She was never a character and obviously she did not love her children because she had them with someone she did not love. Yes, women can be very selfish and awful. Because women, like men, are people. You figured it out dumb ass. Thread over.
>She was never a character
The original Nick site said she was born royalty, the perfect match for Ozai, and was concerned with raising her kids into good royals. The abused, theater girl Ursa was a retcon.
>She was never a character and obviously she did not love her children because she had them with someone she did not love.
Her original character bio said that she was Ozai's perfect match when they first met.
friendly reminder that gene yang was the fall guy for yet another byrke frick up. they cant write character dynamics to save their lives. the ehasz, o bryan and the rest of the orginal writing team carried those hacks
It was a combined effort. When Ehasz went off on his own it wasn't really that much better than Korra. Ultimately ATLA was lightning in a bottle and the team fracturing basically killed it.
Warren Spector said that no game is created by one person, and the same can be said here. None of them have been able to create an ATLA level success again because no single one of them was the solitary reason behind the success of ATLA.
And every animated show nowdays wants to be either this, Steven Universe, or Gravity Falls.
that's why i also mentioned o bryan, the ehasz's (plural) and the others (should have mentioned josh hamilton).
though in the case of aaron, dragon prince in season 1-3 prior to the writer mutiny easily beats out korra IMO. bad worldbuilding with good characters are far easier to put up with than the reverse.
I mean based on how they talked about her in their commentaries for season 2, or their interview in 2007 before season 3 came out, Im pretty sure that their takes on her in pic related are them just quoting what notes/drafts Aaron gave them for her character
>Im pretty sure that their takes on her in pic related are them just quoting what notes/drafts Aaron gave them for her character
i believe it. iirc it was stated by a writer that no one else had a real grasp on azula's characterization.
It was mentioned here in one of these threads, i'll look for it on the archive
It was aaron himself who said it, which stills tracks because he clearly understood her the most given how much he changed from azula's initial draft byrke came up with
1 month ago
Anonymous
Okay, yeah I know about that, but Ive heard a guy on the fandom-wiki forums say that this was made by a fake/troll account, so I wonder is this 100% his account or not, I mean I do think it actually is probably true though, as this is what one of the people that worked on the show said about her:
>DOS SANTOS: Who knows, if given the proper circumstances growing up if Azula would have turned out differently or if that was just her inherent nature. I think my big takeaway is that it's an incredibly tragic ending to that specific arc. For Zuko to have to watch his sister reduced to that state of pure feral rage ... again, kids' show. My mind was pretty blown working on it.
Which this does honestly seem to suggest that most of the people working on the show had very little understanding of her character.
1 month ago
Anonymous
it's real. not only is his username/handle the same but most of the tweets in picrel popped right up when i searched the profile. i assume the top middle tweet not popping up is because he probably got sent a CAD because byrke got there panties in a bunch.
1 month ago
Anonymous
https://www.reddit.com/user/ehasz/comments/
Yeah thats definitely Aaron, though the argument by the guy is that because when you search for the comments they dont show up, even though they still should, meaning that theyre fake
> Try to actually go to the comments directly, & you'll find them missing. The way Reddit works, deleted comments still appear on your own profile. That is one of several red flags that they're fake, & also that's asking the wrong question, the right question is where's the proof that they're REAL?
1 month ago
Anonymous
Although, was that comment made 8 years ago, because there are a couple comments at the very end, in a thread talking about ATLA, which say [removed], meaning thats likely where they are and the guy is a moron (I mean that was obvious to me already before)
1 month ago
Anonymous
That's because twitter doesn't load every tweet from profiles with hundreds of tweets, especially anything pre 2015. >Redditors being moronic
Many such cases.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean this same guy unironically tried to convince me that a true psychopath is capable of emotional attachments, and caring about such things as their parents being proud of them, because psychopaths are capable of caring about what other people think of them in a cognitive sense thus this obviously means that Azulas strong attachment and care about her mother and fathers opinions of her totally isnt definitive evidence of her not being a psychopath, according to this guy she MUST show remorse/guilt for her actions in order to not be a psychopath (which she did in The Search at the end) because he is an obvious liberal who believes that not acknowledging the moral principles of western liberal democratic society means you are a psychopath.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>byrke
Did he really ruin ATLA?
1 month ago
Anonymous
>aaron claims the reason season 4 of atla didn't happen despite him being approached by nick for ideas is that byrke pushed for the live action shamalan movie even though shamalan himself insisted that they just do season 4 instead.
IMO yes, as everything since tracks with a lot of what aaron has said. byrke were executive producers on the movie and never let people forget that...
on whim i decided to look at the writing credits between atla and korra and the difference in quality makes complete sense. >korra had no head writer, thus no one to overule byrke >dos santos is the only director from atla who worked on korra, and there were 4 directors who did more than him >josh hamilton and tim hendrick are the only atla writers who worked on korra, and the most notable episodes they wrote consist of the cave of two lovers, the painted lady, the swamp, lake laogai, sokka's master, the puppetmaster and ember island players among others. >the following writers didn't work on korra: aaron ehasz, elizabeth welch, john o bryan, may chen, james eagen and 15 different co writers. >source: IMDB
i want to not shit on the two writers who did stay, as they clearly had to write whatever byrke stuck on the wall, but the fact that they're the reason the puppetmaster, the painted lady and two lovers exist explains so much kek.
>dragon prince in season 1-3 prior to the writer mutiny easily beats out korra IMO
Don't make me remember how much they fumbled the story and characters in these new seasons.
As soon as they promoted the new female head writer,to appease the twitter/tumblr mob who believed in the false accusations against Eshaz,everything went to shit.
She was able to completely make Rayla,what was the favorite character of the fandom,to one of the most hated one's just because she wanted her to be always forgiven no matter what she does or how she act's so she could live her fantasy of being always right and forgiven
i really do have to get around to watching dragon prince... did they at least get rid of this writer for season 6? i can just head cannon 4/5 out of existence
1 month ago
Anonymous
Season 6 is still not out and there is no date since it seems Netflix is postponing it's release date for some reasons especially since it was already done in September.
Some say that it is because they have problems with the apparently change of rating and the maturity of season 6 and 7.
Regarding the head writer she is still there and she will remain for all of this series since the writing is already done for the last two seasons and they even maybe already done all voice recording
We just have to hope that the writing improve in these last two seasons since they are finally done with the presentation of the time skip and start of the new plot.
Already season 5 was way better than season 4 and had already better animation,which season 6 seems that it improved it even more if the spoilers from the first ep are true,but it still had some problems that didn't let it be as enjoyable as the first three seasons so let's hope the trend continues and these last two seasons are actually good
It was a combined effort. When Ehasz went off on his own it wasn't really that much better than Korra. Ultimately ATLA was lightning in a bottle and the team fracturing basically killed it.
Warren Spector said that no game is created by one person, and the same can be said here. None of them have been able to create an ATLA level success again because no single one of them was the solitary reason behind the success of ATLA.
And every animated show nowdays wants to be either this, Steven Universe, or Gravity Falls.
that's why i also mentioned o bryan, the ehasz's (plural) and the others (should have mentioned josh hamilton).
though in the case of aaron, dragon prince in season 1-3 prior to the writer mutiny easily beats out korra IMO. bad worldbuilding with good characters are far easier to put up with than the reverse.
[...] >Im pretty sure that their takes on her in pic related are them just quoting what notes/drafts Aaron gave them for her character
i believe it. iirc it was stated by a writer that no one else had a real grasp on azula's characterization.
on whim i decided to look at the writing credits between atla and korra and the difference in quality makes complete sense. >korra had no head writer, thus no one to overule byrke >dos santos is the only director from atla who worked on korra, and there were 4 directors who did more than him >josh hamilton and tim hendrick are the only atla writers who worked on korra, and the most notable episodes they wrote consist of the cave of two lovers, the painted lady, the swamp, lake laogai, sokka's master, the puppetmaster and ember island players among others. >the following writers didn't work on korra: aaron ehasz, elizabeth welch, john o bryan, may chen, james eagen and 15 different co writers. >source: IMDB
i want to not shit on the two writers who did stay, as they clearly had to write whatever byrke stuck on the wall, but the fact that they're the reason the puppetmaster, the painted lady and two lovers exist explains so much kek.
I mean the main problem of Korra, that remained constant throughout the whole series, was the underwhelming characterization and character dynamics of the main cast, the ONLY character that is on par with the ATLA main cast (Aang, Katara, Sokka, Toph, Zuko, Iroh)+Azula is Tenzin, everyone else remains extremely one-dimensional and uninteresting for the rest of the show, Korra does get a little bit better in season 4 due to the whole PTSD thing, but was a too little, too late and wasnt even executed that well.
It is obvious beyond belief to anyone that pays attention that whilst Bryke are definitely good at worldbuilding, they are beyond terrible when it comes to actually writing characters and if it werent for Aaron fixing Toph and Irohs characterizations, and writing most of Zukos character arc, and also clearly being the driving force behind making Azula an actual complex character, just taking those things away makes it blatantly clear that without him and several others the show would have been no better than your average Saturday morning Nickelodeon show post-2000, whichbis exactly what LoK ended up becoming, despite all its attempts to tackle more mature topics, it never reached the heart and soul that ATLA managed, and on the maturity part, nothing in LoK comes close to this quote
>Sozin was just as much Fire Nation as Roku was, if anything their story proves that anyone is capable of both great good and great evil.
Hitting at the heart of eastern philosophy the show is based upon, and the nature of Yin and Yang “In good there is evil, in evil there is good”
Zuko should have married and procreated with an Earth Kingdom girl. Nothing would be a bigger "frick you" to Ozai than having an Earth Bender be the next Fire Lord.
>He should be plowing Jin, anyway.
Why do people think Jin would be good for Zuko when she only briefly interacted with "Lee"? Is it because she considered to be is hotter than Mai?
Because Jin was a well-adjusted girl who knew how to have fun which balances Zuko out nicely and even brought out some of his sentimental side. Mai is a depressed, gloomy woman and when paired with Zuko, a depressed, gloomy pessimist they are an actual black hole of charisma.
im in the anyone but mai camp, but yes this was the obvious decision if it has to be a fire nation girl. some times i really do think byrke paired zukp with mai out of spite. she's literally the worst option for him
>He should be plowing Jin, anyway.
Why do people think Jin would be good for Zuko when she only briefly interacted with "Lee"? Is it because she considered to be is hotter than Mai?
I mean, The Search had 2 good scenes with her, the one where shes second guessing herself about the throne being her destiny, and the whole part with her confronting Zuko and Ursa was pretty great.
Plus her most recent comic is pretty, it asserts a lot of the things about her character that were previously mostly hinted at, and leaves her off in a much better position than before.
Yeah, and then there is this moron, who insists she is a psychopath based on her being a one-dimensional villain at the beginning, and refuses to accept that maybe Bryke were morons, just like they were for many other things, who didnt listen to Aarons pleas about how making Azula more flawed earlier on, to set up her possible redemption would make for a great story, until Book 3 when they finally listened to him.
“If they don’t want to say things outright, but they still want it to be interpreted a certain way, they have to be very careful to frame things so that it actually comes across that way. A couple half-assed reactions in a single episode or two isn’t going to change how people interpret the whole character based on the rest of the context, & if the writers really expected it to, I’m honestly very disappointed in them. I will continue to think they’re better than that until when & if there’s so much evidence to the contrary that I can no longer extend that charitability.“
i dont think it was just aaron calling them out for being morons, but yea byrke not noing how multifaceted characterization works isn’t anything new.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean based on how they talked about her in their commentaries for season 2, or their interview in 2007 before season 3 came out, Im pretty sure that their takes on her in pic related are them just quoting what notes/drafts Aaron gave them for her character
>she killed Azulon in the show
This.
It was also HEAVILY implied earlier in the show that either Ozai backstabbed & blamed her, or he made it clear beforehand that if she did it it was her funeral, either way she fricking died.
Then Bryke & DiMartino pussied out, or possibly Nickelodeon forced them to censor out the mother murder, (see also: Jet) and she was clumsily retconned to be cucking Ozai or something. Weakest plot point in the show IMO and very deservedly swept under the carpet, and one of many reasons to ignore the comics.
If they did that, what would be the one thing they'd keep that'd cause the funniest reaction and/or most butthurt? Mai cucking Zuko? Smokebending? Forklift?
>The frick is smokebending? Is that a subset of airbending?
No, villains use smoke bombs and morons think it's magic.
>No, villains use smoke bombs and morons think it's magic.
Smokebending appears to be a subset of firebending. How can you explain shit like smoke coming out of Azula while she is generating lightning otherwise?
Or some kind of half-breed or mutation since Aang is both an airbender and the Avatar. Probably it would just be one of their many kids.
[...]
kino
posting the superior firelady crackship
1 month ago
Anonymous
>anything involving mai >superior
Yeah, nah. She was trash in the show and made even worse in the comics.
She contributes nothing to azula's team that ty lee doesn't do 10x better, she has the worst chemistry with zuko out of all the girls he interacts with, and overall has a shitty personality.
Should have replaced her character with june.
>Says smokebending is really Azula and her goons using sleigh of hand and smokebombs even though their hands are occupied and no character ever comments on them using smoke bombs.
