People complain about the tech in 0083 being way too advanced compared to what we see in Z, but the Orchis is just a big box filled with weapons. The most advanced thing about it is the I Field Generator and that was already present in the MAs we saw in 0079.
I remember the main complaint I think was that the stats of the MS in 0083 were higher, like the perfotmance stats of the GP01Fb was higher than the Zeta.
If the Zeta had two giant thrust pods it'd also go as fast, but the Zeta adopted a sleeker profile for atmospheric entry and flight rather than raw output. I mean, there's stuff in Zeta that had giant thrusters as well, the Gabthley and Messala come to mind.
Sure, probably. The Mark II didn't have amazing performance to begin with, it was on par with the best grunts of its day.
>Sure, probably. The Mark II didn't have amazing performance to begin with, it was on par with the best grunts of its day.
That's reductive. The best grunts were on par because they're basically all clones of the Mk-II with some dressing
The only grunt that is arguably a clone of the Mark II is that one Barzam variant. Other than that the GM III inherits a near-identical backpack and the Jegan only has very loose ties to the Mark II. There's a bunch of NZ and Fed grunts that have nothing to do with the Mark II.
Any non-transforming MS with a movable frame is a Mk-II clone. AE lifted it straight out of the Mk II
We don't even know if most grunts have a movable frame since details like that (along with magnetic coating, etc) are almost never mentioned, and the ones that we do know that have movables frames like the Nemo are not Mark II clones.
>AE lifted it straight out of the Mk II
Pfft. I guess you think every MS with a core block is a clone of the Guntank then.
The Nemo is just a mk ii clone ever since the MG retconned it to give a movable frame.
>Pfft. I guess you think every MS with a core block is a clone of the Guntank then.
No, but I think all core fighters are clones of each other. Movable frame is a whole ass, fully functional MS.
>like the perfotmance stats of the GP01Fb was higher than the Zeta.
Here's the thing and this is what people need to drill into their fricking skulls, the fricking specs they give mean shit for dick and are generally thought up by people after the fact, often times not even directly tied to the frickin project aside from like height maybe it's all pulled from various asses.
It's inconsistent though, that's the issue.
I know it's inconsistent and I'm saying it doesn't matter because the numbers mean jack shit, so don't let it bother you because it's meaningless fluff. Like yeah it's insofar a problem that whoever shitting the numbers out didn't do the due diligence but it's not a problem in any real way because it has zero actual bearing on the shows at all.
I think allot of them are shat out by bandai's side like
for the manuals, others for random obscure shit that didn't have a kit came from various magazines and technical books, allot of which aren't even official but people tout them anyways.
Who at Sunrise is responsible for shitting out these technical stats for their mobile suits? I assume it's just baseless numbers for nerds but is there any math involved in calculating any level of thruster output? Do they use real world aircraft as a reference?
It happens at Bandai.
I don't think there's ever been official mention of it even in databooks, but occasionally there does seem to be some workable math rather than always random numbers. Here's some reading on the matter if you want:
https://www.mechatalk.net/viewtopic.php?t=15854
its not that impossible. some supercars from 1990s can still keep up/outperform supercars of today.
I think that the GP series are like the Bugatti Veyrons, all that speed and power to reach the highest speeds. while newer supercars are all about balance of speed/acceleration/braking/handling
Can GP01/Fb beat MK-II?
People shit on 0083's tech levels but that's the thing I've been trying to tell people for years, it's all mostly OYW tech taken to its extremes and not a lot of new innovations. They don't like that the GP01Fb and GP03 outperform the Mark II, but what did they expect? They're all prototypes but the GP series had a massive budget and could be combat-deployed while the Mark II was meant just to test its new frame construction and the Titans wanted to save money and probably didn't intend it for combat since they didn't bother to give it the new armor tech that was just around the corner.
The only piece of tech in 0083 I take any issue with is the Neue Ziel. Its output is comparable to stuff from ten years later during CCA. It's stupid for the time period it's in. At least the Rebellion manga somewhat addressed it by adding in the La Vie En Rose chapter where the Axis Fleet had to take it there for servicing because their equipment both in the Advance Fleet and at Axis itself was far from able to fine tune it in a way to prevent it from overloading.
As for the GP03, it's so big and has so many thrusters on it you could justify it. It looks more like a small battleship. The way it moves is still fairly clunky and with its big boxes being mostly just missile storage, it's far lighter than it looks. So the Dendrobium's output is a lot more justifiable. The Neue Ziel is just a bit too cutting edge for late 0083. I think everyone's complaints towards it are entirely justified.
>I take any issue with is the Neue Ziel. Its output is comparable to stuff from ten years later during CCA.
It happens IRL too:
F-14 Tomcat: 1974
F-18 Super Hornet: 1999
The Tomcat is much superior than the Super Hornet.
