The consensus is wrong, Prime is boring, ugly and Optimus himself in it is one of the worst parts about it. I like Bulkhead and Megatron though. Beast Wars is the best Western TF show.
Transformers, especially the shows, are for babies and children, Animated is just one of the best of those because it actually has fun with it and knows it's not topping Beast Wars in the "actually a serious and good cartoon" department. A fun show with fun characters > the serious boredom of Prime, WFC Trilogy etc.
>Prime is literally the best show in the franchise, that is the consensus
a consensus of who, you're friends?
Everyone loves the transformer show they watched when they were 8 to 10. G1 gets a little boost because the 86 movie very easy to enjoy and IDW managed to make the characters popular with nerdy high school girls about 5, 10 years ago.
some people think beast wars is best. Others like the anime ones. Some are giant animated fans. Others only like the live action movies. And a couple like prime.
Also, prime kind of falls apart in the later episodes and the backgrounds are bland. I know a lot of the other shows have bland backgrounds, but that should have no longer been a problem by the time of Primes release.
NTA but Primegays have been on the rise in the western fanbase recently, I think they're close to IDWgays or something
there's been some conflicts between them and Animatedgays
it's amazing to me how the Western fanbase tries to present the JG1 timeline as "convoluted" or "nonsensical" when it's nowhere near as bad as fricking Aligned
honestly a lot of the western fanbase is full of barely-concealed anti-Japanese racism, it's nuts
9 months ago
Anonymous
In Aligned’s defense, Hasbro was trying to cram everything into that continuity, even stuff that clearly wasn’t made for it. This is why it’s so schizo and the timeline is fricked.
We got a really cute version of Prowl as consolation, unfortunately he never shows up unless you read the books.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I know, its fricking weird. Because Transformers is the direct result of 80s mecha boom, the Japanese car culture of that time, and Marvel's unique relationship with Toei company. For a franchise rooted in Japanese pop culture and anime, a lot of Western fans seem bitter towards Japan, super robots, and anything that isn't their own Western take on robots.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>a lot of Western fans seem bitter towards Japan, super robots, and anything that isn't their own Western take on robots.
while some of it is IDWgays being Tumblrites and we all know how they are to any Japanese work that isn't as sexless as lesbian bed death, but it's definitely a problem among old guard fans as well
my armchair spitballing is that the older fans do it due to their views on Japan being informed by the paranoia about them overtaking the West that was prevalent back in the day
9 months ago
Anonymous
>my armchair spitballing is that the older fans do it due to their views on Japan being informed by the paranoia about them overtaking the West that was prevalent back in the day
At this point I kind of wish they had.....
9 months ago
Anonymous
It's fundementally a case of "Which expansion of G1 did you like more?" if you didn't move on. If you were an autistic homosexual, it was the britbong comics that are nowadays so coated in nostalgia and old wank that a tank gun couldn't pierce them, if you were just kind of frickboy then it was Japanese G1 and you quietly waited for and kept quiet about having subs actually worth a frick for like 30 years.
9 months ago
Anonymous
it's amazing to me how the Western fanbase tries to present the JG1 timeline as "convoluted" or "nonsensical" when it's nowhere near as bad as fricking Aligned
honestly a lot of the western fanbase is full of barely-concealed anti-Japanese racism, it's nuts
Japanese G1 fans remain the least annoying Transformers fans by virtue of mostly just being /m/ enjoyers rather than exclusively being TF fans
I see Transformers like a rorschach test franchise
The original G1 Sunbow series and Marvel comics were written like any other western science fiction/superhero series of their time and as such future installments in western Transformers reflected this as those two genres changed in the passing decades (particularly when tacticool became mainstream).
Someone brought this up but despite the lack of lasting violence and death (sans the movie), Sunbow Generation 1 Transformers translated well in Japanese
The people writing the series weren't influenced whatsoever by Japanese media but in Japanese perspectives it was a lighthearted but aesthetically cool robot anime and as such with future Japanese Transformers installments adopting more conventional super robot tropes.
At its core, it's the same material but looked in very different ways
It's why I'm so curious about Astrobots since it's Furman writing a sapient robot comic without the Transformers name, I want to see if it's to the Western side what Brave is to the Japanese end of the spectrum
9 months ago
Anonymous
What's interesting too is that most of Transformers writers worked on Mighty Orbots beforehand, with Osamu fricking Dezaki and Akio Sugino at the helm. It almost was a prototype for this East meets West synthesis that Transformers came to represent.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Frick I want more Mighty Orbots. It was so good.
9 months ago
Anonymous
It's just Godmars but actually animated
9 months ago
Anonymous
Except it’s not. It’s Metal Men as a Mech show.
Similar design doesn’t mean same show, they’re nothing alike.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I don't think it's a mattter of leaning into Super Robot tropes since something like J-Decker is a lot like a Transformers show. It's more the Japanese series don't lean into given each robot some kind of quirk or personality. American Transformers had no less than three different "big transport guys" in the form of Skyfire, Omega Supereme, and Sky Lynx and they're all quite different. Was there anything notable about Galaxy Shuttle (aside from being the most bootlegged Transformer of all time)?
9 months ago
Anonymous
>J-Decker is a lot like a Transformers show
The Braves as a series were built off of Transformers. You can see the progression from Masterforce -> Victory -> Exkaiser.
> American Transformers had no less than three different "big transport guys" in the form of Skyfire, Omega Supereme, and Sky Lynx and they're all quite different.
Skyfire/Jetfire, Omega Supreme, Sky Lynx and others all originated from different toylines that Hasbro licensed other that the Takara lines. Skyfire/Jetfire was originally a Macross Valkyrie toy, Omega Supreme was originally an independent "moonbase robot" toy and Sky Lynx was part of a planned but unreleased toyline. They only made them so different because they were orinally massive different toys.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>The Braves as a series were built off of Transformers.
It's a matter of how the characters act. Like the Constructicons all have at least something to their personalities similar to how the Build Tiger guys are. On the flip side there's not much going on with say, the Trainbots or the Victory combiner teams. When you start getting into Brave there's a lot of guys who only show up to fight and could have easily been unvoiced drones like with most Thunder Baron. JP TF and Brave did benefit a little bit from the smaller casts but a lot of times they just have them show up as part of someone's entourage. Hell in Headmasters one of the Trainbots never even spoke.
>>They only made them so different because they were orinally massive different toys.
I meant personality wise. Skyfire has a jovially demeanor that sometimes drifts into flyboy territory, Omega Supreme: Serious Business, and Sky Lynx is a extremely confident narcist even before you get into him being a robot dinobird cat.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I’ve heard that the robots in J-Decker have personality. I plan to watch it.
With Da-Garn, while I wish there was a smaller robot roster and they had a bit more personality, the show’s focus is heavily on Seiji, his parents, and Yancha (another controller of a robot) and how they develop as characters. So it isn’t that there is no characterization or story arcs, it’s just that it’s focused strongly on watching Seiji’s quest to protect the earth and what he has to do, sacrifice, and understand in order to do it.
I haven’t seen Might Gaine but I heard that it’s pretty human character focused too.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Most Brave shows are really about the kids with the robots just their as their guardians and fighting mons. The only Braves that really focus on the robots are Fighbird, and Dagwon because they ARE the robots.
9 months ago
Anonymous
And with Fighbird there's only a handful of episodes focusing on the other robots. Guard Wing in particular gets the most focus but that's mostly because he's a massive prick. With Katori, it's more about him being an alien inside a robot body that's trying to act human. In fact as the show goes on they emphasize the love triangle between him, the reporter chick, and the doctor lady as the show goes on. Maybe they started getting letters from moms who were watching the show with their kids.
9 months ago
Anonymous
People only know this show for the meme but nothing prepares you for how the main character is this pure-hearted perfect husband type. Like an even more wholesome version of Superman.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Did Japan not do filecards explaining personalities?
9 months ago
Anonymous
They did but they never got extended biographies like the Transformer Universe books by Marvel. Their own manga was very action focused with very few character moments.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>At its core, it's the same material but looked in very different ways
Reminds me of this
9 months ago
Anonymous
>transformers + mecha anime >gaogaigar >gaogaigar couldn't have existed without G1
Also why is it just the unicron trilogy, there's a billion different transformers animes
9 months ago
Anonymous
Because the artist didn't really know about anything before what Hasbro calls the "Unicron Trilogy."
9 months ago
Anonymous
Because the artist didn't really know about anything before what Hasbro calls the "Unicron Trilogy."
the artist who made it is legit Japanese so I guess they went with Unicron Trilogy (IIRC that's not technically a thing in Japan) out of preference
9 months ago
Anonymous
It's just a shorthand otherwise the artist would've had to draw BWII, BWN, RID/Car Robots, Zone, MasterForce, Victory, etc.
It's easier to just use the Unicron Trilogy.
9 months ago
Anonymous
What would Beast Wars be?
Transformers + 90's Science Fiction Dramas?
9 months ago
Anonymous
Transformers + Canadians
9 months ago
Anonymous
Consider how much of the voice cast was in those sci-fi dramas (like Stargate SG1) it fits perfectly.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>DATS RAYSIS
9 months ago
Anonymous
Recently there's been gays on TFwiki sperging out and trying to amp up the anti-jap shit while scrubbing both the jokes and anything that might get them canceled on tumblr.
It makes sense though, there's always been a lowkey split since the G1 days that started as ComicsVSCartoon and just quietly expanded from there into JapCartoonG1 and britgaycomics G1. Most of the time it got ignored because getting good subs and shit of TF anime used to be hard as frick because Hasbro actually could and would sue your ass as compared to most pirate subs so it was kinda just ignored, fanbase wasn't big enough or able to communicate fast enough for seething fricking grudgematches or temper flare ups anyway.
A shitload of the tumblrgay shit in IDW was written by fans who were schizos in some frickfrickcircus UK fanmail circle back in the day who naturally fall on the britgay side of that quite little resentment jizzpile everyone used to ignore, and a lot of homosexuals lapped that shit up.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>trying to amp up the anti-jap shit
like what?
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Recently there's been gays on TFwiki sperging out and trying to amp up the anti-jap shit while scrubbing both the jokes and anything that might get them canceled on tumblr.
The original version of Blacker's page was amazing. If you want to embarrass those guys, they still do bad jokes and racist anti-Japan stuff on the Gobots sister wiki.
The consensus is wrong, Prime is boring, ugly and Optimus himself in it is one of the worst parts about it. I like Bulkhead and Megatron though. Beast Wars is the best Western TF show.
She ruins the fricking show because I can't take the Autobots seriously slinging that fricking ass
Genuinely female robots do nothing good for transformers
shit taste, the only downside to the Prime Arcee design is that it's harder to pay attention whenever any fembot with that design appears because of how boner-inducing it is
9 months ago
Anonymous
>apc toys died before they made transmutate and flamewar
It aint fair
9 months ago
Anonymous
Thats literally what im trying to say, how the frick does Optimus Prime not tap that shit holy frick that one episode with Shockwave and Starscream they should've spit roasted her got damn
9 months ago
Anonymous
Remember that the only reason Arcee and nobody else mass-shifts to an insane degree in Prime is because they realized that they made her and Jack too obviously horny for eachother despite a "sibling" dynamic being intended and needed to put up a barrier to try and cut that off at the pass. This is also why all the shit built up around Jack eventually becoming some kind of /m/ protagonist went nowhere.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Prime needs some kind of reimagining comic or something because for everything that was hype there were like 3 plot threads that got abruptly dropped.
The thing that pissed me off the most was Smokescreen and that whole thing with him almost becoming a Prime. When Bumblebee was chosen instead and Smokescreen said something like "that's ok I guess I wasn't the right bot after all" it felt personally insulting.
9 months ago
Anonymous
It almost felt like they just did that to frick with the people who never liked Rodimus Prime.
Oh yeah, Masterforce and Victory doing that before Yuusha.
