Why did the late 90s/early 2000s special effects age so poorly? I couldn't even sit through the intro of this show because the fighting scenes are laughably bad.
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don’t care. take it as it was made or frick off. your problem.
The fight scenes are okay, certainly not the best part of the show but they are decent fun. If you want better fight scenes watch Xena
i think the fight scenes were bad on purpose as a middle finger to any "bros" who were watching the show.
problem is leftist overton window shifted so rapidly that bros became the core audience of buffy.
is this the guy making up shit again? the stunt crew weren't doing it bad on purpose. they just had a limited budget. the fight choreographer for the first 4 seasons was the guy from MMPR and his wife was the stunt double for the pink ranger and she did the stunts for buffy in the first 4 seasons until Joss Whedon fired them.
Give him a minute - he's gonna accuse both of you of being the same person as before
love how one of you idiots wrote this feminist slop post
and are trying to attribute it to me after I rightly called it out
you remind me of those Aemondposters. Probably the same ones.
lol nice cope. You just won't stop samegayging Karen
nice try, roastie. but this circular shit will just spiral the thread faster. by all means, keep it up.
sounds more like something you’d say, moron. no one was going out of their way to make anything “bad on purpose,” and anyone who misunderstands camp as that is probably under 18 and belongs here less than you do.
moron, can you read? i didn't say they were doing anything bad on purpose. i clearly said they were limted by their budget.
You knew Marcus Aurelius?
you’re embarrassed now coz your pal didn’t agree and are not trying to pin it on me. Pathetic. lol
imagine being you and thinking anyone on Buffy saw male audiences as bad or needing to be chastised by shitty fight scenes.
>oh no my dick went soft because that jump kick wasn’t realistic enough!
>who cares about her skirt and bouncy breasts, the martial arts sacred code was violated!
the mind of a femcel lmfao
gotcha
stop replying to me homosexual.
Don't bother trying to use things like proof and evidence anon. It won't work, I've tried already
good thing you never had any, then you might someday be in danger of being right. one time. Maybe. hahahaha
you’re now fighting eachother, love it lol
so easy to turn the femcels on eachother
>i think the fight scenes were bad on purpose as a middle finger to any "bros" who were watching the show.
what moronic historical revisionism. making shit incompetently out of spite is a purely modern phenomenon.
>problem is leftist overton window shifted so rapidly that bros became the core audience of buffy.
>all those sexy girls fighting and grunting totally weren’t for a male audience
has to be self parody at this point. you cannot be that moronic. lol
Joss was a terrible director even for the time, he has no aptitude for cinematography or direction. He was just a writer before Buffy.
He was taught to direct by Sarah Michelle Geller while on buffy, how to run a set, she had been working on soaps her entire life. That's why their falling out got so acrimonious. It was both their big breaks and He couldn't admit to needing her or give her producer credits. (Also maybe an affair before she got with Freddy prince)
doubt she ever fricked him honestly. she’s not his type and she had to audition and fight for the role, he probably was pissed his actual side piece, Charisma, didn’t get it (she tried too).
SMG is a scarily shrewd, professional, and aggressive person. she knew the score and how to push through from her earlier experience. that’s why she was able to start wearing pants early on (she fought them on trying to keep her fighting in skirts).
I agree though that she probably had a huge role in production. also acted like a union leader for crew.
interesting stuff
yeah, she spoke a lot about trying to get the role, couldn’t imagine herself acting like a west coaster, etc. then was surprised when she got the call that she got it. And carpenter was Whedon’s muse before Acker.
SMg is pretty well documented fighting for better hours and pay for the crew. Not even just actors, but the blue collar invisible ones behind the scenes.
I know a samegay will passive-aggressively reply to call it all made up, but whatever, I found some of the background interesting.
think SMG got misunderstood as entitled/ uppity at the time, when she’s more like a workhouse & bulldog.
>And carpenter was Whedon’s muse before Acke
would you stop making shit up? Whedon thought Carpenter could barely act. David Greenwalt was the Charisma fanboy and when he left Angel, her character went to shit.
