haha no it goes back further than him, though Watchmen should have been a warning
https://i.imgur.com/E1EXUu4.jpg
Why is DC flopping so hard? What's next?
they've overspent repeatedly on movies that are simply bad from the ground up, rather than put them back into development work and spend a little more that they'd probably make back, they chose to plow on and make overcosted movies that will never make budget back
they have no idea what they're doing and when something does rarely work (Wonder Woman, Shazam!, Aquaman, Joker) they manage to frick it up on the sequel (Wonder Woman 1984, Shazam 2, Black Adam, Aquaman 2, Joker 2)
there's an over-reliance on star power from faded and sometimes bizarre choices, people who are big names on paper but haven't made a good movie in years if ever (Johnson, Affleck, Leto) with classier actors on the sidelines as throwaway supporting characters
there's an over-reliance on the brand itself to sell frankly very bad versions of the characters and settings to the public, coupled with an incredible assumption that after more than a dozen Batman movies since 1989 and half a dozen Superman movies since 1978 the same public they expect to flock to the brand don't have any real concept of what DC is or what they want from a DC movie
there's a truly lazy assumption that because the MCU sells a DCU would also sell (this didn't work out for Universal Monsters, AvP or the Hanna-Barbera Cinematic Universe, and arguably isn't working for the MonsterVerse with its diminishing returns, and likewise didn't work for the FOX X-Men with their series of increasingly shitty and disjointed movies), backed by a secondary assumption that because DC has older titles those can simply be grandfathered in without hurting the brand in order to actively promote bad new movies with nostalgia for bad old movies: George Clooney showing up at the end of Flash would only be shocking or amusing if he were connecting Gravity (2013) and the Ocean's film series to the new DCU, instead it's just a lazy cameo
>haha no it goes back further than him, though Watchmen should have been a warning
No it doesn't, Nolan's Batman had a lot of fans, you just need a director that isn't pretentious and edgy with their super hero interpretations and Jesus/Superman analogies.
All you need is a simple story and make it for kids (MCU) or teenagers (Batman movies, James Gunn movies, Joker) and boom, you got yourself a hit, it's that simple.
Walter Hamada deserves most of the blame, he's just not a recognizable enough name and face for people to rail against.
Snyder, for all his faults, is prestige cheese executed with sincerity. His films have a unified, but nonetheless horrible, vision that has its own adherents, and it served as a counterpoint to the MCU. The post Snyder movies serve no such pragmatic function. They come across as facile imitation that hope to surpass the originals simply by being bigger, flashier, and more explosion-y. Joker, their single great movie, survives by the grace of benign neglect and a lack of faith. I read once that WBD offered Todd Phillips the position of studio, but he wisely turned it down. I am certain he just does not want to hang out with the tasteless frickers that run WB.
Snyder is the ultimate scapegoat despite being their only competent director.
Snyder left but the vast majority of the DCEU worldbuilding, every single character and 99% of the lore was made by him, it's impossible to deny his responsability on the DCEU, calling him a "scapegoat" is just ridiculous. The DCEU is his creation, if it was a massive sucess it would be because of him, and since it is a failure it's because of him as well.
>Snyder had the right idea with taking superheroes seriously
Taking Superheroes seriously doesn't just mean edgy darkness and biblical references, it means respecting these characters and where they came from. His Batman worked well enough because that particular box of toys is naturally closest to his sensibilities, but Batfleck was introduced in BvS and Snyder's Superman was so off the mark that the whole movie project was bound to fail as a consequence.
Cavill and Affleck deserved better than Snyder and WB.
>Snyder had the right idea with taking superheroes
No he didn't. He should have just made a tone that was appropriate to the specific cape character instead of turning everything into the Dark Knight Returns. It's the exact same issue of turning every MCU character into Iron Man but worse.
DC trying it's own thing would be good but Snyder was just copying Michael Bay but without the good fight scenes and CGI(the two only reasons why people even watch transformers)
Except that's not what DC is.
The New Gods aren't supposed to look like fricking graphics card box art, they're supposed to be vibrant and full of life.
You can take a hero seriously and not have the movie be some melodramatic piece of shit full of slow mo and dbz fight scenes. See spiderman 1 and 2. I rest my case.
I agree with you in theory but the fact you think Snyder of all people is a good filmmaker is why people don't take you gays seriusly. Man has literally never made a single good film in his life.
Want a serious hero film that takes the property with geniune class? Cool.
Joker did that.
The Batman (2022) did that.
Snyder tries to be this and always fails. Snyder only got as far as he did because of his israelite wife.
The thing is, even though Synder is gone that doesn't mean that the decisions he made and bad movies he put out have not continued to taint what comes after.
If someone burns down my house today, and the guy gets caught and goes to jail, a week from now my house is STILL burnt to the ground. "What do you mean you don't have a place to live, didn't they already catch the guy?" is a nonsensical answer.
It's amazing that Snyder's essentially been gone since BvS and people still think he's in charge of these films.
