Sonic

Chao are actually regressed aliens who became moronic infants from using the Chaos Emeralds that they found on Mobius and were hunted to near-extinction by the embodiment of heat death of the universe.

Do you not understand what "retcon" means or something?

Yeah and also they used to wear these charm accessories which are what the koco are, and those charms for no real reason at all have their owners' memories imprinted on them and think that they are the people who owned them. The story takes itself super seriously yet makes peak moron decisions like that.

As long as whisper suffers it's ok

>Nusally the sheep
Who?

Dreamworks bought out Sega years ago, the evidence is CLEAR!!!

She’s a background character that the writer likes

Lanolin doesn’t even feel like Sally. She feels like a watered down version of Geoffrey St John. I say watered down because she hasn’t assaulted minors.

There's still time.

Who should I blame? Ian or some Japanese guy?

Most likely Sonic Team, but Ian is to blame for every other sentence being a reference to something.

You'd think Ian would learn after making Charmy moronic. He keeps doing weird shit like this and the incest undertones with Ice Man and Reboot Nicole.

Yeah, that's what I'm getting at. He makes weird lore calls that just complicate shit. Rock, Roll and Blues are siblings, but the MM1 bots aren't, but the MM2/3 bots are? It's a mess. Either don't engage or pick a lane. Same deal with writing Reboot Nicole as "gaining sentience from copying Sally" and growing up alongside her, only to turn around and say they're a couple.

The dude is terrible at reading social cues when things aren't literal.

Wow, you think?
Evan's confirmed on the spectrum and she's better at this stuff than he is. The problem is getting good, socially capable writers on a low paying gig with an obnoxious fan base.

Emeralds came from space and like anon said, chao are mutated devolved Chaos beings that were a super advanced alien race. It was basically just lore for the sake of lore and not because it added anything meaningful to the overall worldbuilding. At least the Titans and End were cool.

Pontac and Graff who wrote/localized every game main game from Colors to TSR. They turned everything into a joke.

You're moronic

Terrible.

In the original, Vanilla facial expression were too lewd to show instead of an innocent charming mom. so I kinda can understand why they're changed that even tho I like the original way better imo.

I mean, coming back down to the reality of matters, she doesn't have a sex drive not because she's a mom, but because it's a children's comic. But that simple fact is making them redraw panels just because her eyes (from a POV of someone who might be LOOKING for it) were a bit too sultry, and that just kind of fricking sucks.

They redrew it because her face was sarcastic and snarky, not because it’s sultry you desperate projecting virgins. Vanilla’s thing is being the sweet kind mom, having her do the sassy dreamworks eyebrow doesn’t fit that

Black person it’s THE dreamworks smile. Complete with the lidded eyes, crooked eyebrows and looking at the viewer while you say something to the viewer.

You have such a tiny dyfunctile dick that it forces you to desperately project porn onto the most censored sterilesanitised children’s media imaginable because you can’t get off to anything you didn’t consoom as a 4 year old

It’s the same moron. I described every way it’s the same, crooked euebrow, lidded eyes, looking at viewer from the side. It’s the same thing Superman did at the end of every silver age comic when he waggled his eyebrow at the viewer.
you’re incapable of describing any way it’s different other than you can’t accept you’re desperately trying to brainwash yourself into jacking it to pozzed bland sterile nothing

Please tell me you are trolling

>Zoomer learned a new word and starts using it without understanding the actual meaning

She’s talking with an open mouth because she’s saying something to the viewer, again, exavtly what Superman always did. It’s a famous cliche to look at the viewer and sarcastically comment on the situation
I’m glad you made it clear now you have literally no counterargument to what I just proved other than pathetic cope. It’s sad seeing sonic manbabies like yourselves too stupid and immature to self-reflect

>Dreamworks smile
>Exactly what Superman always did
Bit your own tail. It's almost like it's a perfectly normal expression used throughout mankind's history with multiple variations.
Imagine spending your Christmas ranting about a face living in your head.
>I-I'm not mad, you're the mad ones!
Go drink some eggnog and relax

>The more buzzwords I used the more right I'll be!

Are those required? OOPS! Vanilla wasn't looking at the viewer! Debunked your own claim just like that.

See:

They did the same with Vanilla's original facial expression before they changed to the official one.

It's even more obvious when her eyes are wide.
She is blatantly looking forward. Either at Vector or someone next to him. Dreamworks claim... deboonked.

That or maybe your entire argument just wasn't very good, and you're kind of sad, raging in a thread because multiple people contested your claim.