HANNIGAN was Whedon's waifu before Acker and then Glau on Firely.
called it.
don’t care, didn’t ask, have a nice day, etc
Just to be clear - that's a different anon you're replying to. I'm this guy:
The guy you're replying to is a different anon. So that's TWO people who are telling you to stop making shit up
>to be clear, the samegay pretending to be someone different agreeing with me is totally different and I really needed you to know!
>so that’s me and TOTALLY NOT ME TELLING YOU TO STOP BECAUSE I—I MEAN WE—ARE THE ARBITERS OF TRUTH
thanks for confirming it, holy cringe lol
Nope lol. Notice the (You)s. Two different people are telling you you're wrong and make shit up. Calling us a samegay is you making shit up again
>editing screenshots to support your samegay
no matter how you try to police the threads, Karen, people will post how they want and you can do nothing but end your life, which I highly encourage.
you’re autistic about a show but can’t even get the details right, and your only joy in life is killing any threads about Buffy by swamping it with your policing bullshit.
definitely one of the more pathetic posters I’ve seen this week.
btw don’t care, didn’t ask, have a nice day, etc
The only person "killing" this thread is (You) with your lies and autistic tantrums anon
>omg your “lies” against the holy institution of muh headcanon!!!
I was interacting in good faith earlier but I’ll just help you murder this person thread out of spite. you’re already in an autism spiral lol
>Joss was a terrible director
kys, also everything you wrote was wrong.
Hi, Joss.
Examples of AI writing coming to entertain and outrage you on Cinemaphile, the interactive picturebook for manbabies.
here’s another “totally not the other poster” desperate for a new line of attack
>manbabies
should have known you were a bitter roastie, no wonder you go full Karen. maybe Cinemaphile isn’t for you.
Different standards. It's like how Star Trek episodes, not matter how serious the main plot, always end with everyone on the bridge teasing Spock, and him raising his eyebrow as everyone laughs into the outro.
a) you've just become cynical, it's just a televsion series
b) it was always bad, you were just too young to realise
c) nuke the earth
d) the girls in it were all that mattered
Everyone in the mid-late 90s wanted to be John Woo. None of them had the money, talent, or crew to be.
the effects didn't age poorly. They were always bad. I watched the show as it aired and we would laugh about how bad the mayor snake looked.
Never seen it, but if the effects are CG then is right. People thought the CGI was shitty back then too, Hollywood just kept pushing it anyway because they're lazy frickers who don't care about quality.
also the fight scenes and the monsters are not the point of the show. the point of the show is what is buffy going through this week. its a drama.
tv shows did not have real budgets until breaking bad
What about Rome? Didn't it get cancelled because it was too expensive?
Star Trek TOS had a huge budget.
Buffy.
Classic episode. The Gentlemen still give me nightmares.
>Joss Whedon was a terrible director
as opposed to who on tv back then? Only show directed better in 1999 was Sopranos.
really loved some of those close-in shots they did of her. knew how to make her look tough in unexpected ways.
also apparently the filming for Anne was particularly grueling.
X-files guy. Easy.
Does she get with a black man?
goes on a weird awkward platonic date with one where she basically says she suspects him of being a bad guy, but otherwise no. Faith does though.
yeah, needs more blue lasers going up into the sky, and hyper realistic actor faces on purple aliens
For me, it's Buffy in Faith's body.
For me, it's me in Buffy (and Dawn, and Willow).
Very lewd.
Dawn used to be sexy but in recent years she's looking uncanny valley.
Exhibit A: sexy michelle
Pls no meth bald pics part 2
Exhibit B: ill Michelle
She appears to be suffering from anorexia causing liver damage hence the thinning hair and yellow eyes. a few fans have urged her to get medical help but she is trashing them on her instagram saying there is nothing wrong with her.
she also had buccal fat removed from her cheeks.
If Michelle could've stayed looking like this forever, she would've been perfect but we are all victims of the passage of time and we can't fight it so its best to age gracefully.
>she also had buccal fat removed from her cheeks.
many sad cases
but they'll all tell you iets just contour make up or whatever and they look perfectly fine.
he's accused me of being you like 2 or 3 times already.
her eyes look fricked too, what the actual frick did she do to herself.
they look creepier as they age - I wonder if its genetics fighting against the plastic surgery?
>she is trashing them on her instagram saying there is nothing wrong with her.
Yeah she always explains it away with
>I'm old! I'm 38!