Are you really this fricking stupid? The DCEU is built on the foundation Snyder made. His utter lack of talent doomed all future projects to failure because he set the mold they have to work in.
Are you really this fricking stupid? The DCEU is built on the foundation Snyder made. His utter lack of talent doomed all future projects to failure because he set the mold they have to work in.
Yeah, sure, they were so successful that the only movies which were reported to actually do good budget-wise were MoS, Aquaman and Skwad, and straight up 2 of these movies didn't have Snyder get involved.
Also the fact that most of the times these movies only did well internationally while domestically they didn't do so good doesn't help either.
And we shouldn't even mention at this point the whole cultist-like behavior from a big number of Indian and white trash fans has managed to hurt the brand even more.
No, anon, things got really messed up thanks to Snyder, although of course, this also happened due to the executives in WB trying to double down on supporting him, THEN sacking him when JL was mid-production, and no, I mean they could have waited for Snyder to process his period over his daughter's suicide, but naaaah, let's jump immediately into Josh Whedon, cuz he definitely won't frick things even faster (he did).
>lol. Imagine coping this hard
Not an argument troglodyte, explain how is it that Snyder actually didn't frick things up or go back to your twitter and facebook circles.
>let's jump immediately into Josh Whedon, cuz he definitely won't frick things even faster (he did).
I agree with most of the post but trying to blame Whedon is ridiculous, the movie was 70% done when he joined and was just BvS part 2, the entire DCEU worldbuilding was pretty much completed by Snyder
No one not even the best director of all time would be able to turn a mostly finished shitty movie from a shitty movie series into something good.
WB should end the DCEU, wait a decade or the conclusion of the MCU and then reboot with an experienced producer like Kevin Feige in charge, and start hiring competent directors like Nolan and Donner again not infamous divisive hacks like David Ayer and Zack Snyder
The fricked up thing is that he took the job. He should've shown solidarity with a fellow artist, even if he disagrees or dislikes his movies, and given the finger to the studio. It such a fricking dick move of him to agree to butcher someone else's work at the behest of a buncha corpo suits.
WB fricked cuz they tried to course correct and didn't delay Justice league so Snyder and Terio can write an actual 2 hour movie.
The unwatchable cut was a chopped up version of his 4 hour movie that was never gonna work.if they wanted him off they should have done it before filming started, get a new script and a new director and delay JL by at least a year.
But WB has been ran with a stupid stick for years. Especially when it comes to the DC movies(why destroy Krypton what if superman needs to go home as one exec was quoted to have said)
The mcu didn't start at a billion and it's a stupid metic even today cuz not every film has a billion dollar story. WW was their IM2 if you will. They should have just stayed course for the main 4 (Supes, WW, Bats and Aquaman) got in board with lower scale movies with new directors.
>Also the fact that most of the times these movies only did well internationally while domestically they didn't do so good doesn't help either.
"Guys, we actually were winning money but it was FOREIGN money, aaaaaaahhh"
>He brought about the most success for this brand in years.
MoS and BvS were 2-3 years after 2 billion box office highly praised Batman movies, Justice League Unlimited ending and Young Justice starting, Arkham series being a massive sucess and DC selling more comics than Marvel for the first time in decades
DC was beating Marvel in every way and making billions before he took over and it all ended with MoS
Instead of the MCU where profits went up over time because people liked the MCU, people checked into Synder's early shit, realized it was crap and checked out which is why sales went down and down and down.
>Have the first on-screen encounter between Batman and Superman, something that had been hyped for decades >Add Wonder Woman, so now the stakes are higher >Arguably the three most recognizable superheroes in popular culture aside from Spider-Man and the Hulk >That alone should have printed money because unlike Iron Man or Thor; everyone and their grandma knew who Superman, Batman and WW are >Absolutely frick up the result by turning the movie into a continuity mess filled with christian references to Superman as Jesus >Instead of teaming up, you kill Superman in a way that felt extremely underwhelming instead of saving Doomsday for a slugfest featuring the entire League
Snyder has amazing visuals, but he isn't really a synonym for success. Shazam, Aquaman and WW standalones outperformed BvS AND the Justice League. Frick, d-listers like the Guardians of the Galaxy outperformed the two most popular superheroes in the box office three times.
Only the DCEU has been flopping. Joker and The Batman being the biggest hits show that the DCEU is the problem.
They should have rebooted years ago, but Wonder Woman and Aquaman successes made WB think it was worth saving it.
>Why did the flash flop
They literally maked a movie with PS2 tier CGI but still expected the people to be fine about it.
This movie is a big middle finger to anyone who went to the cinema. I would have tried to get a refund for the ticket price if I went to see this shit movie
Nothing they had one chance to make a universal reboot but they threw it away.
Now they will do what webcomic artists do when they run out of ideas/get busy/get bored, abandon the project and never mention it again.
>Why is DC flopping so hard? What's next?
