Why is Snow White (1937) so fricked up

I just watched it again a week ago

I understand the importance of it, but I liked Bambi a lot more both in terms of animation and storytelling. It was my favourite of the 'classic' Disney movies. Cinderella was my favourite princess.

>story about men gaining maturity and establishing their place in the social hierarchy
Try not being filtered next time

Good thing I was talking about the classic movies, not the Renaissance ones.

The problem with Bambi is that it doesn't know if it wants to be a coming of age journey of an animal prince or a documentary about deer, so it fails at both. The former was done better in Lion King because it fully embraced the idea. It aimed for a setting that truly felt like a huge, prosperous kingdom, ignoring unrealistic things like why would the animals worship their own predators. Simba's journey feels more grandious, more significant. You could feel the weight of his crown and how important it was for him to defeat his usurper.

In contrast, Bambi's royalty feels slapped on. He's the prince of the kingdom of who the frick knows according to king literally who that shows up for like 2 seconds. His enemies are Man(tm) and some unnamed deer that he fights over some forgettable doe's pussy. I remember watching the movie and lowkey hoping for a scenery shot showing a modern day city somewhere nearby, just to show how insignificant Bambi's world was. I also hated how they spent such a large amount of time just playing as kids. We get it, innocent childhood. Lion King was quicker to the point and didn't wasted the viewer's theme with that kind of shit. It had a musical sequence to show Simba's innocent worldview and excitement about becoming king and that was all that it needed to get the message across.

Them there's the alternative. Something like a Merry Melodies short, the kind where the narrator describes real life events and funny shit happens. That would have been fine, too. A movie about the life of a deer becoming an adult and continuing the circle of life. Ditch the prince shit and the plot still works. The scene where they play can now function as animated wildlife footage. The horny scene also works better since it ties into the movie's focus of showing a part of an animal's life cycle. The shallow social commentary with the human hunter is also now more significant because the movie is more grounded. Etc. So much could have been done.

>His enemies are Man(tm) and some unnamed deer that he fights over some forgettable doe's pussy.
Ironically, I feel like you're missing the forest for the trees. The Hunter in Bambi isn't just some finger wagging at humanity, he's the embodiment of death itself. It's why the Hunter isn't given any sort of characteristics, and he leaves the story after the job is done. He's there to teach Bambi a cold, cruel lesson, that death is not fair, nor kind, nor rational. It's swift and sudden, and could happen to anyone.

And that's what makes Bambi's final fight so significant. He is more than aware that he's putting his own life at stake, he knows what failure would entail. Yet he fights anyway, pushing past the fear of death out of love, inadvertently living up to his father's legacy.

Same. I figured with Wish bombing, I might as well see the original Disney movie.

And did you enjoy it?

I did. Only part I didn't like was Snow White telling the story to the dwarves, and that's just personal preference for being sappy.

>Disney artists unionise
>art quality immediately backslides
Pottery

>We can't afford to do cool stuff now that we actually have to pay our workers
And that is why decades later the Japanese ate the market.

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Art takes passion. The instant you start demanding mandatory breaks and paid vacations, you have lost the passion and the art suffers accordingly.
Treating the employee-employer relationship as an adversarial one is wellpoisoning that ought to not be tolerated.
>b-but
Look into your heart, you know it to be true.

People aren't fricking slaves, you pathetic bootlocker. Companies abusing people's passion until they either work to death or that passion dies and they leave the industry is precisely why so many areas of modern entertainment are so dogshit. Just look at how many vidya companies are on life support because they drove away all the talent. Look at how the anime industry is on life support despite being so profitable. They have to outsource to fricking Twitter users because nobody wants to work on anime anymore.

Frick, Disney itself has been dealing with a notorious crunch problem since Frozen, and look where it's got them. Quit being a fricking homosexual and realize that passion only goes so far you goddamn nimrod.

The main reason budgets have ballooned is because of corporations throwing money everywhere to compensate for the talent drain. In companies with stable working conditions that keeps talent around that is never an issue.

>asking people to do their jobs is bootlicking
People like you are why society is so dysfunctional these days.

Grinding people to dust with unreasonable conditions is not "asking people to do their jobs" you disingenuous frick.

>Treating the employee-employer relationship as an adversarial one is wellpoisoning that ought to not be tolerated.
Frick off. I absolutely hate how much the employer and their cohorts control every damn aspect of any industry and then play themselves up like wimpering puppies with no control or influence over their meanie employees wanting better conditions. Pretending like the heads of any industry don't meet behind closed doors or give silent head nods in how to keep the status quo of their industries. With their endless asinine corporate rules that have no legal jurisdiction but will play themselves up on power trips over the most benign issues. And if any change needs to be made in any industry, it never comes. Its from a collect big middle finger from the employee to the employer or an eternally long time from the government for any change to be made.
>The instant you start demanding mandatory breaks and paid vacations, you have lost the passion and the art suffers accordingly.
Tell me you don't lick corpo boots or are just a paid corpo bot. Because either your a neet, a trust fund kid, or live off of their parents paycheck, or a corpo implant you sound like someone who's never had to truly work in any real job or industry.