>How can you explain shit like smoke coming out of Azula while she is generating lightning otherwise?
she's firebending out of her ass to produce the smoke duh
>she's firebending out of her ass to produce the smoke duh
I think smokebending is the precusor to true psychic firebending, unlike combustionbending, and think Azula learning how to psychically firebend is how she'll remain a threat to the adult Gaang when she eventually confronts them in a show or movie.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>even though their hands are occupied
The switch is controlled by sphincter. >no character ever comments on them using smoke bombs
Why would they need to?
1 month ago
Anonymous
>The switch is controlled by sphincter.
Ah. I see now that you are just messing around trying to cope with the comics fricking with the bending system. It's fine, I don't like it either, but Bryke decided to keep them canon. >Why would they need to?
If they were smokebombs, then why wouldn't Aang for example quickly disarm the Fire Warriors instead of letting himself get knocked out and need saving from Mai and Kei Lo?
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Ah. I see now that you are just messing around trying to cope with the comics fricking with the bending system.
Not really. You are just being a bit autistic. The comics have far worse things than fricking smoke.
I don't see it as a fire bending or bending in general. They are posing as ghosts, and the smoke, which appears only when they are in costumes (right?), is part of the facade and the clothes. They just stuck smoke bombs under the cape. They don't need to do anything because smoke bombs work automatically. >why wouldn't Aang for example quickly disarm the Fire Warriors instead of letting himself get knocked out and need saving from Mai and Kei Lo?
The pic? He just took a breath at the wrong time.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>They are posing as ghosts, and the smoke, which appears only when they are in costumes (right?), is part of the facade and the clothes. They just stuck smoke bombs under the cape. They don't need to do anything because smoke bombs work automatically.
We see the inside of their cloaks and there are no bombs, nor are, or at least Azula, is carrying a belt of bombs.
1 month ago
Anonymous
You can only see the legs in this image
1 month ago
Anonymous
>You can only see the legs in this image
You can see a part of the inside of the cloak. The outside of the cloak is a sleek black while part of the inside of the cloak is gray with lines inside of it.
None of azula’s soldiers who use smoke in smoke in shadow use it in the next comic. Neither does Azula.
>None of azula’s soldiers who use smoke in smoke in shadow use it in the next comic. Neither does Azula.
Zuko does capture some of the Fire Warriors and (probably) learned of smokebending from interrogating them. If Azula or the remaining Fire Warriors use smokebending, it would instantly alter everyone to their true identities. And considering the Fire Warriors don't want to actually hurt anyone, only help the Fire Nation's downtoddern, I don't think they would want to start a true life or death fight.
>How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho?
They activate it when no one sees it, between panels >And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs?
so that there is mystery and mystisism.
>>How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho? >They activate it when no one sees it, between panels >>And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs? >so that there is mystery and mystisism.
Zuko has every incentive to not allow Azula escape and she is within his line of sight the entire time during the Catacombs talk. Yet, if she is using a smokebomb, Zuko allowed her to use in front of him and escape because...? Whereas if it is smokebending, then it makes sense why she was able to activitate without Zuko being unable to do anything about it: he doesn't know how to smokebend himself.
Also, considering Bryke said the comics are canon subject to minor revisions, and we don't see Azula use smokebending or her advanced lightning techs in her comic, I think they are going to ignore most of Azula's bending feats in the comics so non-comic readers aren't caught off guard by Azula's absurd jump in power and skill.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>You can see a part of the inside of the cloak.
Yes, only the part that corresponds to the legs.
They have much more space to hide a bomb
.> Zuko allowed her to use in front of him and escape because...?
He didn't know they had bombs and she was always faster than him.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>They have much more space to hide a bomb
But where tho if not on the bottom part of their cloak or on a belt tied to their waists. ATLA takes place in the rough equivalent of the 19th century; their smoke bombs are going to be relatively big, especially considering how much smoke they make even when not fighting. >He didn't know they had bombs and she was always faster than him.
I agree on the always faster than him part, but he already experienced her using smoke on him and others before, yet he never mentions the possibility of them using smoke bombs, or trying to come up with countermeasures, because?
1 month ago
Anonymous
>I think they are going to ignore most of Azula's bending feats in the comics so non-comic readers aren't caught off guard by Azula's absurd jump in power and skill. >byrke not powercreeping for the frick of it.
i'll believe it when i see
1 month ago
Anonymous
not powercreeping for the frick of it. >i'll believe it when i see
But how they can powercreep Azula without using her genetics as an excuse for why other firebenders can't copy her abilities or having the Gaang kill after she mostly succeeds in her scheme? Because all that's left imo is for her to make her instant lightning lethal and/or learn pyschic firebending, both of which would make her a deadly threat to an adult Gaang.
1 month ago
Anonymous
None of azula’s soldiers who use smoke in smoke in shadow use it in the next comic. Neither does Azula.
>How can you explain shit like smoke coming out of Azula while she is generating lightning otherwise?
she's firebending out of her ass to produce the smoke duh
>literally a smoke bomb
How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho? And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs?
1 month ago
Anonymous
>How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho?
They activate it when no one sees it, between panels >And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs?
so that there is mystery and mystisism.
even if show ursa was mostly prompted up by fanon and headcanon i still find it funny how despite the writers going out of their way to make ursa seem sympathetic most fans ended up hating her
even if show ursa was mostly prompted up by fanon and headcanon i still find it funny how despite the writers going out of their way to make ursa seem sympathetic most fans ended up hating her
Maybe if I gouge my eyes out I would have a better chance of reading these
I honestly thought that it was implying that its implying that Ursa transitioned into Ozai, and that the reason “Ozai” is laughing at the end is because thats actually Ursa
There was this fanfic I read that had Ursa end up in the Water Tribes and Kya end up in the Fire Nation, Ursa marries Hakoda and Kya marries Ozai. I can't find it though.
Azula made me so sad when I rewatched the show recently. It seems like she was supposed to be a parallel to Toph - Yin pretending to be Yang vs Yang pretending to be Yin - but man was that nowhere to be seen in Season 2. It's like how Katara flips between hardcore and nag at will, but without the human side entirely.
>Azula made me so sad when I rewatched the show recently.
Me too. >it seems like she was supposed to be a parallel to Toph - Yin pretending to be Yang vs Yang pretending to be Yin
Elaborate please, I can't really decipher your message >in Season 2
whatever it is, she has too little screen time. Despite that, and her role as a villain, she still manages to show a lot off human-like characteristics.
I'm aware, but all the main recurring cast members of ATLA are small. Zuko is the tallest at 5'3", Iroh is 5'1 or 5'2" and so is Sokka. >Ozai and Ursa are tall, aren't they?
I'm gonna guess Ozai is about 6', not much more. A good comparison shot would be great.
I'm aware, but all the main recurring cast members of ATLA are small. Zuko is the tallest at 5'3", Iroh is 5'1 or 5'2" and so is Sokka. >Ozai and Ursa are tall, aren't they?
I'm gonna guess Ozai is about 6', not much more. A good comparison shot would be great.
Kinda shitty comparison shot, but Ozai is seemingly about 6'3"
Azula herself, in show. The cold, rigorous Azula we met in season two would have just killed her "friends" after they betrayed her and moved one without a second thought, like sociopath she clearly was.
Yes, because having our 2 main villains be basically the exact same character would have been such a great decision.
The only mistake with Azulas character was not showing us the cracks in her armor earlier, which was most likely due to Bryke being morons and not listening to Aaron until season 3
I never said that, what I said was that having Ozai and Azula basically be the exact character is simply redundant, it adds nothing to the story, and if anything only detracts from Ozai as a threat even more, because there is really no way to distinguish him from Azula, who we were introduced to first.
And who ever said that Azula was just a misunderstood victim or whatever, she is both a victim and an abuser, she ultimately decided by her own actions to choose to go down a dark path, instead of her just being born that way.
If anything having her just be born that way makes her actually less evil, because you cant judge her as culpable for her actions as you otherwise could if she was a result of both nature and nurture, because she was simply acting according to her nature, there was no choosing the dark, or making the wrong choices in life with her anymore, because she could of only ever made one choice which we happen to judge as evil.
Would a praying mantis be judged as evil for eating its partners after sex, even though thats just as natural to them as seeking a life-long partner is to you, no of course, thus in the same vein making Azulas behavior just be a result of her nature, and almost nothing to do with her nurture suddenly just makes her not evil.
I know that you have a boner evil villainesses, and you Azula to remain just that instead of being a more complex character, but I want you to ask yourself, what do you think makes for a better story, in particular when it comes to ATLA.
A pure evil villainess, with zero complexities beyond being a perfectionist and wanting to please her dad, and who the only things she ever does is by a obstacle to our heroes, and look hot whilst it.
Or a villainess who explores the less bright and optimistic aspects of the struggle between good and evil, where someones soul and spirit is so immensely corrupted by hatred and jealousy, that the only piece of light and goodness within her is in cont.
Cont. the fact how that hatred is based upon a wrongdoing that never was, thus ones whole reasoning and justification for ones actions in this regard comes crumbling down, and we see this person eventually come to terms with the fact that the cause of their misery and pain was their own choices and mistakes in life, where they are able to restore some of the light within their soul, and come to peace with their past, but are will ultimately remain forever scared for the rest of their lives.
Basically, showing that indeed “Anyone is capable of both great good and great evil”.
But of course, a liberal, or abrahamic would never be able to possess such nuance towards good and evil, where one is always found within the other, no instead evil is evil, and good is good, because we care so much about the concept of universal justice, and dividing the world into obviously good and obviously bad people because that makes things simpler for ourselves and justifies us whenever we need to punish anyone who dares question our preconceived assumptions about life.
Okay then, would a lion be judged as evil for killing its rival cubs
>inb4 the mothers protect them
Yes because its in their nature to want to protect their offspring, just like it is in the male lions nature to kill any rival offspring, their actions cannot be judged as evil though.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Assuming the lion was sapient and capable of self-reflection, yes. You can be an unfeeling sociopath and still decide to abide by the moral norms of society.
1 month ago
Anonymous
??? Why though, there is no such thing as objective morality in a world where there is no such thing as the ultimate consequence for deciding to do one thing instead of the other.
The only moral systems that work are, ordered from the system with the weakest metaphysical understanding, to the highest:
1.egoism-the only thing that is right are things that satisfy the ego, the reason you care for others is because you want to, not because there is any moral law stating you must
2.negative utilitarianism-suffering is all that matters, a perfect life with no suffering is the equivalent of non-existence by either never being born, or by death
3.non-dualism-there is no such thing as separateness of things, all things are just aspects of a greater singular unity, consciousness is a self-aware screen that does not begin with birth, nor end with death, and is the only possible source of identity, meaning that YOU are everyone at all times, all the pleasures, all the pains in all of existence, YOU will experience all of them, this means that preventing a birth, or death do not achieve the absolute nothingness and prevention of suffering that is expected, meaning that life is worth continuing or worth starting if it is going to have more no suffering states, than suffering states, as there is no such thing as non-existence. This also means that since YOU are everyone at all times, hurting another is hurting yourself, thus in an egoist sense, the right course of action is that which generates as much happiness as possible, and whilst minimizing the suffering.
As you can see, none of these moral systems are anything alike the moral system of western liberal democracy, since unlike that, these moral systems dont rely on social constructs or “spooks”, but instead on actual epistemologically and metaphysically provable facts.
1 month ago
Anonymous
> there is no such thing as objective morality
That is it.
Cont. the fact how that hatred is based upon a wrongdoing that never was, thus ones whole reasoning and justification for ones actions in this regard comes crumbling down, and we see this person eventually come to terms with the fact that the cause of their misery and pain was their own choices and mistakes in life, where they are able to restore some of the light within their soul, and come to peace with their past, but are will ultimately remain forever scared for the rest of their lives.
Basically, showing that indeed “Anyone is capable of both great good and great evil”.
But of course, a liberal, or abrahamic would never be able to possess such nuance towards good and evil, where one is always found within the other, no instead evil is evil, and good is good, because we care so much about the concept of universal justice, and dividing the world into obviously good and obviously bad people because that makes things simpler for ourselves and justifies us whenever we need to punish anyone who dares question our preconceived assumptions about life.
>NOOOOOO Azula can't just take after her father she has to be the poor misunderstand victim NOOOOO
That is not the point.
First of all, she clearly isn't just psychopath, because otherwise we wouldn't have this tread over and over again. See how no one tries to defend Ozai?
Second, the problem with Azula's characterization is that it was not finished. You concentrate on a few cases when she displays "evil behavior". Others concentrate on her human side and all the mistreatment she got. The problem is there is no distinctive answer given by the show, which one it actually is.
She is, at least in my opinion very similar to 1st season Zuko, only more capable. And while Zuko gets the help of an uncle and multiple chance to redeem himself, he still manages to blew some of them. Azula on the other hand, doesn't get even one. How can you make a statement about her psychopathy when you can't juxtapose her actions?
Im going to use a bit of a cringe terminology here, although there definite merit in its parts, and thats Zuko and Azulas base personality based upon MBTI.
Now Zuko is most likely an ISFx, I cant decide whether he would be judging or prospecting, Ive seen others put him as and ISFP, but struggle to see how he doesnt follow rules, or a strict schedule, but it doesnt matter.