They could do something closer to the comics by respecting the source like Super Mario did, but they preferred to do something stupid like the MCU does In phase 1 the MCU had In phase 1 the MCU had Hayley Atwell, Scarlett Johansson, Kat Dennings, who did the DCEU have at the beginning Gal Gadot?
It's the opposite, the MCU is a sucess because it's quite close to the comics with a few minor changes to avoid comic gays spamming spoilers everywhere while the DCEU is nothing like the comics in tone or worldbuilding.
Are the pea brains on this board really going to insist that Snyder's gritty take on DC wouldn't succeed in today's world where everyone is sick of Marvel's style?
It's stupid to turn iconic characters like Batman into psychopathic killing and carving machines. Just introduce edgy characters like Lobo or Darkseid.
In theory the idea isn't totally dogshit, having him kill randos was stupid though, but the main issue is that for some stupid ass reason Synder decided to start his arc near the fricking end of it right at the beginning? We needed a solo movie or two with implied downtime between them where he's just doing his shit, before he snapped and went all crazy before being redeemed by Supe's hopes or whatever.
That's the problem with Snyder. He takes characters like Batman and Superman then changes the fundamental character traits of them. So we end up with a dude dressed like Batman murderingpeople and then Snyder fabs cheer because they never gave a frick about Batman as a character, they just want big music video action scenes.
Keaton!Bats literally murders ppl with his own hands and ppl are upset that Alfleck Batman indirectly gets ppl killed even tho that's what happens in the comics.
You can have edge, gore and less "safe" elements in your adaptation and still make the IP have good writing to it, just like Spawn, Invincible, The Boys and other liked series have done.
The issue falls entirely on shoving down edge and religious imagery on your adaptation and trying to paint it as art, or as something above people's head, when in reality it only ends up as pretentious bullshit without head or tails.
No one is sick of the MCU style, Guardians 3 just made as much money as Guardians 2, the MCU is just worse now because Feige got too wienery and decided to hire a bunch of shitty directors(just like DC did when the DCEU started)
DC, and even Disney, should be learning a tough lesson this year. Superheroes are not what drives people to theaters. Compelling movies with simple and elegant themes of heroism, sacrifice, tragedy, and redemption are what drives people. Those also happen to be qualities that classic superhero comics had in spades. That's what made the first 3 phases of the MCU successful. The more the MCU strayed from those themes, the more they delved into abstract gimmicks, moral ambiguity, and subversion, is when they started to slip.
DCEU, meanwhile, never understood. They wanted epic fights, grand spectacle, and enough CGI pyrotechnics to raze a virtual continent three times over. They believed this during the Snyder era, and they continued to believe this after, with the addition of forced humor. The few successes in the DCEU were flukes that have not been repeated, and the successes outside came from auteur film makers working far away from the dirty molesting fingers of executives greedy for cinematic universes, and cabals of subpar writing teams looking to hook themselves onto successful platforms so that they may one day take over.
Suicide Squad, crap. Birds of Prey and WW84, overstuffed crap draped in a feminist flag. Black Adam, Fury of the Gods, and the Flash, vomitous, overwrought cgi diarrhea. This is a shit batting average that drags down the decent and mildly pleasant movies.
Stop making superhero movies, and start making good movies with superheroes in them.
(You)'ll get no yous here if the only thing you do is try to appear as a connoisseur when you only end up as a moron, moron.
Also, no one here has commented on either thing so... Maybe you should stop being a schizo and learn to read?
Or go back to /tv-v-pol/, stupid ass tourist.
I think it has to do with unattainable economic standards. If the movie doesn't break even on week one, they give up on it. Let's face it, there's no room for economic growth.
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
No one gives a shit about the Flash and it looks like poop made by directors and writers who have already moved on from this universe. Who the frick is the audience for Tim Burton's Batman in this film? These movies are over 30 years old and boomers don't give a shit about this zoomer garbage. Maybe if they had Bale more people would have flocked in. You need 2000 property to get e-celebs and zoomerinos excited like with Raimi-Man or Fox's Wolverine >What's next?
Superman Legacy made by James Gunn. It will barely make Man of Steel numbers unless they advertise James Gunn as the guy who brought people their favourite MCU films
>It will barely make Man of Steel numbers
Yeah, it's way too soon for a reboot, the audience will be confused and not interested due to DC several failures.
>unless they advertise James Gunn as the guy who brought people their favourite MCU films
They put "From the visionary director of GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY" in every thread they made for the Squad and that movie still flopped.
Yeah but now he is actually done with the MCU and they now are going all in on Gunn's vision of his own universe compared to last time where the Snyderverse was already kind of dead. Gunn was also shilling The Flash a lot and that movie obviously bombed as well. I think people just don't care about the Snyderverse anymore and capeshit interest has gone to almost zero. You need something extremely quirky or Spider-Man to make some cash.
I think part of the issue was how the cameo was handled, I like Keatonbats and just hearing him just gets killed twice and knowing his world is doomed kills my interest in seeing it since there are no stakes as Barry just abandons it at the end so he hardly feels heroic. NWH actually did something with the crossovers in the movie and had fun with both Garfield and Maguire along their villains.