>Masterforce
i am halfway through this show for some reason and this is some weird shit. i can handle most of it but a few things bug me for odd reasons. Pretenders, headmasters, godmasters, magic powers, etc i can deal with. It makes it feel like a different kind of show than Transformers but that's okay. i've never been a fan of yell-what-you're-doing in anime but for a human operating a cybertronian body it kinda makes sense to have voice activation for things like transforming. But seeing Metalhawk have to yell "TRANSFOOOOORM" when it's something his own body can just do makes me giggle because it's kind of like if a human had to yell "MAKE POOOOOOOP" when they sat on a toilet.
But what really bugs me is not even the fact that Ginrai is driving Optimus Prime's body around but that no one even recognizes it. i know it's a separate continuity and there was no Optimus Prime in this universe but seeing his body without it being him is the weirdest thing about this show for me.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Funnier on how it took like 10 or episodes for Ginrai the character to debut. Feels like a strange marketing and writing decision.
9 months ago
Anonymous
i kept seeing him in the OP and expected it to be Prime. Also in the episode i just watched (the one with the fortune teller and the asteroids) there was a cameo by Hotrod when they showed the battle in space. Also Chromedome but they actually called him by name and he had dialogue earlier in the series, and Sixshot being an occasionally major character, which only makes the whole not-Optimus thing weirder.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Masterforce feels like a follow up that eventually got rewritten to be a sequel sort like like Ultraseven and Skyrider.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Also in the episode i just watched (the one with the fortune teller and the asteroids) there was a cameo by Hotrod when they showed the battle in space.
That was literally just the intro from Headmasters so that tells you how much they were thinking about connecting the two shows. Victory sort of resets things to a universe where the Transformers are common again but also they didn't get The Movie until after the show ended so Wheeljack is alive for cameo.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>literally just the intro from Headmasters
idk, Sixshot featured pretty prominently, and as of ep 24 the weird Destron commanders Giga and Mega are piloting Overlord. It seems more like they thought a lot about connecting the two shows but just couldn't make up their minds about it.
>it's a separate continuity and there was no Optimus Prime in this universe
...Anon....they...the entire reason he looks like Optimus was because he got a transtector that was made for Optimus.
If that is true, then maybe it would have been nice for *anyone* in the show to recognize him. Teh Pretenders know Chromedome as this great war hero but have no idea who Optimus is?
9 months ago
Anonymous
It's true it's just bad writing. Like it was made as a soft reboot but didn't commit to it so they tied it to 2010/headmasters. They at least tried to make a greater effort in Victory and Zone.
9 months ago
Anonymous
The footage with Rodimus and the Headmasters is just the show's intro.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>it's a separate continuity and there was no Optimus Prime in this universe
...Anon....they...the entire reason he looks like Optimus was because he got a transtector that was made for Optimus.
9 months ago
Anonymous
That information is never stated in the show itself. It's from a clip show produced for home video.
Back in college the literally moronic weeb fatass girl at the class liked both Animated and Prime, that can give you an idea of who were part of the consensus.
I'd rate CR higher than BW or Animated. Most people nostalgia-over how godfrick awful both of those started or how assfrick ugly BW was, while the biggest bugaboo people have about CR is pretty much literally a case of them not paying fricking attention with "Hur hur dumb japs say this is G1" because apparently people needed to be spoonfed.
>Starscream was the only good part of Armada
He's definitely the most memorable character. There were like 50 episodes in the show but the only things I remember are Starscream and that episode about a lost civilization
>that episode about a lost civilization
Oh, that one is a good one.
It's always fascinating seeing the insane pretzels that Bayshitters will contort themselves in to pretend that a large pile of incoherent scrap metal and explosions is actually peak cinema. Fricking christ even Bay himself thinks those movies are dogshit, he only did them to get his crew paychecks and fund other projects.
I don't know if he thinks bright colors are gay or childish, but these are brightly colored characters. Starscream is brightly colored and so is Soundwave! At the very least a color scheme would have made it easier to keep track of the characters' transformations instead of it devolving into a murky mess.
>Why can't Japan make a good Transformers series like Prime or Beast Wars?
japan for whatever reason thinks 5 year old japanese kids are both really smart and really stupid. That is their target demographic for transformers for whatever reason. So they think 5 year olds are smart enough to play with complicated $20, $35 $50 and $100 transforming robots but at the same time not smart enough for competent writing, so they dumb all the dialog and writing down for them.
Its fricking weird and I have no answer for you as to why they do this.
America on the other hand I think has always targeted 8 to 12 year olds, but 5 to 7 can also watch if they want.
imo perhaps japan wanted the old G1 show to fail in japan so they wouldn't have to pay the US to licence the show for japan. They might have have also hoped the marvel show would fail so they could replace it with an anime and then licence that to the US like they did some of the shows in the late 90s and early 00s. thats just me guessing though.
>so they wouldn't have to pay the US to licence the show for japan
They presumably didn't have to pay for licensing, they have always owned the rights to it in Japan, because they own the IP to the same extent Hasbro does in other countries. Takara has full control over the brand, and F!SRLF Transformers was something they manned on their own. The only reason the sequel series were Japan only anime was because TF fell out of popularity for Hasbro took keep paying for more episodes, while Takara ponied up the cash to make their own shows since it was still very popular. In fact, Sunbow gained the rights to the sequel anime and their Hong Kong dubs and simply never did anything with them.
Hasbro and Takara aren't competing, they have equal control over their shared IP in their respective regions.
for whatever reason thinks 5 year old japanese kids are both really smart and really stupid. That is their target demographic for transformers for whatever reason. So they think 5 year olds are smart enough to play with complicated $20, $35 $50 and $100 transforming robots but at the same time not smart enough for competent writing, so they dumb all the dialog and writing down for them.
When did Western Transformers have "smart dialogues"?
Because in Japan Transformers is a franchise for babies. The Japanese don't like the idea of sentient robots and think it's childish compared to something like Gundam. They also think pre-assembled toys are for babies, hence why the Prime toys removed decals for stickers and added the Arms Microns as model kits.
>Brave was always, ALWAYS a series that skewed far younger.
Yes, yes. Tell that to the older audiences.
Also tell that to the Gundam Sentinel...or Sandrock (who kinda is but KINDA).
Westaboos? No not really, more like Japan's otaku equivalent to nostalgic Gen Xers. Transformers isn't seen as Western like Marvel or DC are, its seen as a unique collaboration of East and West.
>Westaboo's
Japanese love Beast Wars and that show is filled with nothing but meme for its JP dub.
9 months ago
Anonymous
nips love their meme wars but the hardcore fans import US media
9 months ago
Anonymous
I remember when Cinemaphile discovered a Japanese game review wiki site and it turned out there were efforts from Japanese fans to get Devastation and the For Cybertron duology localized
9 months ago
Anonymous
I though the Japanese DVD actually had the English audio with subtitles (which is fricking rare for JP media) so they could see it as originally intended.
>hasbro financial reports say Transformers is one of their strongest brands >takara transformers are no longer sold at retail and the MP line, such as the trainbots, has become a complete disgrace with awful QC
you know that streaming sites don't report their viewerdship numbers. Everyone in Hollywood is striking over it. And there hasn't been an investor's meeting since it came out so we don't know how successful the toyline was.
The Movie was already a great looking treat on par with DYRL or CCA, if you want something like F91 or Stardust Memory then I'm afraid it'll never be 🙁
I liked Prime, but I can acknowledge that it had problems. The biggest was how concepts felt introduced and dropped, but other stuff was dragged out.
What kept it good for me were the amazing performances and solid character moments. I think in general it had some of the best characterizations for a lot of Transformers.
Only if they swear not to do the stock Trigger plot again. The fact that Cyberpunk ended with the last girl just fleeing to space instead of fighting aliens is nothing short of a goddamn miracle.
Majority of Trigger stuff are not like Franxx. SSSS shows, Kill la Kill, Edgerunners stay in their ground and doesn't change genre in the last 10 minutes.
>SSSS
Gridman was alright, but holy shit if I ever had any faith in the idea that Trigger can't make bad anime Dynazenon would have destroyed it. Fricking plotless meandering mess of a show.
the only thing gridman did was the obvious hentai video edits at sankaku, not even the space harem anime got this.
CEO Confirms Michael Bay still has Absolute Power over the Transformers Films
He was the producer of both Bumblebee and ROTB, but he didn't direct them or write them. And you know what else actually flopped? IDW comic run, which was incharged by bunch of rampant Bay haters.
The only good things IDW did in any order >Shockwave's buttholery >Autobot Megatron >Starscream's redemption arc and PTSD >Starscream's redemption Arc thanks to Windblade >Windblade and her sisters >Bumblebee being a the only Bot Starscream gave shit because he didn't treat him like shit. >butthole Prowl >DJD >Thundercracker and Skywarp Redemption arc and Starscream giving a shit to them because they were his brothers >Starscream's ultimate Sacrifice >Starscream's backstory in both IDW runs >And Starscream and Windblade, on which she cared for him with all of his defects.
She ruins the fricking show because I can't take the Autobots seriously slinging that fricking ass
Genuinely female robots do nothing good for transformers
I loved Animated. It was a love letter to the franchise. They had a fricking Wreck-Gar episode where he was voiced by Weird Al or fricks sake. It's the best.
This, too, is Prime's fault. There was going to be a fourth season, but it was axed so that Prime could run in streaking shit behind it.
Really objective opinions on Prime drop the more you actually know about the circumstances of its creation and how things went behind the scenes. The showrunners of Prime being asswipes was the reason why Aligned was such a convoluted train wreck, and the tard they brought in for the third season tearing up all their plans and shouting that Optimus should be green lost them so much money that they haven't been willing to commit to a high budget transformers series since.
>because no one can
Thats not true. They CAN, it's just that the franchise has been stuck in a creative rut for awhile but nobody wants to abandon the formula and try for something novel and interesting. By the time Prime came out the G1 formula had pretty much been milked dry, and the writers weren't able to pick up the slack with interesting characters. In a way Prime had the same formula as animated, but where Animated had a derivative, but original history, Prime kept the histories of its characters more vague and detached. The lore of the series, trying to establish all these high concepts like the 13 primes and stuff, tried to paint a larger picture while leaving out a lot of characterization that held up the cast of animated.
Getting off animated, Beast Wars and the Unicron Trilogy had fairly unique plots, either setting the war in new locations (far earth past or planet hopping like Cybertron/Galaxy Force) or had some interesting gimmick pullilng it along (minicons). Of course both of these series also gave the characters new and appealing designs/characterizations, where as recently all of the new stories both keep the setting on earth/cybertron, and rely on evergreen designs/characterizations that act more as callbacks and reinforces the popular conception of whatever Optimus/Megatron/Whoever already is. I felt IDW was notorious also for just cannibalizing legacy characters and designs, and when new OC was included they were just offensively bad or just bland.
I may have rambled a bit but I don't think there's anything interesting that can be done with transformers at the moment, unless you do some Trigger animated G1 wank spectacle, and that the franchise needs to be stripped down to its bare minimum, and rebuilt up from the concept of "robots that turn into cars and other things"
>the franchise needs to be stripped down to its bare minimum, and rebuilt up from the concept of "robots that turn into cars and other things"
I want this so badly. The closest you really get is, ironically, the first season of the G1 series. The franchise was in its infancy, they were just barely fleshing out what made Transformers unique, and there was no preconceived notion of what TF should be by audiences. I'd like a hard-reset return to the basics like that.
>Thats not true. They CAN, it's just that the franchise has been stuck in a creative rut for awhile but nobody wants to abandon the formula and try for something novel and interesting.
The formula is like the opposite of the problem though. 90% of the problems in any given series can unironically be summed up as "writers didn't want to do G1 and what G1 did again with a healthy amount of "What's megatron's scheme this week" episodes and wanted to do their own *unique* and *impressive* plot they thought was interesting, usually cribbing something that did work for a 2 part episode or a single comic and making it the entire fricking series, and then promptly learning that "Oh this is actually fricking shit and was a bad idea" before doubling down.
The problem with Transformers is they keep cancelling shows and then rebooting everything while the toys keep going up in price and the quality of the figures gets closer to a McDonald's toy.
Not a show, but Transformers 6 & 7 in their original intended Bayverse films >B-b-b-but Bumblebee/Rise of the Beasts
They're the 6th and 7th live-action Transformers films, but they're not "Transformers 6" or Transformers 7"
You think letting Lorenzo Di Boneventura drill through the bottom of the barrel after trying to insert fricking King Arthur into the movies was a better plan?