Azula is most likely an xNTJ, its kind of difficult to say whether she is an extrovert or an introvert, but I the most likely answer to that is shes somewhere inbetween so an ambivert, otherwise Ive seen her classed as an ENTJ, and think that makes sensr for her.
Now the part that actually matters for this, are the cognitive functions, as thats the part that is actually somwhat scientific and its what Jung was talking about.
So for Zuko, his functions would be
1.Fi
2.Se
3.Ni
4.Te
And for Azula, her functions would be
1.Te
2.Ni
3.Se
4.Fi
I dont wanna bother going into too much detail, but what this means is that Zuko is a lot more value/moral based, and thinks in a lot more practical/grounded terms, he struggles with abstract thinking, and cares a lot about upholding said values to himself.
Azula on other hand, is a lot more logic/reason based, she thinks in creative/abstract terms, she has very good abstract intelligence, and cares a lot about having her thoughts and opinions be expressed and asserted to others.
This means that even if lets say Zuko was the prodigy and Azula was average, they would not act the same even if morals were shifted, where Azula values Ursa, and Zuko values Ozai, Zuko would promote his fathers worldview in a very emotional/passionate manner, and would be acting like, well apparently Louis XVII of France, aka the guy who was killed during the french revolution, whereas Azula would be upholding her mothers values in much more controlled but extremely committed manner, and would basically be committing her life to spite her father, and honor her mother.
It certainly is interesting and it does makes some sense. btw, when I said they are similar I didn't mean it like that, I meant their views and relationship with the rest of the world.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Ok, I get that.
But honestly, Ive been thinking for the last 10-20 minutes, about a potential AU, where Zuko was the prodigious and favored son, whereas Azula was the average embarrassment who Ursa took under her wing, and it honestly sounds very interesting, because it wouldnt be just a retelling of the original, as I believe that when Azula got banished by Ozai, she would go and try to find the Avatar just like Zuko did, but instead of doing it with the goal of restoring her honor in the face of her father, she would instead do it with the intent to team up with the Avatar to defeat her father, and basically book 1 Azula would tell Aang in the pilot that she intends to join forces with him, but must keep it secret from everyone but her uncle, as otherwise they would be labeled as traitors and lose all their potential privileges from being Fire Nation, even if limited, but Aang with the advice of Katara and Sokka wouldnt know whether to trust Azula, so the rest of book 1 would be a lot about Azula unsuccessfully trying to earn Aangs trust, until when book 2 begins, and Zuko is sent by Ozai to capture/kill Azula and Iroh, Azula would figure out that Zuko is lying to her, and even if he werent she would never want to return to her father, but goes along so that her and Iroh are officially labeled as traitors so that she would have an easier time getting Aang to trust her, and from there you can write pretty much anything you want, though I would suggest keeping an Azula Alone episode in there, to give an insight into Azulas attachment to her mother.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Nice.
What if she and Zuko were raised in a Sokka and Katara environment?No royalty, just a normal peasant
1 month ago
Anonymous
Thats just Distorted Reality, although thats a not full on AU, since Aang is from the original timeline, where they failed at Sozins comet 3 years into the future, so hes 16 years old mentally, but back in a 12 year olds body [SPOILER] Also Azula develops a crush on Aang, and the ship is significantly better than Kataang, or any canon ship [/spoiler]
1 month ago
Anonymous
Frick, first time spoiler fail
1 month ago
Anonymous
Is it accurate to their personalities?
1 month ago
Anonymous
Aang is a lot more jaded and serious than in the original due the whole 3 years of watching your allies and world be destroyed and left in ruin, to the point where he wants to kill Ozai and Azula out of revenge, which kickstarts the whole AU
And Azula is pretty much exactly how you would think she would be (unless you think shes a psychopath, but if you think that youre an idiot), if she had a normal childhood, with a loving mother and father, she is still incredibly mean, ruse, condescending, scheming, merciless to her enemies, lies to her enemies (not friends) to get what she wants, incredibly intelligent, and highly competitive.
The only times she acts differently are after she develops her crush around Aang, she acts incredibly awkwardly and sheepishly around him, as she doesnt know how to win his affection, or when she is jealous of Toph after she learns Aang and her were friends in the OG timeline, she starts acting incredibly petty and hostile towards her, though I guess that is in character aswell.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>disorted reality
No, not really.
you're talking about the guy whose constantly willing to take care of other men's kids.
we dont know anything about his supossed wife either.
>She is, at least in my opinion very similar to 1st season Zuko
First season Zuko risks his life to save a member of his crew, and then rejects the chance to chase the avatar first to spare his crew, then to save his uncle. Azula's very first action is threatening to murder her crew if they minorly inconvenience her. Her next is to try and murder Zuko in cold blood, when he went out of his way to try and save even Zhao. Then she threatens her supposed friend with death in order to enslave her.
Azula stans really do have a terminal case of headcannon
1 month ago
Anonymous
Yes. Case in point.
>First season Zuko risks his life to save a member of his crew >Azula's very first action is threatening to murder her crew if they minorly inconvenience her
This are not similar situations. >Her next is to try and murder Zuko in cold blood
Her next is to try and bring them home without any fights and murders, before "cough cough" captain blew it. >Then she threatens her supposed friend with death in order to enslave her.
Zuko threatens with death in order to enslave Avatar.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Okay, which statement is incorrect?
1 month ago
Anonymous
Literally all of them.
1 month ago
Anonymous
So according to you: >threatening someone with a murder
is the opposite to >saving someone
According to you Azula did not try to lure Iroh and Zuko on the ship with deception.
According to you Zuko doesn't threaten the village in order to capture the Avatar.
Good job Zuko stan!
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean this is the logic applied by the most powerful Azula villifier in a debate he had with me, constantly confusing emotional empathy(feeling anothers emotions) with compassionate empathy(caring about anothers emotions), talking about how a clearly sad face in animation is ambiguous, or how she totally isnt empathizing with Ty Lee here because, umm she could be thinking about her mother for literally no reason, or how psychopaths cant totally care deeply about their parents being proud/happy of them the way Azula is shown.
Also they are a Redditor, with all the stereotypes that come with one (hes a fricking mod on the LoK subreddit ROFL)
Im not going to call names, but if you go through the thread, and the following comments, I think there is possibility that you would be able to piece together who they are
Okay, yeah I know about that, but Ive heard a guy on the fandom-wiki forums say that this was made by a fake/troll account, so I wonder is this 100% his account or not, I mean I do think it actually is probably true though, as this is what one of the people that worked on the show said about her:
>DOS SANTOS: Who knows, if given the proper circumstances growing up if Azula would have turned out differently or if that was just her inherent nature. I think my big takeaway is that it's an incredibly tragic ending to that specific arc. For Zuko to have to watch his sister reduced to that state of pure feral rage ... again, kids' show. My mind was pretty blown working on it.
Which this does honestly seem to suggest that most of the people working on the show had very little understanding of her character.
https://www.reddit.com/user/ehasz/comments/
Yeah thats definitely Aaron, though the argument by the guy is that because when you search for the comments they dont show up, even though they still should, meaning that theyre fake
> Try to actually go to the comments directly, & you'll find them missing. The way Reddit works, deleted comments still appear on your own profile. That is one of several red flags that they're fake, & also that's asking the wrong question, the right question is where's the proof that they're REAL?
I mean this same guy unironically tried to convince me that a true psychopath is capable of emotional attachments, and caring about such things as their parents being proud of them, because psychopaths are capable of caring about what other people think of them in a cognitive sense thus this obviously means that Azulas strong attachment and care about her mother and fathers opinions of her totally isnt definitive evidence of her not being a psychopath, according to this guy she MUST show remorse/guilt for her actions in order to not be a psychopath (which she did in The Search at the end) because he is an obvious liberal who believes that not acknowledging the moral principles of western liberal democratic society means you are a psychopath.
I mean this is the logic applied by the most powerful Azula villifier in a debate he had with me, constantly confusing emotional empathy(feeling anothers emotions) with compassionate empathy(caring about anothers emotions), talking about how a clearly sad face in animation is ambiguous, or how she totally isnt empathizing with Ty Lee here because, umm she could be thinking about her mother for literally no reason, or how psychopaths cant totally care deeply about their parents being proud/happy of them the way Azula is shown.
Also they are a Redditor, with all the stereotypes that come with one (hes a fricking mod on the LoK subreddit ROFL)
I mean the dude said he was a studying for a degree in psychology in one of his comments, as a diagnosed Aspie I must take someone for their word when they claim something as I dont understand why someone would just lie on the internet for no reason.
One bit of help I will give is that they have the same username on the fandom-wiki forums, and reddit
1 month ago
Anonymous
>I'm the anon in most these replies
oh you're talking about the guy you mentioned earlier. yeah, i went back and looked and your not wrong, though like i said: >redditors being moronic
many such cases
1 month ago
Anonymous
Aaron?
1 month ago
Anonymous
No? Why would it be Aaron, his opinion on Azula is absolutely based, to the point this guy refuses to acknowledge his opinion as meaning anything because he doesnt work on the series anymore, despite Bryke changing their tunes about Azula very clearly after they decided to look at what Aaron had to offer to him.
1 month ago
Anonymous
IDK then
1 month ago
Anonymous
>I think there is possibility that you would be able to piece together who they are
I am out of the loop, who is it?
I dont want to namecall the dude, since he b***hed to me about my “bad manner” or whatever in the google doc (you can just look into it and see, at the end of the second and third chapters), so I dont want to give him any more food by namecalling him
1 month ago
Anonymous
Is the google doc his work?
1 month ago
Anonymous
Yes it is
I mean this is the logic applied by the most powerful Azula villifier in a debate he had with me, constantly confusing emotional empathy(feeling anothers emotions) with compassionate empathy(caring about anothers emotions), talking about how a clearly sad face in animation is ambiguous, or how she totally isnt empathizing with Ty Lee here because, umm she could be thinking about her mother for literally no reason, or how psychopaths cant totally care deeply about their parents being proud/happy of them the way Azula is shown.
Also they are a Redditor, with all the stereotypes that come with one (hes a fricking mod on the LoK subreddit ROFL)
>One bit of help I will give is that they have the same username on the fandom-wiki forums, and reddit
Aaron?
Isn't the guy who wrote a whole war crimes google doc that got roasted on her and on tumblr?
1 month ago
Anonymous
I dont know show me
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Isn't the guy who wrote a whole war crimes google doc that got roasted on her and on tumblr?
???????????????????????????????????
>Not knowing who BahamutLithp is
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLastAirbender/comments/nncgpg/avatar_war_crime_analysis/
1 month ago
Anonymous
Yep, thats the guy
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Isn't the guy who wrote a whole war crimes google doc that got roasted on her and on tumblr?
???????????????????????????????????
1 month ago
Anonymous
Who's her?
1 month ago
Anonymous
>I think there is possibility that you would be able to piece together who they are
I am out of the loop, who is it?
1 month ago
Anonymous
someone with a murder >is the opposite to
someone
Yes, and if you are genuinely too moronic to see that then you unironically should be locked in a padded cell forever. Just like Azula.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Azula vilifiers on the other hand have a terminal case of armchair psychology, where a villain acting like a villain immediately makes them a psychopath, and any future evidence to the contrary is to be either ignored, or reinterpreted via bullshit ulterior motives
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean your not wrong but surely there has to a balanced take between "she's evil incarnate" and "she's no different from zuko"
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean there is, and its the one I and most Azula defenders on the internet seem to take, Ive honestly seen way more of the former than the latter.
>First season Zuko risks his life to save a member of his crew >Azula's very first action is threatening to murder her crew if they minorly inconvenience her
This are not similar situations. >Her next is to try and murder Zuko in cold blood
Her next is to try and bring them home without any fights and murders, before "cough cough" captain blew it. >Then she threatens her supposed friend with death in order to enslave her.
Zuko threatens with death in order to enslave Avatar.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>This are not similar situations.
Yeah, Azula had nothing urgent at all propelling her forward, she just didn't want to wait slightly longer and was willing to murder a guy over it.
>Her next is to try and bring them home without any fights and murders, before "cough cough" captain blew it.
She had him down for the count and decided to murder him with lightning. Contrast Zuko's behavior with Zhao in episode fricking three.
>Zuko threatens with death in order to enslave Avatar.
He doesn't threaten his friends with death or going around conscripting teenaged girls.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Yeah, Azula had nothing urgent at all propelling her forward, she just didn't want to wait slightly longer and was willing to murder a guy over it.
Whatever? Making sure your subordinates follow orders is bad. If she did kill him, that would be another story. You are making such a big deal out of it because? >She had him down for the count and decided to murder him with lightning. Contrast Zuko's behavior with Zhao in episode fricking three.
They were fighting, each blow is deadly, so what? Yes Zuko stoped during Agni Kai, since he won and doesn't have balls to kill, but this wasn't a honor duel, it was a fight. Btw, Iroh had her down for the count and decided to murder her by drowning. >He doesn't threaten his friends with death or going around conscripting teenaged girls.
She is teenage girl and removing the net of a skilled acrobat is not the same as threatening to destroy a village.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Whatever? Making sure your subordinates follow orders is bad. If she did kill him, that would be another story. You are making such a big deal out of it because?
The sheer unreal levels of reality denial of Azula stans is something to behold. Care for crew = actively threatening to murder crew for small inconvenience, as long as it's precious little Azula doing it uwu.