No Way Home actually also had the decency of not turning Raimi-Man into an absolute loser to shill Holland since he is older and that's just expected from your favourite heroes like with Star Wars, Indiana Jones, The Flash's Batman or even Spiderverse. It intergrated the doom of the Snöyverse well into Andrew's character where he isn't exactly a failure but shit that happened in the past still haunted him because it was that traumatic and he became insecure which was appropriate.
I can't believe they're banking on the Gunnverse and not starting over with The Batman. Slowly introduce super science in the next one with Freeze or Ivy, Get a more gritty, grounded street level DCEU with a depowered Superman who can leap buildings and throw cars (still optimistic and colorful though) and start from there.
If Gunnverse Batman happens there will be three fricking seperate live action continuities of Batman at the same time. Four if Flash wasn't the last movie. Warner Bros really is made of morons
It was 10 years and they couldn't have a Superman and a Batman that actually worked together. That should be the foundation for any DC universe and they couldn't achieve that. So fans just never got invested in their movies.
I think DC movies should buy into nostalgia instead of trying to keep up with the times.
Make movies about Batman/Superman in the 50s, old school superheroes in an old school setting.
Man I was sure bringing in Keaton Bats would at least ensure the film turned a profit but I’ve never been so happy to be wrong. Frick this movie, frick WB, and frick Zaslav.
At this point i am convinced that Warner just want to "crash the plane with no survivors" or at least devalue itself until another company is encouraged to buy.
That is the only thing that explain why they hired James Gunn tbh
>Have the first on-screen encounter between Batman and Superman, something that had been hyped for decades >Add Wonder Woman, so now the stakes are higher >Arguably the three most recognizable superheroes in popular culture aside from Spider-Man and the Hulk >That alone should have printed money because unlike Iron Man or Thor; everyone and their grandma knew who Superman, Batman and WW are >Absolutely frick up the result by turning the movie into a continuity mess filled with christian references to Superman as Jesus >Instead of teaming up, you kill Superman in a way that felt extremely underwhelming instead of saving Doomsday for a slugfest featuring the entire League
Snyder has amazing visuals, but he isn't really a synonym for success. Shazam, Aquaman and WW standalones outperformed BvS AND the Justice League. Frick, d-listers like the Guardians of the Galaxy outperformed the two most popular superheroes in the box office three times.
> Shazam, Aquaman and WW standalones outperformed BvS AND the Justice League.
Bruh Shazam didn't even earn 400 millions
Actor is a psychotic delusional nonbinary cultist and literal child groomer. Real question is why they thought people would be fine with this.
It's Hollywood. What did you expect?
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
Snyder.
> What's next?
Nothing.
haha no it goes back further than him, though Watchmen should have been a warning
they've overspent repeatedly on movies that are simply bad from the ground up, rather than put them back into development work and spend a little more that they'd probably make back, they chose to plow on and make overcosted movies that will never make budget back
they have no idea what they're doing and when something does rarely work (Wonder Woman, Shazam!, Aquaman, Joker) they manage to frick it up on the sequel (Wonder Woman 1984, Shazam 2, Black Adam, Aquaman 2, Joker 2)
there's an over-reliance on star power from faded and sometimes bizarre choices, people who are big names on paper but haven't made a good movie in years if ever (Johnson, Affleck, Leto) with classier actors on the sidelines as throwaway supporting characters
there's an over-reliance on the brand itself to sell frankly very bad versions of the characters and settings to the public, coupled with an incredible assumption that after more than a dozen Batman movies since 1989 and half a dozen Superman movies since 1978 the same public they expect to flock to the brand don't have any real concept of what DC is or what they want from a DC movie
there's a truly lazy assumption that because the MCU sells a DCU would also sell (this didn't work out for Universal Monsters, AvP or the Hanna-Barbera Cinematic Universe, and arguably isn't working for the MonsterVerse with its diminishing returns, and likewise didn't work for the FOX X-Men with their series of increasingly shitty and disjointed movies), backed by a secondary assumption that because DC has older titles those can simply be grandfathered in without hurting the brand in order to actively promote bad new movies with nostalgia for bad old movies: George Clooney showing up at the end of Flash would only be shocking or amusing if he were connecting Gravity (2013) and the Ocean's film series to the new DCU, instead it's just a lazy cameo
I think Snyder's movies could be seen as a series of power-draining rituals
>Hanna-Barbera Cinematic Universe
Huh? You mean Scoob and that Hong Kong Fooey/Eddie Murphy reel?
>haha no it goes back further than him, though Watchmen should have been a warning
No it doesn't, Nolan's Batman had a lot of fans, you just need a director that isn't pretentious and edgy with their super hero interpretations and Jesus/Superman analogies.
All you need is a simple story and make it for kids (MCU) or teenagers (Batman movies, James Gunn movies, Joker) and boom, you got yourself a hit, it's that simple.