All I hear is REEEEEEEEE

Please tell me you are trolling

I can't believe they've been doing the Dreamworks face since ye olden days, is this evidence of an ancient hierarchy?

>This piece I asked for in the original thread about it

God bless the drawanon that did that.

[...]
In the original, Vanilla facial expression were too lewd to show instead of an innocent charming mom. so I kinda can understand why they're changed that even tho I like the original way better imo.

Wait but in the scans version they use that one

I mean, coming back down to the reality of matters, she doesn't have a sex drive not because she's a mom, but because it's a children's comic. But that simple fact is making them redraw panels just because her eyes (from a POV of someone who might be LOOKING for it) were a bit too sultry, and that just kind of fricking sucks.

Anon... Rouge, at introduction, had jiggle physics and a textured labia. Who is really to blame for horny fans here?

You can make out something on her spandex.

>she's been forever branded as the wholesome and pure mom with no sexual desires
Have you seen the way ABT draws her?

Nah mate you’re also an autismo moron for getting so butthurt from a “shitposter” you post essays in denial that it’s a dreamworks smile

Aaaaand suddenly I am thinking about Judy Hopps...Well, I guess being ready to go at all times means the urge isn't as insane as being in heat.

Nah. Makes him look like a b***h. Some people cope differently.

I feel like there has to be a middle ground between "acts like a gigantic pussy" and "sarcastic, unfeeling sociopath."

>Sobbing like a b***h = "any negative emotion."
Remember to take your estrogen pills.

>Silver is a rookie
This motherfricker fought in the apocalypse and even almost took down Sonic. Twice!
Silver’s uwu persona in the comics has done irrefutable damage to him

>Silver is a rookie.
Silver was a commander and fighter in the resistance for six months. He founded both the resistance with Knuckles and the restoration with Amy. He fought through a hellscape apocalypse in the bad future and defeated his own Eggman in the good future. Who the frick is Lanolin to talk down to him?

He's a rookie compared to Lanolin who is more disciplined and a natural leader. Fighting longer than someone else doesn't automatically make you more experienced than them.

Not post-06 Silver

>Silver is a rookie
This motherfricker fought in the apocalypse and even almost took down Sonic. Twice!
Silver’s uwu persona in the comics has done irrefutable damage to him

Yeah really this pissed me off even though we joke about Silver, He's still a badass and one of the top tiers in their world bro literally saved the world multiple times. Lanolin was a pencil pusher who was scared of everything in her early cameos, joined the resistance after the war.

She literally has the least amount of time and experience even if we assume the forces story line was Silvers only canon battle experience. Lanolin calling rank on him and whisper just pissed fans off.

I remember talking with some friends about how silver would destroy the diamond cutters in less than 10 secs. The only one with a remote chance is whisper and she'd still get wrecked

>It's how they frame it. Lanolin's proper intro is fricking terrible and fails to convey any of the necessary info for what they're trying to do with her.
Agreed with all this.

I'm not gonna rewrite my thesis from over here
[...]
but I'll say these characters already being what they are isn't the problem. It's that the writers don't take the necessary steps to justify and work off of these things. A lot of stuff "just is" in a way that makes readers unconvinced while a bunch of stuff you take for granted is over-explained.

Example: israeliteel is the leader of the Restoration because she's good at management. We only know this because characters say so and she has a museum. In the years since she took over the restoration, we've seen her role factor into a story, scene or even gag exactly 0 times. She's just kinda there. They felt the need to answer "who runs the restoration," but never felt the need to show that character do anything.

>It's that the writers don't take the necessary steps to justify and work off of these things.
That's probably what I meant, I felt I wasn't conveying my idea properly as I was writing it. Yeah, the IDW characters are like if all we knew about Tails as his introduction was him telling Sonic that he's so smart he made a television out of popsicle sticks or whatever that line in Colors was.

You get more info on them in the manuals. Tails’ backstory was in the Sonic 2 manual. Thing is, localization tend to change them to match up with whatever the US cartoons of the UK comic were doing with the setting. So you’d only get the real story for the first time in the flashback from Adventure. Even then, it’s just Tails following him and doesn’t mention him getting bullied. You’d see THAT in X.

Lol, yeah really that's pretty telling of either Ian is lying or isn't trusted and Danny just is better at editing his own work or they know he can do his own stuff. I'm starting to believe the mandates aren't that bad it's just they want to do some of the stuff the mandates say they can't. They pull a rebecca sugar and just toss stuff to them knowing it's against the rules then are surprised when they have to rush to fix it and make the plot incoherent.