>They were fighting, each blow is deadly, so what? Yes Zuko stoped during Agni Kai, since he won and doesn't have balls to kill, but this wasn't a honor duel, it was a fight.
She lured him into a trap with a squad of soldiers, then won, then decided to murder him anyway just because she could. The fact that you are claiming this as being the same as season 1 Zuko only shows how insane you have to be to stan Azula.
> Btw, Iroh had her down for the count and decided to murder her by drowning.
He kicked her into water right beside a fricking pier. You're now telling me she can't swim and he knows that? If he wanted to kill her he'd just redirect her murder weapon right back into her chest.
>She is teenage girl and removing the net of a skilled acrobat is not the same as threatening to destroy a village.
Actually it's a great deal worse because a village of enemy combatants is a much more legitimate target than a teenaged noncombatant on your own side.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>The sheer unreal levels of reality denial of Azula stans is something to behold.
keep repeating it and you will be able to convince someone
> Care for crew = actively threatening to murder crew for small inconvenience
Threatening to murder != murdering.
Making sure your subordinates follow orders is not opposite of caring for them.
>She lured him into a trap with a squad of soldiers, then won, then decided to murder him anyway just because she could >He kicked her into water right beside a fricking pier. You're now telling me she can't swim and he knows that?
She would have shot at his feet to render him immobile. You're now telling me he can't survive a zap in the leg? If my sarcasm escaped you. Since you infer her murderous intent from charging a lightning, fair enough, lightnings kill. You know what also kills? Falling in the water on your back from the height of a battle ship. Falling in the water and tacking involuntary breath of water since you have been just kicked in the solar plexus. Losing conciseness in the water from a high fall and a kick.
>Actually it's a great deal worse because a village of enemy combatants is a much more legitimate target than a teenaged noncombatant on your own side.
She is teenage herself, and the audacity to call a village with the only "male" Sokka a village of enemy combatants is fricking hilarious.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>keep repeating it and you will be able to convince someone
No one who isn't a fricking moron needs convincing of that. This has to be a troll.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Threatening to murder != murdering. >Making sure your subordinates follow orders is not opposite of caring for them
Yes, in fact, diregarding your subordinates lives is, in fact, the literal opposite of caring for them. You moron.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>disregarding your subordinates lives is, in fact, the literal opposite of caring for them. You moron.
Oh I know someone who can do whatever he wants, but decides to sail in to the enemy territory and in doing so disregards his subordinates lives.
1 month ago
Anonymous
The guy who literally kicked out of friendly waters? You serious?
1 month ago
Anonymous
You know fine, it isn't fair. It is not like he can just shave his head and live as a peasant, fine. Also the water tribes are destroyed, so they are not as dangerous. Not as dangerous as the tides at least. You know what is more dangerous? Charging head on the blockade of fricking battleships that can destroy your pathetic boat with a single blast.
1 month ago
Anonymous
None of his crew seemed to have a problem with it.
1 month ago
Anonymous
The captain did not have a problem with pulling the ship in.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Yeah he did, that's why she had to threaten to murder him if he didn't.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>He doesn't threaten his friends with death
Didn't he attack Aang out of the blue during Sozin's Comet for not preparing, even though they had no reason to, forcing Aang to hit him with a semi-serious air blast to get him to stop? And isn't this a redeemed Zuko who a couple of day later is deemed by Iroh to be the Fire Lord the Fire Nation and world needs?
1 month ago
Anonymous
But Aang is the Avatar, he is skilled enough to leave the situation unscathed! wait...
1 month ago
Anonymous
That's literally basic training for fighting a firebender.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>even though they had no reason to
because they decided to procrastinate without telling him.... jfc there's no way you're actually equating this to azula's antics. this is why people are quick to shit on you guys. it's one thing to suggest she had redeemable aspects, but to paint the picture that she's just a female zuko is both dishonest and disservice to a character.
I mean this is the logic applied by the most powerful Azula villifier in a debate he had with me, constantly confusing emotional empathy(feeling anothers emotions) with compassionate empathy(caring about anothers emotions), talking about how a clearly sad face in animation is ambiguous, or how she totally isnt empathizing with Ty Lee here because, umm she could be thinking about her mother for literally no reason, or how psychopaths cant totally care deeply about their parents being proud/happy of them the way Azula is shown.
Also they are a Redditor, with all the stereotypes that come with one (hes a fricking mod on the LoK subreddit ROFL)
>Redditors dont understand nuance
stop the presses. they still are incapable of thinking aang is anything but a perfect jesus expo, frankly you should know better to engage with them
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean the dude said he was a studying for a degree in psychology in one of his comments, as a diagnosed Aspie I must take someone for their word when they claim something as I dont understand why someone would just lie on the internet for no reason.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>because they decided to procrastinate without telling him
True, but he should have told them ASAP instead of assuming they were going to fight Ozai on the day of the Comet. A second genocide in a 100 years is not something to be taken lightly. >jfc there's no way you're actually equating this to azula's antics. this is why people are quick to shit on you guys. it's one thing to suggest she had redeemable aspects, but to paint the picture that she's just a female zuko is both dishonest and disservice to a character.
I never said that Azula is a female Zuko. I think either she has naturally low empathy, though existent, or Zuko is a highly empathetic individual. I just wanted to refute the point that Zuko doesn't threaten his death. And yes, firebending at someone when they are not expecting it, even if they are the Avatar, let alone aggressively firebending at some, is threaten to kill them
1 month ago
Anonymous
>but he should have told them ASAP instead of assuming they were going to fight Ozai on the day of the Comet.
Fair. why he didn't lead with that when he joined is very much peak "zuko not thinking things through" >I just wanted to refute the point that Zuko doesn't threaten his death.
...I just dont think anyone here is arguing otherwise? context is key
1 month ago
Anonymous
Zuko is literally the softest kid Ive ever seen in my life, every other kid Ive met throughout my life whether they were my generation or younger, were all incredibly selfish, petty, narcissistic, self conceited, didnt care about others feelings etc.
Most people I knew acted closer to kid Azula than Zuko ffs, yet people b***h about how Azula acted in the flashbacks despite the fact that outside of the scene where she taunts Zuko about Ozai killing him (and even that scene is overblown, shes not celebrating Ozai killing him, she is just being incredibly tactless by making fun of Zuko for such a serious topic, she wouldnt be going about him getting adopted by an earth kingdom family if it werent), she doesnt do anything worse than kids her age do all the time
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Zuko is literally the softest kid Ive ever seen in my life
1 month ago
Anonymous
I am seriously not exaggerating, the only people that you could claim to have been anywhere near as concerned as Zuko about his conscience, were very obvious sub-100 iq, and I would confidently say very obvious sub-80 iq individuals, and thats mainly obviously because they were too dumb to act in the manner the other kids did, which is really saying something about Zuko
1 month ago
Anonymous
What?
1 month ago
Anonymous
Zuko is like kids with down syndrome.
1 month ago
Anonymous
As someone whose interacted with "that special type" of people for a good chunk of their childhood I dont think that comparison makes any sense at all dude or why you're even bringing him up at all when the topic seemed to be discussing Azula's empathy.
I am sorry if you were bullied as a kid but seven years old dont usually make fun of a close family member losing their son in a war.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean, were they really that close family, the siege of Ba-Sing-Se lasted for 600 days, add on that the time it took for him to surround the city, and the time it took to get to campaign from the Fire Nation, its likely the last time Azula saw Iroh was when she was 4-5 years old.
Plus I dont even think what shes making fun of him is even that bad, shes mocking him for deciding to pussy out due to the death of his son, instead of taking this as an even greater incentive to burn the whole place to the ground as revenge for them killing his son, add on that Ozai feeding her how much Iroh sucks, and yeah I dont see how most people wouldnt react like this.
1 month ago
Anonymous
> Now, Azula is never definitively called a psychopath; however, it is strongly consistent with how the writers approach the character. If you observe the flashbacks to their childhood, there is a consistent contrast between Azula and Zuko: At extremely young ages, Zuko has a strong conscience, and even when it's at its most suppressed, in Book 1, he often struggles with it. Azula just doesn't have that. She is cruel to animals and people alike no matter how far we go back, and we don't actually see direct evidence of her learning this behavior from her parents. There also appears to be something biologically peculiar about Azula. People are normally unable to defeat Toph's lie detection abilities, even if they're skilled liars, because the innate guilt and anxiety over lying leads to fluctuations in heartbeat and breathing that are imperceptible to normal people but truthseers can't miss. In reality, lie detection is a discredited science, but in Avatar, we're clearly meant to think this works. So, the fact that it doesn't work on Azula is significant. It implies she has not merely learned to suppress her guilt but just doesn't have it in the first place. There is no way she could have practiced against Toph's ability because she had just found out about it for the first time. Nothing else about Azula adequately explains all of this. Her upbringing influenced her behavior in certain ways, but this is not mutually exclusive with having psychopathy.
This guys b***hing about why Azula is a psychopath because she doesnt have as strong of a conscience as Zuko does, b***h most kids are buttholes and act much closer to Azula than they do to Zuko, the only difference is that they arent also raised as royalty and taught their entire life that their inherently better than everybody else.
Thats what Im talking about.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Everyone is a bloodthirsty psycho like Azula!
Lol keep coping
1 month ago
Anonymous
I was mainly talking about her behavior in the flashbacks, not her behavior during the main timeline, and how what she does is literally not that far off from how most kids act, and if anything Zuko is the massive outlier
1 month ago
Anonymous
So what you're saying is that you don't have any kids and never will.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Im 22, have never had sex, am aromantic (not in queer sense, I just hate romantic love, and infinitely prefer platonic love), and am incredibly socially awkward.
I am merely speaking from my experience with my classmates, other kids from school, and my younger sisters and brothers generation.
Then again I am from the balkans, former republic of venice part, so maybe Im just biased by the culture I was surrounded by growing up.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Im 22, have never had sex, am aromantic (not in queer sense, I just hate romantic love, and infinitely prefer platonic love), and am incredibly socially awkward.
So you're a literal virgin autist? Explains why you stan Azula and can't grok social interaction or ordinary behavior.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I dont think Azula is a psycho neither, her personality is clearly a case of nurture mostly involved thanks to her father which doesnt mean her behaviour is normal at all.
Oh, and having a breakdown continued with banishing everyone near you just because two childhood friends had enough of your crap seems like something a person with down syndrome would do rather than anything Zuko ever does on-screen.
I mean, were they really that close family, the siege of Ba-Sing-Se lasted for 600 days, add on that the time it took for him to surround the city, and the time it took to get to campaign from the Fire Nation, its likely the last time Azula saw Iroh was when she was 4-5 years old.
Plus I dont even think what shes making fun of him is even that bad, shes mocking him for deciding to pussy out due to the death of his son, instead of taking this as an even greater incentive to burn the whole place to the ground as revenge for them killing his son, add on that Ozai feeding her how much Iroh sucks, and yeah I dont see how most people wouldnt react like this.
>How most people would react to this
I dont know what type of values your family raised you with, but having a laugh about your cousin's let it be distant or not, and his father's sorrow is pretty FRICKED UP in any civilized part of the world.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean, yeah I agree, but the point I was making was that lets say that your dad and his brother had a massive falling out before your birth for whatever reason, and your dad has been telling you the whole time how much that guy sucks, then one day his son dies and your uncle instead of doing something like a father would do, lets say go pick up his sons corpse, instead decides to chicken out and drive to another state/country so he wouldnt have to deal with this.
Would you now laugh at this person who youve been taught sucks balls, and from what little you remember of them does indeed suck balls, for deciding to act like a total pussy.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Agree. If you repeat that a guy is a loser every single day.(which is bad, but oh well) Then doing that again when his son dies does not make you worse.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I would just go on about my day because as a seven year old why would I even give a shit about someone I supossedly barely know in the first place? Nor would I see why would I be making fun about the guy who died in the first place.
Anon, I dont know what mental gymnastics are you proposing here, but Azula is not only further away from Zuko in the terms of behaving a 'normal kid' but by also literally every kid you see on-screen.
Aang was implied to have been bullied as a kid for being the Avatar if I am not mistaken yet he wasnt happy at all when noticing that 99% of the people he knew back then were dead.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Again, this might just be because of the culture where I grew up in, kids were a lot meaner to each other growing up when I was a kid
The captain did not have a problem with pulling the ship in.
That is why I specifically called attention to the fact that I was going to be focusing on their cognitive functions, rather than the letters themselves, since those actually do have some merit behind them from Jungs work, beyond mere horoscopes for the IFLS crowd.
And from there you can clearly tell that their cognition is literally inverse of one another, where they both tend to be defined by the same traits, just in the completely opposite order of significance.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Also, what I meant was that Zuko is WAY too concerned with acting nice in the flashbacks, yes kid Azula is worse than most kids (although Im willing to bet Ive met several kids worse than her), but Zuko is so passive in those flashbacks that the only people Ive known on par were people who were barely passing class with a 1.5 GPA just because the teacher was nice to them.
1 month ago
Anonymous
What the actual frick are you talking about? Zuko acts perfectly normal, he's even playing soldier with his knife.
1 month ago
Anonymous
He cares too much about whether he is doing the right thing or not, and making his mom angry, most kids Ive known tend to disobey their parents all the time, even when very young.