>Joker
>aimed at teenagers
at teenagers
Yes.
A film they couldn't even see without bringing mommy? Are you stupid anon?
It's amazing that Snyder's essentially been gone since BvS and people still think he's in charge of these films.
Walter Hamada deserves most of the blame, he's just not a recognizable enough name and face for people to rail against.
Snyder, for all his faults, is prestige cheese executed with sincerity. His films have a unified, but nonetheless horrible, vision that has its own adherents, and it served as a counterpoint to the MCU. The post Snyder movies serve no such pragmatic function. They come across as facile imitation that hope to surpass the originals simply by being bigger, flashier, and more explosion-y. Joker, their single great movie, survives by the grace of benign neglect and a lack of faith. I read once that WBD offered Todd Phillips the position of studio, but he wisely turned it down. I am certain he just does not want to hang out with the tasteless frickers that run WB.
Shut the frick up Snyderhomosexual, Snyder deserves all the blame.
Snyder left but the vast majority of the DCEU worldbuilding, every single character and 99% of the lore was made by him, it's impossible to deny his responsability on the DCEU, calling him a "scapegoat" is just ridiculous. The DCEU is his creation, if it was a massive sucess it would be because of him, and since it is a failure it's because of him as well.
It's 50% Snyder being a hack and 50% WB being a mess of a company without any vision for the long run.
If you want the MCU just watch the MCU.
Snyder had the right idea with taking superheroes seriously and expanding the genre beyond trite quips.
>Snyder had the right idea with taking superheroes seriously
Taking Superheroes seriously doesn't just mean edgy darkness and biblical references, it means respecting these characters and where they came from. His Batman worked well enough because that particular box of toys is naturally closest to his sensibilities, but Batfleck was introduced in BvS and Snyder's Superman was so off the mark that the whole movie project was bound to fail as a consequence.
Cavill and Affleck deserved better than Snyder and WB.
>Snyder had the right idea with taking superheroes
No he didn't. He should have just made a tone that was appropriate to the specific cape character instead of turning everything into the Dark Knight Returns. It's the exact same issue of turning every MCU character into Iron Man but worse.
DC trying it's own thing would be good but Snyder was just copying Michael Bay but without the good fight scenes and CGI(the two only reasons why people even watch transformers)
The fight scene with Zod and Batman warehouse scene were kino
Except that's not what DC is.
The New Gods aren't supposed to look like fricking graphics card box art, they're supposed to be vibrant and full of life.
You can take a hero seriously and not have the movie be some melodramatic piece of shit full of slow mo and dbz fight scenes. See spiderman 1 and 2. I rest my case.
The DBZ fight scenes were actually entertaining.
I like Spiderman, but for the one liners and not the drama.
I agree with you in theory but the fact you think Snyder of all people is a good filmmaker is why people don't take you gays seriusly. Man has literally never made a single good film in his life.
Want a serious hero film that takes the property with geniune class? Cool.
Joker did that.
The Batman (2022) did that.
Snyder tries to be this and always fails. Snyder only got as far as he did because of his israelite wife.
Snyder is a 14 year old's idea of "serious".
He's the scapegoat.
It's like covid. "Why were you late today?" -> "Covid." -> "Understandable. Have a nice day."
Makes 0 sense but nobody questions it lol
The thing is, even though Synder is gone that doesn't mean that the decisions he made and bad movies he put out have not continued to taint what comes after.
If someone burns down my house today, and the guy gets caught and goes to jail, a week from now my house is STILL burnt to the ground. "What do you mean you don't have a place to live, didn't they already catch the guy?" is a nonsensical answer.
Are you really this fricking stupid? The DCEU is built on the foundation Snyder made. His utter lack of talent doomed all future projects to failure because he set the mold they have to work in.
>it's been 6 years - almost 7 - that Snyder left
It's just sad at this point.
See
and then have a nice day.
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
outdated characters that are going the way of Tarzan, Doc Savage, The Phantom, The Shadow, etc.
Kys Ladderbro
I remember this fabled "ladderbro" from way back. Is he really still around? Why is he called "ladder" bro? I need answers.
his comic shelf had ladders
He was a fricking manlet?
Those characters never go out of style. Illiterate normies just don't want to read anything that isn't "NEW" for whatever moronic reason...
Is the next Aquaman movie still a thing?
Ezra cannot pull off being a superhero. The costume is fricking amazing and he can't sell it all because of his goofy fricking face.
>What's next?
Just look at their release calendar, coming up next is Hispanic Beetle.
Bankruptcy?
When I was a kid, any time a DC show came on on cartoon network, I would change to Nick.
Cringe
yeah he should have changed to Fox.
I would switch to the nick channel too, but for another reason...
KEK!
When I was a kid, any time a Marvel show came on on cartoon network, I would change the channel since I thought they were the knockoff versions
cringe
>Marvel show came on on cartoon network
no actually those were pretty bad, you didn't missed out anything.
how to know when a DCuck is crying:
>copies other's people replies trying to "balance out" the discussion
lmao copy this one too
How to spot a Marvelgay
>Can't reap what he sows
lmao cry about this one too
Why do anti-Snyders still cope about him? He brought about the most success for this brand in years.