This was one of my favorite pics back in the day.
too far into her emaciation era. Early s3 Buffy was peak.
all three israelites
watch out, a feminist bulldyke has claimed ownership of this thread and won’t allow any wrongthink.
For me it's Dru
>tfw no crazy psychic dommy mommy goth gf to talk to dead birds with
doesn't feel good ngl
muh dick
Legit question: are you watching the HD version of the show? Because it's genuinely one of the worst HD conversions of any show ever, maybe THE worst, and it makes the show seem way cheaper and shittier than it actually was. Don't get me wrong, the first two seasons have some rough effects work (it only starts getting decent in season 3 and even then it has some issues,i.e. the giant CGI snake in the S3 finale looked like shit even at the time) as well as some clunky direction and fight choreography. But you might be having issues because you're watching a butchered HD conversion, NOT because of the actual, original show they made in the 90s/2000s
Here's a whole video on how butchered the HD version is if you're wondering:
I remember when joss and the cast seethed so hard over the hd remaster.
>reeeee they destroyed my legacy!
I mean it’s terrible but that shit was funny.
i doubt the cast cared and i don't think Whedon has even commented on the hd transfer. He only reeeed over the show being shown in 16x9 since he claims he framed the show for 4x3 but yet they made 16x9 masters and that is what was shown in the uk and australia(america didn't get wide screen on DVD.)
they all cared, but especially him. bunch of handwringing on social media.
Actually no. Most of the cast were unaware and when it was pointed out to them on social media they mostly went, "Oh, that sucks," and then moved on with their lives. This includes Whedon whose only comment was, "Wtf? I shot it in 4:3, it really shouldn't be in widescreen."
I'm no Whedon defender btw, I just have issues with people who make shit up on the internet
nothing made up, directly remember them complaining, saying it ruined the show, shouldn’t have happened, posting screen caps with outrage, etc.
don’t care what you are, aren’t, or take issue with, Mr internet historian. feel free to have a nice day if you take so much issue.
Weird... Cause the only screencap I can find from Whedon is this one which basically says exactly what I said before
>This includes Whedon whose only comment was, "Wtf? I shot it in 4:3, it really shouldn't be in widescreen."
buffy fans have a really weird habit of making up shit like that bullshit that xander was ever supposed to be gay or oz would die and willow would go evil. its all nonsense. i watched the show as it aired. i had friends who wrote for the buffy magazine and talked to the show's writers. its all bullshit lol.
>buffy fans have a really weird habit of making up shit
To be fair that's literally every fandom on the internet. Don't get me started on Star Wars fans (and I like Star Wars)
don't listen to the 480p dvd quality perverts
the 4k version removes the wrinkles from most characters, which in turn makes them look younger and therefore more credible
That's called using DNR wrong. See also: the Predator blu ray (they fixed it for the 4K version though - also Buffy literally doesn't have a 4K version, just a 1080p HD version, so you're just completely fricking wrong)
Forgot pic:
>That's called using DNR wrong. See also: the Predator blu ray
right looks smoother and younger
left looks pixelated and aged
looks like shit - why make an HD version if you're just gonna digitally remove all the detail?
why do you want to see the detail? are you attracted to stretch marks?
the 4k version improves on almost everything over the inferior crt box version
i prefer my buffy episodes with film grain in a tiny little square as the director intended.
so you can say you made it and sell more dvds
They also failed to remove crew, filming equipment, and all kinds of other shit from other shots, absurdly.
>so you can say you made it and sell more dvds
That's the thing though, they haven't. The HD version's never seen a home release. It's just the version that's now on almost streaming service because it's the HD version. There isn't a blu-ray release and the dvds are still using the old sd transfer
Wild that they bothered then if they never tried to merch it, that’s what I always assumed.
no one even wants it. think there are tons of shows on streaming that weren’t remastered. ds9 comes to mind.
iirc (and maybe double check this because I might be wrong) they were going to do a blu ray release around the 20th anniversary but the fans complained, whoever was in charge took notice and also realized the HD version was shit and they ended up rereleasing the old dvds with new covers instead.