1 month ago
Anonymous
That's a weird correlation you have between the intelligence of someone and feeling empathy, anon.
Im 22, have never had sex, am aromantic (not in queer sense, I just hate romantic love, and infinitely prefer platonic love), and am incredibly socially awkward.
I am merely speaking from my experience with my classmates, other kids from school, and my younger sisters and brothers generation.
Then again I am from the balkans, former republic of venice part, so maybe Im just biased by the culture I was surrounded by growing up.
>Im 22, Have never had sex
GRIM.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Those kids werent more empathetic, but were rather the weak ones out, they were too easily exploitable by the rest of the kids around, that their only survival strategy was to completely go with the whims of others more popular and dominant kids.
1 month ago
Anonymous
I mean ffs, these kids were taunting me for years about me being not liking to talk about liking girls, to the point that the one and only time I decided, as an 11 year old, to spend a night at the beach hanging out with them, they decided to play a truth or dare with me where they were forcing me to either kiss a girl, or drink saltwater, from which I got sick for a few weeks after. They were by far the least empathetic bunch you could ever see.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Actually nevermind, I turned 11 later that year, I was actually 10 years old at the time, and so were most of the kids
What a crusty ass picture.
Couldn't find a better one
She was never a character and obviously she did not love her children because she had them with someone she did not love. Yes, women can be very selfish and awful. Because women, like men, are people. You figured it out dumb ass. Thread over.
>obviously she did not love her children because she had them with someone she did not love.
She killed her father in law to protect her kids dumbass.
>She killed her father in law to protect her kids dumbass.
If it did not happen in the cartoon, it is not canon.
Imagine being this stupid. You didn’t even watch the show.
>She was never a character
The original Nick site said she was born royalty, the perfect match for Ozai, and was concerned with raising her kids into good royals. The abused, theater girl Ursa was a retcon.
>The abused, theater girl Ursa was a retcon.
It isn't retcon. It is fan fiction.
Stupid head
You need to be 18 to post here, Azula.
>Because women, like men, are people
Wrong
*mic drop
Women arent people, what silly notion is this. Theyre half-men.
>Theyre half-men.
>Every woman is half her father
...Son of a b***h.
kinda surprised the comic autist didnt respond to the post with the most replies on this thread
yet
Who?
an anon who'd just spam comics panel in response to ANY reference to the comics.
>she did not love her children because she had them with someone she did not love.
You don't know how motherhood works.
>She was never a character and obviously she did not love her children because she had them with someone she did not love.
Her original character bio said that she was Ozai's perfect match when they first met.
>women, like men, are people
good one
Mai got it pretty bad in the comics too
friendly reminder that gene yang was the fall guy for yet another byrke frick up. they cant write character dynamics to save their lives. the ehasz, o bryan and the rest of the orginal writing team carried those hacks
It was a combined effort. When Ehasz went off on his own it wasn't really that much better than Korra. Ultimately ATLA was lightning in a bottle and the team fracturing basically killed it.
Warren Spector said that no game is created by one person, and the same can be said here. None of them have been able to create an ATLA level success again because no single one of them was the solitary reason behind the success of ATLA.
And every animated show nowdays wants to be either this, Steven Universe, or Gravity Falls.
that's why i also mentioned o bryan, the ehasz's (plural) and the others (should have mentioned josh hamilton).
though in the case of aaron, dragon prince in season 1-3 prior to the writer mutiny easily beats out korra IMO. bad worldbuilding with good characters are far easier to put up with than the reverse.
>Im pretty sure that their takes on her in pic related are them just quoting what notes/drafts Aaron gave them for her character
i believe it. iirc it was stated by a writer that no one else had a real grasp on azula's characterization.
>iirc it was stated by a writer that no one else had a real grasp on azula's characterization
Can you provide me a link to that?
It was mentioned here in one of these threads, i'll look for it on the archive
It was aaron himself who said it, which stills tracks because he clearly understood her the most given how much he changed from azula's initial draft byrke came up with
Okay, yeah I know about that, but Ive heard a guy on the fandom-wiki forums say that this was made by a fake/troll account, so I wonder is this 100% his account or not, I mean I do think it actually is probably true though, as this is what one of the people that worked on the show said about her:
>DOS SANTOS: Who knows, if given the proper circumstances growing up if Azula would have turned out differently or if that was just her inherent nature. I think my big takeaway is that it's an incredibly tragic ending to that specific arc. For Zuko to have to watch his sister reduced to that state of pure feral rage ... again, kids' show. My mind was pretty blown working on it.
Which this does honestly seem to suggest that most of the people working on the show had very little understanding of her character.
it's real. not only is his username/handle the same but most of the tweets in picrel popped right up when i searched the profile. i assume the top middle tweet not popping up is because he probably got sent a CAD because byrke got there panties in a bunch.
https://www.reddit.com/user/ehasz/comments/
Yeah thats definitely Aaron, though the argument by the guy is that because when you search for the comments they dont show up, even though they still should, meaning that theyre fake
> Try to actually go to the comments directly, & you'll find them missing. The way Reddit works, deleted comments still appear on your own profile. That is one of several red flags that they're fake, & also that's asking the wrong question, the right question is where's the proof that they're REAL?
Although, was that comment made 8 years ago, because there are a couple comments at the very end, in a thread talking about ATLA, which say [removed], meaning thats likely where they are and the guy is a moron (I mean that was obvious to me already before)
That's because twitter doesn't load every tweet from profiles with hundreds of tweets, especially anything pre 2015.
>Redditors being moronic
Many such cases.
I mean this same guy unironically tried to convince me that a true psychopath is capable of emotional attachments, and caring about such things as their parents being proud of them, because psychopaths are capable of caring about what other people think of them in a cognitive sense thus this obviously means that Azulas strong attachment and care about her mother and fathers opinions of her totally isnt definitive evidence of her not being a psychopath, according to this guy she MUST show remorse/guilt for her actions in order to not be a psychopath (which she did in The Search at the end) because he is an obvious liberal who believes that not acknowledging the moral principles of western liberal democratic society means you are a psychopath.
>byrke
Did he really ruin ATLA?
>aaron claims the reason season 4 of atla didn't happen despite him being approached by nick for ideas is that byrke pushed for the live action shamalan movie even though shamalan himself insisted that they just do season 4 instead.
IMO yes, as everything since tracks with a lot of what aaron has said. byrke were executive producers on the movie and never let people forget that...
It's on the novelization if I am not mistaken
on whim i decided to look at the writing credits between atla and korra and the difference in quality makes complete sense.
>korra had no head writer, thus no one to overule byrke
>dos santos is the only director from atla who worked on korra, and there were 4 directors who did more than him
>josh hamilton and tim hendrick are the only atla writers who worked on korra, and the most notable episodes they wrote consist of the cave of two lovers, the painted lady, the swamp, lake laogai, sokka's master, the puppetmaster and ember island players among others.
>the following writers didn't work on korra: aaron ehasz, elizabeth welch, john o bryan, may chen, james eagen and 15 different co writers.
>source: IMDB
i want to not shit on the two writers who did stay, as they clearly had to write whatever byrke stuck on the wall, but the fact that they're the reason the puppetmaster, the painted lady and two lovers exist explains so much kek.
>dragon prince in season 1-3 prior to the writer mutiny easily beats out korra IMO
Don't make me remember how much they fumbled the story and characters in these new seasons.
As soon as they promoted the new female head writer,to appease the twitter/tumblr mob who believed in the false accusations against Eshaz,everything went to shit.
She was able to completely make Rayla,what was the favorite character of the fandom,to one of the most hated one's just because she wanted her to be always forgiven no matter what she does or how she act's so she could live her fantasy of being always right and forgiven
i really do have to get around to watching dragon prince... did they at least get rid of this writer for season 6? i can just head cannon 4/5 out of existence
Season 6 is still not out and there is no date since it seems Netflix is postponing it's release date for some reasons especially since it was already done in September.
Some say that it is because they have problems with the apparently change of rating and the maturity of season 6 and 7.
Regarding the head writer she is still there and she will remain for all of this series since the writing is already done for the last two seasons and they even maybe already done all voice recording
We just have to hope that the writing improve in these last two seasons since they are finally done with the presentation of the time skip and start of the new plot.
Already season 5 was way better than season 4 and had already better animation,which season 6 seems that it improved it even more if the spoilers from the first ep are true,but it still had some problems that didn't let it be as enjoyable as the first three seasons so let's hope the trend continues and these last two seasons are actually good
I mean the main problem of Korra, that remained constant throughout the whole series, was the underwhelming characterization and character dynamics of the main cast, the ONLY character that is on par with the ATLA main cast (Aang, Katara, Sokka, Toph, Zuko, Iroh)+Azula is Tenzin, everyone else remains extremely one-dimensional and uninteresting for the rest of the show, Korra does get a little bit better in season 4 due to the whole PTSD thing, but was a too little, too late and wasnt even executed that well.
It is obvious beyond belief to anyone that pays attention that whilst Bryke are definitely good at worldbuilding, they are beyond terrible when it comes to actually writing characters and if it werent for Aaron fixing Toph and Irohs characterizations, and writing most of Zukos character arc, and also clearly being the driving force behind making Azula an actual complex character, just taking those things away makes it blatantly clear that without him and several others the show would have been no better than your average Saturday morning Nickelodeon show post-2000, whichbis exactly what LoK ended up becoming, despite all its attempts to tackle more mature topics, it never reached the heart and soul that ATLA managed, and on the maturity part, nothing in LoK comes close to this quote
>Sozin was just as much Fire Nation as Roku was, if anything their story proves that anyone is capable of both great good and great evil.
Hitting at the heart of eastern philosophy the show is based upon, and the nature of Yin and Yang “In good there is evil, in evil there is good”
Fully agree anon. ATLA is a case study on how great execution is just as if not more important than a great inital premise.
>the ONLY character that is on par with the ATLA main cast (Aang, Katara, Sokka, Toph, Zuko, Iroh)+Azula is Tenzin
And Lin.
Maybe but
Tbh toph was better for toph.
Toph was better for Zuko* god damn it
Zuko should have married and procreated with an Earth Kingdom girl. Nothing would be a bigger "frick you" to Ozai than having an Earth Bender be the next Fire Lord.
How many wives can zuko have?
Would empress toph get mad?
That would get him killed by basically all the nobility.
He should be plowing Jin, anyway.
>He should be plowing Jin, anyway.
Why do people think Jin would be good for Zuko when she only briefly interacted with "Lee"? Is it because she considered to be is hotter than Mai?
>to be is hotter than Mai
Grim.
Because Jin was a well-adjusted girl who knew how to have fun which balances Zuko out nicely and even brought out some of his sentimental side. Mai is a depressed, gloomy woman and when paired with Zuko, a depressed, gloomy pessimist they are an actual black hole of charisma.
they should have tried to balance Zuko's gloom with Ty Lee's cheerfulness. Mai just brings out more angst
im in the anyone but mai camp, but yes this was the obvious decision if it has to be a fire nation girl. some times i really do think byrke paired zukp with mai out of spite. she's literally the worst option for him
>Basically the same height as Azula compared to Zuko
Jin is about 5'
Sorry, Jin is taken.
why are you posting a set where jin is forced to deepthroat zuko tho
The only people who make it out of the comic virtually unscathed are Aang and Sokka
Aang became a genocide enjoyer and Sokka was quite irrelevant through it all
>byrke not derailing any male without making their insert right challenge: impossible
dont even get me started on what they did to roku
I've honestly never seen anything good from the comics. I dropped them early on, a decision I don't regret.
>Name a bigger character assassination
Azula in the comics
How exactly?
Its not explicitly stated, but its heavily implied by Ozai that she killed Azulon in the show
All depth is stripped from her character, she's just a crazy b***h
Also Zuko got done pretty dirty with how he treated her
I mean, The Search had 2 good scenes with her, the one where shes second guessing herself about the throne being her destiny, and the whole part with her confronting Zuko and Ursa was pretty great.
Plus her most recent comic is pretty, it asserts a lot of the things about her character that were previously mostly hinted at, and leaves her off in a much better position than before.
*pretty good
>character
She had like 3 seconds of screentime.
>Azula
>depth
Lol. She is an one-dimensional villain. The writers tried to rush and give her some flaws in the last couple of episodes.
Yeah, and then there is this moron, who insists she is a psychopath based on her being a one-dimensional villain at the beginning, and refuses to accept that maybe Bryke were morons, just like they were for many other things, who didnt listen to Aarons pleas about how making Azula more flawed earlier on, to set up her possible redemption would make for a great story, until Book 3 when they finally listened to him.
“If they don’t want to say things outright, but they still want it to be interpreted a certain way, they have to be very careful to frame things so that it actually comes across that way. A couple half-assed reactions in a single episode or two isn’t going to change how people interpret the whole character based on the rest of the context, & if the writers really expected it to, I’m honestly very disappointed in them. I will continue to think they’re better than that until when & if there’s so much evidence to the contrary that I can no longer extend that charitability.“
i dont think it was just aaron calling them out for being morons, but yea byrke not noing how multifaceted characterization works isn’t anything new.