Also you are exactly right we meme on silver and we've accepted silver's failings before but in this arc it was just so over the top. It's also just feels like another example of some writers just hating silver he's like the marcy wu of sonic. Really though they did the typical writing choice of humilating characters to make their oc look better but in the end it made her look more like a c**t. I agree that really potential exist not much though because god she's boring and just a thinly veiled oc for ABT to coom too. Even her plot really is unnecessary she's leader of a team of mid fighters and basically a replacement of soldier knuckles/amy as the leads of the resistance.

It feels like they’re trying to rewrite Silver into a “newbie hero with a lot of potential but looks up to others!” And that’s…not really him at all
Like yeah he can be naive but the boy straight up is insanely powerful and can take out pretty much any threat that comes his way
Heck Ian had to make Silver get knocked out by bombs in the Metal Virus arc so he’d be out of commission for half of it and not just immediately solve most of its problems

Yep really goes to show how slept on our boy is, really I get the jokes and hate from some but silver deserves better. I meme on him to but he's definitely not the worst sonic character and really could and has lended himself to some of the best sonic plot points and dynamics.

Weird they act as if he's a kid when he should be older or at least way more harden than lanolin who literally joined the resistance after the war after the first issue actually. She is a bigger rookie than even silver is.

The writers are leaning into his tendency to shoot first, ask questions later. They're just doing it wrong.

Yeah see this would work way better, he has a time limit and one mistake cost the world. It'd be a interesting way of portraying him other than naive and childish..

I meant it more in how she still got to talk down to silver and another oc when this is like her 5th offical issue she was in. It's a bit ridiculous but yeah it's more of just the jumping to the scene and weirdness surrounding it. also had that typical cringe ness of old edge sonic fan comics. Go from jokey ton to serious fights/argument and melodrama.

Got in for popularity he says I keked so hard, not even a diss at you bro but come on she was forced into every background scene. That's ABT being one of the lead artist not fan love, it's like when companies for a meme. He made a oc posted her everywhere tumblr, here twitter deviantart etc. He then gives her tons of fanart and cameos and lil stories of course people will say ok who is that girl. My friend thought that one panel of her getting zoom focused over the main cast during belle's intro arc was her being set up as a mole.

Silver is just that guy from 30 rock where he's white knuckling it through his depression and trauma. That'd be a fun silver arc but as you said he's just now a softboi, literally made for girls to jill too and think of him as a seme or femdommed. Someone said it in the actual issue where he gets kicked out,they might as well pull a charmy just age him down younger than the others.

>These writers confuse being dicks or constantly sad with character development and arcs.
Too true, that seems to be a modern writing thing in general.
>Genuine Plank of wood
Kek
>kidding
I wouldn't kid about it. Look at Nine from Prime, he's more fun and interesting than actual Tails in my opinion. He went from wanting nothing to do with Sonic to going full yandere for him on top of not being afraid to get shit done no matter who gets stepped on for the most part, which is more agency than Tails often shows. All the canon characters were "OCs" at one point and while they are timelessly charming as well as backed by nostalgia, there's no reason new characters couldn't potentially appeal to people more than them. Archie reboot was just the right amount of games influence mixed in with everything else Sonic related and balanced drab melodrama with fun adventure more masterfully than IDW has, lot of people still liked its OCs and versions of existing characters more than the 'canon' ones.

Yeah it's weird how suddenly current year writers on mass forgot how to writer characters just strawmen and the so cool but tragic mc

True we all complain about edge but sometimes edge beats out the moralhomosexualry and bland same old same old. I feel nine is representational of all the villian tails and harden tails fan comics and art. Most people want tails to be less of a inconsistent sidekick. So they love nines snark and confidence and being able to solo. It's always good to have a character be able to do things on their own and break away from the norm a bit at times. I think the OCs could be great it's why I said whisper has potential if they got her away from tangle

I now want to see your stuff anon, also eh we all are also theirs a way to do it and make it work. Like things like the early Mcu and devil may cry, but most cases the best bet is not to have them be right after the other or jokes not at the expense of the characters.

I mean tons of great designs in the comic actually like all the ref designs and just fawned over background characters. I will accept it but I won't let us forget it was nepotism less we let ABT really believe his cope that people actually like her more than as coombait and forced hype.

So she's just autistic moronic lol, but yeah happy to hear that but yeah probably again just like what he did he pushed her as focal as he could so people would say hey who's that. I remember thinking early on oh is she a sonic character I forgot about?

That is true, most writers now are silver spoon kids and people that got in because of nepotism or having the right opinions and kissed the right asses. It's also just people hiring the cheapest person as well so many people just get grabbed off twitter or tumblr with like no lead writer or artist experience it's weird.