From memory the HD version only exists because Peawiener (or some other D-tier American network) wanted an HD version and somehow got it made as cheaply and quickly as possible. Problem is that increasingly we're in a digital HD world and the HD versions accidentally become the most common version on streaming services and it seems to be completely by accident
Buffy was camp like the original batman
the special effects were supposed to be cheesy
The "special effects" were done in 480, and Joss was adamant about keeping it in 4:3 ratio (says so in the DVD box set) which was the norm for pre-HD CRT viewing (releasing letterboxed DVD was all the rage then). So watching forever 480 cgi on an "up mastered" HD edition will always age poorly.
If you're watching it on a old CRT tv in DVD resolution it looks ok, it's just that you're spoiled/used to UHD era cgi. Same for a lot of other 90s syndicated shows.
idk why but your post reminds me of the people from the old buffy IMDb board that made their offshoot proboards in the late 2000s, early 2010s.
god I miss IMDb boards. better than Cinemaphile on its least worst day.
you aged poorly
good
2d women don't age
TV shows always had bad VFX until recently because they had lower budgets than movies. It actually forced them to put more effort into the writing and characterizations though. Now you have the opposite problem where shows look great but have terrible writing.
>Now you have the opposite problem where shows look great but have terrible writing.
Yeah, well a lot of TV shows would be movies in any other era of Hollywood. Once you get the locations, build sets, get costumes, hire everybody and get them onto set, it doesn't cost that much more to shoot 8-9 hours for a limited series than a 2.5 hour movie.
The whole economics have changed. Long movies used to be poison, fewer screenings, less money, but with on-demand streaming, longer is better.
didn’t just force them, the talent was simply better. writers strikes, politics, and labor trends killed writing.
look at the pattern of labor since the 80s:
>outsourced to cheaper countries
>now brought back to factories of mostly robots
they found with the 2007-2008 strikes they could hire cheap, young writers and cut out all the experienced old blood. saves a huge amount of money.
now what started happening to the cheap, young writers strike last years strike? Replaced by AI, or soon to be.
same thing is happening more slowly in education. most college lecturers are underpaid part timers, who swamp out the full timers.
Since they get AI run education going, the part timers will be out too.
I dunno, I think it's quantity of shows, too. There weren't that many people hiring TV comedy writers in the 90s, as compared to now, where there are the same number of network shows as there were, plus more shows on cable, plus now Netflix shows, Hulu shows, HBO shows, Paramount+ Originals, and the list goes on. It isn't like people have gotten exponentially better at writing as the demand for writers has grown. If anything, they're probably worse, because most people spend less time alone with their thoughts thinking up things to entertain themselves.
i would give it to every chick on this show especially joyce
If you're watching the HD remastered version which was butchered, that's probably why. Otherwise, the effects are pretty sovlful
To be completely fair the effects in the first two seasons are pretty rough and even once they start getting an actual budget in season 3 there's still a few really bad effects scattered throughout (the CGI mayor snake from Graduation Day is the big one that comes to mind)
When I watched the series recently for the first time, I just took all the effects as part and parcel of a show for that time. Didn't really bother me
Oh yeah it's totally watchable (although the HD version's really bad) I'm just saying the effects in the first 2 seasons do look very, very dated. And I say that as someone who thinks the 2nd half season 2 is best bit of the show
>someone who thinks the 2nd half season 2 is best bit of the show
shocking that you have the most basic, pleb-tier opinions on the show.
bet you handwring over s4 too and trash it constantly.
what next, “season 5 is the best arc and season 6 is underrated depression kino?”
lol moron
wtf.. nta but second half of s2 IS the best run of the show...
Give him a minute, he's gonna call you a samegay in a second and then he's gonna tell you to off yourself
here’s a tip, when you go to the effort to disclaim you’re “totally not that other guy” pre-emptively, it tips them off.
but yes definitely commit suicide.
>wtf…nta but
lmfao just can’t help yourself. actually laughed irl that time
CALLED IT! What do i win?
don’t see anything about suicide, so I guess you win the moron award. again.
It's true. You're a boring contrarian.
>if you don’t agree with me you’re a contrarian!!!!
you should be an HR manager, you have the right energy to gatekeep everyone into loathing you.
>start getting an actual budget in s3
wow this sad little samegay thinks they’re some insider authority. nice headcanon.
Whedon loved Hannigan so much, that he made her the godmother of his children and he is godfather of her children.