Yeah, sure, they were so successful that the only movies which were reported to actually do good budget-wise were MoS, Aquaman and Skwad, and straight up 2 of these movies didn't have Snyder get involved.
Also the fact that most of the times these movies only did well internationally while domestically they didn't do so good doesn't help either.
And we shouldn't even mention at this point the whole cultist-like behavior from a big number of Indian and white trash fans has managed to hurt the brand even more.
No, anon, things got really messed up thanks to Snyder, although of course, this also happened due to the executives in WB trying to double down on supporting him, THEN sacking him when JL was mid-production, and no, I mean they could have waited for Snyder to process his period over his daughter's suicide, but naaaah, let's jump immediately into Josh Whedon, cuz he definitely won't frick things even faster (he did).
lol. Imagine coping this hard
>lol. Imagine coping this hard
Not an argument troglodyte, explain how is it that Snyder actually didn't frick things up or go back to your twitter and facebook circles.
>let's jump immediately into Josh Whedon, cuz he definitely won't frick things even faster (he did).
I agree with most of the post but trying to blame Whedon is ridiculous, the movie was 70% done when he joined and was just BvS part 2, the entire DCEU worldbuilding was pretty much completed by Snyder
No one not even the best director of all time would be able to turn a mostly finished shitty movie from a shitty movie series into something good.
WB should end the DCEU, wait a decade or the conclusion of the MCU and then reboot with an experienced producer like Kevin Feige in charge, and start hiring competent directors like Nolan and Donner again not infamous divisive hacks like David Ayer and Zack Snyder
The fricked up thing is that he took the job. He should've shown solidarity with a fellow artist, even if he disagrees or dislikes his movies, and given the finger to the studio. It such a fricking dick move of him to agree to butcher someone else's work at the behest of a buncha corpo suits.
WB fricked cuz they tried to course correct and didn't delay Justice league so Snyder and Terio can write an actual 2 hour movie.
The unwatchable cut was a chopped up version of his 4 hour movie that was never gonna work.if they wanted him off they should have done it before filming started, get a new script and a new director and delay JL by at least a year.
But WB has been ran with a stupid stick for years. Especially when it comes to the DC movies(why destroy Krypton what if superman needs to go home as one exec was quoted to have said)
The mcu didn't start at a billion and it's a stupid metic even today cuz not every film has a billion dollar story. WW was their IM2 if you will. They should have just stayed course for the main 4 (Supes, WW, Bats and Aquaman) got in board with lower scale movies with new directors.
>Also the fact that most of the times these movies only did well internationally while domestically they didn't do so good doesn't help either.
"Guys, we actually were winning money but it was FOREIGN money, aaaaaaahhh"
good morning sirs
Is Cinemaphile trannies, they are delusional
>He brought about the most success for this brand in years.
MoS and BvS were 2-3 years after 2 billion box office highly praised Batman movies, Justice League Unlimited ending and Young Justice starting, Arkham series being a massive sucess and DC selling more comics than Marvel for the first time in decades
DC was beating Marvel in every way and making billions before he took over and it all ended with MoS
Instead of the MCU where profits went up over time because people liked the MCU, people checked into Synder's early shit, realized it was crap and checked out which is why sales went down and down and down.
>He brought about the most success for this brand in years.
No, that would be the Joker.
>Have the first on-screen encounter between Batman and Superman, something that had been hyped for decades
>Add Wonder Woman, so now the stakes are higher
>Arguably the three most recognizable superheroes in popular culture aside from Spider-Man and the Hulk
>That alone should have printed money because unlike Iron Man or Thor; everyone and their grandma knew who Superman, Batman and WW are
>Absolutely frick up the result by turning the movie into a continuity mess filled with christian references to Superman as Jesus
>Instead of teaming up, you kill Superman in a way that felt extremely underwhelming instead of saving Doomsday for a slugfest featuring the entire League
Snyder has amazing visuals, but he isn't really a synonym for success. Shazam, Aquaman and WW standalones outperformed BvS AND the Justice League. Frick, d-listers like the Guardians of the Galaxy outperformed the two most popular superheroes in the box office three times.
The problem with Snyder is that he didn't care at all about Supes lore. The only relevant character for him is Lois and nobody else.
Snyder said you need an origin story for why Superman doesn't kill. He's a literal sociopath.
And then he proceeded to kill people in BvS
Only the DCEU has been flopping. Joker and The Batman being the biggest hits show that the DCEU is the problem.
They should have rebooted years ago, but Wonder Woman and Aquaman successes made WB think it was worth saving it.
>Why did the flash flop
They literally maked a movie with PS2 tier CGI but still expected the people to be fine about it.
This movie is a big middle finger to anyone who went to the cinema. I would have tried to get a refund for the ticket price if I went to see this shit movie
best movie since TDK, they said.