Yeah I feel it effects whisper more than tangle tangle is just a random autist but whisper actually has a backstory and skills that make her feel unique compared to the rest of the cast. Then tangle is just a lol random sonic simp/wannabe. Really as you said they probably were just paired as the ocs or were made to be gay together but it's sad because tangle is such a non character and at least whisper has something no one else has being a sharpshooter and using wispons in multiclassing in it. And of course the war and backstory but they basically through that out for just her being tangle's crying lesbian gf.

Ha make them just like the game characters but they cry and have weird boring gay moments, this will make people love them for sure kek. I feel it's more the lack of ability

Well keep at it anon, it's just a matter of time and practice.

Heh true, oh the dream of at least 3 good not even peak sonic games in a row. Really though yeah I get it still dislike her and she's still mostly fapbait but I understand why people were interested but seems most people hate her now.

I haven't but sounds interesting also where does all this lanolin lore even come from? I hate ocs for this exact reason, "oh they are so much deeper than you think just wait guys I swear". But yeah if it's true hopefully they find a way to mix it into her actual character so she isn't just a bag of crap with double Ds.

I can accept that I just hate this oc business mostly because they all suck except the guys actually lol, they are all weirdly multifaceted and actually strong.

Oh you have no idea my bro bought me spider man 2 I'm playing it now because I have it and god It's so lame. Like the only good part is the gameplay and even that isn't that great. But yeah games have been so mid and bad, I wanted a ps5 forever once I had the money to get it I said hell no then someone got me one like a year or 2 ago hadn't even started it up til spider man 2 that's how little I was interested in most AAA games. Really I've just been focusing on my art which is actually good I guess but I miss having a lot media I could enjoy wholeheartedly.

Yep but sadly whisper is just another jobber now, she really just exist to cry and shoot a couple rounds. It sucks as you said she had that whole non powered thing going for her and she had silver hype for being a goat in the war but nope. Whisper the Wolf a assassin who kills and goes all out and can solo missions who's that this is Mumbles the b***h who cries all day long lol.

I'd like to believe it as well but I'm so tired of hoping because it just keeps getting worse anon.

No problem bro we all need support and know we can do it with time

Usually it is trying to force a meme or fad makes it cringe or kills it. Like how people tend to fall for side characters the moment the writers try to react to it they ruin it. Like neo and penny from rwby they brought them back just to slowly ruin and kill them.

Hmm interesting, I'll check it out still doesn't count because no canon it must be canon for me to not hate the canon version.

I mean after a certain point if you don't stop then you are either dumb or obsessive like me and whisper. I think she has potential but I know she's ass and deserves the title of crying lesbian and the memes. A fool can't see things for what they are it's why modern stuff sucks people keep being forgiving and refusing to be more brutally honest or at least honest. Which allows writing and art and over all ethics to get worse in things like you were saying about AAA stuff.

Ha thanks bro, I'm gonna be posting some stuff in the cotc thread and hilda thread probably later today or tommorow. Also yeah reall one must fix media industry by becoming the media industry. But most are trying that with indie animations and games and comics. It's slowly healing bro.

Yep she had her chance now she's a fraud and can stay in obscurity with the rest of the dkyemond cutters.

Yeah same, really I tend to try just about all media give it a shot unless it's a huge cost investment *ie video games* . But yeah I'll catch a show try a comic, but as you said hope I don't give that away for free anymore. I can't get hurt when something goes bad or is completely ass.

Thanks

>I don't know why Ian and Evan struggle so much with writing cartoon adventures.
Even when you guys get them like the Winter Jam issue, it's quickly forgotten for complaining about the Diamond Cutters for the 1,000th time.

The Shadonic shipping will never ve forgotten

>Winter Jam wasn't written by Ian or Evan
Not relevant to my point.

It feels like they’re trying to rewrite Silver into a “newbie hero with a lot of potential but looks up to others!” And that’s…not really him at all
Like yeah he can be naive but the boy straight up is insanely powerful and can take out pretty much any threat that comes his way
Heck Ian had to make Silver get knocked out by bombs in the Metal Virus arc so he’d be out of commission for half of it and not just immediately solve most of its problems

>Silver is a rookie
This motherfricker fought in the apocalypse and even almost took down Sonic. Twice!
Silver’s uwu persona in the comics has done irrefutable damage to him

Silver is pure shit, period.

>spouting shit like "I'm the coolest!"
That’s from the localization. In the original, he says “Interesting” due to Sonic managing to get one over him.

ShTH is significantly less edgy in the Japanese version.