He loved Acker so much, he gave her a better character to flex her acting muscles with when she grew bored of playing Fred and cast her in multiple projects post-Angel.
He loved Glau so much he made her the focus of the Firefly movie and cast her in multiple projects post Firefly.
Same for Felicia Day and especially Dushku.
But I'm supposed to believe that Carpenter, the comic relief of Buffy and a character who got shat on and dumped on Angel as soon as he got more involved with the series and has also according to Carpenter shat on her acting for years, was somehow his muse? lol
Who was the only Buffy/Angel actress who didn't comment on Whedon on social media when he got canceled? Oh yeah it was Hannigan.
>says 90-00s effects are bad in the age of zoomer alpha beta gen ai slop
Ah yes the average 12-40 something dongbrain
This fricking dumb ass thinks everyone in a thread of 24 unique posters is somehow the same poster. Fricking dumb ass.
keep it going, love the seethe. make up more shit and act like the authority on this show. go diplg up your old Spike x OC fanfics that got you through highschool (and college) for comfort.
>made for tv
that's why
some fx from this period still hold up today
This show comes from an era where 22 episodes per year were expected, with fight scenes and special effects in every episode. You really expect perfection when actors had 1 week max to practice choreography before filming, and vfx artists had just a few days max to produce effects suitable to air?
But I'd rather have that than 8 episodes every 2.5 years like what we're getting now.
I always wondered why certain shows in this era got around 22 (Farscape, er, Gilmore girls, Buffy, etc) but others got 25-30. Think even LOST and Greys Anatomy were higher at first despite coming out a few years later. like why 22 of any number.
really sad now how they can’t get a decent number of episodes and make them worth watching. back when Netflix had 13 ep series they’d just make 4-5 of them totally skippable like they were killing time.
guess no one can write a well-rounded season of any length anymore.
Yeah, it's brutal, especially for sitcoms and comedies. With 22-24 episodes, they can easily spend two or three episodes spaced out in a season building a secondary character without it feeling like the show is losing focus. But with 10 episodes, it's the finale and the pilot, and then just 8 in the middle. So with an ensemble of characters, you're left leaving them undeveloped.
A show like How I Met Your Mother, there'd be a brief love interest or something hang around for four episodes, and it'd just be a little thing, like episodes 12-15 out of 24 episodes touch on a character, but that's like half the season if you're only doing 10.
it was that and also the stigmatization of episodic tv.
nowadays anything called “filler” isn’t actually filler in the old sense.
Used to be filler was monster of the week, it added to characterization not didn’t (always) advance the primary arc.
with prestige tv and all that, episodic became antiquated and seen as lame. they wanted long, serialized plots. This could work if done well ( lost s1), but overtime it’s just become the same rhythm as actual soap operas:
advance glacially and formlessly until a finale or premier, but then artificially prolonged it anyway for 5 more seasons.
so yeah, you’re right, if that’s what you’re doing for 10 eps, who cares about the middle 8.
If anyone was left who could write decent episodic shows, we might get some new kino.
It's funny you mention Lost season 1, because the original plan, what the network wanted, what they were trying to do, was make an episodic show. It was pitched as a bunch of people on the island, each episode following a different person in the real world, which the network loved, because JJ Abrams was the Alias guy, which was very serialized, and they wanted something people could tune in one week, get busy, tune in three weeks later because there's a cool guest star on.
And it tries to do that for a while, before it eventually becomes just 100% fully serialized.
it still is episodic, which I should make clear. But if you watch through, each ep sheds light on something about the overall mystery, it’s not just a pure digression. I agree tho, it’s not “pure” serialization.
I used it because it was part of a wave that moved toward serialization.
and yeah they got lazy and went all in later on.
cleansing this thread of homosexualry
>be disgusting 40 year old lesbian blob
>cleansing thread of homosexualry
kek
Wish streaming didn't have these comically bad hd cuts. I like the show enough to put it on while I work out but not enough to pirate a 480p version. But these shots of camera crew peaking into the shot happen waaaay too much.