Why did they keep that criminal as the flash. That fish lipped psycho gave me no desire to see the movie. Also keaton was a poor choice.
because the audience loves gay men who run badly as their Flash
Once they had proof of Miller's crimes, they should have replaced him with the CW Flash.
Also, they had like 5 extra years to improve those graphics.
So apparently The Flash didn't actually reboot the universe. Where are they going with this?
Nothing they had one chance to make a universal reboot but they threw it away.
Now they will do what webcomic artists do when they run out of ideas/get busy/get bored, abandon the project and never mention it again.
They will simply reboot it without an in-universe explanation, like most franchises
All the alleged connections between the remaining movies and the Gunn reboot are probably cheap attempts to sell more tickets.
You could say that The Flash has been... Flushed
>Why is DC flopping so hard? What's next?
They could do something closer to the comics by respecting the source like Super Mario did, but they preferred to do something stupid like the MCU does In phase 1 the MCU had In phase 1 the MCU had Hayley Atwell, Scarlett Johansson, Kat Dennings, who did the DCEU have at the beginning Gal Gadot?
It's the opposite, the MCU is a sucess because it's quite close to the comics with a few minor changes to avoid comic gays spamming spoilers everywhere while the DCEU is nothing like the comics in tone or worldbuilding.
>, the MCU is a sucess because it's quite close to the comics with a few minor changes
???
thicc
When I was growing up DC was a shoe brand and I didn't know why Superman and Batman weren't from Marvel.
That about sums it up, DC has no bran recognition.
>When I was growing up DC was a shoe brand and I didn't know why Superman and Batman weren't from Marvel.
The gasp is really this big?
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
they are making bad movies
Are the pea brains on this board really going to insist that Snyder's gritty take on DC wouldn't succeed in today's world where everyone is sick of Marvel's style?
It's stupid to turn iconic characters like Batman into psychopathic killing and carving machines. Just introduce edgy characters like Lobo or Darkseid.
Batman becoming more brutal and careless is actually very well-justified in the story though.
Except you'd think Batman would have killed Joker and other dangerous supervillains already if so, so the argument kinda falls flat.
I think he simply couldn't at the time. Joker was at large in Suicide Squad after all, and maybe Waller was stopping him from getting to the others.
In theory the idea isn't totally dogshit, having him kill randos was stupid though, but the main issue is that for some stupid ass reason Synder decided to start his arc near the fricking end of it right at the beginning? We needed a solo movie or two with implied downtime between them where he's just doing his shit, before he snapped and went all crazy before being redeemed by Supe's hopes or whatever.
That's the problem with Snyder. He takes characters like Batman and Superman then changes the fundamental character traits of them. So we end up with a dude dressed like Batman murderingpeople and then Snyder fabs cheer because they never gave a frick about Batman as a character, they just want big music video action scenes.
Keaton!Bats literally murders ppl with his own hands and ppl are upset that Alfleck Batman indirectly gets ppl killed even tho that's what happens in the comics.
This is why Snydergays are moronic. Your first movie in a new universe featuring Batman can't be Dark Knight Returns Batman.
You can have edge, gore and less "safe" elements in your adaptation and still make the IP have good writing to it, just like Spawn, Invincible, The Boys and other liked series have done.
The issue falls entirely on shoving down edge and religious imagery on your adaptation and trying to paint it as art, or as something above people's head, when in reality it only ends up as pretentious bullshit without head or tails.
No one is sick of the MCU style, Guardians 3 just made as much money as Guardians 2, the MCU is just worse now because Feige got too wienery and decided to hire a bunch of shitty directors(just like DC did when the DCEU started)
This was literally the exact same thing people were saying 10 years ago about Snyder. Guess what happened?
Dark and gritty doesn't work on every DC hero. Thats the problem.
DC, and even Disney, should be learning a tough lesson this year. Superheroes are not what drives people to theaters. Compelling movies with simple and elegant themes of heroism, sacrifice, tragedy, and redemption are what drives people. Those also happen to be qualities that classic superhero comics had in spades. That's what made the first 3 phases of the MCU successful. The more the MCU strayed from those themes, the more they delved into abstract gimmicks, moral ambiguity, and subversion, is when they started to slip.
DCEU, meanwhile, never understood. They wanted epic fights, grand spectacle, and enough CGI pyrotechnics to raze a virtual continent three times over. They believed this during the Snyder era, and they continued to believe this after, with the addition of forced humor. The few successes in the DCEU were flukes that have not been repeated, and the successes outside came from auteur film makers working far away from the dirty molesting fingers of executives greedy for cinematic universes, and cabals of subpar writing teams looking to hook themselves onto successful platforms so that they may one day take over.
Suicide Squad, crap. Birds of Prey and WW84, overstuffed crap draped in a feminist flag. Black Adam, Fury of the Gods, and the Flash, vomitous, overwrought cgi diarrhea. This is a shit batting average that drags down the decent and mildly pleasant movies.