Scrapping planned sequels when a movie turns out to be a complete turd is a reasonable response.
Bumblebee did poorly due to how burnt out people were on Bayshit, but despite that got very positive reactions. Meanwhile Rise of the Bayshit had Lorenzo going around telling everyone that the movie would be 100% more Bayshit and ended up being the lowest grossing Transformers movie of them all.
People don't like Bayshit. It's done. Game over. You lost.
I remember the first trailer for Bumblebee having a very accurate "Starscream" transformation and everyone going nuts. Rise of the Beasts felt like it went back to early Bayformer shit where they hide or don't really focus on the transforming. Also despite being a "Beast" movie they didn't really do much with them.
>went back to early Bayformer shit where they hide or don't really focus on the transforming
Really? Transformers 2007 places transformations at the center of the action almost everytime, ILM was busy flexing their new tech. RotB felt very cheap by comparison, in no small part due to its relativd lack of practical effects.
9 months ago
Anonymous
say what you will about Bayformers, those transformations were mind-boggling back when TF2007 came out
I'm sure that seeing the opening scene with Blackout transforming and then wrecking the army base as a kid was one of the things that put me on the path to being a /m/an
These transformation looks like toy shilling rather than goodlooking. Hollywood definitely doesn't need Shoji Kawamori's obvious toy shilling. Sometimes subtle toy advertisement works better, even if the toys don't come out as movie accurate.
9 months ago
Anonymous
the bayformers designs look like absolute dogshit. They are, bar none, the worst mecha designs in any media ever concieved. I'm sorry but if you like those indistinct masses of polygons you are mentally disabled.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I don't care. They works in cinematic environment. This is just like how capeshit costume looks extremely dumb, because they don't work in liveaction. And majority of G1 designs are fricking dogshit.
9 months ago
Anonymous
They're all superior to whatever the live action films put out and if people don't like it then they don't deserve the franchise. Live action is a mistake, nobody wants to real disgusting meat people. 2d is superior
9 months ago
Anonymous
Twilight made a shit ton of money too, I guess it was amazing. Hell it made more than Godfather, it must be better.
Big Bang Theory had record breaking views, guess it’s the best comedy show ever.
9 months ago
Anonymous
They managed to get Barricade's design looking pretty fricking good in the worst movie, absolute tragedy. Jazz's design actually grew on me over time, goddamn shame that he doesn't do anything.
9 months ago
Anonymous
You seriously prefer an Ugly Triangle Bird Midget to that Blitzwing clip?
Are you baiting?
This scene is actually extremely controversial in the Transformers fandom. Bayformers fans had long held that Transformers designs that looked like they were supposed to was impossible, and the fact that the scene received such raucously positive fan reception has made them violently reject it. They genuinely hate it and get extremely mad if you talk positively about it.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>impossible
nah
9 months ago
Anonymous
>>and the fact that the scene received such raucously positive fan reception has made them violently reject it. They genuinely hate it and get extremely mad if you talk positively about it.
People only pretend to like ROTB and Bumblebee. Both of them are box office flops because they feel like IDW gaygshit. No one actually cares about boxy designs or "emotional storytelling". The appeal of cinematic transformers is to look at hyper complex giant robots fight each other. The boxy Kawamori-esque robots don't work in Hollywood and probably in liveaction alltogether.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>THAT DOESNT WORK BECAUSE NOBODY LIKES IT >try it >it works >people like it >NOOOOO YOU DIDNT ACTUALLY LIKE THAT AAAAAAA
have a nice day baytard
9 months ago
Anonymous
>>>it works
like it >>Box office was a 1/2 of The Last Knight
You G1 gays are so sad.
9 months ago
Anonymous
And Last Knight made less than Age of Extinction which made less than Dark of the Moon which made less than Age of Extinction. Bayformers poisoned the well and made people afraid to go see a new movie, especially with all the confused messaging about whether it was a reboot or not.
Despite that it got extremely positive reception, especially from actual fans of the property, who are who the films should have been made for in the first place if the morons had been properly gatekept away. And unless you're as much of a drooling moron as you're acting like, you should know that box office returns don't necessarily make a successful product, or else Fortnight would be the greatest video game ever made.
But then you had Lorenzo di Bonaventura claw his way back into the franchise and run the press circuit assuring people they were discarding everything they liked about Bumblebee, telling people it wasn't a reboot, and assuring people that Bay still had 100% control of the movies...
Paramount CEO Confirms Michael Bay still has Absolute Power over the Transformers Films
https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/paramount-ceo-confirms-michael-bay-still-has-absolute-power-over-the-transformers-films/47839/
...and you can see why most people would give Rise of the Bayshit a pass.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Age of Extinction which made less than Dark of the Moon
Both movies still reach over 1 billion dollars and The Last Knight still gained over 600 million dollars. Bumblebee and ROTB didn't have Bay as main director, both are box office flops, he was just a guy who inject money into these movies as a way to evade tax.
9 months ago
Anonymous
CEO Confirms Michael Bay still has Absolute Power over the Transformers Films
He was the producer of both Bumblebee and ROTB, but he didn't direct them or write them. And you know what else actually flopped? IDW comic run, which was incharged by bunch of rampant Bay haters.
9 months ago
Anonymous
It's always fascinating seeing the insane pretzels that Bayshitters will contort themselves in to pretend that a large pile of incoherent scrap metal and explosions is actually peak cinema. Fricking christ even Bay himself thinks those movies are dogshit, he only did them to get his crew paychecks and fund other projects.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I hate how this style of greentexting infiltrated the whole site.
It doesn't really matter. They won't make anymore. Hasbro is getting out of the film and toy business to chase game money because BG3 made them think the bucks are there.
So according to RotB and TLK, Unicron was going to eat himself? Did past Unicron go into hibernation billions of years ago and then just turned into Earth?
TLK and ROTB are not in the same movie series. Bumblebee was a reboot. Bumblebee and ROTB take place in an entirely different continuity from the first five live action TF movies. The Earth is not Unicron in ROTB.
Wrong but I can understand how you'd think that. Bumblebee was a half-attempt at a reboot but the producers refused to commit to it. In one cut of the movie they mention the "ice man" (Megatron from the 2007 movie) but it was cut.
The producer of most of the movies, Lorenzo di Bonaventura, was temporarily ousted during Bumblebee but came back for RotB, and he's repeatedly gone on record as saying that this is not a reboot and maintains continuity with the Bayverse, no matter how much it doesn't make sense.
>The producer of most of the movies, Lorenzo di Bonaventura, was temporarily ousted during Bumblebee but came back for RotB, and he's repeatedly gone on record as saying that this is not a reboot and maintains continuity with the Bayverse, no matter how much it doesn't make sense.
What the frick is his problem?
Lorenzo is also the guy who is the reason the TF movies are such clusterfricks. He's gone on record as saying that he chooses his favorite script proposals and has them smashed together into one movie. Ever wonder why Last Knight is about evil Optimus AND King Arthur?
>He's gone on record as saying that he chooses his favorite script proposals and has them smashed together into one movie.
That's completely fricking insane. Granted, I guess it payed off considering how much money the first couple of movies made. >Ever wonder why Last Knight is about evil Optimus AND King Arthur?
To be fair, I never actually saw the last movie. Age of Extinction was finally enough for me. Was the King Arthur shit literal? Was there an Optimus Prime sized Excalibur?
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Was the King Arthur shit literal? Was there an Optimus Prime sized Excalibur?
sorta, King Arthur was a normal guy who was helped out by the Knights of Iacon (a group of Cybertronian knights who ended up on Earth)
Excalibur's a thing but it's a shapeshifting artifact that has nothing to do with Arthur (it's never even called Excalibur in sword form on-screen, only ever "the Talisman"; we only know it's Excalibur because of a HasCon 2017 display)
hell, even the G1 episode that was named "A Decepticon Raider in King Arthur's Court" didn't have anything Arthurian in it at all, I know the name is a Twain reference but you'd think they'd take the opportunity to put some Knights of the Round Table stuff in there Arthurian myth is /m/ because Kay was basically fricking Ultraman in the early stories
G1 Transformers has a big fujoshi audience because it's exactly like Saint Seiya, LoGH, Touken Ranbu, or any other franchise that's 90% male characters.
honestly i don't even care about the pronoun shit, earthspark is just fugly aesthetically
kids deserve shit that looks cool, not this weird looking shit
Some of the designs, like Soundwave and the fembots seekers are pretty good though. The drone girl and the motorcycle guy are dogshit tier designs though
Honest to god, Drone chick actually does look better in animation. Had to sit through this while while sitting for family, and the biggest problems are the fact that the story can't sell you on megs actually signing on with the autobots, and the fact that the bike, the owl, and the girl are all godfrick awful, though somehow the owl's the least painful of those three. Despite a cringy as shit name the van chick's somehow basically alright and the drone's pretty decent.
The mom's pretty bad though and at one point I was half expecting some schizo IDW reveal that Megatron was going to be the kids real dad somefrickinghow because this did have input from the same homosexuals who made cybertronian Mpreg with a human child canon, and the dad was coming off as that cucked and neglected.
I'd say the inclusivity quota hasn't been this bad since Chip was introduced in the first series, there are countless times where he outright saves the Autobots by using their technology better than them and the message comes across as "It's okay if you're disabled, so long as you're a genius and perfect at everything else."
>this is what Simon Furman meant when he wanted them to be genderless
unknowingly, yeah. Though in practice, not seeing gender or race ususally operates under the assumption that the person saying it is the standard.
If a white straight man says he doesnt see gender or race, he sees white straight men as the default. If a white straight woman says it, she sees white straight women as the default.
Liberals can be just as bigoted as conservatives if they dont think about what they are saying.
"The question that once haunted my being has been answered. The future is not fixed, and my choices are my own. And yet, how ironic... for I now find that I have no choice at all! I am a warrior... let the battle be joined."
IIRC the first Sentai to do it was Liveman which was indeed after Transformers started to peter out. Ironically one of the power up robots had an unabashed Optimus Prime head. That head design isn't even common in Transformers itself.
The Michael Bay Transformers movies are one of the closest things to true evil I have ever seen in art. They have no stories no artistic merit, they simply serve as jingoistic celebrations of violence and profit. They are genuinely something that only a degenerated race like Orcs could create.
You people are the biggest fricking drama queens on the planet. Hyperbole after hyperbole after hyperbole about how big bad Bay ruined your childhoods.
They might not be high art but you're delusional if you think these films aren't at least partially written with some sort of heart. The main premise of TF 2007 was a boy and his car, and several scenes throughout the series show that even loud nosiy blockbusters can have some heart. The whole scene with Bumblebee first revealing himself to Sam and Mikaela was great and the Autobots' arrival to Earth was awe-inspiring.
Armada and Cybertron are my favorite shows along with Victory and Beast Wars and the Binaltech toyline and even I happen to think the Bay films have at least a little bit of heart which is insane when you consider that the man didn't even give a shit about TF at first until some Hasbro employees gave him a rundown on the history of the series.
So what I'm trying to say is, grow the frick up already and stop being an eternal victim.
Bayverse isn't even in my top 10 favorite iterations of the franchise. I'm just sick of hearing some ass-blasted little b***h cry about how MICHAEL BAY RUINED MAH CHILDHOOD WHY THE FRICK ISNT THIS AN EXACT COPY OF [INSERT FAVORITE SERIES HERE], and I can at least respect Bay for trying to do his own thing. I don't really even care about Transformers being mature or serious but I would 100% take that over shit like Cyberse/EarthSpark because at the very least the Bayverse gave use license vehicles and fun toys which is more than I can say for either of those series.
>I can at least respect Bay for trying to do his own thing
Except what he did was fricking awful and actively shit on the thing he was supposed to be adapting. Just because something is different doesn't mean it's good.
Bayverse has the worst mechanical design than any /m/ related thing I've ever seen and it has nothing to do with being Transformers, and I never grew up with the G1 cartoon.