I mean based on how they talked about her in their commentaries for season 2, or their interview in 2007 before season 3 came out, Im pretty sure that their takes on her in pic related are them just quoting what notes/drafts Aaron gave them for her character
>Its not explicitly stated, but its heavily implied by Ozai that she killed Azulon in the show
nope
Genuinely have you ever watched the show
Even as a kid, long before I was even aware the comics existed, I caught the implications clearly
I saw it when it came out, people thought that Ozai had killed his father and killed/exiled his wife for opposing it.
>she killed Azulon in the show
This.
It was also HEAVILY implied earlier in the show that either Ozai backstabbed & blamed her, or he made it clear beforehand that if she did it it was her funeral, either way she fricking died.
Then Bryke & DiMartino pussied out, or possibly Nickelodeon forced them to censor out the mother murder, (see also: Jet) and she was clumsily retconned to be cucking Ozai or something. Weakest plot point in the show IMO and very deservedly swept under the carpet, and one of many reasons to ignore the comics.
Azula in the Netflix show
korrasami
Flanders
Talia Al Ghul
Who's ikem
I'm just waiting for them to declare the comics not canon
If they did that, what would be the one thing they'd keep that'd cause the funniest reaction and/or most butthurt? Mai cucking Zuko? Smokebending? Forklift?
>Smokebending?
The frick is smokebending? Is that a subset of airbending?
No, villains use smoke bombs and morons think it's magic.
>The frick is smokebending? Is that a subset of airbending?
>No, villains use smoke bombs and morons think it's magic.
Smokebending appears to be a subset of firebending. How can you explain shit like smoke coming out of Azula while she is generating lightning otherwise?
Azula and Aang's kid should be a smokebender.
>Azula and Aang's kid should be a smokebender.
So you are saying their kid would be firebender then?
if anything, fire x water would make for hot steamy sex
Fire Lady Dowager
https//archiveofourownorg/works/29222730?view_full_work=true
Or some kind of half-breed or mutation since Aang is both an airbender and the Avatar. Probably it would just be one of their many kids.
>Azula x Aang
What the actual frick?
Its unsarcastically 10x better than Kataang in this fic
As for canon timeline, other than Azula potentially crushing on Aang due to him being the most powerful bender around, its just just a crackship
kino
posting the superior firelady crackship
>anything involving mai
>superior
Yeah, nah. She was trash in the show and made even worse in the comics.
She contributes nothing to azula's team that ty lee doesn't do 10x better, she has the worst chemistry with zuko out of all the girls he interacts with, and overall has a shitty personality.
Should have replaced her character with june.
>How can you explain shit like smoke coming out of Azula while she is generating lightning otherwise?
>Says smokebending is really Azula and her goons using sleigh of hand and smokebombs even though their hands are occupied and no character ever comments on them using smoke bombs.
>she's firebending out of her ass to produce the smoke duh
I think smokebending is the precusor to true psychic firebending, unlike combustionbending, and think Azula learning how to psychically firebend is how she'll remain a threat to the adult Gaang when she eventually confronts them in a show or movie.
>even though their hands are occupied
The switch is controlled by sphincter.
>no character ever comments on them using smoke bombs
Why would they need to?
>The switch is controlled by sphincter.
Ah. I see now that you are just messing around trying to cope with the comics fricking with the bending system. It's fine, I don't like it either, but Bryke decided to keep them canon.
>Why would they need to?
If they were smokebombs, then why wouldn't Aang for example quickly disarm the Fire Warriors instead of letting himself get knocked out and need saving from Mai and Kei Lo?
>Ah. I see now that you are just messing around trying to cope with the comics fricking with the bending system.
Not really. You are just being a bit autistic. The comics have far worse things than fricking smoke.
I don't see it as a fire bending or bending in general. They are posing as ghosts, and the smoke, which appears only when they are in costumes (right?), is part of the facade and the clothes. They just stuck smoke bombs under the cape. They don't need to do anything because smoke bombs work automatically.
>why wouldn't Aang for example quickly disarm the Fire Warriors instead of letting himself get knocked out and need saving from Mai and Kei Lo?
The pic? He just took a breath at the wrong time.
>They are posing as ghosts, and the smoke, which appears only when they are in costumes (right?), is part of the facade and the clothes. They just stuck smoke bombs under the cape. They don't need to do anything because smoke bombs work automatically.
We see the inside of their cloaks and there are no bombs, nor are, or at least Azula, is carrying a belt of bombs.
You can only see the legs in this image
>You can only see the legs in this image
You can see a part of the inside of the cloak. The outside of the cloak is a sleek black while part of the inside of the cloak is gray with lines inside of it.
>None of azula’s soldiers who use smoke in smoke in shadow use it in the next comic. Neither does Azula.
Zuko does capture some of the Fire Warriors and (probably) learned of smokebending from interrogating them. If Azula or the remaining Fire Warriors use smokebending, it would instantly alter everyone to their true identities. And considering the Fire Warriors don't want to actually hurt anyone, only help the Fire Nation's downtoddern, I don't think they would want to start a true life or death fight.
>>How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho?
>They activate it when no one sees it, between panels
>>And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs?
>so that there is mystery and mystisism.
Zuko has every incentive to not allow Azula escape and she is within his line of sight the entire time during the Catacombs talk. Yet, if she is using a smokebomb, Zuko allowed her to use in front of him and escape because...? Whereas if it is smokebending, then it makes sense why she was able to activitate without Zuko being unable to do anything about it: he doesn't know how to smokebend himself.
Also, considering Bryke said the comics are canon subject to minor revisions, and we don't see Azula use smokebending or her advanced lightning techs in her comic, I think they are going to ignore most of Azula's bending feats in the comics so non-comic readers aren't caught off guard by Azula's absurd jump in power and skill.
>You can see a part of the inside of the cloak.
Yes, only the part that corresponds to the legs.
They have much more space to hide a bomb
.> Zuko allowed her to use in front of him and escape because...?
He didn't know they had bombs and she was always faster than him.
>They have much more space to hide a bomb
But where tho if not on the bottom part of their cloak or on a belt tied to their waists. ATLA takes place in the rough equivalent of the 19th century; their smoke bombs are going to be relatively big, especially considering how much smoke they make even when not fighting.
>He didn't know they had bombs and she was always faster than him.
I agree on the always faster than him part, but he already experienced her using smoke on him and others before, yet he never mentions the possibility of them using smoke bombs, or trying to come up with countermeasures, because?
>I think they are going to ignore most of Azula's bending feats in the comics so non-comic readers aren't caught off guard by Azula's absurd jump in power and skill.
>byrke not powercreeping for the frick of it.
i'll believe it when i see
not powercreeping for the frick of it.
>i'll believe it when i see
But how they can powercreep Azula without using her genetics as an excuse for why other firebenders can't copy her abilities or having the Gaang kill after she mostly succeeds in her scheme? Because all that's left imo is for her to make her instant lightning lethal and/or learn pyschic firebending, both of which would make her a deadly threat to an adult Gaang.
None of azula’s soldiers who use smoke in smoke in shadow use it in the next comic. Neither does Azula.
>How can you explain shit like smoke coming out of Azula while she is generating lightning otherwise?
she's firebending out of her ass to produce the smoke duh
literally a smoke bomb
>literally a smoke bomb
How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho? And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs?
>How can she use a smokebomb when her hands are occupied tho?
They activate it when no one sees it, between panels
>And why does the comic never imply or show them using such bombs?
so that there is mystery and mystisism.
Mai, easily.
she’d have to had a character to assassinate it anon
comics are not canon
>Name a bigger character assassination
Azula's mental breakdown.
even if show ursa was mostly prompted up by fanon and headcanon i still find it funny how despite the writers going out of their way to make ursa seem sympathetic most fans ended up hating her
posting more old comics
Maybe if I gouge my eyes out I would have a better chance of reading these
maybe i'm moronic but I don't get what this comic is trying to say what happened to her
I honestly thought that it was implying that its implying that Ursa transitioned into Ozai, and that the reason “Ozai” is laughing at the end is because thats actually Ursa
how deep
Anyway, have any good ATLA Fanfiction?
Distorted Reality
There was this fanfic I read that had Ursa end up in the Water Tribes and Kya end up in the Fire Nation, Ursa marries Hakoda and Kya marries Ozai. I can't find it though.
LOK, though I wouldnt call it good
Legend of Korra is just the most expensive fan fiction of all time
>LOK
Ew
Burn The World Down is pretty good if you're fine with smut and a villain SI protagonist.
The Alliance is a good one.
Azula made me so sad when I rewatched the show recently. It seems like she was supposed to be a parallel to Toph - Yin pretending to be Yang vs Yang pretending to be Yin - but man was that nowhere to be seen in Season 2. It's like how Katara flips between hardcore and nag at will, but without the human side entirely.
>Azula made me so sad when I rewatched the show recently.
Me too.
>it seems like she was supposed to be a parallel to Toph - Yin pretending to be Yang vs Yang pretending to be Yin
Elaborate please, I can't really decipher your message
>in Season 2
whatever it is, she has too little screen time. Despite that, and her role as a villain, she still manages to show a lot off human-like characteristics.
Choosing to forget your own children is repulsive.
that's kinda hot
kino
She should grab her chin and make the girl watch her in the eyes.
The more they build on Ursa, ironically the worse a mother she becomes.
>5' vs 6'2"
>the whole time in ATLA azula was just an angry femlet femcel
it all makes sense now
Ozai and Ursa are tall, aren't they?
You are forgetting that she is only 14.
I'm aware, but all the main recurring cast members of ATLA are small. Zuko is the tallest at 5'3", Iroh is 5'1 or 5'2" and so is Sokka.
>Ozai and Ursa are tall, aren't they?
I'm gonna guess Ozai is about 6', not much more. A good comparison shot would be great.
>Iroh is a manlet compared to his brother
Why's that?
Because he doesnt have a Z in his name, he didnt inherit the ability to grow vertically, but instead only horizontally
I think Azula is the shortest person in the room in nearly every scene she's in except when facing Aang or Toph tho.
Azula is taller than Katara for sure, Ive seen the rule34 models
>rule34 models
I would say Mrpotatoparty is the most accurate to an extent.
Because shortness = weak, resentful, treacherous.
Take from that whatever you want.
you're talking about the guy whose constantly willing to take care of other men's kids.
we dont know anything about his supossed wife either.
Kinda shitty comparison shot, but Ozai is seemingly about 6'3"
just so we're clear, these are all guestimates right?
Confirmed:
-Korra at 5'7"
-Mako at 6'2"
The ATLA crew has this height chart from production
Beyond that, most of the stuff is guestimates
azula is only 14 so she might have a growth spurt. it is actually over for zuko though
>girl
>14
>growth spurt
???
I mean, girls do tend to enter puberty 2 years before boys do, so maybe theyll both grow to be about as tall as eachother
Old man Zuko in Korra is a bit taller than Korra, might be 6'
That logic could apply to nearly everyone from the main cast despite the fact that they're growing teenagers
>the fire nation lost to a bunch of gnomes
GRIM
lmao
>casually manhandling a bratty 5 ft tall azula during the eclipse
the reason toph exists is due to higher ups at nick
?
They truly do ruin everything.
toph and raven gave me foot fetish...
ain't fair
Foot fetish from TLA? I have no idea how that could have happened.
hng
how did they get away with this
>how did they get away with this
It fricking Nick anon. I'm surprised they didn't add in more foot shots to be quite honest.
i was same age as toph and her just...doing kung fu and stomping did something to me.
i wanted to clean them and put them on my face.
Mommy Ursa = goat
Frick off
frick you homosexual
Weren't you banned for posting porn? Why don't you go get your hand pregnant and stop shitting up this thread
woah
Boop
Azula herself, in show. The cold, rigorous Azula we met in season two would have just killed her "friends" after they betrayed her and moved one without a second thought, like sociopath she clearly was.
Yes, because having our 2 main villains be basically the exact same character would have been such a great decision.
The only mistake with Azulas character was not showing us the cracks in her armor earlier, which was most likely due to Bryke being morons and not listening to Aaron until season 3
>NOOOOOO Azula can't just take after her father she has to be the poor misunderstand victim NOOOOO
Disgusting.
I never said that, what I said was that having Ozai and Azula basically be the exact character is simply redundant, it adds nothing to the story, and if anything only detracts from Ozai as a threat even more, because there is really no way to distinguish him from Azula, who we were introduced to first.
And who ever said that Azula was just a misunderstood victim or whatever, she is both a victim and an abuser, she ultimately decided by her own actions to choose to go down a dark path, instead of her just being born that way.
If anything having her just be born that way makes her actually less evil, because you cant judge her as culpable for her actions as you otherwise could if she was a result of both nature and nurture, because she was simply acting according to her nature, there was no choosing the dark, or making the wrong choices in life with her anymore, because she could of only ever made one choice which we happen to judge as evil.
Would a praying mantis be judged as evil for eating its partners after sex, even though thats just as natural to them as seeking a life-long partner is to you, no of course, thus in the same vein making Azulas behavior just be a result of her nature, and almost nothing to do with her nurture suddenly just makes her not evil.
I know that you have a boner evil villainesses, and you Azula to remain just that instead of being a more complex character, but I want you to ask yourself, what do you think makes for a better story, in particular when it comes to ATLA.
A pure evil villainess, with zero complexities beyond being a perfectionist and wanting to please her dad, and who the only things she ever does is by a obstacle to our heroes, and look hot whilst it.