I’d hardly call colony dropping a giant space station in the shape of Eggman’s face on to the Earth edgy. SA2 is a goofy action movie to me. But that’s just me, these days anything darker than literal toddler shows are called edgy.
He was brainwashed into thinking his sister’s dying last wish was to kill humanity. Even if you think trying to drop the colony is dark Gerald is the actual edgy one.

Maria is shot off-screen and there’s no blood. If Batman isn’t considered edgy neither should Shadow.

He’s not considered edgy. His parents being killed by criminals has always been a core part of his backstory yet there are multiple toys, coloringbooks, and really kiddy tv shows based on him.

Batman was always the edgiest big-name super. They used to draw him with fangs and claws and a hunchback in the 90s because of that reputation. They did Infinite Crisis, Dark Knight Returns, Serious House and New 52 because of that reputation.
The reason he mellowed out in certain decades including the 2020s was because of his no-kill rule, so unlike Punisher (who also has coloring books and tv shows) he can cross over the line whenever it’s trendy to be le wholesome and reddit like it is now

Looks like a sloth to me. But I don't know if it's a reference or anything.

I didn't watch Sonic X, but I highly doubt we get any peeks at a timeskip, considering Sonic is not allowed to be anything but 16 years old.

Easy to say when no one is threatening you.

>gives the target victim points
Probably because you made them a victim?

Get with the times young blood, being a victim on the internet only makes you stronger. There's a reason people fake that shit.

You literally said his personality was Asian due to those traits.

This is what you said.
>His personality is pretty asian, all in all. He's ascetic and lives in modest conditions, has a strong sense of pride, has a set goal he will go to autistic heights to achieve, and he has autism, if that wasn't clear.

>Jewel’s creator
Is Ian, not Jennifer. She just did the design, the character herself was made by Ian.

Yeah well, that's not the case here. The writers conceptualize the characters and the artist makes the designs and it is tweaked and modified by editorial and Sega. They do not determine the character's personality, history, or role in the story. The only time an artist was more responsible for a character over the writer (when the writer and artist wasn't the same person) was Lanolin and that's because ABT created her wholesale in the background before she became an official character.

Theres an issue with Lanolin's personality?

>she's got a plastic smile and shows her faking being pleasant
Are you sure that's what a single image of her smiling with the caption "plastic smile" means or did you just see that part and make up the rest in your head? Because nowhere in her time as a background character did she seem to act like a "passive aggressive b***h."

K so I was right, thanks.

>or did you just see that part and make up the rest in your head
https://twitter.com/AdamBryceThomas/status/1650720954241421312
Nice try, though.

>Sega
>Caring about Lanolin
It's just Ian and Evan's character.

ABT

Yes

As he refused to fight her and still had a messed up leg. Before he literally made her run scared and basically was dogging her stuff easily even with him not wanting to hurt surge anymore

What's gonna happen, Sonic?
You've forgiven every single person who has done something villainous?
You gonna give 'em a slap on the wrist, huh?
Maybe give 'em a long-winded and egocentric speech? I know you love those.
All you did with the Zeti was send them back home.
You've never even thrown a punch at Eggman.
So what's gonna happen? Tell us.

I feel they are setting up a sonic breaking point arc, but knowing how bad Evan is it'll get fricked up some how. Or worse they don't even realize they are building it up for sonic to basically go full punisher on his villians.

I don't want a edgy sonic even though I do love the schizonic memes and jokes especially back when we first realized surge was a jobber so he'd bully and ryona her. But in the end of the day I still want sonic to be sonic and have a bit of a ego and free spirit vibe but also know when to put these frickers down I mean shit at least put them in jail. Like most people that were in prison weren't even put in there by sonic.

Archie had it's flaws but at least sonic wasn't such a puss, I really hope they are setting up a sonic moral break arc and he just realizes "damn I've got to kill these guys or at least incapacitate them". The funny thing is at first most of us didn't realize how bad it was we thought the tinker thing was a fluke or just a unique situation but the writers refuse to have sonic do anything remotely smart or interesting with his villians just forgiving and forgiving.

>they are building it up for sonic to basically go full punisher on his villians.
What are you talking about you moron

>they have been sprinkling potential development
If you've been paying attention that's all they really do since the characters aren't allowed to develop almost at all, Sonic isn't going to go through any kind of arc. He shouldn't even have had one set up like this, calling serious attention to Sonic letting bad people go the way the comic has was a massive mistake considering he's only going to keep doing it not so much because it makes narrative sense but because that's the nature of a franchise built to last forever with the characters never aging or dying for the most part. It makes some sense in something like Archie where the world had more depth and things were allowed to change but this introspective and melodramatic aspect of the comic doesn't suit most Sonic characters if they're their games selves.