Also this. It's fricking embarrassing that they tried to sell those hideous buckets of scrap metal as robots, and it fricked with all western mechanical design in film to this day. They look fricking awful in motion, and it doesn't help that Bay is one of the worst cinematographers in the business so combined with those awful designs you just have scene after scene of indistinct CGI vomit on screen
>indistinct CGI vomit
I get not liking the designs but if you actually have a hard time seeing what's on the screen, you might need to get your eyes checked
9 months ago
Anonymous
Wow you got him
9 months ago
Anonymous
Since Bay has no understanding of basic filmmaking concepts, he didn't know that your characters should stand out distinctly from your backgrounds and from one another. I know you're coping but you can't sit there and tell me that even anything on camera in those movies is coherent.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I'm glad animated got axed to make way for more bay
Bayverse has the worst mechanical design than any /m/ related thing I've ever seen and it has nothing to do with being Transformers, and I never grew up with the G1 cartoon.
if I could press a button and instantly kill everyone even tangentally associated with the production of the michael bay transformers movies I couldn't be kept away from it by chains
You know what actually ruined my childhood? Beast Machines.
>Let's make a direct sequel as if it it wasn't a direct sequel
????? Dan DiDio why >Let's make an entire toyline with good designs then use different ones in the show
At least I loved them. Vehicons were the best though
EVERYONE SHUT THE FRICK UP
There's no real best Transformers animated series, each ones has it different shares of flaws. The consensus is that the most solid ones are Beast Wars, Prime and Animated. After those, Victory, Armada, G1, Cyberverse and Rescue Bots. Do we AGREE on that?
Beast Wars is objectively the best Transformers show >but muh ugly CG
that's irrelevant to the actual quality and it gets better literally within the 1st season anyway, if you have this opinion you have to be 18 to post here
Beast Wars is objectively the best Transformers show >but muh ugly CG
that's irrelevant to the actual quality and it gets better literally within the 1st season anyway, if you have this opinion you have to be 18 to post here
Yeah I'd say Beast Wars is the best overall followed by Animated.
Since Bay has no understanding of basic filmmaking concepts, he didn't know that your characters should stand out distinctly from your backgrounds and from one another. I know you're coping but you can't sit there and tell me that even anything on camera in those movies is coherent.
Bay is a superbly talented filmmaker. >you can't sit there and tell me that even anything on camera in those movies is coherent
I can actually. The action is incredibly easy to follow unless you're purposefully lowering the brightness and/or contrast on your tv.
I find that quite the humorous statement. His only bad film in the last decade was 6 underground which he admitted was more experimental in the manner it was filmed. Even then, the major flaw in that movie was the choice of script and not any major errors in Bay's mise-en-scene.
You can say what you want about The Last Knight but then again it had the same problem.
Bay's supreme talent for grand and/or lavish visual sense and kinetic action is best on display (in the last decade) in Pain And Gain and 13 Hours, but it is unfortunate he didn't put in the effort for Transformers 4 and 5 that he did for 1 and 3.
Better to just make two different movies at that point.
Bay is an auteur
Prime isn't bad, but I'm honestly surprised that people regard it as highly as Beast Wars. >Decepticons are pretty good, while the Autobot cast is a pale shadow of earlier incarnations >Most of the action scenes are skirmishes against low-level goons, doesn't help that everyone uses the same tactics/techniques >Wants to be dark and gritty, but doesn't really commit to it outside of flashbacks and select episodes
Then again I've only seen the first season, so maybe it got better at some of these things as it goes along.
Dreadwing was the best part of Prime
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Bay is an autist
ftfw. He man is a fricking hack who can't make anything more than commercials. His movies are nothing but product placement, shilling for the US Military, and incoherent shakycam """"action"""" scenes. He is the single worst hollywood director and it's not even a contest.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>no arguments >never demonstrates that he knows what an auteur is or what mise-en-scene is
that's what I thought
keep being mad, your brain is stuck back in 2008 pop-culture.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>ACTUALLY BAD THING IS..... LE GOOD!!!1111
uh oh reddit moment!
9 months ago
Anonymous
>crying this hard
why? just accept that you've been proven wrong and move on, like an adult.
Tony Todd is often a high point of any show.
I also really liked Sobolov on the show
9 months ago
Anonymous
proven wrong by what exactly? I have Bay's entire filmography proving me right, and all you can say is "nu uh he's le goated!"
9 months ago
Anonymous
I have posted evidence demonstrating the skills I have claimed he has and you have posted nothing in favor of your own position. All you've done is say "no that doesn't count it just proves me right" without saying why or how. You've also posted nothing in refutation of my points.
Incredible amounts of cope and delusion.
Keep being mad
9 months ago
Anonymous
you posted three youtube videos made by a blithering incompetent who doesn't understand basic filmmaking.
Honestly of all the people in the movie industry Michael Bay is the one who deserves to be literally executed for his crimes against the artform.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>continues to assert his point with no evidence
Delusional lmfao
I can only imagine the state of pure seethe you're in right now
9 months ago
Anonymous
what "evidence" is required beyond his own work? You're losing it, kiddo
9 months ago
Anonymous
>still posting without any arguments
8 months ago
Anonymous
The TF film series is the anti-Reddit excluding TLK, Bumblebee, and ROTB
Only redditors mald over Bayformers
8 months ago
Anonymous
reddit LOVES bayshit
8 months ago
Anonymous
Reddit is a constant state of malding because of shit like the twins, the racial stereotypes, oversexualization, etc etc.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Only on Cinemaphile could you find a contrarian moron to defend the twins.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I'm sure at least a couple of toy reviewers like or tolerate the twins. In either case, I wasn't defending them, I was just saying that they make redditors like yourself mald. Stay on topic.
8 months ago
Anonymous
reddit LOVES bayshit
Imagine trying to falseflag this hard
9 months ago
Anonymous
Tony Todd is often a high point of any show.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Bay is an auteur
is that why Anthony Anderson ate all the donuts
Prime isn't bad, but I'm honestly surprised that people regard it as highly as Beast Wars. >Decepticons are pretty good, while the Autobot cast is a pale shadow of earlier incarnations >Most of the action scenes are skirmishes against low-level goons, doesn't help that everyone uses the same tactics/techniques >Wants to be dark and gritty, but doesn't really commit to it outside of flashbacks and select episodes
Then again I've only seen the first season, so maybe it got better at some of these things as it goes along.
>Then again I've only seen the first season, so maybe it got better at some of these things as it goes along.
It does. The action in particular got a lot more inventive, which I expect is down to people becoming more familiar with their rendering software.
This is why Japs need US collaboration and input to make their stuff feasible. It's like how a lot of US studios outsource cel animation to Japan while American writers were in charge of the story and characters. Japan is good at following orders not taking the helm.
>muh Transformers lore is treated just like Greek mythology
This was what I hated most about Aligned continuity. I like corny pulpy sci-fi and that's all it was beforehand, then somewhere along the line Amerilards weren't happy with it so they wanted something more Marvel adjacent with this moronic Aligned lore.
>he
nice try. You said "Americans wanted to make Transformers more like Marvel" without actually knowing anything about Transformers.
You have to go back. Twitter is more your speed; they'll coddle your moronation I'm sure.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>You said
No I didn't >without actually knowing anything about Transformers
Project much? How do you know how much he knows?
Transformers has never been owned by Marvel and hasn't been published by Marvel since the 90s >"Americans wanted to make Transformers more like Marvel"
what he meant by this, if you knew anything about Transformers (clearly you don't) is that the purpose of the aligned continuity was to use it as a "shared universe" the way that marvel had a single continuity for their movies in the same time period
You're too much of a redditor to admit this though
9 months ago
Anonymous
You're the one who didn't know G1's origins so it's funny that you're going around accusing other people of not knowing about transformers because you're mad
9 months ago
Anonymous
I'm that anon, yes I know G1 was in the most *literal* sense penned at Marvel, but what I'm referring to is exactly what that other anon was saying. It was Marvel only in name and felt more like 60s and 70s sci-fi. Prime took that and tried to make something like the MCU with Transformers, which it never was like that in terms of story to begin with.
on the topic of the Bay movies, the 2007 film is mostly decent and indeed with a bit more editing(there's a lot of chaff that could be trimmed out from both the hackers sideplot and from most of Sam's scenes prior to Barricade interrogating him) it could have been full on good, not sure there's any way to salvage Revenge of The Fallen from the mess we got, and Dark of The Moon is overall decent enough but it does suffer a bit from being a bit unnecessarily grim for the kind of film it is, never got around to seeing AOE or LK, or BB or ROTB so can't really judge those meaningfully
will say though if nothing else the thing I appreciate the most about the Bay series is that they're willing to get weird with the TF designs, especially with the Decepticons all being a bunch of weird Goblins, Orcs, and Trolls, the onscreen execution of this doesn't always land but the effort is appreciated(and it has lead to some fantastic toys being made)
>I appreciate the most about the Bay series is that they're willing to get weird with the TF designs
In the first 3, they attempted designs with as little mass shifting as possible, which is why Star Scream ended up being so wide. In 4 and 5 there's a ton of mass-shifting and cybertronians rarely transform on-screen.
>In the first 3, they attempted designs with as little mass shifting as possible, which is why Star Scream ended up being so wide.
that definitely is part of it
>In 4 and 5 there's a ton of mass-shifting and cybertronians rarely transform on-screen.
true(based on the handful of clips from those two I've seen), though still some good designs in both(particularly TLK Megatron and his crew)
>mostly decent
bumblebee pisses on a guy
>bumblebee pisses on a guy
a bit juvenile but funny(and let's be honest TF07 era Simmons was a jackass who deserved it)
>transformers
>good
Frick off Cinemaphilecksucker
>>Good
Western TF are cuckshit.
>Western TF are cuckshit
Beast Wars is good but Prime is ugly and dull, if you're gonna use Western TF as your example you should mention Animated or Rescue Bots.
Prime is literally the best show in the franchise, that is the consensus
The consensus is wrong, Prime is boring, ugly and Optimus himself in it is one of the worst parts about it. I like Bulkhead and Megatron though. Beast Wars is the best Western TF show.
Prime is so fricking boring, it reminds me of the original RiD with how small everything feels but at least RiD had good designs.
Animated is baby garbage.
Transformers, especially the shows, are for babies and children, Animated is just one of the best of those because it actually has fun with it and knows it's not topping Beast Wars in the "actually a serious and good cartoon" department. A fun show with fun characters > the serious boredom of Prime, WFC Trilogy etc.
>Prime is literally the best show in the franchise, that is the consensus
a consensus of who, you're friends?
Everyone loves the transformer show they watched when they were 8 to 10. G1 gets a little boost because the 86 movie very easy to enjoy and IDW managed to make the characters popular with nerdy high school girls about 5, 10 years ago.
some people think beast wars is best. Others like the anime ones. Some are giant animated fans. Others only like the live action movies. And a couple like prime.
Also, prime kind of falls apart in the later episodes and the backgrounds are bland. I know a lot of the other shows have bland backgrounds, but that should have no longer been a problem by the time of Primes release.
NTA but Primegays have been on the rise in the western fanbase recently, I think they're close to IDWgays or something
there's been some conflicts between them and Animatedgays
Japanese G1 fans remain the least annoying Transformers fans by virtue of mostly just being /m/ enjoyers rather than exclusively being TF fans
it's amazing to me how the Western fanbase tries to present the JG1 timeline as "convoluted" or "nonsensical" when it's nowhere near as bad as fricking Aligned
honestly a lot of the western fanbase is full of barely-concealed anti-Japanese racism, it's nuts
In Aligned’s defense, Hasbro was trying to cram everything into that continuity, even stuff that clearly wasn’t made for it. This is why it’s so schizo and the timeline is fricked.
We got a really cute version of Prowl as consolation, unfortunately he never shows up unless you read the books.
I know, its fricking weird. Because Transformers is the direct result of 80s mecha boom, the Japanese car culture of that time, and Marvel's unique relationship with Toei company. For a franchise rooted in Japanese pop culture and anime, a lot of Western fans seem bitter towards Japan, super robots, and anything that isn't their own Western take on robots.