It is not that simple and you even admit passion only goes so far. You need passionate people but you also need people to reel them in when it is unrealistic with a budget. Which is the actually problem. Budgets are ballooned so bad, which is what is killing games not crunch, and to keep margins they outsource and cut salaries. There was a golden median at some point and the only way we can return to it is to let the big companies burn down so things aren't so profit driven but also tell unions to frick off when they make it impossible for a new studio to start without dropping millions for just staff.

>Budgets are ballooned so bad, which is what is killing games not crunch, and to keep margins they outsource and cut salaries.
They've ballooned because they have useless middle management, overpaid upper management, too many departments, too big and/or pricey facilities to run their studios (aka huge frick all buildings), and have too much fat all around. They could easily trim the fat, find dedicated artists, allow those artists to imagine up a movie together without the executives and management sticking their finger into it. And then letting them cook it out. Instead, many of these studios are too big and bloated to begin with and should be gutting the non-essentials and going back to bare bones of their roots.

The postwar films definitely entered a slow decline, don't pretend they didn't.

The main reason budgets have ballooned is because of corporations throwing money everywhere to compensate for the talent drain. In companies with stable working conditions that keeps talent around that is never an issue.

[...]
Grinding people to dust with unreasonable conditions is not "asking people to do their jobs" you disingenuous frick.

>unreasonable conditions
"Oh no I have to do the same amount of work that animators in the 1930s did, how horrible! Walt is asking me to work the same hours he does, this is impossible!!"
Nobody was making them work at Disney. You can beat around the bush all you like, unionisation always is the harbinger of the death of an industry. Unionisation led to the Disney dark age, and the likes of UPA (a literal co-op for animators formed by disgruntled ex-Disney animators) directly led to the rise of the absolutely abhorrent cut rate animation of the 60s-80s.

They quit because they were being led astray by literal soviet agitators. Remember, in the 1930s 'communism' was not the taboo it would become in the 1950s, it is a well documented fact that every single union leader in 1930s Hollywood was on take from Moscow.

Walt's death 20 years after they unionized led to the "Dark Age," you fricking donkey

Things don't happen overnight, moron. Why do you think there was a steady decline in their animation quality through the 50s? Why do you think they moved to xeroxing in 1961?

Go back to burning twitter to the ground, Musk

Go back to starving on the collective farm, Zhangisnki

>Disney rules with an iron fist, greatest animation ever made
>animators unionise, decline in animation
It's not complex.

Cindy mogs.
>that's also a union film
Slow decline, not a light switch. Their best animation was either Pinocchio or Bambi.

Neither are you apparently.

Projection. You are a tool for societal disruption, what is referred to as a 'useful idiot'. Come the revolution, you will be the first to be lined up and shot. You will NOT be the leader, or the man holding the gun.
>Nb4 "temporarily embarrassed millionaire" deflection

It isn't, but whatever helps you sleep at night.

>most people
proofs?

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/
>nb4 "I don't like that source"

What the frick are you even talking about anymore you prolapsed bunghole

Simpleton

Except we're talking about socialism (unions), you strawmanning queer. Leave it to a dipshit socialist to argue in bad faith.

oh well let's just consult Mr. Rotten Tomatoes, then
>Pinocchio 74% audience score
>Lion King 93%
well now that can't be right, after all, most people agree the golden age is better than the Renaissance. Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong movies like a silly billy
>Sleeping Beauty 80%
>Aladdin 92%
oh wait, Sleeping Beauty is a union production and thus dogshit, how silly of me
>Snow White 78%
>The Little Mermaid 88%
well
shit
what about what is almost universally believed to be the single best movie of the entire golden age, surely the discerning "most people" of Rotten Tomatoes will at least rate that higher than any given Renaissance movie?
>Fantasia 83%
>Mulan 85%
SHIT
FRICK
"MOST PEOPLE" ARE LETTING ME DOWN

Cool. What was their ratings 5 years ago before the Great Purge?
Which Disney films were selected for national preservation first? Which ones are frequently included on the lists of greatest animation of all time?

See

Also
>ignoring critic scores because they rank the classic movies higher
Lol, didn't think I'd catch that, did you

Pinocchio specifically has one of the highest ratings on the entire site.