In my opinion they should have started things out like their classic comics: a lot of game characters show up, they do some fun episodic shit, the tone is generally lighthearted, and the zones are colorful and interesting. They almost sort of did that in the beginning, but in a way where it felt like Forces never ended so they're still fighting a war and after that the characters form a Justice League to become the world's janitors, from then on it only occasionally feels adventurous which is a problem if it's a Sonic comic. Arcs either feel rushed or too stretched out with almost no in-between and sometimes there's too much focus on worldbuilding for a purposefully neutered setting rather than just playing to the restrictions' strengths and focusing more on character interactions. People have been saying Sonic expositing Blaze and Silver's relationship feels too forced and it probably does because it was told to us like that rather than shown through more interactions between those two. The comic has its moments but overall it feels like it's often trying to be something it's not, or rather something Sega won't ever let it be, rather than work more within its means to be good at things it actually can be. Of course it's also my and every other complainer's fault for continuing to read it just because it's a Sonic comic that isn't too terribly bad, so there is that.

meant to add this, it represents my eternal struggle as a modern fan of most series kek.

Yeah hopefully they get better but in reality they seem to keep getting worse also with lanolin being ABT oc and waifu she'll be more and more prominent and commanding. Really I don't even know how to make her work in the series as she's just another soldier and really just ABT fapbait like why should we care? Her most memorable scene was her hating on silver which got most sonic fans to immediately hate her.

See the potential thing is why I like whisper she arrived and had tons of potential compared to the other ocs. Sadly like most lesbians the moment it was decided she was gay all her character slipped away she now exist to be tangles gf (bff) and tangle is just the embodiment of sonic random autismo. It's sad really she wasn't going to be some epic character but I thought whisper had that something no other oc had. I'm ok with israeliteels but yeah she's more interesting in the side comics the author makes because she's just a lame gay lesbian bug.

Yep ABT is great at art if only he wasn't a sonic/furry coomer.

Ha and funny enough my bro hyped metal virus up so hard I had to start reading IDW. originally I was like no Archie and universe are the only canon sonic comics to me. Really I think metal virus is ok, best if like me you read it in one go like modern writers are too into manga but forget their is less down time with manga. No one wants to wait a month for mid or boring shit, its why comics used to be so edgy and controversial with all their deaths and cliffhangers they needed you to not be able to wait for next month's issue.

I'm not gonna rewrite my thesis from over here

The problem isn't that Silver is subordinate to Lanolin. It's how they frame it. Lanolin's proper intro is fricking terrible and fails to convey any of the necessary info for what they're trying to do with her. It doesn't explain that she's a ridiculous workaholic, it only passively suggests she's much more proactive than others, it does a poor job conveying that she's juggling being high strung/stressed and keeping it together, it doesn't convey that she's constantly tired very well, it doesn't do a good job conveying that she's an authority on tactics and planning.

If her intro conveyed even some of this well or if the arc where Silver joins the Diamond Cutters did a good job showing that despite being newer to this, Lanolin has a lot to teach Silver about teamwork and logical thinking, nobody would care. We KNOW Silver is hasty and rash. If the comic properly framed this as "I want to make a difference and I need to learn how to keep a cool head," it would actually be interesting.

IDW's problems are a cascade of execution slipups like this that Archie tended to catch before publication. IDW's editors are asleep at the wheel and Ian and Evan don't know how to edit their own work in a timely fashion. Best example of this is Ian chalking problems up to constant Sega requests while Danny says he didn't get a single note on Scrapnik.

but I'll say these characters already being what they are isn't the problem. It's that the writers don't take the necessary steps to justify and work off of these things. A lot of stuff "just is" in a way that makes readers unconvinced while a bunch of stuff you take for granted is over-explained.

Example: israeliteel is the leader of the Restoration because she's good at management. We only know this because characters say so and she has a museum. In the years since she took over the restoration, we've seen her role factor into a story, scene or even gag exactly 0 times. She's just kinda there. They felt the need to answer "who runs the restoration," but never felt the need to show that character do anything.

>These writers confuse being dicks or constantly sad with character development and arcs.
Too true, that seems to be a modern writing thing in general.
>Genuine Plank of wood
Kek
>kidding
I wouldn't kid about it. Look at Nine from Prime, he's more fun and interesting than actual Tails in my opinion. He went from wanting nothing to do with Sonic to going full yandere for him on top of not being afraid to get shit done no matter who gets stepped on for the most part, which is more agency than Tails often shows. All the canon characters were "OCs" at one point and while they are timelessly charming as well as backed by nostalgia, there's no reason new characters couldn't potentially appeal to people more than them. Archie reboot was just the right amount of games influence mixed in with everything else Sonic related and balanced drab melodrama with fun adventure more masterfully than IDW has, lot of people still liked its OCs and versions of existing characters more than the 'canon' ones.