It's happening right now with video cards too
Wait til you figure this out:
Z Gundam: 1986
0083: 1991
They weren't foreseeing the future of real-life jets.
I was under the impression the Super Hornets are preferred for their lower maintenance outlays relative to the Tomcats? Swing wings are expensive, especially when most fighters are just missile trucks nowadays.
Also the Super Hornet has an actually working Radar. Tomcat radars were so bad they could be allowed to launch without them working if they only had bombs under wing.
You'd be lucky if you had 2/10 available to go as they had that many issues.
The F-18 is better in every way except thrust and top speed. So its an apt comparison between the GP01FB and Zeta suits.
>Neue Ziel. Its output is comparable to stuff from ten years later
It's also enormous — even compared to the Orchis — and thus has the capacity for all those generators and weapons.
>At least the Rebellion manga somewhat addressed it
Don't even mention the Rebellion manga. That manga made things so much worse with their ridiculous upgrade they gave the Dendrobium. And changing the story from Gato beating Kou in the anime..... to Kou beating Gato in the final. Then Kou giving Gato a lecture! Utter nonsense.
>That manga made things so much worse with their ridiculous upgrade they gave the Dendrobium.
That particular mode comes from the old Fix Figuration action figure designed by Katoki and released back in 2007.
Not that anon but how does that suit even work? It's too small to Power all those systems
Anon, you reached the level of autism that shouldn't even possible...
It's actually one of the flaws of that mode that it cannot power everything simultaneously, so Kou has to have great timing in terms of balancing the suit's prototype thrusters and protective I-field with the available power he has.
She said the output from the gundam is not big enough to operate everything, not " It has small size so it might drain battery fast ". It like when you build a PC and the PSU doesn't have enough output to active every other components. Electricity is not the problem, the problem is the PSU is weak.
Also, this is a scifi giant robot we are talking about here, so who gives a frick? Because it looks cool, that's the answer.
I don't really see why you're concerned about the size.
never mentioned size.
Sorry but no. This is just too out of place. Technology had not miniaturized enough in 0083. The best they could do was the Dendrobium and Neue Ziel for I-field generators. That Gundam looks like a parody and is wildly unbalanced. Very stupid given what we know.
Was I the only one that thought that suit wasn't real?
I thought it was something Bandai made up because they didn't want to make a full Dendrobium action figure because it would be too expensive.
So they had this concept so collectors could still show off the Stamen Gundam.
I would have liked this more.
aw frick that looks cool
Imagine a backpack like this, but it's not just compatible with an MS, but is also compatible with a transforming MS jet mode that's not just a smaller Core Fighter
I think they didn't want to make the full figure twice. The MSiA was a little undersized compared to the HGUC.
It's because GP03 was Katoki's way of making Deep Striker a real animated Gundam.
How the frick did the Neue Ziel have an I-Field and the A-Azieru didnt??
Makes no sense and nothing can justify such a frickup.
Because the writing with 0083 is sloppy.
Neo Zeon is full of morons, they chose to not give the azieru an I-field
>How the frick did the Neue Ziel have an I-Field and the A-Azieru didnt??
Neue Ziel was a free gift from Neo Zeon to Delaz. It took months to build, and Admiral Delaz didn't need to pay for it. Alpha Azieru was built out of Char's own budget. While Char's Neo Zeon wasn't poor, they were not as rich as Haman's Neo Zeon. I-fields are crazy expensive and very maintenance heavy. That probably played a big factor. Char also had to build his suits in secret.
Char opted to have Alpha Azieru be focused on firepower, speed, and funnel spam. Most grunts had missiles installed anyway by the time of 0093.
Char ended up being right since the thing that destroyed Alpha Azieru was a missile to the wienerpit, and not a beam. An I-Field would have been a waste anyway
Char was on a budget. He couldn't buy Axis with gold, build a new ship fleet, mass produce Gears Dogas, make the Sazabi, AND give Alpha Azieru an I-field. Too much.
0083 was influenced by ZZ and CCA more than Zeta. The NA release order just caused a lot of confusion
Seems almost quaint after Thunderbolt.
Thunderbolt has the excuse of being an AU so it's tech inconsistencies don't matter.
There is such a thing where the old tech is better than the new
Oh my god it's/vr/
>Make bleeding-edge tech that doesn't actually do anything wrong
>Zeon drop a fricking colony
>Defeat the Zeon using said technology
>Titans come in and somehow don't salvage all the data with the intention of steamrolling Zeon remnants
Why
Does Gundam actually even have a "canon"?
There's the OG shows, then there's the movies, then there's the novelisations, then there's stuff like Char's Deleted Affair/Zeta Define, and now Thunderbolt takes a big stinking shit on anything that tries to reconcile these sorts of issues...is it just whatever you want or what