Why haven't writers other than Moore made a superhero comic as good as Watchmen after the fact, whether pessimistic, optimistic, etc?
Moore said it took a lot of work, but surely some young up-and-comer had the required level of moxie?
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astro city > watchmen
Astro City is pretty good but it's not as good. The art is also pretty lacking.
Same, except the art is excellent.
More than a few of them are good.
I agree that Astro City is good, but considering it is an anthology it isnt as dense in “deep“ writing or in presentation as Watchmen. Thats like gold digging in the river (AstroCity) to digging a gold vein in the mountain (Watchmen).
This is ironically, a shallow way of viewing things. Actual creators appreciate short works, and many long form works can be hollow.
You misunderstand me. The problem is that Astrocity has good issues but several that are just your standard good F4 or Spider-Man comic. Not every issue is like the Silver Agent one or in the origin of the Confessor.
And there isnt something like the pirate comic or the appendix lore text pages in every issue of Astro City. Or i dont remember that it ever tried to do graphically like the Watchmen symbols like the Hiroshima couple or plays with the panel layout in every issue.
Thats what i mean that these good things are evenly distributed over the whole series rather than in a 12 issue series with this every page.
The New Frontier
HAAAAAAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
No.
Superhero comics are not good.
>as good as Watchmen
Because most writers arent good. Look at how many bad or onions books exist. Now pair that with a small pond of comic writers and how comics includes lettering and drawing with writing.
You dont get the small group of good writers to write comics.
>onions
get the frick outta here
>Moore said it took a lot of work, but surely some young up-and-comer had the required level of moxie?
It doesn't take work, it takes talent, and you can't get more of it than you're born with. Moore was born with the best writing genes. No one can ever surpass him because you'd have to rewrite your DNA to be as good a writer as him. No, you can't just practice, it doesn't work like that.
OP said "as good as" Watchmen, not better.
The Death-Ray is worse than Watchmen.
nope
yep
Watchmen is one of the main culprits in the downfall of western comics and media in general. The whole 'dark and edgy subversion' of an otherwise lighthearted trope planted the seeds of destruction.
thats only because morons took the wrong message away from Watchmen
Neither Evangelion nor Madoka killed anime or made it darker.
The main culprits were Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns. I don't count Moore's Swamp Thing because that was a horror book.
>otherwise lighthearted trope
>trope
Not genre?
Watchmen should not be to blame for the hack work of later writers and editors.
Swamp Thing is a horror/superhero comic. Before these there was Miller's Daredevil and Moore's Marvelman. The main culprit, as in any case with anything bad in comics, is the industry itself.
Frick I meant genre, mb
Yeah. While Watchmen is not really bad, I feel like it did really affect comics in a negative way.
Hm, true.
paraphrasing David Letterman, there are superhero comics that are as good (and important) as Watchmen but I can't think of any that is better
The truth is 99.99% of all Marvel and DC writers including the "A-listers" are literal who hacks that can't get a job as a writer anywhere else nevermind publish their own books, Moore is one of the extremely few with actual talent and skill.
kek easily most of the worst writers at Marvel and DC are the people who were already TV/movie writers or had book deals.
Remember Brad Meltzer crossing over from novels to comics and his big idea was to introduce rape to the Justice League?
Name one relevant novel from any of the +1000 big 2 writers in the last 80 years
Impossible mode: not American Gods.
Just disqualify Neil Gaiman on a whole because Good Omens is great too.
I wanted him to make a list so it would be all Neil Gaiman
Ta-Nehisi Coates is a best selling author. And he sucks at making comics.
Who?
Why does Gaiman even bother being underpaid by Marvel when he already is filthy rich
You have bad taste. Watchmen isn't good.
Who said this?
https://www.comicsreporter.com/index.php/index/reading_the_watchmen_various_entrance_points_into_the_esteemed_graphic_nove/
Tom Spergeon
We get it anon. Your "good taste" is only things that validate your manchild sensibilities and consumptions.
Not enough dedication to the art of rape.
It takes more than just moxie. Someone would also need experience, a deep appreciation for comics as a medium, some degree of autism, and creative freedom to tell a self-contained story that isn't meant to be franchised and optioned for a movie/show from the get go.
I'd also point out the people who obsess over the superhero deconstruction part too much may miss out on the formal elements of the comic itself that make it so much greater than the sum of its parts.
Enigma is said to be equally kino or better but I don't really see it.
I want to reread it soon.
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Alan Moore read and wrote actual books.
I went to a comic convention where comic writers had booths. Curiously, I asked their inspiration for their writings. They all cited previous capeshit books or movies. No literature, no history, no documentaries, no "deep" movies. Nothing. It's impossible to have good writing when your only knowledgebase is dogshit. (the writers were DC ones for anyone curious)
I would say history, philosophy and psychology are even more important to a writer than reading classics. The more you know about those 3 the better the content will be. Those 3 and knowing how to deliver a twist and good jokes.
A lot of older writers read books. It didn't always make their work great, but it gave them an edge writers today do not have.
I feel like they are afraid.