>a lot of Western fans seem bitter towards Japan, super robots, and anything that isn't their own Western take on robots.
while some of it is IDWgays being Tumblrites and we all know how they are to any Japanese work that isn't as sexless as lesbian bed death, but it's definitely a problem among old guard fans as well
my armchair spitballing is that the older fans do it due to their views on Japan being informed by the paranoia about them overtaking the West that was prevalent back in the day
>my armchair spitballing is that the older fans do it due to their views on Japan being informed by the paranoia about them overtaking the West that was prevalent back in the day
At this point I kind of wish they had.....
It's fundementally a case of "Which expansion of G1 did you like more?" if you didn't move on. If you were an autistic homosexual, it was the britbong comics that are nowadays so coated in nostalgia and old wank that a tank gun couldn't pierce them, if you were just kind of frickboy then it was Japanese G1 and you quietly waited for and kept quiet about having subs actually worth a frick for like 30 years.
I see Transformers like a rorschach test franchise
The original G1 Sunbow series and Marvel comics were written like any other western science fiction/superhero series of their time and as such future installments in western Transformers reflected this as those two genres changed in the passing decades (particularly when tacticool became mainstream).
Someone brought this up but despite the lack of lasting violence and death (sans the movie), Sunbow Generation 1 Transformers translated well in Japanese
The people writing the series weren't influenced whatsoever by Japanese media but in Japanese perspectives it was a lighthearted but aesthetically cool robot anime and as such with future Japanese Transformers installments adopting more conventional super robot tropes.
At its core, it's the same material but looked in very different ways
It's why I'm so curious about Astrobots since it's Furman writing a sapient robot comic without the Transformers name, I want to see if it's to the Western side what Brave is to the Japanese end of the spectrum
What's interesting too is that most of Transformers writers worked on Mighty Orbots beforehand, with Osamu fricking Dezaki and Akio Sugino at the helm. It almost was a prototype for this East meets West synthesis that Transformers came to represent.
Frick I want more Mighty Orbots. It was so good.
It's just Godmars but actually animated
Except it’s not. It’s Metal Men as a Mech show.
Similar design doesn’t mean same show, they’re nothing alike.
I don't think it's a mattter of leaning into Super Robot tropes since something like J-Decker is a lot like a Transformers show. It's more the Japanese series don't lean into given each robot some kind of quirk or personality. American Transformers had no less than three different "big transport guys" in the form of Skyfire, Omega Supereme, and Sky Lynx and they're all quite different. Was there anything notable about Galaxy Shuttle (aside from being the most bootlegged Transformer of all time)?
>J-Decker is a lot like a Transformers show
The Braves as a series were built off of Transformers. You can see the progression from Masterforce -> Victory -> Exkaiser.
> American Transformers had no less than three different "big transport guys" in the form of Skyfire, Omega Supereme, and Sky Lynx and they're all quite different.
Skyfire/Jetfire, Omega Supreme, Sky Lynx and others all originated from different toylines that Hasbro licensed other that the Takara lines. Skyfire/Jetfire was originally a Macross Valkyrie toy, Omega Supreme was originally an independent "moonbase robot" toy and Sky Lynx was part of a planned but unreleased toyline. They only made them so different because they were orinally massive different toys.
>The Braves as a series were built off of Transformers.
It's a matter of how the characters act. Like the Constructicons all have at least something to their personalities similar to how the Build Tiger guys are. On the flip side there's not much going on with say, the Trainbots or the Victory combiner teams. When you start getting into Brave there's a lot of guys who only show up to fight and could have easily been unvoiced drones like with most Thunder Baron. JP TF and Brave did benefit a little bit from the smaller casts but a lot of times they just have them show up as part of someone's entourage. Hell in Headmasters one of the Trainbots never even spoke.
>>They only made them so different because they were orinally massive different toys.
I meant personality wise. Skyfire has a jovially demeanor that sometimes drifts into flyboy territory, Omega Supreme: Serious Business, and Sky Lynx is a extremely confident narcist even before you get into him being a robot dinobird cat.
I’ve heard that the robots in J-Decker have personality. I plan to watch it.
With Da-Garn, while I wish there was a smaller robot roster and they had a bit more personality, the show’s focus is heavily on Seiji, his parents, and Yancha (another controller of a robot) and how they develop as characters. So it isn’t that there is no characterization or story arcs, it’s just that it’s focused strongly on watching Seiji’s quest to protect the earth and what he has to do, sacrifice, and understand in order to do it.
I haven’t seen Might Gaine but I heard that it’s pretty human character focused too.
Most Brave shows are really about the kids with the robots just their as their guardians and fighting mons. The only Braves that really focus on the robots are Fighbird, and Dagwon because they ARE the robots.
And with Fighbird there's only a handful of episodes focusing on the other robots. Guard Wing in particular gets the most focus but that's mostly because he's a massive prick. With Katori, it's more about him being an alien inside a robot body that's trying to act human. In fact as the show goes on they emphasize the love triangle between him, the reporter chick, and the doctor lady as the show goes on. Maybe they started getting letters from moms who were watching the show with their kids.
People only know this show for the meme but nothing prepares you for how the main character is this pure-hearted perfect husband type. Like an even more wholesome version of Superman.
Did Japan not do filecards explaining personalities?
They did but they never got extended biographies like the Transformer Universe books by Marvel. Their own manga was very action focused with very few character moments.
>At its core, it's the same material but looked in very different ways
Reminds me of this
>transformers + mecha anime
>gaogaigar
>gaogaigar couldn't have existed without G1
Also why is it just the unicron trilogy, there's a billion different transformers animes
Because the artist didn't really know about anything before what Hasbro calls the "Unicron Trilogy."
the artist who made it is legit Japanese so I guess they went with Unicron Trilogy (IIRC that's not technically a thing in Japan) out of preference
It's just a shorthand otherwise the artist would've had to draw BWII, BWN, RID/Car Robots, Zone, MasterForce, Victory, etc.
It's easier to just use the Unicron Trilogy.
What would Beast Wars be?
Transformers + 90's Science Fiction Dramas?
Transformers + Canadians
Consider how much of the voice cast was in those sci-fi dramas (like Stargate SG1) it fits perfectly.
>DATS RAYSIS
Recently there's been gays on TFwiki sperging out and trying to amp up the anti-jap shit while scrubbing both the jokes and anything that might get them canceled on tumblr.
It makes sense though, there's always been a lowkey split since the G1 days that started as ComicsVSCartoon and just quietly expanded from there into JapCartoonG1 and britgaycomics G1. Most of the time it got ignored because getting good subs and shit of TF anime used to be hard as frick because Hasbro actually could and would sue your ass as compared to most pirate subs so it was kinda just ignored, fanbase wasn't big enough or able to communicate fast enough for seething fricking grudgematches or temper flare ups anyway.
A shitload of the tumblrgay shit in IDW was written by fans who were schizos in some frickfrickcircus UK fanmail circle back in the day who naturally fall on the britgay side of that quite little resentment jizzpile everyone used to ignore, and a lot of homosexuals lapped that shit up.
>trying to amp up the anti-jap shit
like what?
>Recently there's been gays on TFwiki sperging out and trying to amp up the anti-jap shit while scrubbing both the jokes and anything that might get them canceled on tumblr.
The original version of Blacker's page was amazing. If you want to embarrass those guys, they still do bad jokes and racist anti-Japan stuff on the Gobots sister wiki.
Says my dick Motorcycle Arcee is fricking hot
She ruins the fricking show because I can't take the Autobots seriously slinging that fricking ass
Genuinely female robots do nothing good for transformers
we get it, you're gay
gay
shit taste, the only downside to the Prime Arcee design is that it's harder to pay attention whenever any fembot with that design appears because of how boner-inducing it is
>apc toys died before they made transmutate and flamewar
It aint fair
Thats literally what im trying to say, how the frick does Optimus Prime not tap that shit holy frick that one episode with Shockwave and Starscream they should've spit roasted her got damn
Remember that the only reason Arcee and nobody else mass-shifts to an insane degree in Prime is because they realized that they made her and Jack too obviously horny for eachother despite a "sibling" dynamic being intended and needed to put up a barrier to try and cut that off at the pass. This is also why all the shit built up around Jack eventually becoming some kind of /m/ protagonist went nowhere.
Prime needs some kind of reimagining comic or something because for everything that was hype there were like 3 plot threads that got abruptly dropped.
The thing that pissed me off the most was Smokescreen and that whole thing with him almost becoming a Prime. When Bumblebee was chosen instead and Smokescreen said something like "that's ok I guess I wasn't the right bot after all" it felt personally insulting.
It almost felt like they just did that to frick with the people who never liked Rodimus Prime.
>Masterforce
i am halfway through this show for some reason and this is some weird shit. i can handle most of it but a few things bug me for odd reasons. Pretenders, headmasters, godmasters, magic powers, etc i can deal with. It makes it feel like a different kind of show than Transformers but that's okay. i've never been a fan of yell-what-you're-doing in anime but for a human operating a cybertronian body it kinda makes sense to have voice activation for things like transforming. But seeing Metalhawk have to yell "TRANSFOOOOORM" when it's something his own body can just do makes me giggle because it's kind of like if a human had to yell "MAKE POOOOOOOP" when they sat on a toilet.
But what really bugs me is not even the fact that Ginrai is driving Optimus Prime's body around but that no one even recognizes it. i know it's a separate continuity and there was no Optimus Prime in this universe but seeing his body without it being him is the weirdest thing about this show for me.
Funnier on how it took like 10 or episodes for Ginrai the character to debut. Feels like a strange marketing and writing decision.
i kept seeing him in the OP and expected it to be Prime. Also in the episode i just watched (the one with the fortune teller and the asteroids) there was a cameo by Hotrod when they showed the battle in space. Also Chromedome but they actually called him by name and he had dialogue earlier in the series, and Sixshot being an occasionally major character, which only makes the whole not-Optimus thing weirder.
Masterforce feels like a follow up that eventually got rewritten to be a sequel sort like like Ultraseven and Skyrider.
>Also in the episode i just watched (the one with the fortune teller and the asteroids) there was a cameo by Hotrod when they showed the battle in space.
That was literally just the intro from Headmasters so that tells you how much they were thinking about connecting the two shows. Victory sort of resets things to a universe where the Transformers are common again but also they didn't get The Movie until after the show ended so Wheeljack is alive for cameo.
>literally just the intro from Headmasters
idk, Sixshot featured pretty prominently, and as of ep 24 the weird Destron commanders Giga and Mega are piloting Overlord. It seems more like they thought a lot about connecting the two shows but just couldn't make up their minds about it.
If that is true, then maybe it would have been nice for *anyone* in the show to recognize him. Teh Pretenders know Chromedome as this great war hero but have no idea who Optimus is?
It's true it's just bad writing. Like it was made as a soft reboot but didn't commit to it so they tied it to 2010/headmasters. They at least tried to make a greater effort in Victory and Zone.
The footage with Rodimus and the Headmasters is just the show's intro.
>it's a separate continuity and there was no Optimus Prime in this universe
...Anon....they...the entire reason he looks like Optimus was because he got a transtector that was made for Optimus.
That information is never stated in the show itself. It's from a clip show produced for home video.
translation
>I AM A HUGE homosexual AND I LOVE SUCKING wiener
Disagree. I watched the Unicron Trilogy when I was that age but I still think Beast Wars, which I didn't watch till I was a teen is superior.
Nothing will beat the unicron trillogy.
There is no Unicron Trilogy. Cybertron isn't related at all to Energon and its superior predecessor Armada.
Back in college the literally moronic weeb fatass girl at the class liked both Animated and Prime, that can give you an idea of who were part of the consensus.
>Prime is literally the best show in the franchise
Amarda exists and you spout this shit
Best show post 90’s is likely gonna be armada, least cucked fanbase and best toys along with a decent enough show
>best toys
if you like unarticulated bricks
frick off Cinemaphile
Victory, Car Robots and Armada were good not Beast Wars or Animated good but better then Prime.
I'd rate CR higher than BW or Animated. Most people nostalgia-over how godfrick awful both of those started or how assfrick ugly BW was, while the biggest bugaboo people have about CR is pretty much literally a case of them not paying fricking attention with "Hur hur dumb japs say this is G1" because apparently people needed to be spoonfed.