Or a villainess who explores the less bright and optimistic aspects of the struggle between good and evil, where someones soul and spirit is so immensely corrupted by hatred and jealousy, that the only piece of light and goodness within her is in cont.
Cont. the fact how that hatred is based upon a wrongdoing that never was, thus ones whole reasoning and justification for ones actions in this regard comes crumbling down, and we see this person eventually come to terms with the fact that the cause of their misery and pain was their own choices and mistakes in life, where they are able to restore some of the light within their soul, and come to peace with their past, but are will ultimately remain forever scared for the rest of their lives.
Basically, showing that indeed “Anyone is capable of both great good and great evil”.
But of course, a liberal, or abrahamic would never be able to possess such nuance towards good and evil, where one is always found within the other, no instead evil is evil, and good is good, because we care so much about the concept of universal justice, and dividing the world into obviously good and obviously bad people because that makes things simpler for ourselves and justifies us whenever we need to punish anyone who dares question our preconceived assumptions about life.
>Would a praying mantis be judged as evil for eating its partners after sex,
They don't actually do that in their natural environment though.
Okay then, would a lion be judged as evil for killing its rival cubs
>inb4 the mothers protect them
Yes because its in their nature to want to protect their offspring, just like it is in the male lions nature to kill any rival offspring, their actions cannot be judged as evil though.
Assuming the lion was sapient and capable of self-reflection, yes. You can be an unfeeling sociopath and still decide to abide by the moral norms of society.
??? Why though, there is no such thing as objective morality in a world where there is no such thing as the ultimate consequence for deciding to do one thing instead of the other.
The only moral systems that work are, ordered from the system with the weakest metaphysical understanding, to the highest:
1.egoism-the only thing that is right are things that satisfy the ego, the reason you care for others is because you want to, not because there is any moral law stating you must
2.negative utilitarianism-suffering is all that matters, a perfect life with no suffering is the equivalent of non-existence by either never being born, or by death
3.non-dualism-there is no such thing as separateness of things, all things are just aspects of a greater singular unity, consciousness is a self-aware screen that does not begin with birth, nor end with death, and is the only possible source of identity, meaning that YOU are everyone at all times, all the pleasures, all the pains in all of existence, YOU will experience all of them, this means that preventing a birth, or death do not achieve the absolute nothingness and prevention of suffering that is expected, meaning that life is worth continuing or worth starting if it is going to have more no suffering states, than suffering states, as there is no such thing as non-existence. This also means that since YOU are everyone at all times, hurting another is hurting yourself, thus in an egoist sense, the right course of action is that which generates as much happiness as possible, and whilst minimizing the suffering.
As you can see, none of these moral systems are anything alike the moral system of western liberal democracy, since unlike that, these moral systems dont rely on social constructs or “spooks”, but instead on actual epistemologically and metaphysically provable facts.
> there is no such thing as objective morality
That is it.
Nah, she's crazy and she needs to go down.
>NOOOOOO Azula can't just take after her father she has to be the poor misunderstand victim NOOOOO
That is not the point.
First of all, she clearly isn't just psychopath, because otherwise we wouldn't have this tread over and over again. See how no one tries to defend Ozai?
Second, the problem with Azula's characterization is that it was not finished. You concentrate on a few cases when she displays "evil behavior". Others concentrate on her human side and all the mistreatment she got. The problem is there is no distinctive answer given by the show, which one it actually is.
She is, at least in my opinion very similar to 1st season Zuko, only more capable. And while Zuko gets the help of an uncle and multiple chance to redeem himself, he still manages to blew some of them. Azula on the other hand, doesn't get even one. How can you make a statement about her psychopathy when you can't juxtapose her actions?
Im going to use a bit of a cringe terminology here, although there definite merit in its parts, and thats Zuko and Azulas base personality based upon MBTI.
Now Zuko is most likely an ISFx, I cant decide whether he would be judging or prospecting, Ive seen others put him as and ISFP, but struggle to see how he doesnt follow rules, or a strict schedule, but it doesnt matter.
Azula is most likely an xNTJ, its kind of difficult to say whether she is an extrovert or an introvert, but I the most likely answer to that is shes somewhere inbetween so an ambivert, otherwise Ive seen her classed as an ENTJ, and think that makes sensr for her.
Now the part that actually matters for this, are the cognitive functions, as thats the part that is actually somwhat scientific and its what Jung was talking about.
So for Zuko, his functions would be
1.Fi
2.Se
3.Ni
4.Te
And for Azula, her functions would be
1.Te
2.Ni
3.Se
4.Fi
I dont wanna bother going into too much detail, but what this means is that Zuko is a lot more value/moral based, and thinks in a lot more practical/grounded terms, he struggles with abstract thinking, and cares a lot about upholding said values to himself.
Azula on other hand, is a lot more logic/reason based, she thinks in creative/abstract terms, she has very good abstract intelligence, and cares a lot about having her thoughts and opinions be expressed and asserted to others.
This means that even if lets say Zuko was the prodigy and Azula was average, they would not act the same even if morals were shifted, where Azula values Ursa, and Zuko values Ozai, Zuko would promote his fathers worldview in a very emotional/passionate manner, and would be acting like, well apparently Louis XVII of France, aka the guy who was killed during the french revolution, whereas Azula would be upholding her mothers values in much more controlled but extremely committed manner, and would basically be committing her life to spite her father, and honor her mother.
It certainly is interesting and it does makes some sense. btw, when I said they are similar I didn't mean it like that, I meant their views and relationship with the rest of the world.
Ok, I get that.
But honestly, Ive been thinking for the last 10-20 minutes, about a potential AU, where Zuko was the prodigious and favored son, whereas Azula was the average embarrassment who Ursa took under her wing, and it honestly sounds very interesting, because it wouldnt be just a retelling of the original, as I believe that when Azula got banished by Ozai, she would go and try to find the Avatar just like Zuko did, but instead of doing it with the goal of restoring her honor in the face of her father, she would instead do it with the intent to team up with the Avatar to defeat her father, and basically book 1 Azula would tell Aang in the pilot that she intends to join forces with him, but must keep it secret from everyone but her uncle, as otherwise they would be labeled as traitors and lose all their potential privileges from being Fire Nation, even if limited, but Aang with the advice of Katara and Sokka wouldnt know whether to trust Azula, so the rest of book 1 would be a lot about Azula unsuccessfully trying to earn Aangs trust, until when book 2 begins, and Zuko is sent by Ozai to capture/kill Azula and Iroh, Azula would figure out that Zuko is lying to her, and even if he werent she would never want to return to her father, but goes along so that her and Iroh are officially labeled as traitors so that she would have an easier time getting Aang to trust her, and from there you can write pretty much anything you want, though I would suggest keeping an Azula Alone episode in there, to give an insight into Azulas attachment to her mother.
Nice.
What if she and Zuko were raised in a Sokka and Katara environment?No royalty, just a normal peasant
Thats just Distorted Reality, although thats a not full on AU, since Aang is from the original timeline, where they failed at Sozins comet 3 years into the future, so hes 16 years old mentally, but back in a 12 year olds body [SPOILER] Also Azula develops a crush on Aang, and the ship is significantly better than Kataang, or any canon ship [/spoiler]
Frick, first time spoiler fail
Is it accurate to their personalities?
Aang is a lot more jaded and serious than in the original due the whole 3 years of watching your allies and world be destroyed and left in ruin, to the point where he wants to kill Ozai and Azula out of revenge, which kickstarts the whole AU
And Azula is pretty much exactly how you would think she would be (unless you think shes a psychopath, but if you think that youre an idiot), if she had a normal childhood, with a loving mother and father, she is still incredibly mean, ruse, condescending, scheming, merciless to her enemies, lies to her enemies (not friends) to get what she wants, incredibly intelligent, and highly competitive.
The only times she acts differently are after she develops her crush around Aang, she acts incredibly awkwardly and sheepishly around him, as she doesnt know how to win his affection, or when she is jealous of Toph after she learns Aang and her were friends in the OG timeline, she starts acting incredibly petty and hostile towards her, though I guess that is in character aswell.
>disorted reality
No, not really.
The frick are you even implying dude...
Interesting
explain this terminology to me like im moronic
Just look up, mbti types and mbti cognitive functions, and go into images, or read up on it on some sites.
Actually, I will provide a link here
https://wiki.personality-database.com/books/jungian-derivatives
meyers-briggs is horoscopes for the I HECKIN HEART SCIENCE crowd
Dude it is literally:
-Are you extroverted?
-Yes.
-You are extroverted.
>She is, at least in my opinion very similar to 1st season Zuko
First season Zuko risks his life to save a member of his crew, and then rejects the chance to chase the avatar first to spare his crew, then to save his uncle. Azula's very first action is threatening to murder her crew if they minorly inconvenience her. Her next is to try and murder Zuko in cold blood, when he went out of his way to try and save even Zhao. Then she threatens her supposed friend with death in order to enslave her.
Like season 1 Zuko my ass
Azula stans really do have a terminal case of headcannon
Yes. Case in point.
Okay, which statement is incorrect?
Literally all of them.
So according to you:
>threatening someone with a murder
is the opposite to
>saving someone
According to you Azula did not try to lure Iroh and Zuko on the ship with deception.
According to you Zuko doesn't threaten the village in order to capture the Avatar.
Good job Zuko stan!
I mean this is the logic applied by the most powerful Azula villifier in a debate he had with me, constantly confusing emotional empathy(feeling anothers emotions) with compassionate empathy(caring about anothers emotions), talking about how a clearly sad face in animation is ambiguous, or how she totally isnt empathizing with Ty Lee here because, umm she could be thinking about her mother for literally no reason, or how psychopaths cant totally care deeply about their parents being proud/happy of them the way Azula is shown.
Also they are a Redditor, with all the stereotypes that come with one (hes a fricking mod on the LoK subreddit ROFL)
https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/15HMqaUVJWaFcFxPdanWRPZIqDXilLky0iU4Mp3aIQ5U/mobilebasic?pli=1
>Also they are a Redditor
Who
Im not going to call names, but if you go through the thread, and the following comments, I think there is possibility that you would be able to piece together who they are
One bit of help I will give is that they have the same username on the fandom-wiki forums, and reddit
>I'm the anon in most these replies
oh you're talking about the guy you mentioned earlier. yeah, i went back and looked and your not wrong, though like i said:
>redditors being moronic
many such cases
Aaron?
No? Why would it be Aaron, his opinion on Azula is absolutely based, to the point this guy refuses to acknowledge his opinion as meaning anything because he doesnt work on the series anymore, despite Bryke changing their tunes about Azula very clearly after they decided to look at what Aaron had to offer to him.
IDK then
I dont want to namecall the dude, since he b***hed to me about my “bad manner” or whatever in the google doc (you can just look into it and see, at the end of the second and third chapters), so I dont want to give him any more food by namecalling him
Is the google doc his work?
Yes it is
>One bit of help I will give is that they have the same username on the fandom-wiki forums, and reddit
Isn't the guy who wrote a whole war crimes google doc that got roasted on her and on tumblr?
I dont know show me
>Not knowing who BahamutLithp is
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLastAirbender/comments/nncgpg/avatar_war_crime_analysis/
Yep, thats the guy
>Isn't the guy who wrote a whole war crimes google doc that got roasted on her and on tumblr?
???????????????????????????????????
Who's her?
>I think there is possibility that you would be able to piece together who they are
I am out of the loop, who is it?
someone with a murder
>is the opposite to
someone
Yes, and if you are genuinely too moronic to see that then you unironically should be locked in a padded cell forever. Just like Azula.
Azula vilifiers on the other hand have a terminal case of armchair psychology, where a villain acting like a villain immediately makes them a psychopath, and any future evidence to the contrary is to be either ignored, or reinterpreted via bullshit ulterior motives
I mean your not wrong but surely there has to a balanced take between "she's evil incarnate" and "she's no different from zuko"
I mean there is, and its the one I and most Azula defenders on the internet seem to take, Ive honestly seen way more of the former than the latter.
>First season Zuko risks his life to save a member of his crew
>Azula's very first action is threatening to murder her crew if they minorly inconvenience her
This are not similar situations.
>Her next is to try and murder Zuko in cold blood
Her next is to try and bring them home without any fights and murders, before "cough cough" captain blew it.
>Then she threatens her supposed friend with death in order to enslave her.
Zuko threatens with death in order to enslave Avatar.
>This are not similar situations.
Yeah, Azula had nothing urgent at all propelling her forward, she just didn't want to wait slightly longer and was willing to murder a guy over it.
>Her next is to try and bring them home without any fights and murders, before "cough cough" captain blew it.
She had him down for the count and decided to murder him with lightning. Contrast Zuko's behavior with Zhao in episode fricking three.
>Zuko threatens with death in order to enslave Avatar.
He doesn't threaten his friends with death or going around conscripting teenaged girls.
>Yeah, Azula had nothing urgent at all propelling her forward, she just didn't want to wait slightly longer and was willing to murder a guy over it.
Whatever? Making sure your subordinates follow orders is bad. If she did kill him, that would be another story. You are making such a big deal out of it because?
>She had him down for the count and decided to murder him with lightning. Contrast Zuko's behavior with Zhao in episode fricking three.