Stop making superhero movies, and start making good movies with superheroes in them.
Mission impossible has never been good.
This but it gives people what they want. Good looking action scenes.
morons like you are why DC is failing and cruise is saving the box office
absolutely delusional
What does me saying that Cruise films are getting watched for their great looking action scenes have to do with DC failing
you agreed with him saying mi was never good??
Well yeah. They're not well written films in any way. They're action flicks. It's great action but that's all they are.
(You)'ll get no yous here if the only thing you do is try to appear as a connoisseur when you only end up as a moron, moron.
Also, no one here has commented on either thing so... Maybe you should stop being a schizo and learn to read?
Or go back to /tv-v-pol/, stupid ass tourist.
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
Because it's a poor man's Marvel.
They should just buy AMC theatres and they can show what they want lmao, boomers probably afraid of a monopoly because of it or something.
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
Because HE left.
Snyder is the ultimate scapegoat despite being their only competent director.
Was the tooth thing really necessary?
I think it has to do with unattainable economic standards. If the movie doesn't break even on week one, they give up on it. Let's face it, there's no room for economic growth.
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
No one gives a shit about the Flash and it looks like poop made by directors and writers who have already moved on from this universe. Who the frick is the audience for Tim Burton's Batman in this film? These movies are over 30 years old and boomers don't give a shit about this zoomer garbage. Maybe if they had Bale more people would have flocked in. You need 2000 property to get e-celebs and zoomerinos excited like with Raimi-Man or Fox's Wolverine
>What's next?
Superman Legacy made by James Gunn. It will barely make Man of Steel numbers unless they advertise James Gunn as the guy who brought people their favourite MCU films
>It will barely make Man of Steel numbers
Yeah, it's way too soon for a reboot, the audience will be confused and not interested due to DC several failures.
>unless they advertise James Gunn as the guy who brought people their favourite MCU films
They put "From the visionary director of GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY" in every thread they made for the Squad and that movie still flopped.
Yeah but now he is actually done with the MCU and they now are going all in on Gunn's vision of his own universe compared to last time where the Snyderverse was already kind of dead. Gunn was also shilling The Flash a lot and that movie obviously bombed as well. I think people just don't care about the Snyderverse anymore and capeshit interest has gone to almost zero. You need something extremely quirky or Spider-Man to make some cash.
I think part of the issue was how the cameo was handled, I like Keatonbats and just hearing him just gets killed twice and knowing his world is doomed kills my interest in seeing it since there are no stakes as Barry just abandons it at the end so he hardly feels heroic. NWH actually did something with the crossovers in the movie and had fun with both Garfield and Maguire along their villains.
No Way Home actually also had the decency of not turning Raimi-Man into an absolute loser to shill Holland since he is older and that's just expected from your favourite heroes like with Star Wars, Indiana Jones, The Flash's Batman or even Spiderverse. It intergrated the doom of the Snöyverse well into Andrew's character where he isn't exactly a failure but shit that happened in the past still haunted him because it was that traumatic and he became insecure which was appropriate.
I can't believe they're banking on the Gunnverse and not starting over with The Batman. Slowly introduce super science in the next one with Freeze or Ivy, Get a more gritty, grounded street level DCEU with a depowered Superman who can leap buildings and throw cars (still optimistic and colorful though) and start from there.
If Gunnverse Batman happens there will be three fricking seperate live action continuities of Batman at the same time. Four if Flash wasn't the last movie. Warner Bros really is made of morons
>not starting over with The Batman
Matt Reeves wants Batman to be stand-alone.
He wants Batman to be the only cape shitter. Reminder that they're making a Penguine show in that universe
It was 10 years and they couldn't have a Superman and a Batman that actually worked together. That should be the foundation for any DC universe and they couldn't achieve that. So fans just never got invested in their movies.
I think DC movies should buy into nostalgia instead of trying to keep up with the times.
Make movies about Batman/Superman in the 50s, old school superheroes in an old school setting.
Man I was sure bringing in Keaton Bats would at least ensure the film turned a profit but I’ve never been so happy to be wrong. Frick this movie, frick WB, and frick Zaslav.
It that were true the MCU wouldn't be a thing
What's next?
Anime
It was a fun movie. The CGI was so inconsistent across several scenes and looked like trash sometimes though
> Why is DC flopping so hard?
>why is DC flopping so hard
when has it not been? Have you missed the whole last 15 years?
>What's next?
Anime.
At this point i am convinced that Warner just want to "crash the plane with no survivors" or at least devalue itself until another company is encouraged to buy.
That is the only thing that explain why they hired James Gunn tbh
> Shazam, Aquaman and WW standalones outperformed BvS AND the Justice League.
Bruh Shazam didn't even earn 400 millions
>Hire the guy who made one of the most succesful trilogies in the last decade to devalue your IPs
I don't understand
>Why is DC flopping so hard?
You can't build a house on a mud puddle.
>What's next?
The Gunnverse, but it'd suck for them if the superhero fad was over by then.