Because the Brave series is already better.
I’ve only seen Da-Garn, but that show was so good that this is a hard point to argue.
I’m debating which series to watch next.
Armada and RiD was good.
Starscream was the only good part of Armada. Unless you mean to say that the Unicron Trilogy is extremely funny, which it is.
>Starscream was the only good part of Armada
He's definitely the most memorable character. There were like 50 episodes in the show but the only things I remember are Starscream and that episode about a lost civilization
>that episode about a lost civilization
Oh, that one is a good one.
I don't know if he thinks bright colors are gay or childish, but these are brightly colored characters. Starscream is brightly colored and so is Soundwave! At the very least a color scheme would have made it easier to keep track of the characters' transformations instead of it devolving into a murky mess.
>Why can't Japan make a good Transformers series like Prime or Beast Wars?
japan for whatever reason thinks 5 year old japanese kids are both really smart and really stupid. That is their target demographic for transformers for whatever reason. So they think 5 year olds are smart enough to play with complicated $20, $35 $50 and $100 transforming robots but at the same time not smart enough for competent writing, so they dumb all the dialog and writing down for them.
Its fricking weird and I have no answer for you as to why they do this.
America on the other hand I think has always targeted 8 to 12 year olds, but 5 to 7 can also watch if they want.
imo perhaps japan wanted the old G1 show to fail in japan so they wouldn't have to pay the US to licence the show for japan. They might have have also hoped the marvel show would fail so they could replace it with an anime and then licence that to the US like they did some of the shows in the late 90s and early 00s. thats just me guessing though.
>so they wouldn't have to pay the US to licence the show for japan
They presumably didn't have to pay for licensing, they have always owned the rights to it in Japan, because they own the IP to the same extent Hasbro does in other countries. Takara has full control over the brand, and F!SRLF Transformers was something they manned on their own. The only reason the sequel series were Japan only anime was because TF fell out of popularity for Hasbro took keep paying for more episodes, while Takara ponied up the cash to make their own shows since it was still very popular. In fact, Sunbow gained the rights to the sequel anime and their Hong Kong dubs and simply never did anything with them.
Hasbro and Takara aren't competing, they have equal control over their shared IP in their respective regions.
for whatever reason thinks 5 year old japanese kids are both really smart and really stupid. That is their target demographic for transformers for whatever reason. So they think 5 year olds are smart enough to play with complicated $20, $35 $50 and $100 transforming robots but at the same time not smart enough for competent writing, so they dumb all the dialog and writing down for them.
When did Western Transformers have "smart dialogues"?
Beast Wars had some very dark episodes filled with wise quotes.
I think it depends on the property. Shinkalion is pretty smart despite being a kid show and it's also Takara-Tomy.
Because in Japan Transformers is a franchise for babies. The Japanese don't like the idea of sentient robots and think it's childish compared to something like Gundam. They also think pre-assembled toys are for babies, hence why the Prime toys removed decals for stickers and added the Arms Microns as model kits.
>>The Japanese don't like the idea of sentient robots and think it's childish compared to something like Gundam.
Both of these franchises are for kids. Wake up.
>The Japanese don't like the idea of sentient robots and think it's childish
That's bullshit. Tell that to the Braves.
...which is a show for babies. Brave was always, ALWAYS a series that skewed far younger.
>Brave was always, ALWAYS a series that skewed far younger.
Yes, yes. Tell that to the older audiences.
Also tell that to the Gundam Sentinel...or Sandrock (who kinda is but KINDA).
transformers also brings in an older secondary audience but they're mostly westaboos
Westaboos? No not really, more like Japan's otaku equivalent to nostalgic Gen Xers. Transformers isn't seen as Western like Marvel or DC are, its seen as a unique collaboration of East and West.
>Westaboo's
Japanese love Beast Wars and that show is filled with nothing but meme for its JP dub.
nips love their meme wars but the hardcore fans import US media
I remember when Cinemaphile discovered a Japanese game review wiki site and it turned out there were efforts from Japanese fans to get Devastation and the For Cybertron duology localized
I though the Japanese DVD actually had the English audio with subtitles (which is fricking rare for JP media) so they could see it as originally intended.
>Why can't Japan make a good Transformers series like Prime or Beast Wars?
Because they made something better
one of the ugliest prime designs of all time. What the frick were they thinking with that head
Blurr looked godawful in that, too.
I'm pretty sure that Optimus was designed by a westerner. I'm kinda fond of the super mode head but it's ugly for sure.
Japan exists to save the whole fricking franchise whenever Hasblow tanks sales with shitty toys.
>hasbro financial reports say Transformers is one of their strongest brands
>takara transformers are no longer sold at retail and the MP line, such as the trainbots, has become a complete disgrace with awful QC
our saviours
And how well is Earthspark doing?
you know that streaming sites don't report their viewerdship numbers. Everyone in Hollywood is striking over it. And there hasn't been an investor's meeting since it came out so we don't know how successful the toyline was.
The toyline is repainted cyberverse returns.
Only Shockwave and the Seekers. Everything else is new.
Well Earthspark exists. Where's Takara's show?
Japanese kids don't care about Transformers, they wouldn't make a show.
Too busy with diaclone
Cope
It's established history that hasbro will always frick it up, and Takara will always swoop in to save the franchise.
>Prime
>good
Only the first season is good. RID2015 beats it in average quality.
My pipedream was a transformers anime made by Sunrise
The closest you'll get is Transformers The Movie (animated by mostly Bebow animators) or Yuusha Exkaiser.
Imagine an OVA with trad cels and a good budget
The Movie was already a great looking treat on par with DYRL or CCA, if you want something like F91 or Stardust Memory then I'm afraid it'll never be 🙁
My pipedream is a Transformers anime made by Trigger
that seems to be trigger's ambition, too
I liked Prime, but I can acknowledge that it had problems. The biggest was how concepts felt introduced and dropped, but other stuff was dragged out.
What kept it good for me were the amazing performances and solid character moments. I think in general it had some of the best characterizations for a lot of Transformers.
Let Trigger make a Transformers OVA with full creative freedom
They're practically begging for it
Only if they swear not to do the stock Trigger plot again. The fact that Cyberpunk ended with the last girl just fleeing to space instead of fighting aliens is nothing short of a goddamn miracle.
Majority of Trigger stuff are not like Franxx. SSSS shows, Kill la Kill, Edgerunners stay in their ground and doesn't change genre in the last 10 minutes.
>SSSS
Gridman was alright, but holy shit if I ever had any faith in the idea that Trigger can't make bad anime Dynazenon would have destroyed it. Fricking plotless meandering mess of a show.
the only thing gridman did was the obvious hentai video edits at sankaku, not even the space harem anime got this.
The only good things IDW did in any order
>Shockwave's buttholery
>Autobot Megatron
>Starscream's redemption arc and PTSD
>Starscream's redemption Arc thanks to Windblade
>Windblade and her sisters
>Bumblebee being a the only Bot Starscream gave shit because he didn't treat him like shit.
>butthole Prowl
>DJD
>Thundercracker and Skywarp Redemption arc and Starscream giving a shit to them because they were his brothers
>Starscream's ultimate Sacrifice
>Starscream's backstory in both IDW runs
>And Starscream and Windblade, on which she cared for him with all of his defects.
You make sex with your butt, sweetheart.
Prowl
I love him so much.
Trigger sucks.
based contrarian moron
>Nooo eat the shit, anon!
Frick CGI anime, frick SSSS and DynaZenon’s boring as frick pacing.
I loved Animated. It was a love letter to the franchise. They had a fricking Wreck-Gar episode where he was voiced by Weird Al or fricks sake. It's the best.
It was fine, but I feel like it took way too long to get to the interesting stuff and we didn’t get it for long enough.
This, too, is Prime's fault. There was going to be a fourth season, but it was axed so that Prime could run in streaking shit behind it.
Really objective opinions on Prime drop the more you actually know about the circumstances of its creation and how things went behind the scenes. The showrunners of Prime being asswipes was the reason why Aligned was such a convoluted train wreck, and the tard they brought in for the third season tearing up all their plans and shouting that Optimus should be green lost them so much money that they haven't been willing to commit to a high budget transformers series since.
No, that’s Animated’s fault for taking so long to get there. All of those stupid supervillain episodes could’ve easily been cut out.
Masterforce was hit or miss but I enjoy it.
Because no one can. Transformers is cringe
>because no one can
Thats not true. They CAN, it's just that the franchise has been stuck in a creative rut for awhile but nobody wants to abandon the formula and try for something novel and interesting. By the time Prime came out the G1 formula had pretty much been milked dry, and the writers weren't able to pick up the slack with interesting characters. In a way Prime had the same formula as animated, but where Animated had a derivative, but original history, Prime kept the histories of its characters more vague and detached. The lore of the series, trying to establish all these high concepts like the 13 primes and stuff, tried to paint a larger picture while leaving out a lot of characterization that held up the cast of animated.
Getting off animated, Beast Wars and the Unicron Trilogy had fairly unique plots, either setting the war in new locations (far earth past or planet hopping like Cybertron/Galaxy Force) or had some interesting gimmick pullilng it along (minicons). Of course both of these series also gave the characters new and appealing designs/characterizations, where as recently all of the new stories both keep the setting on earth/cybertron, and rely on evergreen designs/characterizations that act more as callbacks and reinforces the popular conception of whatever Optimus/Megatron/Whoever already is. I felt IDW was notorious also for just cannibalizing legacy characters and designs, and when new OC was included they were just offensively bad or just bland.
I may have rambled a bit but I don't think there's anything interesting that can be done with transformers at the moment, unless you do some Trigger animated G1 wank spectacle, and that the franchise needs to be stripped down to its bare minimum, and rebuilt up from the concept of "robots that turn into cars and other things"
>the franchise needs to be stripped down to its bare minimum, and rebuilt up from the concept of "robots that turn into cars and other things"
I want this so badly. The closest you really get is, ironically, the first season of the G1 series. The franchise was in its infancy, they were just barely fleshing out what made Transformers unique, and there was no preconceived notion of what TF should be by audiences. I'd like a hard-reset return to the basics like that.
>Thats not true. They CAN, it's just that the franchise has been stuck in a creative rut for awhile but nobody wants to abandon the formula and try for something novel and interesting.
The formula is like the opposite of the problem though. 90% of the problems in any given series can unironically be summed up as "writers didn't want to do G1 and what G1 did again with a healthy amount of "What's megatron's scheme this week" episodes and wanted to do their own *unique* and *impressive* plot they thought was interesting, usually cribbing something that did work for a 2 part episode or a single comic and making it the entire fricking series, and then promptly learning that "Oh this is actually fricking shit and was a bad idea" before doubling down.
The problem with Transformers is they keep cancelling shows and then rebooting everything while the toys keep going up in price and the quality of the figures gets closer to a McDonald's toy.
Quiz: Name the last show they cancelled.
Note: conclusions are not cancellations.
Not a show, but Transformers 6 & 7 in their original intended Bayverse films
>B-b-b-but Bumblebee/Rise of the Beasts
They're the 6th and 7th live-action Transformers films, but they're not "Transformers 6" or Transformers 7"
You think letting Lorenzo Di Boneventura drill through the bottom of the barrel after trying to insert fricking King Arthur into the movies was a better plan?
Scrapping planned sequels when a movie turns out to be a complete turd is a reasonable response.
Bumblebee did poorly due to how burnt out people were on Bayshit, but despite that got very positive reactions. Meanwhile Rise of the Bayshit had Lorenzo going around telling everyone that the movie would be 100% more Bayshit and ended up being the lowest grossing Transformers movie of them all.
People don't like Bayshit. It's done. Game over. You lost.
I remember the first trailer for Bumblebee having a very accurate "Starscream" transformation and everyone going nuts. Rise of the Beasts felt like it went back to early Bayformer shit where they hide or don't really focus on the transforming. Also despite being a "Beast" movie they didn't really do much with them.