And they only struggle with that in this book. Ian did fine with Sonic X and Boom

I'd say the stuff I'd point at is Scrapnik, a couple of the stories from the annuals, and (as much as "muh power levels" readers hate it) most of Evan's Surge arc. The Chao race story got bogged down in trying to do too many things, even if I agree it was one of the better stories. I'd even say Camping wasn't BAD, just way too long and full of loose plot threads.

You're on the money. The writers need to focus on telling a good batch of fun stories to establish ideas before they work on seeding things in so heavily and a lot of the fanbase really needs to understand Sonic isn't a story with an ending. Maybe get Ian up to speed on that too, since he keeps wasting time explaining how things are happening.

Most anime filler sucks, but sometimes it works. Loose, episodic adaptations are a better analogy, I think.

That is a better analogy, I was just thinking of filler I actually like rather than filler as a whole.

That's actually a good criticism of how Colors handled character writing in general.

Thing is, most characters in Sonic are introduced with no justification, but usually the story is crafted in a way that makes it feel natural. We never got some big intro to Tails. He popped up on the title screen and started tagging along behind Sonic, and then we see him fly a plane. We don't get a backstory dump on Knuckles: he suckerpunches Sonic, he keeps setting up traps, he realizes he was duped, he helps you. Amy hugs Sonic, gets kidnapped, is saved.

These guys were re-introduced in a game originally designed as an RPG and all they got were VERY basic intros that tell the player just enough to go "Okay, yeah!"

The solution for a simple character's believability is never "write more words," it's "frame them better." Readers are primed to accept the author's word. If they aren't believing basic premises, you're conveying info incorrectly.

>If they aren't believing basic premises, you're conveying info incorrectly.
Basically. I was about to argue maybe it can't be done in IDW because the plot is more complex, but remembering some suggestions for Lanolin it actually could have been conveyed more simply and effectively. In fact it really doesn't take much to introduce a character even in a more complex story, in Xenogears the main character randomly runs into a woman in military dress who holds him at gunpoint and speaks a weird foreign language, alright so where is she from and why is she here? Makes the player want to know more. Later on the protag gets sent to prison and has to fight all the top prisoners but loses to their brute of a champion. Not the most lore-implicit introduction but he makes an impactful introduction. Like you said all it takes is a hook to make the reader want to keep tuning in, but all that exposition fast forwards having to get to know the character more over time and makes it feel like the writer isn't very confident in their characters or just doesn't care too much and wants to move onto something else.

Yeah as usual it's an ok idea presented with half baked execution. IDW desperately needs more of a vision behind its overarching storytelling because honestly just about everything in the comic feels forced in some way.

I think the guy who keeps cuddling problems because he doesn't listen asking for help on listening and going "You know what? I didn't listen. My bad." is pretty reasonable to anyone who doesn't have a massive chip on their shoulder.

>I don't know why Ian and Evan struggle so much with writing cartoon adventures.
Even when you guys get them like the Winter Jam issue, it's quickly forgotten for complaining about the Diamond Cutters for the 1,000th time.

I saw someone note the chaotix issues as one of the lower points of the comic, I don't wish too many good things on that individual.

I used to think so too but honestly a lot of the games are basically filler in the same sense so I can't accept that excuse. They finally solved the issue temporarily with Starline, Surge, and Kit in that one of IDW's biggest problems was no meaningful villains to make a big story that could matter in a more personal way. In most of the games the main cast don't go through any major developments themselves and sometimes we don't even see the kind of world-altering circumstances that we got with metal virus. They can talk about mandates all they want but people have done more with less, maybe not much less since yes Sega is strict, but things aren't so dire that the stories have to be bad on purpose except in Shadow's case, maybe.

They just do art that looks cool and has implicit meaning, they're able to wordlessly convey stuff with almost no effort that IDW would feel the need to exposit by having a character tell you how another character must be feeling.

Agreed. Sometimes it pays to not be overly conscious of the fanbase, or be like Toriyama and throw curveballs just to laugh at them.

>she almost lost to whisper
Where the frick do you jobber-obsessed homosexuals come up with this? She literally curbstompped her. What, she 'almost lost' because she stopped a few seconds to realize that her new upgrade ran out of juice?

