can actually let go of her past and her pride and trust a person, then I think she can start having an actual real relationship with someone.
I really do think Cleopatra is the allegory for Haman. Did you know Cleopatra was only 21 when she had a son with Caesar who was on his third wife and in his 50s? I'm not sure if it was love or a power grab.
2 years ago
Anonymous
What you are arguing is not "Haman would be different if Char was guaranteed to be faithful"; it's "Haman would be different if she had absolute faith that Char would be faithful". Which, even taking your reading that Haman's attitude is solely based on abandonment issues (presumably from CDA) as definitive, is a little like saying "if Haman was a completely different person then she could be different" i.e. kind of worthless as a statement about the actual person/character as shown.
Which is putting aside that, just because you have faith in someone and want to be in a relationship with them, does not mean you "submit" to them. That's that kind of power dynamic that only happens in relationships with people who are (a) trying to fulfil a kink, (b) fricked up psychologically and/or (c) have external power to maintain. Which, even presuming that Haman had absolute faith in Char AND that Char actually meant it regardless of Haman's faith in him, Haman would still have external power to maintain, while Char would not. So Haman would be a complete idiot to submit to him in any public manner (and so long as it's only motivated by external power, then there's no other reason to do so), because it would weaken her position and basically invite insubordination for her to do so.
She'd also have no reason to submit privately, unless you are proposing that she be mentally healed of any abandonment issues but instead have some codependency issues. Which is not just "if Haman was different she'd be different", but instead the even more silly "if Haman was different in this specific way she'd be different with this specific outcome". Which, yeah? Of course she'd be exactly what you dictate, if you dictate what she is.
Haman to me was primarily characterized by her desire for power and the will and skill to achieve it. She was leading people, she wasn’t anyone’s subordinate and while one could argue she was damaged…she wasn’t delusional or just flat out insane like Une or a complete moron like Carta.
The only character I can think of who’s comparable is Katejina from Victory, but without the charisma or likability.
When looking for a Haman clone you need to ask yourself how much does this woman resemble the sexuality and just overall menace of Elizabeth Taylor's Cleopatra?
I'm saying that there is this amazing line in the movie where Marc Antony comes to her and he starts demanding shit and she tells him to "Bend the knee". He acts all indignified because Marc Antony is a consule of Rome and never had to kneel to anyone, much less a woman, before. He looks hesitant, and then Cleopatra goes "I asked the same of Caesar, but I demand it from you!"
Please explain because Fuala to me is a completely different archetype.
She's just a brainwashed pawn under Tassilo Vago and never amounts to anything other than being a crazy mini-boss just like Mashymere and Chara.
Is Haman a consistent character between Zeta and ZZ? I feel like the overall writing of ZZ in general is worse than the writing in Zeta so I can't give an unbiased answer.
I will never understand the love for this character. She barely does anything in Zeta and is cartoon villain tier throughout ZZ and gets overshadowed by Glemy.
How are any of these characters except for OL Haman, Haman clones? You could argue Lady Une, Fran, Carta and Banana are similar to each other but not to Haman.
Except for Faula they're all in love with their series equivalent of Char but he doesn't return their feelings.
Treize is not a Char clone. The thing that sets those girls apart from Haman is their undying loyalty to their love interest. Une, Banana, Carta and Fram would never try and kill their love interest because they believe in him. They aren't power hungry like Haman is. She didn't want to be Char's lover. She wanted Char to be her lover. She wanted to lead using him and Mineva.
I think she would absolutely 100% submit to Char IF he was guaranted to be faithful and not leave her, but Char is a lying moron who is only faithful to himself. You can't submit and give yourself 100% to a person like that.
I honestly cannot understand why anyone who saw Zeta or ZZ thinks this, because Haman in both is 100% committed to being the one in charge at any cost. She continually offers Char a choice to join her, but only ever to work under her and after she grows tired of it and thinks she has killed Char, she shows only the a smidgen of regret. In a "well, that was a waste" manner. Her attitude is even more explicit in ZZ, where she outright refuses to change or compromise even the tiniest bit to have a relationship with Judau; either he submits to her, or she'll never yield. She outright kills herself rather than accept a world where she can't be the one in charge.
If Char joined her, he would have been a lapdog to her whim, regardless of his fidelity. And honestly, I'm not even sure she'd care about his fidelity, at least so long as he kept any infidelities private i.e. so that they don't affect her public image, and thus her control.