>went back to early Bayformer shit where they hide or don't really focus on the transforming
Really? Transformers 2007 places transformations at the center of the action almost everytime, ILM was busy flexing their new tech. RotB felt very cheap by comparison, in no small part due to its relativd lack of practical effects.
say what you will about Bayformers, those transformations were mind-boggling back when TF2007 came out
I'm sure that seeing the opening scene with Blackout transforming and then wrecking the army base as a kid was one of the things that put me on the path to being a /m/an
These transformation looks like toy shilling rather than goodlooking. Hollywood definitely doesn't need Shoji Kawamori's obvious toy shilling. Sometimes subtle toy advertisement works better, even if the toys don't come out as movie accurate.
the bayformers designs look like absolute dogshit. They are, bar none, the worst mecha designs in any media ever concieved. I'm sorry but if you like those indistinct masses of polygons you are mentally disabled.
I don't care. They works in cinematic environment. This is just like how capeshit costume looks extremely dumb, because they don't work in liveaction. And majority of G1 designs are fricking dogshit.
They're all superior to whatever the live action films put out and if people don't like it then they don't deserve the franchise. Live action is a mistake, nobody wants to real disgusting meat people. 2d is superior
Twilight made a shit ton of money too, I guess it was amazing. Hell it made more than Godfather, it must be better.
Big Bang Theory had record breaking views, guess it’s the best comedy show ever.
They managed to get Barricade's design looking pretty fricking good in the worst movie, absolute tragedy. Jazz's design actually grew on me over time, goddamn shame that he doesn't do anything.
You seriously prefer an Ugly Triangle Bird Midget to that Blitzwing clip?
Are you baiting?
of course he is
This scene is actually extremely controversial in the Transformers fandom. Bayformers fans had long held that Transformers designs that looked like they were supposed to was impossible, and the fact that the scene received such raucously positive fan reception has made them violently reject it. They genuinely hate it and get extremely mad if you talk positively about it.
>impossible
nah
>>and the fact that the scene received such raucously positive fan reception has made them violently reject it. They genuinely hate it and get extremely mad if you talk positively about it.
People only pretend to like ROTB and Bumblebee. Both of them are box office flops because they feel like IDW gaygshit. No one actually cares about boxy designs or "emotional storytelling". The appeal of cinematic transformers is to look at hyper complex giant robots fight each other. The boxy Kawamori-esque robots don't work in Hollywood and probably in liveaction alltogether.
>THAT DOESNT WORK BECAUSE NOBODY LIKES IT
>try it
>it works
>people like it
>NOOOOO YOU DIDNT ACTUALLY LIKE THAT AAAAAAA
have a nice day baytard
>>>it works
like it
>>Box office was a 1/2 of The Last Knight
You G1 gays are so sad.
And Last Knight made less than Age of Extinction which made less than Dark of the Moon which made less than Age of Extinction. Bayformers poisoned the well and made people afraid to go see a new movie, especially with all the confused messaging about whether it was a reboot or not.
Despite that it got extremely positive reception, especially from actual fans of the property, who are who the films should have been made for in the first place if the morons had been properly gatekept away. And unless you're as much of a drooling moron as you're acting like, you should know that box office returns don't necessarily make a successful product, or else Fortnight would be the greatest video game ever made.
But then you had Lorenzo di Bonaventura claw his way back into the franchise and run the press circuit assuring people they were discarding everything they liked about Bumblebee, telling people it wasn't a reboot, and assuring people that Bay still had 100% control of the movies...
Paramount CEO Confirms Michael Bay still has Absolute Power over the Transformers Films
https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/paramount-ceo-confirms-michael-bay-still-has-absolute-power-over-the-transformers-films/47839/
...and you can see why most people would give Rise of the Bayshit a pass.
>Age of Extinction which made less than Dark of the Moon
Both movies still reach over 1 billion dollars and The Last Knight still gained over 600 million dollars. Bumblebee and ROTB didn't have Bay as main director, both are box office flops, he was just a guy who inject money into these movies as a way to evade tax.
CEO Confirms Michael Bay still has Absolute Power over the Transformers Films
He was the producer of both Bumblebee and ROTB, but he didn't direct them or write them. And you know what else actually flopped? IDW comic run, which was incharged by bunch of rampant Bay haters.
It's always fascinating seeing the insane pretzels that Bayshitters will contort themselves in to pretend that a large pile of incoherent scrap metal and explosions is actually peak cinema. Fricking christ even Bay himself thinks those movies are dogshit, he only did them to get his crew paychecks and fund other projects.
I hate how this style of greentexting infiltrated the whole site.
Captcha: NSDPA
Your mind? WARPED by Michael BAYsed
>takes two weeks to reply
Both are shit
Cyberverse and Netflix siege were both cut short from originally intended runs.
bruh Cyberverse got EXTRA material and netflix had three entire seasons
It doesn't really matter. They won't make anymore. Hasbro is getting out of the film and toy business to chase game money because BG3 made them think the bucks are there.
They also have that L4D Transformers game coming out.
but there's a new animated transformers film coming out
And there's three more live action films planned.
calling it now: those aren't happening. You might get one more but those things are toast after Rise of the Flop
So according to RotB and TLK, Unicron was going to eat himself? Did past Unicron go into hibernation billions of years ago and then just turned into Earth?
TLK and ROTB are not in the same movie series. Bumblebee was a reboot. Bumblebee and ROTB take place in an entirely different continuity from the first five live action TF movies. The Earth is not Unicron in ROTB.
Wrong but I can understand how you'd think that. Bumblebee was a half-attempt at a reboot but the producers refused to commit to it. In one cut of the movie they mention the "ice man" (Megatron from the 2007 movie) but it was cut.
The producer of most of the movies, Lorenzo di Bonaventura, was temporarily ousted during Bumblebee but came back for RotB, and he's repeatedly gone on record as saying that this is not a reboot and maintains continuity with the Bayverse, no matter how much it doesn't make sense.
https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/rise-of-the-beasts-news-conference-officially-states-the-film-is-not-a-reboot-and-spoils-end-credit-scene/47724/
>The producer of most of the movies, Lorenzo di Bonaventura, was temporarily ousted during Bumblebee but came back for RotB, and he's repeatedly gone on record as saying that this is not a reboot and maintains continuity with the Bayverse, no matter how much it doesn't make sense.
What the frick is his problem?
Lorenzo is also the guy who is the reason the TF movies are such clusterfricks. He's gone on record as saying that he chooses his favorite script proposals and has them smashed together into one movie. Ever wonder why Last Knight is about evil Optimus AND King Arthur?
>He's gone on record as saying that he chooses his favorite script proposals and has them smashed together into one movie.
That's completely fricking insane. Granted, I guess it payed off considering how much money the first couple of movies made.
>Ever wonder why Last Knight is about evil Optimus AND King Arthur?
To be fair, I never actually saw the last movie. Age of Extinction was finally enough for me. Was the King Arthur shit literal? Was there an Optimus Prime sized Excalibur?
>Was the King Arthur shit literal? Was there an Optimus Prime sized Excalibur?
sorta, King Arthur was a normal guy who was helped out by the Knights of Iacon (a group of Cybertronian knights who ended up on Earth)
Excalibur's a thing but it's a shapeshifting artifact that has nothing to do with Arthur (it's never even called Excalibur in sword form on-screen, only ever "the Talisman"; we only know it's Excalibur because of a HasCon 2017 display)
hell, even the G1 episode that was named "A Decepticon Raider in King Arthur's Court" didn't have anything Arthurian in it at all, I know the name is a Twain reference but you'd think they'd take the opportunity to put some Knights of the Round Table stuff in there
Arthurian myth is /m/ because Kay was basically fricking Ultraman in the early stories
I'm starting to think that Bay isn't the problem, fricking Bonaventura is
Most of Western TF is good but the 2010s have mostly dull (Prime) or braindead (it's sequel RID) shows
In what way is RID15 braindead?
Because they know transformers is just a silly toy commercial
These are only good in relation to other TF media
They literally did zoomer,
Why does Japan make shit like this?
G1 Transformers has a big fujoshi audience because it's exactly like Saint Seiya, LoGH, Touken Ranbu, or any other franchise that's 90% male characters.
Because they have shit taste, we all know that Megatron/SS is the superior ship.
I wonder how they feel about Lambocest.
Admitting you are wrong is hard. I understand, and I'm not mad at you. I'm just disappointed.
He looks like he fricks Autobots.
This is b8 since all the good transformers series are from Japan.
Remember when Transformers was for kids? What the frick happened?
It gets worse btw
honestly i don't even care about the pronoun shit, earthspark is just fugly aesthetically
kids deserve shit that looks cool, not this weird looking shit
Some of the designs, like Soundwave and the fembots seekers are pretty good though. The drone girl and the motorcycle guy are dogshit tier designs though
Honest to god, Drone chick actually does look better in animation. Had to sit through this while while sitting for family, and the biggest problems are the fact that the story can't sell you on megs actually signing on with the autobots, and the fact that the bike, the owl, and the girl are all godfrick awful, though somehow the owl's the least painful of those three. Despite a cringy as shit name the van chick's somehow basically alright and the drone's pretty decent.
The mom's pretty bad though and at one point I was half expecting some schizo IDW reveal that Megatron was going to be the kids real dad somefrickinghow because this did have input from the same homosexuals who made cybertronian Mpreg with a human child canon, and the dad was coming off as that cucked and neglected.
Due to diversity based hiring practices merit based design was replaced with agenda based design.
I'd say the inclusivity quota hasn't been this bad since Chip was introduced in the first series, there are countless times where he outright saves the Autobots by using their technology better than them and the message comes across as "It's okay if you're disabled, so long as you're a genius and perfect at everything else."
No one's ever REALLY disabled, as long as they have courage!
I don't really think that applies here Chip but we see your point
this is what Simon Furman meant when he wanted them to be genderless
>this is what Simon Furman meant when he wanted them to be genderless
unknowingly, yeah. Though in practice, not seeing gender or race ususally operates under the assumption that the person saying it is the standard.
If a white straight man says he doesnt see gender or race, he sees white straight men as the default. If a white straight woman says it, she sees white straight women as the default.
Liberals can be just as bigoted as conservatives if they dont think about what they are saying.
if a straight black man says he doesn't see race, all he sees is........ straight black men?
>straight black men
sometimes, or white men that he wants to be good in with.
furman was an idiot. females were right there in the first few episodes of the cartoon
>furman was an idiot. females were right there in the first few episodes of the cartoon
but anon, robbie the robot, johnny five and c3p0 dont have breasts or dicks. NO breasts OR DICKS ON JOHNNY FIVE, ANON!!! REEEEEEEREEE
they just couldn't whip their junk out in pg movies
Devastator got his balls out.
that wasn't pg
I just read Mazinger vs Transformers because of this thread and it waa fricking awesome. Especially Mazinscream.
"The question that once haunted my being has been answered. The future is not fixed, and my choices are my own. And yet, how ironic... for I now find that I have no choice at all! I am a warrior... let the battle be joined."
Honestly, the Golden Disk storyline is the peak of Transformers. Unbelievably strong storytelling.
Amuro?
Mobile Gundam: Char's Counterattack: Beltorchika's Children
Where's Char?
So, how do you find Optimus Prime with super/power up modes? Yah or nah?
Gives me Brave series vibes, so yah
>one of the best Optimus heads design in the franchise
>fricking ruin it for the ugly super mode
Galaxy Force was the only one to get it correct. The rest look like shit unironically.
It's a franchise staple. Even Bayformers did it as an homage to Armada.
Didn't Transformers start this trend, and Yuusha simply kept the same formula? I swear Sentai didn't do it till after Transformers too.
Oh yeah, Masterforce and Victory doing that before Yuusha.
IIRC the first Sentai to do it was Liveman which was indeed after Transformers started to peter out. Ironically one of the power up robots had an unabashed Optimus Prime head. That head design isn't even common in Transformers itself.
I think they even shared some designs
Even the Geists from Exkaiser were intended to be retooled Dinobots.
They shared many designs being a sister series, Exkaiser wa essentially a scrapped G1 Transformers continuation
I prefer when obtimus has a combiner, but the standard trailer is good too.
I'm still upset Animated Season 4 never came out and we were robbed of Powermaster Optimus Prime
DJWs death last year was sad
>AAAAAAAH WE HAVE TO SAVE RAPH FROM DARK ENRGON POISONING
Trying to build up to a new hero wasn't uncommon. It even happened in a show Masterforce references.