Also
>ignoring critic scores because they rank the classic movies higher
Lol, didn't think I'd catch that, did you

[...]
>critic scores
but you said "most people," not critics. You can't appeal to the masses then say "b-but critics" when it turns out the masses don't actually agree with you.

"Most people" as in 'critical reviewers', people more likely to judge objectively. Unless you'd like to argue Frozen mogs the entire Disney back catalogue simply because half the world's 7 year old girl population is in love with Elsa.

Im now convinced Walt's head really was preserved on his death and they just plugged it into the internet to shitpost forever.

Frozen actually ranks under most of the Renaissance films

See [...]
Pinocchio specifically has one of the highest ratings on the entire site.

>critic scores
but you said "most people," not critics. You can't appeal to the masses then say "b-but critics" when it turns out the masses don't actually agree with you.

Just like employees! Crush them like the vermin they are so they can be grateful for the opportunity!

>my original wording was not clear
>to the point that I said literally the opposite of what I actually meant
I dunno anon, seems like you just moved the goalposts after your original argument failed

I also suspect this because you tried three separate unrelated counterpoints before landing on "actually I meant critics all along"

Oh word did I just hallucinate you trying to deflect to
>actually most of the reviews got deleted (???)
>actually the older movies got preserved first
>actually top 10 clickbait articles

Cool. What was their ratings 5 years ago before the Great Purge?
Which Disney films were selected for national preservation first? Which ones are frequently included on the lists of greatest animation of all time?

and I'm seeing now it took you 5 whole minutes to come up with "actually I meant critics" which is frankly hilarious

ok Mister Big Important Man

What the frick are you even talking about anymore you prolapsed bunghole

>Disney rules with an iron fist, greatest animation ever made
>animators unionise, decline in animation
It's not complex.

it's gonna blow your mind to find out Disney was still unionized during the Renaissance

>most people
proofs?

Go back to burning twitter to the ground, Musk

>When your art style develops
Cal Arts was created by Disney by the way

Wasn't Walt someone who hated the UPA style? Although it was more because he thought that anyone who worked there probably was a commie. But the reason why Sleeping Beauty looks the way it does, it's also because of Walt, he wanted something that looked different compared to the previous princess films, and it never fully sat right with him that the art for the movies in the concepts was almost invisible in the final product (Look at how different both Mary Blair's and even David Hall's original concept for Alice in Wonderland looked like compared to the movie for instance), so he wanted to stick closer to Eywind Earle's art, especially because he liked the idea of a film that looked like medieval tapestry, much to the frustration of the animators because it wasn't easy to do.

What he really disliked were the Xerox works that have been made in his lifetime, he hated the pencil sketches, but at that point he was more concerned about Disneyland to force them to make a do-over and it was cheaper.

TL;DR: Walt wanted the movie to reflect more the concept art

He also made some terrible live actions movies, to be honest growing up with a lot of those C tier live actions in re-runs gave the impression Disney was never a company that did good movies, it was more like company that did mediocre ones with 1 or 2 good ones every decade.

bluth quote bums me out
if it was such a problem back then when he left disney, how much worse it must be now
I know people were really wanting a 2d disney film for their 100th anniversary but I wonder if they would even be able to put out a really good one emulatory of their classics, maybe the talent is just gone now

>They didn't just disappear after a few years.
This is the REAL concern right now, with more and more stuff being moved to digital media only, and to streaming services past that. Shit can just get deleted forever if the one streaming service carrying it decides they want a tax break and toss it in the garbage.

Can't say I remember when I first knew about SnowWhite but it was probably the movie.

>There are plenty of mothers that legit feel threatened by their own daughters.
It's rare, but there. I once read about this exact situation where a woman slowly tortured and murdered her daughters when each one started puberty out of pure jealousy of how pretty they were becoming while her own looks were fading. The last one survived by running away at 14.

Well, metaphorically, the disguise ironically represents her true nature, she was ugly on the inside, but now she's also ugly on the outside.
But in a more practical sense, her hag disguise is so different from her usual look that it's perfect for tricking Snow White.

That's why you'll never be the fairest in the land.

Could you imagine the Evil Queen needing to put on a disguise but being too vain to actually try and hide her own beauty? So she shows up to the dwarves house in the most paper thin guise you can imagine; like, she just put on a different dress and acts like she's now a disgusting, aged hag?
And Snow White goes along with it, of course, because she's too polite to point it out and her stepmother looks like she's having fun showing off her body.