They were fighting, each blow is deadly, so what? Yes Zuko stoped during Agni Kai, since he won and doesn't have balls to kill, but this wasn't a honor duel, it was a fight. Btw, Iroh had her down for the count and decided to murder her by drowning.
>He doesn't threaten his friends with death or going around conscripting teenaged girls.
She is teenage girl and removing the net of a skilled acrobat is not the same as threatening to destroy a village.
>Whatever? Making sure your subordinates follow orders is bad. If she did kill him, that would be another story. You are making such a big deal out of it because?
The sheer unreal levels of reality denial of Azula stans is something to behold. Care for crew = actively threatening to murder crew for small inconvenience, as long as it's precious little Azula doing it uwu.
>They were fighting, each blow is deadly, so what? Yes Zuko stoped during Agni Kai, since he won and doesn't have balls to kill, but this wasn't a honor duel, it was a fight.
She lured him into a trap with a squad of soldiers, then won, then decided to murder him anyway just because she could. The fact that you are claiming this as being the same as season 1 Zuko only shows how insane you have to be to stan Azula.
> Btw, Iroh had her down for the count and decided to murder her by drowning.
He kicked her into water right beside a fricking pier. You're now telling me she can't swim and he knows that? If he wanted to kill her he'd just redirect her murder weapon right back into her chest.
>She is teenage girl and removing the net of a skilled acrobat is not the same as threatening to destroy a village.
Actually it's a great deal worse because a village of enemy combatants is a much more legitimate target than a teenaged noncombatant on your own side.
>The sheer unreal levels of reality denial of Azula stans is something to behold.
keep repeating it and you will be able to convince someone
> Care for crew = actively threatening to murder crew for small inconvenience
Threatening to murder != murdering.
Making sure your subordinates follow orders is not opposite of caring for them.
>She lured him into a trap with a squad of soldiers, then won, then decided to murder him anyway just because she could
>He kicked her into water right beside a fricking pier. You're now telling me she can't swim and he knows that?
She would have shot at his feet to render him immobile. You're now telling me he can't survive a zap in the leg?
If my sarcasm escaped you. Since you infer her murderous intent from charging a lightning, fair enough, lightnings kill. You know what also kills? Falling in the water on your back from the height of a battle ship. Falling in the water and tacking involuntary breath of water since you have been just kicked in the solar plexus. Losing conciseness in the water from a high fall and a kick.
>Actually it's a great deal worse because a village of enemy combatants is a much more legitimate target than a teenaged noncombatant on your own side.
She is teenage herself, and the audacity to call a village with the only "male" Sokka a village of enemy combatants is fricking hilarious.
>keep repeating it and you will be able to convince someone
No one who isn't a fricking moron needs convincing of that. This has to be a troll.
>Threatening to murder != murdering.
>Making sure your subordinates follow orders is not opposite of caring for them
Yes, in fact, diregarding your subordinates lives is, in fact, the literal opposite of caring for them. You moron.
>disregarding your subordinates lives is, in fact, the literal opposite of caring for them. You moron.
Oh I know someone who can do whatever he wants, but decides to sail in to the enemy territory and in doing so disregards his subordinates lives.
The guy who literally kicked out of friendly waters? You serious?
You know fine, it isn't fair. It is not like he can just shave his head and live as a peasant, fine. Also the water tribes are destroyed, so they are not as dangerous. Not as dangerous as the tides at least. You know what is more dangerous? Charging head on the blockade of fricking battleships that can destroy your pathetic boat with a single blast.
None of his crew seemed to have a problem with it.
The captain did not have a problem with pulling the ship in.
Yeah he did, that's why she had to threaten to murder him if he didn't.
>He doesn't threaten his friends with death
Didn't he attack Aang out of the blue during Sozin's Comet for not preparing, even though they had no reason to, forcing Aang to hit him with a semi-serious air blast to get him to stop? And isn't this a redeemed Zuko who a couple of day later is deemed by Iroh to be the Fire Lord the Fire Nation and world needs?
But Aang is the Avatar, he is skilled enough to leave the situation unscathed! wait...
That's literally basic training for fighting a firebender.
>even though they had no reason to
because they decided to procrastinate without telling him.... jfc there's no way you're actually equating this to azula's antics. this is why people are quick to shit on you guys. it's one thing to suggest she had redeemable aspects, but to paint the picture that she's just a female zuko is both dishonest and disservice to a character.
>Redditors dont understand nuance
stop the presses. they still are incapable of thinking aang is anything but a perfect jesus expo, frankly you should know better to engage with them
I mean the dude said he was a studying for a degree in psychology in one of his comments, as a diagnosed Aspie I must take someone for their word when they claim something as I dont understand why someone would just lie on the internet for no reason.
>because they decided to procrastinate without telling him
True, but he should have told them ASAP instead of assuming they were going to fight Ozai on the day of the Comet. A second genocide in a 100 years is not something to be taken lightly.
>jfc there's no way you're actually equating this to azula's antics. this is why people are quick to shit on you guys. it's one thing to suggest she had redeemable aspects, but to paint the picture that she's just a female zuko is both dishonest and disservice to a character.
I never said that Azula is a female Zuko. I think either she has naturally low empathy, though existent, or Zuko is a highly empathetic individual. I just wanted to refute the point that Zuko doesn't threaten his death. And yes, firebending at someone when they are not expecting it, even if they are the Avatar, let alone aggressively firebending at some, is threaten to kill them
>but he should have told them ASAP instead of assuming they were going to fight Ozai on the day of the Comet.
Fair. why he didn't lead with that when he joined is very much peak "zuko not thinking things through"
>I just wanted to refute the point that Zuko doesn't threaten his death.
...I just dont think anyone here is arguing otherwise? context is key
Zuko is literally the softest kid Ive ever seen in my life, every other kid Ive met throughout my life whether they were my generation or younger, were all incredibly selfish, petty, narcissistic, self conceited, didnt care about others feelings etc.
Most people I knew acted closer to kid Azula than Zuko ffs, yet people b***h about how Azula acted in the flashbacks despite the fact that outside of the scene where she taunts Zuko about Ozai killing him (and even that scene is overblown, shes not celebrating Ozai killing him, she is just being incredibly tactless by making fun of Zuko for such a serious topic, she wouldnt be going about him getting adopted by an earth kingdom family if it werent), she doesnt do anything worse than kids her age do all the time
>Zuko is literally the softest kid Ive ever seen in my life
I am seriously not exaggerating, the only people that you could claim to have been anywhere near as concerned as Zuko about his conscience, were very obvious sub-100 iq, and I would confidently say very obvious sub-80 iq individuals, and thats mainly obviously because they were too dumb to act in the manner the other kids did, which is really saying something about Zuko
What?
Zuko is like kids with down syndrome.
As someone whose interacted with "that special type" of people for a good chunk of their childhood I dont think that comparison makes any sense at all dude or why you're even bringing him up at all when the topic seemed to be discussing Azula's empathy.
I am sorry if you were bullied as a kid but seven years old dont usually make fun of a close family member losing their son in a war.
I mean, were they really that close family, the siege of Ba-Sing-Se lasted for 600 days, add on that the time it took for him to surround the city, and the time it took to get to campaign from the Fire Nation, its likely the last time Azula saw Iroh was when she was 4-5 years old.
Plus I dont even think what shes making fun of him is even that bad, shes mocking him for deciding to pussy out due to the death of his son, instead of taking this as an even greater incentive to burn the whole place to the ground as revenge for them killing his son, add on that Ozai feeding her how much Iroh sucks, and yeah I dont see how most people wouldnt react like this.
> Now, Azula is never definitively called a psychopath; however, it is strongly consistent with how the writers approach the character. If you observe the flashbacks to their childhood, there is a consistent contrast between Azula and Zuko: At extremely young ages, Zuko has a strong conscience, and even when it's at its most suppressed, in Book 1, he often struggles with it. Azula just doesn't have that. She is cruel to animals and people alike no matter how far we go back, and we don't actually see direct evidence of her learning this behavior from her parents. There also appears to be something biologically peculiar about Azula. People are normally unable to defeat Toph's lie detection abilities, even if they're skilled liars, because the innate guilt and anxiety over lying leads to fluctuations in heartbeat and breathing that are imperceptible to normal people but truthseers can't miss. In reality, lie detection is a discredited science, but in Avatar, we're clearly meant to think this works. So, the fact that it doesn't work on Azula is significant. It implies she has not merely learned to suppress her guilt but just doesn't have it in the first place. There is no way she could have practiced against Toph's ability because she had just found out about it for the first time. Nothing else about Azula adequately explains all of this. Her upbringing influenced her behavior in certain ways, but this is not mutually exclusive with having psychopathy.
This guys b***hing about why Azula is a psychopath because she doesnt have as strong of a conscience as Zuko does, b***h most kids are buttholes and act much closer to Azula than they do to Zuko, the only difference is that they arent also raised as royalty and taught their entire life that their inherently better than everybody else.
Thats what Im talking about.
>Everyone is a bloodthirsty psycho like Azula!
Lol keep coping
I was mainly talking about her behavior in the flashbacks, not her behavior during the main timeline, and how what she does is literally not that far off from how most kids act, and if anything Zuko is the massive outlier
So what you're saying is that you don't have any kids and never will.
Im 22, have never had sex, am aromantic (not in queer sense, I just hate romantic love, and infinitely prefer platonic love), and am incredibly socially awkward.
I am merely speaking from my experience with my classmates, other kids from school, and my younger sisters and brothers generation.
Then again I am from the balkans, former republic of venice part, so maybe Im just biased by the culture I was surrounded by growing up.
>Im 22, have never had sex, am aromantic (not in queer sense, I just hate romantic love, and infinitely prefer platonic love), and am incredibly socially awkward.
So you're a literal virgin autist? Explains why you stan Azula and can't grok social interaction or ordinary behavior.
I dont think Azula is a psycho neither, her personality is clearly a case of nurture mostly involved thanks to her father which doesnt mean her behaviour is normal at all.
Oh, and having a breakdown continued with banishing everyone near you just because two childhood friends had enough of your crap seems like something a person with down syndrome would do rather than anything Zuko ever does on-screen.
>How most people would react to this
I dont know what type of values your family raised you with, but having a laugh about your cousin's let it be distant or not, and his father's sorrow is pretty FRICKED UP in any civilized part of the world.
I mean, yeah I agree, but the point I was making was that lets say that your dad and his brother had a massive falling out before your birth for whatever reason, and your dad has been telling you the whole time how much that guy sucks, then one day his son dies and your uncle instead of doing something like a father would do, lets say go pick up his sons corpse, instead decides to chicken out and drive to another state/country so he wouldnt have to deal with this.
Would you now laugh at this person who youve been taught sucks balls, and from what little you remember of them does indeed suck balls, for deciding to act like a total pussy.
Agree. If you repeat that a guy is a loser every single day.(which is bad, but oh well) Then doing that again when his son dies does not make you worse.
I would just go on about my day because as a seven year old why would I even give a shit about someone I supossedly barely know in the first place? Nor would I see why would I be making fun about the guy who died in the first place.
Anon, I dont know what mental gymnastics are you proposing here, but Azula is not only further away from Zuko in the terms of behaving a 'normal kid' but by also literally every kid you see on-screen.
Aang was implied to have been bullied as a kid for being the Avatar if I am not mistaken yet he wasnt happy at all when noticing that 99% of the people he knew back then were dead.
Again, this might just be because of the culture where I grew up in, kids were a lot meaner to each other growing up when I was a kid
That is why I specifically called attention to the fact that I was going to be focusing on their cognitive functions, rather than the letters themselves, since those actually do have some merit behind them from Jungs work, beyond mere horoscopes for the IFLS crowd.
And from there you can clearly tell that their cognition is literally inverse of one another, where they both tend to be defined by the same traits, just in the completely opposite order of significance.
Also, what I meant was that Zuko is WAY too concerned with acting nice in the flashbacks, yes kid Azula is worse than most kids (although Im willing to bet Ive met several kids worse than her), but Zuko is so passive in those flashbacks that the only people Ive known on par were people who were barely passing class with a 1.5 GPA just because the teacher was nice to them.
What the actual frick are you talking about? Zuko acts perfectly normal, he's even playing soldier with his knife.
He cares too much about whether he is doing the right thing or not, and making his mom angry, most kids Ive known tend to disobey their parents all the time, even when very young.
That's a weird correlation you have between the intelligence of someone and feeling empathy, anon.
>Im 22, Have never had sex
GRIM.
Those kids werent more empathetic, but were rather the weak ones out, they were too easily exploitable by the rest of the kids around, that their only survival strategy was to completely go with the whims of others more popular and dominant kids.
I mean ffs, these kids were taunting me for years about me being not liking to talk about liking girls, to the point that the one and only time I decided, as an 11 year old, to spend a night at the beach hanging out with them, they decided to play a truth or dare with me where they were forcing me to either kiss a girl, or drink saltwater, from which I got sick for a few weeks after. They were by far the least empathetic bunch you could ever see.
Actually nevermind, I turned 11 later that year, I was actually 10 years old at the time, and so were most of the kids
>Name a bigger character assassination
Oh, that's easy.
yeah… yeah.
So, how are nomies going to react when the comics material is acknowledged in the Gaang movie, if it is ever released?