You homosexuals act like dbz spics. Surge could beat everyone in the goddamn cast and break sonic over her knee like bane and you'd still find a reason to call her a 'jobber'

IDW issue 50 says otherwise

At least Archie Sonic had more personality since he actually had things to have personal feelings about, IDW Sonic just comes off as a preachy mouthpiece that occasionally acts like Sonic.

That's fair. I'm used to Sonic not always being a great person and don't mind it since I liked fleetway.

IDW Sonic is up his own ass and preachy for some reason, but otherwise still Sonic.
Archie Sonic is an actual piece of shit who hurts people.

Fleetway Sonic is more on brand than either of them despite being an absolute ass for "the bantz."

Tailsgays are weird "nice guys" and arguably even worse than Shadowgays.
I'm just saying Archie Sonic supports Hitler as long as it means he gets to frick Hitler's daughter.

The whole thing is really stupid and feels very Geoff Johns.

You can sidestep all of this by just doing the two things Sonic Rush does: punt him into the stratosphere or go "Dang!" because he's already gotten away. The fact they can't seem to grasp this confuses me. Just let Sonic win a fight or "win" but lose! It's not difficult! Stop making them talk so much when they aren't saying anything!

Anon, that's not le epic masterplannerino.
Having Eggman get humiliated would make him less scary and serious! We can't have that!
Ian's handling of Eggman is barely different from Penders', I don't understand why people praise it.

It really took 60+ issues and Evan being the writer for Eggman to suffer ANY repercussions by having him be teleported into the sky and explode along with his city.
Also, not that I don't think he should've been punished, but pretty inconsistent for him to just be let go unharmed after causing global terror and beating everyone into a pulp, but then he gets fricking exploded for building a city that would eventually take over the world.
This was also the only good thing about what is arguably the worst arc in the entire comic.

As someone who hated this moment for a long time, I finally empathize with Sonic and it's for the reason I disliked that moment in the first place. EVERYONE was there minus a couple people and Eggman WAS seconds away from decimating them before Sonic arrived and practically solo'd him. What the frick were these people doing that they couldn't handle Eggman as a group? I would let Eggman walk with no repercussions if I was in Sonic's shoes too. What a bunch of pathetic useless jobbers.

>Eggman also probably didn't design it to fight Sonic considering he was MIA.
A real subversion from issue 175

Like the one anon said, it takes literally no effort to have Eggman get fricked off after losing. Sonic abandons him in almost every game as whatever facility or bot he was in starts exploding and the guy just comes back next game for more. He was trapped in timeless white space and still came back to dick around. Sonic doesn't need to specifically spare him at all.
>we wasted half of it on the damn ocs.
>and were back to the nobodies"
This itself isn't the problem, the OCs just weren't doing anything all that interesting and the crying and pats on the back didn't make for an enjoyable read.

Ian was actually asked about their power-level.

>Q:Which Eggmechs could Rough and Tumble reliably take out?
Ian: I imagine they could handle your standard Egg Mobile variants, I'm counting those as egg mechs. They're machinery, they're mechanical, Eggman flies them. Getting into the modern era, the speed aspect is a bit of a problem because I can't see either of them keeping up with like the Unleashed bosses, the ones that you're like chasing down, that's a bit much.
Kyle: What about things like just base enemies?
Ian: Like badniks? Sure yeah, no problem. They can handle those. When we get into like end boss tier, I think they could probably handle the Death Egg Robot but Egg Dragoon might be a bit...well if they're working together-
Kyle: No, it's funnier if they just get absolutely curb stomped by the Egg Dragoon.
Ian: If they're working together, they might severely damage it. Egg Hornet, Egg Walker, Egg Viper maybe...? They beat the Egg Viper but they fall for the suicide dive, every time, because this time they're gonna get it! This time-nope. The thing with Rough and Tumble is as goofy as they are, as low tier villainy as they are, they are still able to cause trouble for Sonic and that alone makes them fairly powerful.
Kyle: Yeah it's just relative level.
Ian: Yeah, I mean there's a reason why Sonic and the gang win, they're better, but compared to your average joe Rough and Tumble are still pretty formidable.

>Shadow is still the biggest jobber in the comic
What about Metal? What's his win/loss score?

Metal has a better Win/Loss record than Shadow.
3/4 if my memory is right.

A fight won offscreen is worthless. You need to demonstrate a character being effective. Show, don't tell.

The only acceptable "Shadow doesn't win against Surge" scenario is Shadow having something more urgent to go and take care of mid-fight. He's the last one who should job against some rookie.

>Worf effect
God I hate how common this trope is these days.
I feel like it's in practically all long running action media from the past decade.

>from the past decade.
You have only been watching action media for that long.