Has there been an episode of your typical cynical comedy where the character of the week is the sweetest, most pure person with no "secretly evil" twist behind them and that drives the typical cast of awful people and pessimists to near insanity by how this person is an utter anomaly to how they view the world to be?
Cause I'd like to see that

Seinfeld? Sunny? That actually seems like the normal trope, because the perspective for the people who fund the operation identify more with the people acting shitty. For comedy's sake, of course.

Can you name any specific episodes please?

Fair enough

I like this characterization of the evil queen knowing she would have nothing to gain from "explicitly" showing disdaim from her air headed daughter-in-law until her growing jealousy was justified by the mirror
Makes her seem more cold and calculist than the other villains from old Disney. I also like that she becomes a complete different character after the potion, implying that she finally became 100% insane

I like the irony that the witch's disguise is a better reflection of what was inside rather than her original beauty. In a way she died clad in her true skin.

>I want her love, she has mine

https://i.imgur.com/idJNA0N.jpg

Why is Snow White (1937) so fricked up

this makes me think of this version
yes it's porn

>futa

It's still Futa trash

'sauce anon?

imagine being so moronic that you think image search actually works.

>anon posts an edited imagine where none of the results other than the one he's edited resemble the search in the slightest
Meanwhile if I go and do it it actually shows up with a 100% match in five seconds, a rare occurrence.
Both of you are moronic but at least the first homosexual wasn't a lying wienermonkey. Expecting reverse image search to work is usually an exercise in futility.

>futa
Patrician

I think you'd basically just get how the Maleficent movie turned out, wouldn't you?

>he doesn't want the story of Evil Queen mommy lovingly raising her pure-hearted innocent daughter while terrorizing the kingdom

I think you'd basically just get how the Maleficent movie turned out, wouldn't you?

Hopefully not as shitty.

Reminds me of this comic that only reached one arc that was basically "What if Voldemort kidnapped Harry Potter and raised him"
I haven't read it myself though, I just follow the writer's more recent work so I don't know if not-Voldemort actually did grow to love not-Harry as a son

>so I don't know if not-Voldemort actually did grow to love not-Harry as a son
We're lucky if that's how things went.

The closest I know is some isekai Korean webtoon.

>I’m Only a Stepmother, but My Daughter is Just so Cute!

It's okay. Does that webtoon thing where half the screen is empty fricking space instead of proper panels but it's not bad. If I have one complaint it's that I wish she did more evil queen shit while also being a doting mother, she's just kind of standard shoujo heroine for the most part.

>The queen and the mirror act like SnowWhite parents.
>Their concern is that Snow White is not evil enough
>sweetie I love you, but the mirror and I are concerned you are not evil enough

Thanks!

Why are you....
splitting hairs?

>Young in mid-20s range.
More like late teens, he definitely doesn't look in his 20s.
>in the book he was much older.
The book is a completely different story, we're talking about the Disney movie here.

>The prince was clearly in his 20s & it shows even in the movie.
Agree to disagree I guess, I don't think he looks that old, and the early outline seems to confirm my belief, since it says he's supposed to be 18.
>Not an argument. Disney based his version of the story from the book.
Okay? It still changed some things, it's not like it was an 100% accurate adaptation.

I probably actually know a few of these guys. Sad that Disney's entire 2d studio got axed when 3d became cheaper. And after this movie being their last gasp bookend, of all things.

>It's particularly amazing how much money there was to throw around on crazy stuff nobody had tried before.
There wasn't as much as you think; Snow White was so expensive that if it had flopped then Disney would have been sold for parts even with their massively successful shorts, Pinnochio nearly bankrupted Disney yet again, Fantasia didn't recoup its cost until 1970 and Bambi just about broke even. Literally the only financial success with a feature film that Disney had in the 40s was Dumbo and that was because it was by far the cheapest of the films they made.

The only reason The Three Caballeros exists is because Disney wanted to attract Latin American audiences to replace the European ones.

It's not, they are just references to the other disney movies, but not actual canon origin stories. And Amaya is suppose to be seen as a hero character, not an evil one, that is entirely fanon because she looks evil to anyone with two braincells left.

So is goodness

Modern bongs genetically are more closely related to ancient celts than to continental Germanics. The 'ango-saxons' were a ruling minority who intermingled with the locals and eventually got bred out of existence. their culture dominated, but their genetics got drowned out by the Celtic majority. The place with the highest percentage of Saxon DNA is the southeast, where it averages around 50%.
Modern English are a mutt race of Celt, Saxon, and Norman.

>Snow White and the Prince come back to find each of their kingdoms at war and multiple claimants vying for the thrones
sounds like another adventure

Oh frick the prince is death?

this can't have been an outrage thread, i liked those sketches

She absolutely is, but look at those cheeks.
I can fix her.

That's probably what the nice mr. king thought 🙁

yeah she is kinda cute