Galaxy Convoy is a top tier Optimus design right next to Armada and G1
he cool
The Michael Bay Transformers movies are one of the closest things to true evil I have ever seen in art. They have no stories no artistic merit, they simply serve as jingoistic celebrations of violence and profit. They are genuinely something that only a degenerated race like Orcs could create.
I'm not watching that.
You people are the biggest fricking drama queens on the planet. Hyperbole after hyperbole after hyperbole about how big bad Bay ruined your childhoods.
They might not be high art but you're delusional if you think these films aren't at least partially written with some sort of heart. The main premise of TF 2007 was a boy and his car, and several scenes throughout the series show that even loud nosiy blockbusters can have some heart. The whole scene with Bumblebee first revealing himself to Sam and Mikaela was great and the Autobots' arrival to Earth was awe-inspiring.
Armada and Cybertron are my favorite shows along with Victory and Beast Wars and the Binaltech toyline and even I happen to think the Bay films have at least a little bit of heart which is insane when you consider that the man didn't even give a shit about TF at first until some Hasbro employees gave him a rundown on the history of the series.
So what I'm trying to say is, grow the frick up already and stop being an eternal victim.
>NOOOO YOU HAVE TO LIKE BAYSHIT ITS FOR GROWED UPS BECAUSE IT GOTS ESPLOSIONS AND ARE TROOPS!!!1111
you are less than a person and the world would be a better place without you in it
Bayverse isn't even in my top 10 favorite iterations of the franchise. I'm just sick of hearing some ass-blasted little b***h cry about how MICHAEL BAY RUINED MAH CHILDHOOD WHY THE FRICK ISNT THIS AN EXACT COPY OF [INSERT FAVORITE SERIES HERE], and I can at least respect Bay for trying to do his own thing. I don't really even care about Transformers being mature or serious but I would 100% take that over shit like Cyberse/EarthSpark because at the very least the Bayverse gave use license vehicles and fun toys which is more than I can say for either of those series.
>I can at least respect Bay for trying to do his own thing
Except what he did was fricking awful and actively shit on the thing he was supposed to be adapting. Just because something is different doesn't mean it's good.
Also this. It's fricking embarrassing that they tried to sell those hideous buckets of scrap metal as robots, and it fricked with all western mechanical design in film to this day. They look fricking awful in motion, and it doesn't help that Bay is one of the worst cinematographers in the business so combined with those awful designs you just have scene after scene of indistinct CGI vomit on screen
>indistinct CGI vomit
I get not liking the designs but if you actually have a hard time seeing what's on the screen, you might need to get your eyes checked
Wow you got him
Since Bay has no understanding of basic filmmaking concepts, he didn't know that your characters should stand out distinctly from your backgrounds and from one another. I know you're coping but you can't sit there and tell me that even anything on camera in those movies is coherent.
I'm glad animated got axed to make way for more bay
>They might not be high art but you're delusional if *HEADCANON*
Bayverse has the worst mechanical design than any /m/ related thing I've ever seen and it has nothing to do with being Transformers, and I never grew up with the G1 cartoon.
Orks would consider them muckin' about.
if I could press a button and instantly kill everyone even tangentally associated with the production of the michael bay transformers movies I couldn't be kept away from it by chains
You know what actually ruined my childhood? Beast Machines.
>Let's make a direct sequel as if it it wasn't a direct sequel
????? Dan DiDio why
>Let's make an entire toyline with good designs then use different ones in the show
At least I loved them. Vehicons were the best though
The tanks were cool. Never much cared for the motorcycles, though.
I liked that one time Bay ripped off an MST3k movie.
EVERYONE SHUT THE FRICK UP
There's no real best Transformers animated series, each ones has it different shares of flaws. The consensus is that the most solid ones are Beast Wars, Prime and Animated. After those, Victory, Armada, G1, Cyberverse and Rescue Bots. Do we AGREE on that?
Nope.
>Beast Wars, Animated and Prime above G1.
>not even mentioning Car Robots.
I'm thinking no.
Beast Wars is objectively the best Transformers show
>but muh ugly CG
that's irrelevant to the actual quality and it gets better literally within the 1st season anyway, if you have this opinion you have to be 18 to post here
Is Victory worth it? I've never actually seen it, is it like Armada?
No, it's like a prototypical Brave series. It has some really weird humor which is weird even for anime.
Absurd
Yeah I'd say Beast Wars is the best overall followed by Animated.
Bay is a superbly talented filmmaker.
>you can't sit there and tell me that even anything on camera in those movies is coherent
I can actually. The action is incredibly easy to follow unless you're purposefully lowering the brightness and/or contrast on your tv.
>Bay is a superbly talented filmmaker.
He is bar none the worst filmmaker in the business
I find that quite the humorous statement. His only bad film in the last decade was 6 underground which he admitted was more experimental in the manner it was filmed. Even then, the major flaw in that movie was the choice of script and not any major errors in Bay's mise-en-scene.
You can say what you want about The Last Knight but then again it had the same problem.
Bay's supreme talent for grand and/or lavish visual sense and kinetic action is best on display (in the last decade) in Pain And Gain and 13 Hours, but it is unfortunate he didn't put in the effort for Transformers 4 and 5 that he did for 1 and 3.
America really needs to adopt the idea of splitting duties for action and character scenes.
Better to just make two different movies at that point.
Bay is an auteur
Dreadwing was the best part of Prime
>Bay is an autist
ftfw. He man is a fricking hack who can't make anything more than commercials. His movies are nothing but product placement, shilling for the US Military, and incoherent shakycam """"action"""" scenes. He is the single worst hollywood director and it's not even a contest.
>no arguments
>never demonstrates that he knows what an auteur is or what mise-en-scene is
that's what I thought
keep being mad, your brain is stuck back in 2008 pop-culture.
>ACTUALLY BAD THING IS..... LE GOOD!!!1111
uh oh reddit moment!
>crying this hard
why? just accept that you've been proven wrong and move on, like an adult.
I also really liked Sobolov on the show
proven wrong by what exactly? I have Bay's entire filmography proving me right, and all you can say is "nu uh he's le goated!"
I have posted evidence demonstrating the skills I have claimed he has and you have posted nothing in favor of your own position. All you've done is say "no that doesn't count it just proves me right" without saying why or how. You've also posted nothing in refutation of my points.
Incredible amounts of cope and delusion.
Keep being mad
you posted three youtube videos made by a blithering incompetent who doesn't understand basic filmmaking.
Honestly of all the people in the movie industry Michael Bay is the one who deserves to be literally executed for his crimes against the artform.
>continues to assert his point with no evidence
Delusional lmfao
I can only imagine the state of pure seethe you're in right now
what "evidence" is required beyond his own work? You're losing it, kiddo
>still posting without any arguments
The TF film series is the anti-Reddit excluding TLK, Bumblebee, and ROTB
Only redditors mald over Bayformers
reddit LOVES bayshit
Reddit is a constant state of malding because of shit like the twins, the racial stereotypes, oversexualization, etc etc.
Only on Cinemaphile could you find a contrarian moron to defend the twins.
I'm sure at least a couple of toy reviewers like or tolerate the twins. In either case, I wasn't defending them, I was just saying that they make redditors like yourself mald. Stay on topic.
Imagine trying to falseflag this hard
Tony Todd is often a high point of any show.
>Bay is an auteur
is that why Anthony Anderson ate all the donuts
>Beast Wars
any animal mecha type of shit is cringe and always will be
Even Zoids?
i wonder if the JP fanbase has sub vs dub arguments over the American shows
>good Transformers
>Prime
https://twitter.com/onecolo03096231/status/1699226398026788988
Prime isn't bad, but I'm honestly surprised that people regard it as highly as Beast Wars.
>Decepticons are pretty good, while the Autobot cast is a pale shadow of earlier incarnations
>Most of the action scenes are skirmishes against low-level goons, doesn't help that everyone uses the same tactics/techniques
>Wants to be dark and gritty, but doesn't really commit to it outside of flashbacks and select episodes
Then again I've only seen the first season, so maybe it got better at some of these things as it goes along.
I admire the fact that you didn't use the word "edgy"
>Then again I've only seen the first season, so maybe it got better at some of these things as it goes along.
It does. The action in particular got a lot more inventive, which I expect is down to people becoming more familiar with their rendering software.
I was a kid when Prime came out
Did ANYONE think the Aligned continuity was a good idea?
This is why Japs need US collaboration and input to make their stuff feasible. It's like how a lot of US studios outsource cel animation to Japan while American writers were in charge of the story and characters. Japan is good at following orders not taking the helm.
Bad news, Japan isn't outsourced to for American animation anymore, it's all in Korea or India these days.
I know that's why it's absolute shit nowadays.
Truly. The era where Obari and his cohorts' drawings wound up on American Children's TV will never come back.
>muh Transformers lore is treated just like Greek mythology
This was what I hated most about Aligned continuity. I like corny pulpy sci-fi and that's all it was beforehand, then somewhere along the line Amerilards weren't happy with it so they wanted something more Marvel adjacent with this moronic Aligned lore.
>more marvel adjacent
OG G1 was literally written by Marvel and was canon to the Marvel Universe
>le disingenuous reddit post
epic bro but that's clearly not what he meant by saying that
You're not going to weasel out of your moronic statement.
You're not going to pretend he said something he didn't
>he
nice try. You said "Americans wanted to make Transformers more like Marvel" without actually knowing anything about Transformers.
You have to go back. Twitter is more your speed; they'll coddle your moronation I'm sure.
>You said
No I didn't
>without actually knowing anything about Transformers
Project much? How do you know how much he knows?
Transformers has never been owned by Marvel and hasn't been published by Marvel since the 90s
>"Americans wanted to make Transformers more like Marvel"
what he meant by this, if you knew anything about Transformers (clearly you don't) is that the purpose of the aligned continuity was to use it as a "shared universe" the way that marvel had a single continuity for their movies in the same time period
You're too much of a redditor to admit this though
You're the one who didn't know G1's origins so it's funny that you're going around accusing other people of not knowing about transformers because you're mad
I'm that anon, yes I know G1 was in the most *literal* sense penned at Marvel, but what I'm referring to is exactly what that other anon was saying. It was Marvel only in name and felt more like 60s and 70s sci-fi. Prime took that and tried to make something like the MCU with Transformers, which it never was like that in terms of story to begin with.
on the topic of the Bay movies, the 2007 film is mostly decent and indeed with a bit more editing(there's a lot of chaff that could be trimmed out from both the hackers sideplot and from most of Sam's scenes prior to Barricade interrogating him) it could have been full on good, not sure there's any way to salvage Revenge of The Fallen from the mess we got, and Dark of The Moon is overall decent enough but it does suffer a bit from being a bit unnecessarily grim for the kind of film it is, never got around to seeing AOE or LK, or BB or ROTB so can't really judge those meaningfully
will say though if nothing else the thing I appreciate the most about the Bay series is that they're willing to get weird with the TF designs, especially with the Decepticons all being a bunch of weird Goblins, Orcs, and Trolls, the onscreen execution of this doesn't always land but the effort is appreciated(and it has lead to some fantastic toys being made)
>I appreciate the most about the Bay series is that they're willing to get weird with the TF designs
In the first 3, they attempted designs with as little mass shifting as possible, which is why Star Scream ended up being so wide. In 4 and 5 there's a ton of mass-shifting and cybertronians rarely transform on-screen.
>In the first 3, they attempted designs with as little mass shifting as possible, which is why Star Scream ended up being so wide.
that definitely is part of it
>In 4 and 5 there's a ton of mass-shifting and cybertronians rarely transform on-screen.
true(based on the handful of clips from those two I've seen), though still some good designs in both(particularly TLK Megatron and his crew)
>bumblebee pisses on a guy
a bit juvenile but funny(and let's be honest TF07 era Simmons was a jackass who deserved it)
>mostly decent
bumblebee pisses on a guy
The movie designs for transformers are a main stay at universal theme parks world wide. Admit it, bay won while the other stuff remains irrelevant