It's up on archive:
https://archive.org/details/BuffyVampireSlayer
Starts with crap movie but there's the entire show in its original state. However it is the PAL/UK dvd versions so from season 4 onwards its in widescreen and you occasionally get bloopers on the sides of the screen (but it's not the shit HD version where they often crop it incorrectly so if you download it from archive it's as easy as setting your video player to crop to 4:3 and it's how the show's supposed to be)
Annoying you're gonna have to find Angel for yourself
>not jumping into the middle of wherever TNT is on their 24/7 Angel repeats.
Do they even air Angel anymore? does tnt exist anymore?
rip
i sometimes see Buffy on random channels but i don't think any actual tv channels are showing Angel anymore. i know for sure its on hulu but i dont' know what other streaming servies has Angel.
catching reruns of Angel late at night on TNT made up like 70% of my rewatches. Princely why I can watch shit out of order now. something comfy about it.
I used to think they ran it because of the Kate actress being on Angel then moving to law & order for a while, but I doubt it. was just a weird coincidence.
The effects were charming. Like Star Trek tos and tng. Or the Twilight Zone. Its not soulless avengers cgi slop.
seems like there’s a divide between people who can stomach dated movie effects or not. like all or nothing.
find it really comfy on even older movies/shows where it’s really silly.
MOGGED
dont get how acker aged so well
>here's your remaster, bro
Look at this Power Rangers-looking motherfricker. I love him so much. To this day he remains one of my favorite monsters from the entire show.
It's the best bad episode of the show by far - the premise and execution is so fricking stupid that it becomes art. It's fricking hilarious both unintentionally and sometimes intentionally.
the best bad episode is Beer Bad. Caveslayer Buffy is so sexy.
don’t get why this one is even called bad, other than the stupid “ devolve to caveman” trope. found it really funny and tightly written. smg had crazy good comedic timing.
Wasn't it funded by the FDA or something? Like it was supposed to be an anti-drug PSA type thing (or rather anti-drinking) and the FDA gave the network money for it but it ended up transforming into a comedy. Do look that up tho - I might be wrong and I don't want to be like some people in this thread who just make shit up and then have a thread-long autistic tantrum when everyone starts calling them out for it.
you don’t want to be a normal person who recollects something then gets called an evil liar by a crazy schizo c**t who had to ruin the thread for the sake of her own warped ego?
Imagine if you just remembered shit and weren’t accused by a bunch of “nta but..” autists of maliciously tarnishing your sacred headcanon.
Imagine if you just interacted normally in the thread, I’m sure I wouldn’t feel the need to factcheck you on a random piece of trivia. but here we are, you fricked it, no one else to blame.
Was a chill thread until you started up, don’t try to blame anyone else. dumb fricking c**t.
So you're not having a thread-long autistic tantrum?
I’m not the one paralyzed with angst and fury about others daring to remember differently than me. I got mildly annoyed when you kept spazzing out so I fricked with it out of spite, but I started off genuinely interested in the topic.
That's not an answer. It's a yes or no question. I'll ask it again:
So you're not having a thread-long autistic tantrum?
here’s my answer:
You’re a gatekeeping dyke c**t, and you killed the thread with your autistic screeching. I helped by riling you up after the fact.
You lack the introspection to ever understand when you’re responsible for anything, so you won’t understand this. Probably one of those b***hes who goes, “omg she’s me so mad at me I have no idea why teehee.”
Nonetheless, that’s my answer for you.
>so fricking stupid that it becomes art.
cringe
I thought the fraternity snake demon god was pretty gnarly, got a good pic of that one? From s2. Just realized this show has a multiple snake demon gods.
This is the best one I could find.
that one actually surprised me how creepy it was. Expected it to look silly once they unveiled it.
there’s machida, the snake demon mayor was feeding babies to, mayor himself. any other snake demon gods?
now that the samegay accusation Black person has left the thread, can we all agree that Goth Chubby Michelle was best Michelle?
It was bad back then.
TV shows just didn't have the budget back then, hell Buffy was lucky they didn't just get a hand puppet or some guy in a suit for most scenes. Which I'm pretty sure they did many times actually.
Also I don't really give a frick what anyone says, Whedon was a damn good and innovative writer at that point it time.
don’t knock puppets, Farscape made that shit work. although that level of craft is probably not what you’re referring to.
So did Angel, the superior show
>he was unironically filtered by season one buffy's special effects
You have my pity. Maybe try again when you're a bit older and able to discern kino.