>kevin conroy also stopped doing a different voice for bruce and batman at this time
that one was apparently due to executives thinking Kevin Conroy's voice for Bruce was "too gay" sounding
Being WB, I guarantee you at least one executive insisted that it was confusing kids despite nobody having problems with it during the Fox run.
At any rate, it's a real shame. BTAS Bruce did a wonderful job of feeling distinct from Batman in a way that you could buy people not recognizing him in the suit. The whole Christopher Reeve deal of making himself look smaller by slumping his shoulders and sound meeker with a slightly different voice.
The entire philosophy behind BTAS's art style was that cartoons of the '80s had too many details in the designs and required too high a budget to be able to animate properly. The less lines animators have to draw, the less money it costs. TNBA was Timm going full moron with that whole idea since Kids WB was cheap,
And that's cheaper than white triangles with black dots?
8 months ago
Anonymous
In the original series, his eyes change shape constantly depending on his expression along with all the other details and folds on his face. Since the original shows had far more realistic animation with proper squash/stretch. Within the rigid confines of the new style, if they had gone with simple white triangles with black dots it would have looked even worse. There actually was an episode that showed what this might have looked like with a character dressed up as Joker, and it looked terrible. Pic related.
His eyes aren't the only thing that changed; there's no light reflecting on his hair, barely no folding lines on his clothes and the lipstick is gone. It's not bullshit that every line costs money because every line has to be drawn over and over hundreds and hundreds of times. That's why Joker wasn't the only character who went through these changes.
Same, I think both are fine. Not like we barely saw "Blue meanie" Joker. WB wanted redesigns ala the Superman Show and it worked out. Especially considering the crossover special.
>WB wanted redesigns ala the Superman Show and it worked out.
WB was actually completely fine with doing episodes like the old show. It was Timm who wanted to update it to his evolved style because the old chunky designs made him cringe.
Bruce Timm isn't content unless every design fits into the exact same generic template. It's why all of his women look like the same 14-year old girl wearing different outfits.
I thought maybe he had that form of autism where everything has to look exactly the same way but with only slight variations.
8 months ago
Anonymous
His style evolved in service to what makes the most consistent animation. Fewer details, fewer curved lines, and homogeneity because drawing the same thing over and over again is easier than drawing many different things.
I didn't mind the design because I think of TNBA as more of a kiddy version of BTAS anyway. It wasn't until they adapted 'Mad Love' that I disliked it. I can't take that design seriously at all and it ruins that story for me.
After marathoning BTAS, new adventures included, the new design grew on me. Not as clown prince of crime and in the same breath very expressive and terrifying to be stuck in a room with.
That being said, Justice League found a great middle-ground between the two.
Love how they showed off this design >Have it be in Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker, starting off in shadow, only show the lower part of the face and eyes before moving the full face into light
Genius.
Timm wanted Joker to look like a grinning skull because he represents death. Paul Dini cried to Jean MacCurdy about how Timm took away his lips, so Timm passive aggressively went over his lips with a pink highlighter and everyone agreed it looked terrible so they kept it lipless. He finally accepted the criticism with Return of the Joker.
It was cheaper to animate. Thats it.
This. Every decision was made to save money. Shit sucked in the late 90s.
Lips are expensive
It's supposed to look like the glowering eyes from Killing Joke.
But without the shading of the brim he just looks like a squirrel or something
kevin conroy also stopped doing a different voice for bruce and batman at this time
corners were cut
>kevin conroy also stopped doing a different voice for bruce and batman at this time
that one was apparently due to executives thinking Kevin Conroy's voice for Bruce was "too gay" sounding
Being WB, I guarantee you at least one executive insisted that it was confusing kids despite nobody having problems with it during the Fox run.
At any rate, it's a real shame. BTAS Bruce did a wonderful job of feeling distinct from Batman in a way that you could buy people not recognizing him in the suit. The whole Christopher Reeve deal of making himself look smaller by slumping his shoulders and sound meeker with a slightly different voice.
TBNA Bruce was pretty blatantly Batman.
A white washed Joker for all the future school shooters to idolize.
I see people give this design flack often but I've always liked it, has a neat look to it.
lmao, same style of teeth
Normal eyes would've been too expensive? Fricking bullshit.
BTAS Joker used his eyes and makeup to emote.
TNBA Joker just used his eyes.
So one less feature to animate.
>Fricking bullshit
The entire philosophy behind BTAS's art style was that cartoons of the '80s had too many details in the designs and required too high a budget to be able to animate properly. The less lines animators have to draw, the less money it costs. TNBA was Timm going full moron with that whole idea since Kids WB was cheap,
I mean, why would inverting the colors of his eyes change? Whites to be white qnd so on
His eyes are literally just triangles with white dots now.
And that's cheaper than white triangles with black dots?
In the original series, his eyes change shape constantly depending on his expression along with all the other details and folds on his face. Since the original shows had far more realistic animation with proper squash/stretch. Within the rigid confines of the new style, if they had gone with simple white triangles with black dots it would have looked even worse. There actually was an episode that showed what this might have looked like with a character dressed up as Joker, and it looked terrible. Pic related.
His eyes aren't the only thing that changed; there's no light reflecting on his hair, barely no folding lines on his clothes and the lipstick is gone. It's not bullshit that every line costs money because every line has to be drawn over and over hundreds and hundreds of times. That's why Joker wasn't the only character who went through these changes.
It'd be fine in a vacuum, if the previous one didn't exist.
Same, I think both are fine. Not like we barely saw "Blue meanie" Joker. WB wanted redesigns ala the Superman Show and it worked out. Especially considering the crossover special.
>WB wanted redesigns ala the Superman Show and it worked out.
WB was actually completely fine with doing episodes like the old show. It was Timm who wanted to update it to his evolved style because the old chunky designs made him cringe.
Bruce Timm isn't content unless every design fits into the exact same generic template. It's why all of his women look like the same 14-year old girl wearing different outfits.
He was traumatized by those Akom episodes. Putting everyone into a factory mold makes them easier to draw.
I thought maybe he had that form of autism where everything has to look exactly the same way but with only slight variations.
His style evolved in service to what makes the most consistent animation. Fewer details, fewer curved lines, and homogeneity because drawing the same thing over and over again is easier than drawing many different things.
>warner bros. jocker
I didn't mind the design because I think of TNBA as more of a kiddy version of BTAS anyway. It wasn't until they adapted 'Mad Love' that I disliked it. I can't take that design seriously at all and it ruins that story for me.
After marathoning BTAS, new adventures included, the new design grew on me. Not as clown prince of crime and in the same breath very expressive and terrifying to be stuck in a room with.
That being said, Justice League found a great middle-ground between the two.
Love how they showed off this design
>Have it be in Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker, starting off in shadow, only show the lower part of the face and eyes before moving the full face into light
Genius.
Timm wanted Joker to look like a grinning skull because he represents death. Paul Dini cried to Jean MacCurdy about how Timm took away his lips, so Timm passive aggressively went over his lips with a pink highlighter and everyone agreed it looked terrible so they kept it lipless. He finally accepted the criticism with Return of the Joker.
It's funny how he thought he was being edgy but all it did was make Joker look like a character straight out of Freakazoid.
Well to be fair, at the end of the day this was a show for kids. They didn't want to terrify them out of the living room.