I'm going back to
and say it's complicated. Julius Caesar was nobody's lapdog, but he was still a simp for this woman and building statues of Cleopatra in the temple of Venus. Cleopatra wasn't a lapdog either, never married Caesar, but declared her son with him a God. They had a complicated relationship with each other on their terms, but neither of them submitted to the other.
Haman has abandonment issues. She wants all relationships to be on her terms so she can control them and then maybe that they won't leave. If she can actually let go of her past and her pride and trust a person, then I think she can start having an actual real relationship with someone.
I really do think Cleopatra is the allegory for Haman. Did you know Cleopatra was only 21 when she had a son with Caesar who was on his third wife and in his 50s? I'm not sure if it was love or a power grab.
What you are arguing is not "Haman would be different if Char was guaranteed to be faithful"; it's "Haman would be different if she had absolute faith that Char would be faithful". Which, even taking your reading that Haman's attitude is solely based on abandonment issues (presumably from CDA) as definitive, is a little like saying "if Haman was a completely different person then she could be different" i.e. kind of worthless as a statement about the actual person/character as shown.
Which is putting aside that, just because you have faith in someone and want to be in a relationship with them, does not mean you "submit" to them. That's that kind of power dynamic that only happens in relationships with people who are (a) trying to fulfil a kink, (b) fricked up psychologically and/or (c) have external power to maintain. Which, even presuming that Haman had absolute faith in Char AND that Char actually meant it regardless of Haman's faith in him, Haman would still have external power to maintain, while Char would not. So Haman would be a complete idiot to submit to him in any public manner (and so long as it's only motivated by external power, then there's no other reason to do so), because it would weaken her position and basically invite insubordination for her to do so.
She'd also have no reason to submit privately, unless you are proposing that she be mentally healed of any abandonment issues but instead have some codependency issues. Which is not just "if Haman was different she'd be different", but instead the even more silly "if Haman was different in this specific way she'd be different with this specific outcome". Which, yeah? Of course she'd be exactly what you dictate, if you dictate what she is.
Do any of these women live?
Lady Une does
Lady Une is forever.
I really don’t see the similarity either.
Haman to me was primarily characterized by her desire for power and the will and skill to achieve it. She was leading people, she wasn’t anyone’s subordinate and while one could argue she was damaged…she wasn’t delusional or just flat out insane like Une or a complete moron like Carta.
The only character I can think of who’s comparable is Katejina from Victory, but without the charisma or likability.
>she wasn’t delusional or just flat out insane
FRICK the Irish.
When looking for a Haman clone you need to ask yourself how much does this woman resemble the sexuality and just overall menace of Elizabeth Taylor's Cleopatra?
Are you implying Cleopatra had fannels?
I'm saying that there is this amazing line in the movie where Marc Antony comes to her and he starts demanding shit and she tells him to "Bend the knee". He acts all indignified because Marc Antony is a consule of Rome and never had to kneel to anyone, much less a woman, before. He looks hesitant, and then Cleopatra goes "I asked the same of Caesar, but I demand it from you!"
That's Haman.
KONNO PRESHA!
hang all hamangays
Thank you for your contribution to this thread. I am sure you reported it and it will get deleted.
That is strangely cursed.
Well they both die so it makes sense
Une was a Haman clone?
Yes. She just lived
>sexually frustrated/scorned villainess dies like a b***h
Haman herself is a clone of Harulu and Myan/Lady Poseidal, really
Haman is the fricking best
HAMAN-SAMA BANZAI
>capeshit in the OP pic
Problem?
Sorry to say this but Gundam is the capeshit of mecha
I wish. That'd mean every universe getting new anime and movies.
Cry about it.
G reco haman makes me ..
BANANA
Fuala is not a Haman clone. There's no Haman clone in Victory. She's more of a Chara Soon clone.
wrong
Please explain because Fuala to me is a completely different archetype.
She's just a brainwashed pawn under Tassilo Vago and never amounts to anything other than being a crazy mini-boss just like Mashymere and Chara.
Barara!
Can we talk about how Jerid is unemployed in this comic? I hope Scirocco shows up and gives him a job.
cute sarah
Is Haman a consistent character between Zeta and ZZ? I feel like the overall writing of ZZ in general is worse than the writing in Zeta so I can't give an unbiased answer.
carta was such a cute dork
it's a shame she died a pathetic death
I will never understand the love for this character. She barely does anything in Zeta and is cartoon villain tier throughout ZZ and gets overshadowed by Glemy.
well she's hot.
but who is best girl?
Haman
I asked for best, not worst
BARARA!
Anya
I love her so much and I hope the OL manga ends with her happy.
i'm gonna say Hairsocks because she's the only one I actually felt bad for.
Lady Une